Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw

[Himu]

AEW with a larger audience than WWE! 

https://twitter.com/AEWonTNT/status/1240458505867288577

A lot of these clips are just highlighting how bad/stupid American wrestling really is.

They have an opportunity to be WWE's competitition and it's the same corny 5-20 minute skits of endless talking. AEW is the most boring, waste of potential I've ever seen.

I swear to God when is an American wrestling company with sense going to copy NXT and NJPW's format? Nothing but matches. The only other mic time are interviews. Treat it "sport" like.

This does not, in any way, look like an actual rival to WWE. It looks more of the same. All this hype it's a wet fart. JFC.

[Trent Dole]

You want them to bump in front of no one?

[Himu]

Yeah, from footage I've seen AEW looks like the most pointless thing ever. They're trying so hard to actually be WWE when the entire point was to have an alternative to WWE to begin with. Given that many of their wrestlers are NJPW alumni, I (logically) assumed that their product would be more realistic, sports oriented. Why they didn't go in that direction and carve a market for something that isn't there in American wrestling is baffling to me.

What's Lucha Underground doing right now? They are the only American wrestling product that knows how to take modern American wrestling theatrics and actually make it appealing.

And then the new NWA apparently doesn't go for the sports like feel of the old NWA. What is wrong with these people? I want sports style "realistic" wrasslin. I guess I'll be sticking with NJPW.

[Tripon]

https://twitter.com/davemeltzerWON/status/1240777750362783744

[Himu]

You want them to bump in front of no one?

Huh?

No, my point is that so much of American wrestling is stupid storyline theatrics. Like in the clip from AEW above. Some cut to Matt Hardy on some rail looking like a moron. 

Then you've got Stone Cold listing shit to do on 3/16 Day.

The lack of crowd highlights how stupid it is.

Here's what wrasslin should be:

Interviews: this is your time to give a promo and build a storyline.



No in-ring promos. Giving time to people talk for 20 minutes is unrealistic and boring/stupid.

Outside of interviews, stories should be told in-ring, in-match.

I don't care about 3/16 day. I don't care about Matt Hardy on some rafters. This should be about the belt (whatever belt it is) and the fight to get that championship only. That's the only story that matters. More time should be spent wrestling than stupid skits.

For an example of the format I'm talking about, watch NXT. Unless they've change it since I regularly followed it.

[Himu]

Lucha was too good for us. I gotta see if I can order Lucha from Amazon.

[Himu]

If they pulled away from sport oriented wrestling are they wasting pick ups like Kenny Omega and Cody Rhodes, who excelled in njpw?

[Tripon]

This guy's voice.

[Himu]

Someone explain the rise of Drew? Is he over?

[nachobro]

"Drew & Wife"

He is over. I'm blown away but he's somehow getting really good reactions. He came back from TNA with "the look" and Vince fell back in love is the reason behind it I guess.

[Tripon]

"Drew & Wife"

He is over. I'm blown away but he's somehow getting really good reactions. He came back from TNA with "the look" and Vince fell back in love is the reason behind it I guess.

Paul Heyman by all reports is also big on him. Drew is as big as you can get without taking steroids, I guess.

[Himu]

"Drew & Wife"

He is over. I'm blown away but he's somehow getting really good reactions. He came back from TNA with "the look" and Vince fell back in love is the reason behind it I guess.

How'd they reintroduce him to WWE?

[Himu]

He had to go back through the farm system?


Hard work bruh

[Himu]

Is he a face or heel? What's his gimmick?

[Himu]

So he's the Joe Biden of wrestlers?

[Human Snorenado]

The real problem with AEW is that no one is there to tell the talent "no." The Bucks and Lucha Bros wanna do million mile an hour stupid spot monkey fests with dozens of finisher kick outs, so they get to do them. Cody wants to be his dad and shit on WWE, so he gets to try, anyway. Jericho wants to be fat and gets to, Moxley wants to have stupid gory garbage matches every week, etc etc etc.

Honestly the only thing worth watching on the show is Britt Baker emasculating Tony Schiavone. But I'm aware that I'm a very specific audience with a very specific kink, so.

[Human Snorenado]

By a SHITTY WRESTLING DENTIST. Very specific needs.

Tbh the second big problem with AEW is that their audience are a bunch of idiots that will cheer for damn near anything* because they're so desperate to not like WWE. (In their defense, WWE largely sucks, but this ain't it, Jack.)

*I don't think even that dumb fucking audience ever really popped for the Nightmare Collective, so at least we can assume they probably are smart enough not to stick forks in wall sockets

[Himu]

The real problem with AEW is that no one is there to tell the talent "no." The Bucks and Lucha Bros wanna do million mile an hour stupid spot monkey fests with dozens of finisher kick outs, so they get to do them. Cody wants to be his dad and shit on WWE, so he gets to try, anyway. Jericho wants to be fat and gets to, Moxley wants to have stupid gory garbage matches every week, etc etc etc.

Honestly the only thing worth watching on the show is Britt Baker emasculating Tony Schiavone. But I'm aware that I'm a very specific audience with a very specific kink, so.

So it's the exact opposite problem of WWE.

[Human Snorenado]

The real problem with AEW is that no one is there to tell the talent "no." The Bucks and Lucha Bros wanna do million mile an hour stupid spot monkey fests with dozens of finisher kick outs, so they get to do them. Cody wants to be his dad and shit on WWE, so he gets to try, anyway. Jericho wants to be fat and gets to, Moxley wants to have stupid gory garbage matches every week, etc etc etc.

Honestly the only thing worth watching on the show is Britt Baker emasculating Tony Schiavone. But I'm aware that I'm a very specific audience with a very specific kink, so.

So it's the exact opposite problem of WWE.

I mean, WWE's problem is that it's programming for a 74 year old increasingly senile Republican white male in 2020. AEW's problem is that the inmates are running the asylum.

[Himu]

But how do they know what's over and build a storyline if the crowd cheers at everything?

[Himu]

good argument

[I am (not) a weeb]

aew is fine. its an entertaining rasslin tv show with fun characters, engaging storylines, decent booking, and white hot crowds. not sure what more folks want tbh, especially when there's a niche for everyone now

storylines/promos/character work >>>>> wrestling match quality anyway, so i don't think a strictly sports focused product would've worked as well, at least here in america. that's why stuff like the cody lashing worked as well as it did

at the end of the day, it's a tv show first and foremost, so it's got to hook as much of the mainstream wrestling audience and lapsed fans that it can

[Himu]

aew is fine. its an entertaining rasslin tv show with fun characters, engaging storylines, decent booking, and white hot crowds. not sure what more folks want tbh, especially when there's a niche for everyone now

storylines/promos/character work >>>>> wrestling match quality anyway, so i don't think a strictly sports focused product would've worked as well, at least here in america. that's why stuff like the cody lashing worked as well as it did

at the end of the day, it's a tv show first and foremost, so it's got to hook as much of the mainstream wrestling audience and lapsed fans that it can

You mistake sports wrestling as wrestling quality. Old school WWF was sports wrestling and its wrestling quality was garbage.

Sports wrestling tells stories IN RING. It's not less story. It's just a different kind of storytelling. And the rise of nxt goes against your idea it couldn't work in America.

[I am (not) a weeb]

i agree on the in-ring storytelling stuff actually, but it should be there to accentuate the first and foremost storytelling done outside the ring too. i'm not implying you disagree with the latter either, just speaking on my preferences.

like the omega/page vs young bucks match was all out spots with tons of in ring story telling, but it wouldn't have had as much impact without the good build or without page getting over being an attitude era-like character.

has nxt really got over past the hardcore of the hardcore though? i feel like aew's audience might include a slightly wider net of folks, idk. i don't really watch nxt but the way wwe has presented it as the minors doesn't really help. it seems like it kinda peaked at the last survivor series, but wwe didn't really capitalize on presenting it as equal to the other two brands

[Himu]

i agree on the in-ring storytelling stuff actually, but it should be there to accentuate the first and foremost storytelling done outside the ring too. i'm not implying you disagree with the latter either, just speaking on my preferences.

like the omega/page vs young bucks match was all out spots with tons of in ring story telling, but it wouldn't have had as much impact without the good build or without page getting over being an attitude era-like character.

But that's the purpose of the interview. Which allows you promo time and to shine. You can build outside the ring all you want. But the sports entertainment cheesiness is wack, outdated, and limits wrestling's appeal.

Take Austin's KOTR win interview. Compare it with the promos posted on last page like the AEW Hardy crap with the drone.



Which video sells the next ppv more? Which video has you more into the storyline? How does a drone make you want to watch someone kick the crap out of their opponent in any way?

An interview is all you need to build. Standing in the middle of the ring talking to yourself for 20 minutes is wack.

The interview point also ties in with the fact that modern wrestling is far too over scripted. Let them sink or swim. It'll sort the chaff from the wheat real quick. 20 minutes of scripted promos is boring and having such a promo without a crowd highlights how scripted it is.

[I am (not) a weeb]

tbf there's not much that can beat a goat austin promo lol. and i'm not against a more serious presentation, hell aew had an awesome special with nothing but interviews leading up to their last ppv. all i'm saying is today's mainstream wrestling audience probably grew up on wwf/wcw, so it's possible behind the scenes they weighed their production choices and maybe they saw that going for a more typical rasslin show was ideal, who knows.

i think a sports oriented show like you're proposing (like the pre-ppv specials or jim ross' sitdowns) would've been great too, but it's a bit reductionist to say all aew does to build is doing nothing but 20 min in-ring promos. i don't even think they've ever had a promo go that long lol, and if they did they're usually filled with wcw brawl fuckery, and don't feel as dragged out like wwe's are.

sure aew does in ring promos, backstage segments, and other typical wwe shit to build their storylines, but they definitely have a fresher approach(wrestlers having more input on their characters), their presentation doesn't feel stale(jericho cruise, no-crowd show), and they are willing to listen to feedback(nightmare collective). it all adds up to an entertaining tv show imo. it being a mixed bag of wrestling, i think you could find something you would enjoy.

edit: i'm pretty sure aew doesn't really script their promos at all, at least for the big players


tldr: #StandUpForAEW

[nachobro]

tnaew is so "watchable" that in the middle of a pandemic when people are locked inside their homes and the competition is running a clip show AND they debut two former wwe guys they still can't crack 1mil viewers.

and this dude listing "no crowd shows" as a selling point

[nachobro]

98.9% of all no crowd shows suck from any company so i dunno if that's much of an endorsement

i'm sure aew is fine if all you want is "not wwe" but there's nothing there for me. adam page seems to have already grown more than i expected there, he was the one highlight of the entire last ppv, so good on him. otherwise most of there stuff seems to be kinda meh with a mix of old and busted wwe (matt hardy, luke harper, goldust) and literal who cares wwe (swagger, the 10 guy). maybe all they need is cody to make another speech or two about how much his dad means to him or whatever. also they should fire their entire women's division and start over.

[nachobro]

also some of that good sports wrestling from wwe like choppy choppy the peepee

[bork]

98.9% of all no crowd shows suck from any company so i dunno if that's much of an endorsement

i'm sure aew is fine if all you want is "not wwe" but there's nothing there for me. adam page seems to have already grown more than i expected there, he was the one highlight of the entire last ppv, so good on him. otherwise most of there stuff seems to be kinda meh with a mix of old and busted wwe (matt hardy, luke harper, goldust) and literal who cares wwe (swagger, the 10 guy). maybe all they need is cody to make another speech or two about how much his dad means to him or whatever. also they should fire their entire women's division and start over.

Same.  I was pretty excited about it in the beginning, but it's just so...'eh'.  The roster feels too shallow and I'm tired of seeing the same handful of matches over and over again.  I can't even remember the last time I watched it, but it was after having not watched it for a month or two, and it felt like I missed nothing- the same storylines with the same people were still going on, in a way much more than anything WWE.

While I think it's good that Matt Hardy isn't associating with that awful Dark Order gimmick, he would have been a better leader reveal than Luke Harper.  Now it's like they're a Wyatt family spin-off.   

[nachobro]

actually here's a stro challenge, since he knows so much about wrestling i never even knew existed: what's the best no crowd/empty arena match and is there video of it? i need things to watch since i'm stuck inside until the world ends next month.

[Tripon]

https://twitter.com/bristei/status/1241054930540134405

[Himu]

How can the fans cheer because it's not WWE when AEW is basically WWE in all but name?

[nachobro]

cause people like the elite a lot and the style of match you get from that crew in a format they are familiar with, i suppose. wwe been pushing the monday night war narrative so much over the years that people are wanting another one.

[Tripon]

AEW is basically late 90s Nitro without all the backstage backstabbing that hurt the wrestling product.

[nachobro]

Gronk time

[nachobro]

these shows are so bizarre

solo cole is not the move i would have gone with

[Tripon]

these shows are so bizarre

solo cole is not the move i would have gone with

Did Carmella and Graves get the Corona Virus? 

[Tripon]

Wow, WWE just embrace its full camp.

[Tripon]

https://www.cricketsweepstakes.com/wwenetwork

Cricket giving away 3 months of free WWE

---

They made Alistair Black wrestle on Main Event? 

[Tripon]

https://twitter.com/AEWrestling/status/1241189251124953089

AEW cancels war games and will do it later.


_____


Some high praise here.


https://twitter.com/GreatBrianLast/status/1241175512602607616

[nachobro]

https://twitter.com/AEWrestling/status/1241189251124953089

AEW cancels war games and will do it later.

luckily we're getting these fresh faces and new stars instead, thank god for aew

[nachobro]

first ever mutual 69 fuckfest

[nachobro]

also that empty arena match was fantastic, stro. funk just screaming in that high octave and cursing and then just getting stabbed in the eye

[Tripon]

[nachobro]

wwe finally changing up production now that raw isn't live?

[nachobro]

replaying the triple threat from RR2015 is a weird choice but this match is so i'll allow it

[nachobro]

https://twitter.com/WWE/status/1242191818860699655

[Tripon]

The Tiger needs you.

[nachobro]

aj pls put this old man out of our misery forever

[Tripon]

heh, reusing main event footage for Raw itself.

[Himu]

when does nwa air

[Human Snorenado]

when does nwa air

Normally Tuesdays at 6:05 on the youtubes but they've got like 1, 2 more episodes already taped and they've already had to cancel their ppv for April obviously, so they've decided not to air new episodes until they have a viable path going forward to do more tapings, which could be months optimistically. They do have like almost 20 episodes to watch, and 2 ppvs too, though.

I think on the one hand you would really appreciate what they're doing- it's very basic, formulaic, old school Dusty Rhodes booking wrasslin. Nobody gets in the ring for promos, it's all interviews. They're very good at booking arcs and telling stories, and most of the people they've got on the show are above average to awesome on the mic.

On the other hand, the in ring product is kinda basic and you're not gonna see a lot of "sportsy" action like in NJPW, so I think ultimately you'll probably get frustrated with this because it's not exactly what you want, which is apparently a requirement for you.

[nachobro]

NWA airs 24/7 on youtube dot com baybayyyy. start it off here:

[Pissy F Benny]

replaying the triple threat from RR2015 is a weird choice but this match is so i'll allow it

That match made me believe in Seth Rollins as a top guy and not the candy ass jaybrone that he is

[nachobro]

https://twitter.com/WWENXT/status/1242451353596723201

i sorta expected day one of WM to just be the NXT show but i guess not

[bork]

A HUGE WWE BRAND SWITCH HAS HAPPENED- WILL SHAKE EVERYTHING UP! 

spoiler (click to show/hide)

After previously being on WWE Raw, Mojo Rawley has quietly been moved to Smackdown without any fanfare or announcement.  Of course, the reason for this move is that his good friend Rob Gronkowski has been placed on Smackdown.    

[close]

[bork]

Rumors and news and shit:

-The Big Show has a new Netflix series called..."The Big Show Show." 

-Rumor is Mania will have eight matches per night, with the Shayna/Becky headlining night one.

-Matt Hardy confirming he left WWE because of Vince: "Even days after I left, after my contract was up, I talked to Triple H and he was cool. I feel like if Triple H would have been the guy that was solely in power, I would have probably had a much better opportunity of getting to do what I wanted to do creatively.  But it is what it is. "

-Rey Mysterio and Dana Brooke have reportedly been pulled from WrestleMania 36 as a result of being quarantined due to the Coronavirus Pandemic.  Andrade and Angela Garza will now face the Street Profits instead and the SD title match will just have five women instead of six.

-John Cena vs. The Fiend at WrestleMania 36 “will get a full blown movie treatment with a unique look & feel”, according to Gorilla Position. It’ll be shot in a warehouse, like the Randy Orton/Bray Wyatt House of Horrors match at Payback in 2017.

-Not only did WWE not reach out to CM Punk for WrestleMania this year, Dave Meltzer said on Wrestling Observer Radio that the company is against the idea of him ever wrestling for them again. There’s apparently more bitterness from WWE toward Punk now than vice versa.

[Tripon]

https://twitter.com/raulisonline/status/1242500437426589696
https://twitter.com/Slasher/status/1242571498981928961

[nachobro]

an official wwe2k stream could probably also beat a nascar race from 6 years ago on espn too