Author Topic: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town  (Read 215814 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

james

  • Donate to the JAMES FUND
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2160 on: September 19, 2022, 04:41:11 PM »
so, again: why does anyone want to stop desantis from sending people up north?

https://twitter.com/MarisaKabas/status/1571849207174123522
:O

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2161 on: September 19, 2022, 04:42:37 PM »
Even liberals writing for The Atlantic found liberal Covid education policy too much. Studies have shown that the mask mandates is detrimental to early learning. Whoops, there goes another liberal FUCK UP which of course, they refuse to acknowledge like the pissants they are.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2022/01/democrats-botched-public-school-covid-policy/621183/

:crowdlaff

In the midst of the aftermath one has to reason that Trump and the red state reaction to Covid were right.
IYKYK

Propagandhim

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2162 on: September 19, 2022, 04:45:44 PM »
Because Italy's problem is ships. NGO's use big ships to pick up the migrants in their small and leaky boats and bring them to Europe.
So friends of Erdogan sell those poor people leaky boats that can only make it half way.

To travel from Libya and Turkey by land you either have to take your chances on the Turk/Greek border or move through Ukraine.


This will surely help with the approval ratings
https://twitter.com/wallstmemes/status/1571887396869865474

Another day, another Democratic "solution". And that solution of course is ignoring the problem because haha, there is no problem. As much as I hate him I really should have voted Trump. We are in the hands of a geriatric with dementia whose administration is staffed with Twitter addled fa**ots. Far from the centrist he campaigned on.

The Fed is run by a fiscally conservative Republican.  Increasing rates is exactly what he would do in a Republican admin.

Granted, I'm not knowledgeable about economy. I'm not an expert. All I know and see is that the President and Democrats are pretending it's not a problem, which I know a Republican admin wouldn't do because that's what they're strong on.


Joe Biden is not the World Economic Arbiter.   Every nation of Europe has above a ~9% threshhold inflation rate, with energy averaging 40%, and non-energy industrial goods increasing to 7%+.    You can read the fed monetary reports to understand what's to be done: https://www.federalreserve.gov/newsevents/pressreleases.htm -- these problems are global and require a global amelioration effort.   Everyone has the same solution for the same problem -- it just takes time.  It'll happen.  Markets are still expected to drop at the expectation of rate increases, but there's nothing you can do about it.  There's a general consensus among economists that forecasts 0+ GDP growth in the fourth quarter and ~1% growth next year, down about half a percentage point from expectations -- that's what this stuff is about.  We're dealing with fractions of a percentage point and slow changes over years.  This is just the way it is.  Playing the blame game with partisan politics doesn't make any sense.  It's not like one party knows what to do and the other doesn't -- the externalities of the world are dealt with the same way by both.  Buy treasuries if you're feeling the pain -- the yields are making record gains.  Brace and wait out the lows.  Short-term pain.  We're all in this together - stop being tribal shitheads.

I'm not being tribal. I give both parties shit. It doesn't change the fact that Democratic Party messaging on inflation is God awful and proves their streak for elitist ivory tower horse shit. It takes their problems and make them even more unlikable.

Joe Biden is not the World Economic Arbiter.   Every nation of Europe has above a ~9% threshhold inflation rate, with energy averaging 40%, and non-energy industrial goods increasing to 7%+.    You can read the fed monetary reports to understand what's to be done: https://www.federalreserve.gov/newsevents/pressreleases.htm -- these problems are global and require a global amelioration effort.   Everyone has the same solution for the same problem -- it just takes time.  It'll happen.  Markets are still expected to drop at the expectation of rate increases, but there's nothing you can do about it.  There's a general consensus among economists that forecasts 0+ GDP growth in the fourth quarter and ~1% growth next year, down about half a percentage point from expectations -- that's what this stuff is about.  We're dealing with fractions of a percentage point and slow changes over years.  This is just the way it is.  Playing the blame game with partisan politics doesn't make any sense.  It's not like one party knows what to do and the other doesn't -- the externalities of the world are dealt with the same way by both.  Buy treasuries if you're feeling the pain -- the yields are making record gains.  Brace and wait out the lows.  Short-term pain.  We're all in this together - stop being tribal shitheads.

I'm not being tribal. I give both parties shit. It doesn't change the fact that Democratic Party messaging on inflation is God awful and proves their streak for elitist ivory tower horse shit. It takes their problems and make them even more unlikable.

Deep breaths, Propagandhim.  Deep breaths.


There's no such thing as a government that's not strong on the economy, which is why every Central Bank is independently run and apolitical.  We split the atom 100 years ago, you don't think we're able to figure out the equation that determines what grows the economy and what doesn't?  Everyone subscribes to the same model - keep inflation low while allowing businesses to take out the maximum amount of money to grow sectors of the economy.  Allow capital to have inherent growth to incentivize money-on-hand and debt reduction.  Keep income inequality as tight as possible to soak up the labor curve and avoid political distress.  Invest in human capital by creating a social security net while incentivizing risk and wealth creation.    As simplistic as this chart is, it really does represent the truth:   average GDP growth over Republican/Democratic administrations norms across global capital booms. 



What do you take away from this chart?  Do you think Kennedy and Bill Clinton's administration specifically figured out what grew an economy, and the subsequent administrations threw out that conventional wisdom? The economy grew 30 million jobs in 8 years and 35% gdp growth under Clinton.  We can see a very simple causal link between investment in the middle class that reduced unemployment -- but then why doesn't everyone just invest in the middle class? 

Clinton is a perfect microcosm on why thinking about political parties during economic boons is short-sighted. During Clinton's tenure, the strength of the labor market was unprecedented, median household income in real dollars reached a peak that we still haven't recovered from, and the poverty rate reached an all-time low which we also haven't recovered from.  Let's look back at the 70's: Reagan and the Fed were tasked and succeeded in taming inflation with a brief recession in '82.  You might've heard about 'trickle down' - His supply-side policies focused on tax-cuts from the top and rolling back Johnson's welfare programs that were an albatross in the 70s inflationary economy.  The market crashes in 1987 and inflation skyrockets in the 1990s, which prompted interest rate hikes and a new recession in the Bush years.  When Clinton took over, he reversed the budget deficits that Reagan created, which allowed the new Fed chairman, Alan Greenspan, enough room to keep interest rates low, which encouraged unemployment to fall.  When interest rates fall,  the amount of private sector savings that goes into buying federal debt reduces, instead it increases the amount of private sector investment. So unemployment kept falling and private business investment soared.    Increased private investment increased labor productivity, combined with labor scarcity, and wages were pushed up. Median incomes rose, and poverty fell.  This created deficit reduction.  Great.   But deficit reduction isn't always the right economic strategy for the time - it was for this circumstance.  A low interest rate, specifically in the 90s, was especially and specifically effective at deficit reduction.  Republicans say that the credit truly belongs to Ronald Reagan, because his supply-side economics created a great wave of entrepreneurial-technological innovation that transformed and restructured the economy - he engendered a kind of fortunate circumstance that allowed the US to take advantage of the serendipity of global phenomena like the internet and easy communication and set up for cheap globalized manufacturing, which resulted in a lot of prosperity that continued.  Democrats point to Clinton's policies of deficit reduction.  The truth is that they're both right - it's a causal chain of events from multiple administrations.  Clinton raised marginal tax rates on the highest-income Americans -- Reaganite supply-siders thought that was economically disastrous and it was uniformly opposed by Republicans, but as we know now the economy was much more prosperous after this than it was during the years Reagan was actually in office and taxes were lower.  But whose to argue that Reagan's investments in the private sector didn't enabled this? What many Republicans make of Clinton's tenure is that he was simply fortunate in his timing with insane stock valuations because of burgeoning global phenomenon like the internet, and clearly the high prices lifted the economy for anyone invested in the markets.  It was called "The Clinton bubble", where the market was fueled by aggressive financial deregulatory policies from Clinton and Greenspan -- huge sums of cash from IPO underwriting that investment banks were engaged in persuaded the administration to open up the market to new competition from commercial banks.  So commercial banks are lending out more money to a booming middle class, thanks to market surges.  It's capitalism, money begets more money for bursts of time.  But for the past 10 years prior to this bursting era, the United States and other rich European countries suffered from a shortfall in aggregate demand (aggregate demand is the measure of total demand for goods and services) - a situation in which even very low interest rates do not induce either full employment or inflation.  So Reagan could not have employed this strategy of cutting rates to any success until those market surges, but he contributed to those market surges.  It simply does not make sense to put tons of stock in economic policy from the lens of short-term partisan politics.   Normally during interest rate cuts fears about inflation curbs growth. But Clinton's policies dealt with fears through trade agreements and extra participation from a workforce that was incentivized by certain social security policies, and things like childcare investment (thanks to a booming global economy and revolutions in economic communication, transfer, and travel of globalization).  A good economy begets good results -- and allowed Clinton to tackle the Reagan-era structural deficit.  What's the takeaway from this?  That Keynesian (keynesians economics is a belief that the government can stabilize the economy with countercyclical fiscal policy - like lowering taxes to stimulate aggregate demand) economics that handle budget deficit is the key to economic growth, right?  That Reagan should not have cut taxes to create a large structural budget deficit and Clinton's push for a deficit reduction is the key?  Actually, no.  Over the past 15 years, it's been the complete opposite.  Interest rates and inflation stayed low during the economy of the early to mid aughts, as George W. Bush brought budget deficits back (the deficits were created by fiscal stimulus) and he cited the Clinton surplus as evidence that taxes were too high, which drove the U.S. budget into the red.  When Obama took over, he called deficit reduction, " balanced budget fetishism" during the Global Financial Crisis, because global factors out of his control wouldn't allow him to get a handle on it -- much of economic policy is a non-partisan group asking themselves "What options do we have?" not, "What would this Democrat/Republican administration want?" Because they don't control the major factors of the economy -- which is why the same problems remain extant over many years and exist globally.  When the Asian financial crisis hit in the late 90s, it was devastating to east asian and south-east asian markets -- everyone thought that devastation would transfer to the US, but the result was actually very minimal.  Their currency collapsed so our exports to them fell sharply, right? Well most U.S. industries experienced export decline
to Asia, but the decline in export demand had no noticeable impact.   And for the most part, we learned that imports from Asia do not compete directly with U.S. production. Therefore, an appreciation in the dollar with respect to Asian currencies leads to gains in consumption with little or no domestic pain.  Creating an economy that transactionally behaves like this with Asia is a great situation right?  Thanks to the experience of the 90s it was fantastic.  Thanks to the experience of 2022, it's fucking terrible.  Supply chain issues and an energy crisis compound and beget more problems.  What specific administration is responsible for engendering this causal chain of events?  Who set up the economy to function like this?   90% of it is outside an administration of 4-8 years' control and periphery of credit/blame.   

All of this wall of text is already well understood by every government on earth -- that's fiscal policy is complex and inherited from causal factors over long periods of time and global.  This is why every Central Bank in every advanced economy is insulated from short-term political pressures by being given a degree of autonomy outside of the legislature.   Otherwise, they'd do things like enacting excessive expansionary monetary policy to lower unemployment in the short term, to fuck over the next administration, and say "see? look what these dipshits did!"  There isn't one side that cares more or even knows more about fixing the economy than the other, nobody is that prescient.  All the information we have is being utilized in the exact way as intended per the short window of time.     
« Last Edit: September 19, 2022, 05:02:15 PM by Propagandhim »

james

  • Donate to the JAMES FUND
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2163 on: September 19, 2022, 04:47:29 PM »
The question is where are you getting your info? This is considered fact at this point. Covid restrictions have fucked blue states and their economic recovery as well as education prospects of their children.

I am comparing GDP - a standard, tracked metric that displays a hard number while you are using "Moody’s Analytics developed an index of 13 metrics, including the value of goods and services produced, employment, retail sales and new-home listings. "

AKA: Throw everything into a pot until you get the message you want.

Like what does "new home listings" even show? If its high, does it mean everyone is fleeing the state in droves, or does it mean that Tollhouse is cranking out homes by the thousands?

And unemployment rate also says very little on its own. North Dakota has ALWAYS had a low rate...because no one wants to fucking live there. They need to pay people $150k to dig holes for oil.

I mean come on, look at this shit:

Quote
At the Ohana Institute, a private school in Florida’s Panhandle, for kindergarten through 12th grade, the waiting list for students grew from 95 just before the pandemic to 393 last fall, Executive Director Lettye Burgtorf said.

LOL, imagine thinking that is data

The politico article is even worse because at no point does it even try to explain what metrics they used. Do you know what a black box is? Im sure Professor Benjamin would be happy to school you on that.
:O

Occam

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2164 on: September 19, 2022, 04:54:38 PM »
@Propagandhim
He's not going to read or comprehend this, and it will have no effect on the way he thinks.
Pearls and all that.
504

james

  • Donate to the JAMES FUND
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2165 on: September 19, 2022, 04:58:02 PM »
@Propagandhim
He's not going to read or comprehend this, and it will have no effect on the way he thinks.
Pearls and all that.

He will have moved on to the next talking points.

Immigrants->inflation->masks   I think CRT is next?
:O

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2166 on: September 19, 2022, 05:01:06 PM »
Because Italy's problem is ships. NGO's use big ships to pick up the migrants in their small and leaky boats and bring them to Europe.
So friends of Erdogan sell those poor people leaky boats that can only make it half way.

To travel from Libya and Turkey by land you either have to take your chances on the Turk/Greek border or move through Ukraine.


This will surely help with the approval ratings
https://twitter.com/wallstmemes/status/1571887396869865474

Another day, another Democratic "solution". And that solution of course is ignoring the problem because haha, there is no problem. As much as I hate him I really should have voted Trump. We are in the hands of a geriatric with dementia whose administration is staffed with Twitter addled fa**ots. Far from the centrist he campaigned on.

The Fed is run by a fiscally conservative Republican.  Increasing rates is exactly what he would do in a Republican admin.

Granted, I'm not knowledgeable about economy. I'm not an expert. All I know and see is that the President and Democrats are pretending it's not a problem, which I know a Republican admin wouldn't do because that's what they're strong on.


Joe Biden is not the World Economic Arbiter.   Every nation of Europe has above a ~9% threshhold inflation rate, with energy averaging 40%, and non-energy industrial goods increasing to 7%+.    You can read the fed monetary reports to understand what's to be done: https://www.federalreserve.gov/newsevents/pressreleases.htm -- these problems are global and require a global amelioration effort.   Everyone has the same solution for the same problem -- it just takes time.  It'll happen.  Markets are still expected to drop at the expectation of rate increases, but there's nothing you can do about it.  There's a general consensus among economists that forecasts 0+ GDP growth in the fourth quarter and ~1% growth next year, down about half a percentage point from expectations -- that's what this stuff is about.  We're dealing with fractions of a percentage point and slow changes over years.  This is just the way it is.  Playing the blame game with partisan politics doesn't make any sense.  It's not like one party knows what to do and the other doesn't -- the externalities of the world are dealt with the same way by both.  Buy treasuries if you're feeling the pain -- the yields are making record gains.  Brace and wait out the lows.  Short-term pain.  We're all in this together - stop being tribal shitheads.

I'm not being tribal. I give both parties shit. It doesn't change the fact that Democratic Party messaging on inflation is God awful and proves their streak for elitist ivory tower horse shit. It takes their problems and make them even more unlikable.

Joe Biden is not the World Economic Arbiter.   Every nation of Europe has above a ~9% threshhold inflation rate, with energy averaging 40%, and non-energy industrial goods increasing to 7%+.    You can read the fed monetary reports to understand what's to be done: https://www.federalreserve.gov/newsevents/pressreleases.htm -- these problems are global and require a global amelioration effort.   Everyone has the same solution for the same problem -- it just takes time.  It'll happen.  Markets are still expected to drop at the expectation of rate increases, but there's nothing you can do about it.  There's a general consensus among economists that forecasts 0+ GDP growth in the fourth quarter and ~1% growth next year, down about half a percentage point from expectations -- that's what this stuff is about.  We're dealing with fractions of a percentage point and slow changes over years.  This is just the way it is.  Playing the blame game with partisan politics doesn't make any sense.  It's not like one party knows what to do and the other doesn't -- the externalities of the world are dealt with the same way by both.  Buy treasuries if you're feeling the pain -- the yields are making record gains.  Brace and wait out the lows.  Short-term pain.  We're all in this together - stop being tribal shitheads.

I'm not being tribal. I give both parties shit. It doesn't change the fact that Democratic Party messaging on inflation is God awful and proves their streak for elitist ivory tower horse shit. It takes their problems and make them even more unlikable.

Deep breaths, Propagandhim.  Deep breaths.


There's no such thing as a government that's not strong on the economy, which is why every Central Bank is independently run and apolitical.  We split the atom 100 years ago, you don't think we're able to figure out the equation that determines what grows the economy and what doesn't?  Everyone subscribes to the same model - keep inflation low while allowing businesses to take out the maximum amount of money to grow sectors of the economy.  Allow capital to have inherent growth to incentivize money-on-hand and debt reduction.  Keep income inequality as tight as possible to soak up the labor curve and avoid political distress.  Invest in human capital by creating a social security net while incentivizing risk and wealth creation.    As simplistic as this chart is, it really does represent the truth:   average GDP growth over Republican/Democratic administrations norms across global capital booms. 

(Image removed from quote.)

What do you take away from this chart?  Do you think Kennedy and Bill Clinton's administration specifically figured out what grew an economy, and the subsequent administrations threw out that conventional wisdom? The economy grew 30 million jobs in 8 years and 35% gdp growth under Clinton.  We can see a very simple causal link between investment in the middle class that reduced unemployment -- but then why doesn't everyone just invest in the middle class? 

Clinton is a perfect microcosm on why thinking about political parties during economic boons is short-sighted. During Clinton's tenure, the strength of the labor market was unprecedented, median household income in real dollars reached a peak that we still haven't recovered from, and the poverty rate reached an all-time low which we also haven't recovered from.  Let's look back at the 70's: Reagan and the Fed were tasked and succeeded in taming inflation with a brief recession in '82.  You might've heard about 'trickle down' - His supply-side policies focused on tax-cuts from the top and rolling back Johnson's welfare programs that were an albatross in the 70s inflationary economy.  The market crashes in 1987 and inflation skyrockets in the 1990s, which prompted interest rate hikes and a new recession in the Bush years.  When Clinton took over, he reversed the budget deficits that Reagan created, which allowed the new Fed chairman, Alan Greenspan, enough room to keep interest rates low, which encouraged unemployment to fall.  When interest rates fall,  the amount of private sector savings that goes into buying federal debt reduces, instead it increases the amount of private sector investment. So unemployment kept falling and private business investment soared.    Increased private investment increased labor productivity, combined with labor scarcity, and wages were pushed up. Median incomes rose, and poverty fell.  This created deficit reduction.  Great.   But deficit reduction isn't always the right economic strategy for the time - it was for this circumstance.  A low interest rate, specifically in the 90s, was especially and specifically effective at deficit reduction.  Republicans say that the credit truly belongs to Ronald Reagan, because his supply-side economics created a great wave of entrepreneurial-technological innovation that transformed and restructured the economy - he engendered a kind of fortunate circumstance that allowed the US to take advantage of the serendipity of global phenomena like the internet and easy communication and set up for cheap globalized manufacturing, which resulted in a lot of prosperity that continued.  Democrats point to Clinton's policies of deficit reduction.  The truth is that they're both right - it's a causal chain of events from multiple administrations.  Clinton raised marginal tax rates on the highest-income Americans -- Reaganite supply-siders thought that was economically disastrous and it was uniformly opposed by Republicans, but as we know now the economy was much more prosperous after this than it was during the years Reagan was actually in office and taxes were lower.  But whose to argue that Reagan's investments in the private sector didn't enabled this? What many Republicans make of Clinton's tenure is that he was simply fortunate in his timing with insane stock valuations because of burgeoning global phenomenon like the internet, and clearly the high prices lifted the economy for anyone invested in the markets.  It was called "The Clinton bubble", where the market was fueled by aggressive financial deregulatory policies from Clinton and Greenspan -- huge sums of cash from IPO underwriting that investment banks were engaged in persuaded the administration to open up the market to new competition from commercial banks.  So commercial banks are lending out more money to a booming middle class, thanks to market surges.  It's capitalism, money begets more money for bursts of time.  But for the past 10 years prior to this bursting era, the United States and other rich European countries suffered from a shortfall in aggregate demand (aggregate demand is the measure of total demand for goods and services) - a situation in which even very low interest rates do not induce either full employment or inflation.  So Reagan could not have employed this strategy of cutting rates to any success until those market surges, but he contributed to those market surges.  It simply does not make sense to put tons of stock in economic policy from the lens of short-term partisan politics.   Normally during interest rate cuts fears about inflation curbs growth. But Clinton's policies dealt with fears through trade agreements and extra participation from a workforce that was incentivized by certain social security policies, and things like childcare investment (thanks to a booming global economy and revolutions in economic communication, transfer, and travel of globalization).  A good economy begets good results -- and allowed Clinton to tackle the Reagan-era structural deficit.  What's the takeaway from this?  That Keynesian (keynesians economics is a belief that the government can stabilize the economy with countercyclical fiscal policy - like lowering taxes to stimulate aggregate demand) economics that handle budget deficit is the key to economic growth, right?  That Reagan should not have cut taxes to create a large structural budget deficit and Clinton's push for a deficit reduction is the key?  Actually, no.  Over the past 15 years, it's been the complete opposite.  Interest rates and inflation stayed low during the economy of the early to mid aughts, as George W. Bush brought budget deficits back (the deficits were created by fiscal stimulus) and he cited the Clinton surplus as evidence that taxes were too high, which drove the U.S. budget into the red.  When Obama took over, he called deficit reduction, " balanced budget fetishism" during the Global Financial Crisis, because global factors out of his control wouldn't allow him to get a handle on it -- much of economic policy is a non-partisan group asking themselves "What options do we have?" not, "What would this Democrat/Republican administration want?" Because they don't control the major factors of the economy -- which is why the same problems remain extant over many years and exist globally.  When the Asian financial crisis hit in the late 90s, it was devastating to east asian and south-east asian markets -- everyone thought that devastation would transfer to the US, but the result was actually very minimal.  Their currency collapsed so our exports to them fell sharply, right? Well most U.S. industries experienced export decline
to Asia, but the decline in export demand had no noticeable impact.   And for the most part, we learned that imports from Asia do not compete directly with U.S. production. Therefore, an appreciation in the dollar with respect to Asian currencies leads to gains in consumption with little or no domestic pain.  Creating an economy that transactionally behaves like this with Asia is a great situation right?  Thanks to the experience of the 90s it was fantastic.  Thanks to the experience of 2022, it's fucking terrible.  Supply chain issues and an energy crisis compound and beget more problems.  What specific administration is responsible for engendering this causal chain of events?  Who set up the economy to function like this?   90% of it is outside an administration of 4-8 years' control and periphery of credit/blame.   

All of this wall of text is already well understood by every government on earth -- that's fiscal policy is complex and inherited from causal factors over long periods of time and global.  This is why every Central Bank in every advanced economy is insulated from short-term political pressures by being given a degree of autonomy outside of the legislature.   Otherwise, they'd do things like enacting excessive expansionary monetary policy to lower unemployment in the short term, to fuck over the next administration, and say "see? look what these dipshits did!"  There isn't one side that cares more or even knows more about fixing the economy than the other, nobody is that prescient.  All the information we have is being utilized in the exact way as intended.   

What's your point? How does this relate to Biden and his administrations messaging? It feels like we are talking about completely different things and you're bringing up the central bank - something I never even mentioned much less insinuated at.

Watch the Twitter video again, then re-read your post and tell me what in the fuck it has to do with Biden dismissing inflation rate on 60 Seconds. Bush doesn't have anything to do with. Republican record on economy and their tendency to overspend despite their "fiscal conservative" messaging has nothing to do with. Historical Democratic economic policy has nothing to do with it, either. Your entire argument deflects from the point of the post, which is about Biden, his administration, and their messaging on inflation.
« Last Edit: September 19, 2022, 05:05:40 PM by Himu »
IYKYK

Propagandhim

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2167 on: September 19, 2022, 05:03:20 PM »
You said:

Quote
Granted, I'm not knowledgeable about economy. I'm not an expert. All I know and see is that the President and Democrats are pretending it's not a problem, which I know a Republican admin wouldn't do because that's what they're strong on.


What are Republicans strong on?   I watched the video -- it encompasses my point exactly.  Biden is saying the inflation rate went up .10% That's noise on forescasting.  Morgan Stanley and BoA projected a differential higher than that between each other.  That's how noisy that is.  Why is it noise?  Because it takes years for the inflation rate to go down.  I even wrote it a few days ago.

Quote
It takes a year to reduce inflation 3 to 4 percentages points.  CPI showed it was .10% above estimates (and in line with most conservative estimates) -- that's less than 2 weeks on a linear trajectory.  It's noise.   Anyone making a big stink about Biden is just political chaff.

Biden is being a politician.  He's trying to calm fears and letting the Fed do what it does.   You can't avoid this pain.  This is happening everywhere and will take time to fix.   
« Last Edit: September 19, 2022, 05:08:57 PM by Propagandhim »

Occam

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2168 on: September 19, 2022, 05:10:55 PM »
What are Republicans strong on?   
Turning gullible human brains into pretzels. During the past 50 years they have perfected their method.
504

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2169 on: September 19, 2022, 05:11:00 PM »
You said:

Quote
Granted, I'm not knowledgeable about economy. I'm not an expert. All I know and see is that the President and Democrats are pretending it's not a problem, which I know a Republican admin wouldn't do because that's what they're strong on.


What are Republicans strong on?

You wrote all that to articulate that Republicans have a tendency to overspend, create huge amounts of national debt?

I will concede that Democratic Presidents tend to be better on economy. I was wrong and pushed my ire towards liberals too far. I hate them that much. But right now, the main problem is Biden and his awful economic messaging.

I watched the video -- it encompasses my point exactly.  Biden is saying the inflation rate went up .10% That's noise on forescasting.  Morgan Stanley and BoA projected a differential higher than that between each other.  That's how noisy that is.  Why is it noise?  Because it takes years for the inflation rate to go down.  I even wrote it a few days ago.

Quote
It takes a year to reduce inflation 3 to 4 percentages points.  CPI showed it was .10% above estimates (and in line with most conservative estimates) -- that's less than 2 weeks on a linear trajectory.  It's noise.   Anyone making a big stink about Biden is just political chaff.

Biden is being a politician.  He's trying to calm fears and letting the Fed do what it does.   You can't avoid this pain.  This is happening everywhere and will take time to fix.

That's fair enough. I cannot stand politicians and I don't trust them.
IYKYK

Propagandhim

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2170 on: September 19, 2022, 05:15:53 PM »
You said:

Quote
Granted, I'm not knowledgeable about economy. I'm not an expert. All I know and see is that the President and Democrats are pretending it's not a problem, which I know a Republican admin wouldn't do because that's what they're strong on.


What are Republicans strong on?

You wrote all that to articulate that Republicans have a tendency to overspend, create huge amounts of national debt?

I will concede that Democratic Presidents tend to be better on economy. I was wrong and pushed my ire towards liberals too far. I hate them that much. But right now, the main problem is Biden and his awful economic messaging.

I watched the video -- it encompasses my point exactly.  Biden is saying the inflation rate went up .10% That's noise on forescasting.  Morgan Stanley and BoA projected a differential higher than that between each other.  That's how noisy that is.  Why is it noise?  Because it takes years for the inflation rate to go down.  I even wrote it a few days ago.

Quote
It takes a year to reduce inflation 3 to 4 percentages points.  CPI showed it was .10% above estimates (and in line with most conservative estimates) -- that's less than 2 weeks on a linear trajectory.  It's noise.   Anyone making a big stink about Biden is just political chaff.

Biden is being a politician.  He's trying to calm fears and letting the Fed do what it does.   You can't avoid this pain.  This is happening everywhere and will take time to fix.

That's fair enough. I cannot stand politicians and I don't trust them.

No, I didn't insinuate Republicans have a tendency to overspend -- i provided a snapshot of time that proves what was causally impacted by factors before and after it are part of a larger scheme beyond the paradigm of Democrat and Republican.  I credited Reagan with a lot of Clinton's economic boon, but Clinton's era policies were very effective due to a Republican Fed chairman!  The main message is, zeroing in on what Biden says about inflation on 60 minutes is a waste of time and not an indication of anything.  He doesn't have the control you think he does.  These global inflation conflagrations happen routinely and routinely ameliorate over time.  Markets are driven by a balance: a need to satisfy aggregate demand, which is a function of how healthy labor markets are, and the ability for the economy to provide incentive for risk and wealth creation.   You have a toolkit to tweak those variables around, but when global political conflicts, energy crisis, supply chain problems occur, the local economy takes the pain.  Then it goes down.   It's routine.
« Last Edit: September 19, 2022, 05:23:03 PM by Propagandhim »

Uncle

  • Have You Ever
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2171 on: September 19, 2022, 05:18:56 PM »
so, again: why does anyone want to stop desantis from sending people up north?

https://twitter.com/MarisaKabas/status/1571849207174123522

the brochure isn't fake, the services are all real, whether these particular immigrants are eligible for all of them or not

https://www.mass.gov/service-details/list-of-ori-programs-and-services

are we certain this was actually handed to all of them as an indication of where they were going, or is it equally likely they found themselves in an immigration building that had many brochures from a lot of different states, addressing a variety of different immigration statuses? and, as expected when you don't speak the local language and find yourself in unfamiliar territory, have ample opportunity for misunderstanding?
« Last Edit: September 19, 2022, 05:23:59 PM by Uncle »
Uncle

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2172 on: September 19, 2022, 05:19:15 PM »
The main message is, zeroing in on what Biden says about inflation on 60 minutes is a waste of time and not an indication of anything.  He doesn't have the control you think he does.

I already know the President doesn't have the power I think he does. It's still his job as a leader to face shit and make me feel better. Wasn't that why the old fuck was elected? Because he was to make things normal and actually lead from the chaotic monstrosity of the Trump administration?
IYKYK

Propagandhim

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2173 on: September 19, 2022, 05:21:40 PM »
He was probably mostly elected because he's tall and white, tbh.  I mean, if you want to look at the correlates for what gets people elected, anyway.

james

  • Donate to the JAMES FUND
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2174 on: September 19, 2022, 05:25:11 PM »
so, again: why does anyone want to stop desantis from sending people up north?

https://twitter.com/MarisaKabas/status/1571849207174123522

the brochure isn't fake, the services are all real

https://www.mass.gov/service-details/list-of-ori-programs-and-services

are we certain this was actually handed to all of them as an indication of where they were going, or is it equally likely they found themselves in an immigration building that had many brochures from a lot of different states? and, as expected when you don't speak the local language and find yourself in unfamiliar territory, have ample opportunity for misunderstanding?

The services are ONLY for people resettled through the official asylum program, like folks being brought in from Ukraine.  DeSantis copied and pasted that into a word document and gave it to people who dont qualify.

You really think a random office in Texas would have a pamphlet for MARTHAS FUCKING VINYARD?

We know it's fake because any government agency worth their own salt would spend at least 4 weeks on ensuring the state seal is properly centered and colored. Source: Have worked with government logos.

Come on man, we dont need two Himus.
:O

james

  • Donate to the JAMES FUND
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2175 on: September 19, 2022, 05:27:12 PM »
administration is staffed with Twitter addled fa**ots. Far from the centrist he campaigned on.

Oh shit I missed this. See you in November I guess.
:O

Nintex

  • Finish the Fight
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2176 on: September 19, 2022, 05:29:00 PM »
Would be quite something if this stunt sinks DeSantis and that puts Trump back in the White House :trumps
🤴

james

  • Donate to the JAMES FUND
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2177 on: September 19, 2022, 05:31:19 PM »
Would be quite something if this stunt sinks DeSantis and that puts Trump back in the White House :trumps

Republicans fighting over who hates latinos the most is going to be very helpful for Democrats this November

Florida Cubans will not like that people "fleeing communism" are being treated like trash
:O

Uncle

  • Have You Ever
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2178 on: September 19, 2022, 05:32:14 PM »
The services are ONLY for people resettled through the official asylum program, like folks being brought in from Ukraine.  DeSantis copied and pasted that into a word document and gave it to people who dont qualify.

You really think a random office in Texas would have a pamphlet for MARTHAS FUCKING VINYARD?

We know it's fake because any government agency worth their own salt would spend at least 4 weeks on ensuring the state seal is properly centered and colored. Source: Have worked with government logos.

Come on man, we dont need two Himus.

another reason we know it's fake is because it was brought to light by the trusted reliable american institution, popular.info
Uncle

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2179 on: September 19, 2022, 05:34:21 PM »


:sabu :crowdlaff

Propa:

Don't forget Biden ignored the inflation problem for 12 MONTHS. He is the leader of the country! And he says this on a 60 Minutes interview?



Fuck him.

administration is staffed with Twitter addled fa**ots. Far from the centrist he campaigned on.

Oh shit I missed this. See you in November I guess.



Right.

IYKYK

james

  • Donate to the JAMES FUND
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2180 on: September 19, 2022, 05:35:43 PM »
The services are ONLY for people resettled through the official asylum program, like folks being brought in from Ukraine.  DeSantis copied and pasted that into a word document and gave it to people who dont qualify.

You really think a random office in Texas would have a pamphlet for MARTHAS FUCKING VINYARD?

We know it's fake because any government agency worth their own salt would spend at least 4 weeks on ensuring the state seal is properly centered and colored. Source: Have worked with government logos.

Come on man, we dont need two Himus.

another reason we know it's fake is because it was brought to light by the trusted reliable american institution, popular.info

Here is the local CBS station.

https://twitter.com/TedNesi/status/1570530903662940160
:O

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2181 on: September 19, 2022, 05:37:37 PM »
Prop: Also, let's be real. Biden's administration hasn't done him favors. You bring up his fed, I'm talking policy. Even more Covid Stimulus, BBB, cancelling student loans are all things that will make a bad situation worse. That's on the Democrats and the Biden administration's crappy progressive politics, not on banks,  not on the federal reserve.
IYKYK

Uncle

  • Have You Ever
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2182 on: September 19, 2022, 05:38:46 PM »
we went over this already anyway

ideally the entire situation would be handled much better, as you suggested Biden should be running the buses

but again, if the migrants end up with incorrect information this is just more of the desantis self-own that delivers more wins to liberals

being as far from florida or texas as possible is in the immigrants' best possible interests all around
Uncle

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2183 on: September 19, 2022, 05:39:28 PM »
I thought the liberal areas were sanctuary states. :doge
IYKYK

Himu

  • Senior Member
IYKYK

james

  • Donate to the JAMES FUND
  • Senior Member
:O

Propagandhim

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2186 on: September 19, 2022, 05:43:13 PM »
Prop: Also, let's be real. Biden's administration hasn't done him favors. You bring up his fed, I'm talking policy. Even more Covid Stimulus, BBB, cancelling student loans are all things that will make a bad situation worse. That's on the Democrats and the Biden administration's crappy progressive politics, not on banks,  no on the federal reserve.

Trump also provided Covid stimulus and forgave loans and provided huge tax cuts to the top earners in this country.  Remember, he put his name on the check.   Stimulus like that does contribute to inflation -- you're right.  But the Biden admin isn't forgiving student debt out of the goodness of their heart -- analysts generally agree that forgiving student debt boosts gdp by an average of $100+ billion each year for a decade (remember, economic policy outlasts presidential terms), then continues at a receded rate over time.  It may or may not impact the affordable housing market for the better, too.  It remains to be seen.   That says nothing about the morality of the decision -- I understand that it's unfair for certain people.  I'm not making a value judgement on the ethics and morality of that and what it means for other people who paid it off, i'm just saying economically speaking it has utility beyond being nice to kids.

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2187 on: September 19, 2022, 05:46:48 PM »
Prop: Also, let's be real. Biden's administration hasn't done him favors. You bring up his fed, I'm talking policy. Even more Covid Stimulus, BBB, cancelling student loans are all things that will make a bad situation worse. That's on the Democrats and the Biden administration's crappy progressive politics, not on banks,  no on the federal reserve.

Trump also provided Covid stimulus and forgave loans and provided huge tax cuts to the top earners in this country.  Remember, he put his name on the check.   And the Biden admin isn't forgiving student debt out of the goodness of their heart -- analysts generally agree that forgiving student debt boosts gdp by an average of $100+ billion each year for a decade, then continues at a receded rate over time.  That says nothing about the morality of the decision -- I understand that it's unfair for certain people.  I'm not making a value judgement on the ethics and morality of that and what it means for other people who paid it off, i'm just saying economically speaking it has utility beyond being nice to kids.

I know. Which is why I said Biden gave even more stimulus. Trump giving stimulus at the time was needed. Biden took an already big problem and is basically throwing gasoline on a fire by increasing spending. I not once said Trump didn't spend big. My argument is,"hey, Trump administration and the federal government gave over trillions to the People. Maybe hold your horses."

Biden administration? "NO!"
IYKYK

Propagandhim

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2188 on: September 19, 2022, 05:56:06 PM »
Prop: Also, let's be real. Biden's administration hasn't done him favors. You bring up his fed, I'm talking policy. Even more Covid Stimulus, BBB, cancelling student loans are all things that will make a bad situation worse. That's on the Democrats and the Biden administration's crappy progressive politics, not on banks,  no on the federal reserve.

Trump also provided Covid stimulus and forgave loans and provided huge tax cuts to the top earners in this country.  Remember, he put his name on the check.   And the Biden admin isn't forgiving student debt out of the goodness of their heart -- analysts generally agree that forgiving student debt boosts gdp by an average of $100+ billion each year for a decade, then continues at a receded rate over time.  That says nothing about the morality of the decision -- I understand that it's unfair for certain people.  I'm not making a value judgement on the ethics and morality of that and what it means for other people who paid it off, i'm just saying economically speaking it has utility beyond being nice to kids.

I know. Which is why I said Biden gave even more stimulus. Trump giving stimulus at the time was needed. Biden took an already big problem and is basically throwing gasoline on a fire by increasing spending. I not once said Trump didn't spend big. My argument is,"hey, Trump administration and the federal government gave over trillions to the People. Maybe hold your horses."

Biden administration? "NO!"

It's complicated.  Stimulus increases inflation, no doubt.  You can make some good arguments for being more discerning with need-based stimulation or vetting business loans better.   I don't want to get into what it means to not be able to pay your bills because of an event you can't control and real wages stagnating for the middle class.  Political stability is important for confidence in markets.  You can look at charts for U.S. economic growth over historical and recent periods of time -- but it won't show the whole picture because of changes in income inequality.  Things are going to get a bit worse before they get better, and they will get better.  And when they do, someone else who just sat in a warm seat will take the credit for it.  ...and the cycle continues. 

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2189 on: September 19, 2022, 05:57:55 PM »
Prop: Also, let's be real. Biden's administration hasn't done him favors. You bring up his fed, I'm talking policy. Even more Covid Stimulus, BBB, cancelling student loans are all things that will make a bad situation worse. That's on the Democrats and the Biden administration's crappy progressive politics, not on banks,  no on the federal reserve.

Trump also provided Covid stimulus and forgave loans and provided huge tax cuts to the top earners in this country.  Remember, he put his name on the check.   And the Biden admin isn't forgiving student debt out of the goodness of their heart -- analysts generally agree that forgiving student debt boosts gdp by an average of $100+ billion each year for a decade, then continues at a receded rate over time.  That says nothing about the morality of the decision -- I understand that it's unfair for certain people.  I'm not making a value judgement on the ethics and morality of that and what it means for other people who paid it off, i'm just saying economically speaking it has utility beyond being nice to kids.

I know. Which is why I said Biden gave even more stimulus. Trump giving stimulus at the time was needed. Biden took an already big problem and is basically throwing gasoline on a fire by increasing spending. I not once said Trump didn't spend big. My argument is,"hey, Trump administration and the federal government gave over trillions to the People. Maybe hold your horses."

Biden administration? "NO!"

It's complicated.  Stimulus increases inflation, no doubt.  You can make some good arguments for being more discerning with need-based stimulation or vetting business loans better.   I don't want to get into what it means to not be able to pay your bills because of an event you can't control and real wages stagnating for the middle class.  Political stability is important for confidence in markets.  You can look at charts for U.S. economic growth over historical and recent periods of time -- but it won't show the whole picture because of changes in income inequality.  Things are going to get a bit worse before they get better, and they will get better.  And when they do, someone else who just sat in a warm seat will take the credit for it.  ...and the cycle continues.

Fair enough. I hate politics. If I still drank, I'd get a beer with you and love to talk. I could order an alcohol free Heineken and we could talk shit about James and Occam.
IYKYK

Phoenix Dark

  • I got no game it's just some bitches understand my story
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2190 on: September 19, 2022, 06:20:04 PM »
Prop: Also, let's be real. Biden's administration hasn't done him favors. You bring up his fed, I'm talking policy. Even more Covid Stimulus, BBB, cancelling student loans are all things that will make a bad situation worse. That's on the Democrats and the Biden administration's crappy progressive politics, not on banks,  not on the federal reserve.

This right here tells me you're just regurgitating talking points and don't understand the issue. I'm not going to provide a Fed deep dive though.

Inflation has been occurring globally since economies re-opened, it makes little sense to blame the administration. Any more than it made sense to blame Biden for gas prices, when prices increased globally as well. And then of course when prices dropped over the last couple months no one could point to any conservative explanation for why. We didn't "start drilling more" after all.

Globally, the dominant drivers of inflation have been significantly increased demand and supply chain delays/shortages due to shutdowns. The war in Ukraine has also played a factor in oil and food (grain shortages) cost increases. Entire Chinese cities that manufactured car chips were suddenly closed during the pandemic (and continue today in some areas), increasing new and used car prices as supply failed to match demand. People spent much of the latter part of the shutdowns spending a shit ton of money purchasing things, often online, and companies couldn't handle the drastic rise from lowered demand (initial quarantine) to maximum demand.

In the US the other major factor is the job market. We went from large portions of our labor force being shut down or reduced to a massive re-hiring spree alongside wage increases. Unemployment is at near record lows, wages continue to rise, and costs are increasing alongside it.

Those are the major drivers of this. Some parts of this will naturally solve themselves. As we move back to consumers spending money on services, vs the highly elevated spending on goods during the pandemic, inflation will decline. But the demand for goods remains relatively high and companies/supply chains continue to struggle to meet it. The fed is pushing higher interest rates, and a potential recession will give companies an opportunity to reduce wage growth.
010

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2191 on: September 19, 2022, 06:25:44 PM »
Prop: Also, let's be real. Biden's administration hasn't done him favors. You bring up his fed, I'm talking policy. Even more Covid Stimulus, BBB, cancelling student loans are all things that will make a bad situation worse. That's on the Democrats and the Biden administration's crappy progressive politics, not on banks,  not on the federal reserve.

This right here tells me you're just regurgitating talking points and don't understand the issue. I'm not going to provide a Fed deep dive though.

Inflation has been occurring globally since economies re-opened, it makes little sense to blame the administration. Any more than it made sense to blame Biden for gas prices, when prices increased globally as well. And then of course when prices dropped over the last couple months no one could point to any conservative explanation for why. We didn't "start drilling more" after all.

Globally, the dominant drivers of inflation have been significantly increased demand and supply chain delays/shortages due to shutdowns. The war in Ukraine has also played a factor in oil and food (grain shortages) cost increases. Entire Chinese cities that manufactured car chips were suddenly closed during the pandemic (and continue today in some areas), increasing new and used car prices as supply failed to match demand. People spent much of the latter part of the shutdowns spending a shit ton of money purchasing things, often online, and companies couldn't handle the drastic rise from lowered demand (initial quarantine) to maximum demand.

In the US the other major factor is the job market. We went from large portions of our labor force being shut down or reduced to a massive re-hiring spree alongside wage increases. Unemployment is at near record lows, wages continue to rise, and costs are increasing alongside it.

Those are the major drivers of this. Some parts of this will naturally solve themselves. As we move back to consumers spending money on services, vs the highly elevated spending on goods during the pandemic, inflation will decline. But the demand for goods remains relatively high and companies/supply chains continue to struggle to meet it. The fed is pushing higher interest rates, and a potential recession will give companies an opportunity to reduce wage growth.

I understand all of this. You're mistaking me articulating my blame on the administration and saying they could be preventing it fully, when we are in the fumes of a global pandemic and mass shortages. Of course we have inflation. My problem isn't the inflation, it's my frustration in the administrations response, messaging, and overall ignoring it. Even a simple "we as Americans will all bear the brunt of increasing inflation and there's little we can do to stop it. We as Americans need to simply hold tight and look for light at the end of the tunnel" would make me feel better. Instead we get that Biden sound bite on 60 Minutes. It just doesn't deliver confidence despite the fact I know, internally, that all we can do is wait.

BBB and the student loan situation aren't helping things.
IYKYK

Phoenix Dark

  • I got no game it's just some bitches understand my story
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2192 on: September 19, 2022, 06:53:10 PM »
Prop: Also, let's be real. Biden's administration hasn't done him favors. You bring up his fed, I'm talking policy. Even more Covid Stimulus, BBB, cancelling student loans are all things that will make a bad situation worse. That's on the Democrats and the Biden administration's crappy progressive politics, not on banks,  not on the federal reserve.

This right here tells me you're just regurgitating talking points and don't understand the issue. I'm not going to provide a Fed deep dive though.

Inflation has been occurring globally since economies re-opened, it makes little sense to blame the administration. Any more than it made sense to blame Biden for gas prices, when prices increased globally as well. And then of course when prices dropped over the last couple months no one could point to any conservative explanation for why. We didn't "start drilling more" after all.

Globally, the dominant drivers of inflation have been significantly increased demand and supply chain delays/shortages due to shutdowns. The war in Ukraine has also played a factor in oil and food (grain shortages) cost increases. Entire Chinese cities that manufactured car chips were suddenly closed during the pandemic (and continue today in some areas), increasing new and used car prices as supply failed to match demand. People spent much of the latter part of the shutdowns spending a shit ton of money purchasing things, often online, and companies couldn't handle the drastic rise from lowered demand (initial quarantine) to maximum demand.

In the US the other major factor is the job market. We went from large portions of our labor force being shut down or reduced to a massive re-hiring spree alongside wage increases. Unemployment is at near record lows, wages continue to rise, and costs are increasing alongside it.

Those are the major drivers of this. Some parts of this will naturally solve themselves. As we move back to consumers spending money on services, vs the highly elevated spending on goods during the pandemic, inflation will decline. But the demand for goods remains relatively high and companies/supply chains continue to struggle to meet it. The fed is pushing higher interest rates, and a potential recession will give companies an opportunity to reduce wage growth.

I understand all of this. You're mistaking me articulating my blame on the administration and saying they could be preventing it fully, when we are in the fumes of a global pandemic and mass shortages. Of course we have inflation. My problem isn't the inflation, it's my frustration in the administrations response, messaging, and overall ignoring it. Even a simple "we as Americans will all bear the brunt of increasing inflation and there's little we can do to stop it. We as Americans need to simply hold tight and look for light at the end of the tunnel" would make me feel better. Instead we get that Biden sound bite on 60 Minutes. It just doesn't deliver confidence despite the fact I know, internally, that all we can do is wait.

BBB and the student loan situation aren't helping things.

You can't keep saying you understand something while simultaneously demonstrating you don't. It's the same with the immigration argument where you were railing on the feds while simultaneously arguing Beto could magically worsen a situation he will not control. Not to mention advocating for the wall.

BBB doesn't even exist and wasn't passed. I haven't seen one compelling argument for 10k student loan forgiveness driving inflation today. We know what the primary drivers are. We know what the Fed plan is. Why are you focused on tenuous arguments about side dishes, beyond the politics of "democrats bad" lol? It makes no sense.

Even the messaging argument...no I don't think Biden's messaging is good. And yet democrats are tied or leading midterm polls. Clearly my views on the messaging are irrelevant to many Americans as they determine who they're going to vote for in November.
010

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2193 on: September 19, 2022, 06:57:16 PM »
For comparison, Bush made a speech addressing the nation regarding the 2008 financial crisis.



Here's Carter remarking on anti-inflation measures



Sure, it's beyond their control. But as leaders it is their job to assuage the public, make us less fearful, and inject confidence into the nation. Biden and his administration have for the past twelve months pretended it's not even a thing and when faced with a 60 Minutes interview this is what happens.

Compare and contrast.



Biden is not Presidential. He offers even less leadership than Carter.
IYKYK

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2194 on: September 19, 2022, 07:03:53 PM »
Prop: Also, let's be real. Biden's administration hasn't done him favors. You bring up his fed, I'm talking policy. Even more Covid Stimulus, BBB, cancelling student loans are all things that will make a bad situation worse. That's on the Democrats and the Biden administration's crappy progressive politics, not on banks,  not on the federal reserve.

This right here tells me you're just regurgitating talking points and don't understand the issue. I'm not going to provide a Fed deep dive though.

Inflation has been occurring globally since economies re-opened, it makes little sense to blame the administration. Any more than it made sense to blame Biden for gas prices, when prices increased globally as well. And then of course when prices dropped over the last couple months no one could point to any conservative explanation for why. We didn't "start drilling more" after all.

Globally, the dominant drivers of inflation have been significantly increased demand and supply chain delays/shortages due to shutdowns. The war in Ukraine has also played a factor in oil and food (grain shortages) cost increases. Entire Chinese cities that manufactured car chips were suddenly closed during the pandemic (and continue today in some areas), increasing new and used car prices as supply failed to match demand. People spent much of the latter part of the shutdowns spending a shit ton of money purchasing things, often online, and companies couldn't handle the drastic rise from lowered demand (initial quarantine) to maximum demand.

In the US the other major factor is the job market. We went from large portions of our labor force being shut down or reduced to a massive re-hiring spree alongside wage increases. Unemployment is at near record lows, wages continue to rise, and costs are increasing alongside it.

Those are the major drivers of this. Some parts of this will naturally solve themselves. As we move back to consumers spending money on services, vs the highly elevated spending on goods during the pandemic, inflation will decline. But the demand for goods remains relatively high and companies/supply chains continue to struggle to meet it. The fed is pushing higher interest rates, and a potential recession will give companies an opportunity to reduce wage growth.

I understand all of this. You're mistaking me articulating my blame on the administration and saying they could be preventing it fully, when we are in the fumes of a global pandemic and mass shortages. Of course we have inflation. My problem isn't the inflation, it's my frustration in the administrations response, messaging, and overall ignoring it. Even a simple "we as Americans will all bear the brunt of increasing inflation and there's little we can do to stop it. We as Americans need to simply hold tight and look for light at the end of the tunnel" would make me feel better. Instead we get that Biden sound bite on 60 Minutes. It just doesn't deliver confidence despite the fact I know, internally, that all we can do is wait.

BBB and the student loan situation aren't helping things.

You can't keep saying you understand something while simultaneously demonstrating you don't. It's the same with the immigration argument where you were railing on the feds while simultaneously arguing Beto could magically worsen a situation he will not control. Not to mention advocating for the wall.

BBB doesn't even exist and wasn't passed. I haven't seen one compelling argument for 10k student loan forgiveness driving inflation today. We know what the primary drivers are. We know what the Fed plan is. Why are you focused on tenuous arguments about side dishes, beyond the politics of "democrats bad" lol? It makes no sense.

Even the messaging argument...no I don't think Biden's messaging is good. And yet democrats are tied or leading midterm polls. Clearly my views on the messaging are irrelevant to many Americans as they determine who they're going to vote for in November.

The Federal government controls immigration and borders but why should Texas let someone that defends illegal immigrants when facing an illegal immigrant crisis its governor? How can you have a governor that doesn't defends the states best interests? Even Biden agrees with me on the wall and is continuing its build. Hurry it up then.

BBB didn't pass but it was a big part of Biden's agenda. Don't deny it. It was a massive loss and an example for what his vision for the country is and interests are. He's trying to cater to Latinos but Latinos and in much of the state are overwhelmingly anti-illegal immigrant.

Democrats are tied or leading because of Roe v Wade repeal and bad GOP candidates.
« Last Edit: September 19, 2022, 07:14:13 PM by Himu »
IYKYK

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2195 on: September 19, 2022, 07:24:45 PM »
That said, I'm reading more on Beto's stance on the border. Like I said, I'm on the fence regarding Abbott and O'Rourke.

I wrongly pegged Beto's stance on the border as following in step with Biden because of his prior extreme rhetoric and habit for histrionic politics.

https://www.texastribune.org/2022/04/18/beto-orourke-immigration-border-policy/

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/texas-governor-hopeful-beto-orourke-criticizes-biden-immigration-2021-11-21/

Jfc it's refreshing to see Beto even agree that Biden sucks big black hairy balls. Probably Obama's. Democrats at the Federal level are truly disgusting creatures. Locally, they have more rope.
IYKYK

Phoenix Dark

  • I got no game it's just some bitches understand my story
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2196 on: September 19, 2022, 07:38:25 PM »
It's not 1978, and it's surely not 2008. We're not in the midst of a decades long economic decline in the face of Soviet aggression, or the greatest economic collapse since the Great Depression. The economy is shocking strong in many respects. We've got a problem largely based around Americans having too much money to spend on stuff. If ever there was a time for a president to be a dick and express confidence, it would be right now. Might as well get it in before the Fed knocks us off a cliff...

010

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2197 on: September 19, 2022, 07:51:13 PM »
PD do you think Beto will continue the state funded border wall in Texas if elected? What about deploying the Texas National Guard? These things Abbott has done demonstrate good leadership on the issue. He rightfully criticizes Biden's record on immigration but he also critiques Abbott's. How would he do better?

Look at this shit.

Quote
O’Rourke himself has avoided labeling the situation a “crisis” and has said National Guard troops are being sent to address “a solution in search of a problem.” Abbott’s campaign has highlighted that comment in near-daily news releases this month under the headline, “Beto’s Big Border Denial.”
And in an interview, he said he disagrees with the notion that Democrats are divided over the issue and said voters appreciate a nuanced policy.

In the back of my mind I still label Beto a grifter. On one he criticizes Biden as not doing enough but on the other sending National Guard to the border, which is logical for security, is looking for a problem? What are his solutions beyond silly rhetoric?

Abbott is limited as he's just a state governor but he's doing what he can as a leader. That's a man worth voting for.

It's not 1978, and it's surely not 2008. We're not in the midst of a decades long economic decline in the face of Soviet aggression, or the greatest economic collapse since the Great Depression. The economy is shocking strong in many respects. We've got a problem largely based around Americans having too much money to spend on stuff. If ever there was a time for a president to be a dick and express confidence, it would be right now. Might as well get it in before the Fed knocks us off a cliff...
a

It's not 1978 or 2008 but Americans are being hurt by inflation and the President is acting like it's nothing burger. Waving a stick and flexing during this moment would be the height of Democratic ineptitude but very much on brand.
IYKYK

Phoenix Dark

  • I got no game it's just some bitches understand my story
  • Senior Member
010

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2199 on: September 19, 2022, 08:20:15 PM »
He has political ambitions. Guarantee it. He's also liberal going by his record.
IYKYK

james

  • Donate to the JAMES FUND
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2200 on: September 19, 2022, 08:25:10 PM »
As someone who always BACKS THE BLUE put me on the side of LAW AND ORDER. I don't care how famous you are, it's you broke the law and illegally trafficked people across state lines, you need to serve at least a decade in prison.

:O

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2201 on: September 19, 2022, 08:40:40 PM »
I thought you wanted them to have better lives? Won't they in MV? Send more. :)

235,478 in April 239,416 illegals in May alone. Wow.

https://www.risch.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/2022/7/report-president-biden-is-responsible-for-the-crisis-at-the-southern-border

That does it. I'm voting for Abbott. :rejoice
IYKYK

james

  • Donate to the JAMES FUND
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2202 on: September 19, 2022, 09:02:46 PM »
Great, now that we've settled that debate, lets talk about the Muslim problem.

This DeSantis guy has some real interesting thoughts on the subject

Quote
Republican gubernatorial nominee Ron DeSantis spoke at a conference of an anti-Muslim group in October 2017 whose founder argues devout Muslims cannot be loyal Americans.

DeSantis, who resigned from his U.S. House seat last week to focus on his run for governor, spoke to the group meeting in Washington, D.C., taking a hard line on immigration and asylum, and characterizing some U.S. Department of State employees as sympathetic to Arab views.

DeSantis’ address to ACT for America is evidence of another meeting with groups known for extremist views, including a conference featuring speakers who have defended a candidate accused of child molestation, suggested killing Muslims and argued that women are less likely to be in leadership roles because of “biological causes.”

Founded in 2007, ACT for America promotes itself as the “largest national security grassroots organization.” ACT refers to the organization’s former name, American Congress for Truth. The group has built a reputation for lobbying state legislators to ban Sharia law and has referred to Islam as “Islamofascism.”

“Tens of thousands of Islamic militants now reside in America, operating in sleeper cells, attending our colleges and universities, even infiltrating our government,” ACT for America’s website once claimed. “They are here — today. Many have been here for years. Waiting. Preparing.”

https://fcir.org/2018/09/17/ron-desantis-spoke-at-anti-muslim-conference-in-2017/

I cant decide between him and Ted Cruz

Quote
Ted Cruz calls for law enforcement to ‘patrol and secure’ Muslim neighborhoods

Cruz spokeswoman Alice Stewart later said there needs to be a robust law enforcement presence in American neighborhoods where many Muslims live.

"Local, state and federal law enforcement agencies all have divisions that target threats like drugs, gangs, human trafficking and organized crime. Radical Islamic terrorism is a significant and growing threat in this country, but this administration refuses to recognize it because they are afraid of being labeled ‘politically incorrect,’” Stewart said.

Cruz said: "For years, the West has tried to deny this enemy exists out of a combination of political correctness and fear. We can no longer afford either. Our European allies are now seeing what comes of a toxic mix of migrants who have been infiltrated by terrorists and isolated, radical Muslim neighborhoods."
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2016/03/22/ted-cruz-calls-for-law-enforcement-to-patrol-and-secure-muslim-neighborhoods/

Although they both pale in comparison to the OG, hope my main man runs again!

Quote
The United States will have “absolutely no choice” but to close down some mosques where “some bad things are happening,” Donald Trump said in a recent interview, explaining his rationale for doing so.

“Nobody wants to say this and nobody wants to shut down religious institutions or anything, but you know, you understand it. A lot of people understand it. We’re going to have no choice,” the Republican presidential said in an interview from Trump Tower on Fox News’ “Hannity” on Tuesday night.

Those remarks go further than Trump did on Monday, when he said he would “strongly consider” closing mosques as part of a response to last Friday’s terrorist attacks in Paris that killed more than 130 and injured hundreds more.

Asked to explain his shifting position by Sean Hannity, Trump remarked that things are “happening a lot faster than anybody understands.”
https://www.politico.com/story/2015/11/trump-close-mosques-216008

Hopefully the Rs sweep this November and we can focus on the real issues. At least Mexicans eat pork and worship Jesus like the founding fathers intended. In fact, many of them go by the name Jesus, thats how much they love the guy

:O

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2203 on: September 19, 2022, 09:11:15 PM »
:lol

That line of argumentation, huh? "The Republicans hate you!!!!" :stop

Both Democrats and Republicans look into Muslim communities. They're just throwing out stuff for their base. The Christians are misguided and should realize their closest ally, but they are forgiven. I'd much rather walk alongside a "Muslim hater" than someone whose politics are so contrary to Islam like Rep. Omar. Better to make friends with enemies than play footsies with toes of Satan.



:rejoice

The booing of Omar at that one Somali festival in her own district gave me life. Boo her harder. :sabu



Basically, both parties suck and both hate and neither is in line with Islam but the Republicans are the closest. I know who my allies are and it's definitely  not liberals. The solution you're offering isn't to vote Democratic, it's to not vote at all.
« Last Edit: September 19, 2022, 09:17:57 PM by Himu »
IYKYK

james

  • Donate to the JAMES FUND
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2204 on: September 19, 2022, 09:27:34 PM »
I think DeSantis should start chartering flights directly from Caracas to New England.

1. Solves the border crisis
2. Pro-life
3. He appears to have the money to do so
:O

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2205 on: September 19, 2022, 10:28:52 PM »


:lol Democrats running on draining the swamp
IYKYK

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2206 on: September 19, 2022, 11:58:26 PM »
Benji, there's absolutely no reason I should support unvetted illegal immigrants from cartel infested Mexico that terrorizes that country and starts streaks of violence on the border. Thousands streaming into the state of Texas daily, unvetted, who could be very much tied to the cartel. What if they bring guns? What if they come to traffic Americans? Nope. They can fuck off. If they're a genuine migrant who traveled to America to escape political upheaval they have my sympathy and should go through legal channels at the border so that they can be vetted and ID'd. We ID anyone that flies into our borders, we should do so for every single gotdamn channel of entry and I'm not a Nazi for believing so. Finish the wall, force legit migrants genuine and legal entry, relax legal immigration laws so that you don't have to be a rich tech worker to immigrate legally, put more guns on the border, strike a deal with Mexico to make their side of the border also strong. Send guns on the Mexican side of the border too.

I thought the Democrats supported legal entry for migrants? So why let them cross such unsafe territory to America? Nope. Finish the wall and force them through CBP. When immigrants in the past came to America they came through legal channels, namely Ellis Island. Build a wall and make a new Ellis Island like port on the southern border for people to get through legally and welcome to America. If they wanna come, they gotta do it right. End of.

 I won't let the left redefine this word and label all illegal immigrants "migrants". I won't and I will not let them.
My dude, all your appeals are complete nonsense. The "legal channels" of the past were everywhere in the country, Ellis Island was a way station for immigrants coming in through New York City not the only legal path of entry into the United States. Even after the blatantly xenophobic Immigration Acts of the 1920s, Ellis Island was simply a filthy inhumane detention center. The concept of "illegal" immigration made no sense to America until America began sealing its borders and imposing ethnic quotas, if you came to America you were a "legal" immigrant period.

You're not just demanding the borders be sealed but you're talking about committing something that could plausibly be interpreted as acts of war against a neighboring country because of an incredibly minor problem you only seem to believe comes from all Latinx people not born in America.

I'm not even talking about restoring America to the open borders past it had for the first hundred plus years of the country, I'm merely talking about making the current immigration system less insane and kafkaesque. You claim to want this but at the same time seem to also want a police state imposed on Americans while inflaming the situation within a friendly neighboring country and then punishing anyone who tries to escape the situation you're deliberately making worse to punish innocent people who share a heritage with criminals.

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2207 on: September 20, 2022, 12:00:50 AM »
What are Republicans strong on?
Personally, I'm a big fan of tax cuts that are difficult to repeal.

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2208 on: September 20, 2022, 11:13:33 AM »
Lmfao party is full of shit

Quote
If Democrats truly want to “save democracy” from MAGA Republicans, why is their party spending millions in this year’s primaries to boost . . . MAGA Republicans?

A new analysis by The Washington Post found Democrats have shelled out $53 million this year to aid “far-right” candidates in Republican primaries. In Illinois alone, they coughed up a whopping $35 million to help Donald Trump-backed state Sen. Darren Bailey defeat Aurora mayor Richard Irvin, who could’ve been the state’s first black governor.

https://nypost.com/2022/09/12/dems-spending-on-maga-republicans-belies-just-how-cynical-their-threat-to-democracy-cries-are/
IYKYK

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2209 on: September 20, 2022, 11:25:10 AM »
Benji, there's absolutely no reason I should support unvetted illegal immigrants from cartel infested Mexico that terrorizes that country and starts streaks of violence on the border. Thousands streaming into the state of Texas daily, unvetted, who could be very much tied to the cartel. What if they bring guns? What if they come to traffic Americans? Nope. They can fuck off. If they're a genuine migrant who traveled to America to escape political upheaval they have my sympathy and should go through legal channels at the border so that they can be vetted and ID'd. We ID anyone that flies into our borders, we should do so for every single gotdamn channel of entry and I'm not a Nazi for believing so. Finish the wall, force legit migrants genuine and legal entry, relax legal immigration laws so that you don't have to be a rich tech worker to immigrate legally, put more guns on the border, strike a deal with Mexico to make their side of the border also strong. Send guns on the Mexican side of the border too.

I thought the Democrats supported legal entry for migrants? So why let them cross such unsafe territory to America? Nope. Finish the wall and force them through CBP. When immigrants in the past came to America they came through legal channels, namely Ellis Island. Build a wall and make a new Ellis Island like port on the southern border for people to get through legally and welcome to America. If they wanna come, they gotta do it right. End of.

 I won't let the left redefine this word and label all illegal immigrants "migrants". I won't and I will not let them.
My dude, all your appeals are complete nonsense. The "legal channels" of the past were everywhere in the country, Ellis Island was a way station for immigrants coming in through New York City not the only legal path of entry into the United States. Even after the blatantly xenophobic Immigration Acts of the 1920s, Ellis Island was simply a filthy inhumane detention center. The concept of "illegal" immigration made no sense to America until America began sealing its borders and imposing ethnic quotas, if you came to America you were a "legal" immigrant period.

You're not just demanding the borders be sealed but you're talking about committing something that could plausibly be interpreted as acts of war against a neighboring country because of an incredibly minor problem you only seem to believe comes from all Latinx people not born in America.

I'm not even talking about restoring America to the open borders past it had for the first hundred plus years of the country, I'm merely talking about making the current immigration system less insane and kafkaesque. You claim to want this but at the same time seem to also want a police state imposed on Americans while inflaming the situation within a friendly neighboring country and then punishing anyone who tries to escape the situation you're deliberately making worse to punish innocent people who share a heritage with criminals.

I'm being realistic and sane. You're being idealistic and nuts. America is the top country in the world in many areas. Not all, but many, and the world's sole superpower. Many come here for a better life. Fine! But guess what! We can't take everyone. Resources are limited. One of the most illogical contradictions of progressives is their incessant need of a greater social safety net while also proclaiming the need the for infinite immigration. These two points are utterly contradictory. How much immigration is too much? Have you ever asked that? You have the mind of an utopian child. America is supposed to take everyone and everything that comes upon this country? Nope. If you are a migrant go through legal channels. Wait for your case to be approved. Otherwise, unless you're a child or pregnant woman, you should have a CBP gun to your face. Some of these people traveled from places like Venezuela. They stopped in Mexico, a place with their same language. They can find a place to live there.

A police state? Every nation in the world does this. Stay with an expired visa? Welcome to deportation land. Try to be an illegal immigrant in Japan or France, Egypt, Italy, or even Saudi Arabia. You'll get a quick boot to the ass and a pistol whip to the face. In Egypt you get lifetime imprisonment, which has recently been amended, but still strict. Close the border. Add more men (guns) on it. Talk to Mexico into doing the same. Send the illegals packing. You will not guilt trip me with changing my mind on what's right through a pedantic appeal to emotion. Try it with someone that cares.
« Last Edit: September 20, 2022, 11:40:33 AM by Himu »
IYKYK

Nintex

  • Finish the Fight
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2210 on: September 20, 2022, 11:45:19 AM »
The dumbest thing is that when you land on an airport of your own country with your passport, they scan your luggage, check your vaccine status and demand you wear a mask.
If you packed anything illegal or not allowed like a banana or a prescription drug that you forgot you had in your bag you will pay a hefty fine or will be denied entry.
If they suspect you of literally anything they will go through your phone to see if you've been texting Bin Laden in the after life or strip search you.

However, if you walk across the border or climb over a fence illegally with 150 others suddenly all these rules don't apply.
At some point literally anything that protects land borders is deemed 'off limits' or 'radical'.

If you want your country to have borders and a process of admission, you are literally a Nazi now. :idont

So either the same airport security standards are applied to the land borders or we scrap everything including airport security and have real open borders.
🤴

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2211 on: September 20, 2022, 11:55:44 AM »
I mentioned that earlier, Nintex. The double standard stings. Whenever you land in any country you have your passport checked. I, as an American, have to go through TSA every time I fly and that's within my own country. If they wanna be Americans, hey, they're in for a reckoning because over here we follow the gotdamn rules.

Why in the fuck would I allow people that:

1. I don't know
2. I don't know their background
3. Coming from Cartel infested Mexico

It belies any standard of common sense.

Seal the border. Add more guns to the border. Finish the wall. Deport fresh arrivals en masse. Keep sending them to snooty liberal areas where they think they know better because fuck them.
IYKYK

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2212 on: September 20, 2022, 12:05:30 PM »
Nintex, do you think that progressivism is a rejection of anything that's the status quo? Like, what is progress, really? If you have one thing, that's considered a standard norm is it progressivisms job to fight against it no matter what that standard is? Because that's what it's starting to feel like.

Also remember, that despite all the "Nazi" talk it wasn't that long ago that both parties were on the same page about illegal immigration. This is but one example of the Democratic Party's moving further left than the Republicans moving further right.
« Last Edit: September 20, 2022, 12:11:42 PM by Himu »
IYKYK

Nintex

  • Finish the Fight
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2213 on: September 20, 2022, 01:02:19 PM »
I don't think even progressives know what progressivism is at this point. Jimmy Dore has pointed this out time and time again. They just want something to shout at and people to donate.

The main issue now is that a great number of working class people hate the politicians (and of course this happened before) but the new development is that now the politicians on the 'left' hate the people they are supposed to govern too.
They now openly call them enemies of the state just for not supporting their failed policies and then they cry about disinformation and how no one trusts them anymore. When people protest they want them silenced or jailed.

The right has a different problem and that is a 'radical' religious element that has returned back from the depths. Trump sort of kept them contained by saying the things they wanted to hear without having to actually act on it.
But now they see their momentum (especially among the youth) as an opportunity to not just stop secularisation but reverse it. 
🤴

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2214 on: September 20, 2022, 02:32:10 PM »
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2019/04/david-frum-how-much-immigration-is-too-much/583252/

Quote
Under present immigration policies, the U.S. population will exceed 400 million by 2050. Nobody is seriously planning for such population growth—building the schools and hospitals these people will need, planning for the traffic they will generate. Nobody is thinking very hard about the environmental consequences, either. The average American causes the emission of almost 17 tons of carbon dioxide each year, quadruple the annual emissions of the average Mexican and 45 times the emissions of the average Bangladeshi.

The question before the United States and other advanced countries is not: Immigration, yes or no? In a mobile world, there will inevitably be quite a lot of movement of people. Immigration is not all or nothing. The questions to ask are: How much? What kind?

Too little immigration, and you freeze your country out of the modern world. Too much, or the wrong kind, and you overstress your social-insurance system—and possibly upend your democracy. Choose well, and you build a stronger, richer country for both newcomers and the long-settled. Choose badly, and you aggravate inequality and inflame intergroup hostility. How we choose will shape the future that will in its turn shape us.

Great article despite the headline
« Last Edit: September 20, 2022, 02:40:07 PM by Himu »
IYKYK

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2215 on: September 20, 2022, 02:36:52 PM »
I'm being realistic and sane.
You have the mind of an utopian child.
unless you're a child or pregnant woman, you should have a CBP gun to your face.
Try to be an illegal immigrant in Japan or France, Egypt, Italy, or even Saudi Arabia. You'll get a quick boot to the ass and a pistol whip to the face. In Egypt you get lifetime imprisonment, which has recently been amended, but still strict. Close the border. Add more men (guns) on it. Talk to Mexico into doing the same. Send the illegals packing. You will not guilt trip me with changing my mind on what's right through a pedantic appeal to emotion. Try it with someone that cares.
Why in the fuck would I allow people that:

1. I don't know
2. I don't know their background
3. Coming from Cartel infested Mexico

It belies any standard of common sense.

Seal the border. Add more guns to the border. Finish the wall. Deport fresh arrivals en masse.
God Bless America, land of liberty and home of the free. Unless Himu doesn't know you personally and you look like someone he's decided he hates, then enjoy your boot in the ass and pistol whip to the face for trying to improve your life. You should be thankful you aren't being deprived of your life like realistic and sane countries! And all the Americans who get to have their constitutional rights erased because they live near the border? Fuck you for not wanting to militarize your daily life in loyalty to the state! Don't you realize that the adult needs some innocents to be punished?

I wasn't trying to appeal to emotion, I was trying to appeal to your own claims of what your concerns were. Instead you're now making clear you just want to see people be hurt and don't actually give a single shit about the things you spent how many posts claiming were your concerns rather than hatred of others. I don't have a problem with people taking glee in the suffering of others they've decided they should hate irrationally, I just prefer people be honest about it as you now are.

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2216 on: September 20, 2022, 02:42:11 PM »
:lol

Hatred.

That word is used too often. Suffering of others, as if there's an easy answer. Force and might and heavy laws are the only real deterrant to illegal immigrants.

Nintex look at Canada.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2018/07/canada-immigration-success/564944/
« Last Edit: September 20, 2022, 02:47:58 PM by Himu »
IYKYK

james

  • Donate to the JAMES FUND
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2217 on: September 20, 2022, 03:00:27 PM »
The problem with radical leftists like Benjamin is that they believe in the free movement of labor. I wouldn't be surprised if he reads the drivel printed by radical communist John Smith. What we need is a strong central government or individual who decides which people are capable leaders, which are good workers, and which don't belong in our society. We need to go back to our roots, and create an agrarian society by forcibly relocating the urban population to the countryside to work on collective farms.
:O

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2218 on: September 20, 2022, 03:02:27 PM »
I ask you, what have the people of Ohio done to demonstrate they should be able to access the world outside its borders? :snob

james

  • Donate to the JAMES FUND
  • Senior Member
Re: USA Politics Thread |OT| Cleaning up the town
« Reply #2219 on: September 20, 2022, 03:18:49 PM »
:O