Author Topic: The NBA thread (Read 1520683 times)

Joe Molotov · « **Reply #1140 on:** February 19, 2011, 11:19:02 PM »

Blake Griffin should have dunked the entire trophy into the back seat of the car and the drove over Charles Barkley in it.

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #1141 on:** February 19, 2011, 11:52:41 PM »

Reggie and Chuck really were hatin' tonight. Reggie has been sour all season about Ray breaking his record

I can barely stand to listen to games he calls now.

I like The Basketball Jones' ranking best:
Dunk Rank, Top 5: (1) DeRozan's Showstopper, (2) Epic Vale's Two Nets, (3) Blake's Elbow, (4) DD's Easy Bay Funk Remix, (5) Ibaka's Dr. J.

Pity it's the dumb car stunt that will get replayed forever. Basically anyone in the league could have made that dunk, except maybe Steve Nash.

Stoney Mason · « **Reply #1142 on:** February 20, 2011, 12:51:52 AM »

[youtube=560,345][/youtube]

Stoney Mason · « **Reply #1143 on:** February 20, 2011, 12:00:52 PM »

[youtube=560,345][/youtube]
[youtube=560,345][/youtube]
[youtube=560,345][/youtube]
[youtube=560,345][/youtube]

Stoney Mason · « **Reply #1144 on:** February 20, 2011, 12:52:40 PM »

DeRozan's reverse windmill was my favorite dunk. That's the kind of dunk I like. I think I like Blake's dunks more in the flow of the game rather than in a competition like this.

Great Rumbler · « **Reply #1145 on:** February 20, 2011, 12:57:03 PM »

Quote from: Wrath2X on February 20, 2011, 12:44:48 PM

I was pissed how the 3 ball dunks and the two dunks at the same time got good scores. I prefer the actual dunks to the gimmicks.

Save the actual dunks for real games, the All-Star Game is all about style and gimmicks.

Phoenix Dark · « **Reply #1146 on:** February 20, 2011, 08:08:12 PM »

Craig Sager

Phoenix Dark · « **Reply #1147 on:** February 20, 2011, 08:10:19 PM »

Stevie Wonder at the game

Stoney Mason · « **Reply #1148 on:** February 20, 2011, 08:21:29 PM »

Are you gonna go my way.

Really?

Phoenix Dark · « **Reply #1149 on:** February 20, 2011, 08:34:25 PM »

Quote from: Stoney Mason on February 20, 2011, 08:21:29 PM

Are you gonna go my way.

Really?

He'll be playing that song at sports events thru 2040

Stoney Mason · « **Reply #1150 on:** February 20, 2011, 11:26:54 PM »

Decent enough all star game. Got competitive in the fourth because of Lebron and Kobe which is what you want.

[youtube=560,345][/youtube]

Great Rumbler · « **Reply #1151 on:** February 21, 2011, 12:32:01 AM »

Durant had a big game too, especially those 5 points near the end.

Bocsius · « **Reply #1152 on:** February 21, 2011, 11:05:44 PM »

Reportedly a done deal. Carmelo to the Knicks. Everyone but Amare to Denver.

Smooth Groove · « **Reply #1153 on:** February 21, 2011, 11:13:21 PM »

Quote from: Bocsius on February 21, 2011, 11:05:44 PM

Everyone but Amare to Denver.

At least the Knicks are also getting back Ronaldo Blackman but they still won't win a championship before Stoudemire and Anthony have retired.

Stoney Mason · « **Reply #1154 on:** February 21, 2011, 11:20:05 PM »

Quote

The New York Knicks have acquired Carmelo Anthony, league sources told ESPN The Magazine's senior writer Chris Broussard on Monday night.

Knicks Blog
Looking for more information on your Knicks? ESPNNewYork.com has you covered. Blog

League sources also told Broussard that none of the teams can officially confirm the deal until Tuesday.

The swap is a three-way deal including Minnesota, a league source told Broussard.

As a part of the deal, Denver will get Wilson Chandler, Raymond Felton, Danilo Gallinari, Timofey Mozgov, the Knicks' 2014 first-round draft pick, the Warriors' 2012 second-round pick, the Warriors' 2013 second-round pick and $3 million in cash while Chauncey Billups, Shelden Williams, Anthony Carter and Renaldo Balkman will head to New York, according to the Denver Post.

New York will send Anthony Randolph and Eddy Curry to Minnesota as part of the deal, according to the newspaper.

"I'm glad its over," Nuggets coach George Karl said, according to the Denver Post. "I'm glad it's an opportunity to reinvent. I think everybody handled it as classy as you could handle it. There's some sadness to it, there always will be."

Photos: Carmelo Anthony's career

Stay in Denver? Go to N.Y. or L.A.? As MeloDrama plays out, enjoy photos of
a star's career: Carmelo Anthony

Anthony wasn't at the Nuggets' practice on Monday night. Instead, the All-Star forward was in Burbank, Calif., taping a segment on "Conan."

Anthony, who has been the subject of intense speculation as Thursday's trade deadline approaches, stayed behind in Los Angeles following the NBA All-Star Game while his teammates gathered at the Pepsi Center.

Team spokesman Tim Gelt told The Associated Press that Anthony's absence was excused. Late Monday afternoon, Anthony tweeted: "Headed to Burbank to film THE CONAN SHOW."

Anthony has been the subject of trade talks ever since he declined to sign a three-year, $65 million extension with the Nuggets last summer. His biggest pursuers were the Knicks and New Jersey Nets.

http://sports.espn.go.com/new-york/nba/news/story?id=6145912

pilonv1 · « **Reply #1155 on:** February 21, 2011, 11:41:31 PM »

Don't know how but the Knicks defense is worse now. And they can't rebound. Will be hilarious to watch.

TakingBackSunday · « **Reply #1156 on:** February 21, 2011, 11:44:35 PM »

Billups to NY!

Stoney Mason · « **Reply #1157 on:** February 21, 2011, 11:52:09 PM »

Quote from: pilonv1 on February 21, 2011, 11:41:31 PM

Don't know how but the Knicks defense is worse now. And they can't rebound. Will be hilarious to watch.

It wasn't like they were going to go anywhere with the squad currently as assembled anyway. Better to roll the die and try to be great while the moment is there.

Smooth Groove · « **Reply #1158 on:** February 21, 2011, 11:57:34 PM »

Best thing about this trade is that Melo now gets to play Lebron 4 times a year. He usually gives his best effort in those match-ups.

Mandark · « **Reply #1159 on:** February 22, 2011, 12:17:16 AM »

Good for the Nuggets. They managed to get quite a haul, compared to what teams usually get for a disgruntled star (remember Toronto's take for the Vince Carter trade? Me neither).

Phoenix Dark · « **Reply #1160 on:** February 22, 2011, 12:25:26 AM »

NY gets Billups too? Holy shit

CajoleJuice · « **Reply #1161 on:** February 22, 2011, 12:28:11 AM »

I don't know enough about basketball to make a judgement call, but people whose opinions I usually respect do NOT seem to like this trade. The Knicks really gave up a shitload.

Mandark · « **Reply #1162 on:** February 22, 2011, 12:32:34 AM »

It was a ton to give up if they thought they had a good shot at getting him in free agency.

Good chance it makes them a little worse in the short term, too. But it's a lot easier to acquire players roughly as good as the ones they gave up than it is to get another Carmelo.

Then again, maybe Amare's knees give out and none of this matters.

Smooth Groove · « **Reply #1163 on:** February 22, 2011, 12:46:35 AM »

Just came across Basketball reference's community rankings today.

Pretty good list. I can't argue with their top 5 although my 6-10 are probably different.

pilonv1 · « **Reply #1164 on:** February 22, 2011, 12:48:14 AM »

@ LeBron being higher than Kobe.

Phoenix Dark · « **Reply #1165 on:** February 22, 2011, 12:51:03 AM »

Quote from: pilonv1 on February 22, 2011, 12:48:14 AM

@ LeBron being higher than Kobe.

Invalidates the entire list

kobe kobe kobee

Smooth Groove · « **Reply #1166 on:** February 22, 2011, 12:51:21 AM »

The gap should be even larger.

Great Rumbler · « **Reply #1167 on:** February 22, 2011, 12:55:33 AM »

Quote from: Phoenix Dark on February 22, 2011, 12:51:03 AM

Quote from: pilonv1 on February 22, 2011, 12:48:14 AM
@ LeBron being higher than Kobe.

Invalidates the entire list

kobe kobe kobee

Kobe Bryant? What's he done lately? Overrated player total.

Smooth Groove · « **Reply #1168 on:** February 22, 2011, 01:01:45 AM »

The real travesty is Havlicek being ranked as only the 6th greatest white player, 7th if you count Karl Malone. He's pretty much the only white player that could not only score but guard the best black players 1 on 1.

pilonv1 · « **Reply #1169 on:** February 22, 2011, 01:05:09 AM »

There's too many current players in that list anyway.

Chris Paul? Jason Kidd? DWAYNE WADE one spot behind Mikan? I don't even see Kevin McHale. gahbage

Stoney Mason · « **Reply #1170 on:** February 22, 2011, 01:06:13 AM »

Quote from: CajoleJuice on February 22, 2011, 12:28:11 AM

I don't know enough about basketball to make a judgement call, but people whose opinions I usually respect do NOT seem to like this trade. The Knicks really gave up a shitload.

It's much harder to get a superstar much less two versus rebuilding a bunch of lesser players and a bench. Yes the knicks gave up a lot and took on a lot but if they are serious about winning a title now (well not this season but in the next couple or three) is probably the time to actually go for it rather than waiting for Amare to blow out his knee again. It's better to try to build a team around Melo and Amare and a bunch of scrubs rather than what they had in place which was just a .500 basketball team. They could have potentially waited until the off-season but then Melo might have been pissed about leaving money on the table and might have said no out of spite. Who knows.

This is New York. You either go for it big or you don't go for it. It's not Oklahoma or Utah or something where people have somewhat realistic expectation for the franchise.

Edit: Note I re-read this and it kind of came off as a bit hectoring so just to be clear this wasn't aimed at you CajoleJuice. Just my general thoughts on the subject.

Smooth Groove · « **Reply #1171 on:** February 22, 2011, 01:08:21 AM »

Yeah, it gets really weak after the top 20 but 1-20 is mostly solid.

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #1172 on:** February 22, 2011, 01:27:43 AM »

Stoney knows what's going on here

. If I was a Knicks fan, my one big concern now would be that the next CBA might make it hard for teams with 2 big-ass contracts in place to get surrounding pieces. I doubt it will be much of a problem for a team like the Knicks though. There is always a way to pay players if you really want to.

The REAL excitement for the hardcore hoops fans starts now...do the Nuggets completely break it up before the trade deadline on Thursday? There are a LOT of nice pieces there that could affect the playoffs way more than Melo and Gallinari will.

Smooth Groove · « **Reply #1173 on:** February 22, 2011, 01:31:56 AM »

Steve Nash going to a top 5 contender would be awesome.

Phoenix Dark · « **Reply #1174 on:** February 22, 2011, 01:36:49 AM »

Seems like a good move. They weren't winning this year (or next year) anyway, and have time to get some players around Melo/Amare. In the meantime they'll sell out the Garden and give fans what they want. This could make them a hotspot for older FAs chasing rings, like the Heat. Maybe they pick up some decent role players who would have gone to the Heat or Lakers in the off season.

Getting Billups will definitely help too.

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #1175 on:** February 22, 2011, 01:47:41 AM »

Quote from: Smooth Groove on February 22, 2011, 01:31:56 AM

Steve Nash going to a top 5 contender would be awesome.

He doesn't even have that big of a contract. If I were the Lakers, I'd sure as hell try to get him. The scary thing about them is that they've always had crappy PGs. And who could be more perfect to serve up assists to the Big 3 in Miami. Dallas is another idea, and they have the depth to make a trade work. Beaubois and Butler, done.

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #1176 on:** February 22, 2011, 04:32:18 AM »

uh, the Knicks are one game over .500. Are you fucking kidding me. What is waiting for them in the off-season?

pilonv1 · « **Reply #1177 on:** February 22, 2011, 05:14:25 AM »

Could have tried to sign someone straight up in the off-season but it's not guaranteed and you have to contend with the new CBA.

I'm interested to see what the Nuggets do with Felton, surely they aren't keeping Lawson and Felton.

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #1178 on:** February 22, 2011, 06:07:18 AM »

The Knicks are quite possibly gonna be THE free agent destination now, asssuming they'll have more money than Miami (although that's not a given witht the CBA). Dwight Howard, Chris Paul and Deron Williams all have only AA year left on their deals and could well pull a Melo next season. Can't believe that there are people that don't like this for the Knicks.

Mandark · « **Reply #1179 on:** February 22, 2011, 07:09:17 AM »

Well, if they could have gotten Carmelo in the offseason for nothing (or for a pittance like Miami paid Cleveland for LeBron), then they should have done that. They could have either gone forward with two big time scorers and a bunch of young role-players, or parlayed those guys into Paul/Howard/D-Will/Disgruntled Star X (whom they might land anyway; what does this do for their cap obligations in the '12 offseason?).

If Anthony was actually going to sign an extension with the Nets, then they made the right call (for themselves and for Melo, who would have been stuck on a terrible team).

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #1180 on:** February 22, 2011, 08:16:55 AM »

Yeah, but let's remember that they just got snubbed by LeBron, Bosh etc etc last offseason. The Dolans have always been eager to throw cash and assets at anyone halfway decent, no way would they have had the patience to let Melo's contract expire.

CajoleJuice · « **Reply #1181 on:** February 22, 2011, 12:38:47 PM »

Quote from: Stoney Mason on February 22, 2011, 01:06:13 AM

Quote from: CajoleJuice on February 22, 2011, 12:28:11 AM
I don't know enough about basketball to make a judgement call, but people whose opinions I usually respect do NOT seem to like this trade. The Knicks really gave up a shitload.
Edit: Note I re-read this and it kind of came off as a bit hectoring so just to be clear this wasn't aimed at you CajoleJuice. Just my general thoughts on the subject.

You are way too diplomatic. I don't give a shit, that wasn't harsh at all.

My understanding of the situation is exactly like yours, Mandark. I just guess there's no way for us to tell if Melo would have gone and signed an extension with the Nets if this didn't happen. This is not like when the Mets gave up total garbage for Johan Santana. The Knicks actually gave up valuable pieces. If they wouldn't have gotten Melo anyhow, then it's worth it, but otherwise...

But like Cormac says, the Knicks have been snubbed before. I'd like to think the Knicks would have been attractive if they finished a few games over .500, though? Whatever, I might start watching games again now, and that's what they were shooting for.

Phoenix Dark · « **Reply #1182 on:** February 22, 2011, 02:28:56 PM »

Quote

CHARLOTTE, N.C. -- Toronto Raptors guard DeMar DeRozan vows he's finished competing in the NBA's slam dunk contest unless the myriad props that dominated Saturday's event are eliminated.

Asked Tuesday if he believes he was robbed when he didn't reach the final of the competition, DeRozan replied, "I think so."

Blake Griffin of the Los Angeles Clippers won by leaping over a car to edge Washington's JaVale McGee in the last round.

"I'm a dunker. Dunk contests, you go out there and dunk. I'm not into all the props and everything," DeRozan said at shootaround before Tuesday's game against Charlotte. "I try to come out with a creative dunk and do it and go from there. My fans liked it and you can see the reaction from a lot of people afterward.

"If there's a dunk contest next year I'll do it. But not no prop dunk contest."

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=6147372

Great Rumbler · « **Reply #1183 on:** February 22, 2011, 04:24:50 PM »

Sounds like sour grapes to me. Props are awesome.

CajoleJuice · « **Reply #1184 on:** February 22, 2011, 05:26:48 PM »

Nate Silver

http://fivethirtyeight.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/02/22/deal-for-anthony-may-limit-knicks-upside/?hpw

Yeah, don't like the trade.

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #1185 on:** February 22, 2011, 06:52:19 PM »

So a team with Amare, Chris Paul and Melo projects to 47 wins?

I think even Hollinger would look at that and think 'that's fucked up'. Show me a 47 win team this season that those 3 couldn't beat playing 3 on 5 with you and I to round out the numbers.

Bocsius · « **Reply #1186 on:** February 22, 2011, 11:06:27 PM »

I'll team with those 3. Just as long as they know I'm getting my shots.

Smooth Groove · « **Reply #1187 on:** February 22, 2011, 11:23:32 PM »

I've owned NCAA Div. 1 players before. Can I get the 5th spot?

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #1188 on:** February 22, 2011, 11:24:51 PM »

Quote from: Bocsius on February 22, 2011, 11:06:27 PM

I'll team with those 3. Just as long as they know I'm getting my shots.

cortisol shots is all you'll get broseph

Mandark · « **Reply #1189 on:** February 22, 2011, 11:43:53 PM »

That Silver article is a good reason why you can't just apply baseball sabrmetric reasoning to basketball. The player interactions are more complex and the publicly available data is limited (a lot of the good stuff is proprietary to NBA teams which keep much more detailed records to get an edge).

Even if you accepted EWA as an end-all stat*, the logic of converting it to a cash value and getting a sum for the roster makes no sense. Only five players can play at a time. At the very least you'd want to calculate EWA/48min, then figure a team's best rotation with starters maxing out at ~40 minutes, cause that's how it's going to be in the playoffs.

Plus the economic analysis is off. Having star players will let New York use the cap loopholes (if they survive) to get aging stars chasing a ring and role players looking to get on the bandwagon. The players they traded away were mostly outplaying their salary because they're on rookie contracts. If you don't trade them you'll wind up with basically the same roster for a lot more money in a few years (see: Trailblazers, Portland).

Like I said on the last page, this might actually make NY a worse team in the near term. But it sets them up for some serious U-shaped improvement.

spoiler (click to show/hide)

*I'm on record as being a big Hollinger fanboy, but you know who was consistently the worst rated SG in the league in terms of EWA during the early 00's? Bruce Bowen.

[close]

Smooth Groove · « **Reply #1190 on:** February 22, 2011, 11:59:04 PM »

Btw, I was completely serious about schooling those Division 1 players but they just happened to be female. LOL

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #1191 on:** February 22, 2011, 11:59:29 PM »

I'm wondering if this will give Billups a boost or not. He had a giant fork in his back last time I saw him in Denver.

How do you like the sound of Battier to the Celtics, Mandark? I haven't bothered to watch many Rockets games this year because they are so middle of the road. It seems like it should be a very nice fit though. Pierce will need a breather in the playoffs for sure.

Mandark · « **Reply #1192 on:** February 23, 2011, 12:08:23 AM »

Haven't seen much of him this year either, but assuming he hasn't fallen off sharply, he's the archetype of the role player good teams want: spaces the floor, plays defense, has a good attitude. Not a great offensive player, but good teams will already have top-notch shot creators. You know Rondo could find him for those corner 3's, for example.

Any contender should take a hard look at acquiring him, but the C's don't have a lot of trade assets. I'm actually kind of surprised that he didn't get snapped up in the last year and a half as the Rockets went with their youth movement.

Smooth Groove · « **Reply #1193 on:** February 23, 2011, 12:10:13 AM »

I've seen Battier play a lot in the past few seasons and he doesn't seem well suited to guard the type of wing player that the Celtics usually have a problem with, i.e. slashers like Wade. Also, Kobe is probably too familiar with Battier for him to be an effective Kobe stopper in the finals.

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #1194 on:** February 23, 2011, 12:16:40 AM »

Yeah, but it's more-or-less impossible to guard slashers these days, particularly the PGs. All you can do is slow them a bit, hope they take jumpers instead and try to make it back on the other end.

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #1195 on:** February 23, 2011, 12:20:30 AM »

The Cs have a fair amount of injured assets they could probably live without for the stretch run, particularly Marquis Daniels and Jermaine O'Neal. Still, if they have Delonte West, Shaq, Big Baby and Nate for the playoffs, they're pretty well set. They don't have a whole lot of value to other teams though. I doubt they will stay pat if they can help it of course - the playoffs are going to be brutal this year.

Smooth Groove · « **Reply #1196 on:** February 23, 2011, 12:21:16 AM »

I was just thinking the other day how Iverson's PER would go way up in today's NBA because his FG% would be much closer to 50%. That combined with how much foul trouble he would get the other team in, he could easily win more than 1 MVP.

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #1197 on:** February 23, 2011, 12:31:35 AM »

Yeah, and he'd have played another 2-3yrs at his peak too with these rules. Especially if he'd taken better care of himself (weights and diet).

Just look at Monta Ellis for an example of how untouchable AI would be, given AI's superior talent and athleticism.

Mandark · « **Reply #1198 on:** February 23, 2011, 12:51:24 AM »

I hate to sound like a crank, but Iverson would only have been better if he adjusted his game, even with the hand-checking rules.

I don't mean anything about Playing The Right Way or any of that, but he always seemed very willing to take low percentage 2 point jumpers off the dribble, when he was way faster than anyone else on the court. Constantly going to the rim could have shortened his career, given his slight frame, but I saw him live at a few games and every time I got the impression of someone who could run by anyone but didn't always make the decisions to capitalize on this.

Sort of a reverse of Steve Nash, or Chris Paul on one leg.

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #1199 on:** February 23, 2011, 01:19:04 AM »

That's undeniable, but no-one would be successful doing nothing but driving to the rim. That's all Corey Maggette does, for example. Most people couldn't tell you what team he plays on, despite owning almost everybody in the league in terms of getting to the rim and drawing fouls for years. AI did take too many but he might well have driven more if he had gotten beaten up less.

News:

Author Topic: The NBA thread (Read 1520683 times)