Author Topic: The NBA thread (Read 1520785 times)

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #4980 on:** April 19, 2012, 11:54:55 PM »

Quote from: Flannel Boy on April 19, 2012, 11:26:29 PM

Quote from: Cormacaroni on April 19, 2012, 10:50:51 PM
Another implication of the low shooting percentages in clutch time is that defense is more significant than offense in those situations.

I don't think either changes in significance. The lower shooting percentage is probably just the result of fatigue, predictability (the ball is going to be in a limited number of players hands), double-teams, and time constraints. If, for example, the Lakers are down by three with five seconds to go, the ball is going into the hands of Kobe, who has played 40 minute. He'll be double or triple teamed at the 3-point line, and he'll have very little time to get a shot off.

That's all valid but it's not just that. All the time-outs play into the hands of the D (allows coaches to sub in defensive specialists and set-up a half-court defense rather than having to defend the full court in transition, for example), as well as literally taking one player off the court (the inbounder). A team that is well-coached defensively can really shine in those situations, I think. Whereas the offensive team often ends up playing to weaknesses rather than strengths (see Philly this year for many many examples - it got destroyed at the end of close games this year for a number of reasons, some of which are mysterious to me but also because it has young athletes who do well in transition but not the half-court I think)

Seen this?

http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/40886/outscoring-opponents-in-the-clutch

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #4981 on:** April 19, 2012, 11:58:41 PM »

So, Miami is drawing the Magic in the first round (as of today at least, though likely fixed by now). Hard to imagine an easier first round with Dwight out.

DJ_Tet · « **Reply #4982 on:** April 20, 2012, 01:04:45 AM »

I want to see Dell Currys numbers in those stats. For a guy who played on a ton of shitty teams he made a tremendous amount of true buzzer beaters for game winners and ties/OT.

Also, everyone knew he would get the ball too and there was nothing to be done about it. Best pure clutch jumper I've ever seen.

Stoney Mason · « **Reply #4983 on:** April 20, 2012, 01:07:57 AM »

Clippers Suns game has been pretty good.

Stoney Mason · « **Reply #4984 on:** April 20, 2012, 01:21:27 AM »

Suns steal it.

Beezy · « **Reply #4985 on:** April 20, 2012, 02:11:10 AM »

Quote from: Cormacaroni on April 19, 2012, 11:58:41 PM

So, Miami is drawing the Magic in the first round (as of today at least, though likely fixed by now). Hard to imagine an easier first round with Dwight out.

Isn't it Heat - Knicks right now? Although the way they're playing Knicks still have a chance of taking the 6th spot from the Magics with Howard gone.

etiolate · « **Reply #4986 on:** April 20, 2012, 03:26:29 AM »

Dwight Howard's year = Seriously WTF is going on dude

DJ_Tet · « **Reply #4987 on:** April 20, 2012, 07:01:35 AM »

I knew I wasn't being too hard on him. They lost to the Bobcats by 15 that night, just think about that. The Hornets beat the Bobcats without Gordon or Kaman playing, but Dwight Howard led the Magic to a 15 pt loss.

DJ_Tet · « **Reply #4988 on:** April 20, 2012, 01:14:42 PM »

At one point before Howard was even hurt ESPN had a stat that Orlando was second only to the Bobcats in 15+ point losses this season.

Of all the teams legitimately tanking the season, none of them except the worst team in our lifetimes had lost more times by a shitload of pts than a team 'actually trying.'

Stoney Mason · « **Reply #4989 on:** April 20, 2012, 08:37:28 PM »

Lakers at San Antonio this evening on espn. Kobe is playing.

T234 · « **Reply #4990 on:** April 20, 2012, 09:04:39 PM »

Quote from: Beezy on April 16, 2012, 06:57:51 PM

I hate Reggie Miller as a commentator.

Reggie Miller is to you how Christian Laettner is to me.

Joe Molotov · « **Reply #4991 on:** April 20, 2012, 09:44:31 PM »

Bobcats still have four more chances.

Stoney Mason · « **Reply #4992 on:** April 22, 2012, 01:29:28 PM »

OKC at Lakers 3:30 est

Knicks on now with Amare back.

Regular season ends this Thursday btw.

Stoney Mason · « **Reply #4993 on:** April 22, 2012, 04:38:47 PM »

Ron Artest being Ron Artest

Stoney Mason · « **Reply #4994 on:** April 22, 2012, 04:51:42 PM »

TakingBackSunday · « **Reply #4995 on:** April 22, 2012, 05:21:20 PM »

fucking artest

also, good lord this game is zzzz. The Lakers are so fucking boring to watch. They're even making the Thunder look boring, possibly the most fun team in the league.

Stoney Mason · « **Reply #4996 on:** April 22, 2012, 06:41:49 PM »

Ended up being a crazy game. Lakers win.

TakingBackSunday · « **Reply #4997 on:** April 22, 2012, 06:47:13 PM »

well I'll eat my crow. Kobe was shit until the 4th quarter. The big story today though: westbrick and durant were awful.

etiolate · « **Reply #4998 on:** April 22, 2012, 08:20:21 PM »

That was a lunatic elbow. Like I'm not sure Artest knew there were other people int he world at that time. He went totally Lennie with the mouse there.

Joe Molotov · « **Reply #4999 on:** April 22, 2012, 09:53:24 PM »

World Peace upside yo head.

Phoenix Dark · « **Reply #5000 on:** April 22, 2012, 10:24:15 PM »

Wow @ Artest. He knew Harden was right near him and still did that shit.

dude might have a concussion

pilonv1 · « **Reply #5001 on:** April 22, 2012, 11:33:30 PM »

fuck my team

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #5002 on:** April 22, 2012, 11:37:23 PM »

another devastating win, eh

pilonv1 · « **Reply #5003 on:** April 22, 2012, 11:43:39 PM »

Previously it was crushing

this one was devestating

one more would be cataclysmic

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #5004 on:** April 23, 2012, 12:10:52 AM »

Jackson could be the first coach in the history of sports to be fired for winning too much

pilonv1 · « **Reply #5005 on:** April 23, 2012, 12:42:12 AM »

It's not his fault. Wolves were fucking horrendous and they didn't go full tank early enough.

The only thing I can blame him for tonight is not taking Jenkins out when he hurt his knee.

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #5006 on:** April 23, 2012, 02:21:49 AM »

i basically haven't watched any games in about 2 weeks 'cause i'm just assuming every team is tanking or resting stars or whatever. Am I missing anything?

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #5007 on:** April 23, 2012, 02:23:14 AM »

Also, I'm pretty cool with where the Celtics are at now. They'll probably go out to the Bulls in the 2nd round but hey. So long as they go down swinging. They will at the least be a fun underdog to root for, with a puncher's chance.

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #5008 on:** April 23, 2012, 03:52:06 AM »

Well shit, Harden is confirmed as having a concussion. If LeBron is anything to go by, he's going to be terrible for at least a couple of weeks. I find it hard to believe it was deliberate but damn, Artest is dumb

DJ_Tet · « **Reply #5009 on:** April 23, 2012, 04:20:59 AM »

Hard to believe it was deliberate? Did you see the play?

Beezy · « **Reply #5010 on:** April 23, 2012, 05:28:34 AM »

Quote from: DJ_Tet on April 23, 2012, 04:20:59 AM

Hard to believe it was deliberate? Did you see the play?

Artest is a head case. It could have been a ref or a teammate near him at that moment. They'd catch that elbow too. He still needs to be suspended for it.

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #5011 on:** April 23, 2012, 08:15:48 AM »

I saw it and agree it looks incredibly bad, but I think it's just too staggeringly dumb to be deliberate, even for Artest. I mean, he wasn't fighting for position (he was under the OKC basket, and I don't even think the ball was in play!), he was celebrating after a dunk (which is so unusual for him that the whole arena's eyes were on him...) - it just makes no kind of sense that even someone as dumb as that would go for a flagrant elbow at that time.

DJ_Tet · « **Reply #5012 on:** April 23, 2012, 09:42:18 AM »

Unless he was having a seizure I don't see how cocking your arm back and throwing an elbow constitutes a 'celebration.'

I agree that he could have thrown a wild bow in that situation, it was the 'cocking' of the arm that made it look deliberate to me.

And Artest is legitimately crazy, I mean, for real. He always has been. This is the guy who got invited to train with Jordan for his comeback and actually broke his ribs. He was crazy in college.

He'll be crazy when he's 60. And when you're crazy, anything is on the table, including throwing an elbow right at someone's head for the world to see.

Stoney Mason · « **Reply #5013 on:** April 23, 2012, 09:45:20 AM »

I don't really care whether it was "intentional" or not. The debate about how somebody inwardly is, isn't something that interests me. Especially for Ron Artest. What I can say was that it was an utterly dangerous and stupid move either way and I hope he gets suspended for quite a bit. The dude is a knucklehead. Always has been. Always will be.

Flannel Boy · « **Reply #5014 on:** April 23, 2012, 09:59:27 AM »

When he spun around after the dunk, Artest was directly in front of Harden, who he then hit him in the chest as he was winding up for the elbow. Bottom line is that he knew or SHOULD HAVE known Harden was there.

Great Rumbler · « **Reply #5015 on:** April 23, 2012, 10:00:15 AM »

DJ_Tet · « **Reply #5016 on:** April 23, 2012, 10:59:13 AM »

Quote from: Stoney Mason on April 23, 2012, 09:45:20 AM

I don't really care whether it was "intentional" or not. The debate about how somebody inwardly is, isn't something that interests me. Especially for Ron Artest. What I can say was that it was an utterly dangerous and stupid move either way and I hope he gets suspended for quite a bit. The dude is a knucklehead. Always has been. Always will be.

I agree. Even if it was someone with no past incidents or infractions, I wouldn't be able to give them the benefit of the doubt on that play. The fact that it was Artest just solidifies it in my mind.

DJ_Tet · « **Reply #5017 on:** April 23, 2012, 11:15:01 AM »

Former Duke and Portland Trailblazer (and Celtic) Alaa Abdelnaby with a great point on twitter:

Quote

Metta,when you "accidentally" elbow someone,you are surprised as anyone. You didn't even act like it was an accident! #dumbass

Great Rumbler · « **Reply #5018 on:** April 23, 2012, 11:32:12 AM »

Artest should be suspended for one game more than it takes James Harden to come back.

Flannel Boy · « **Reply #5019 on:** April 23, 2012, 03:35:28 PM »

Laker fans are pretty awesome

Quote

Did he deserve an elbow? Maybe not. But don't pretend Harden didn't have anything in mind when he collided with Artest.

Flannel Boy · « **Reply #5020 on:** April 23, 2012, 03:38:02 PM »

Every single Bobcat except one (and barely) has a PER below league average.

DJ_Tet · « **Reply #5021 on:** April 23, 2012, 05:02:26 PM »

Kemba, a rookie who is shooting what, 35%?

So bad.

etiolate · « **Reply #5022 on:** April 23, 2012, 05:48:34 PM »

got blown the fuck out by the Kings

impressive

DJ_Tet · « **Reply #5023 on:** April 23, 2012, 06:00:49 PM »

It was. We have a tendency to play our worst against the worst. Got blown out twice by the Wizards, got swept by the Pistons. Hadn't lost to the Kings since 2008 and it was over 3 minutes into the game.

Ganhyun · « **Reply #5024 on:** April 23, 2012, 06:30:44 PM »

What chances do the Hawks have in the playoffs?

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #5025 on:** April 23, 2012, 06:35:09 PM »

Quote from: Ganhyun on April 23, 2012, 06:30:44 PM

What chances do the Hawks have in the playoffs?

Stoney Mason · « **Reply #5026 on:** April 23, 2012, 06:35:16 PM »

Quote from: Ganhyun on April 23, 2012, 06:30:44 PM

What chances do the Hawks have in the playoffs?

They've tended to play better in the playoffs than in the regular season in recent years for what is essentially a squad of under achievers. They have a tough matchup in the first round against the Celtics who have played much better in the second half. It's possible they can win that series but I still expect the Celtics to. If they do win its hard to see them going further although I suppose it depends on the second round matchup. They would be competitive with any teams in the conference in a series outside of Miami and Chicago which says more about the weakness of those other squads than the strengths of Atlanta.

Phoenix Dark · « **Reply #5027 on:** April 23, 2012, 06:41:55 PM »

So are the Spurs considered title contenders? I'm still baffled at their record

Chicago v OKC finals?

Stoney Mason · « **Reply #5028 on:** April 23, 2012, 06:44:59 PM »

Quote from: Phoenix Dark on April 23, 2012, 06:41:55 PM

So are the Spurs considered title contenders? I'm still baffled at their record

Chicago v OKC finals?

Why not. They got knocked off by a very tough Grizzlies team last year. They will always be a solid squad. In the east the overwhelming favorites are clearly the Heat or Chicago.

I think the West is a lot less clear. A lot of people like the Thunder but it wouldn't be shocking for a team other than them to get there. I think San Antonio, the Thunder, and the Lakers all have a legit shot.

And the Clippers or Grizzlies could upset anybody potentially.

That first round Clippers/Griz series will be brutal.

etiolate · « **Reply #5029 on:** April 23, 2012, 06:48:21 PM »

It depends on if Manu is healthy for the Spurs. Parker has been great this year, but I think Manu has to be able to have those big killer games if they want into the Finals.

Also, remember when it was heavily rumored that the Spurs had offered Parker & Richard Jeffferson to the Kings for their draft pick & Omri Casspi?

Way to be cheap Maloofs.

Stoney Mason · « **Reply #5030 on:** April 23, 2012, 07:00:23 PM »

What's kinda sad is that if the Mavericks had resigned Chandler they would still be a title contender this year instead of an after thought. I think its almost always bad policy to not actively try to repeat with nearly the same squad. You just never know when you are going to get those chances.

DJ_Tet · « **Reply #5031 on:** April 23, 2012, 07:05:49 PM »

Been arguing with a moron about that on OA. He seems to think they will get Howard and Deron with the cap space saved by not signing Chandler.

Never mind the two years you wasted of Dirk's prime waiting for these pieces to hopefully fall in place. And of course now there's no guarantee Howard's back will hold up or what type of player he will be when he comes back.

You don't dismantle a championship team until they lose in the playoffs. I can understand not signing Barea but not signing Chandler was a mistake.

TakingBackSunday · « **Reply #5032 on:** April 23, 2012, 07:09:45 PM »

I can't wait for Memphis/LAC. Gonna be an awesome series.

Stoney Mason · « **Reply #5033 on:** April 23, 2012, 07:11:26 PM »

They will almost certainly get Deron Williams next year. So I get the idea that signing Chandler would have hurt them potentially for the future. I just think when you win a title you owe it to the players and the fans to legit try to repeat. I have no doubt the mavs will always be a competitive good team with Cuban owning them. But its so difficult to get the right mix of a squad to get to that title that I think you gotta at least give a repeat a chance.

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #5034 on:** April 23, 2012, 07:39:05 PM »

Did you guys hear Cuban on Bill Simmons' podcast? He went into considerable detail about why they did it. He basically pleaded the new CBA above all. He's clever and generally a great owner but occasionally he does commit these sins of over-prudence (not resigning Nash being the most egregious of course, although it was very defensible at the time)

Great Rumbler · « **Reply #5035 on:** April 23, 2012, 07:41:47 PM »

It wouldn't have been nearly as bad if Lamar Odom hadn't been such a massive bust.

pilonv1 · « **Reply #5036 on:** April 23, 2012, 07:42:55 PM »

Re-signing Chandler would have given them no flexibility long term. If he'd signed for 1 year then I think they would have done it in a heartbeat.

Cormacaroni · « **Reply #5037 on:** April 23, 2012, 07:51:11 PM »

Yeah, they'd have had an old, expensive team with no draft prospects for the next 5 years. I mean, Beaubois is the only draft pick they've developed at all in recent years and they are basically at the end of their tether with him I think. Once they get rid of Kidd and Terry, it'll look like a whole different team. Tough choice though, I'm sure Cuban was very very tempted to keep the band together. Chandler is well worth what he's getting paid.

Phoenix Dark · « **Reply #5038 on:** April 23, 2012, 07:53:00 PM »

Quote from: Cormacaroni on April 23, 2012, 07:51:11 PM

Yeah, they'd have had an old, expensive team with no draft prospects for the next 5 years. I mean, Beaubois is the only draft pick they've developed at all in recent years and they are basically at the end of their tether with him I think. Once they get rid of Kidd and Terry, it'll look like a whole different team. Tough choice though, I'm sure Cuban was very very tempted to keep the band together. Chandler is well worth what he's getting paid.

Basically the Pistons a few years ago. Way to go, Joe

DJ_Tet · « **Reply #5039 on:** April 23, 2012, 08:38:06 PM »

Quote from: Great Rumbler on April 23, 2012, 07:41:47 PM

It wouldn't have been nearly as bad if Lamar Odom hadn't been such a massive bust.

But they didn't have Odom and had no way of knowing they could get him at the time they made the decision to let Chandler go.

Quote from: DJ_Tet on April 23, 2012, 06:00:49 PM

It was. We have a tendency to play our worst against the worst. Got blown out twice by the Wizards, got swept by the Pistons. Hadn't lost to the Kings since 2008 and it was over 3 minutes into the game.

Nailed it.

News:

Author Topic: The NBA thread (Read 1520785 times)