The NBA thread

[Cormacaroni]

I'm just don't understand the reaction on the internets.

if we'd had twitter in Vince's rookie year, dayum

[Cormacaroni]

jesus christ, the elevation carter has...fucking insane.

And he's also much more fluid with his dunks.  Lots of momentum, lots are arms movement...and still throws it down with fucking force.  Da GOAT in dunks.

all that and agility too. I have always wondered if he could do a 720.

[Phoenix Dark]

(Image removed from quote.)

Yes!  I was gonna request this, but figured no way does that face get passed up.  Surprised it took this long, if anything.

A tad rough on some edges but it's the best one I've created. Shout out to Smooth Groove

[Steve Contra]

I'm just don't understand the reaction on the internets.

if we'd had twitter in Vince's rookie year, dayum

The amount of gifs going back and forth in an hour of him jumping over that poor white dude would probably equal the amount of internet traffic in  the whole of 2000.

[Mandark]

Likewise, thank God we weren't subjected to daily Skip Bayless during MJ's pre-championship years.

[Steve Contra]

Holy fuck at the hurtin' the thunder are putting on the Jazz :'(

[Smooth Groove]

(Image removed from quote.)

Yes!  I was gonna request this, but figured no way does that face get passed up.  Surprised it took this long, if anything.

I told Joe to go to work already

we can't pass up on an instant classic like that

[Cormacaroni]

time for Dwight to bust on Kobe for not knowing what it takes to win in Lakertown methinks

[TakingBackSunday]

the knicks are fucking awful

[TakingBackSunday]

FUCK

poor chandler.  That looked like a really bad knee injury

[Beezy]

 

I need a hug...

[Cormacaroni]

beezy, the correct response on learning of player injury is to get mad and lash out at everyone in range, blame player for rehab laziness, rage at opposing players for dirty play, wish further injury upon them etc. maybe you're just not built to be a pro-sports fan

[TakingBackSunday]

 

[Beezy]

 

[Cormacaroni]

awww

have a hug Beezy

(don't grab my ass)

[Beezy]

Don't worry, I'm not Himu-chan.

[Smooth Groove]

time for Dwight to bust on Kobe for not knowing what it takes to win in Lakertown methinks

ha ha, LA radio was just going on non-stop about how Dwight's recent success is mostly due to Kobe

Ramona Shelburne especially went on non-stop about Kobe's super ability to will Dwight to produce


http://espn.go.com/espnradio/losangeles/podcast/archive?id=2682382

good comedy if you have the time but be warned that some of the mamba idolatry might make you wanna vomit

[CajoleJuice]

Well I had fun watching a couple of Knicks games this season...

[Smooth Groove]

Well I had fun watching a couple of Knicks games this season...

But weren't you born in Florida?

 

[etiolate]

wtf @ kings blowing out the bulls

[Smooth Groove]

not that surprised

Bulls looked horrible against Lakers

[Joe Molotov]

FUCK

poor chandler.  That looked like a really bad knee injury

[Phoenix Dark]

Cheer up Beezy. At least you're not this guy

[CajoleJuice]

Cheer up Beezy. At least you're not this guy

uh, is that me

[Beezy]

Cheer up Beezy. At least you're not this guy

uh, is that me

[Smooth Groove]

Bruce Bowen often did that sliding move under the shooter and never got punished by the league

not even when stars like Ray Allen, Vince Carter, Stoudemire were injured

it's still amazing how the league let a scrub like Bowen get away with so much

[TakingBackSunday]

um, am I missing something?  That dahntey jones play doesn't seem intentional at all.

[TakingBackSunday]

hmmm, actually, his footing when he comes down does seem a bit suspect...

[Smooth Groove]

Kobe should have smacked him and dealt with the pain later

[Stoney Mason]

The Grizzlies are 15-4 since the Rudy Gay trade.

[Cormacaroni]

hollinger has been twittering with the #gng hashtag...i think it secretly stands for 'Gay Now Gone'

[Stoney Mason]

Also the clippers better be careful. They have slid down to 4th and playing the nuggets in the first round is not a breeze. They are almost unbeatable at home. (29-3)

And since jan 1 the nuggets have been 27-7.  (.794)

[Cormacaroni]

Yeah, Paul is not right I think.

[Beezy]

Yeah, Paul is not right I think.

Is he ever?

[Steve Contra]

hmmm, actually, his footing when he comes down does seem a bit suspect...

Yeah I thought it was just Shinobi being salty, but he definitely moved forward with his leg on purpose. 

[Cormacaroni]

Yeah, Paul is not right I think.

Is he ever?

first half of this season he was pretty spry! I saw him dunk once. Now he's back to picking his spots and trying not to let anyone know he's hurt so as not to jeopardize his coming max extension.

[Smooth Groove]

two boring games on TNT tonight

NBA got to do a better job with the scheduling

[Cormacaroni]

hmmm, actually, his footing when he comes down does seem a bit suspect...

Yeah I thought it was just Shinobi being salty, but he definitely moved forward with his leg on purpose. 

it doesn't look great but why would he foul at that point in the game? especially after the shot. It's not like they're playing the Lakers again tonight.

I guess intention doesn't really matter though - result does. Whether he did it on purpose or by mistake or just plain momentum, he didn't stay out of Kobe's space while he was in the air. I have no problem with penalizing Jones here.

[Stoney Mason]

two boring games on TNT tonight

NBA got to do a better job with the scheduling

I think the only real way to fix stuff like this is to build in some schedule flexibility where you can potentially move some games around at a later date.

[Steve Contra]

hmmm, actually, his footing when he comes down does seem a bit suspect...

Yeah I thought it was just Shinobi being salty, but he definitely moved forward with his leg on purpose. 

it doesn't look great but why would he foul at that point in the game? especially after the shot. It's not like they're playing the Lakers again tonight.

[Cormacaroni]

two boring games on TNT tonight

NBA got to do a better job with the scheduling

I just League Pass some games I missed earlier on when this kind of tragedy strikes

[Beezy]

https://twitter.com/KennethFaried35/status/312320470747856897



 

[Cormacaroni]

[Flannel Boy]

How is Mike James now a starting point guard for a team that won an NBA championship two years ago.

[Flannel Boy]

We know how this will end.

[Flannel Boy]

like . . . that--with a brick from Carter from three (why were they going for a three anyway).

 

[Stoney Mason]

Perhaps not even ESPN's most popular columnist can get away with criticizing what may be its most disliked program without repercussion. Citing an unnamed "ESPN source," Deadspin first reported on Thursday that Bill Simmons had been suspended from Twitter for three days for violating the company's social media guidelines with his criticism of a recent "First Take" segment. Without citing a source, The Hollywood Reporter claimed to have confirmed the Deadspin report. ESPN spokesman Mike Soltys told USA Today Sports that the network declined to comment.

The tweets that have apparently drawn the ire of Simmons' employers at ESPN pertained to the argument between "First Take" co-host Skip Bayless and Seattle Seahawks cornerback Richard Sherman. In a particularly argumentative and uninformative segment during last Thursday's episode of ESPN's controversial debate program, the pair traded barbs, with Sherman notably telling Bayless that "I'm better at life than you." As if often the case when Bayless is involved in a shouting match with an athlete, the segment generated plenty of attention. Simmons vented on Twitter about the nature of the segment as well as those who were giving it more attention than he felt it deserved.

 :skip

[Cormacaroni]

wtf

[Phoenix Dark]

holy fuck Walton doesn't give a single shit. tha GOAT color commentator 

[CajoleJuice]

"we'll just dismiss that comment"

[Smooth Groove]

Throw it down, big man!

[Cormacaroni]

Simmons gave him a lot of love in Book of Basketball, i'm sure Walton has his back

[Smooth Groove]

It's a little surprising that Simmons doesn't like Bayless

While Simmons likes to post as a stat head, most of the time he doesn't know what he's talking about (as evidenced by his arbitrary 42 club)

Like Bayless, Simmons really gets fired up when he's talking about mythical sportswriters bullshit like ice-cold blood in the clutch, wanting it more, seizing the moment, etc.

Basically, pot calling the kettle black

Fuck both these clowns

[benjipwns]

Walton still killing it. 

While Simmons likes to post as a stat head, most of the time he doesn't know what he's talking about (as evidenced by his arbitrary 42 club)

I'll never forgive him for this. NEVER YOU HEAR ME:

Q: Why won't you understand shooting percentages? 33 percent from beyond the arc is the equivalent of 50 percent from within. If a guy shot 50 percent from the field, would you be killing him for shooting? Of course not. You obviously realize how stupid that would be. Yet that's what you've been doing -- FOR YEARS -- with your mind-boggling argument against 3-point shooting unless the guy can hit 75 percent of his 3s. Just think about it for a couple of seconds. Please ... we are begging you.
-- Nick, New York

SG: Dozens of readers e-mailed me Nick's same stupid argument in a similarly condescending way, which is what makes the following so much fun: I'm not stupid, YOU'RE STUPID. That 33/50 logic only makes sense in a professional basketball league in which they aren't calling fouls and you aren't allowed to pass to a teammate ... which, as far as I can tell, doesn't currently exist.

Let's say that one player attempts 12 3-pointers and makes four (for 12 points). His teammate attempts 12 2-pointers and makes six, but during that time -- because he's not standing 25 feet away jacking up 3s like an idiot -- he also draws three fouls on his defender, creates two assists for teammates, makes three of four free throws, turns the ball over once, and misses one layup that gets tapped in by a teammate (we'll call it 19 points). You're telling me those two scenarios are equal? If I'm playing LeBron (a 31 percent 3-point shooter), ideally, I want him jacking up contested 3s because that means (A) he's not getting to the line, (B) he's not getting my guys in foul trouble, and (C) he's not potentially creating shots for someone else. I can't defend LeBron when he's going to the basket, especially if he's getting calls. But you know what? If he's happy shooting 3s from 25 feet with a hand in his face, then I'm delighted. This is great. I want him to do that. And if he's doing something that the other team WANTS him to do, then he's doing the wrong thing. I'm fine with shooting 24-footers over 20-footers, but getting into the paint will always be more valuable than jacking up 3s. It's just a fact.

(Note to Nick and everyone else who mailed me the 33/50 argument: I'm doing the Dikembe finger wave at you. Don't come into my house.)

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/090331

Can't find the mailbag where he makes the same exact argument as to why Chauncey Billups is a horrible offensive player, because his FG% was 42%. (And tries to ignore that half his shots were threes and he went to the line as much hitting 90%.) IIRC, this response came at the end of him spending like two or three years savaging players like Billups and "rejecting" anyone who tried to explain this stuff to him.

I always remember this one though because of how he constructs this fantasy narrative about a player camping at the three point line vs. one who does everything on the court. When the original prompting was a player, in Billups, who SPECIFICALLY did not do this getting close to 8 assists a game under Flip and getting to the line as much as he shot threes. (+ that near 90% shooting there.) Shawn Marion was another he was going after.

Simmons has come pretty far on stats though the last few years. One reason I like the podcasts he does with Zach Lowe is that you can just hear in his voice that interest and thirst for stuff from the synergy related stats. And he's more fair than normal when the stats are shitting on him. And I think that's worked backwards to giving him the comfort level with PER and TS% he's adopted over the last couple years on Grantland.

EDIT: oh god, top of the page

[Cormacaroni]

Simmons still wants to pretend that they're only useful as a means of supporting what the naked eye can see, 'cause that's what makes him seem more valuable. But he is presumably paying a ton of money in salary to stat heads like Lowe himself, has been to almost all of the Sloan MIT conferences etc...I think he mostly gets it now.

[benjipwns]

Something did change and I don't know if it was going to Sloan or what, if you look at how he rags on Hollinger, initially it was for basically just using stats at all, then the last couple years it got to him more just ragging on Hollinger like a coworker or friend when he's wrong or disagrees. (And there was some stuff in there that seemed more about how ESPN was using Hollinger's stats.) He even kinda went through the same change with Morey.

I wonder if he had some private moments like this as he got to spending more and more time with these guys:

[Mandark]

You'd have to be a complete humbug to never warm up to Hollinger.

Simmons has plenty of faults and can be headache-inducing when he's dug in on a particular position (like talking himself into Rose over LeBron and Dwight for MVP), but he's obviously passionate about pro basketball and tries to spread that enjoyment and enthusiasm through his writing.  I wouldn't compare him to Bayless, who is remarkable for not having any redeeming qualities whatsoever.  He so blatantly embodies everything wrong with the current era of ESPN sportsyelling that it's hard not to think his whole character is really a scathing piece of performance art.

[benjipwns]

Oh, just to make clear, I agree that Simmons isn't close to Bayless, especially publicly. I still "love" reading Simmons despite his grating flaws. (Cut to everyone nodding.) That's just my favorite Skip Clip and tied in. (And I needed to get my 2013 callback rant about the Billups stuff in before the end of tax season. Cut to Chauncey Billups being called for a foul on a player knocked out of bounds by the ref.)

But I do think Simmons has warmed to stats actually working with these guys, going to Sloan, talking to JVG, Cuban, etc. He hadn't been doing that at Page 2 and before his podcast. He has hinted that he's had more-than-off-the-record conversations with Morey and such similar to that Cuban/Bayless about stuff he had never really thought too closely about.

And the guy has been openly a nervous wreck about appearing regularly on the NBA coverage. It probably pisses him off to see Bayless doing his act and not changing ever while he tried hard to improve himself to do basically the same job and meet a level he expects from the talking heads.

Semi-related side note: I read this in the last couple months:

Decent enough book I suppose (like the SNL one from the same guys) but certainly confirmed my impressions about not wanting to ever work at ESPN. (You know, hypothetically.)

(Also, I couldn't read any of the Stephen A. Smith parts as if he wasn't yelling them at me.)

[Mandark]

Yeah, I was responding to Smooth's post that you condemned to obscurity when you started a new page.

[benjipwns]

We've all been at the bottom of a page at least once in our life. Our own personal Benghazi's.

Actually, since I was thinking about it after mentioning it, in that ESPN book and the SNL one from the same authors, they do dwell a lot on how people were taking DRUGS and HAVING SEX. COWORKERS. WERE. HAVING SEX. (You can imagine how much the drug and sex content takes up of the SNL book in comparison.)

I take back what I said about it being decent, maybe half-decent. First part about the early days is good.