Author Topic: "A black sheriff?!": The Official Topic of Obama and New Era American Politics  (Read 1868131 times)

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Boogie

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I'm convinced at this point that Warren Spector is clairevoyant.

I, for one, look forward to our Deus Ex future.
MMA

Olivia Wilde Homo

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They need to but if they could hardly do it with a 60 seat supermajority, how the hell are they going to pull it off with a 52-56 majority?

The ultimate problem is that Democrats are too afraid to act like winners so they think they need to act bipartisan, which means watering down bills to the point of them being corporate giveaways with marginal net positives for the public.  Republicans will never support the bills anyway, to play to their base who would vote them out if they got too chummy with the Democrats.  Which is why the Democrats need to hamfist lots of reform bills through.  Republicans never needed to fear cloture because giving them credit, they have the balls to do what they want to do.  Why people are waffling about here wondering how it would be like without a Senate I don't think gets it.  Republicans get what they want because they're determined.  Democrats are anything but determined, save for a few.
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siamesedreamer

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What's all the fuss about?

The SCOTUS merely added in the second half of the equation to the formula Barack Obama started when he turned down public financing. Might as well start printing up his second inauguration invitations right now. In the future, WH press briefing will have a daily corporate/union sponsor, a corporate/union sponsorship patch replace the Amercian flag pin on the president's suit, and you'll have to watch a 30-second Cialis advertisement everytime you go to a government website.

Between this ruling and the imminent domain ruling a few years back, the John Roberts court has seriously fucked things up.  

Phoenix Dark

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Rush...
Quote
There are a lot of people, when you say banker, people think Jewish. ... People who have a little prejudice about them. ... To some people, banker is a code word for Jewish; and guess who Obama is assaulting? He’s assaulting bankers. He’s assaulting money people. And a lot of those people on Wall Street are Jewish. So I wonder if there’s – if there’s starting to be some buyer’s remorse there.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2010/1/21/828430/-ADL:-Rush-Limbaugh-reached-a-new-low
smh  :lol


ADL
Quote
    Rush Limbaugh reached a new low with his borderline anti-Semitic comments about Jews as bankers, their supposed influence on Wall Street, and how they vote.

    Limbaugh’s references to Jews and money in a discussion of Massachusetts politics were offensive and inappropriate. While the age-old stereotype about Jews and money has a long and sordid history, it also remains one of the main pillars of anti-Semitism and is widely accepted by many Americans. His notion that Jews vote based on their religion, rather than on their interests as Americans, plays into the hands of anti-Semitic conspiracy theorists.

    When he comes to understand why his words were so offensive and unacceptable, Limbaugh should apologize.
010

The Fake Shemp

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Re: "A black sheriff?!": The Official Topic of Obama and New Era American Politi
« Reply #7384 on: January 21, 2010, 10:53:51 PM »
I don't see anything wrong ???
PSP

Boogie

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SELL YOUR GREENBACKS, IT'S ALL OVER
MMA

Howard Alan Treesong

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but that's a positive stereotype! like Asians being good at math!
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Human Snorenado

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Thread needs a title change to reflect the arrival of our 45th President Scott Brown to the nation's capital.
yar

Stoney Mason

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Typical Limbaugh idiotry.


Obama is going after dem Jews!


Jews=Banks and Wall Street.

Human Snorenado

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What's all the fuss about?

The SCOTUS merely added in the second half of the equation to the formula Barack Obama started when he turned down public financing. Might as well start printing up his second inauguration invitations right now. In the future, WH press briefing will have a daily corporate/union sponsor, a corporate/union sponsorship patch replace the Amercian flag pin on the president's suit, and you'll have to watch a 30-second Cialis advertisement everytime you go to a government website.

Between this ruling and the imminent domain ruling a few years back, the John Roberts court has seriously fucked things up.  

THIS POST BROUGHT TO YOU BY CARL'S JR.

If I had the energy and could still search on GAF, right about now I'd be fiendishly searching your post history for any posts defending Roberts prior to and after his appointment.
yar

Boogie

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THIS POST BROUGHT TO YOU BY CARL'S JR.

If I had the energy and could still search on GAF, right about now I'd be fiendishly searching your post history for any posts defending Roberts prior to and after his appointment.

Why bother?  We all know that searching SD's post history would reveal an embarrassment of riches.
MMA

recursivelyenumerable

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Re: "A black sheriff?!": The Official Topic of Obama and New Era American Politi
« Reply #7391 on: January 21, 2010, 11:40:16 PM »
So wait, what exactly is the legal situation now?  Can the House just pass the Senate bill as is without it having to go back to the Senate, since it will have been passed through both houses?

The Constitution seems to be awfully vague on what exactly passing a bill means.
« Last Edit: January 21, 2010, 11:47:27 PM by recursivelyenumerable »
QED

Human Snorenado

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Re: "A black sheriff?!": The Official Topic of Obama and New Era American Politi
« Reply #7392 on: January 21, 2010, 11:51:05 PM »
So wait, what exactly is the legal situation now?  Can the House just pass the Senate bill as is without it having to go back to the Senate, since it will have been passed through both houses?

The Constitution seems to be awfully vague on what exactly passing a bill means.

Yes, the House could do that.  But the House bill that originally passed was very watered down from what the majority of the caucus wanted originally and barely passed, and the Senate bill is even MORE watered down from that.  So in a fit of pique and bruised egos, nothing will get done, which will further reinforce the idea that Democrats can't do anything so why bother voting for them anyhow?
yar

recursivelyenumerable

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Re: "A black sheriff?!": The Official Topic of Obama and New Era American Politi
« Reply #7393 on: January 21, 2010, 11:54:37 PM »
I thought the problem was that "reconciliation" would mean that the Senate would have to pass it again, though.  Which they might not have to do if the House just passed the bill as is (?).
QED

Human Snorenado

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Re: "A black sheriff?!": The Official Topic of Obama and New Era American Politi
« Reply #7394 on: January 21, 2010, 11:59:16 PM »
I thought the problem was that "reconciliation" would mean that the Senate would have to pass it again, though.  Which they might not have to do if the House just passed the bill as is (?).

Stuffed passed through budget reconciliation doesn't have to go through a cloture vote (requiring 60 votes).

However, it's only supposed to be used for stuff directly related to the budget.  There's a dude named the Senate Parliamentarian (just a dude, not an actual Senator or elected official whatsoever) who gets to decide what does/doesn't qualify, and the thinking is that lots of good stuff (getting rid of discrimination based on preconditions, etc) would get stricken from anything that passed through reconciliation.

What they SHOULD do is suck it up, pass the Senate bill and then immediately introduce legislation to improve it.
yar

Human Snorenado

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Pretty sure passing it through reconciliation requires only 51 votes? I'm not entirely sure.

correct
yar

recursivelyenumerable

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Re: "A black sheriff?!": The Official Topic of Obama and New Era American Politi
« Reply #7396 on: January 22, 2010, 12:10:50 AM »
Man, American government is the kludgiest system since the one I'm currently stuck at work at 9pm debugging.
QED

Gruco

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Re: "A black sheriff?!": The Official Topic of Obama and New Era American Politi
« Reply #7397 on: January 22, 2010, 12:10:58 AM »
From a pure game theory perspective, I'd say any member of the House Dem caucus unwilling to take that step (vote for the Senate Bill) does not deserve my vote.  I certainly plan on calling my congressman's office tomorrow to make this point as clearly as possible.

Most of the analysis from the pragmatic wing of the left has been dead on, as far as I'm concerned.  As ugly as Brown's win was, it was magnified by powers of thousands by the complete chicken littling from the party, top to bottom.  Health Care was a priority when Obama took office with 58 senators.  It weathered the death panel town halls, the gang of six, and the price of Lieberman and Nelson.  And it kept moving, because it was the Right Fucking Thing To Do.  But then a surprise special election, and it's time to head for the hills, even when the bill can be passed, and improved through reconciliation.  The little shits really need to get their heads on straight.

It's been so depressing to read the emails on TPM from staffers talking about Congress is so insular that they obsess about Appointments and Omnibus Appropriations to the point that they actually make taking points to brag about this and apparently thing of the major new legislations as fun little side projects, or something.  Any retreat at this point would just be such a complete and utter glass jaw betrayal that it would take another 8 years of Bush for the base to even think about coming back.  Even if they get that, it unfortunate that they have such little faith their legislation that they don't even think it's worth doing for their own sake.

I still think it's important to look at who is doing what though.  I still don't blame Obama, Reid, or Pelosi (yet).  But ANY House member who does not commit to support the Senate bill at this point does not deserve democrat's support.

Hm, I should go check out what people are kos and FDL are saying about all this.  Really, they should be celebrating the aftermath of the Brown win, if their thoughts on the Senate bill were honest.  Asshats.

Olivia Wilde Homo

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Re: "A black sheriff?!": The Official Topic of Obama and New Era American Politi
« Reply #7398 on: January 22, 2010, 12:15:28 AM »
I thought the problem was that "reconciliation" would mean that the Senate would have to pass it again, though.  Which they might not have to do if the House just passed the bill as is (?).

Stuffed passed through budget reconciliation doesn't have to go through a cloture vote (requiring 60 votes).

However, it's only supposed to be used for stuff directly related to the budget.  There's a dude named the Senate Parliamentarian (just a dude, not an actual Senator or elected official whatsoever) who gets to decide what does/doesn't qualify, and the thinking is that lots of good stuff (getting rid of discrimination based on preconditions, etc) would get stricken from anything that passed through reconciliation.

What they SHOULD do is suck it up, pass the Senate bill and then immediately introduce legislation to improve it.

I agree.  They just need to get it through and get to work fixing it after it is passed.  In time, it could be something decent.
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Phoenix Dark

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Re: "A black sheriff?!": The Official Topic of Obama and New Era American Politi
« Reply #7399 on: January 22, 2010, 12:18:43 AM »
I thought the problem was that "reconciliation" would mean that the Senate would have to pass it again, though.  Which they might not have to do if the House just passed the bill as is (?).

Stuffed passed through budget reconciliation doesn't have to go through a cloture vote (requiring 60 votes).

However, it's only supposed to be used for stuff directly related to the budget.  There's a dude named the Senate Parliamentarian (just a dude, not an actual Senator or elected official whatsoever) who gets to decide what does/doesn't qualify, and the thinking is that lots of good stuff (getting rid of discrimination based on preconditions, etc) would get stricken from anything that passed through reconciliation.

What they SHOULD do is suck it up, pass the Senate bill and then immediately introduce legislation to improve it.

Yup. Too bad the progressives are dead set against doing that, for now. I don't see why they don't agree to pass the senate bill in exchange for a reconciliation bill that changes the excise tax, expands medicaid, and introduces a medicare buy-in. They finally have all the power, and instead of wielding it they're acting like babies.
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Stoney Mason

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Re: "A black sheriff?!": The Official Topic of Obama and New Era American Politi
« Reply #7400 on: January 22, 2010, 12:23:38 AM »
Man, American government is the kludgiest system since the one I'm currently stuck at work at 9pm debugging.

It's like a game with massive exploits that no one bothers to fix.

That's supposed to be dealt with, with amendments but the purveyors of the status quo have completely eliminated that concept from the political vocabulary. That and the deification of the founding fathers. A group of farmers from a few centuries back who built a government for an agrarian society with a relatively small population and when state's rights was a big issue. In other words nothing to do with the current world.

Percept example of a society in stagnation.
« Last Edit: January 22, 2010, 12:26:32 AM by Stoney Mason »

Olivia Wilde Homo

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Re: "A black sheriff?!": The Official Topic of Obama and New Era American Politi
« Reply #7401 on: January 22, 2010, 12:29:16 AM »
Man, American government is the kludgiest system since the one I'm currently stuck at work at 9pm debugging.

It's like a game with massive exploits that no one bothers to fix.

That's supposed to be dealt with, with amendments but the purveyors of the status quo have completely eliminated that concept from the political vocabulary. That and the deification of the founding fathers. A group of farmers from a few centuries back who built a government for an agrarian society with a relatively small population and when state's rights was a big issue. In other words nothing to do with the current world.

Percept example of a society in stagnation.

I'm not sure I understand your post.  How they are deified doesn't have anything to do with how things are done currently.  People just like to reframe their thoughts to be used as a political tool.  Nobody (outside of insane libertarians) actually pays attention to what they said or did.  It's just another pile of shit to be flung at the other side.
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Boogie

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If there's anything that the House should push for, it's to allow the importation of cheaper drugs from overseas.


You're referring to Afghan heroin and Colombian cocaine, not Canadian prescription drugs, right?  :smug
MMA

Stoney Mason

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Re: "A black sheriff?!": The Official Topic of Obama and New Era American Politi
« Reply #7403 on: January 22, 2010, 12:35:22 AM »
Man, American government is the kludgiest system since the one I'm currently stuck at work at 9pm debugging.

It's like a game with massive exploits that no one bothers to fix.

That's supposed to be dealt with, with amendments but the purveyors of the status quo have completely eliminated that concept from the political vocabulary. That and the deification of the founding fathers. A group of farmers from a few centuries back who built a government for an agrarian society with a relatively small population and when state's rights was a big issue. In other words nothing to do with the current world.

Percept example of a society in stagnation.

I'm not sure I understand your post.  How they are deified doesn't have anything to do with how things are done currently.  People just like to reframe their thoughts to be used as a political tool.  Nobody (outside of insane libertarians) actually pays attention to what they said or did.  It's just another pile of shit to be flung at the other side.

My point is more directly a barb at the lack of political will and capability to reform anything which Amendments are just a small part of but an example of how it is nearly impossible to achieve consensus or at least political consensus on good ideas in modern American society. People reflexively shut down good ideas now simply because the other side came up with it. It also doesn't help that you have one political party that has essentially abandoned any concept of government actually being able to do anything outside of wage war and has no interest in reforming anything other than less regulation in any form what so ever. The other political party is simply a slight deviation on that concept with a few tweaks. And the public in general has never been more complacent about the whole situation.
« Last Edit: January 22, 2010, 12:37:22 AM by Stoney Mason »

CajoleJuice

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This might be old

[youtube=560,345][/youtube]
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Oblivion

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It is. Posted it a couple pages back.

Boogie

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If there's anything that the House should push for, it's to allow the importation of cheaper drugs from overseas.


You're referring to Afghan heroin and Colombian cocaine, not Canadian prescription drugs, right?  :smug

Yeah, but I'd be okay with them dropping it in exchange for a no-knock warrant ban concession from the Senate.


:lol

Nicely done.  I think you're learning ;)
MMA

Re: "A black sheriff?!": The Official Topic of Obama and New Era American Politi
« Reply #7407 on: January 22, 2010, 01:02:33 AM »
If there's anything that the House should push for, it's to allow the importation of cheaper drugs from overseas.

But honestly, if the whole thing fails it might just be for the best. The system as it is currently constructed will collapse sooner rather than later, and single-payer is really the best solution for everyone involved.

Even if the House passed legislation, it'd never leave committee in the Senate.  Thank the few, very few (very few) citizens of Montana for that.  Baucus sold himself for a bucket of oxy and lifetime lipitor.  The feds will never negotiate wholesale, whether proscribed by legislation like Medicare Part D or through agreement to pacify Big Pharma's concern with health "reform."

And if you want single-payer, may as well start the process of becoming a "landed immigrant" to Canada.  We're just too selfish, irrational, and regressive to do what's right, morally and fiscally.   :usacry

Plus, as a Canadian you'll get a nifty SIN card.  Doesn't give you free entrance to nudie bars <rimshot>, but at least you can get your appendix removed without indentured servitude.

Stoney Mason

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Re: "A black sheriff?!": The Official Topic of Obama and New Era American Politi
« Reply #7408 on: January 22, 2010, 01:13:38 AM »
Final post for tonight.









http://jamesfallows.theatlantic.com/archives/2009/12/the_filibuster_and_family_full.php

"We have crossed the mark of over 100 filibusters and acts of procedural obstruction in less than one year," Senator Sheldon Whitehouse, Democrat of Rhode Island, said on the floor on December 20, 2009. "Never since the founding of the Republic, not even in the bitter sentiments preceding Civil War, was such a thing ever seen in this body."


To be clear there are some good examples of filibusters for trying to stop stupid policy. (And some horrible ones like some of them that occurred while Civil rights legislation was trying to be passed) And boy how wonderful it would have been if the whole Iraq Adventure could have been one big filibuster. But clearly what we have here is one party that has decided that nothing will pass without every bit of kicking and screaming possible. They really have no interest in real governance.
« Last Edit: January 22, 2010, 01:24:06 AM by Stoney Mason »

Human Snorenado

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So as I asked earlier, back in the day minority parties used to just argue a lot and vote against stuff, but not actually filibuster everything, right? Is that how it worked? I honestly can't remember.

Dude, the post LITERALLY ABOVE YOURS has a graph showing the frequency of filibusters in the past 50 or so years.
yar

Stoney Mason

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So as I asked earlier, back in the day minority parties used to just argue a lot and vote against stuff, but not actually filibuster everything, right? Is that how it worked? I honestly can't remember.

http://www.apsanet.org/imgtest/2002Supermajority-Mayhew.pdf

ToxicAdam

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The Democrats have been trying to paint the Republicans as obstructionist for 8-12 months now. People don't give a shit and won't give a shit until the economy improves.

Democrats have no intention of removing the filabuster either. They love to wield it when a Republican president takes office and tries to appoint anybody. They will never give up that power.

Phoenix Dark

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And individual senators like the power the filibuster gives them, far too much to give it away. What better way to protect the coal industry or whatever industry that has a hand in yer pocket
010

Mandark

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I think the biggest mistake the democrats made was deciding that the proper response to the banking crisis that almost brought down the world economy was to try and enact healthcare reform.

I waffle on this.  Financial reform would have been easier than health reform, and would have been easier last year than it is now.  There were stories coming out that Axelrod, Emanuel, and pretty much the whole inner circle was telling Obama not to take on health reform.

On the other hand, I really believe that health care is far and away the area where reform could do the most tangible good in people's everyday lives.  The current system heaps more insecurity and misery on people who are already towards the bottom of society, rather than giving them a reliable backstop.  It embodies the basic ideas of empathy and mutual responsibility that make me self-identify as a liberal, and I'd trade several of the other planks of Obama's platform if this could pass.

Hell, give me single-payer and you can put Jesus on our currency.  I wouldn't give a fuck.

Sure, that's why Johnson decided not to run in 1968- he was getting primaried and was gonna lose.

I'd say that that's a horrible idea, but after Mr. Harvard Law Review fucked around for a year kissing Republicans' asses in the vain attempt to get them to responsibly govern in lieu of screaming "SOCIALISM" at the top of their lungs and voting no all the time, I'd love to see Howard Dean get in there and spit some fiyah.

This bothers me, cause it's basically a criticism of tone, an inversion of what conservatives and soi-disant "moderates" leveled at Paul Krugman during Bush's first term.

Netroots liberals spent the better part of a decade defending the notion that someone could get angry still make valid points, that someone who cusses but speaks the truth is more worth listening to than a mannered nitwit with a Washington Post op-ed sinecure.  Now it's almost morphed to the idea that cussing makes you serious, and being calm makes you David Broder.  That's why really smart people defend Matt Taibbi columns which contain half a dozen or so obvious lies.

Obama made two mistakes of judgment that you can arguably file under being too conciliatory:

1)  Nominating relatively uncontroversial judges so they would be able to quickly fill vacancies on the court.  They've been held up by Republican Senators despite not being objectionable.

2)  Proposing too small a stimulus package.  They apparently expected the size of the bill to increase as it went through Congress, when in fact it got shaved down.  They had reasons for this: a lot of bills in recent history (transportation, education, energy) wound up more expensive than when they were first proposed, but they badly misread how the DLC Dems needed to make a show of cutting costs.

But other than that?

I understand how frustrating it is to see the centrists be allowed to repeatedly blackmail their party and be rewarded for it, but asking for Obama to "fight" rather than "suck up" is an emotional response.  Who really thinks he'd could make those guys act productive by snarling at them?  Every problem Senator either outpolled Obama by 10 points in their state, or is Joe Lieberman.

You know who's been way more of a force for good than anyone could have expected?  Max Baucus.  The guy is arguably the most conservative Democrat in the Senate, but he's been a driving force to get a bill done.  That happened because Obama co-opted him and made him feel that the administration's cause was his cause as well.  He got treated with kid gloves.  Yeah, he spent too much time courting the ladies from Maine, but if Obama had tried to strong-arm him?  Baucus would have treated Obama like Daniel Patrick Moynihan and Bob Kerrey treated Bill Clinton.

Coalition politics means grovelling and scraping at the feet of people who don't have your respect and don't deserve it.  You don't have to like it, but if you care more about helping millions of people whose lives are affected by this more than you care about punishing a few pompous officeholders, then you have to accept the reality of it.

Mandark

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Reader's Digest Condensed Mandark:

Obama's not running into problems because he's too darned nice.  He's running into problems because he's trying to push an ambitious (though not radical) liberal agenda through political institutions that are biased against ambitious liberal legislation.  The reader is advised not to vote Republican in a fit of pique.

Human Snorenado

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Quote from: Mandark
Coalition politics means grovelling and scraping at the feet of people who don't have your respect and don't deserve it.  You don't have to like it, but if you care more about helping millions of people whose lives are affected by this more than you care about punishing a few pompous officeholders, then you have to accept the reality of it.

The thing is, the politicians that I and lots of other people have (at times against our better judgment) given money to, made calls for, knocked on doors for and otherwise given blood, sweat and tears for don't get that.  I don't mind it so much with the blue dogs, because it's in their nature anyway and a lot of them are going to lose their jobs this November.  That's the cost of not being able to govern.

What really pisses me off are all of the "progressives" who refuse to hold their nose and give 30 million people access to health care.  They're seriously fucking up and should have to pay for it.  But they're in safe seats and won't have to, and since they're politicians it's pretty much accepted that they're too stupid to learn anything.

So I'll schlep my ass to the polls in November, and I'll vote for these assholes again.  But I'm not gonna give them one fucking dime or one fucking minute of my time if they fail to get anything done on health care and financial reform.  Nothing.  Fuck 'em.
yar

Gruco

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Re: "A black sheriff?!": The Official Topic of Obama and New Era American Politi
« Reply #7416 on: January 22, 2010, 01:47:45 PM »
Definitely sympathetic to the idea that Financial reform should have been tackled first.  The thing is, it wouldn't have prevented movement on the others for any reason. Waxman-Markey passed months before the priority Health Care Bill after all.  If Obama and Congressional leadership made financial reform their priority, he'd have been spending all summer with the populist rage as his tailwind, and then once Healthcare came up as the new priority it'd be much further along, and harder to drag out.

In theory, at least.  It's hard to predict alternative universes.  Just as easily Obama could have failed on financial reform as Wall St picked off votes, and without the deadlines and public pressure Health Care could have stalled out in gang of six phase.  So whatever.  It is what it is, I guess, and such is the problem with coming to office with no less that four large scale, high priority legislative initiatives.

Howard Alan Treesong

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[youtube=560,345][/youtube]
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Mandark

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What really pisses me off are all of the "progressives" who refuse to hold their nose and give 30 million people access to health care.  They're seriously fucking up and should have to pay for it.  But they're in safe seats and won't have to, and since they're politicians it's pretty much accepted that they're too stupid to learn anything.

Amen to that.

This is one time I'd really recommend calling your rep's office.  Enough progressive activists have been trying to kill the bill that they really need to be encouraged to vote for it.

I'm about to ring up Donna Edwards' office and urge her to do the right thing.

The Fake Shemp

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Re: "A black sheriff?!": The Official Topic of Obama and New Era American Politi
« Reply #7419 on: January 22, 2010, 05:49:44 PM »
I kind of disagree. Obama pretty much deferred to Congress when it came to health care reform, and really did not have much of a "plan" (which was made up of loose, vague parameters) until people started screaming at town halls and showing up with firearms.

Nothing about this President is ever specific. That's not a problem with his constituents ("You guys just want a drinking buddy, you don't know how politics work!"), that's a problem with him as a leader.

As far as I can see, this is a President that has bent over for financial institutions, made questionable behind-closed-door promises and remained ambiguous on health care reform at a time when Congress needed a firm, public and specific vision for reform.

Obama has let his agenda get away from him not just because there are politicians opposed to social reforms, but because he never brings anything meaningful and concrete to the public. There's nothing tangible. The end result is everyone can interpret his agenda however they want, and there's a ton of noise.
« Last Edit: January 22, 2010, 06:10:02 PM by The Fake Shemp »
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The Fake Shemp

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Re: "A black sheriff?!": The Official Topic of Obama and New Era American Politi
« Reply #7420 on: January 22, 2010, 06:23:27 PM »
Except that I speculate that many here would say that Democrats - as a party - have compromised too much. Now we are at a point where it's either something or nothing, and apparently some politicians wish to choose nothing - while completely forgetting that these types of reform are routinely revisited after passage.

I fail to see how that's difficult for you to understand, but hey, it is what it is.
PSP

Green Shinobi

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"Obama's financial reform falls short"

Quote
First, Obama proposes to limit the scope and size of large financial institutions. But he ignored suggestions to break up the existing financial behemoths, like Goldman, already in the “too big to fail” category. Instead, his proposed law would simply prevent other, smaller institutions from getting larger.

Of course, this only benefits existing companies, by shielding them from competition. And, of course, these existing companies would still be too big to fail.

So, when Obama says: “I'm also proposing that we prevent the further consolidation of our financial system,” he should not be surprised when people notice the word “further.” The problem isn’t further consolidation of the banking industry. The problem is the consolidation we already have. This is one big reason for the public’s anger.

Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0110/31855.html#ixzz0dODXy2Al

 :yuck :yuck :yuck

Oblivion

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Phoenix Dark

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Quote
So here’s an idea, I have been told reliably, that leaders of both Houses are considering: The House would pass a version of the reconciliation bill containing the various amendments and send it to the Senate. The Senate would change it slightly (in ways that the House agreed to), which would require the House to vote on it again. Only after it got the revised reconciliation bill would the House take up the Senate bill. The House could then pass both bills and send both to the president. Problem solved, health-care passes, and we move on.
http://voices.washingtonpost.com/postpartisan/2010/01/how_the_democrats_may_solve_th.html

get it done dammit
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ToxicAdam

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I'm a fan of Olbermann,


Why not just watch pro-wrestling instead?

Human Snorenado

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I'm a fan of Olbermann,

Why not just watch pro-wrestling instead?

Whoa whoa whoa... let's not accuse pro-wrestling of being so over the top and whiny.
yar

Mandark

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I must say I find this fascinating, though I'm not sure how to relate to it.

My ideological opposites seem to be berating progressive democrats for not compromising enough.   ???


I suppose it's like someone said... yeah, maybe from a purely game theory perspective...

seems a lot of these guys would rather bask in the certitude of their own, objective, metaphysical rightness than try to get results in the real world.

:teehee

Olivia Wilde Homo

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« Last Edit: January 23, 2010, 10:53:50 AM by T EXP »
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Rman

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.


Olivia Wilde Homo

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I also find it interesting that most of the women have their arms crossed for their avatars.
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Human Snorenado

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I also find it interesting that most of the women have their arms crossed for their avatars.

Can't let those sinful titties just be SEEN, you know.
yar

Oblivion

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I'm a fan of Olbermann,


Why not just watch pro-wrestling instead?

Meh, I can understand people not liking Olbermann but at least he doesn't lie, or accuse republicans of being like Hitler for ignoring global warming or whatever.

Human Snorenado

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Looks like Obama is putting Plouffe Daddy in charge of his cantankerous kids in Congress.  Thank Jesus.

Quote
WASHINGTON — President Obama is reconstituting the team that helped him win the White House to counter Republican challenges in the midterm elections and recalibrate after political setbacks that have narrowed his legislative ambitions.

Mr. Obama has asked his former campaign manager, David Plouffe, to oversee House, Senate and governor’s races to stave off a hemorrhage of seats in the fall. The president ordered a review of the Democratic political operation — from the White House to party committees — after last week’s Republican victory in the Massachusetts Senate race, aides said.
yar

Phoenix Dark

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Won't matter if dems cower in a corner on health care and other issues.

That being said, just imagine if they grew some balls and pushed a medicare buy-in (say 55yo), public option, drug negotiations, and expanded medicaid through reconciliation. Even I could win an election running on that list of accomplishments :bow
010

Human Snorenado

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I'm not sure all of that can go through reconciliation.  Medicare buy in and expanding medicaid almost certainly, public option probably not.
yar

Olivia Wilde Homo

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I think it will all be about the economy for 2010, not necessarily issues like health care reform.
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Phoenix Dark

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I'm not sure all of that can go through reconciliation.  Medicare buy in and expanding medicaid almost certainly, public option probably not.

They can get a robust public option through it.

http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2010/01/1-reconciliation-2-3-profit.html

It directly effects the budget. Maybe the question mark is there because Conrad gets to decide what's included, and he's no fan of a public option.

edit: hell, but even if they didn't go for a public option, a medicare buy in+drug negotiations+medicaid expansion+national exchange would be far better than anything we'd get if Brown had lost
010

recursivelyenumerable

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Re: "A black sheriff?!": The Official Topic of Obama and New Era American Politi
« Reply #7438 on: January 24, 2010, 04:57:25 PM »
That chart is kind of BS IMO.  It just shows that the stuff the bill provides polls positively and their costs poll negatively.  I don't think you can conclude anything meaningful by "averaging" those.
QED

Dickie Dee

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Quote
I Don't Even Want To Be Alive Anymore

By Rush Limbaugh
January 25, 2010 | Issue 46•04

I know there are a lot of people out there who are upset about some of the things I've been saying on my radio program lately. My comments about the situation in Haiti have hurt and angered many Americans who genuinely care about the plight of the Haitian people, and that hurt and anger will likely never go away. Many of you are probably wondering, "What would compel a human being to say things like that?" Well, here's your answer: I am a very bad person. And, to tell you the truth, I don't really want to be alive anymore.

Try to look at it from my point of view. I have no reason to live. In my 59 years, I've made millions of dollars, built a veritable media empire, and accomplished virtually everything that a man of my limited imagination and worldview could possibly accomplish. And yet, at this point, in no way could you refer to what I'm doing as "living," exactly. I just sort of exist. I derive no real pleasure from life. Oh, sure, I talk a big game about what a golf nut I am and how much I enjoy the taste of a fine cigar, but it's all horseshit. Complete and utter horseshit.

I don't enjoy that stuff. I don't enjoy anything. I don't even want to be here. The sadness and regret I feel every waking hour of my life is absolutely unbearable. I am a miserable pig and I do not want to exist.

The irony is that, even if I did die, the hell I would surely be sent to could not possibly be any worse than the bottomless pool of excrement I already paddle around in like some demented, shit-covered walrus. In fact, every time I hear my voice coming through the headphones I nearly gag, and I think, "What the fuck am I doing?" Why would I say that Michael J. Fox is faking his Parkinson's symptoms? Why would I find it funny to play a song called "Barack the Magic Negro"? Why would I tell people not to give aid to Haiti?

What the fuck is wrong with me?

I live in constant terror and that terror informs my every word, thought, and action.

See, the thing is, I honestly cannot control the bilious hatred and filth that oozes out of my mouth. I want to—believe me, I want to—but I can't. And every time I speak, a tiny voice inside my head is screaming, "Stop talking, you stupid, insensitive prick. JUST STOP FUCKING TALKING. All you do is spread hate and fear, and the world would be a better place without you, you worthless, amoral, cocksucking fuckface."

What I should really do is just commit suicide. I have this little Sunday ritual I started around the time I publicly compared the torture at Abu Ghraib to a fraternity prank, where I climb into my Jacuzzi and put a gun in my mouth. But I can never work up the guts to pull the trigger. A few times I came close to overdosing on prescription pain pills, but my goddamn doctors were always there to save me. If I had any sense, I would just hole myself up in a Red Roof Inn with a case of Jack Daniel's and slowly drink myself into the gaping maw of death itself.

But what can I say? I guess I'm just too much of a fat fucking pussy to follow through.

You know what? I wish someone would just kill me. I'm serious. Yeah, yeah, I know what you're thinking: "Oh my God, how can you say such a thing? You can't print that in a newspaper!" But see, I don't care anymore. I've cried my tears. I've battled my demons, and I've lost. It's over. It's all over. The only thing left for me to do now is just go away. Have I even once contributed a single ounce of good to humanity? Put me out of my misery. I wouldn't make a fuss. I wouldn't even humiliate myself by saying goodbye. For the first time in my odious, pitiful life, I'd accept my fate with quiet dignity.

Then I wouldn't have to live with my wretched, wretched self. Oh, the release.

I've imagined my death a thousand times over, and it's always the same. In my mind's eye, a serene setting comes into view. I see a funeral procession driving down some small-town Main Street in Nowheresville, U.S.A. On one side of the street, a collection of sycophants and morons are paying their respects in subliterate, sanctimonious tones. Meanwhile, on the other side of the street, I can just make out the faint image of a young boy, his brow furrowed in confusion, clutching the hand of his father. "Who is that man, Daddy?" he asks as the hearse containing my bloated, lifeless body rolls by. "Who is that person they speak of?" The father will then lower his head and say, "There, my son, go the remains of Rush Hudson Limbaugh, the most abominable lump of festering dog shit in the history of American broadcasting. May the likes of him never again soil or tarnish the greatness of our fair country."

Please forgive me, everyone. I am so sorry.
___