"A black sheriff?!": The Official Topic of Obama and New Era American Politics

[recursivelyenumerable]

quitters

[Human Snorenado]

[youtube=560,345]JTzMqm2TwgE[/youtube]

Setting aside for a moment the "omg teh moveon is teh LIBRUL BIAS" thing, can someone explain to me how all of the facts in this video aren't, you know, FACTS and the conclusion is pretty self-evident?

[TakingBackSunday]

I don't know, but whenever I see him, I think of this:

[youtube=560,345]kWliylnxSrA[/youtube]

[Great Rumbler]

[youtube=560,345]JTzMqm2TwgE[/youtube]

Setting aside for a moment the "omg teh moveon is teh LIBRUL BIAS" thing, can someone explain to me how all of the facts in this video aren't, you know, FACTS and the conclusion is pretty self-evident?

Don't really see what the problem is here. In just a few more years, I'll be super-rich. Why should I vote for higher tax on the super-rich? Basically shooting myself in the foot there, which is pretty stupid.

[TakingBackSunday]

[Olivia Wilde Homo]

Most poor conservatives, libertarians, and republicans think that a huge pot o' gold is just waiting for them around the corner.  So they see the top 1% or better yet, the 1% of the 1% as their friend and ally to the cause.  These people believe that if they keep the tax rates low for the super rich, the super rich will kick off a few more crumbs off of their table to them.  That and most poor conservatives believe that only them and the super rich are the only people who actually do work; Democrats just lounge about, collecting welfare checks and popping out brown babies.  It feeds well into their closed world, small town narcissism.

Which is a shame because the real result is fucking brutal for millions of people who live in those ass backwards states as they consistently rank the worst in everything.  The worst part is that it is a vicious cycle: as times get harder for them, the more and more they pine for a rich white knight to show up and kick them some crumbs.  Read Deer Hunting With Jesus if you have some time.  Pretty much explains it better than I could.

[Oblivion]

There's also the "moral" argument where a rich guy worked hard to be rich so it would be unfair, wrong and downright criminal for the gubment to "steal' his monies and give it to a presumably lazy, good for nothing minority..

Also too, there's the fear that if we were to tax the richies more, it's socialism and they would all close up their businesses and flee to China or something.

[ToxicAdam]

Setting aside for a moment the "omg teh moveon is teh LIBRUL BIAS" thing, can someone explain to me how all of the facts in this video aren't, you know, FACTS and the conclusion is pretty self-evident?

Reich plays the typical liberal trick here. He draws a line from 1980 (while the economy was slumping in the late 70's, overall it truly was the golden age for the middle class) and ends it today. 1981-1983 was devastating for the middle class as inner cities began to rot and industrial jobs began a long trek of decline due to incredible productivity gains and increased global competition. As the pool of jobs for their skill/education level decreased, the unions and workers were forced to make more concessions to keep what they had and give away wages/benefits of future employees.

If you draw a line from 1970 to 2006 .. it paints a different picture.

As of 2006 (the last year for which trend data are available), real median annual household income had not yet returned to its 1999 peak, making this decade one of the longest downturns ever for this widely-accepted measure of the middle-class standard of living. Over a longer time period, the picture is much brighter; since 1970, median household income has risen by 41%.

http://pewsocialtrends.org/2008/04/09/inside-the-middle-class-bad-times-hit-the-good-life/

Now, much of that can be attributed to two-income families becoming the norm, a boom in higher education (which helped drive up salaries) and the ability for the middle class to carry a much higher debt load.

The stagnation of the middle class since the 80's can be attributed to many things. Some examples are that the costs of health care, higher education and housing that has FAR outstripped the rate of inflation. Those are huge factors in eating away the spending power of the middle class.

Also, one of his bulletpoints was that revenues have evaporated since 1980. This is just not true. Revenues as a percentage of GDP have remained remarkably stable considering all the variety of tax changes that have happened since WWII.



I think Reich would have made a stronger point to attack corporate taxes, as the revenues from them have seen a long downward trend since the 80's. But in this weird age of corporate cronyism we have from both parties, that doesn't seem to be on the table. Much more politically feasible to attack the upper 1% and blame them for all our woes. 

http://www.deptofnumbers.com/blog/2010/08/tax-revenue-as-a-fraction-of-gdp/

[Mandark]

If you draw a line from 1970 to 2006 .. it paints a different picture.

Here is that picture.

[Human Snorenado]

If you draw a line from 1970 to 2006 .. it paints a different picture.

Here is that picture.

 

[ToxicAdam]

Fuck, why do I even bother.

[Van Cruncheon]

Fuck, why do I even bother.

the top 10% wonder why you do, too, but hey

[Phoenix Dark]

It's already the talk of the life-deprived political world. Down at the Republican Leadership Conference today an "Obama" impersonator was part of the festivities. And when he came up on stage it got so bad with questionably appropriate jokes that the organizers of the conference themselves escorted him from the stage before he could finish his act.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/2011/06/fun_times_at_the_republican_leadership_counference.php#more?ref=fpblg

wat 

[Great Rumbler]

Amazing.

[Phoenix Dark]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/06/19/john-mccain-illegal-immigration-arizona-wildfires_n_880145.html

[Oblivion]

[Dickie Dee]

(Image removed from quote.)

Field Trip!

[Mr. Gundam]

My uncle is running for secretary of state here in Washington. I'm so not psyched.

[Phoenix Dark]

10k troops out of Afghanistan this year
33k troops out of Afghanistan by next Summer

[Brehvolution]

Didn't 30k go in last year? so it's really only a net of 13k less.

[huckleberry]

10k troops out of Afghanistan this year
33k troops out of Afghanistan by next Summer

https://twitter.com/#!/mmhastings/status/83680465923489792

[TakingBackSunday]

*Obama announces plan years prior*

Gaffots: Yeah fuck that man he's gonna break his promise

*Obama sticks to his plan*

Gaffots: Lol dude he's just doing it for re-election, what a fuckup

 

[Brehvolution]

http://blogs.ajc.com/jay-bookman-blog/2011/06/17/gas-farm-labor-crisis-playing-out-as-planned/

Barely a month ago, you might recall, Gov. Nathan Deal welcomed the TV cameras into his office as he proudly signed HB 87 into law. Two weeks later, with farmers howling, a scrambling Deal ordered a hasty investigation into the impact of the law he had just signed, as if all this had come as quite a surprise to him.

[TakingBackSunday]

Eric Cantor, why we still got u???

[huckleberry]

http://blogs.ajc.com/jay-bookman-blog/2011/06/17/gas-farm-labor-crisis-playing-out-as-planned/

Barely a month ago, you might recall, Gov. Nathan Deal welcomed the TV cameras into his office as he proudly signed HB 87 into law. Two weeks later, with farmers howling, a scrambling Deal ordered a hasty investigation into the impact of the law he had just signed, as if all this had come as quite a surprise to him.

 


I wonder what Teapartiers think when the hear about shit like this.

[Human Snorenado]

You guys act as if these people acknowledge reality when it's in front of them.  For fucks sakes, they still think lowering rich people's taxes magically cures everything from unemployment to small tits.

[Olivia Wilde Homo]

"Make Shaniqua the welfare queen go out and pick vegetables!"

[TakingBackSunday]

Same sex marriage is minutes away from being passed in New York.

[Barry Egan]

It passed

[Mr. Gundam]

Oh yeah! Go New York!

Very fitting this happened during Pride Week.

[Eric P]

i can't believe it passed!

[Human Snorenado]

What's gonna be awesome is seeing Maggie Gallagher for the next week being furious n' stupid on tv.

[Brehvolution]

i can't believe it passed!

I was amazed as well. Any right wing gnashing of teeth yet?

[Human Snorenado]

For shizzle.

[TakingBackSunday]

That website is abhorrent.

[Mandark]

New York

NRO, William F. Buckley's deformed hellspawn

Fuck, why do I even bother.

Yeah yeah, you're the voice of reason taking time out to educate the youngsters only to be met with glib one-liners.

But look.  Income inequality has been rising for roughly the last three decades.  1980 as a start point isn't some sort of straight-line-in-stochastic-dataset tricksiness.  The early 80's recession didn't have a disproportionate effect on the income gap.  You can start from 1983 to exclude it and you get the same picture.

The 70's were not a golden age for the middle class.  Median wages look better from 1970 to 2006 not because it includes the 70's, but the booms of the mid-late 80's and 90's.  And even then, once you factor in hours worked and overall growth rates, it's a pretty shockingly small slice of the pie going towards people in the middle of the distribution.

I'm not the hugest Bob Reich fan, but in this case he's got most of it pretty right.  The top 1% are receiving proportionally more and more of the country's income, it's significant enough that it's impairing progress for other people, and it has been going on for a few decades now.  This ain't a librul fever dream.

[Phoenix Dark]

herp derp

[TakingBackSunday]

The US could withdraw funding from the United Nations if its members decide to recognise and independent Palestinian state, a close ally of President Barack Obama has warned. Susan Rice, the American ambassador to the UN, said there was "no greater threat" to US support and funding of the UN than the prospect of Palestinian statehood being endorsed by member states...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/palestinianauthority/8597559/US-could-withdraw-funding-from-UN-if-Palestine-state-is-recognised.html

I'm not the only one that expected something different from the Obama administration, am I?

Considering he campaigned on basically being this way, um, no?  In this matter, anyhoo.

[Mandark]

Bush 2 and Obama are the only presidents to specifically say they support a two-state solution, but that's a bit misleading.  The assumption for decades is that a two-state agreement is the only possible endgame, but US presidents didn't want to act presumptuous when the ideas of unification or Palestinian absorption into other Arab countries was still technically on the table.

But importantly in this case, the US' official position is that it supports a negotiated settlement, ie agreed to by both parties.  Obama's statement that got the AIPAC crowd all in a tizzy was that a Palestinian state would be based on 1967 borders "with negotiated land swaps".  They're not gonna support the UN imposing a new Palestinian state.

Whether you think it's right or wrong (I personally think some serious pressure from the UN is welcome), it's basically consistent with what Obama's said since he started running for president and with US policy since seemingly forever.

[Oblivion]

Omg. Grover Norquist on Colbert is (shocku) a tremendous scumbag. He quite literally implied that it's okay for grandma to die than to raise taxes on the top 2%. Holy shit. 

[Brehvolution]

Grover once said that a conservative journalist is a conservative first, journalist second. Whereas a liberal journalist is a journalist first and a liberal second.

[AdmiralViscen]

Omg. Grover Norquist on Colbert is (shocku) a tremendous scumbag. He quite literally implied that it's okay for grandma to die than to raise taxes on the top 2%. Holy shit. 

If the only way you can avoid something is by increasing inequality, then yeah, maybe you can't justify it.

We should maintain the status quo to preserve economic equality in this country?

[Great Rumbler]

Why should tax be "fair"?

[Phoenix Dark]

Omg. Grover Norquist on Colbert is (shocku) a tremendous scumbag. He quite literally implied that it's okay for grandma to die than to raise taxes on the top 2%. Holy shit. 

If the only way you can avoid something is by increasing inequality, then yeah, maybe you can't justify it.

If you had to choose between signing the Civil Rights Act or raising taxes 5%, which would you do?

[Great Rumbler]

Why should tax be "fair"?

Why shouldn't it be?

All government action should be fair; the goal should be to treat all of its citizens equitably.

Treating a guy on the street who doesn't have a job or a home exactly the same as a guy that lives in a huge mansion and makes a billion dollars a year kind of misses the point.

[Great Rumbler]

Why should tax be "fair"?

Why shouldn't it be?

All government action should be fair; the goal should be to treat all of its citizens equitably.

Treating a guy on the street who doesn't have a job or a home exactly the same as a guy that lives in a huge mansion and makes a billion dollars a year kind of misses the point.

Misses the point?  Treating them the same IS the point.

Billionaires don't really need medicare, social security, low-priced/free housing, low-priced/free education, and unemployment.

Now, if we're talking about the Justice system, that's a different story. The homeless guy with no job only wishes the government would treat him exactly like the billionaire.

[Mandark]

Mostly because that depends on what is the text of "the Civil Rights Act" - considering we have had several historically, and / you could be referring to some theoretical future act... 

I've think I've said this before, but the whole "you know there's more than one CRA " comes off as a smarmy attempt to make yourself seem more knowledgeable than the person you're talking to.

In the context of American politics, if people refer to the CRA, they mean the one in 1964, just like talking about "The Vietnam War" means the one that the US was involved with in the 60's and 70's, "The Constitution" means the one of our federal government, etc.  Rand Paul called it "the Civil Rights Act" when he said he couldn't have voted for it, and I'd be surprised if you jumped down his throat for it.

Anyway, you of all people shouldn't be acting like you've got some special familiarity with the history of the civil rights movement and the legislation associated with it.

[Human Snorenado]

Taxing the rich at the same rate as someone living in poverty = preserving equality

Preventing someone from denying service to a distinguished black fellow on the basis of race alone at their business establishment = tyranny

Did I miss anything? 

[Human Snorenado]

Your opinions will never be majority, and your philosophy will never govern this country.  You will die old, bitter and supported by the state you hate so much.  I can think of no better death for you.

[Great Rumbler]

but somehow when it comes to taxes you want nice things and you want them "free" (for others to buy them for you).

No, we want the people who are best able to afford higher taxes to pay higher taxes, rather than have our political leaders throw their hands up and go "Whelp, we don't have enough money right now, better slash education and healthcare for old people!".

[Brehvolution]

The top 1% should solely pay down the deficit since they reaped the most rewards for running up the debt. Using the military to advance corporate interests and let the poor pay it off obviously isn't working.

[Olivia Wilde Homo]

The upper brackets should pay disproportionately more in taxes because they have disproportionately more power.  In the era of trillion dollar deficits, the tax rate should be a minimum of 50% for the upper bracket.  Hell, at least close tax loopholes vs. slashing funding that benefits crumb bums and distinguished black fellows and piling up more debt that will be disproportionally saddled to the same people that funding is getting cut from.  Anyone that believes that in the wake of financial carnage from last decade's laissez faire policy that the answer is less government is insane.  It's like telling a heroin addict that the best way to kick the habit is to double down on the dosage.

Even if the tax rate were ratcheted up to 80-90% for the top 1%, they will still live better than the vast majority.  I know Libertarians oh so desperately wish that they were billionaire captains of industry but it isn't like championing lower taxes is going to make you their friend who will give you some money or a swank job.  They'd sooner send you through the cogs until you're 40, crippled, and unemployed from your bestest buddies at the top.

[Oblivion]

Which makes me curious, is JayDubya rich?

I understand why rich people are against higher marginal taxes (cause they're rich!), but why do poor/working class people go to bat to protect their taxes is something that's just baffling.

[Phoenix Dark]

I could have sworn Mandark explained this a few pages back, or it might have been Prole on facebook. I'm about to pass out from hunger, can't think straight

[Human Snorenado]

I could have sworn Mandark explained this a few pages back, or it might have been Prole on facebook. I'm about to pass out from hunger, can't think straight

Oh sure, the shiftless distinguished black fellow is looking for a HANDOUT of free food from MY HARD EARNED MONEY.  Toughen up, mister!

[Himu]

Real men work for their food. Why do minorities always expect a handout? The white man doesn't ask for handouts and they're at the top of their game sans the looming Mexican uprising. And that's why they're better than us. Don't you see, Phoenix?

[Van Cruncheon]

wait, when did "fair" get repurposed to mean "people with unequal economic stature pay an equal percentage in taxes"

[Human Snorenado]

wait, when did "fair" get repurposed to mean "people with unequal economic stature pay an equal percentage in taxes"

SUNSHINE!  PUPPIES!  MOONBEAMS!  LIBERTOPIANISM!

[Great Rumbler]

Yeah, as long as we're talking about "equality" and "fairness" I want the government to ensure that I make the same amount of money per year as Bill Gates. Or at least Warren Buffett.

[Human Snorenado]

I just want the same quantity and quality of pussy that Timberlake gets.