THE BORE

General => The Superdeep Borehole => Topic started by: Van Cruncheon on July 08, 2007, 10:29:56 PM

Title: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: Van Cruncheon on July 08, 2007, 10:29:56 PM: i have created this thread to serve as a catch-all for any THE SHIELD related discussion, since a good portion of us just bought the series and are watching it.

me and the wife are currrently halfway into season 3.

i observed to my wife that this show is in many ways REAL conserva-porn, especially moreso than the unsubtle 24 and its expostulating, two-dimensional bombast. it's the way conservatives would LIKE the world to be if they weren't self-loathing finger-pointing racists: paternalistic, fundamentally moral but likewise fundamentally pragmatic strongmen watch over a "family" of morally-centered folks of all colors (but one creed: justice uber alles) and stave off a chaotic tit-for-tat world governed by alien thugs and self-centered beureaucrats, ultimately seeking to GET THE JOB DONE unhindered by any perspective or moral not originally derived from their own self-sufficient, can-do ethic. the obstacles set in their path come from the completely amoral and somewhat depersonalized sectors of society: the gangs; the politicos; the erstwhile do-gooders; the chronically needy; the unhinged personalities that cannot accept the patriarchal order required to survive in a difficult world.

on the other hand, it's completely FUCK AWESOME. the politics don't feed the show, and there's a lot of sensibility not commonly expressed in conservative politics -- in fact, the show is so earnestly focused on some semblence of realistic human interaction that it becomes fundamentally apolitical. the strongest moral center comes from a black female detective who is also very progressive in her thinking, although we, the audience, are frequently frustrated by her insistence to PLAY FAIR when vic, our vicarious hypermasculine alter ego, just wants TO GET THE JOB DONE by any means necessary. as TVC pointed out to me, the gay police officer is also played realistically -- the show is not unsympathetic to his plight, but neither does it turn him into a hero: he represses his homosexuality and eventually emerges as a bit of a self-serving villain. female characters are sympathetically portrayed as strong personalities who are kept outside the good ol' boys' system; again, they are never turned into heroes even though we are asked to identify with their struggles. we're asked to be frustrated alongside them. the only black-and-white value expressed is the idea that bureaucrats are often the real villains and look to exploit the challenges of justice and loyalty in order to serve their own interests.

so far, i haven't enjoyed a crime drama this much since hill street blues (which doesn't hold up very well these days). i've heard good things about the wire, though. there's a few problems with the shield, of course: it has a few small deus ex moments -- vic just gets too damn lucky, or collective memories in farmington become awfully short -- necessary to make sure that there's always several high-tension arcs being juggled; and ocasionally, just occasionally, it's hard to believe that there's still doubt about vic's crookedness inside the barn. on the other hand, i haven't watched a show since the sopranos that asks me to identify so effectively with such unidealized personalities, and done it so well that i don't notice any sort of preachiness.

anyway, i'll post more thoughts as i watch. omg omg omg vic mackey <3 <3 <3
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: CajoleJuice on July 08, 2007, 10:38:38 PM: ...I have no response...that was perfect.

:bow

But really, did you get up to the fight yet? How FUCK AWESOME is it!?!?
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: MrAngryFace on July 08, 2007, 10:41:14 PM: I havent started it yet, finishing Venture Bros and The Practice....in fact that gives me a thread idea.
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: Van Cruncheon on July 08, 2007, 10:42:12 PM: the fight? right now, i'm in the thick of decoy squad versus strike team, claudette's been made captain, shane's being a super-distinguished mentally-challenged fellow manbaby, and

spoiler (click to show/hide)
dutch strangled a cat :o :'(
[close]
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: CajoleJuice on July 08, 2007, 10:45:06 PM: Hmmm I thought you were halfway...

you're only a few episodes in aren't you? :P
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: Van Cruncheon on July 08, 2007, 10:46:02 PM: episode 6, my wife informs me! there's only like 13 this season!
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: CajoleJuice on July 08, 2007, 10:48:55 PM: Am I going insane...this should've happened in episode 4...

spoiler (click to show/hide)
Shane vs. Tevon
[close]
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: Van Cruncheon on July 08, 2007, 10:50:15 PM: oh, that. where mara hits tavon with the iron? :o :o :o

yeah, FUCK'T UP, shane is such a racist fuckbag

sorry, i thought there might be a bigger fight, like mackey versus kern or something.
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: CajoleJuice on July 08, 2007, 10:50:59 PM: Ain't gonna push me aside for no DARKIE
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: TVC15 on July 08, 2007, 10:52:43 PM: I want to read the OP but I am only on season 2 :(

Favorite characters:

1) Vic :hump :hump :hump :hump
2) Shane :bow :bow :bow
3) Claudette :interracial :interracial
4) Dutchboy

Least favorites:
1) Julien :punch :punch :punch :punch
2) Mrs. Mackey :punch :punch :punch
3) Acevada :punch :punch
4) Gilroy :punch :punch
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: Van Cruncheon on July 08, 2007, 10:53:30 PM: gilroy gets so totally and thoroughly fuck owned by vic in season 2 :punch :punch
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: CajoleJuice on July 08, 2007, 10:54:13 PM: Acevada gets thoroughly fuck owned...period.

Oh, and I think I'm on exactly the same episode as you, Drinky. I'm gonna watch a bunch tomorrow.

Scratch that, I'm on 9.
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: Saint Cornelius on July 08, 2007, 10:55:38 PM: I've watched most of the 1st season episodes and I fucking LOVED it.

But if you Shield fans aren't watching the Wire then :'(
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: CajoleJuice on July 08, 2007, 10:56:45 PM: I have The Wire seasons 1-3 on DVD. I don't know whether to wait for the season 4 DVD or to get it off the net. I'm weary of HBO.
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: border on July 08, 2007, 11:00:28 PM: Have you watched much Homicide? It's like The Shield without the corruption and large story arcs. It has compelling characters and much better single-episode stories, though. I feel like Shield's biggest weakness is the single-episode stories, which are rarely memorable (and if so, they're only memorable because of a particularly twisted crime). When you think about it, most of the crimes the Strike Team investigates are pretty uninteresting.....
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: Van Cruncheon on July 08, 2007, 11:25:29 PM: the show isn't about the crimes; it's about THE BARN and the personalities that inhabit it. it's not a procedural show, it's a brutal-ass soap opera based on the LAPD's Rampart scandal.
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: TVC15 on July 09, 2007, 12:19:50 AM: I am 2 eps into season 2, and Acevada changed too much in regards to Mackey.

For the entirety of the first season, he is after Mackey's ass. Acevada has had Mackey by the balls at least twice in these first 2 season 2 episodes, but he lets him off the hook so easily. Coming off of a major scandal, his political career heating up, we are expected to think that Acevada is willing to let one of the most crooked cops in his stable go free? Especially one he was drooling to bag just a few weeks before? Does not ring true at all, and it is kind of pissing on my mellow.
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: Van Cruncheon on July 09, 2007, 12:28:09 AM: yeah, i was a little irked by that too, since the rationalization for it seems a bit too, well, deus ex machina again.
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: TVC15 on July 09, 2007, 12:48:03 AM: It's not show-breaking or anything. It's just a little irksome considering that the implication is that season 2 picks up very shortly after the events of season 1. If say, a year had passed, I could buy this without any explanation, but like, a few weeks later? Eh. . .
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: Van Cruncheon on July 09, 2007, 12:59:30 AM: i think the show simply tries to juggle too many crises at once. makes for fun viewing, but the overall implausibility of vic's continued employment nags from time to time -- he's just screwed up too many times, and the fact that his jenga tower hasn't toppled yet kinda flies in the face of the show's gritty, real world consequences theme. it makes him a little bit superheroic in a show about antiheroes. like you said, not show-breaking, but it's always in your mind a bit when you watch all the shows back-to-back like this.
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: TVC15 on July 09, 2007, 01:03:21 AM: Yeah, the other major storytelling problem is Shane. I love Shane, but really, how the fuck does he keep his job? He's all the worst aspects of Mackey minus the successes. How did he ever rise to the level where he was able to join something exclusive like Strike Team? Like EVERY OTHER COP on the show is better than him. And he not just fucks up police work, but Vic's rackets, too. There's no rational reason why they keep him around!
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: CajoleJuice on July 09, 2007, 01:04:47 AM: I've said it before, The Wire is probably the most intricately written show I've ever seen (I haven't seen The Sopranos though), but I find The Shield more entertaining to watch. I'm not as nit-picky as you guys (hell, I loved 24 for a while), but I'd love to see TVC try to pick apart The Wire. The only hole I remember is when the actor who plays McNulty accidentally breaks into his true British accent in one scene. :lol
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: Van Cruncheon on July 09, 2007, 01:07:36 AM: season 5 and 6 really go over shane's failings -- shane totally fuckin' bombs out. though his actions in early season 3 shoulda guaranteed his unemployment.
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: TVC15 on July 09, 2007, 01:08:38 AM: I've only seen season 1 of The Wire. I liked it a ton, too. Incredibly well done.

The Shield is, well, it's like the half-way point between cable TV goodness and quick network action. It lets you indulge the want of action along with decent characters and edgier material.
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: Van Cruncheon on July 09, 2007, 01:10:15 AM: oh, i love the show, cajole; i just like to pick at things. :shh
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: CajoleJuice on July 09, 2007, 01:12:31 AM: I caught the tail-end of a Michael Chiklis interview on Opie and Anthony one fairly recent morning (they're on K-Rock in the morning, I turned on the car, they were on) and they were talking about The Shield. At one point, Chiklis said, "Yea, we wanted to hit that niche between network TV and the premium channels. Like a poor man's HBO..." He quickly realized what he had said and added, "...but you know... just as good!"

I laughed pretty hard at that.
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: Van Cruncheon on July 09, 2007, 01:17:32 AM: the only reason they keep shane around is because vic protects him. they kinda visit how vic considers him a sort of dumb younger brother and has always looked out for him. the parallels between vic's real family and his strike team "family" are kinda amusing.
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: Van Cruncheon on July 09, 2007, 01:21:09 AM: chiklis is right, though. the shield would be a monster critical success on network tv, but on hbo, it'd fall a little short of the sopranos and their better shows. (it's a step above carnivale and even deadwood, to some extent, though.) it's roughly equal to dexter. the shield has better overall acting than dexter and better camerawork; dexter, however, doesn't try to be as ambitious and really nails the pacing. (plus the guy who plays dexter is fuck perfect in the role.)

actually, the shield feels a lot like deadwood -- it juggles a lot of plot arcs and occasionally collapses under the weight of its need to constantly have multiple crises in the air.
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: TVC15 on July 09, 2007, 01:23:31 AM: I like how Cajole had to go all apologetic about listening to Opie and Anthony. IT WAS ON WHEN I TURNED THE CAR KEYS I SWEAR! STOP JUDGING ME!
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: CajoleJuice on July 09, 2007, 01:24:22 AM: What he said was spot-on, but it was TOO spot-on, and the way he reacted to his own honesty was amusing at the time.
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: CajoleJuice on July 09, 2007, 01:25:45 AM: Quote from: TVC 15 on July 09, 2007, 01:23:31 AM
I like how Cajole had to go all apologetic about listening to Opie and Anthony. IT WAS ON WHEN I TURNED THE CAR KEYS I SWEAR! STOP JUDGING ME!

I'm insecure. So much so that now it seems to be extending into internet land. :-\
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: The Fake Shemp on July 09, 2007, 01:27:20 AM: Jim Norton forced me at gunpoint to listen and give him a blow job! Please don't judge!
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: CajoleJuice on July 09, 2007, 01:28:40 AM: That scenario sounds familiar, Willco.
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: Van Cruncheon on July 09, 2007, 01:30:21 AM: how come, billy? he's great as vic mackey. his interviews make him seem pretty down-to-earth and self-deprecating.

spoiler (click to show/hide)
were you raped by the commish as a child? :o david e. kelley is a dangerous man to party with! :'(
[close]
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: The Fake Shemp on July 09, 2007, 01:33:09 AM: I remember The Commish being popular, but not really. Kind of like JAG or Wings. Nobody can explain why they're still on the air.
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: TVC15 on July 09, 2007, 01:39:28 AM: The Commish was totally a mom TV show. The Chik as Mackey is perfect casting, though, to the point where I can't even tell he's acting. I think that *is* how Chiklis is in real life.
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: TVC15 on July 09, 2007, 01:41:21 AM: Quote from: Billy Rygar on July 09, 2007, 01:40:21 AM
I *do* remember liking the theme song for the Commish.

I. . .don't recall it. I believe it was of the late 90s/early 90s synth-liney model, a la Law and Order, except more upbeat. Right?

EDIT: OH FUCK NO! I WAS SO WRONG THIS IS AWFULSAdl;kS;lkdjasdf;kJMPOASJipfJIOJHNfioANHDSFUOHNASDGVBSFABVGAFSDB
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: Ichirou on July 09, 2007, 01:50:26 AM: I'm glad Evilbore is showing some Shield luv. I've been watching since it premiered. When it first started, FX was the network known for Son of the Beach and shit like that...now it's like the basic cable version of HBO. Pretty awesome.
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: CajoleJuice on July 09, 2007, 02:01:30 AM: See, I watched the first two seasons, then for some inexplicable reason I can't recall I missed a few episodes and because I'm OCD I didn't want to start watching until I got caught up. I never did. :(
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: Cheebs on July 10, 2007, 02:28:23 AM: Best show on television.
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: CajoleJuice on July 18, 2007, 03:03:22 PM: Jesus fucking Christ, Season 5 is rocking my balls. I just finished watching the episode where

spoiler (click to show/hide)
Kavanaugh (Forest Whittaker) gets outsmarted by Mackey and consequently flips the fuck out at the end of the episode.
[close]
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: T234 on July 18, 2007, 07:51:07 PM: Has anybody other than me seen the entire series?
Title: Re: the official evilbore "the shield" discussion thread
Post by: CajoleJuice on July 18, 2007, 08:08:43 PM: Quote from: T234 on July 18, 2007, 07:51:07 PM
Has anybody other than me seen the entire series?

I'll be there soon.