THE BORE
General => The Superdeep Borehole => Topic started by: G The Resurrected on October 01, 2006, 04:45:16 PM
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I've been struggling for years with weight issues and i'm just getting to the point where i'm getting fed up with it. Tried the fad diets, tried heavily altering my daily schedual so that i can ride my bike and work on weights and stuff. I'm feelin like I need to have a gastric just to be accepted by a certain individual.
So i'm kind of fighting over myself cause i feel i'm a good enough person and i keep trying with no results. So should i get a gastric? Any of you know some good resources or maybe friends that have had one done. I know my mom had one and that just made her life worse but she would be dead if she didnt have one.
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The percentage of people who actually *cannot* lose weight the natural way is very, very small.
Fad diets aren't the way to do it, you need to just accept that you have to change your lifestyle. Start eating healthy, eat small portions. Go hungry for awhile, and move your ass.
Gastric bypass surgery is very dangerous, for something (generally) so elective. It's just. . extreme. I dunno, as someone who lost a lot of weight after having a kid I have to say I usually look down on people who do it that way.
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I mean dont get me wrong, there is a difference between the weight women put on during pregnancy and the weight males usually put on. I know its extreme and looked down upon. I looked down on my mom for doing it but when i talked with her doctor about what was going on with her i changed my mind about that situation. But its still very risky. I've tried changing my life greatly and i've yet to see results its driving me mad.
And the pressures i go through with other people in my life are making this choice lean towards having it done.
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Keep at the exercising, and watch your diet carefully. Drink water instead of beer for a while.
Don't wuss out and get some surgery.
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Sleep on your back.
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What a fat persons attitude. Lazy and looking for the easy way out.
Your stomach wasn't naturally made to be fucked around with like that, so your probably going to shed a few years off your life.
Here's an idea, fucking get off your ass and workout and eat right.
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What a fat persons attitude. Lazy and looking for the easy way out.
Your stomach wasn't naturally made to be fucked around with like that, so your probably going to shed a few years off your life.
Here's an idea, fucking get off your ass and workout and eat right.
Can't.... stop..... laughing! :lol
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Eat less, exercise more. If you want something you've got to work for it.
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My aunt had it done and she regrets it.
There are things that they don't tell you about like how your hair and teeth will fall out from malnutrition. You'll never be able to eat a meal again without getting sick and since you never learned the proper way to eat the chances that you'll gain it all back in a few years is pretty good (over time you can slowly stretch your stomach back out).
Before going under the knife try to make a drastic lifestyle change. Start counting calories and exercise everyday. Stick with it, set reasonable goals (instead of trying to loose 100lbs, go for 10lbs at a time) and it helps to have a nice reward for when you get the job done.
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ITS TOO HARD NOT TO HAVE A CHOCOLATE CAKE AFTER EVERY MEAL, I NEED SURGERY :'(
I've never understood when fat bitches need to look to magic diet pills or expensive surgeries when there are plenty of gyms around the country, and hundreds of thousands of weight loss plans -- Atkins, Zone, etc.
Take some fucking responsibility for your lard asses, people.
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Morphix can you show us a before and after pic of you, and how much tiem it took you to pull it off?
And can you say how much weight you lost?
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If anyone i'm gonna take your advice morphix i've watched your progress and even that change over that past few months has made me insanely jealous. But if you can do it maybe i can to.
I wondered how did you start out man? What did you change. I'm just trying to find where i need to change that first step. Cause the ones i've tried to make seem to have done shit. Even if i'm riding my bike like a mad man. I still cant seem to loose it.
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Or -- better yet -- take massive shits every day or jerk off for hours on end. Flush out your system and get a hell of an excercise too! :D
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Everyone I've seen personally who had the surgery ends up looking like a walking corpse. It's disgusting.
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If anyone i'm gonna take your advice morphix i've watched your progress and even that change over that past few months has made me insanely jealous. But if you can do it maybe i can to.
I wondered how did you start out man? What did you change. I'm just trying to find where i need to change that first step. Cause the ones i've tried to make seem to have done shit. Even if i'm riding my bike like a mad man. I still cant seem to loose it.
I lost 50 lbs in college by just only making sure i ate when I was hungry, not because "Ooooh I want that cheeseburger, mm!" Humans were meant to be a LITTLE starved, why not give it a shot? ;) Plus it's easier to work out when you think you look better too. It's just an upward ride from then on.
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You know i'd say something i used to do that made me sweat so much that i knew i lost 30 pounds when her and i lived together that was fun.
I'm saying it right here and right now. I will stop drinking today. I will not drink any booze.
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OMG! You've been drinking while trying to diet? Well yeah, that has to stop. So do sodas, even diet ones. Caffeine distinguished mentally-challenged fellows your metabolism.
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You know i'd say something i used to do that made me sweat so much that i knew i lost 30 pounds when her and i lived together that was fun.
I'm saying it right here and right now. I will stop drinking today. I will not drink any booze.
1) Why don't you just say it? "I did the horizontal mombo with some chick who may or may not like me."
2) lolz I'll bet... :P
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If anyone i'm gonna take your advice morphix i've watched your progress and even that change over that past few months has made me insanely jealous. But if you can do it maybe i can to.
I wondered how did you start out man? What did you change. I'm just trying to find where i need to change that first step. Cause the ones i've tried to make seem to have done shit. Even if i'm riding my bike like a mad man. I still cant seem to loose it.
You want a simple and foolproof way to get thin?
1) Toss out all the junk food in your cupboards, and don't but it again.
2) Read the nutrition labels on the food you buy, and make sure the food is healthy
3) Eat well balanced meals, and keep yourself to a limit of no more than 2000 calories a day (spread across multiple meals. This means you should eat breakfast and lunch. And don't eat late at night!)
4) Exercise. Lift weights, run, and do arobic exercise.
You'll lower the amount of calories you take in, increase your metabolism, and increase the amount of calories your body needs.
You will begin losing weight. It's also going to feel like hell for the first month, and you'll be hungry all the goddamn time. Fight through it, and you'll be ok.
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Morphix can you show us a before and after pic of you, and how much tiem it took you to pull it off?
And can you say how much weight you lost?
(http://morphix.hotarubi.net/pics/fatmorph.jpg)
Nov 2005 (340lbs)
(http://morphix.hotarubi.net/pics/morph928.jpg)
a few days ago (225lbs)
I was well over 350lbs (not sure how much over because my scale only went to 350).
My brother has had similar results.
(http://morphix.hotarubi.net/pics/bigwarn2.jpg)
Nov 2005 (around 340lbs)
(http://morphix.hotarubi.net/pics/warn914.jpg)
2 weeks ago (225, prolly down to 220 now)
I know we have the luxury of not having to work so it is easier for us than most people. TBH I never thought I would be able to do it, but I refused to have the surgery and just stuck with it. I want to get down to 190 and now I don't think of it as an "if" but a "when".
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Yes i drink heavily due to personal reasons :-\ I'll stop it if it means changing things around.
I'm heading to the kitchen now. Its time to get rid of shit.
And shake yes fucking made me loose a lot of weight and i got a metabolism from it. Then i got cut off cold turkey and started on the weight train again.
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THEN FUCK YOU CHICKEN SHIT COCK SMOKER! FUCK YOUR FUCKING BRAINS OUT!
:-*
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I'm like the third brother haha ah shit i should take a picture i'm wearing the same shit. :lol You also have your brother for support thats something that helps cause he'll kick your ass into gear when your not or vice versa.
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Morphix can you show us a before and after pic of you, and how much tiem it took you to pull it off?
And can you say how much weight you lost?
(http://morphix.hotarubi.net/pics/fatmorph.jpg)
Nov 2005 (340lbs)
(http://morphix.hotarubi.net/pics/morph928.jpg)
a few days ago (225lbs)
I was well over 350lbs (not sure how much over because my scale only went to 350).
My brother has had similar results.
(http://morphix.hotarubi.net/pics/bigwarn2.jpg)
Nov 2005 (around 340lbs)
(http://morphix.hotarubi.net/pics/warn914.jpg)
2 weeks ago (225, prolly down to 220 now)
I know we have the luxury of not having to work so it is easier for us than most people. TBH I never thought I would be able to do it, but I refused to have the surgery and just stuck with it. I want to get down to 190 and now I don't think of it as an "if" but a "when".
125 pounds in less than a year what the fuck wow. I'm kinda skeptical about the surgery, but you'd have much crazier skin on you if you did it. I know you must have SOME extra skin, but does working out fix that? I don't even know.
And man yeah you not having to work makes things so nice. I have so much work and so much school lately that I just want to die. If I could just have a ton of money to sit on that would be so nice.... ;( Oh well such is life.
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I wondered how did you start out man? What did you change. I'm just trying to find where i need to change that first step. Cause the ones i've tried to make seem to have done shit. Even if i'm riding my bike like a mad man. I still cant seem to loose it.
toss out all the snack foods, no soda, no candy, no beer just low calories healthy food. You won't have to give it up forever but you want to get you body used to eating stuff that is good for you. Eat fiber to fill you up and count every calories. You can use your bike for an hour and only burn about 300 calories, have 2 cans of coke and there goes all that work.
You need to stick with it too, it will take a few weeks to start seeing some results (you may even gain a bit from putting on some muscle) but as long as you keep your calories intake down you will loose weight.
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ZomBz, I'll gladly whip your ass into shape no matter what. NOW PUT DOWN THE TWINKIES FATTY FUCKER! >:(
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Morphix can you show us a before and after pic of you, and how much tiem it took you to pull it off?
And can you say how much weight you lost?
(http://morphix.hotarubi.net/pics/fatmorph.jpg)
Nov 2005 (340lbs)
(http://morphix.hotarubi.net/pics/morph928.jpg)
a few days ago (225lbs)
I was well over 350lbs (not sure how much over because my scale only went to 350).
My brother has had similar results.
(http://morphix.hotarubi.net/pics/bigwarn2.jpg)
Nov 2005 (around 340lbs)
(http://morphix.hotarubi.net/pics/warn914.jpg)
2 weeks ago (225, prolly down to 220 now)
I know we have the luxury of not having to work so it is easier for us than most people. TBH I never thought I would be able to do it, but I refused to have the surgery and just stuck with it. I want to get down to 190 and now I don't think of it as an "if" but a "when".
I am so proud of the morphix twins. :D
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125 pounds in less than a year what the fuck wow. I'm kinda skeptical about the surgery, but you'd have much crazier skin on you if you did it. I know you must have SOME extra skin, but does working out fix that? I don't even know.
It is there but the docs that I have seen have said it will go away as long as I keep working out. I am not against going in and having a little work done in the future if I have to.
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Yes i drink heavily due to personal reasons :-\ I'll stop it if it means changing things around.
I'm heading to the kitchen now. Its time to get rid of shit.
And shake yes fucking made me loose a lot of weight and i got a metabolism from it. Then i got cut off cold turkey and started on the weight train again.
Listen, if it'll help motivate you at all, I'll begin losing some weight as well. While I've only got 20 lbs or so I want to get rid of, I've still got to lose weight.
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Morphix you ever write down what you eat? I'd just like to compare.
I'm going to do it. If in just a few months i can loose something i'd be happy. Hell i just want to get back into shirts i can buy at regular stores and pants at a regular store. No need for these size 50 pants. I'm lucky that i fit in 2x gym pants at least. But still i'm not happy with it.
Man i've thrown out so much from my fridge its not funny.
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Size 50...what the fuck? Even when I was fat as fuck my size was only a 36, now I'm a 31, but fucking 50...wow.
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:o
Size 50? :(
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:( Yeah i know 50 inch waist is horrible. Its the thighs they bigger than fucking turkeys
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Maybe we can train you and make money off you ;P
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How the fuck have you ever gotten laid? Not to be mean, but if I were I'd chick I'd be scared of having my pelvis crushed from the sheer force of your fatty thighs.... :o
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Size 50...what the fuck? Even when I was fat as fuck my size was only a 36, now I'm a 31, but fucking 50...wow.
Fat as fuck with a size 36?
Hell, I'm about 200 lbs, and I'n a 34/36 depending on the pants.
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Fat as fuck with a size 36?
Hell, I'm about 200 lbs, and I'n a 34/36 depending on the pants.
Same here. Now Chris is making me feel like a fatass too... :'(
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well it wasn't so much my stomach I was pretty much pudgey everywhere...I'm only 5'9 too.
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Size 50...what the fuck? Even when I was fat as fuck my size was only a 36, now I'm a 31, but fucking 50...wow.
Fat as fuck with a size 36?
Hell, I'm about 200 lbs, and I'n a 34/36 depending on the pants.
I wear 36 pants as well and I weigh around 200. I'm 6'3 though.
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well it wasn't so much my stomach I was pretty much pudgey everywhere...I'm only 5'9 too.
:-\
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I've got a large member and I can hold myself up I do a lot of push ups still.
I've got personality and i read people very well. So i guess i'm a good manipulator when i'm around people in real life.
As for training me yeah i could fight, you guys dont believe me but i can fuck anyone up. My caff's the only non fatty covered muscles i have are 20 inches around and you be fucked if i kick you with my big ass foot.
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I've got a large member and I can hold myself up I do a lot of push ups still.
I've got personality and i read people very well. So i guess i'm a good manipulator when i'm around people in real life.
The fuck?
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well it wasn't so much my stomach I was pretty much pudgey everywhere...I'm only 5'9 too.
Bitch, I'm 5'7".
I'll fuck your white ass up.
You don't know me! You don't know me!
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bring it.
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IT'S BEEN BROUGHTEN.
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I think we can make money off this :lol
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where's the receipt :-\
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SOMEWHERE, THERE'S A BIN
A LOOKIN' FOR ITS SHIT
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So back on topic what are some good meal plans?
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Morphix you ever write down what you eat? I'd just like to compare.
I'm going to do it. If in just a few months i can loose something i'd be happy. Hell i just want to get back into shirts i can buy at regular stores and pants at a regular store. No need for these size 50 pants. I'm lucky that i fit in 2x gym pants at least. But still i'm not happy with it.
Man i've thrown out so much from my fridge its not funny.
Breakfast:
I usually don't eat breakfast but if I do its 1 breakfast hotpocket (150 cals)
Lunch:
It varies, a thing of sushi from Publix, a sandwich from Publix (regular not a sub), Tuna and cracker pack things, a Lean Pocket, or something else. My brother seems to enjoy a brand of Fat free hot dogs (3 of them are only 150 cals), but he doesn't eat buns with them. I try to limit lunch to under 500 cals but if I go over I just eat a smaller dinner.
Dinner:
TV Dinners (300-600 cal varites), Chicken, steak, veggies (lots of these), basically keep dinner under 700 cals
If I didn't each breakfast or lunch I usually order in Chinese or Italian. The trick is just eat enough to be full then chuck the rest (or you will eat it later), usually 1 dinner is more then enough for my brother and I to split.
Snacks:
Beef jerky (less then 100 cals a serving), 100 cal packs of various goodies
Drinks:
I go 50/50 with water/coke zero, my bro is more a 90/10 split
I try to keep my daily intake under 1250 (most of the time under 1000). In the beginning I was hungry a lot but now if I eat something like a Gyro for lunch (felt like one last week), thats all I will eat for the day.
When I was at my max weight my pants size was 58, now its 36/38 depending on the pants. :lol
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Did you eat like that before when you were just starting out or did you gradually do it Morphix?
You dont do much cooking do you? I love to cook so balacing that with weight loss is a battle. Cause i cant stand tv dinners. I can however get those 100 cal paks of beef jerky and stuff. I just need to find meal plans and stick with them i think. If anything that will help me out more than anything.
Keeping track of this will be a pain. But i must do it.
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Beef Jerky shall be my undoing.
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i don't understand what the big deal is...if it's fatty don't put it in your fucking mouth, self control. It's hard for like the first week.
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Did you eat like that before when you were just starting out or did you gradually do it Morphix?
You dont do much cooking do you? I love to cook so balacing that with weight loss is a battle. Cause i cant stand tv dinners. I can however get those 100 cal paks of beef jerky and stuff. I just need to find meal plans and stick with them i think. If anything that will help me out more than anything.
Keeping track of this will be a pain. But i must do it.
If you want a website to keep track of your calories, I suggest www.fitday.com . It's not perfect at tracking but it gives you a rough estimate as to how many calories you have consumed in a day.
Two years ago I weighed 300 pounds but now I weigh 160. With the proper motivation you will definetly lose the weight. The first month is really tough but it isn't impossible.
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Did you eat like that before when you were just starting out or did you gradually do it Morphix?
You dont do much cooking do you? I love to cook so balacing that with weight loss is a battle. Cause i cant stand tv dinners. I can however get those 100 cal paks of beef jerky and stuff. I just need to find meal plans and stick with them i think. If anything that will help me out more than anything.
Keeping track of this will be a pain. But i must do it.
I never cooked breakfast or lunch and while I am a pretty good cook when it comes to dinner the stuff I make is the reason I was over 350lbs :lol
I do still cook 2-3 nights a week, but it is nothing special just a plain chicken breast with mushrooms or a small steak. I am usually too busy with stupid stuff to cook anyway (who would want to be slaving over a hot stove when they could be playing X360 :D).
If you can't handle the TV dinners make up a few low cal meals you do like, then buy just enough to make those few meals. This way you won't get yourself into trouble if you want to pig out or something. Since I have the time I just buy groceries for a day or two at a time but not many people can do that.
Remember you have to exercise too. I use a recumbent bike for 1hr in the morning (5days a week at least) and at night I lift weights for about 30min (5day a week).
It was very hard at the beginning but you'll get used to it. Easy to put up with feeling hungry when you know you are looking better because of it.
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m0rphix cut the TV meals out and I'm 100% sure you'll see results faster.
The key is actually
salads
water
chicken
in a nut shell without getting complex.
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Listen to Christopher
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I love to eat meat, i could eat meat meat meat. My body loves protein and fiber. But its those carbs that are evil. So no bread no pasta and flour based shit sucks.
I guess i'm going on a chicken, turkey, veggies and fruit diet along with tea.
I'm gonna try getting some of those small glad ware containers make up my food and put them in that for small servings so i can keep it in the fridge.
I now see that my love for cooking is probably to blame for my excessive and or love for food. :-\
But if i can make it through christmas on this new focus i'll be happy.
I love salad i just cant find a good dressing thats light. Cause i eat the whole damn bag of greens.
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No bread would suck, I love bread.
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don't put anything besides balsamic vinger on salads, all fat free dressings are fat.
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yeah thats all i use really balsamic and i put it in a spray bottle to cover the salad.
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My friend got one of those bypass. she went from around 290 to 130, but she has tons of health issues, and some days, she feels like her body is 70 years old instead. It really fucked her up.
And she's hot as fuck now.
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Yeah i see lots of young girls pressued into doing it and damn they look good. But its those negative things that piss me off
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How does it "piss you off"
look for an easy way out of something that should be goal oriented and worked hard for. That pisses me off, and anyone else like me and m0rphix who struggled and worked hard for.
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Wow, Christopher is the only person making sense in here. TV dinners, wtf Morphy.
I'm not fat at all (6'3, 175lbs :(), but it would be a good idea to drink a lot of water. No need to buy any other drinks; you've got an unlimited amount of water in your house, so put third world countries to shame and drink as much as possible.
I don't eat breakfast either, but when I do it's a breakfast hotpocket. You're going to need to learn how to cook some basic things. Oatmeal will fill you up without fattening you up, and it's good for your heart too; considering you're a size 50, your heart doesn't sound like it's in good condition.
With exercising, start off slow and build up. Walking is a great first step. Wherever you can walk, walk. So if your school or job is close to your house, just walk there; or walk to the bus stop.
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Christopher makes me want to lose weight... :-\
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Christopher makes me want to lose weight... :-\
I need to gain weight. All around my body. I want bigger arms and stuff. Apparently I need to get more protein and fiber.
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I didnt mean to disrespect it just pisses me off cause while its good for some people. I know its not for me, I have to struggle and thats what i'm having to come to grips with in my life. Everywhere i look i'm facing struggle. I want to do it for myself so i have to be strong with it like i have with other shit in my life but this time i gotta buckle down and do it.
Making the change is what i have to do and working hard at it is what i must do as well.
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ramble ramble ramble struggle ramble ramble....
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lol, you people are all misinformed out the ass.
and jesus fucking christ, get a god damn life. look to a DOCTOR for advice on the surgery, not evilbore. yea, we're awesome BUT WE DON'T HAVE ALL THE FUCKING ANSWERS
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Bz, it's hard I imagine. The diet change will suck at first, but eventually you'll get use to it and enjoy it I believe. I changed my diet, not to lose wieght, but other health concerns, and cut out fast food, and increased water intake. Now I can't stand fast food and have come to enjoy my differed eating habits. I am obviously not someone to see about weight loss, but as for the change in diet thing... I think eventually your body comes to enjoy it. I also eat less red meats than before, more chicken and seafood. I still will eat beef and that, but now I mix it up more.
I think the bypass surgery just forces you into a sort of diet that is needed for weight control, and it goes around the issue of will power by the said physical enforcement.
I think you do some sort of exercise if I recall? I think you lift more wieghts than I do. I have to do light impact, and maybe you could try that? I know water exercise lessens the impact on the body while still working it. Maybe a local Easter Seals to build up stamina.
It will be hard any which way you go about it, but Morphix seems to show the benefit of working at it. I know he says he still has some confidence issues, but he seems more self confident.
Anywas, good luck.
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The percentage of people who actually *cannot* lose weight the natural way is very, very small.
Fad diets aren't the way to do it, you need to just accept that you have to change your lifestyle. Start eating healthy, eat small portions. Go hungry for awhile, and move your ass.
Gastric bypass surgery is very dangerous, for something (generally) so elective. It's just. . extreme. I dunno, as someone who lost a lot of weight after having a kid I have to say I usually look down on people who do it that way.
Actually, you're wrong.
Fewer than 1% of people who lose a significant amount of weight keep it off for more than three years.
I also managed to lose over 100 pounds about 9 years ago and I've kept it off. I've also tried to help dozens of other people lose weight, all of whom failed spectacularly.
Those of us who can lose weight through diet and exercise are special, for some set of reasons. Either because of genetics, or having enough of a personality disorder to be able to stick with the self torture long enough, or perhaps sheer good fortune by having a life and/or lifestyle that supports the weight loss.
Anyway, if Bz has tried and failed for many years, the surgery might be his best option. I say go for it.
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Are you trying to categorize lack of willpower as an actual inabillity to lose weight through diet and exercise?
Give me a fucking break! Not being able to stop yourself from falling off the twinkie bandwagon is NOT the same thing as being unable to alter your bodyweight by eating right and getting aerobic exercise.
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If Bz wants to have the surgery than that is up for him and his doc to decide, I would have only done that as a last resort. Despite being a lardass for most of my life last year was the 1st time I ever tried to get into shape, so I may not be the best person to relate with the struggles of loosing weight. That surgery really only forces you to eat small portions, you can do the same thing with a little will power and avoid being sliced open and gutted like a fish.
Good luck Bz, you slim down and I'll work on being smooth with the ladies 8)
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Are you trying to categorize lack of willpower as an actual inabillity to lose weight through diet and exercise?
Give me a fucking break! Not being able to stop yourself from falling off the twinkie bandwagon is NOT the same thing as being unable to alter your bodyweight by eating right and getting aerobic exercise.
No, look up the statistics. Will power may have a genetic component anyway. Also for those of us who managed to do it, our "willpower" may be reinforced by positive results, which also are likely genetic.
I know in our society we like to think anyone can do anything, and that we're the masters of our own destiny, and shit like that. But statistically speaking, and frankly, realistically speaking, only a small percentage of us can actually be successful at anything. Weight loss, financially, athletically, emotionally, psychologically, etc. The vast majority of people end up incapable of actually succeeding.
Really, if people could do anything they wanted, wouldn't more people be in shape, be wealthy, and be happy? ;) It's not because they're lazy, it's because they're not capable.
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Or perhaps it's both!
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drinky: maybe.
I think it's not fair to assume people are fat just because they aren't trying hard enough. It's like assuming I'm not in the NBA because I just didn't practice enough, or that Cyanista isn't a full back for the Saints because she just didn't put in the hours.
Some people are physically more capable than others. This includes things like athletic ability but also things like cholesterol level, insulin resistance, metabolism, hormonal environment, brain chemistry, and the like.
Some people have better life situations than others. Maybe they have a better support network. Maybe they are more financially independent (income and obesity are also correlated...lower incomes tend to be fatter).
Some people are smarter and more organized than others. Maybe they have a better understanding of biology and physics and are able to do things like calorie counting and exercise planning more efficiently.
Some people are more obsessive and perfectionist than others. Maybe these people are able to completely abstain from booze and drugs, from staying up late, from cheating on their diet. These people are probably more likely to keep to their exercise schedule, not miss a session, and also are perhaps more likely to keep pushing their intensity to continue to see improvements.
To be successful at weight loss you have to score high in every component. You could be an independently wealthy, obsessive, intelligent person with nothing better to do than diet and exercise, but if your genetics suck, you'll probably always be fat. You could have great genetics but not have the time or personality that lets you stick to a strict and heavy regimin to see the results.
Bz is obese, he's been obese for years, he hasn't had much success, and he's headed for serious health problems if this doesn't change. Surgery is an extreme option but if his doctor feels he's a candidate, it's probably the right decision. At some point you need to just let go of the ideal fantasy (I can lose the weight on my own...) when it becomes a convenient excuse to not worry about it (...I'll start the diet tomorrow...) or even worse, permission to continue to be self destructive (...after I finish these beers and this large pizza).
Again, statistically speaking, the odds are incredibly small that anyone is able to lose weight (even a tiny amount like 20 lbs) and keep it off for over three years. I don't think anyone has even looked at 10 year statistics, since it's hard enough to even have anyone last three years.
Cyanista, Warnen, Morphix, what you guys have done is incredibly special and very rare. I've found that my own success was not repeatable by anyone I know in person, even when I am training them (the longest candidate lasted about two weeks before he fell off the wagon). It takes something special to be able to lose weight and keep it off without medication and surgery. Most people just could not do it no matter how much they want to.
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It's a lifestyle change. You can keep the weight off *if* you get off the need for certain comfort foods. If your life isn't consistent stable and secure -- as most folks' lives aren't, I imagine -- it's very hard NOT to lapse back into your comfort mechanisms. While there's some truth about genetic predisposition and its effect on weight loss, a great deal of it is also environmental.
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Cyanista, Warnen, Morphix, what you guys have done is incredibly special and very rare.
it's out of context, but boy does this make me LOL like a mufuh
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It's a lifestyle change. You can keep the weight off *if* you get off the need for certain comfort foods. If your life isn't consistent stable and secure -- as most folks' lives aren't, I imagine -- it's very hard NOT to lapse back into your comfort mechanisms. While there's some truth about genetic predisposition and its effect on weight loss, a great deal of it is also environmental.
Sorry, but it's a lot deeper than that. Most people think the way you think. I used to think the way you think. But the statistical evidence is so overwhelming in the other direction that it's just cannot be the case. Effort alone does not equal success. We really want that to be true, because we all want to think we're in control of our health and our lives, but we're really not.
For every successful weight loss case, there are thousands of fatties that are trying just as hard and don't succeed. Genetics is a big part, not only for things like hormones and lipid profiles and insulin resistance, but also things like brain chemistry, intelligence, will power, and determination.
Some (very few, perhaps fewer than 1 in 10,000) people have the ability. Most people are doomed to be the way they are without serious outside intervention.
It's a nice myth we want to believe in North American society that everyone is basically the same and equal and with enough effort, we can all achieve success. The reality is most people are just not capable. Those of us who are capable have to realize it wasn't our effort that got us this success, it was our good fortune that let us be capable of the effort that got us our success. And the people who aren't capable of success would be better off to just realize they can't do it sooner rather than later so they can get the help they need.
When we tell fatties if they try harder or switch to this different diet, they'll do better, we're just setting them up for more failure and delaying their ability to get help. Obesity is rather like Depression - it's a medical disease that most people don't consider a disease, because they haven't seen the science. Telling an obese person they don't need surgery or medication and they'll be fine if they try harder at their diet is like telling a depressed person to just cheer up already and they won't need their SSRI meds. Perhaps 1 in 10,000 depressed people could resolve their illness without medical intervention - but it isn't fair for that one special case to try to convince the others to do the same.
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Almost everyone who burns more calories than they consume while eating foods with a moderate to low glycemic level will lose fat. In fact I doubt there exists a recorded case under strict laboratory conditions where this hasn't happened. Fatties are notorious for underestimating just how much they actually eat. When doctors under controlled settings feed them what they claim to eat they lose weight.
The results from twin studies and adoption studies show that body weight is highly heritable. However this doesn't mean there is a fat gene as there may just be genes that control appetite or have an effect on metabolism or blood sugar. I eat about twice as much as my friend generally does. Most times he leaves his plate half full while I'm still hungry afterwards. I'm sure there is some sort of genetic component in are hunger levels and our capacity to eat. In our ancestral environment this drive to keep eating would confer survival advantages, but in our modern world it is a negative.
Yeah, basic physics alone means anyone who eats less than they burn will lose weight. Thermodynamics applies to your cells as much as it does to the space shuttle.
But the problem is in getting someone to correctly count their calories, stick to the plan, exercise, etc. and keep it up, while also living their life, and accounting for the various differences in metabolism, hormone levels, and the like. When looked at holistically, the stats bear out that 99% of the population cannot lose a statistically relevant amount of weight and keep it off.
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Statistics should never be used as evidence.
Its not just about trying hard, its also about finding what is right for your own body. I dealt with my own problems by thinking about what I do during the day, thinking about what I take in, thinking about my gentic disposition, and realizing that if I wanted to change, it would require strength of character and determination.
It is about WANTING it too tho. Our culture is built around getting what we want and not EARNING what we want. You have to EARN weight loss. Im not saying people who are 'failing at diets' dont try hard, I am saying they don't want it enough to keep trying.
Throwing your hands up and going OH WELL IM SPECIAL! IM SUPPOSED TO BE FAT! doesnt actually solve anything. Its harder for heavier people to lose weight than people who are already thin because your body is used to a higher level of caloric intake. Of course results will be harder to get, of COURSE it will be harder to see them, but dieting requires mental strength.
Ive had many successful diets, but it requires strength and dare I say GUTS. Sure, most of my meals consist of boiled eggs, cheese, beef jerky, and water, but you know what? I feel awesome, ive lost weight, and if the cost is hamburgers and excessive amounts of pizza, so fuckin be it.
I mean seriously, there shouldn't be excuses. Excuses are the reason its so easy to fail. Its because we accept excuses. Im not sayin you cant be fat, be fat for all its worth if you WANT IT. But dont come to me bitching about wanting to lose weight but you cant cause of etc etc.
Nothing worth anything is easy. I know this sounds mighty Draconian in our hug hug its ok culture but come on. Toughen up and take care of business.
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Yeah, that was pretty stupid.... ???
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Malek: Shut up, College.
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Statistics shouldn't be used as evidence. They require deep context to be useful, and by the time that's been established, they've been compromised by the same semantic bullshit they were developed to anull. They're only useful among legitimate authorities who have the same established context; i.e. two particle physicists sharing data.
It may be good ol' argumentum ad authoritatum, but Twain was right about his three types of lies.
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MAF - I used to think like you too.
But most fatties just can't do it. They're not as capable as you.
It's not about throwing your hands up and declaring "oh well, I'm meant to be fat". It's about realizing you just don't have the ability to fix yourself, and getting the professional help you need.
You were able to lose weight on your own, that's great. If you're able to keep it off more than three years, you're part of a very small segment of the population. If you keep it off more than ten years, you're probably 1 in a million.
Medically speaking, no diet or exercise plan is shown to be effective in treating obesity, because the success rate is so insignificant. The only thing that has shown success is surgery and medication.
I know you're saying "Willpower and guts! Willpower and guts!". I say to you, your willpower and guts are special and fairly rare, and that the vast majority of the population is simply not capable of matching you. Most people are not leaders, they're timid little worker bees. They don't have what it takes. And it's not fair for us to look down on them and demand they strive to be as good as us.
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I dont care if you used to think like I do. I STILL think like I do.
EVERYONE has the potential to be what I am. I am not special, anything I can do someone could possibly do better if they had the DRIVE to do it.
I dont care if it makes me look mean, but I expect of others what I expect of myself. It doesnt mean I judge them unfairly, it means that I will help them realize the simple fact that if they actually want to do something they can. I think one of the worst parts of modern society is the fact that we allow people to have self-defeating quirks cause 'life is hard'.
Whens the last time you made railroads, worked at the age of 10 to earn enough money to buy soup for your family, shipped yourself to another country to earn enough money to keep your family afloat.
I mean seriously, life isnt that hard anymore. It just isnt. I can't feel sorry for people who have it so fucking good, but insist on making things so fucking bad for themselves because they cant power through things.
Granted, a crazy is a crazy, but in a world where everyone apparently has ADHD or some variation of, you gotta wonder where it all went wrong.
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Malek is right. This "evidence is not an argument" is a wonky idea, sirs... >:(
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I dont believe in FACTS! I BELIEVE IN GUTS! GUTS ARE ALL YOU NEED TO WIN!
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I dont care if you used to think like I do. I STILL think like I do.
EVERYONE has the potential to be what I am. I am not special, anything I can do someone could possibly do better if they had the DRIVE to do it.
I dont care if it makes me look mean, but I expect of others what I expect of myself. It doesnt mean I judge them unfairly, it means that I will help them realize the simple fact that if they actually want to do something they can. I think one of the worst parts of modern society is the fact that we allow people to have self-defeating quirks cause 'life is hard'.
Whens the last time you made railroads, worked at the age of 10 to earn enough money to buy soup for your family, shipped yourself to another country to earn enough money to keep your family afloat.
I mean seriously, life isnt that hard anymore. It just isnt. I can't feel sorry for people who have it so fucking good, but insist on making things so fucking bad for themselves because they cant power through things.
Granted, a crazy is a crazy, but in a world where everyone apparently has ADHD or some variation of, you gotta wonder where it all went wrong.
It's always been like that. You can't compare working at 10 to losing weight, it's an apples and oranges thing.
Where it all went wrong is this: at some point, we began telling everyone that they can all become president or a movie star or a baseball player if only they tried hard enough. We used to be more honest with ourselves and our children and tell them,
Sorry Jimbo, you're poor white trash and working in the McDonald's is the best you can do. Or sorry Sally, you can't be president no matter how much you want to because you're not smart enough to go to college and our family doesn't have any money or connections. Or sorry Tim, you're fatso because you can't stick to an exercise or diet regimin and you probably never will, because you're just not capable from a biological perspective, you lack the chemistry or the hardware in your brain and body that lets you think that way and stick to a program without cheating yourself.
Most obese people could be thin, if they got the help. They aren't capable of doing it on their own. The few that can, probably do the rest more harm than good by insisting they aren't special.
Well the reality MAF, is this: statistically speaking, you are special. You're as special as the kid who was always the fastest runner at school and could never be beat at track time. You're as special as the whiz kid who always got 100 on the math tests. You're as special as the guy in high school who could always throw a perfect spiral right from the first time he picked up a football. You're a statistical anomaly. In a town of 10,000 you'd probably be one of a kind.
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I dont believe in FACTS! I BELIEVE IN GUTS! GUTS ARE ALL YOU NEED TO WIN!
::) ::) ::)
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Lol more excuses. The more we coddle people the less they will accomplish. Its amazing how there are fewer 'special' people like me as life became more automated and 'easy'.
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Lol more excuses. The more we coddle people the less they will accomplish. Its amazing how there are fewer 'special' people like me as life became more automated and 'easy'.
No, there were always very few special people. It's just that only the special people get mentioned in history and everyone else gets forgotten.
I know it's a little scary to think of yourself as special and better than average, because in our society we don't like to think we're priviliged. But it's the reality. Some of us are just better than others. You're in the better group. You have advantages that others don't have, whether you know what they are or not. Most people simply cannot duplicate your achievements.
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I'm more special than MAF......
I'm lying. :(
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Rio is a large city.
What's your evidence?
well it has 12 million people.
How are you counting people? Do you consider JUST the downtown, or do you include the suburbs? Do you include the exurbs as well? Which cities are you measuring this "largeness" against? What's the context?
Hispanics are less likely to graduate from high school than Asians.
EVIDENCE?
Well only 53% of Hispanics graduate from high school while 77% of Asians graduate.
How do you consider "Hispanics" -- do you take everyone with some Hispanic descent, people with one or two Hispanic parents, or recent immigrants? Do you consider only Mexico, or do you include other Latin American countries? What do you consider "Asian"? Is it the entire Asian continent, or do you inlcide Eastern Europe? What do you consider "high school" -- some states include traditionally "junior high" levels as well.
Beyond that, what is your method of sampling?
Caim:
Babe Ruth was a great home run hitter.
Evidence:
He hit 714
How distant was the infield back then? How was bat technology? How fast was the average pitch speed? How much have baseball rules changed since Babe Ruth was a hitter? How much has player performance changed?
Drinky you are stretching the meaning of the appeal to authority fallacy beyond any reasonable limit.
Nope. Very few people that aren't part of a rigid scientific community establish strict and clearly communicated rules, and who disseminate these statistics between other experts who understand those rules, are served by statistics. For the rest of us, we're simply being lied to in a very disingenuous way.
Malek, you wanna be a law school student -- would you accept STATISTICS as evidence of ANYTHING in court?
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Third World Countries shouldn't be considered third world anymore, cause they have WAY MORE SPECIAL PEOPLE THAN US!
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best way to lose weight is to puke after you eat
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nah
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I don't think "rolleyes" is accepted as an LSAT answer!
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Third World Countries shouldn't be considered third world anymore, cause they have WAY MORE SPECIAL PEOPLE THAN US!
My point might be a bit clouded.
Put any person on strict calorie restriction and they will lose weight. This is simple physics and will hold true for anyone, no matter what their genetics.
However:
Whatever the various factors are that produce willpower, lifestyle, determination, GUTS, ability to exercise, ability to build muscle/an attractive physique (which is genetic and not something anyone can do), support network, amount of free time, intelligence, honesty, and the like that would produce an individual who can ON THEIR OWN, DIET AND EXERCISE SUFFICIENTLY SO THEY LOSE A SIGNIFICANT (more than 20 lbs) AMOUNT OF WEIGHT AND KEEP IT OFF FOR OVER THREE YEARS, whatever those factors are that produce such an individual, they seem to be very rare as most people cannot do this.
ON THEIR OWN.
The odds of being able to diet and exercise to lose 20+ lbs of weight, and keep it off for over three years, if we look at the available stats, are very low. If you are able to do it, you are part of a very small segment of the population.
For whatever reasons, most obese people cannot lose the weight on their own and require medical intervention. With drugs and surgery, the odds of successful weight loss go up dramatically.
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I just cant believe the human race has advanced so much only to give up on self control and staple parts of their bodies shut.
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I just cant believe the human race has advanced so much only to give up on self control and staple parts of their bodies shut.
The human race hasn't really advanced. All our advancements have come from the efforts of a few, special individuals that drag the rest of the species along for the ride. Civilization isn't a group effort! It's the collective contributions of the few special people while the vast majority just trundle along the path of least resistance.
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Malek: well thats a different issue altogether...
Fat: I suggest we get people building pyramids again, that was a great workout!
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Malek: well thats a different issue altogether...
Fat: I suggest we get people building pyramids again, that was a great workout!
Nothing better for body shaping than moving a few tons around, that's for sure.
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Nothing better for body shaping than moving a few tons around, that's for sure.
That's what she said! :-*
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You won't lose weight if you aren't willing to change your lifestyle.
Being fit is not simply just eating the right foods, it's a lifestyle.
Get gastric bypass is taking the easy way out, unless you're honestly way too big to benefit from normal dieting/exercise routine.
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You won't lose weight if you aren't willing to change your lifestyle.
Being fit is not simply just eating the right foods, it's a lifestyle.
Get gastric bypass is taking the easy way out, unless you're honestly way too big to benefit from normal dieting/exercise routine.
:lol
There is nothing easy about a Gastric Bypass. It's major surgery, potentially life threatening, and requires a much more permanent and difficult lifestyle change than most diet and exercise plans
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Nothing better for body shaping than moving a few tons around, that's for sure.
That's what she said! :-*
I tried anal sex seven years ago with a former boyfriend. It was a spur of the moment decision, no lube, no nothing. He got inside me gradually, uncomfortably... and then I asked him to get out. There was nothing pleasurable about it. After that, I had two more boyfriends who were very interested in anal penetration and stimulation. I let one boyfriend stimulate my rosebud, but found nothing pleasurable from it, in fact, all I could think of was "there's a finger up my ass!" And again, this was with no lube. I refused to engage in any anal stimulation with these other two partners, giving or receiving.
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You won't lose weight if you aren't willing to change your lifestyle.
Being fit is not simply just eating the right foods, it's a lifestyle.
Get gastric bypass is taking the easy way out, unless you're honestly way too big to benefit from normal dieting/exercise routine.
:lol
There is nothing easy about a Gastric Bypass. It's major surgery, potentially life threatening, and requires a much more permanent and difficult lifestyle change than most diet and exercise plans
most people who get the surgery who are as large as Zombz and have no experience with dieting or limiting a healthy life style will fuck it up FatGhost. It's unhealthy, and a easy way out, don't defend it when there is nothing there to defend.
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As i understand it gastrics are for serious cases where a person is likely to die in the next year from not loosing weight. Due to heart issues or other issues.
But for me i know its not the way i'm going to be going. I plan on keeping to this plan. Even if its gonna be a bitch i gotta do it.
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You won't lose weight if you aren't willing to change your lifestyle.
Being fit is not simply just eating the right foods, it's a lifestyle.
Get gastric bypass is taking the easy way out, unless you're honestly way too big to benefit from normal dieting/exercise routine.
:lol
There is nothing easy about a Gastric Bypass. It's major surgery, potentially life threatening, and requires a much more permanent and difficult lifestyle change than most diet and exercise plans
most people who get the surgery who are as large as Zombz and have no experience with dieting or limiting a healthy life style will fuck it up FatGhost. It's unhealthy, and a easy way out, don't defend it when there is nothing there to defend.
Hey, most people that are fat are fuck ups anyway, right? If only they had discipline and will power they could be thin and pretty, right? :lol
Obesity is a serious medical problem that leads to all sorts of complications. Like many medical treatments, surgery isn't perfect and is often just a case of switching from one problem to another problem, with the hope that the new problem will be more manageable.
But it's not an easy way out. It's major surgery and requires a major life change. The easy way out is to keep thinking a diet will be the answer and using it as an excuse to put off action until tomorrow.
If you look at the available data, you'd see that those of us who got in shape through hard work, diet, and exercise are the anomaly, not the norm. The sheer weight of the available data makes it pretty clear that it's just not something anyone can do.
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I think it's more of will power to be honest...sure you can delve deep into it and pull it out but I think it just at ground zero it's lazy.
For me I just wanted to impress girls, so I busted my ass all summer long to come back and make an impression...it's drive man, some people just don't have it or want it that bad.
You can make excuses for everything, but in the end your only cheating yourself.
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My friend that i was talking about earlier in this thread is involved in an support association for obese people, she told me that 90% of people who get those type of operations dont actually succesfully lose weight and keep it down. She's one of the few who actually do it.
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One of my friend's mothers had it done. She was easily over 400 lbs. She's very happy with the results now. She lost over 120 lbs in less than a year, and actually complained that it wasn't shedding off faster. Morphix, did you have gastric bypass done as well? Because that's a really dramatic weight loss similar to the results of that kind of surgery. Then again, the subway guy lost something like 200 pounds in a year, so it's possible. Congrats on the hard work :)
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Morphix's secret:
(http://www.metrodrug.org/images/cocaine.jpg)
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Morphix, did you have gastric bypass done as well? Because that's a really dramatic weight loss similar to the results of that kind of surgery. Then again, the subway guy lost something like 200 pounds in a year, so it's possible. Congrats on the hard work :)
I just dieted and exercised everyday. Like I said before my aunt did have the surgery and I have lost about what she has so far but I look healthily and still have all my hair and teeth (she looks like a walking corpse with a boob job) :D
Morphix's secret:
(http://www.metrodrug.org/images/cocaine.jpg)
:shh
that is my magic fairy dust :hyper
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I think it's more of will power to be honest...sure you can delve deep into it and pull it out but I think it just at ground zero it's lazy.
For me I just wanted to impress girls, so I busted my ass all summer long to come back and make an impression...it's drive man, some people just don't have it or want it that bad.
You can make excuses for everything, but in the end your only cheating yourself.
The same could be said about people who are depressed. They should just "snap out of it" and stop being whiny emo bitches, right?
If you lost over 20 pounds and keep it off for over three years, statistically speaking you're 1 in 10,000. Those kind of numbers mean it's not enough to just slap a lazy label on the other 9999. If "lazy" is the problem, then "lazy" is a deeper and more difficult thing to treat than you think. Most people just aren't capable of success. I guess that is pretty hard to accept though, but numbers and decades of research really can't just be thrown out the window just to make us feel like we're really in control.
It's like cancer or heart disease - we all want to think that by not smoking, exercising, and eating lots of broccoli, we can avoid heart disease and cancer, but we can only minimize the risk - we can't completely avoid cancer or heart disease without a big chunk of good luck. Same with significant and lasting weight loss: we can do all the right things, but a big factor is good luck in having all the necessary genetics and tools and personality and lifestyle and support network. Without having all of those ducks in a row, "healthy, natural" weight loss may not be possible or sustainable.
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The difference is that in most cases, the people who end up depressed didn't put themselves in that situation. If you sit there all day and don't exercise and shit, well, ofcourse you're going to end up obese.
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The difference is that in most cases, the people who end up depressed didn't put themselves in that situation. If you sit there all day and don't exercise and shit, well, ofcourse you're going to end up obese.
The problem is that most obese people are usually dieting and trying to exercise, with little success. Whether their lifestyle contributed or caused their disease, they still have a disease, and the available data shows that surgery or drugs are the best (statistically speaking the only viable) treatment.