Mike Huckabee - 28%
Mitt Romney - 25%
Rudy Giuliani - 12%
Fred Thompson - 11%
Oh you wacky Christians.
I still say there should just be a national primary day. Fuck this state by state bullshit.
Tradition rules american politics. Iowa and New Hampshire will hand pick our nominees until a national primary system is forced at them
Tradition rules american politics. Iowa and New Hampshire will hand pick our nominees until a national primary system is forced at them
Tradition is about the dumbest fucking reason to keep doing something ever.
"Hey guys, what do you say we not pound nails into our dicks this Halloween?"
"Dude, we do that EVERY year! It's a tradition!"
"lol you're rite!"
Where does the name Huckabee originate from? Never heard of anybody by that name in Australia
He still lost. :lol
He still lost. :lol
But the point is he won the nomination. I will admit FoC, Paul held his own tonight. I thought McCain clocked him with the WWII/isolationist comment, but overall he did a good job making sense, which can't be said of half the people on the stage
The rise of evangelical Christians as the force that blasted the GOP out of minority status during the past generation always contained an inherent danger: What if these new Republican acolytes supported not merely a conventional conservative but one of their own?
I figured that Huckabee was worrying certain parts of the GOP when I read this column. (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/11/25/AR2007112501547.html) When Robert Novak's penning hit pieces, you know you've arrived.Quote from: NovakThe rise of evangelical Christians as the force that blasted the GOP out of minority status during the past generation always contained an inherent danger: What if these new Republican acolytes supported not merely a conventional conservative but one of their own?
That's a pretty open admission of disdain for a very large chunk of the party's constituency. He may as well just call them useful idiots and be done with it.
Apparently Jesus tortured people. Just ask Huckabee.What, you never had to be subjected to Catholic mass?
Apparently Jesus tortured people. Just ask Huckabee.What, you never had to be subjected to Catholic mass?
You missed my joke. :(Apparently Jesus tortured people. Just ask Huckabee.What, you never had to be subjected to Catholic mass?
Huckabee isn't catholic. I took communion at catholic mass once, does that mean I am going to hell?
PD: They've gotten some traction on stem cells, the Mexico City rule, abstinence-only sex ed funding, Israel policy, and judicial nominations. Their influence isn't as great as a lot of people were saying in the aftermath of 2004, but they're not just a bunch of easily-exploited rubes, either.
PD, I want you to respond to this "Calling Ron Paul an isolationist is like calling your neighbor an isolationist because he doesn't do donuts in your lawn and throw bricks in your windows."
CBS Poll December 2003
Howard Dean 23%
Wesley Clark 10%
Joe Lieberman 6%
Al Sharpton 6%
Richard Gephardt 5%
John Kerry 4%
:o
CBS Poll December 2003
Howard Dean 23%
Wesley Clark 10%
Joe Lieberman 6%
Al Sharpton 6%
Richard Gephardt 5%
John Kerry 4%
:o
Thats funny, my quote didnt mention ron paul anywhere. In fact I wasnt even the first to mention ron paul.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v180/Triumph/colbertturnmh9.gif)
Also, we have a thread for Ron Paul stuff, FoC.
Huckabee is the fucking devil. I'd vote for Ron Paul out of principle if Huckabee were the opponent. If a religious cuntjob wins this election, abandon country! America is dead! It can't take anotehr 8 years of this shit.
how about "calling ron paul an isolationist is like calling your neighbor an isolationist because he keeps a stockpile of guns in his basement and spends an inordinate amount of time peering narrowly through the blinds at your house"
Thats funny, my quote didnt mention ron paul anywhere. In fact I wasnt even the first to mention ron paul.
Huckabee is actually sincere about his faith, and serious - unlike Bush. I'd imagine the inevitable democratic congress would keep him in check with regard to that if he becomes president.
I can think of one political issues that I form my opinion on based on religion; when it comes to effecting people's lives, I don't agree with dictating law on the basis of scripture.
Huckabee is the fucking devil. I'd vote for Ron Paul out of principle if Huckabee were the opponent. If a religious cuntjob wins this election, abandon country! America is dead! It can't take anotehr 8 years of this shit.
Huckabee is the fucking devil. I'd vote for Ron Paul out of principle if Huckabee were the opponent. If a religious cuntjob wins this election, abandon country! America is dead! It can't take anotehr 8 years of this shit.
Your ilk will have to walk around with stylish pink "G's" stitched onto all of your clothes, sir.
Thats funny, my quote didnt mention ron paul anywhere. In fact I wasnt even the first to mention ron paul.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v180/Triumph/colbertturnmh9.gif)(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v180/Triumph/colbertturnmh9.gif)(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v180/Triumph/colbertturnmh9.gif)(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v180/Triumph/colbertturnmh9.gif)(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v180/Triumph/colbertturnmh9.gif)
Considering we are currently talking about the republican debate, of which Paul was apart of...it's perfectly valid to discuss him here in the context of the discussion
Ron Paul isn't just against military intervention. He's also against foreign aid. And international financial institutions. And collective security. And bilateral trade agreements. And immigration.All good positions.
Ron Paul believes in the NAFTA Superhighway, which I believe just came up in this debate.
He's an isolationist. If you want to switch gears and explain why isolationism is awesome, be my guest.
Huckabee is actually sincere about his faith, and serious - unlike Bush. I'd imagine the inevitable democratic congress would keep him in check with regard to that if he becomes president.
I can think of one political issues that I form my opinion on based on religion; when it comes to effecting people's lives, I don't agree with dictating law on the basis of scripture.
First, you better have some evidence if you're going to presume that Bush's faith is more false than, say, yours.
Second, you mean "affecting people's lives".
"Effecting" a life would mean giving birth.
Considering we are currently talking about the republican debate, of which Paul was apart of...it's perfectly valid to discuss him here in the context of the discussion
Exactly, does anyone have the video of Ron Pauls last response. God it was so fucking awesome.
Considering we are currently talking about the republican debate, of which Paul was apart of...it's perfectly valid to discuss him here in the context of the discussion
Exactly, does anyone have the video of Ron Pauls last response. God it was so fucking awesome.
That was pretty sad. :-\
right here: http://galleryofretards.ytmnd.com/
I want to volunteer for the special Olympics one day.
I don't care. I really feel sorry for them.
come on; that song is catchy as hell. if only ron paul could come up with something so memorable
I don't care. I really feel sorry for them.
CBS Poll December 2003
Howard Dean 23%
Wesley Clark 10%
Joe Lieberman 6%
Al Sharpton 6%
Richard Gephardt 5%
John Kerry 4%
:o
I cant wait till Ron Paul voters are forced to pick someone else in Iowa. In Iowa if a candidate does not reach 15% the people who voted for him are asked to pick someone new. There is a 15% voter threshold in the state.Huckabee is the fucking devil. I'd vote for Ron Paul out of principle if Huckabee were the opponent. If a religious cuntjob wins this election, abandon country! America is dead! It can't take anotehr 8 years of this shit.
Ron Paul is your only choice. Submit to religion or socialism. Choose your poison.
I cant wait till Ron Paul voters are forced to pick someone else in Iowa. In Iowa if a candidate does not reach 15% the people who voted for him are asked to pick someone new. There is a 15% voter threshold in the state.Huckabee is the fucking devil. I'd vote for Ron Paul out of principle if Huckabee were the opponent. If a religious cuntjob wins this election, abandon country! America is dead! It can't take anotehr 8 years of this shit.
Ron Paul is your only choice. Submit to religion or socialism. Choose your poison.
Imagine all the people voting for a politician who has a chance of being elected and has some realistic promises.
I cant wait till Ron Paul voters are forced to pick someone else in Iowa. In Iowa if a candidate does not reach 15% the people who voted for him are asked to pick someone new. There is a 15% voter threshold in the state.
I cant wait till Ron Paul voters are forced to pick someone else in Iowa. In Iowa if a candidate does not reach 15% the people who voted for him are asked to pick someone new. There is a 15% voter threshold in the state.Huckabee is the fucking devil. I'd vote for Ron Paul out of principle if Huckabee were the opponent. If a religious cuntjob wins this election, abandon country! America is dead! It can't take anotehr 8 years of this shit.
Ron Paul is your only choice. Submit to religion or socialism. Choose your poison.
Most of his supporters would rather leave than vote for anyone else. But that wont happen. He will get above 15%. Did you shit yourself when they showed Ron Paul was #2 in New HAmpshire gay boy? Are you prepared for your ban?
I cant wait till Ron Paul voters are forced to pick someone else in Iowa. In Iowa if a candidate does not reach 15% the people who voted for him are asked to pick someone new. There is a 15% voter threshold in the state.Huckabee is the fucking devil. I'd vote for Ron Paul out of principle if Huckabee were the opponent. If a religious cuntjob wins this election, abandon country! America is dead! It can't take anotehr 8 years of this shit.
Ron Paul is your only choice. Submit to religion or socialism. Choose your poison.
Most of his supporters would rather leave than vote for anyone else. But that wont happen. He will get above 15%. Did you shit yourself when they showed Ron Paul was #2 in New HAmpshire gay boy? Are you prepared for your ban?
Not one single respected polling outlet has ever listed Paul as #2 in NH. Here is a list of EVERY poll from NH. Not one has him in second. Or even third.
http://www.pollster.com/08-NH-Rep-Pres-Primary.php
Also our deal was about Iowa where is fairing worse than NH.
No that was a deal with someone else, Raol I believe you made one with him if he wins ANY primary.Huckabee is the fucking devil. I'd vote for Ron Paul out of principle if Huckabee were the opponent. If a religious cuntjob wins this election, abandon country! America is dead! It can't take anotehr 8 years of this shit.
Ron Paul is your only choice. Submit to religion or socialism. Choose your poison.
I cant wait till Ron Paul voters are forced to pick someone else in Iowa. In Iowa if a candidate does not reach 15% the people who voted for him are asked to pick someone new. There is a 15% voter threshold in the state.
Most of his supporters would rather leave than vote for anyone else. But that wont happen. He will get above 15%. Did you shit yourself when they showed Ron Paul was #2 in New HAmpshire gay boy? Are you prepared for your ban?
Not one single respected polling outlet has ever listed Paul as #2 in NH. Here is a list of EVERY poll from NH. Not one has him in second. Or even third.
http://www.pollster.com/08-NH-Rep-Pres-Primary.php
Also our deal was about Iowa where is fairing worse than NH.
No it was about any of the primary states.
Ok, now this has gone from a discussion on the debate to stupid Ron Paul chat time. He's not getting 10% in any primary so please, stfuWe all know that. He doesn't lol, FoC leaves in little over a month then and then this will be all over and political topics can be decently normal.
Politics, Cheebs, and myself. The perfect combination :bow
So good sir, what have you been hearing about polls that occurred after this debate? Seems like Huckabee is considered the winner of last night's debate by everyone, and he's surging everywhere.
Ok, now this has gone from a discussion on the debate to stupid Ron Paul chat time. He's not getting 10% in any primary so please, stfuWe all know that. He doesn't lol, FoC leaves in little over a month then and then this will be all over and political topics can be decently normal.
OK, now this has gone from a discussion on the debate to stupid Ron Paul chat time. He's not getting 10% in any primary so please, stfu
OK, now this has gone from a discussion on the debate to stupid Ron Paul chat time. He's not getting 10% in any primary so please, stfu
Same goes for you PD. You worship cheebs, but he is the one that keeps egging me on about Ron Paul. We could have a decent discussion if it wasn't for cheeps and Triumph constantly masterbating their penis.
:lol
Hardball. 7PM, can't wait :hyperHardball is on right now... 7 PM is the rerun of it.
Romney has put so much money into Iowa that it'll be very telling if he loses there. As I predicted, Huckabee is getting a lot of coverage today in the media, and he'll be going one on one with Matthews on Hardball. 7PM, can't wait :hyper
Iowa: Romney (Huckabee in a very close second)
NH: Romney
Michigan: Romney
South Carolina: Huckabee
End results nationally...
1. Romney
2. HUCKABEE - possible VP candidate if Rudy were to win the nom
3. Rudy - I'm expecting his candidacy to implode once the slime reaches the surface
4. Thompson - what happened with him lol
5. McCain - I still fall in love with him sometimes, like last night during his passionate arguments against torture. Too bad that's the only side of him that's honest now
6. Tancredo/Hunter
7. that other guy
Romney plus Huckabee - two different kinds of religious nuts that taste great together?The Republican party: mixed nuts with crackers?
I've made my opinion on Paul known, and I'm not shocked that you've done your hardest to turn this thread into another Paul discussion. Unlike Drinky/Cheebs/Raoul/etc, I'm not going to validate your shitty candidate by discussion him. Like Kucinich (and Rudy) I think he's overall a weak candidate who doesn't understand the current mechanics of the world.
I've made my opinion on Paul known, and I'm not shocked that you've done your hardest to turn this thread into another Paul discussion. Unlike Drinky/Cheebs/Raoul/etc, I'm not going to validate your shitty candidate by discussion him. Like Kucinich (and Rudy) I think he's overall a weak candidate who doesn't understand the current mechanics of the world.
Right... he understands the world better than your ass ever will.
And so does Henry Kissinger, what's your point?
Ichi what's your definition of religious nut? Someone who is religious, or something else
I think McCain has some sort of psychological complex that came from his experience in Vietnam. I think deep down inside he knows that he was sent to Vietnam for a pointless war that achieved nothing. But he can't attack those who sent him to Vietnam because those people are long gone. Rather, McCain projects his anger on anti-war elements such as those which protested the war in Vietnam. Thus, he flips out whenever anyone advocates changing our foreign policy in a fundamental way, because such change would essentially confirm McCain's worst nightmare: that this country sent him to Vietnam for nothing.I think McCain is loyal. It's part of his army mindset. Despite how wrong it is he is is loyal to his party and army.
I think McCain is loyal. It's part of his army mindset. Despite how wrong it is he is is loyal to his party and army.
I think McCain is loyal. It's part of his army mindset. Despite how wrong it is he is is loyal to his party and army.
Thats deep man
If you've ever talked with someone who fought in Vietnam or even Iraq, they won't tell you their buddies died for "nothing". A soldier who jumps on a grenade to save members of his platoon didn't die for "nothing".
If you've ever talked with someone who fought in Vietnam or even Iraq, they won't tell you their buddies died for "nothing". A soldier who jumps on a grenade to save members of his platoon didn't die for "nothing".
Maybe, but I don't think they are dying for my freedom either.
Also, Ron Paul served in the air force during vietnam. Just sayin...
If you've ever talked with someone who fought in Vietnam or even Iraq, they won't tell you their buddies died for "nothing". A soldier who jumps on a grenade to save members of his platoon didn't die for "nothing".
Maybe, but I don't think they are dying for my freedom either.
Also, Ron Paul served in the air force during vietnam. Just sayin...
I don't either, and that is irrelevent to my point.
I respect McCain for his service, but I'll always be disappointed that he traded his soul for political gain. And based on the polls, it looks like he severely miscalculated. Many on the right still hate him, and many on the religious right still don't trust him.
Like Ron Paul? :lol
PD, wtf. You were the one who said you weren't going to feed into FoC's Ron Paul mania, and here you are, doing it again.
I was reading how in the latest Zogby poll, all the current major Republican candidates would beat Hillary Clinton in a general election. Discuss.
John Edwards seems to be the best candidate on the Democrats' side. I wish I wasn't just an observer in this and could actually vote.
I was reading how in the latest Zogby poll, all the current major Republican candidates would beat Hillary Clinton in a general election. Discuss.
It was fitting that Huckabee be asked what Jesus thinks because, in the past, the former Baptist minister has asserted an ability to talk directly to God.
Foc: I wasn't old enough to vote in 2004; I voted for the first time in 2006. If I was able to, I would have voted for Kerry no questions asked
http://www.japantoday.com/jp/news/422110
Sounds fishy, but interesting. From my understanding there has never been a big poll that shows her losing to Guliani or anyone else; in fact Rudy actually brags about polls that show he's the "closest" to beating her in a general lol.Or Ron Paul.
hmmm. Not that I disagree...I don't see Hillary beating Romney, Rudy, or even Huckabee.
FoC, why do you call yourself a Democrat (as you have on EB before)? You seem to be extremely conservative in a lot of respects.
Zogby uses online polling, most in the media don't source them much. Someone mentioned a Zogby Poll on Hardball once and Chris Matthews chewed them saying they aren't reliable. Gallup released a set of polls AFTER Zogby having Hillary beat everyone like all previous polls.
Zogby founded the polling firm Zogby International in 1984. Since then, he has conducted polls around the world, though he has gained the most notoriety for his polls of United States Presidential elections.
He first gained attention in the 1996 Presidential election when his final poll came within a tenth of a point of the actual result. Zogby also correctly predicted the cliffhanger result of the 2000 presidential election won narrowly by George W. Bush, in contrast to most other pollsters who had expected Bush to win easily.
In 2004, however, his predictions failed to materialize. Before polls had even closed in the 2004 presidential election, Zogby predicted a comfortable win for John Kerry (311 electoral votes, versus 213 for Bush, with 14 too close to call), saying that "Bush had this election lost a long time ago," adding that voters wanted a change and would vote for "any candidate who was not Bush." While admitting that he was mistaken, Zogby did not admit any possible flaws in his poll methods, insisting that his predictions were all "within the margin of error." While on The Daily Show With Jon Stewart, he said he felt that Kerry would win due to the undecided voters. Despite his personal prediction, Zogby's final poll showed Bush with a one point lead over Kerry, making him one of the 'winners' among pollsters according to the New York Post and Boston Globe.[1] Zogby later released a "mea culpa" in which he stated "I will do better next time: I will just poll, not predict." [2]
In 2006, Zogby phone polling correctly called all 10 competitive United States Senate races and nailed the exact margin in the three closest races. His interactive online polling correctly called the winner of 17 of 18 races, but was far off in the margin of victory of some races. [3]
Zogby has also had success with elections in countries outside the United States. He correctly called the 2001 Israeli election for Ariel Sharon, the 2000 Mexican election for Vicente Fox and again in Mexico with the victory of Felipe Calderón in 2006. Also, Zogby has made a sideline of polling Arab attitudes toward the United States, particularly in regard to Lebanon.
no, foc, most voting americans are adults, not simple-minded and naive childrenThe American electorate sure fooled me.
no, foc, most voting americans are adults, not simple-minded and naive children
Most americans also want universal health care that kinda goes against Ron Paul.
Americans don't have a problem with govt. spending, as long as they spend it on what they want.
why would they vote for ron paul, a man with a simple and naive view of political reality?
reality-based community ftw
Most americans also want universal health care that kinda goes against Ron Paul.
Americans don't have a problem with govt. spending, as long as they spend it on what they want.
FoC, why do you keep posting Ron Paul stuff here when, like, 99% of the forum either dislikes you or thinks Ron Paul sucks?
I am not telling you what to think, I am telling you how the majority of America feels and why they don't agree with Ron Paul. America is not a nation that is fiscally conservative, not by a long shot. Socially conservative? Sure, to an extent. Fiscally? Not really.Most americans also want universal health care that kinda goes against Ron Paul.
Americans don't have a problem with govt. spending, as long as they spend it on what they want.
You dont need government to tell you how to spend your money :lol :lol
Unless your socialist.
FoC, why do you keep posting Ron Paul stuff here when, like, 99% of the forum either dislikes you or thinks Ron Paul sucks?
You asked me a question i was responding.
I am not telling you what to think, I am telling you how the majority of America feels and why they don't agree with Ron Paul. America is not a nation that is fiscally conservative, not by a long shot. Socially conservative? Sure, to an extent. Fiscally? Not really.
PD: I am using as a point to show FoC's claim that America will "agree" with Ron Paul is inherently false.
This is unrelated to that. You keep posting here even though you've been lepered for like a year, and whenever you talk about Ron Paul, you are mercilessly teased. I mean, you've got Homosexual Boy practically fellating himself in anticipation of your being permabanned.
Why post somewhere where you get kicked around so much?
You dont need government to tell you how to spend your money :lol :lol
Unless your socialist.
Awesome! You are actually agreeing with Ron Paul. Are money is worthless.
money doesn't have value in a vacuum. nor does gold, especially in this day and age. your money is fundamentally worthless without a government backing it.
YOU are thinking in the fashion of a socialist, for what it's worth, even if your tenets difference. "oh, if everyone could just see the ron paul light and live in harmony..." libertarian and socialist mooncalves are simply different sides of the same simple-minded fantasy coin.
Unless your socialist.
Are money is worthless.
FoC is the same age as PD and Gay Boy, right? Why do his posts always sound like they were written by someone five years younger?
Perhaps he's still a child at heart.
Unless your socialist.Are money is worthless.
You're kidding me?
FoC is the same age as PD and Gay Boy, right? Why do his posts always sound like they were written by someone five years younger?
Perhaps he's still a child at heart.
Pretty much. That and I usually than faster than I can think. Being lepered doesn't help since I cant edit my posts.
no, i am not agreeing with ron paul, you simpleton, because i believe that currency is built on strong international banking relations and debt, not fucking gold. and i don't believe our money is worthless, because WE AREN'T IN A VACUUM. it's simple black-and-white dogma like paul's monetary platform that is so insulting. the world is as complex -- and possibly moreso -- as paul's manchild supporters fear. it's called FIAT CURRENCY, and ron would love to pretend it doesn't exist -- but that's the way it works.
FoC is the same age as PD and Gay Boy, right? Why do his posts always sound like they were written by someone five years younger?
Perhaps he's still a child at heart.
Pretty much. That and I usually than faster than I can think. Being lepered doesn't help since I cant edit my posts.
You just come off as way too naive, dude. You need to come face to face with some harsh realities of life...there are reasons why Ron Paul's view of the world will never, ever come to pass.
FoC is the same age as PD and Gay Boy, right? Why do his posts always sound like they were written by someone five years younger?
Perhaps he's still a child at heart.
What does the world being complex have to with a currency that has real value. If the government had to back every dollar with gold then the fed couldn't print off however much they needed which would mean that the government would actually have to *gasp* be fiscally responsible.
Cheebs is 21 and I'm 20. I'm pretty sure FoC is like 24. I'm not an intellectual, and honestly I'm not that smart when it comes to these issues; my forte is more along business lines, history, etc. But what I try to do is understand people's perspectives, understand where they're coming from, and fucking get an understanding of an issue.
What does the world being complex have to with a currency that has real value. If the government had to back every dollar with gold then the fed couldn't print off however much they needed which would mean that the government would actually have to *gasp* be fiscally responsible.
then all you do is make GOLD the new fiat currency with paper money as a proxy. society and the government it creates to support it dictate what is valuable and what isn't. moving to a new arbitrary standard changes nothing, as history as shown. under the current currency model we have to arbitrate internationally which i think is a GOOD thing in the long term.
The reality that Huckabee is more legitimately a Republican, and a more viable candidate than Paul by a long shot, fills me with both joy and revulsion.
Reagan invented the republican party?The reality that Huckabee is more legitimately a Republican, and a more viable candidate than Paul by a long shot, fills me with both joy and revulsion.
What? none of the candidates even resemble Reagan.
Reagan invented the republican party?The reality that Huckabee is more legitimately a Republican, and a more viable candidate than Paul by a long shot, fills me with both joy and revulsion.
What? none of the candidates even resemble Reagan.
we're not in the beginning of civilization, dipshit. we have many commodities that have far more intrinsic value than gold, including uranium in the simplest case and microprocessors and banking contracts in the more complicated cases.we aren't far from synthesizing gold. ultimately, though, it matters for nothing, BECAUSE MODERN SOCIETY AND GOVERNMENT DETERMINE THE INTRINSIC VALUE OF GOLD, JUST LIKE PAPER. the government merely has to devalue gold to destroy your purchasing power. all currency is fundamentally fiat. get used to it. reality is mean.
Reagan invented the republican party?The reality that Huckabee is more legitimately a Republican, and a more viable candidate than Paul by a long shot, fills me with both joy and revulsion.
What? none of the candidates even resemble Reagan.
i think foc has been reading too much bob novak. also, barry goldwater and his teabagging of the moral conservative set am cry
Reagan invented the republican party?
Reagan invented the republican party?The reality that Huckabee is more legitimately a Republican, and a more viable candidate than Paul by a long shot, fills me with both joy and revulsion.
What? none of the candidates even resemble Reagan.
i think foc has been reading too much bob novak. also, barry goldwater and his teabagging of the moral conservative set am cry
Never read any of them. You lose.
:elfReagan invented the republican party?The reality that Huckabee is more legitimately a Republican, and a more viable candidate than Paul by a long shot, fills me with both joy and revulsion.
What? none of the candidates even resemble Reagan.
i think foc has been reading too much bob novak. also, barry goldwater and his teabagging of the moral conservative set am cry
Never read any of them. You lose.
no, YOU lose because bob novak is the loudest paul apologist on the pundit circuit, and barry goldwater CREATED the modern republican party.
wait, why am i arguing politics with a guy who doesn't know anything about his party's political history?? fool me once, shame on me. fool me twice, shame on you. fool me thrice, FHUTA!
wait, why am i arguing politics with a guy who doesn't know anything about his party's political history?? fool me once, shame on me. fool me twice, shame on you. fool me thrice, FHUTA!
Because I didnt read goldwater's book, I dont know anything abut the party's history? :lol
wait, why am i arguing politics with a guy who doesn't know anything about his party's political history?? fool me once, shame on me. fool me twice, shame on you. fool me thrice, FHUTA!
Because I didnt read goldwater's book, I dont know anything abut the party's history? :lol
th' fuck! do you even know who barry goldwater is?
i certainly know he did a lot more than write a book, clown. don't be disingenuous.
no, i didn't. i said you were reading bob novak. the following sentence suggested that barry goldwater would cry if he knew you thought modern republicanism began with reagan. JESUS FUCK YOU REALLY ARE ILLITERATE
wait, why am i arguing politics with a guy who doesn't know anything about his party's political history?? fool me once, shame on me. fool me twice, shame on you. fool me thrice, FHUTA!
Because I didnt read goldwater's book, I dont know anything abut the party's history? :lol
th' fuck! do you even know who barry goldwater is?
In response to Moral Majority founder Jerry Falwell's opposition to the nomination of Sandra Day O'Connor to the Supreme Court, of which Falwell had said, “Every good Christian should be concerned,” Goldwater retorted: “I think every good Christian ought to kick Falwell right in the ass.”:lol
yet he sucked their dicks when the hippies were at his doorstep!
Modern republicans are molded more in the mold of a Reagan, who also wasn't known for fiscal responsibility but was conservative on taxes and social issues. People seem to forget what Reagan did lol.Oddly Reagan really wasn't religious. He never went to church. He just knew how to use the religious right. lol
Modern republicans are molded more in the mold of a Reagan, who also wasn't known for fiscal responsibility but was conservative on taxes and social issues. People seem to forget what Reagan did lol.Oddly Reagan really wasn't religious. He never went to church. He just knew how to use the religious right. lol
Modern republicans are molded more in the mold of a Reagan, who also wasn't known for fiscal responsibility but was conservative on taxes and social issues. People seem to forget what Reagan did lol.Oddly Reagan really wasn't religious. He never went to church. He just knew how to use the religious right. lol
He was a master politician, like Clinton. He knew who to motivate and when
Horrible foreign policy decision. But it makes no sense to deny Reagan's mastery of his field on that - the fact that he was even forgiven for that my most people is a testament to how much people trusted him. If that had happened to Bush or Nixon they wouldn't have came out alive lol
Horrible foreign policy decision. But it makes no sense to deny Reagan's mastery of his field on that - the fact that he was even forgiven for that my most people is a testament to how much people trusted him. If that had happened to Bush or Nixon they wouldn't have came out alive lolReagan and Clinton were good at that.
Modern republicans are molded more in the mold of a Reagan, who also wasn't known for fiscal responsibility but was conservative on taxes and social issues. People seem to forget what Reagan did lol.Oddly Reagan really wasn't religious. He never went to church. He just knew how to use the religious right. lol
He was a master politician, like Clinton. He knew who to motivate and when
Modern republicans are molded more in the mold of a Reagan, who also wasn't known for fiscal responsibility but was conservative on taxes and social issues. People seem to forget what Reagan did lol.Oddly Reagan really wasn't religious. He never went to church. He just knew how to use the religious right. lol
He was a master politician, like Clinton. He knew who to motivate and when
Please read some books.
Too bad McCain is outpolling him in both Iowa and NH(http://www.paulunteer.com/images/PaulOwnsMcCain.gif)
what does that supposed to mean? And what does it have to do with the topic at all?Too bad McCain is outpolling him in both Iowa and NH(http://www.paulunteer.com/images/PaulOwnsMcCain.gif)
what does that supposed to mean? And what does it have to do with the topic at all?
You have a ron paul topic, take this shit there. We were talking about Reagan and Clinton yet you are spamming with ron paul images when no one is even talking about him on this page. Jesus Christ you have issues.:santocry
With stuff ABOUT RON PAUL which is on topic. We werent even talking about Ron Paul in here, we were talking about Reagan and Clinton. Jan 3rd can't come soon enough.You have a ron paul topic, take this shit there. We were talking about Reagan and Clinton yet you are spamming with ron paul images when no one is even talking about him on this page. Jesus Christ you have issues.:santocry
You spammed my Ron Paul thread. Deal with it.
With stuff ABOUT RON PAUL which is on topic. We werent even talking about Ron Paul in here, we were talking about Reagan and Clinton. Jan 3rd can't come soon enough.You have a ron paul topic, take this shit there. We were talking about Reagan and Clinton yet you are spamming with ron paul images when no one is even talking about him on this page. Jesus Christ you have issues.:santocry
You spammed my Ron Paul thread. Deal with it.
Modern republicans are molded more in the mold of a Reagan, who also wasn't known for fiscal responsibility but was conservative on taxes and social issues. People seem to forget what Reagan did lol.Oddly Reagan really wasn't religious. He never went to church. He just knew how to use the religious right. lol
He was a master politician, like Clinton. He knew who to motivate and when
Please read some books.
I thought you were taking a break from the internet because you realized your ron paul obsession was getting out of hand?
what does that supposed to mean? And what does it have to do with the topic at all?
(http://www.paulunteer.com/images/PaulOwnsMcCain.gif)
Seriously, where are you getting the image of Reagan as some LBJ-style political player? I don't think I've heard that even from his supporters.
http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=1733824 (http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=1733824)
Here is Reagan's first inaugural address. It's pretty awesome.
He was a master speaker, great debater, etc.
In ten years I'd imagine Clinton's historical praise will rise as well
the poor got royally fucked under reagan
Okay, I took "who to motivate and when" referred to him personally motivating those around him, as in staff, department heads, and legislators. I meant LBJ-style, rather than LBJ-level of effectiveness.
Reagan was a good media politician and a mediocre manager. He let intra-administration feuds fester, delegated almost all of the legislative heavy lifting to other people (the Bakers, Dole and Rostenkowski, for example), and didn't accomplish much of his platform.
If you meant he was choosing which parts of the electorate to motivate and when to do it, I can only scratch my head. He won with the same coalition Nixon did (mythical Reagan Democrats aside), and made speeches when he wanted to push a major part of his agenda or get elected. If Reagan transcended politics for some people, it says way more about them than anything he accomplished.
So who was Reagan so good at motivating, in your eyes? Voters or pols?
Please show your work.
I read in this week's US News and World Report that Ron Paul is polling at 3.3%!
Did you read the follow up story about that very fundraiser?I read in this week's US News and World Report that Ron Paul is polling at 3.3%!
(http://www.paulunteer.com/images/PaulOwnsMcCain.gif)
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1107/7105.html (http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1107/7105.html)
Did you read the follow up story about that very fundraiser?I read in this week's US News and World Report that Ron Paul is polling at 3.3%!
(http://www.paulunteer.com/images/PaulOwnsMcCain.gif)
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1107/7105.html (http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1107/7105.html)
"Latest Paul money bomb looks like dud"
"A one-day fundraising drive billed as the second “money bomb” for Republican presidential candidate Ron Paul appears to be falling well short of its target"
your own source that you cited said today was one!Did you read the follow up story about that very fundraiser?I read in this week's US News and World Report that Ron Paul is polling at 3.3%!
(http://www.paulunteer.com/images/PaulOwnsMcCain.gif)
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1107/7105.html (http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1107/7105.html)
"Latest Paul money bomb looks like dud"
"A one-day fundraising drive billed as the second “money bomb” for Republican presidential candidate Ron Paul appears to be falling well short of its target"
His second money bomb is the 16th. You fail more miserably than usual.
http://teaparty07.com/
your own source that you cited said today was one!
Want me to trivialize it?:tbslol :tbslol
Howard Dean made the most money but didn't win a single primary.
When Ron Paul gets the nomination an you record yourself crying like a little homo and then post it?If he wins the primary I'll vote republican till the day I die.
So who was Reagan so good at motivating, in your eyes? Voters or pols?
Please show your work.
I was referring to his support among the American people, as well as the party; like all master politicians he was able to positively influence public opinion without much effort - that trust was there for whatever reason, just like Clinton more recently.
So who was Reagan so good at motivating, in your eyes? Voters or pols?
Please show your work.
I was referring to his support among the American people, as well as the party; like all master politicians he was able to positively influence public opinion without much effort - that trust was there for whatever reason, just like Clinton more recently.
You're trying to speak for the zeitgeist of a period you didn't live through, without citing anything to show why you'd think it. This just reeks of received wisdom, and for the most part it's wrong.
Reagan's approval ratings were not anything special (not as good as Ike, JFK, Bush 1, or LBJ when taken as averages over their time in office), and he had one major domestic policy triumph, the tax cuts in 81. He was re-elected easily, but the same is true for Nixon. Like all politicians, they were very dependent on the general political climate of the time and of outside factors (get elected during a recession, re-elected during a boom).
Boo great man theory of history. Hooray verifiable facts.
So who was Reagan so good at motivating, in your eyes? Voters or pols?
Please show your work.
I was referring to his support among the American people, as well as the party; like all master politicians he was able to positively influence public opinion without much effort - that trust was there for whatever reason, just like Clinton more recently.
You're trying to speak for the zeitgeist of a period you didn't live through, without citing anything to show why you'd think it. This just reeks of received wisdom, and for the most part it's wrong.
Reagan's approval ratings were not anything special (not as good as Ike, JFK, Bush 1, or LBJ when taken as averages over their time in office), and he had one major domestic policy triumph, the tax cuts in 81. He was re-elected easily, but the same is true for Nixon. Like all politicians, they were very dependent on the general political climate of the time and of outside factors (get elected during a recession, re-elected during a boom).
Boo great man theory of history. Hooray verifiable facts.
You say Reagan had a special ability to make people support him. Okay. Give some evidence.
Stop asserting a narrative that you can't support with either facts or personal experience. Is this so hard to understand?
He was a master politician, like Clinton. He knew who to motivate and when
Quote from: PhoenixDarkHe was a master politician, like Clinton. He knew who to motivate and when
I don't think anything you've said has indicated that he made savvy choices in which people to motivate, or when to do so.
I'll concede that Reagan has an uncanny skill for being well-remembered two decades after the fact, but that's not quite the same thing.
Who did he choose to motivate? When did he do it?
wait, you think LBJ was a great president? the only reason he signed the civil rights bill was because he had nothing to gain from vetoing it. the country was mostly for civil rights and russia and the rest of the world were shocked at the racism in the US. LBJ also pushed a 1956 or 57 civil rights bill when he was a senator and that had all the things of the 65 one but since there was no civil rights movement, the northern senators had nothing to gain from pissing off the southern senators and so LBJ had to cut out everything important from it and voila, the south was still segregated for another decade.
I mean I'm sure LBJ had a COLOSSAL approval rating but he was not a great president.
A Republican pandering to culturally reactionary white people in 1980 wasn't a masterstroke. It was business as usual.
the only reason he signed the civil rights bill was because he had nothing to gain from vetoing it.He had A LOT to gain from veteoing it. And he did his all to get it signed. He went down the senate and roughed up senators, swearing at them and grabbing them by their collars to force them to vote for it. He put his all into getting that bill passed.
He had A LOT to gain from veteoing it. And he did his all to get it signed. He went down the senate and roughed up senators, swearing at them and grabbing them by their collars to force them to vote for it. He put his all into getting that bill passed.
It WAS great, I wouldn't call him a great president due to Vietnam but those rough actions he took during the civil rights bill lead up was great leadership. He rough-housed senators who didn't want to pass a bill to give civil rights, he used any means necessary to get that bill passed and America is better off because of it.
He had A LOT to gain from veteoing it. And he did his all to get it signed. He went down the senate and roughed up senators, swearing at them and grabbing them by their collars to force them to vote for it. He put his all into getting that bill passed.
Sounds like a great president. ::)
Oh, I'm getting your points. You're just making bad ones.
If you think of the Christian right as a movement that spawned in a vacuum, largely because Reagan decided to take the evangelicals away from Carter, then it was a genius move on his part.
I don't, though. The leaders of the movement had been operating for years, and there was a rich history of people voting against the new, morally permissive culture that was tearing down old norms and sources of authority. If you wanted, you could trace it back a century before Reagan. Amnesty, Acid, and Abortion in 1972. Rum, Romanism, and Rebellion in 1884.
The people involved in the Moral Majority were the ones who composed Nixon's silent majority. They had pushed back against the civil rights movement, fought the ratification of the EPA, decried Roe v. Wade, and generally hated hippies. This happened before Reagan, and right-wing politicians had been capitalizing on those sentiments for years when 1980 rolled around.
Reagan didn't buck conventional wisdom or pull off something very few other politicians could have. He put together roughly the same coalition that last elected a Republican president, on issues that had already been at the forefront of popular debate.
If you can't make a real argument, then don't fall back on accusations of bad faith. It's not a good look.
They wouldn't but they got the fucking job done. And when the goal is something as nobel as civil rights history is willing to "allow" the roughness of his tactics.
Cheebs: I agree. His tactics probably wouldn't fly in today's society lol.
Cheebs: I agree. His tactics probably wouldn't fly in today's society lol.
They wouldn't but they got the fucking job done. And when the goal is something as nobel as civil rights history is willing to "allow" the roughness of his tactics.
(http://www.paulunteer.com/images/PaulOwnsMcCain.gif)
Bu-bu-but THE CONSTITUTION! Bu-bu-but STATES RIGHTS!
England created our founding fathers by that logic we should give them control.
It wasn't England who endowed all men with certain unalienable rights; that doesn't mean our laws are dictated--or our lives should be governed--by that creator.
He had A LOT to gain from veteoing it. And he did his all to get it signed. He went down the senate and roughed up senators, swearing at them and grabbing them by their collars to force them to vote for it. He put his all into getting that bill passed.He would have been MORE successful (read: got a real civil rights bill passed sooner) if he withdrew his first one instead of cutting everything out of it. Since that civil rights bill was passed, southern segregationists could say they were being fair because they following the civil rights bill's laws. it's not that hard to understand.
Signing the civil rights bill killed the Democratic Party in the south. It lead to the death of the dixiecrat. As he said when signing the bill, they have lost the south to the republican party forever. He would have been able to keep the south democrat if he vetoed it.
and foc, you fucked a girl AFTER you slept with her so you have to understand that we may doubt your foresight.(http://www.paulunteer.com/images/PaulOwnsMcCain.gif)
Cheebs, you should lock this topic so FoC will bump his shitheap.
It's hilarious that you're so stuck on this one point, which you've failed you even address. With respect to it being a "genius" move I never suggested that. But you've proven for more than a page that you're not interested in reading comprehension.
Cheebs: I agree. His tactics probably wouldn't fly in today's society lol.
PD, stop making general statements based on how the media is portraying Reagan nowadays and give us some legit sources and hard info to back up what you're saying, please.
PD's certainly listed some historical factoids. He just hasn't arranged them into anything like a coherent argument.
Now he's all defensive and credential-waving. Boogie 2.0