THE BORE

General => The Superdeep Borehole => Topic started by: Billy Rygar on December 26, 2007, 04:56:12 PM

Title: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: Billy Rygar on December 26, 2007, 04:56:12 PM
The prologue begins as something Borges could have (and would have) dispatched in four pages or less, but the book begins to put on a show of linguistic fireworks (the most curious description of a car stuck in the snow is to be found here) as the prologue reaches the end.  At first I wasn't quite sure of how to approach the poem itself, should I just read it the first time uninterrupted by the annotations?  Or should I follow the book's own prescription and read the annotations first and fold them back into the poem itself?  I opted for the former and am just reading the poem for the meaning that can be had from the language itself (and what language it is).  I will leave my final impressions for the big finish (I'm starting Canto 3). 

I'm cutting this book up with Mandark's choice Johnathon Strange and Mr Norrell
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: TVC15 on December 26, 2007, 05:12:36 PM
You and Patel are making me want to read this again.  It will have to wait until after the new year though.
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: Howard Alan Treesong on December 26, 2007, 05:43:20 PM
Imma gonna try to finish this on the plane up to Seattle

Def. read the poem first, then the annotations. And what annotations they are!

J. Strange & M. Norrel also fuck rocks
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: Eric P on December 26, 2007, 05:49:10 PM
Quote from: Synthesizer Patel on December 26, 2007, 05:43:20 PM
J. Strange & M. Norrel also fuck rocks

i also endorse this message

i wish there were more to the book.

maybe i should re-read it. 
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: TVC15 on December 26, 2007, 06:06:08 PM
Should I read that Strange and Norrel book?  I kind of avoided it because it was a Big Popular Book and if I miss them on the upswing, I generally wait until the hype cools down to assess and read. 
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: Howard Alan Treesong on December 26, 2007, 06:13:59 PM
I totally recommend it, even post-hype.
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: Howard Alan Treesong on December 26, 2007, 07:10:58 PM
the most fun part of JSMN is the fake history and footnotes, which are absolutely deep and wonderful (not that the main story is shabby). it's not really qualifying as a meta-narrative, but it does add a really fun level of scholarship and depth to her magical England
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: TVC15 on December 26, 2007, 07:35:40 PM
Here is an excerpt from Pale Fire 2:  Himumu Boogaloo

(http://indarktrees.com/pics/threat.png)
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: Eric P on December 26, 2007, 07:57:31 PM
Quote from: Synthesizer Patel on December 26, 2007, 06:13:59 PM
I totally recommend it, even post-hype.

i agree with this statement

i have the wonderful knack of finding wonderful things i enjoy ruined when the rest of humanity gets its grubby hands on it.

this, sadly, is one of those things i watched die.

for White Man, I'd also like to suggest the book Q by "Luther Blissett"

Quote
The book follows the journey of an Anabaptist radical across Europe in the first half of the 16th century as he joins in various movements and uprisings that come as a result of the Protestant reformation. The book spans 30 years as he is pursued by 'Q', a spy for the Roman Catholic Church cardinal Giovanni Pietro Carafa. The main character, who changes many names during the story, first fights in the Peasants' War beside Thomas Müntzer, then is in Münster's siege, during the Münster Rebellion, and some years later, in Venice.

but the book is much much more than that
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: TVC15 on December 26, 2007, 08:10:20 PM
Quote from: Genghis Cohen on December 26, 2007, 08:03:33 PM
I remeber the hype for J. Strange being deafeningly obnoxious prior to the book actually being published.

I hate that I'm like this, but working in a book store for a while kind of soured me towards book marketing and book hype.  Yeah, that's really petty, and it is irrational, but FUCKING GOD DAMNED WHORE OPRAH RUINED A FEW OF MY FAVORITE BOOKS AND I HATE THE GODDAMNED WORLD!!!!!
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: Mandark on December 26, 2007, 08:33:06 PM
The bad thing about being too lazy to plug into the information streams about your hobbies is that you lag behind everything and who knows what you miss.

The upside is you're completely insulated from hype and your own misanthropic backlash.

I found out about JSMN from a blog post making fun of I Am Charlotte Simmons, and bought it when I was an amateur night watchman for a weekend and needed a book.  I'm biased cause I'm a huge Jane Austen fanboy and the book is obviously in her style, but it's still really good.
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: TVC15 on December 26, 2007, 08:34:33 PM
I Am Charlotte Simmons was a total lol.  I don't think I even finished it.  It should have been titled I Am Tom Wolfe and I Am Hopelessly Out of Touch With Anyone Younger Than Like 70.
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: TVC15 on December 26, 2007, 08:56:46 PM
You missed it, Cohen.  I don't know if you know this, but there are YOUNG PEOPLE having sex right now.  And some of them ARE GIRLS
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: Howard Alan Treesong on December 26, 2007, 08:59:39 PM
UNMARRIED GIRLS!!!!!!1
THEIR DORMITORY HOUSES ARE UNCHAPERONED
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: drohne on December 26, 2007, 10:09:01 PM
kinbote's suggestion to read the notes first, refer back to the poem, reread the notes, clip them out for easier access, etc. -- is meant to be a comic display of egoism. you were right to read the poem first
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: TVC15 on December 26, 2007, 10:16:10 PM
Hey Drohne, were you aware of the Pale Fire reference in The X-Files?  it's how I learned that Patel was an X-Files VIRGIN. 

I will spoiler tag this even though it isn't really a spoiler for either TXF or Pale Fire, but I just feel that such things should be spoiler tagged for the sake of keeping your readings uninfluenced.

spoiler (click to show/hide)
In Jose Chung's From Outer Space, one of the aliens that is acting benevolent and wise (I believe he saves a yokel from 2 aggressive aliens) loudly proclaims himself, in a very Lordly manner, to be LORD KINBOTE.  it is teh funny
[close]

See:  http://www.fulmerford.com/waxwing/nabopop/np11.html
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: Flannel Boy on December 26, 2007, 10:33:21 PM
Quote from: Genghis Cohen on December 26, 2007, 08:58:51 PM
Somebody should tell Malek.
I know. It just makes me all the more bitter.

Kids and sex. Will they let me join? HELL NO.
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: drohne on December 26, 2007, 11:21:02 PM
awesome -- that's my favorite episode of the x-files too. but i hadn't read pale fire the last time i saw it.
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: Mandark on December 27, 2007, 10:03:28 AM
Here's that post.  Man, I miss that site. (http://fafblog.blogspot.com/2004/11/fafblog-review-of-book-well-were-back.html)

Cohen: I describe it to people as a cross between Austen and Neil Gaiman.  I think the "HP for grownups" is going to be the marketing slogan for every single book involving magic and an adult reading level for the next couple decades, like the inevitable LOTR comparisons on fantasy book dust jackets.

And yeah, even though I love Austen, when someone says they're a fan, it usually signals a fascination with regency England or escapist romances.

TVC: Haw!

spoiler (click to show/hide)
That guy was meant to be done in stop-motion as a tribute to Ray Harryhausen, but they didn't have the time so they applied some effects to a guy in a monster suit.  Objectively best X-Files episode ever!
[close]
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: The Fake Shemp on December 27, 2007, 02:20:11 PM
Books suck. We should burn them.
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: drohne on December 27, 2007, 04:33:00 PM
even transformers: the official novelization of the film and transformers: the official production diary? :o
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: The Fake Shemp on December 27, 2007, 04:33:38 PM
Transformers are only cool when you actually see them transforming!
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: Mandark on December 27, 2007, 04:40:18 PM
So that's a thumbs down to the Transformers stage play, but thumbs up to Origami Prime.
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: Howard Alan Treesong on January 07, 2008, 03:03:22 PM
BUMP

I finished Pale Fire last night. I'll post thoughts later today.

Also, I found this girl online who listed I Am Charlotte Simmons as one of her favorite books in her, um, online dating profile. ANYWAYS, I wrote this charming letter complimenting her on her keenly honed sense of ironic narrative and she got all prissy pissy IN MY FACE about how it was one of her actual serious favorite books and made her who she is today.

El Oh El
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: TVC15 on January 07, 2008, 03:13:32 PM
Quote from: Synthesizer Patel on January 07, 2008, 03:03:22 PM
BUMP

I finished Pale Fire last night. I'll post thoughts later today.

Also, I found this girl online who listed I Am Charlotte Simmons as one of her favorite books in her, um, online dating profile. ANYWAYS, I wrote this charming letter complimenting her on her keenly honed sense of ironic narrative and she got all prissy pissy IN MY FACE about how it was one of her actual serious favorite books and made her who she is today.

El Oh El

IE it made her someone that took her first sip of alcohol after only 7 years as a college student, and a HUSSY that once contemplated kissing a man. . .BEFORE MARRIAGE?
Title: Re: Pale Fire: The Christmas Break Thread
Post by: Howard Alan Treesong on January 07, 2008, 03:54:03 PM
I'm reading this essay right now: http://www.libraries.psu.edu/nabokov/walter.htm

Pretty helpful. It explains a lot of stuff I missed or failed to completely parse, including

Actual Spoiler
spoiler (click to show/hide)
The additional identity of V. Botkin
[close]

Part of this is because I made a conscious effort to read the book "as a novel," from page first to page last. This meant that I ignored all of the early requests to go read notes in the 800-1000 range. It appears that something like 90% of these dicursive cross-references appear in the first 40 notes (!), before tapering off almost entirely. It appears that the structure is actually designed to reward people who follow Kinbote's labyrinth of madness--something I might actually attempt on a second readthrough.