THE BORE
General => The Superdeep Borehole => Topic started by: TVC15 on January 19, 2008, 07:54:06 PM
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Sorry about the new thread, but let's talk about Scarface without dumbasses trying to pretend that Indiana Jones, The Godfather, and Die Hard are comparable films. I've done a lot of PCP in my life, but not that much.
We all knew what my bias was going into the movie, so let's not recap that. We also know that I LURVE Oliver Stone, and as a homosexual man, the mere mention of Giorgio Moroder kind of makes me ejaculate. Let's just put all my preconceived notions aside, and let me try to tackle this one tabula rasa.
Scarface is kinda like a combination of the mafia porn epics and action genres. The violence is done very well, and it is relatively abundant, and the mafia porn, at times, works. The key thing that makes the movie not that good is the running time. De Palma spent lots of time shooting action scenes, and lots of time shooting non action scenes, but when it came time to put them in a pot and make himself up a stew, the ensuing running time more resembled a mafia epic than an action movie. The visceral thrills are the most memorable part of this movie, and when your movie is based on that sort of things, there is no possible way you can justify a 3 fucking hour running time. Also, Michelle Pfeiffer has no real purpose in the movie, even going so far as to completely disappear with no real consequence on the movie. You cut out the bitches, you shave off an hour of wasted screen time, easily.
So, where to start the cutting? Well, like Stone's later Natural Born Killers, there's abundant excess, and not in the thematic sense. Tony's plot with his sister? Largely irrelevant! We are supposed to buy that he loves her more than anything, that she is his Beethoven's Ninth, but the movie fails to sell the relationship, because they only appear in ONE scene together before their relationship turns to shit. Now, don't get me wrong, I understand that in movies, cuts have to be made, but how the fuck is it that in a three hour running time, they couldn't believably set up a textbook character relationship properly? You cut his sister's subplot, you lose nothing of value. You just need to come up with another plot device to make Pacino pull a trigger in the third act.
And hey! That classical three act structure? It does the movie more harm than good, because up until the third act, the downfall, it seems like most of the more IMPORTANT shit is being done off camera. In act one, Tony does the job with the chainsaw scene. And then YADA YADA YADA he is a higher up, then he ends up taking over the top and YADA YADA YADA he has influence over the eastern seaboard. Now, Tony's ambition is probably the most sold part of his character, but we know he's not a particularly smart man, yet smart things appear to be happening during the YADA YADAs between acts. The movie is apparently trying to seem like some sort of Greek drama, but let's face it folks, this is like a greek drama starring, I dunno, Elmer Fudd. In short, this movie could have said all it needed to be said in 90 minutes.
Pacino's acting is a better than I remember it, but it's still not very good. I'll concede a little and say this poor casting decision was De Palma's fault, not Pacino's. I guess Pacino does a decent job with the material he has, although he does Keanu up that accent a little too frequently, and on the rare occasions he gets it right, it sounds a bit stiff. He yells all awesome, though.
Giorgio Moroder's score is pretty fuckin' great. COMPLETELY out of place--in the one place it would fit, the club scenes, pop music is playing--but hey, it's motherfuckin' Giorgio!
The movie also does have a tendency to look kinda cheap. The interior scenes are roses, but the exterior scenes are ehhhhhhhhhh. I don't particularly think that is De Palma's fault. He wanted to shoot on location in Florida, but he got stuck shooting in LA. Maybe he didn't handle it particularly gracefully, but the visuals are never so bad that it takes me out of the movie.
So I think it is on the low end of the decent scale. Caligula is more entertaining and interesting than this. I guess Scarface is a sort of must see due to the unfair amount of influence it's had on our culture. It's kind of sad seeing Pacino in full-on ridiculous mode, and recognizing that his cheesy little persona, from demeanor to his game with women, has inspired so many people dumbasses. DUMBASSES DUMBASSES DUMBASSES.
I give it a Dumbledore out of Gay.
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scarface is ruined by its admirers
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Can I have your dvd, sweetheart?
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It would be a tragedy if you ended up with a copy of Kane and Lynch instead.
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Eww :(
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I'm just glad you're not a professional movie critic TVC :)
This was basically a recap of all what you had said before.
You take movies completely apart and examine every little screw in detail. Irrelevant this. irrelevant that. In life there are a lot of irrelevant things. Now I know Scarface is meant to be over the top, as said by the makers themself, but there is also a large bit of reality in it. Little everyday bullshit. The movie would have suffered more if it was 90 minutes. Then it would be a complete straight to vhs gangster movie.
And don't worry, I think you're a dumbass too most of the time :)
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The issue with the over the topness is that it is tonally inconsistent, and it is anyone's guess as to whether they were trying to make a realistic portrayal of how the drug trade works, or whether they wanted to make Cannibal Holocaust with italians poorly playing Cubans. You offer no real defense of the movie. My main criticism is that it's about twice as long as it needs to be, I've recanted on just about everything I've said previously, so I do not see how I am recapping what I have previously said (also note, I did not complain about the length previously, so my main complaint is one that I have not mentioned before). Maybe your dumb ass needs to learn to read?
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I'll take that Kane and Lynch
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The issue with the over the topness is that it is tonally inconsistent, and it is anyone's guess as to whether they were trying to make a realistic portrayal of how the drug trade works, or whether they wanted to make Cannibal Holocaust with italians poorly playing Cubans. You offer no real defense of the movie. My main criticism is that it's about twice as long as it needs to be, I've recanted on just about everything I've said previously, so I do not see how I am recapping what I have previously said (also note, I did not complain about the length previously, so my main complaint is one that I have not mentioned before).
your quotes from the other movie thread:
Scarface, this is like a 90 minute movie dragged to three hours.
Dude you are on the reefer. You probably fall asleep during it. Here's a hint: the movie doesn't end at the chainsaw scene. It goes on for like 7 more hours.
So far, I'd say the two are about on par. This is going to get dinged for being FUCKING LONG though. 170 minutes? There are very very very very fucking few movies that need to be anywhere NEAR that long.
hmm
Maybe your dumb ass needs to learn to read?
maybe you need to chill the fuck out and not take this so personally like a cigarillo?
You're the one who started calling names in the OP. And it was obvious that it was meant at me, so don't even try to say I started it.
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I have not read what he said but I totally agree!
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The issue with the over the topness is that it is tonally inconsistent, and it is anyone's guess as to whether they were trying to make a realistic portrayal of how the drug trade works, or whether they wanted to make Cannibal Holocaust with italians poorly playing Cubans. You offer no real defense of the movie. My main criticism is that it's about twice as long as it needs to be, I've recanted on just about everything I've said previously, so I do not see how I am recapping what I have previously said (also note, I did not complain about the length previously, so my main complaint is one that I have not mentioned before).
your quotes from the other movie thread:
Scarface, this is like a 90 minute movie dragged to three hours.
Dude you are on the reefer. You probably fall asleep during it. Here's a hint: the movie doesn't end at the chainsaw scene. It goes on for like 7 more hours.
So far, I'd say the two are about on par. This is going to get dinged for being FUCKING LONG though. 170 minutes? There are very very very very fucking few movies that need to be anywhere NEAR that long.
hmm
Those quotes were after I started watching the movie, actually. I was going to throw that caveat in my previous post, but I figured it would be implicitly undertstood.
Maybe your dumb ass needs to learn to read?
maybe you need to chill the fuck out and not take this so personally like a cigarillo?
You're the one who started calling names in the OP. And it was obvious that it was meant at me, so don't even try to say I started it.
No, it was NOT meant at you, it was meant at the GROUP of people defending Scarface. Sorry, Powerslave, but you are not the center of my universe. If you don't grok the generally playful tone of Evilbore, either, I'd suggest learning it. If you haven't noticed, we kind of call each other names here rather frequently. I'm sorry that fucking Scarface is apparently your Virgin Mary.
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Now why would you go and pull out the "MY LIFE DOESNT REVOLVE AROUND YOU" comeback? Are you that desperate to make this so personal? Jesus Christ, get over yourself. Don't act like I don't know how calling names is part of the culture here alongside of many other forums. That's not the issue here.
But the thing is, I was the one who brought up Die Hard and Indiana Jones. And you mentioned that in your first line in the OP. And then you went on and said it was aimed at the GROUP of people who defended Scarface. No 'group' other than me 'compared' Scarface to Die Hard/Indiana Jones.
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Now why would you go and pull out the "MY LIFE DOESNT REVOLVE AROUND YOU" comeback? Are you that desperate to make this so personal?
As you said:
And it was obvious that it was meant at me,
Now please, can we not talk about who's more distinguished mentally-challenged and instead talk about the fucking movie?
I did mention the Indy/Godfather/Dieh Hard thing, but to be honest, I didn't remember who specifically made those comments. I just remembered it was one of the people defending Scarface. I don't particularly want to bicker, so can we please not?
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I dunno, I think the distinguished mentally-challenged and the fans of the movie could be closely linked
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Uhh, because you said it was not aimed at me, while in fact it was? That's basically what I explained in my previous post. I don't get your last post.
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Uhh, because you said it was not aimed at me, while in fact it was? That's basically what I explained in my previous post. I don't get your last post.
Dude, it was not aimed at you personally, okay? It was aimed at the group of people defending Scarface, of which, yes, you are a member. More importantly it was a jibe, ie, not serious! Do you see all the shit we give PD for liking garbage? It's like that.
Now please, bygones! I am sorry if I inadvertently offended you. Chock it up to miscommunication or something
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Greek drama sounds right to me. It certainly follows the general arc of those tragic hero stories we talked about so much in 10th grade.
When I saw the original, Paul Muni version I wondered if they included the downfall as sop to the censors (even though it was pre-code). They didn't -- it was too central to the story for that to be a real possibility anyway -- but they did add "Shame of the Nation" as a subtitle and put some text at the beginning reminding viewers that he was a bad, bad man.
So even 70+ years ago you had people worrying that the movie was setting a bad example.
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I think the comparison between Tony Montana and Elmer Fudd is appropriate. Montana is too stupid and too rash to climb the ladder of a fast food restaurant. And he has about as much charisma as a microwaved burger.
I will never understand why people put Tony Montana posters up on their walls. SMH
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Greek drama sounds right to me. It certainly follows the general arc of those tragic hero stories we talked about so much in 10th grade.
When I saw the original, Paul Muni version I wondered if they included the downfall as sop to the censors (even though it was pre-code). They didn't -- it was too central to the story for that to be a real possibility anyway -- but they did add "Shame of the Nation" as a subtitle and put some text at the beginning reminding viewers that he was a bad, bad man.
So even 70+ years ago you had people worrying that the movie was setting a bad example.
Have you seen The Aviator, Mandark? I don't know how reliable a source it is (thought it does seem to hue relatively close to the facts and timeline I know of Hughes), but it makes it sound like Hughes did have some trouble getting the original movie released. They cite the difficulty of its release when he is fighting the censors over his next movie, which featured titties.
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Now please, can we not talk about who's more distinguished mentally-challenged and instead talk about the fucking movie?
I did mention the Indy/Godfather/Dieh Hard thing, but to be honest, I didn't remember who specifically made those comments. I just remembered it was one of the people defending Scarface. I don't particularly want to bicker, so can we please not?
I dont know, you're not a dumb guy so I know you know I was the one saying that. There were basically two Scarface defenders in the thread, and I had the 'biggest mouth' of them all, so to say and you know how much I defend this movie.
And about your last part, hey it's actually me who doesn't want to bicker but when you start saying "Maybe your dumb ass needs to learn to read?" it just screams a personal attack and not one of those good ol' 'bore happy namecalling. I know you don't like me in particular so this just added up perfectly to me.
But I'm good, I don't dislike you or anything. And I propose the dropping of our biggotry against eachother.
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yeah........ I was still writing while you posted all of that :P
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yeah........ I was still writing while you posted all of that :P
Someone got 30 wpm on that typing test!
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You're a dumbass, TVC 15. How could you waste your time typing such tripe.
Also, Michelle Pfeiffer has no real purpose in the movie, even going so far as to completely disappear with no real consequence on the movie. You cut out the bitches, you shave off an hour of wasted screen time, easily.
Scarface took a liking to her as soon as he saw her, which lead to all the tensions between him and his boss. She was also a giant part of his downfall as she was an overall shitty wife who used him for money and unlimited access to drugs.
You cut his sister's subplot, you lose nothing of value. You just need to come up with another plot device to make Pacino pull a trigger in the third act.
Here again, it's like you didnt even watch the movie. Scarface had a weird thing for his sister, he was WAY over-protective, that was part of his character.
The entire last third of his movie is about his downfall. The only things that matter in Scarface's life is ,oney, his wife, and his sister. He massively fucked up that hit on the drug commission dude, his marriage with his wife had gone to shit (as shown by the fact that he couldnt have a kid with her and that they would fight all the time leading up to how he just blew up at her at the restaurant), and he ended up killing his best friend over her sister. A The whole movie is about the things more important to him being the cause of his own downfall.
At the end, with all those things combined, he wasnt giving a fuck about anything and decided to just suicide-rush the other guys since he had nothing worth living for at this point. He had money, but the rest of his life was gone. He could had easily escaped by the window, but decided to go all out.
Ah fuck it; it's not even worth posting the rest of things I had in mind. I can't be bothered.
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Paul Muni > Pacino mang
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The ending was such a piece of shit. It's like someone edited in a ninja attack in the script as a joke and it stayed.
well Montana pissed off the most powerful drug lord in the world at the time. He even dared to challenge him on the phone.
The drug dude went all out.
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I agree with Shuri's post, TVC. I think you were looking for things to hate on the movie. The storyline with the sister is pretty fucking important. It's weird how the things that are most "moral" about the Tony Montana character (refusing to kill children, not wanting his sister to get involved in the criminal life) are what lead to his downfall.
Well, that and the mountains of coke. But still!
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And I don't know why I'm wasting my time responding. Is anyone here NOT noticing that I didn't hate the movie? It's not a black and white thing! I'm sorry I don't think it's the best movie ever.
You're a dumbass, TVC 15. How could you waste your time typing such tripe.
Also, Michelle Pfeiffer has no real purpose in the movie, even going so far as to completely disappear with no real consequence on the movie. You cut out the bitches, you shave off an hour of wasted screen time, easily.
Scarface took a liking to her as soon as he saw her, which lead to all the tensions between him and his boss. She was also a giant part of his downfall as she was an overall shitty wife who used him for money and unlimited access to drugs.
A giant part of his downfall that just disappears in the third act, and whose story is not resolved? I'm sorry, her character was about as necessary as generic Hot Girl's in transformers. Pfeiffer does well with the material she has. I actually liked her performance--it just wasn't particularly necessary to the story. It very easily could have been, but just like with the sister, for a movie with a 3 hour running time, it shockingly develops none of the characters that should be developed.
You cut his sister's subplot, you lose nothing of value. You just need to come up with another plot device to make Pacino pull a trigger in the third act.
Here again, it's like you didnt even watch the movie. Scarface had a weird thing for his sister, he was WAY over-protective, that was part of his character.
I might be misremembering here, but there are a grand total of 4 scenes with his character. The first scene where they are on good terms and it is established that he is protective. The second scene in the club where Scarface goes apeshit on her in the bathroom. The post-marriage scene, and finally the final scene. Tony is portrayed as a rather stereotypical overprotective brother, but it's done in exceedingly simple terms, so simple that it's LAUGHABLE at the end when his sister apparently reveals some sort of psychological sexual component to the relationship that was never there before. I'm not sure who gets the blame for that, but it totally reeks of the movie thinking it is something grander than it actually is. In short, it does not pull it off.
The entire last third of his movie is about his downfall. The only things that matter in Scarface's life is ,oney, his wife, and his sister. He massively fucked up that hit on the drug commission dude, his marriage with his wife had gone to shit (as shown by the fact that he couldnt have a kid with her and that they would fight all the time leading up to how he just blew up at her at the restaurant), and he ended up killing his best friend over her sister. A The whole movie is about the things more important to him being the cause of his own downfall.
I like most of the third act on its own merits. That's the best part of the movie. The only thing I dislike is the wife and sister shit. The movie is at its best when it is on the crime angle. As a personal portrait, it just doesn't do anything for me. There are no characters here.
Once again, I didn't hate the movie! I don't see why it has to be a love it or hate it thing.
The storyline with the sister is pretty fucking important.
Important? It probably has less than 20 minutes of airtime in a 170 minute movie.
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Have you seen The Aviator, Mandark? I don't know how reliable a source it is (thought it does seem to hue relatively close to the facts and timeline I know of Hughes), but it makes it sound like Hughes did have some trouble getting the original movie released. They cite the difficulty of its release when he is fighting the censors over his next movie, which featured titties.
Haven't seen the Aviator, but I vaguely remember some history from an old film class.
The censors (who were more local and ad hoc in those days, IIRC) forced some changes including a new ending. Tony already died in the original version, but the new one involved a capture, trial, and death sentence rather than a heroic blaze of glory.
Actually, it looks like Filmsite (http://www.filmsite.org/scar.html) has a good rundown of it. I'm not sure which version was actually released at the time, or if both were on a state-by-state or county-by-county basis.
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The thing I don't get is why rappers and frat guys idolize Tony Montana...he's not a likable character at all, who wants to be an ignorant dick that alienates everyone he knows and gets himself killed through his own stupidity?
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cuz he gets mo' money and mo' bitches and ain't no-one disrepect him no SUH
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maybe they always turn the movie off right before he dies
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he went out livin' da lyfe, dat's how da big dawgz roll
thug lyfe, nukka
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The thing I don't get is why rappers and frat guys idolize Tony Montana...he's not a likable character at all, who wants to be an ignorant dick that alienates everyone he knows and gets himself killed through his own stupidity?
It's because while he's still a criminal and does bad things, he appears to be righteous and has a good heart, somewhere deep inside him. He is one of the people who have been criminals since they were kids, so for starters that's not a good reason to hate him. It's just his life. But the actions he takes and his moral principles of loyalty is what makes him an anti-hero.
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remember, kids, as long as you have a righteous manner and a good heart, you can chainsaw folks to pieces and powerslave will forgive you
i hear baby jesus is packin a tech9
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Didn't laugh.
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he don't do women
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We need to bring back the montage (probably the best thing from Scarface):
[youtube=425,350]ZvqOwAMHJRU[/youtube]
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We need to bring back the montage (probably the best thing from Scarface):
[youtube=425,350]ZvqOwAMHJRU[/youtube]
Oh god, I forgot about the montage. Much like the Giorgio Moroder score, it is kinda out of place, but I'm a sucker for a good, cheesy 80s montage, so I really couldn't complain. Listen to that music, man. The only thing that's missing is Pacino practicing boxing against a hanging slab of meat.
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Paul Kersey...now there's an awesome guy.
(http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r126/Drewsy_photobucket/Bronson.jpg)
"They're like roaches...you gotta kill em' all otherwise what's the point."
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It is obvious that Scarface is a Greek tragedy set during the Mariel Boatlift.
In the beginning, he busts his ass and makes little or nothing, another immigrant disillusioned with the cold reality of the American Dream. He then sees that there are guys out there just like him that are rolling in dough and wants a piece. Deciding that he can't succeed by listening to his superiors (his boss when he was a dish washer and Omar Suarez), he takes initiative and aims for the top. Then he is told by Frank the fatal message: don't underestimate the competition and don't get high on your own supply.
Tony follows these words but as he eliminates his competition, he ignores the wise words and believes that he is above the rules. So he keeps fucking up until he gets sloppy, as his cocaine use increases, he fails to anticipate that drug competition, his dealer, and the Miami PD want to take him down. He violates both rules and he gets shot by his coke dealer's top assassin.
The sister's subplot had symbolic importance. She represented the Tony of the beginning when he was working long hours for low pay washing dishes. She believed that if she did what she was told, then she would have success. Perhaps this might be why Tony seemed over protective of her: she represented Tony's small hope that there were in fact good people in the world and not greedy fucks like his competition, his friends, and well, himself. When Gina went to make out and probably blow or fuck that dude in the bathroom, his hope was temporarily shattered. When she married Manny, he lost that hope because now she married into the game and now, there were absolutely no positives or even the hopes of positives in his life. As for the whole ending scene of sexuality, that was fucking stupid and is typical for Oliver Stone.
The wife was symbolic as well. She was the trophy. He married his first significant boss and once he killed him, he had undisputed dominance of coke dealings in his area. She was just some object. The child he wanted was going to be another trophy. Of course, things fell apart before it ever got that far. Getting Elvira meant that he finally succeeded. He made it from Cuban prisoner to multimillionaire businessman. You are right, Michelle Pfeiffer had little role to the film because she was just a trophy. You weren't supposed to see her take a significant role in his life no more than his customized bulletproof car.
The thing I don't get is why rappers and frat guys idolize Tony Montana...he's not a likable character at all, who wants to be an ignorant dick that alienates everyone he knows and gets himself killed through his own stupidity?
They only see that a poor dude grows up, gets rich, and then gets shot. That and the final shootouts, shooting up the competition, and then gets the girl. It is a very shallow appreciation of the film. The same can be said about Fight Club. Most people like it because Tyler Durden has a few memorable quotes but ignores that the moral of the story is that conformity is fatal, whether it is Ikea-based or anarchy-based.
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I think the wife/Pfeiffer angle would have been better sold in about the same amount of time if there was a kid involved. A lil' hackneyed, yes, but nothing adds instant character depth like 2 seconds of looking longingly at a baby. I'm not quite certain whether Pfeiffer was supposed to be a trophy wife, or if Tony actually loved her. At the beginning, it was totally a trophy thing, but during the drunk scene, he says some things that imply there was something else there, particularly when it came to producing an heir. So we only really know that Tony had real feelings for her due to drunken exposition, and a few tossed off comments towards the end. If they would have repurposed 5 minutes of the movie into her having a baby, or a miscarriage, or an abortion, or whatever, there would have been easy depth added.
It's kind of a shame that I don't like the wife plot, because I do think Michelle Pfeiffer gives one of the best performances in the movie.
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Great post, Experiment.
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That dinner scene was crucial to the story. Tony basically feels defeated, that everything is lost. Sure, there is the idea that he would blow up the guy in front of the UN Building, but his attitude is that he lost. Now he wonders what was the point of getting to where he is now and looks at his successes as failures. What was beautiful is now ugly. From trophy wife, she is now a coke junkie. The idea of the heir now seems infeasible because the mother is fucked up because she is the product of the fucked up world of drug dealing.
Of course he looks at all of this with an extremely egotistical eye, laying all the blame on others instead of himself. It is Manny's fault that he was arrested. It is Elvira's fault that she is probably too fucked up to be a mother to his heir.
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The thing I don't get is why rappers and frat guys idolize Tony Montana...he's not a likable character at all, who wants to be an ignorant dick that alienates everyone he knows and gets himself killed through his own stupidity?
it's because of what he did, not what he became
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killing people and being a general drain on society?
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Yes,I know it's shallow.
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I appreciate Scarface due to the awesome references in the GTA games and the music. And me being of Hispanic decent I'm pretty much required to list the movie as my Top 10 of All time. THUG L1F3
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And the movie is idolized due to Tony coming up from nothing and getting rich. Thats it. The people who idolize him also don't mind selling drugs and buying $500 Cell Phones so they can brag to their friends. If they're not selling drugs they gotta sell their foodstamps so they can get the cash they need for shit other than food. IE Idiots
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I appreciate Scarface due to the awesome references in the GTA games and the music. And me being of Hispanic decent I'm pretty much required to list the movie as my Top 10 of All time. THUG L1F3
And this is the genius of the white man. A movie by a couple of extremely rich white dudes used to virally inspire/control the minorities of America. They practically invite themselves to be undermined! I guess I should be glad that Scarface exists since it helps keep whitey on top.
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Pretty much
When you think about it, it happens to all facets of entertainment. Funnily enough my cousin on my mothers side asked for "Scarface stuff" cause shes planning on making a sort of gameroom full of Scarface stuff. This is a single mother scraping by who has two kids (shes younger than me, by the way) who doesn't even have a room to spare.
smh
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Pretty much
When you think about it, it happens to all facets of entertainment
I am sure there's been shit written about the effect of Scarface being a cult hit, and what, if any, effect it's had on the ensuing street drug era that began in the 1970s. Is it a chicken or the egg thing? Did Scarface depict reality, or have stoned people just been depicting Scarface ever since?
I think it's the latter, since I *know* De Palma isn't talented enough to depict anything that well.
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I'd never even heard of this movie. OK, I had, but nothing beyond the title and that it's some kind of Mafia movie. Is that why I don't understand modern American culture?
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killing people and being a general drain on society?
Don't forget about the doing lots of blow and wanting to fuck your sister! :lol
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I know Scarface is flawed, but I can't bring myself to get too down on any DePalma movie, yes, even Mission to Mars (the soundtrack rocks you effers!).
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I know Scarface is flawed, but I can't bring myself to get too down on any DePalma movie, yes, even Mission to Mars (the soundtrack rocks you effers!).
I can only really like his earlier, most Hitchcocky stuff. Maybe up until the mid 80s. When was Body Double? That was awesome. Might be his best. I think Sisters is his best. I do believe you see some Margot Kidder 70s titties in that. More than I can say for Scarface. 70s boobs make bad movies mediocre, at a minimum.
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I know Scarface is flawed, but I can't bring myself to get too down on any DePalma movie, yes, even Mission to Mars (the soundtrack rocks you effers!).
I can only really like his earlier, most Hitchcocky stuff. Maybe up until the mid 80s. When was Body Double? That was awesome. Might be his best. I think Sisters is his best. I do believe you see some Margot Kidder 70s titties in that. More than I can say for Scarface. 70s boobs make bad movies mediocre, at a minimum.
Body Double was 85 I think and featured a skinny Melanie Griffith and her titays. You should check out Raising Cain, which is so bonkers I can't believe it got a wide release and a studio investment. Carlito's Way was his last really solid film, is like Scarface but with a protagonist who deserves sympathy, which is not bad at all.
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I don't think I have ever actually heard of Raising Cain. I will check it out. I guess to me, it seems that he just started making less interesting films in the 90s. I guess he got sick of making quirky weird suspense movies and decided to make a swing for the blockbuster shit, and it just didn't quite work out in my opinion.
Who did the soundtrack to mission to mars? I remember it being someone good.
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What was the point of having Tony fuck his sister? Was Stone trying to be 'deep'?
And dang, that music definitely IS out of place, but it's also definitely awesome. Probably the best thing about the movie imo. :bow Giorgio
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He also does the music for Cat People. It is delicious. That man's got style.
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I have to very reluctantly admit to enjoying the theme songs to Neverending Story and Top Gun :-[ :-[ :-[
fuck, I hope my mom never sees this post.
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I have to very reluctantly admit to enjoying the theme songs to Neverending Story and Top Gun :-[ :-[ :-[
fuck, I hope my mom never sees this post.
Had to mention Top Gun?
[youtube=425,350]xHklGtW3rwU[/youtube]
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I have to very reluctantly admit to enjoying the theme songs to Neverending Story and Top Gun :-[ :-[ :-[
fuck, I hope my mom never sees this post.
This is awesome. No need to be ashamed.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f0UOZ9NHDsY&feature=related
edit: TVC's was better. :/
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Had to mention Top Gun?
it's the photography. I enjoyed the Star Wars prequels for basically the same reason. I get off on Boeing commercials and motivational posters too
defense contractors :heart :heart :heart
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Had to mention Top Gun?
it's the photography. I enjoyed the Star Wars prequels for basically the same reason. I get off on motivational posters too
Top gun I can see, but it is difficult for me to get an aesthetic high from science fiction. When my brain knows it's not real, it gets limp. Have you ever seen Barry Lyndon? That is basically my ultimate cinematography boner academy movie.
Check this out
[youtube=425,350]Ccb0chQtlRw[/youtube]
:drool All natural lighting omg
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I think I'm almost attracted to unreality for its own sake, so we're obviously coming from very different places here. Reality was kind of an acquired taste for me.
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I'd still recommend checking out Barry Lyndon. The movie was shot with special cameras, using nasa technology, in order to be filmed in specific and odd lighting circumstances. All natural light! The movie frequently looks like an impressionist painting.
(http://stalkingelmo.net/blog/wp-content/uploads/2006/11/Barry_Lyndon_screenshot.JPG)
(http://www.cinematographers.nl/GreatDoPh/Films/BarryLyndon2.jpg)
It's pretty insane. I paused that movie to gawk more than any other. Gorgeous.
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I'd like to seriously get into movies but I'm waiting on HD. As a dirty poor I can't afford it yet. Why didn't these special cameras fall into general use?
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Why didn't these special cameras fall into general use?
Who knows. If it's NASA tech I'm guessing it was prohibitively expensive? This was in the 70s, so I'm sure that whatever the tech was has matured and is in use for something by now.
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What was the point of having Tony fuck his sister? Was Stone trying to be 'deep'?
And dang, that music definitely IS out of place, but it's also definitely awesome. Probably the best thing about the movie imo. :bow Giorgio
Wtf? Tony didn't fuck his sister. Nor had he really incesteous feelings at all. Gina went crazy and implied Tony wanted to fuck her because of his over-protecting attitude.
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What was the point of having Tony fuck his sister? Was Stone trying to be 'deep'?
And dang, that music definitely IS out of place, but it's also definitely awesome. Probably the best thing about the movie imo. :bow Giorgio
Gina went crazy and implied Tony wanted to fuck her because of his over-protecting attitude.
Yeah, this is how I took it. Some people seem to believe that there was supposed to be some sort of incestuous love bond thing, but i don't see it. It's better if it's just her going crazy.
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It's a latin thing, his wanting his little sister to remain "pure", and her angrily taunting him with her sexuality to make him uncomfortable. She knows that the idea of his sister as a sexual being is the one thing Tony Montana cannot allow.
It has to do with the whole gender role thing in hispanic culture.
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remember, kids, as long as you have a righteous manner and a good heart, you can chainsaw folks to pieces and powerslave will forgive you
i hear baby jesus is packin a tech9
Scarface didnt even chainsaw anyone, his friend got chainsawed :|
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I know Scarface is flawed, but I can't bring myself to get too down on any DePalma movie, yes, even Mission to Mars (the soundtrack rocks you effers!).
You are kidding me? I thought that was one of the worst scores I've ever heard.
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I appreciate Scarface due to the awesome references in the GTA games and the music. And me being of Hispanic decent I'm pretty much required to list the movie as my Top 10 of All time. THUG L1F3
:-\
This is why I changed my online forum nick.
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Also, I don't think we were suposed to feel sorry for Scarface at all. That dude was an hardened criminal who had done some real nasty stuff back in Cuba already; he caused the death of many people; all he cared about was himself and his own personal success. The only thing that was really 'admirable' in him was his incredible drive and motivation.
The dude was a despicable person outside of that.
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but he don't do women
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BARRY LYNDON :bow
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Had to mention Top Gun?
it's the photography. I enjoyed the Star Wars prequels for basically the same reason. I get off on Boeing commercials and motivational posters too
defense contractors :heart :heart :heart
Agreed with you, as long as they keep paying me. Of course I love Top Gun b/c one of our products was featured in it.
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but he don't do women
Or kids.
Scarface :bow
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but he don't do women
Or kids.
Scarface :bow
Psh, by the "let's worship the bad elements of this evil character" logic, that means the fascists in Pan's Labyrinth are EVEN COOLER than Scarface.
:bow fascism
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I hated Captain Vidal. :maf
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I hated Captain Vidal. :maf
del Toro's next movie should be 170 minutes of this:
(http://i27.tinypic.com/2lj3i39.gif)
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(http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r86/ricanpapi_04/nypr.gif)
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Scarface wasn't Puerto Rican!
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Oh I know, thats off my cousins MySpace. I chuckled when I saw it. Not only do gangbangers forget that he was a dumb dumb and that he dies in the end but that hes also Cuban. Its also funny how someone thats supposed to be vile is so lauded in the community that they wish he was of our decent.
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Fun movie, tho.
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The incest part at the end with his sister kinda ruined the movie for me. It was good up until then.