THE BORE

General => The Superdeep Borehole => Topic started by: TVC15 on September 10, 2008, 03:21:22 AM

Title: Camille Paglia: Still crazy after all these years
Post by: TVC15 on September 10, 2008, 03:21:22 AM: Quote from: Camille Paglia
Conservative though she may be, I felt that Palin represented an explosion of a brand new style of muscular American feminism.

http://www.salon.com/opinion/paglia/2008/09/10/palin/

I forgot just how random this woman could be. I knew I should I have stopped being in love with her after learning her stance on Foucault.

spoiler (click to show/hide)
I'd still let her fuck my shitter
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Title: Re: Camille Paglia: Still crazy after all these years
Post by: T-Short on September 10, 2008, 03:36:53 AM: Quote
I am still waiting for substantive evidence that Sarah Palin is a dangerous extremist. I am perfectly willing to be convinced, but right now, she seems to be merely an optimistic pragmatist like Ronald Reagan, someone who pays lip service to religious piety without being in the least wedded to it.

hehe

also this is delicious

Quote
One reason I live in the leafy suburbs of Philadelphia and have never moved to New York or Washington is that, as a cultural analyst, I want to remain in touch with the mainstream of American life. I frequent fast-food restaurants, shop at the mall, and periodically visit Wal-Mart (its bird-seed section is nonpareil).

:lol
Title: Re: Camille Paglia: Still crazy after all these years
Post by: TVC15 on September 10, 2008, 03:43:00 AM: I actually kind of dig Camille Paglia because she tends to catch me off guard with her opinions. I may not agree with her a significant amount of the time, but her sort of contrarianism gets me to look at things from angles I'd normally be quick to write off. She's generally an entertaining writer, though, and she seems to always be writing in earnest.
Title: Re: Camille Paglia: Still crazy after all these years
Post by: Mandark on September 10, 2008, 03:45:10 AM: I haven't read much of her stuff but at some point I filed her with Christopher Hitchens under Trolls, Literate.
Title: Re: Camille Paglia: Still crazy after all these years
Post by: TVC15 on September 10, 2008, 03:50:20 AM: Quote from: Mandark on September 10, 2008, 03:45:10 AM
I haven't read much of her stuff but at some point I filed her with Christopher Hitchens under Trolls, Literate.

Hmmm, if she's a troll, I don't think she is intentionally one. If she is, well, she writes circles around any other pro troll out there.

If you are into lit crit, Sexual Personae is basically essential reading. Her Salon columns are about her commenting on culture as it is right now, but she's got mad brains.
Title: Re: Camille Paglia: Still crazy after all these years
Post by: ToxicAdam on September 10, 2008, 04:04:48 AM: It's kind of dismissive to call her a troll. More of provocateur.

Nice article, but I couldn't really grasp an overriding theme. It was more of a stream-of-concious essay on summer politics.

The one thing I gleamed from it is that she struggles (like many people) with having to share the same "bed" with other people in her party. The hatchet men, the litmus-test crazed fanatics and other fringe groups that all seem to get a larger share of attention than they deserve.

I wouldn't call Palin a model of anything. Just a small-time politician that was plucked from obscurity to fit a demographic need. Like most veepees are. She just happens to have a certain "it" factor that makes people (media) fascinated by her. If McCain ends up squeaking this out, you will have to point to the Palin appointment as a key moment in his water-treading campaign.
Title: Re: Camille Paglia: Still crazy after all these years
Post by: TVC15 on September 10, 2008, 04:07:54 AM: Quote from: ToxicAdam on September 10, 2008, 04:04:48 AM
It's kind of dismissive to call her a troll. More of provocateur.

Nice article, but I couldn't really grasp an overriding theme. It was more of a stream-of-concious essay on summer politics.

This is what her column is usually like--all over several maps. I don't think she concerns herself with themes in it. I think provocateur is a better label than troll. If you've never read her, and you liked this, I'd recommend checking out past columns.
Title: Re: Camille Paglia: Still crazy after all these years
Post by: Human Snorenado on September 10, 2008, 09:22:48 AM: Yeah, Paglia is batshit insane. She thinks people just up and choose to be gay. Now, while I'm not gay I really don't think awkward teenagers are just jumping at the chance to invite MORE complication and bullying into their lives.
Title: Re: Camille Paglia: Still crazy after all these years
Post by: Olivia Wilde Homo on September 10, 2008, 12:56:36 PM: Feminism in the US has been dead for some time because of the "All sex is rape" feminism that has dominated feminism for some time, courtesy of such people like Dworkin, MacKinnon, and Steinem. I don't think Palin is quite the revolution Paglia thinks she is. Palin was just a fundamentalist choice meant to sensationalize. It isn't like McCain said, "Ok, its time that we have this masculine styled feminist." No, its clear that McCain didn't even think about that at all.

Oh well.
Title: Re: Camille Paglia: Still crazy after all these years
Post by: TVC15 on September 10, 2008, 01:02:09 PM: Edit: nm, gotta go work
Title: Re: Camille Paglia: Still crazy after all these years
Post by: Eric P on September 10, 2008, 01:10:24 PM: Quote from: The Experiment on September 10, 2008, 12:56:36 PM
Feminism in the US has been dead for some time because of the "All sex is rape" ...

well that's true in my case
Title: Re: Camille Paglia: Still crazy after all these years
Post by: radioheadrule83 on September 10, 2008, 01:49:47 PM: All sex is rape.. I hate that shit. All that symbolism and talk of penetration as a violent act -- I get where they're coming from, in the sense of which gender is often more sexualised and sexually forceful, the selfishness when it comes to the orgasm, societal norms that exist... the idea that some women maybe feel a sexual obligation...

Sex is still the method by which our bodies pro-create. And its a fucking fine way for men and women to have fun together. I feel sorry for non-academics who feel compelled to overthink it or politicise it. I've seen some women spend hours gazing into their naval about sex/feminism, some who cast aside dignity in the name of empowering themselves (when all they're often really doing is trying to abate their own insecurities), and I've seen a real gender-war mindset in some people. Women still aren't treated equal, they don't hold as many jobs, and pay often isn't fair either -- the former isn't gonna change until we not only have progressive women, but also progressive men. More people that become house-husbands or something and properly share the domesticated household/family burdens. Or more people that just strike out in life by staying single / open. I found all of it interesting at college, just not my thing now. And I know plenty of normal, progressive girls who truly became wonderful, independent personalities and didn't need to get all pensive or angry over the writings of Greer or something.

After reading the Paglia article, she's probably more my kind of feminist. I particularly liked the line about not needing to pass an ideological litmus test to join the club. Having said that, Palin just seems like a total pawn to me. All wrapped up in cotton wool. I've not been impressed at all. I'd be interested in hearing more of her thoughts after the debates.
Title: Re: Camille Paglia: Still crazy after all these years
Post by: TVC15 on September 10, 2008, 01:53:42 PM: The "all sex is rape" subset of feminism is in no way representative of any of the waves. That was the lunatic fringe.
Title: Re: Camille Paglia: Still crazy after all these years
Post by: Human Snorenado on September 10, 2008, 01:58:52 PM: Quote from: TVC 15 on September 10, 2008, 01:53:42 PM
The "all sex is rape" subset of feminism is in no way representative of any of the waves. That was the lunatic fringe.

Yeah, but wasn't Steinem spouting that shit? She's like the most recognizable and recognized "face of feminism" in America.
Title: Re: Camille Paglia: Still crazy after all these years
Post by: TVC15 on September 10, 2008, 02:03:55 PM: Quote from: The Card Cheat on September 10, 2008, 01:58:52 PM
Quote from: TVC 15 on September 10, 2008, 01:53:42 PM
The "all sex is rape" subset of feminism is in no way representative of any of the waves. That was the lunatic fringe.

Yeah, but wasn't Steinem spouting that shit? She's like the most recognizable and recognized "face of feminism" in America.

I'd guess that was during the anti-pornography crusade? I don't know exactly. I'd call the anti-pornography crusade partially fringe feminism.
Title: Re: Camille Paglia: Still crazy after all these years
Post by: Mandark on September 10, 2008, 02:34:16 PM: TVC: Like I said, I haven't read much of her stuff. It's just the vibe I get.

Quote from: The Card Cheat on September 10, 2008, 01:58:52 PM
Quote from: TVC 15 on September 10, 2008, 01:53:42 PM
The "all sex is rape" subset of feminism is in no way representative of any of the waves. That was the lunatic fringe.

Yeah, but wasn't Steinem spouting that shit? She's like the most recognizable and recognized "face of feminism" in America.

Nah, that was meant to be Andrea Dworkin or Catherine MacKinnon and it's fabricated to boot.

Feminism has some crazy fringes, like any movement, but it gets hit pretty unfairly by a lot of FUD tactics and it's generally on the side of angels. Like TVC said none of the waves involved treating hetero sex as rape.

PS Would you vote for a candidate or party whose platform was based on repealing the 13nth Amendment? If not, welcome to the litmus test club!
Title: Re: Camille Paglia: Still crazy after all these years
Post by: TVC15 on September 10, 2008, 02:39:32 PM: I'm not huge into feminism, but from reading a lot of Foucault and that leading into Queer Theory, I picked up a bit of the history of feminism. For the most part, it sounds like the three major waves of the movement have been rationally well-grounded in relation to the periods of time they took place. Of course, I have no intention of studying feminism further since I am basically a total misogynist.

I think Paglia's column is like monthly at Salon. It's usually good for a hoot or two. She's a bizarre old lesbian that's obsessed with Madonna, and not in the faggy way. She believes that Madonna is some sort of important cultural milestone. She had an awesome article some years back where she breathlessly and hyperbolically reviewed the latest Madonna album (I want to say it was Confessions on a Dance Floor). It was most sexcellent.