THE BORE

General => The Superdeep Borehole => Topic started by: TVC15 on December 13, 2008, 09:29:51 PM

Title: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TVC15 on December 13, 2008, 09:29:51 PM: I didn't even like it as much as BB. I actually still have to watch the ending. It felt like the movie should be almost over and there was still more than a half hour left. Begins was also too long, but it somehow felt worse here.

Ledger's performance was as overrated as expected. It was decent, hut nowhere approaching great. In a direct comparison, I don't see this performance as in any way better than Cillian Murphy in Begins.

Minor point, but Bale's Batman voice is distinguished mentally-challenged. I think I understand the logic behind it, but it's still really bad to the point where I wish the idea was cut or replaced.

In some regards, I think the editing in this movie is worse than Begins. The fights and action are definitely better, but there were at least 3 instances of bad cutting in other scenes. Offhand I am recalling the scene with the explosion of the judge's car, but there were other similar weak cuts.

The opening scene was pretty great. I think they should have cut the Falcone shut and ahortened their movie by a half hour, at least. My other big criticism is that I just didn't find the flick as gripping as BB. Also Christian Bale's cheeks look disturbing and the person replacing Katie Holmes looks scary and older than her.

I'd give it 2 or 2.5 vs. Begins 3 stars. This is, honestly, by no measure a great movie. I'm not sure I'll be sewing that ending anytime soon given the feedback on it. The BD transfer was very nice, though.

tL;dr: I'm legitimately unimpressed to a puzzling degree. While I did not love Begins, I thought it was an entertaining flick. TDK wasn't worth my time, though.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Himu on December 13, 2008, 09:30:36 PM: Okay.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TVC15 on December 13, 2008, 09:34:00 PM: Go pray, foo.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TakingBackSunday on December 13, 2008, 09:34:10 PM: I think you went in WANTING to hate it. But oh well, your opinion.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Phoenix Dark on December 13, 2008, 09:34:35 PM: of course he did. it's a reaction to the fanboys
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TakingBackSunday on December 13, 2008, 09:35:45 PM: That's great, and they're annoying yes, but that shouldn't be a reason to try to hate a movie.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Madrun Badrun on December 13, 2008, 09:36:08 PM: I agree with whiteman that this movie needs more sodomy and the the falcone stuff should have been replaced with a child sex slave ring that Batman tries to bust by having Wayne pretend to be a buyer.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Himu on December 13, 2008, 09:36:39 PM: Quote from: TVC 15 on December 13, 2008, 09:34:00 PM
Go pray, foo.

Subhanakalahuma wabihamdika watabarakasmuka wa ta'ala jaduka wa la ilaha ghairuka.

Aoozo billahi menaishetanarajeem. Bismillah irahaman-irahim.

I'm still trying to memorize Al Fatiha, but the trick is learning in English and then in Arabic, and since Al Fatiha is kinda long in both Arabic and English it's a big ordeal for me.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TVC15 on December 13, 2008, 09:37:56 PM: You go on thinking that. I'm legits this time. I was expecting it, baseline, to be clearly better than begins, and I really haven't been sold on any scale aside from better action sequences and general cinematography.

Also, PD, scouts honor this time. I haven resorted to any sort of hyperbole. Do you at least agree that the movie is way overrated?

Edit: sorry for typos, on mah phone

Also brandnew, why would I try to hate a movie I bought? I've said many times I wanted to see this in theatres, I just hate crowds. I liked the first movie!
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Fresh Prince on December 13, 2008, 09:39:07 PM: Post this on GAF.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Himu on December 13, 2008, 09:39:13 PM: I dunno, Keith. I liked it a lot more than BB. I watched it 3 times in theaters. While I'm not a huge fanboy or anything, I thought it was an enjoyable flick.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TakingBackSunday on December 13, 2008, 09:42:00 PM: Overrated? Most assuredly, going by the fanboners over at GAF. But an enjoyable, awesome summer flick by a country mile, and certainly better than Begins. I can't even go back to Begins without thinking "fuck I want this to be over so I can watch The Dark Knight."

I have some minor editing complaints, ending complaints, and Bale's voice is meh, but other than that I can't think of anything that bad. You were unimpressed by Ledger's performance? I really don't see how.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Himu on December 13, 2008, 09:42:18 PM: I think the villians, the dialogue, and the overall plot made it far more interesting than BB. Have you rewatched BB since watching TDK?
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: WrikaWrek on December 13, 2008, 09:43:36 PM: So you lied before? Why?

And i completely disagree with you on Ledger, and reading the words "as overrated as expected" just drives the point home that you went in wanting to dislike it, with a set opinion, and nothing short of miraculous would change anything.

Your opinion ain't worth crap this way. Either you go in with an open mind, or why bother with sharing opinions?

edit: Although let me say, i completely agree with you on the weird editing job of the movie, and on Bale's cheeks. There was something wrong with them when he is in the balcony talking, it's like i'm staring at a skull.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TVC15 on December 13, 2008, 09:44:42 PM: Also, on the joker--I didn't like it when it was unveiled, nut by the time I saw the movie, I had accepted it. Heath did it very well, bit not like posthumous Oscar well. If he were still alive, this would have just been another role.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Himu on December 13, 2008, 09:44:55 PM: Why did you think Heath's acting was overrated? I thought it was great. Not once did I think,"Hey this is the same kid from Brokeback Mountain" or whatever. He nailed that role.

Okay yeah, it wasn't oscar worthy, but he did a great job.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TVC15 on December 13, 2008, 09:46:46 PM: Wrika-- as overrated as expected means fanbous overrated Begins, and they even had extra ammo to overrated TDK.

And I lies before because trolling is fun
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TakingBackSunday on December 13, 2008, 09:47:10 PM: It was one of those performances where I watched the movie and I hardly ever saw the Joker as Heath Ledger. He was completely the character and I always saw him as the Joker, never an actor. That's why I was so impressed-he nailed the character, accent, inflection, and body action.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Phoenix Dark on December 13, 2008, 09:48:00 PM: Oh definitely I agree it's overrated, and I'll admit the film's biggest apologists make me want to hate it. Hell I saw it weeks after its release because I thought it would be meh. The comic book morality at the end is not only stupid, it reaches new levels of stupidity due to Bale's delivery. I understand the Alter Ego has to sound different/more menacing but come on

BB is average to me. I honestly think Superman Begins is a better comic book movie. To me TDK fixed just about every problem I had with BB - mainly the shitty fight choreography, the lack of a proper villain, and the lack of any suspense. The thing that wasn't fixed is the complete indifference I had towards the Batman character. I simply didn't care about him, he wasn't interesting, etc. The Joker and Dent were far more interesting as characters. Bale's Wayne is pretty good but I just don't buy him as Batman; Keaton was far better IMO
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TVC15 on December 13, 2008, 09:49:11 PM: Himu-he's a good actor, don't get me wrong. It just wasn't a performance I'd remember as anythin but a decent comic book movie performance.

I'm heading in a few minutes, so I'm going to stop defending in a bit.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Himu on December 13, 2008, 09:49:36 PM: Quote from: BrandNew on December 13, 2008, 09:47:10 PM
It was one of those performances where I watched the movie and I hardly ever saw the Joker as Heath Ledger. He was completely the character and I always saw him as the Joker, never an actor. That's why I was so impressed-he nailed the character, accent, inflection, and body action.

This.

Quote from: TVC 15 on December 13, 2008, 09:49:11 PM
Himu-he's a good actor, don't get me wrong. It just wasn't a performance I'd remember as anythin but a decent comic book movie performance.

I'm heading in a few minutes, so I'm going to stop defending in a bit.

Rewatch BB, and tell us what you think after that.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TakingBackSunday on December 13, 2008, 09:51:09 PM: Keaton was being Keaton. He wasn't a good or bad Batman. He was just neutral.

At least Bale has a purpose for the voice, as stupid as it fucking sounds. I think I read something that his voice was amplified in the editing process.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Phoenix Dark on December 13, 2008, 09:51:24 PM: I thought Heath was perfect. I doubt there would be Oscar talk if he was alive but it was definitely one of the better Villains I've seen on the screen. That scene where he's leaning out the car window, soaking in the chaos he's created like a dog might lap up air...wow.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: cool breeze on December 13, 2008, 09:51:52 PM: Just to get it out of the way, TDK is one of my favorite movies and like MGS4 this is a case where I have blind love for it.

Now, I do agree that the editing at times was really bad. The worst case is easily the fundraiser party where it ends with Batman on a smashed car at street level while the Joker, Harvey, Alfred, and a whole group of rich people were at the party several stories up -- then it just goes to another scene without explaining what happened here. I guess we're to expect that despite Joker coming there to kill Dent, he instead found interest in watching Batman save some chick with a jello face before strolling on out of there apologizing for the mess he's caused.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TVC15 on December 13, 2008, 09:52:26 PM: PD, my big problem with Begins is that the final act doesn't live up to the rest of the movie. I guess I won't know of TDK fixed that.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Crushed on December 13, 2008, 09:53:06 PM: may you burn in jahannam, infidel

i am prepared to die for the honored bat man, a thousand constipated voices sing his praises
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: WrikaWrek on December 13, 2008, 09:54:02 PM: Superman Returns sucks dick.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Himu on December 13, 2008, 09:54:56 PM: Okay, let's say we can settle that TDK is overrated. But worse than BB? I just disagree with that.

That said, I kinda had the same reaction when I first TDK. It didn't have the same oomph when BB ended because BB was, well, the first good Batman movie in well over a decade. So the fact it was actually decent to good made an impact, on me personally. But the more I watch TDK, the more I like it. The second viewing in particular was very memorable.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TakingBackSunday on December 13, 2008, 09:55:16 PM: Yeah, I only watched it once after my initial viewing and I completely lost the high I got after the first viewing. Crappy movie.

Superman that is
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: cool breeze on December 13, 2008, 09:55:31 PM: Quote from: BrandNew on December 13, 2008, 09:51:09 PM
Keaton was being Keaton. He wasn't a good or bad Batman. He was just neutral.

At least Bale has a purpose for the voice, as stupid as it fucking sounds. I think I read something that his voice was amplified in the editing process.

I think Bale is both the best Batman and Bruce Wayne in TDK (not so much in Begins for Bruce Wayne), but yeah, that voice was bad. I also heard that the voice was made worse digitally later on. It's made worse by how out of breath he sounds. Maybe it's good for the overall world they are trying to portray, but if there is a third film they need to fix that.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TakingBackSunday on December 13, 2008, 09:56:34 PM: I just don't understand why he can't just speak lower.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Mupepe on December 13, 2008, 09:56:52 PM: the worst editing in the movie is the joker entering the fundraiser and batman jumping out the window with rachel and landing on the car. what happened to the joker and his thugs afterwards? did they get bored and leave? Or did they get drunk and party?

Anyways, I still think it's a great action movie. Much like LOTR:ROTK, I don't think I'll ever watch the last half hour anymore.

Two Face should have been saved for the next film or they should have taken the time to turn it into a 3 hour movie and actually fleshed him out. It's so rushed and stupid. The ending is incredibly bad.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TVC15 on December 13, 2008, 09:57:15 PM: Quote from: BrandNew on December 13, 2008, 09:56:34 PM
I just don't understand why he can't just speak lower.
I'll also echo something Prole said earlier this week: I think RDJ's Iron Man performance impressed my more than Heath's.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: cool breeze on December 13, 2008, 09:57:28 PM: And about Bale seeming too thin here, I do kind of agree but not to the point where it bothered me. If you go watch Begins again it's more jarring if only because it seems like his weight fluctuates while filming. Some scenes have him incredibly beefy, others have him really thing.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TakingBackSunday on December 13, 2008, 09:58:34 PM: Quote from: TVC 15 on December 13, 2008, 09:57:15 PM
Quote from: BrandNew on December 13, 2008, 09:56:34 PM
I just don't understand why he can't just speak lower.
I'll also echo something Prole said earlier this week: I think RDJ's Iron Man performance impressed my more than Heath's.

Why? RDJ is great, but he was being himself in it, basically.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: cool breeze on December 13, 2008, 09:59:52 PM: Quote from: TVC 15 on December 13, 2008, 09:57:15 PM
Quote from: BrandNew on December 13, 2008, 09:56:34 PM
I just don't understand why he can't just speak lower.
I'll also echo something Prole said earlier this week: I think RDJ's Iron Man performance impressed my more than Heath's.

RDJ was just playing RDJ in Iron Man. If I would really applaud anyone it would be whoever casted him.

Quote from: BrandNew on December 13, 2008, 09:56:34 PM
I just don't understand why he can't just speak lower.

I don't know, I think they should kind of keep the idea of being it rougher and all, just tone it down a lot. Again, he has a Bruce Wayne voice now in TDK, so there are three voices he's balancing and the crazy Batman voice wasn't needed.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TVC15 on December 13, 2008, 10:03:16 PM: (Sorry on the lock, accident)

I guess he was kinda just being himself, but up until that point, I don't think I expected him to do well in a comic book movie, so it took me by surprise. Also he was fucking hilarious.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TakingBackSunday on December 13, 2008, 10:03:47 PM: Quote
RDJ was just playing RDJ in Iron Man. If I would really applaud anyone it would be whoever casted him.

Spot fucking on.

Quote
I don't know, I think they should kind of keep the idea of being it rougher and all, just tone it down a lot. Again, he has a Bruce Wayne voice now in TDK, so there are three voices he's balancing and the crazy Batman voice wasn't needed.

He really is a great Bruce Wayne, even though he's basically playing the same person in American Pyscho. But it fucking works.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TVC15 on December 13, 2008, 10:05:08 PM: They should just slightly digital alter his voice and spout some hoo-hah about there being a modulator on the throat of his costume or on the roof of his mouth or some such.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Oblivion on December 13, 2008, 10:06:59 PM: I personally loved Heath Ledger's performance minus the constant tongue clapping.

But what do I know. I have horrible taste in movies.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Himu on December 13, 2008, 10:08:30 PM: I loved the way he licked his lips and shit and acted like he was chewing something all the time.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: demi on December 13, 2008, 10:09:34 PM: Quote from: Oblivion on December 13, 2008, 10:06:59 PM
I personally loved Heath Ledger's performance minus the constant tongue clapping.

But what do I know. I have horrible taste in movies.

And games
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Oblivion on December 13, 2008, 10:11:03 PM: Quote from: demi on December 13, 2008, 10:09:34 PM
Quote from: Oblivion on December 13, 2008, 10:06:59 PM
I personally loved Heath Ledger's performance minus the constant tongue clapping.

But what do I know. I have horrible taste in movies.

And games

how did i know this post would arise
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Phoenix Dark on December 13, 2008, 10:11:06 PM: The final act of BB was cool the first time I saw it (omg they burned Rome!) but after multiple views it's just so stupid. Interestingly the use of large amounts of prisoners was a bane for both movies: the "island of drugged felons" and "Hello freight boat passengers, my name is Jigsaw Joker, lets play a little game" scenes were pretty weak to me.

I need to watch BB again because right now I can barely think of things I liked in it. Oh, the training at the beginning was cool
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TakingBackSunday on December 13, 2008, 10:15:00 PM: I loved the entirety of Begins up until the part where he goes to rescue Rachel. Then it becomes standard comic book movie affair.

It's like Nolan can't finish movies correctly.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: demi on December 13, 2008, 10:15:33 PM: Quote from: Oblivion on December 13, 2008, 10:11:03 PM
Quote from: demi on December 13, 2008, 10:09:34 PM
Quote from: Oblivion on December 13, 2008, 10:06:59 PM
I personally loved Heath Ledger's performance minus the constant tongue clapping.

But what do I know. I have horrible taste in movies.

And games

how did i know this post would arise

And girls
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TVC15 on December 13, 2008, 10:19:40 PM: A few misc notes and I am headed out:

1) It should be noted that I am a very vocal proponent of the idea that unless they have a god-damned good reason, the vast, vast majority of movies should be under two hours. Both nu-Batman movies violate this. This rule of thumb is a big deal to me, for whatever reason. It's like, most pop songs should be around 3-4 minutes. Anything longer and you'd better be like Stairway to Heaven or some shit.

2) One thing that I'm surprised didn't bug me: for whatever reason it didn't bug me that this was something of a Batman-lite Batman movie.

3) I liked Ledger's tongue play. The visual design of the Joker still does remind me of like, a crazy polish grandmother trying to force gross-ass kopytka on people.

4) What the fuck was up with Maggie Gyllenhal's head? Does she have some sort of disease or STD?

and I'm out for a bit
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: demi on December 13, 2008, 10:20:12 PM: nobod cares distinguished mentally-challenged fellow
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Phoenix Dark on December 13, 2008, 10:31:12 PM: Rented TDK earlier today, gonna watch it now. I'll borrow BB from my parents tomorrow and give it a fair shake
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: WrikaWrek on December 13, 2008, 10:52:09 PM: Quote from: TVC 15 on December 13, 2008, 09:57:15 PM
Quote from: BrandNew on December 13, 2008, 09:56:34 PM
I just don't understand why he can't just speak lower.
I'll also echo something Prole said earlier this week: I think RDJ's Iron Man performance impressed my more than Heath's.

Now that is just dumb.

He was being himself, there was nowhere where "acting" was required of him, he never had to go outside of his realm.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: fistfulofmetal on December 13, 2008, 11:25:23 PM: TDK is better than BB in pretty much every way.

But Hellboy 2 is superior to both.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: WrikaWrek on December 13, 2008, 11:47:23 PM: Lol at the notion of Hellboy 2 being superior.

It's not even better than the 1st, Hellboy felt like it had a purpose, Hellboy 2 felt like some T.V Episode.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Olivia Wilde Homo on December 14, 2008, 12:02:48 AM: LOL @ Hellboy 2. That movie was forgettable crap.

The Dark Knight is fucking awesome and I'm baffled at the reasons why people think it sucks, unless the only reason is that it brought in over $500,000,000 which means some of the unwashed masses went to see it, which doesn't jive with your outlook on movies.

It isn't without its flaws.

- Maggie Gyllenhaal was shit. People thought Katie Holmes was bad but she was much better than Ms. Saggy Tits in TDK. Maggie barely phoned it in. While Bale and Ledger gave strong performances, she just phoned it in. I'm glad they killed her off because for TDK2, I won't have to see her fat face and her saggy tits ever again.

- They ruined the potential of Two Face. I'm guessing they will try to write him in the next film but it wouldn't make sense. Eckhart, like Gyllenhaal, put out a mediocre performance.

The ending was a tad cheesy but it had to set up the plot for the sequel. If you guys complained about its length, then would you really want 5-10 extra minutes fleshing this storyline out? Probably not.

Iron Man was a good movie and RDJ put out a good performance but it is nowhere near TDK. Hellboy 2 is disposable garbage that nobody will give half a shit about next year. Hell, who even cares about it now? Just a bunch of internet contrarians who basically hate everything that is known outside of their small hipster sets and nerd enclaves on message boards.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: fistfulofmetal on December 14, 2008, 12:09:50 AM: HB2 stole all of TDK's thunder. A more enjoyable and more interesting movie that made TDK feel so drab. Yawn, car chase, yawn, interrogation scene, yawn yawn yawn.

Troll market :omg
Golden army :omg :hyper
Selma Blair :heartbeat
Hellboy :rock
Batman (http://forums.slizone.com/style_emoticons/slizone/zzz.gif)
Bale's Batman voice :rofl
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TakingBackSunday on December 14, 2008, 12:46:52 AM: Oh you're a horrible troll, at least TVC is clever.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Eel O'Brian on December 14, 2008, 12:55:59 AM: there's just a lot of plot discrepancies and bullshit dialogue in tdk, and were it any other movie some of the same people defending it would be posting mocking photoshops and irritating text memes about it

and i say this as someone who liked the movie

spoiler (click to show/hide)
80% of it, anyway
[close]
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Mandark on December 14, 2008, 01:42:03 AM: Ledger's Joker is like Depp's Jack Sparrow or Alan Rickman's Sheriff of Nottingham. I'm not sure if any of those parts should even be categorized as "acting" but they were easily the best things going in their respective movies.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: bagofeyes on December 14, 2008, 01:55:24 AM: I didn't like batman's new mask, and the whole ferry thing at the end was the kind of shit I would have expected in a spiderman movie. If I ever watch it again I'm turning off before the last half hour. I liked begins better too.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Mandark on December 14, 2008, 01:57:59 AM: Chacun a son gout, but I'm boggled that anyone prefers BB over TDK.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: bagofeyes on December 14, 2008, 02:00:41 AM: you could have replaced batman with bruce willis in TDK and it would have been diehard 5.0
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TVC15 on December 14, 2008, 02:06:50 AM: I might watch Hellboy 2 tonight. I love del Toro and Ron Perlman. I would eat del Toro's shit--I draw the line at the Hobbit though. That's sub-shit.

I don't have high hopes for Hellboy 2, though, because I know it's more fantasy than typical Hellboy fare. But del Toro also did fantasy great, so I'm kinda ambivalent, but Hellboy + mythology-esque fantasy doesn't seem like a great formula to me. I'm sure the movie will at the very least be very pretty. I think that one is also pretty long, isn't it?

I think there is maybe a 50% chance I will take Hellboy 2 out partially through and maybe put in Pan's Labyrinth, Spirit of the Beehive, or Cria Cuervos.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Mandark on December 14, 2008, 02:13:45 AM: It's probably best to watch Hellboy 2 without bringing any sort of attachment to the comic book version.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TVC15 on December 14, 2008, 02:17:20 AM: Quote from: Mandark on December 14, 2008, 02:13:45 AM
It's probably best to watch Hellboy 2 without bringing any sort of attachment to the comic book version.

Will my hardcore Ron Perlman appetite be satiated with an adequate amount of badassness, at least? Does he at any point wield a cigar?
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Mandark on December 14, 2008, 02:23:07 AM: You won't be disappointed on that front. I also thought Selma Blair was pretty great.

The set pieces are really well done, but I think I've been too saturated by modern special effects to appreciate them.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TVC15 on December 14, 2008, 02:24:57 AM: Sons of Anarchy really made me appreciate how big of a part Ron Perlman plays in my life. I think I might be gay because of his role as Vincent in Beauty and the Beast, for example.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Mandark on December 14, 2008, 02:26:40 AM: God, I hope you get to meet him and tell him that.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TVC15 on December 14, 2008, 02:29:15 AM: I'd hope he'd kick my ass <3
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Phoenix Dark on December 14, 2008, 02:51:26 AM: After watching TDK for the third time (first time on DVD) my opinion remains the same. It's the best superhero flick ever made, and one of the best action flicks of the last few years imo. That being said like most movies it has its flaws

-the intro bank heist is great but I'll agree with Cohen and admit the beginning has some problems. I really didn't like the Scarecrow scene. My brother pointed out that it lent continuity to the film which is true but it just seemed poorly executed. Didn't like the Batman clones or the dumb "i'm not wearing hockey pants" quip either

-Maggie Gyllenhaal is definitely a weak link. Like Heat, this movie would have been better if there were no women involved

-The Hong Kong scene is eh. I've read reviews where people really hate on it but it was just average/meh to me. Not a deal breaker

-The ending monologue is still grating. I'm referring to Batman's, not Gordon's which I really like. The mixture of the Batman voice and the music really make it laughable. I thought Dent's character was great while Two Face really seemed half assed, stuck on the end of the film. The scene where he's threatening the kid is great but overall...what a wasted opportunity. That being said Eckhart is great.

Comparing RDJ's Starks to Ledger is pretty weak. RDJ was playing RDJ playing Tony Starks; it's the equivalently of Tom Cruise or Will Smith strutting around in a role as themselves. Heath brought a character to life independent of himself, just as De Niro did back in the day. I'm not saying Heath's performance is on the level of a great De Niro performance obviously. But Heath definitely reached a level where he totally became his character and made you believe every minute of it. RDJ didn't do that in Iron Man because he's already that damn character, irl and many movie roles
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TVC15 on December 14, 2008, 03:01:31 AM: I was including the Hong Kong scene in my "Cut the Falcone storyline" critique, I think. The Scarcrow/Batclone scene didn't bug me so much, but the hockey pants line was pretty bad.

I still think RDJ (playing himself or not) impressed me more than Ledger. As I said before, it probably comes from not expecting RDJ to be able to pull off a superhero role. Ledger made a strong first impression with the pencil scene, but outside of that, the way he carried himself coming into the party scene, and the police station scene, I wasn't all that impressed. Again, he did fine with the role, but it wasn't a performance I'd be rushing to give an award.

And best superhero movie?
spoiler (click to show/hide)
The Incredibles
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Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: duckman2000 on December 14, 2008, 03:12:43 AM: Quote from: TVC 15 on December 13, 2008, 09:37:56 PM
You go on thinking that. I'm legits this time.

As if that's something you can control. :teehee
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Mandark on December 14, 2008, 03:13:52 AM: I'm pretty sure it was "hockey pads" not "pants".
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TVC15 on December 14, 2008, 03:16:47 AM: I heard pants, too. I can check the subtitles if I get bored. I guess pads makes more sense, though, so you're probably right. I guess that explains why I thought the line was dumb.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Himu on December 14, 2008, 03:17:31 AM: the ending monologue is the worst thing about the movie imo.

it's just so self indulgent. would be better without any voice.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: TVC15 on December 14, 2008, 03:25:10 AM: The good news is that I am enjoying Hellboy 2. It has Ron Perlman and cigars, so it's all good. The decidedly not Hellboy-y story isn't bugging me so much and the visual designs of the creatures are pretty nice. Whoever said it feels like a TV show is kinda right, though. It doesn't feel like it has movie-ish scale for whatever reason.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Fresh Prince on December 14, 2008, 05:40:50 AM: RDJ was nuance, he played the prick and hero but not in an over top way. The joker was over acted.
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: EvilBoris on December 14, 2008, 08:44:50 AM: Quote from: Fresh Prince on December 14, 2008, 05:40:50 AM
RDJ was nuance, he played the prick and hero but not in an over top way. The joker was over acted.

Ooooh...
I didn't find anything distracting, gimmicky or gratuitous about the ok yes, stylized prism ledger and the character demanded itself to be in. I think you're just using 'over acted' as a simple critical shorthand to dismiss work in this mode.

Ledger had far more simplistically written impulses than what RDJ had to work with in Iron Man....
but he worked on a physical rhythm to make the character's spontaniety credible, and eloquent, in its own ugly, perverse way. especially in that resourceful interrogation scene
.. there is something raw, true twisted in those silent car window and hospital exit scenes. and just smaller moments which are easy to miss.

so yeah concluding my little 'for you consideration' ad I say there is alot of nuance in his emotional volatility buuuut...

RDJ is also loose and will deservedly ride similar waves to oscars for tropic thunder... and flipping things around a bit it might just be ledger's death which opened up the possibility for that facepainted academy recognition 8)

Neither will win though Brolin :heartbeat
Title: Re: Okay, I actually watched TDK this time, and. . .
Post by: Cheebs on December 14, 2008, 10:41:43 AM: Quote from: WrikaWrek on December 13, 2008, 11:47:23 PM
Lol at the notion of Hellboy 2 being superior.

It's not even better than the 1st, Hellboy felt like it had a purpose, Hellboy 2 felt like some T.V Episode.
Thank you! Hellboy 1 was a fun movie. Hellboy 2 felt like it was a made-for-tv fantasy movie for the sci-fi channel. I dunno wtf Del Toro was smoking when he made it. It was a boring movie that only had a purpose of showing off an endless stream of monsters with a very cliched fantasy plot about princes, crowns and nonsense. The good characters from the first movie were severely underused and instead focused on elves and shit.