I love it, but it's not even Top 5 WRPG of the generation for me.
It's just eminently playable. I also sunk well over 100 hours into it across multiple platforms. Honestly, reminds me of KOTOR last gen as a comparison.
triumph, have you played titan quest
triumph, have you played titan quest
no
pc version is still the best wrpg this gen (that I've played)
That's a weird order since Mass Effect 1 was a lot better than Mass Effect 2.
That's a weird order since Mass Effect 1 was a lot better than Mass Effect 2.
in RPGS atmosphere, plot and ost go alot farther to me than 'gameplay' , the nebulous term as any time i'm 'playing the game' is gameplay, even dialogue.
but idc that much about Mass Effect to have a side, it's not really an rpg series anymore and i don't care that it's not, i just prefer the experience of 1 better.
in RPGS atmosphere, plot and ost go alot farther to me than 'gameplay' , the nebulous term as any time i'm 'playing the game' is gameplay, even dialogue.
but idc that much about Mass Effect to have a side, it's not really an rpg series anymore and i don't care that it's not, i just prefer the experience of 1 better.
This is what I don't get about most wrpg fanatics. They seem mostly concerned about plot and story than mechanics and gameplay.
WRPGs have completely, absolutely shit all over JRPGs in mechanics and gameplay this gen. Story and plot for that matter, too.
As an aside: I see a bunch of people saying they enjoyed Fallout New Vegas more than Fallout 3 in this thread... really? I admit that I never got to the strip in New Vegas but for whatever reason the game just didn't click with me like 3 did. Could have something to do with all of the goddamn glitches, bugs, and updates but yeah.
WRPGs have completely, absolutely shit all over JRPGs in mechanics and gameplay this gen. Story and plot for that matter, too.
As an aside: I see a bunch of people saying they enjoyed Fallout New Vegas more than Fallout 3 in this thread... really? I admit that I never got to the strip in New Vegas but for whatever reason the game just didn't click with me like 3 did. Could have something to do with all of the goddamn glitches, bugs, and updates but yeah.
WRPGs have completely, absolutely shit all over JRPGs in mechanics and gameplay this gen. Story and plot for that matter, too.
As an aside: I see a bunch of people saying they enjoyed Fallout New Vegas more than Fallout 3 in this thread... really? I admit that I never got to the strip in New Vegas but for whatever reason the game just didn't click with me like 3 did. Could have something to do with all of the goddamn glitches, bugs, and updates but yeah.
Name me some of these great JRPGs from this gen, cause I'm just not seeing them. If you say FF anything, I will punch you in the dick over the internet.
Name me some of these great JRPGs from this gen, cause I'm just not seeing them. If you say FF anything, I will punch you in the dick over the internet.
The only enjoyable JRPG experiences I've had this gen are Lost Odyssey and Fire Emblem Radiant Dawn. Lost Odyssey was completely because of the story/plot- the gameplay was absolute generic vanilla rpg stuff. Radiant Dawn was enjoyable for the complete opposite reason- gameplay and I guess a little bit of nostalgia carried over from PoR. Everything else out of Japan that I've played has been either mediocre or awful. Compare that to DA:O, Fallout 3 and even New Vegas... yeah. Plus, unlike you I don't sit around and cry over ME2 not being an rpg. It's an action rpg and a damn fine one.
in RPGS atmosphere, plot and ost go alot farther to me than 'gameplay' , the nebulous term as any time i'm 'playing the game' is gameplay, even dialogue.
but idc that much about Mass Effect to have a side, it's not really an rpg series anymore and i don't care that it's not, i just prefer the experience of 1 better.
This is what I don't get about most wrpg fanatics. They seem mostly concerned about plot and story than mechanics and gameplay.
If I'm spending >20 hours in a game it better damn sure have some great immersion qualities. Whether we specifically call that "plot" and "story" is another issue. It's why Fallout New Vegas for me would never make any list other than buggiest pile of 2010. But that's just my imo.
If I'm not motivated by your world in some manner I'm going to stop playing your game once it goes over a certain time length.
The only real exception to me for this is loot games which have a constant level up and reward mechanic in place. But the reality is that most games can't effectively string it out for that long.
in RPGS atmosphere, plot and ost go alot farther to me than 'gameplay' , the nebulous term as any time i'm 'playing the game' is gameplay, even dialogue.
but idc that much about Mass Effect to have a side, it's not really an rpg series anymore and i don't care that it's not, i just prefer the experience of 1 better.
This is what I don't get about most wrpg fanatics. They seem mostly concerned about plot and story than mechanics and gameplay.
If I'm spending >20 hours in a game it better damn sure have some great immersion qualities. Whether we specifically call that "plot" and "story" is another issue. It's why Fallout New Vegas for me would never make any list other than buggiest pile of 2010. But that's just my imo.
If I'm not motivated by your world in some manner I'm going to stop playing your game once it goes over a certain time length.
The only real exception to me for this is loot games which have a constant level up and reward mechanic in place. But the reality is that most games can't effectively string it out for that long.
I completely understand this.
But I think there's a line between your philosophy, and like say, GreatRumbler's, where they advertise how much of a great game Vampire The Masquerade: Bloodlines is, and it turns out that it play like shit. But it's written well! -- and that apparently is the only thing that truly matters. Have the same issue with those crappy Euro rpgs every drools over.
Who cares about story. U guys are lame. Fallout NV>>>>>>>>>>>Fallout3
Bad shit is going down. You need to get stats and loots to stop it. Best story ever.
Bad shit is going down. You need to get stats and loots to stop it. Best story ever.
Bad shit is going down. You need to get stats and loots to stop it. Best story ever.
Who cares about story. U guys are lame. Fallout NV>>>>>>>>>>>Fallout3
Name me some of these great JRPGs from this gen, cause I'm just not seeing them. If you say FF anything, I will punch you in the dick over the internet.
Shin Megami Tensei: Strange Journey
Etrian Odyssey
Cladun
Dragon Quest IX
Tales of Vesperia
Devil Survivor
Demon's Souls
Valkyrie Chronicles
Ys VII
Ys III
ZHP
If you want to have good jrpgs this gen you have to go to the handhelds. This may or may not be to your liking, but they're certainly there like they always have been and I haven't even played Dark Souls, Last Remnant, Trails of the Sky, or Radiant Historia, which I hear are fab.
My original point was that I find it sad that the bulk of the wrpgs this gen have sacrificed their more rpg roots for becoming glorified shooters. It wasn't a post directly comparing jrpgs to wrpgs in any way, though to be truthful, I do find jrpgs to be mechanically superior to wrpgs, as seen in games such as Strange Journey or Demons's Souls, which hilariously enough, are games directly inspired by western rpgs of old.
Even the dregs of the PS2 era are better than some of these "great" JRPGs. :-\
Apparently, all we have learned from this thread is that weeaboos are gonna be weeaboos, no matter how much evidence there is to the contrary. "BUBUBUT HANDHELDS!"
J vs W debates are a waste o time
J vs W debates are a waste o time
My issue with J fans is that they act like there isnt a tidal wave of shit JRPGs every year that go under the radar because publishers know the games wont sell over here. You get that level of filtration WRPGs just dont enjoy.
jrpg fans like that shit tho.
I'm a JRPG fan and I don't like that shit. Then again, I guess I'm not a JRPG fan to the extent that I love a game just for being in the genre. I also don't ignore handhelds so I've had more than enough good JRPGs to play without having to convince myself that the latest PS3 shitbomb JRPG is actually NOT SO BAD if you give it a chance!
Even Planescape isn't that fun to play.
My issue with J fans is that they act like there isnt a tidal wave of shit JRPGs every year that go under the radar because publishers know the games wont sell over here. You get that level of filtration WRPGs just dont enjoy.
Honestly, the filtration level ain't what it used to be for JRPGs. I think more decent games than terrible ones have been left over here while I've been here. The truly awful shit like Gust RPGs and stuff like Neptunia seem to make it over without fail, while higher quality efforts from companies like SEGA, Capcom, and Nintendo stay in Japan. This is certainly a newer phenomena (probably from PS2 generation onwards), but there just aren't as many quick and dirty garbage JRPGs made these days. The 8/16/32bit eras though? Whoa nelly, I'm only starting to grasp just how much JRPG shiiiiiiiiiiiit was produced in those eras.
I've heard so many divisive opinions of New Vegas, I really need to see for myself... Loved original Fallout 3 though, a LOT more than I thought.
NV really didnt do it for me. The whole warring factions was just a bit of a clusterfuck.
I don't understand people who play RPGs and say story doesn't matter. Isn't that the whole point of an RPG? If all you're interested in is tactical gameplay, there are a ton of games out there with more depth and complexity than story-focused games like Dragon Age or Fallout 3 or what have you. I'm not saying those games are bad (I liked both of them), but if the story, characters, world, etc. weren't interesting, then I don't see why anyone would play them.
I don't understand people who play RPGs and say story doesn't matter. Isn't that the whole point of an RPG? If all you're interested in is tactical gameplay, there are a ton of games out there with more depth and complexity than story-focused games like Dragon Age or Fallout 3 or what have you. I'm not saying those games are bad (I liked both of them), but if the story, characters, world, etc. weren't interesting, then I don't see why anyone would play them.
you said like the exact same fucking thing at the top of this page.
it's not that they're different concepts as much as they are different elements. saying "i feel the story in this game is crappy, but the combat systems are pretty cool" is like saying "I thought the graphics kind of sucked, but the music was outstanding". or saying "man the special effects in transformers are pretty good but only a cocksucking distinguished mentally-challenged fellow would like the story".
I don't think it's fair to say it's necessary for both aspects to be great in order for the game to be worth playing.
I don't understand people who play RPGs and say story doesn't matter. Isn't that the whole point of an RPG? If all you're interested in is tactical gameplay, there are a ton of games out there with more depth and complexity than story-focused games like Dragon Age or Fallout 3 or what have you. I'm not saying those games are bad (I liked both of them), but if the story, characters, world, etc. weren't interesting, then I don't see why anyone would play them.
because, and perhaps you need to be a bit aspertarded to get this, NUMBERS.
The thing is I get why some gamers are against the idea of "story". Because reviewers use the story concept to cover over game flaws and pretend they don't exist. They've started to review games as if they are fucking movies instead of games first and foremost which is annoying as fuck. And gamers tend to be more about the gameplay which in most cases is the right call. Then there is the tiring debate about what constitutes quality game story telling which means different things to different people. Which is why I don't really like to talk about or debate story merits in video games. All I can really say is when I play a game whether I'm hooking into the character and want to continue to find out what happens to that character or I dig being that character. Mass Effect has high immersion for me. Red Dead Redemption had high immersion for me. Fallout has high immersion for me. Hell MW 2 had high immersion for me because of the combat, the music, and the atmopshere. The story is garbage but I was immersed as hell and in the moment. So yes immersion does matter to me. And it means different things to different people. And it matters more the longer the game is.
It's why Crackdown never attracted me. Or Just Cause. Even though I get why others really dug those games.
GR, Please tell me which RPGs had amazing stories so I can laugh at you
then you get people listing Vampire: the Masquerade: Bloodlines as being one of the best rpgs ever, when it plays like total dog shit, is a half made game, and bug ridden at that. Why? Oh. The writing.
(http://www.kotowari.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/baal.png)
look at those hot digit :o
So how are you liking it chrono? Whatever you do never pick up 2...
I think you're cutting it way too much slack.
But the fact you are comparing it down to bigger turds just shows how terribad of a sequel it is.
It has absolutely nothing to do with the original imho. How can you defend the constant reuse of assets, which is borderline criminal when you consider games from smaller studios don't even do it that much? What even made you finish it? To me it felt like some fan made Neverwinter Nights scenario you could download for free.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMcVZQI6ybw
heck, i'd give the original DAO a B-/C+, and DA2 is quite a bit worse than it
</tomchick>
WHAT GAME IS THAT
long rant ahead
(http://a248.e.akamai.net/www.direct2drive.com/images/product/screenshots/8323/normal/screenshot2.jpg)(http://www.kotowari.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/baal.png)
look at those hot digit :o
(http://www.wuphonsreach.org/Games/Fallout3/Vault101-Baby/SPECIAL-Book.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/9vgbh.jpg)
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-2LfL-oWlAig/Tfo5AeDEyGI/AAAAAAAACGc/DgjwSmBvX6o/s1600/BGMain%2B2011-04-13%2Bcharacter%2Bsheet.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/K2eJG.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/o234Q.gif)
:omg
long rant ahead
I agree with what you're saying, but you're comparing a story-driven RPG to a turn-based strategy game, and they are different things. When I say stories are the point of an RPG, I'm not talking about games like Knights in the Nightmare, R-Type Tactics, Fire Emblem, etc., because those games are about strategic gameplay first and foremost - it makes sense to not give a shit about story if you're playing those games. But what I don't understand is why people are playing story-driven games like Final Fantasy (just an example) if they don't care about the story? Traditional RPGs like that have very little strategic depth, so why bother?