THE BORE

General => Video Game Bored => Topic started by: mojovonio on February 18, 2014, 12:47:47 PM

Title: Bioshock Finite
Post by: mojovonio on February 18, 2014, 12:47:47 PM
Quote
A Message From Ken Levine

When Jon Chey, Rob Fermier and I founded Irrational Games seventeen years ago, our mission was to make visually unique worlds and populate them with singular characters.
We built Rapture and Columbia, the Von Braun and The Rickenbacker, the Freedom Fortress and some of the nastiest basements a SWAT team ever set foot into. We created Booker and Elizabeth, the Big Daddy and the Little Sister, MidWives and ManBot. In that time, Irrational has grown larger and more successful than we could have conceived when we began our three-person studio in a living room in Cambridge, MA. It’s been the defining project of my professional life.

Now Irrational Games is about to roll out the last DLC for BioShock Infinite and people are understandably asking: What’s next?

Seventeen years is a long time to do any job, even the best one. And working with the incredible team at Irrational Games is indeed the best job I’ve ever had. While I’m deeply proud of what we’ve accomplished together, my passion has turned to making a different kind of game than we’ve done before. To meet the challenge ahead, I need to refocus my energy on a smaller team with a flatter structure and a more direct relationship with gamers. In many ways, it will be a return to how we started: a small team making games for the core gaming audience.

I am winding down Irrational Games as you know it. I’ll be starting a smaller, more entrepreneurial endeavor at Take-Two. That is going to mean parting ways with all but about fifteen members of the Irrational team. There’s no great way to lay people off, and our first concern is to make sure that the people who are leaving have as much support as we can give them during this transition.

Besides financial support, the staff will have access to the studio for a period of time to say their goodbyes and put together their portfolios. Other Take-Two studios will be on hand to discuss opportunities within the company, and we’ll be hosting a recruiting day where we’ll be giving 3rd party studios and publishers a chance to hold interviews with departing Irrational staff.*

What’s next?

In time we will announce a new endeavor with a new goal: To make narrative-driven games for the core gamer that are highly replayable. To foster the most direct relationship with our fans possible, we will focus exclusively on content delivered digitally.

When I first contemplated what I wanted to do, it became very clear to me that we were going to need a long period of design. Initially, I thought the only way to build this venture was with a classical startup model, a risk I was prepared to take. But when I talked to Take-Two about the idea, they convinced me that there was no better place to pursue this new chapter than within their walls. After all, they’re the ones who believed in and supported BioShock in the first place.

Thanks to Irrational and 2K’s passion in developing the games, and the fans who believe in it, BioShock has generated retail revenues of over a half billion dollars and secured an iconic place in gaming. I’m handing the reins of our creation, the BioShock universe, to 2K so our new venture can focus entirely on replayable narrative. If we’re lucky, we’ll build something half as memorable as BioShock.

We do our best to update an FAQ in this space as questions come in.

-Ken Levine
@iglevine

*If you’re a 3rd party interested in interviewing some of the best game developers in the world, please contact chris.bigelow@2k.com


http://www.irrationalgames.com/ (http://www.irrationalgames.com/)
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Yulwei on February 18, 2014, 01:01:18 PM
holy shit
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Sho Nuff on February 18, 2014, 01:03:03 PM
Well that's that

Feel bad for the retardedly talented people looking for work now. This sucks regardless of whether or not Ken was a nut, he kept people employed
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: headwalk on February 18, 2014, 01:04:31 PM
the console centric AAA model reaches out with its claws and steals another victim in its spastic death throes.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Stoney Mason on February 18, 2014, 01:05:39 PM
So it took 6 years to do infinite with the full team so we should be seeing this next game somewhere around 2040.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Yulwei on February 18, 2014, 01:06:47 PM
the console centric AAA model reaches out with its claws and steals another victim in its spastic death throes.

It really does sound like Infinite pushed him over the edge. Starting over with such a tiny team (in this day and age) is certainly going to be incredibly tough for them. I doubt we'll be hearing anything from them for a long, long time.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: headwalk on February 18, 2014, 01:14:43 PM
the console centric AAA model reaches out with its claws and steals another victim in its spastic death throes.

It really does sound like Infinite pushed him over the edge. Starting over with such a tiny team (in this day and age) is certainly going to be incredibly tough for them. I doubt we'll be hearing anything from them for a long, long time.

nah, i think we'll be seeing a gone home-a-like first person walking simulator within 18 months or so.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Great Rumbler on February 18, 2014, 01:15:58 PM
"Bioshock Infinite cost 2K a ton of money, so I gotta fire a whole bunch of people and make some mobile games instead."
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Stoney Mason on February 18, 2014, 01:16:21 PM
I think he realizes Infinite was a flawed game from the premise. Either do a story game or do a combat game. But trying to jury rig them together for no good reason doesn't really work.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Eel O'Brian on February 18, 2014, 01:17:18 PM
He's a screenwriter now
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: brob on February 18, 2014, 01:28:36 PM
They have mountains of assets. Why not just make telltale adventure games set in rapture/cloudcity or something?
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Stoney Mason on February 18, 2014, 01:31:31 PM
They have mountains of assets. Why not just make telltale adventure games set in rapture/cloudcity or something?

I think that's the real issue. They were building these universes where your only meaningful interactions within the worlds was shooting people in the face.  In a real sense they weren't that different from COD. Especially Infinite which dropped most of the pretensions of being something more that the original Bioshock had.

Well that and the fact that Infinite probably cost a shitload and maybe didn't sell as much as they hoped/thought.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: brob on February 18, 2014, 01:35:13 PM
wasn't one of the hype-points about the infinite dlc that the player doesn't get a gun for a long while? Isn't the sort of person who likes the bioshock franchise mostly in it for the narrative (and world building lore)? Isn't the most resource consuming part of development asset creation?

I feel like it would be very obviously a good move for them to move in a more tell tale like direction building on what they already have, but I thought that after bioshock came out of it's seven year dev cycle as well so wtf do I know...
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Raban on February 18, 2014, 01:36:56 PM
http://youtu.be/rY0WxgSXdEE
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Eel O'Brian on February 18, 2014, 01:37:26 PM
The first part is just Bioshock starring that racist dude from the clouds
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Stoney Mason on February 18, 2014, 01:37:50 PM
wasn't one of the hype-points about the infinite dlc that the player doesn't get a gun for a long while? Isn't the sort of person who likes the bioshock franchise mostly in it for the narrative (and world building lore)? Isn't the most resource consuming part of development asset creation?

I feel like it would be very obviously a good move for them to move in a more tell tale like direction building on what they already have, but I thought that after bioshock came out of it's seven year dev cycle as well so wtf do I know...

They could has also moved in a more Deus Ex like direction and that would work too. But yeah I agree. The current path was not working so well for what the games were imo.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Eel O'Brian on February 18, 2014, 01:42:48 PM
So 2k owns Bioshock outright now?

Get ready for biOShock!
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Shaka Khan on February 18, 2014, 01:55:03 PM
I think he realizes Infinite was a flawed game from the premise. Either do a story game or do a combat game. But trying to jury rig them together for no good reason doesn't really work.

Or he realizes the current model of skyrocketing costs and meager margins is unsustainable with little to no room of growth with a team and projects of that size. Gotta hit the reset button fast.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Steve Youngblood on February 18, 2014, 01:57:26 PM
I think he realizes Infinite was a flawed game from the premise. Either do a story game or do a combat game. But trying to jury rig them together for no good reason doesn't really work.

Or he realizes the current model of skyrocketing costs and meager margins is unsustainable with little to no room of growth with a team and projects of that size. Gotta hit the reset button fast.

Not to nitpick, but I would assume that Take-Two realized that for him.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Stoney Mason on February 18, 2014, 02:00:52 PM
(http://i.imgur.com/PIj9wPc.jpg)
:jawalrus
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: HyperZoneWasAwesome on February 18, 2014, 02:01:20 PM
2k always owned Bioshock.

and I'm kinda surprised that Levine is staying with his old publisher, after, you know, being forced to lay off damn near his whole studio.  You think if anybody could get outside funding for a small indie team it'd be that guy.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Steve Youngblood on February 18, 2014, 02:08:28 PM
2k always owned Bioshock.

and I'm kinda surprised that Levine is staying with his old publisher, after, you know, being forced to lay off damn near his whole studio.  You think if anybody could get outside funding for a small indie team it'd be that guy.

Well, another way of looking at it is that Take-Two employed him and his rather large team for all those years. I don't necessarily know if he'd be in a position to be indignant about this.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: hampster on February 18, 2014, 03:15:30 PM
Sucks for everyone laid off :( but I do hope this leads to Shawn Elliot getting back into podcasting. Or at least streaming with Jeff Green
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Himu on February 18, 2014, 03:45:21 PM
Does anyone have that image of the middle eastern leader holding his hands up for damage control? I need this image to prove to a friend that the industry is fucked.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: AdmiralViscen on February 18, 2014, 04:00:43 PM
Baghdad bob
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: benjipwns on February 18, 2014, 04:03:43 PM
Finally, a third Freedom Force game.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Himu on February 18, 2014, 04:08:47 PM
Baghdad bob

thanks boo
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Rufus on February 18, 2014, 04:25:07 PM
(http://i.imgur.com/PIj9wPc.jpg)
:jawalrus
Ah, Twitter. JP LeBreton has always sounded like a nice guy when he was on IdleThumbs. Guess we know why he left Irrational for 2K Marin and then went to Double Fine.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Tasty on February 18, 2014, 04:28:46 PM
Quote
my passion has turned to making a different kind of game than we’ve done before

:drudge mobile dystopia incoming :drudge
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Third on February 18, 2014, 04:32:34 PM
I feel bad for the people who got laid off. Infinite was such a piece of shit.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: drew on February 18, 2014, 04:38:06 PM
Bioshock in general always made me feel awful when I played it, and I didn't like the constant easter egg hunt/trash can looting.  This is nothing but good news (for me).
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Cerveza mas fina on February 18, 2014, 05:10:37 PM
I could never get into Bioshock, always quit after an hour.

Guess ill give it another go now its free on ps+

Shrug about the closure
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Bebpo on February 18, 2014, 05:14:25 PM
Yeah, I can't imagine the six year dev cycle between Bioshock and Infinite was something you could make back with one good selling game.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: StealthFan on February 18, 2014, 05:18:08 PM
New SWAT and Freedom Force brehs.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: fizzel on February 18, 2014, 05:33:44 PM
the console centric AAA model reaches out with its claws and steals another victim in its spastic death throes.

Barely in the new gen and it's already taken the scalp of a GOTY contender, EPIC is next.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: brob on February 18, 2014, 06:05:45 PM
Polygon did a story about Ken Levine (http://www.polygon.com/features/2013/1/10/3853198/ken-levine-bioshock-infinite-vgas) not that long ago that had this bit in it:

"In the past year, a number of high level employees quietly left Irrational for similar jobs at other studios. Levine acknowledges that, in some part, departures are a response to the company's abnormally intense iteration practices.

"I'm a bit of a slow chiseler, you know?" says Levine. "So it doesn't bother me that much. I think it's probably tougher for other people on the team. I think that's probably hard for some people."

Nate Wells, the art director of BioShock Infinite, and arguably the best known Irrational employee after Levine, was susceptible to massive creative gutting. This anecdote from a colleague of Wells gives an idea of what iteration, at its most extreme, was like in the office.

Levine and Wells had a blowout fight over Finkton. In BioShock Infinite, Finkton is the shantytown, home to the workers and outcasts of the floating city of Columbia.

The art team and level designers had been working on Finkton for a long time, with Wells directing the style. The inspiration was like the slums in Jamaica or Key West. All of the housing was wooden and colorful, as if painted by the residents to make the depressed quarters more livable. And each bright shack was stacked atop the next, climbing into the sky like an anthill, with the skyline piercing through it.

Ken had been in level reviews numerous times. Then one day, the Finkton team was doing a play test, when Ken decided the entire stage was wrong. It looked like the residents lived in garbage. It needed to be beautiful, because Columbia was designed so that even the poor lived beautifully.

It was all wrong. And it had to go.

Wells was furious. Levine had been looking at this for months. In August of this year, Wells announced his new role as art director at Naughty Dog Studios."


Hella auteurism, bro.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: cool breeze on February 18, 2014, 06:12:35 PM
was finkton the place where you shot people?
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: benjipwns on February 18, 2014, 06:41:23 PM
Since the release of BioShock, Levine has come off to me in various instances like he views himself as this visionary philosopher enlightening us common people through his art. There was his bitching about online idiots ruining gaming by creating too much pressure on designers and Zach Braff and Veronica Mars ruining Kickstarter by stealing it from the common man. Plus his whole schtick about how BioShock/Infinite isn't this black/white morality universe but instead the realistic and complex consequences of extremism and choice and blah blah blah has always rubbed me the wrong way, not getting things hard down there at all.

I actually thought BioShock 2 did that better because it wasn't trying so hard. :lol
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Great Rumbler on February 18, 2014, 06:42:03 PM
was finkton the place where you shot people?

No, it was the place where you shot people a whole lot.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Stoney Mason on February 18, 2014, 06:43:46 PM
Since the release of BioShock, Levine has come off to me in various instances like he views himself as this visionary philosopher enlightening us common people through his art.

I've liked both Bioshock games to varying degrees but yeah I would agree. I think TLOU is also a flawed game but at least you don't tend to see them popping up everywhere telling you how deep the stuff is they are making. They just tend to let the work speak for itself.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: benjipwns on February 18, 2014, 06:49:22 PM
I like his games a good amount, but it does feel and read to an extent like he's been getting trapped going down that rabbit hole and it's hurting his gameplay designing skill to whatever extent that existed prior. Like in that exchange Brobzoid posted, his goal isn't necessarily to create a game anymore that's just the medium he's in and knows.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Mupepe on February 18, 2014, 07:19:23 PM
I like his games a good amount, but it does feel and read to an extent like he's been getting trapped going down that rabbit hole and it's hurting his gameplay designing skill to whatever extent that existed prior. Like in that exchange Brobzoid posted, his goal isn't necessarily to create a game anymore that's just the medium he's in and knows.
Kojima complex
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: brob on February 18, 2014, 07:27:43 PM
Kojima and Levine probably aren't that far apart on the auteurism spectrum, though Konami seems to hold their leash more taut than 2K.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: magus on February 18, 2014, 07:56:06 PM
so when it's going to be ubisoft turn so we can finaly get rid of ass-ass-in creed?
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Great Rumbler on February 18, 2014, 08:39:11 PM
The next Bioshock will be a cover-shooter with QTEs.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: benjipwns on February 18, 2014, 08:40:51 PM
BioShock themed match-three MOBA for phones.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Himu on February 18, 2014, 08:49:37 PM
You guys are acting like the bioshock franchise was good to begin with.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Himu on February 18, 2014, 09:29:30 PM
No, Rumbler and Benji are. Like it's some downgrade going from an on rails fps to a cover shooter.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Stoney Mason on February 18, 2014, 09:33:53 PM
No, Rumbler and Benji are. Like it's some downgrade going from an on rails fps to a cover shooter.

They are joking.

And a lot of people do like the Bioshock franchise. I'm more mixed on it, but I understand at least partially why they do.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Himu on February 18, 2014, 10:08:20 PM
No one brought up Shenmue.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: fizzel on February 18, 2014, 11:07:45 PM
http://youtube.com/watch?v=JPMiqDqkWn8
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: The Sceneman on February 18, 2014, 11:11:13 PM
lmao trying to get in on that Walking Dead money. Good luck shithead
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: The Sceneman on February 18, 2014, 11:11:58 PM
The next Bioshock will be a cover-shooter with QTEs.

Better than a dogshit FPS
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Himu on February 18, 2014, 11:13:19 PM
http://youtube.com/watch?v=JPMiqDqkWn8

:neogaf
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: duckman2000 on February 19, 2014, 04:22:28 AM
I thought Bioshock and Infinite were really pretty, in a big way. The artists (and their directors) involved really knew how to create place. I have no idea how much of that Levine was directly or indirectly responsible for, but that's the first and lasting impression.

The games themselves were just cumbersome shooters. I guess the production values were just plain high, enough so to get me through the games.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Mupepe on February 19, 2014, 10:14:40 AM
I thought they were all pretty damn fun *shrug*  But I tend to like almost anything I play.  Whatevs
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Raban on February 19, 2014, 11:06:46 AM
I thought Bioshock and Infinite were really pretty, in a big way. The artists (and their directors) involved really knew how to create place. I have no idea how much of that Levine was directly or indirectly responsible for, but that's the first and lasting impression.

The games themselves were just cumbersome shooters. I guess the production values were just plain high, enough so to get me through the games.
The scale and beauty of the environment work in those games (especially Infinite) kinda reminded me of the first time I saw the huge, stylized vistas of a Final Fantasy game on PS1. Sadly it wasn't enough for me to tolerate the boring, shallow gunplay.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: archie4208 on February 19, 2014, 11:35:32 AM
The next Bioshock will be a cover-shooter with QTEs.

Bioshock Infinite already came out.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: magus on February 19, 2014, 11:46:39 AM
so when it's going to be ubisoft turn so we can finaly get rid of ass-ass-in creed?

we already had their version of this when patrice desilets left

oh wait.... do you think bioshock is going somewhere?  silly magoose.

better game have biten the dust, it's time to finaly see some AAA FPS do the same

join the whimsy revolution! :japancry
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: benjipwns on February 19, 2014, 08:53:46 PM
A libertarian miffed by Bioshock? You don't say!
A real free market utopia wouldn't be that linear!
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Human Snorenado on February 19, 2014, 09:13:18 PM
A libertarian miffed by Bioshock? You don't say!
A real free market utopia wouldn't be that linear!

:jawalrus

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7QDv4sYwjO0
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: benjipwns on February 19, 2014, 10:08:32 PM
Joking aside, I think 2's setup is better done even if it's just as strawman or black/white as in Levine's two stories. If only because it's a personal and possibly sympathetic usage of the same kind of concepts. Not to spoil for anyone but the villains seem a lot less openly villainy but that could just be my interpretation.

Besides, the first game doesn't really have much of anything to do with libertarianism, it sorta works as an Objectivist society though. I probably mainly dislike it and Infinite's stuff because it's so oddly praised as deep and intellectual and crap when it's mostly ham-fisted. So maybe that's why I favor 2 since it never got any of that hype, especially the "BIG MEANINGFUL CHOICES" crap. Or maybe my love of audiologs and that kind of thing made me pay too much attention.  :lol They all play pretty much the same though, some real good, some sorta good and some real bad. As mentioned, visually, the world's are pretty great too.

spoiler (click to show/hide)
:teehee
[close]
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Human Snorenado on February 19, 2014, 10:19:25 PM
I'm probably thinking too much about BioShock, but I think the reason the first played better as a game for me than Infinite (never played 2) was that you were basically just trying to survive in a setting that had ALREADY had a fall from grace. In Infinite, you're the engine of that fall, whether it's deserved or not.

I haven't played the first one since 2008 I wanna say, so I might be wrong, but I remember enjoying the gameplay better than Infinite's as well, even though the skyhook shit was really fun.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: benjipwns on February 19, 2014, 10:24:11 PM
Yeah, I liked that in the first Metroid Prime as well where you've come in after shit's gone down and you basically uncover the history through the logs.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: benjipwns on February 19, 2014, 10:29:45 PM
That is one of the worst things about all the shooting, along with the pacing, it'd be more tolerable otherwise. One of the problems I have with the Call of Duty's single player too. On PC anyhow.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Stoney Mason on February 19, 2014, 11:01:49 PM
I'm probably thinking too much about BioShock, but I think the reason the first played better as a game for me than Infinite (never played 2) was that you were basically just trying to survive in a setting that had ALREADY had a fall from grace. In Infinite, you're the engine of that fall, whether it's deserved or not.

I haven't played the first one since 2008 I wanna say, so I might be wrong, but I remember enjoying the gameplay better than Infinite's as well, even though the skyhook shit was really fun.

I think the combat is better in infinite than the original by a good margin. But the problem is I don't think combat is the reason you play these games.

So what if the combat is better. I think Bioshock 1 probably had the more unique world and probably the better story and a very nice twist. That counts for a lot. (That being said it was pretty damn flawed too) The combat in both games gets very tedious. There is no real stealth approach option for either game. The AI is brick dumb. So you end up with an average shooter that has to stand on the originality of the world. And the first time around is always going to be more original than the sequel.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Great Rumbler on February 20, 2014, 12:51:10 AM
The final battle in Bioshock Infinite was so utterly abysmal, totally devoid of any effort whatsoever.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: benjipwns on February 20, 2014, 02:01:54 AM
I'm trying to remember the last good final battle in a FPS I've played, they're so often let downs even compared to earlier battles in the game. The one that always sticks with me where I was first actually upset about it is Call of Duty 2 which had all these great level designs and grand scale battles, and then the last one you run around some small town for five minutes then put bombs on a couple of tanks and then the game just sorta ends after a couple of guys talk for a minute.

And it's like immediately AFTER Pointe du Hoc and Hill 400. Let alone the Stalingrad and El Alamein parts from earlier in the game.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: cool breeze on February 20, 2014, 02:09:22 AM
I liked half life 2 ep 2's.  7 years ago ain't recent, but still.

The worst is FEAR 2.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: The Sceneman on February 20, 2014, 02:16:21 AM
Bioshock Infinite was so utterly abysmal, totally devoid of any effort whatsoever.

ftfy
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: The Sceneman on February 20, 2014, 02:23:04 AM
More games need to understand the concept of a final boss.

In Bioshock's case, the designers needed to understand the concept of a well designed videogame. The kind of game design which consistently tests and rewards the player, with a clear motive behind the nature of the gameplay, and adheres to fundamental design models of entertainment in general.

Bioshock Infinite is one of the worst games I have ever played. It looked great, beautiful art and interesting setting and story. The game it self was a quagmire of gameplay ideas, which all seemed completely disjointed, unbalanced and seemingly no thought put into what was happening and how the player was reacting to one scene to the next. Hannah Montana: the Movie: the Game was in all regards a more well honed, focused product.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Himu on February 20, 2014, 07:55:25 AM
More western games need to understand the concept of a final boss.

Fixed.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Positive Touch on February 20, 2014, 08:21:19 AM
I'm trying to think of ANY fps that had worthwhile final bosses. serious Sam comes to mind, as does the metroid prime series, but man that shit is rare. it's weird to me that so few fps games have mirror-match type battles, too.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Tasty on February 20, 2014, 11:36:13 AM
Deus Ex had bad bosses all around. Which sucks cause the rest of the game is awesome.

Supposedly fixed in DX for Wii U :rejoice
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Rahxephon91 on February 20, 2014, 02:21:07 PM
Fixed in The Directors Cut in general.

Though still not actually good.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Steve Contra on February 20, 2014, 02:21:24 PM
I'm still wondering how after 7 years of development Levine managed to produce a game that felt exactly the game he just made but worse.  He talks so much about iteration but what exactly was he iterating?
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: Stoney Mason on February 20, 2014, 02:47:45 PM
I'm still wondering how after 7 years of development Levine managed to produce a game that felt exactly the game he just made but worse.  He talks so much about iteration but what exactly was he iterating?

Racism
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: The Sceneman on February 20, 2014, 03:46:40 PM
I'm still wondering how after 7 years of development Levine managed to produce a game that felt exactly the game he just made but worse.  He talks so much about iteration but what exactly was he iterating?

Racism

Yeah, and "irony"

There was one moment that just hammered home to me; exactly how diehard Bioshock stans are some of the most distinguished mentally-challenged faux-intellectuals on the planet.

I was listening to the song "Irene Goodnight" on Youtube (because Infinite did have great music), and the top rated comment was:
Quote
This was originally written by a black man during the 30's.Oh, the irony.

My brain melted trying to comprehend that sentence and how that person understood the meaning of irony. Wow, just wow
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: chronovore on February 21, 2014, 01:05:15 AM
Well that's that

Feel bad for the retardedly talented people looking for work now. This sucks regardless of whether or not Ken was a nut, he kept people employed
As bad as I feel for that group of people, I assume most of them will have less trouble being picked up by other studios than Ken Himself would. That's a staggering amount of talent and, while I assume this is no picnic for any of them, they are likely all on to greener pastures.

Ken, though, and that "gee, it's been great, and i'm still employed, but everyone else has got to go" memo, it is hard to picture a more self-serving PR misstep than that. I wonder if anyone will spit on him at GDC.

I feel bad for the people who got laid off. Infinite was such a piece of shit.

Wait, I find NOTHING contentious in a Third post? SOUND THE ALARM, THE END TIME IS NIGH.
Title: Re: Bioshock Finite
Post by: a slime appears on February 23, 2014, 09:58:55 AM
Well that's that

Feel bad for the retardedly talented people looking for work now. This sucks regardless of whether or not Ken was a nut, he kept people employed
As bad as I feel for that group of people, I assume most of them will have less trouble being picked up by other studios than Ken Himself would. That's a staggering amount of talent and, while I assume this is no picnic for any of them, they are likely all on to greener pastures.

Ken, though, and that "gee, it's been great, and i'm still employed, but everyone else has got to go" memo, it is hard to picture a more self-serving PR misstep than that. I wonder if anyone will spit on him at GDC.

I feel bad for the people who got laid off. Infinite was such a piece of shit.

Wait, I find NOTHING contentious in a Third post? SOUND THE ALARM, THE END TIME IS NIGH.

Yeah, they're currently over 50 companies already actively hiring people left and right. More than 112 recruiters are heading to the job fair at Irrational to hire people.

Say what you will about Levine (my friend who used to work with him HATES his guts) but the guy is actively promoting his laid off employees on Facebook and other social media outlets and doing what he can to make the best of a shitty situation. I've never seen a studio head go out of his way like this.