THE BORE

General => The Superdeep Borehole => Topic started by: Fresh Prince on April 24, 2007, 08:43:17 AM

Title: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Fresh Prince on April 24, 2007, 08:43:17 AM
Jay-Z

or

White People

I say Jay-Z  >:(
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Tauntaun on April 24, 2007, 09:22:15 AM
both?
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Powerslave on April 24, 2007, 09:28:13 AM
Eminem didn't kill hiphop. It was a combination of Cash Money, Jay-Z, 50 Cent, No Limit oh and...8 Mile..So in a way, Eminem did kill hiphop hmmm
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: lordmaji on April 24, 2007, 10:13:02 AM
50 Cent and his Goons.

Also Bling and Beefs.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: nufaust on April 24, 2007, 10:24:36 AM
white people  :D
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Tauntaun on April 24, 2007, 10:27:58 AM
white pople  :D
:wstupid
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 10:39:06 AM
It's not white people per se, because whites have been big hip hop supporters even back in the Public Enemy days. Where do you think the love from the Beasties comes from?

There's a mixture of a few things. First and foremost, Jay Z didn't kill hip hop at all. He has his own thing, he can't help that others imitate it. At least he's creative about it and knows when to switch it up. Cash Money and No Limit should be blamed more than him. For one thing, the hip hop fans don't know their history. They're always into the next big thing out and don't care about the classics, unlike fans of other genres. This means that pioneers are extremely hard to come by, and without pioneers, you lack influence.

Since hip hop fans are so damn impressionable, the man has used this to his advantage ever since hip hop became a boom. They blacked out all underground records on BET. They only play widely mainstream stuff on tv and radio when they didn't in the past (it used to be, on the west coast you'd hear west coast style, and on the east coast you'd have east coast style hip hop. It used to be diverse). They do this because they know they can get away with it, and the typical hip hop fan is too impressionable to care.

Since all of these networks play the same songs with similar themes, there becomes a trend. People want to be just like that, and the music's identity is gone. Instead of getting innovators we're left with a bastion of me too's. The record companies and other corportate ceo's see this, cash it in, and the people buy it, making the process repeat.

In summary, the thing that killed hip hop was the fact it became mainstream and a billion dollar revenue business. I remember when I was little kid people were scared of hip hop culture. Now you see it all in commercials, and everyone wants to be hip hop.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Saint Cornelius on April 24, 2007, 10:48:50 AM
Hip-hop isn't dead.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 10:50:50 AM
Hip-hop isn't dead.

Mainstream hip hop is.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Prost on April 24, 2007, 11:12:52 AM
I think when someone is listening to hip-hop in their car they're being trashy.




















































Now THAT was meant to provoke SC! ;P
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Beezy on April 24, 2007, 12:41:17 PM
Record execs and dumbass ignorant "rappers" like Cam'ron.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: MrAngryFace on April 24, 2007, 12:45:01 PM
I dont listen to much hip hop...actually any at all. HOWEVER, in the music industry in general it is, as Beezy suggested, always the execs' fault.

However some blame can be placed on the people who buy the stuff thats so obviously created simply to make money rather than further develop the genre.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 12:57:37 PM
Record execs and dumbass ignorant "rappers" like Cam'ron.

The fans are just as much to blame as them. Hip hop fans are stupid.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Saint Cornelius on April 24, 2007, 01:03:10 PM
Gee Himuro, blanket statements are so awesome!
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: nufaust on April 24, 2007, 02:22:41 PM
white pople  :D
:wstupid

oh you called somebody who made a typo stupid (i must admit posting on message boards while you are trying to work and when you got million other things to do is not working for me so i'll excuse myself and just go back to lurking like i usually do) you must be feeling so cool now i guess taun. how cool is tauntaun? super witty cool  ::)

going back to the topic i do think that white suburbia killed mainstream hip hop in the u.s.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 02:24:44 PM
Gee Himuro, blanket statements are so awesome!

Most of them are. Why do you think people like Cam'Ron are popular? Hell I like Ballin' but come on. I hang around people who love main stream rap all the time and they act like idiots when discussing it, and when they aren't they bring up random and distinguished mentally-challenged rap slang into the mix.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 02:25:36 PM
going back to the topic i do think that white suburbia killed mainstream hip hop in the u.s.

White suburbia are the majority of the people keeping the awesome artists afloat. It sure ain't the hood rats.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Saint Cornelius on April 24, 2007, 02:27:20 PM
Himuro have you ever been to a hip-hop show in your life?

going back to the topic i do think that white suburbia killed mainstream hip hop in the u.s.

i disagree.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Tauntaun on April 24, 2007, 02:31:42 PM
white pople  :D
:wstupid

oh you called somebody who made a typo stupid (i must admit posting on message boards while you are trying to work and when you got million other things to do is not working for me so i'll excuse myself and just go back to lurking like i usually do) you must be feeling so cool now i guess taun. how cool is tauntaun? super witty cool  ::)

going back to the topic i do think that white suburbia killed mainstream hip hop in the u.s.

 :lol thanks baby, maybe we could talk sometime and you could pick up on my *ahem* "super witty cool".

ps, it was a joke ;)
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:hump <~~~this isn't
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or is it?  :-*
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Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 02:31:59 PM
Himuro have you ever been to a hip-hop show in your life?

No, but I'm not talking about the enthusiasts who like good music, I'm talking about Mr. Joe Scmoe, the everyday cunt who listens to horrible music. Talk to any rap fan my age and you'll see that they're dolts and have the attention span of a squirrel.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Saint Cornelius on April 24, 2007, 02:37:14 PM
No, but I'm not talking about the enthusiasts who like good music, I'm talking about Mr. Joe Scmoe, the everyday cunt who listens to horrible music. Talk to any rap fan my age and you'll see that they're dolts and have the attention span of a squirrel.


You're painting with too broad a stroke to be taken seriously, duder.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Phoenix Dark on April 24, 2007, 02:37:17 PM
Record execs and dumbass ignorant "rappers" like Cam'ron.

The fans are just as much to blame as them. Hip hop fans are stupid.

Himu ftw. Not all hip hop fans are stupid, but all you need to do is look at the charts to see many of them are. They demand disposable trash and they're supplied disposable trash. The funny thing is that most rap albums are selling poorly now. So while people may love listening to the various singles, they aren't buying the albums. Maybe they aren't stupid afterall.

And it's not just white execs: black execs are the ones dictating what's played on BET and who gets signed now. The white execs for the most part write the checks, although some like Jimmy Iovine do much more. But even Jimmy doesn't have much control over his bigger artists. Before the Marshal Mathers LP came out Jimmy had Em go back in the studio and create a better single (The Real Slim Shady). Do you think he could tell Em to get his shit together now? Same with 50. They're the ones signing artists now

Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 02:38:47 PM
No, but I'm not talking about the enthusiasts who like good music, I'm talking about Mr. Joe Scmoe, the everyday cunt who listens to horrible music. Talk to any rap fan my age and you'll see that they're dolts and have the attention span of a squirrel.


You're painting with too broad a stroke to be taken seriously, duder.

No I am really not.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Tauntaun on April 24, 2007, 02:39:56 PM
No, but I'm not talking about the enthusiasts who like good music, I'm talking about Mr. Joe Scmoe, the everyday cunt who listens to horrible music. Talk to any rap fan my age and you'll see that they're dolts and have the attention span of a squirrel.


You're painting with too broad a stroke to be taken seriously, duder.

No I am really not.

ON SNAPS!

(http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/9520/hankthrustrm1.gif)
(http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/9520/hankthrustrm1.gif)
(http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/9520/hankthrustrm1.gif)
(http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/9520/hankthrustrm1.gif)
(http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/9520/hankthrustrm1.gif)
(http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/9520/hankthrustrm1.gif)
(http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/9520/hankthrustrm1.gif)
(http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/9520/hankthrustrm1.gif)
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 02:40:12 PM
And it's not just white execs: black execs are the ones dictating what's played on BET and who gets signed now. The white execs for the most part write the checks, although some like Jimmy Iovine do much more. But even Jimmy doesn't have much control over his bigger artists. Before the Marshal Mathers LP came out Jimmy had Em go back in the studio and create a better single (The Real Slim Shady). Do you think he could tell Em to get his shit together now? Same with 50. They're the ones signing artists now



Naw dude. BET only sold out when Viacom bought them. I don't think there's a coincidence, but yeah you're right.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Phoenix Dark on April 24, 2007, 02:43:31 PM
And it's not just white execs: black execs are the ones dictating what's played on BET and who gets signed now. The white execs for the most part write the checks, although some like Jimmy Iovine do much more. But even Jimmy doesn't have much control over his bigger artists. Before the Marshal Mathers LP came out Jimmy had Em go back in the studio and create a better single (The Real Slim Shady). Do you think he could tell Em to get his shit together now? Same with 50. They're the ones signing artists now



Naw dude. BET only sold out when Viacom bought them. I don't think there's a coincidence, but yeah you're right.
also
[youtube=425,350]lm0mEfL8S9s[/youtube]

opposing viewpoint:
[youtube=425,350]COjB_mD6T58[/youtube]
 :rofl
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 02:44:52 PM
Holy shit Boyancee :rofl
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Saint Cornelius on April 24, 2007, 02:45:21 PM
I think Phoenix Dark killed hip-hop.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Phoenix Dark on April 24, 2007, 02:47:34 PM
I think Phoenix Dark killed hip-hop.

My boy is bringin in back
[youtube=425,350]HDIe0_UoLlg[/youtube]

smh at the video but the song is hot. PREMO
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: nufaust on April 24, 2007, 02:59:35 PM
Himuro have you ever been to a hip-hop show in your life?

going back to the topic i do think that white suburbia killed mainstream hip hop in the u.s.

i disagree.

they(white suburbia) turned a semi-underground genre of music into multi billion dollar mainstream commercialism fest. i'm not denying that there are still some amazing hip hop artists out there or the fact that this commercial hip hop empire has many positive effects on the scene and on the communities. i'm just saying that as a music aficionado, i'm not feeling the spirit of hip hop that i fell in love with during 85-95 era anymore and i believe this all started when white kids from suburbs started to pour their money into label execs' pockets.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Phoenix Dark on April 24, 2007, 03:01:54 PM
It's a bigger market, of course it had an effect. I wouldn't put all the blame on them though. Last time I checked white kids are supporting real hip hop far more than black kids. Ever seen a Roots/Mos Def/etc concert? Filled with white people.

Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 03:03:49 PM
It's a bigger market, of course it had an effect. I wouldn't put all the blame on them though. Last time I checked white kids are supporting real hip hop far more than black kids. Ever seen Roots/Mos Def/etc concert? Filled with white people.

Word.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Saint Cornelius on April 24, 2007, 03:07:28 PM
they(white suburbia) turned a semi-underground genre of music into multi billion dollar mainstream commercialism fest. i'm not denying that there are still some amazing hip hop artists out there or the fact that this commercial hip hop empire has many positive effects on the scene and on the communities. i'm just saying that as a music aficionado, i'm not feeling the spirit of hip hop that i fell in love with during 85-95 era anymore and i believe this all started when white kids from suburbs started to pour their money into label execs' pockets.


Two things:

1) I too love the era of hip-hop you're bigging up, just so you don't think I'm constantly hating on whatever anyone has to say
2) Like I asked Himuro, have you ever been to a hip-hop show? Whenever I go see hip-hop acts that I guess would be considered "underground" - like Del, People Under the Stairs, Blackalicious, De La Soul, etc... the crowd is ALWAYS 95% white. So much so that it's EMBARRASSING, like where are the brothers and sisters? Fuck, MURS even did a SONG about it.

I don't think it's white kids from suburbia killing hip-hop; I think it's the white music executives and program directors who are killing hip-hop by playing nothing but the lowest common denominator music.

Quote
ANDERSON COOPER: If your record label said to you, "Look, we're not going to promote you, we're not going to distribute you, if you keep calling Curtis Jackson a snitch, or [if] you keep writing about guns and selling drugs," would you stop?

CAM'RON: No record company in the world would say, "We're not going to promote you if you call somebody a snitch." They know what makes money. A record company would never be that stupid. Never.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Saint Cornelius on April 24, 2007, 03:10:03 PM
Also, if Himuro wants to just ask PD who killed hip-hop, maybe this should've been better kept to PMs, instead of me pouring out my heart about something I actually do care about
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 03:13:10 PM
Corny, like I said before, I'm not talking about the musical enthusiasts. I haven't been to a hip hop show, but I have been exposed to a number of idiotic rap fans, who AREN'T enthusiasts. Sorry if I offended. You know I like hip hop. I'm mainly talking about how the fanbase seems to completely forget it's roots and goes for the next big thing.

It's sad because you see rock fans loving classic stuff like Guns N' Roses, Zepp, Ozzie, Pink Floyd, The Beatles, and so forth, but you never see hip hop fans actively get into the roots of the genre. This is why I said most hip hop fans are stupid. I blame the fans for 50% of hip hops increasing stagnation.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 03:13:58 PM
Also, if Himuro wants to just ask PD who killed hip-hop, maybe this should've been better kept to PMs, instead of me pouring out my heart about something I actually do care about

I didn't make this thread, Fresh Prince did.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Phoenix Dark on April 24, 2007, 03:15:53 PM
Also, if Himuro wants to just ask PD who killed hip-hop, maybe this should've been better kept to PMs, instead of me pouring out my heart about something I actually do care about

No one is starting stuff. In fact, our opinions are basically the same. I already brought up the point you just made about white kids being the ones who are supporting underground stuff. Himu just has a more angry tone I guess, and I can't knock him - it does make me kinda mad when I think about what's going on.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Tauntaun on April 24, 2007, 03:18:11 PM
Just a white man coming through, don't mind me...


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Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Beezy on April 24, 2007, 03:24:19 PM
 :lol :lol :lol
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: nufaust on April 24, 2007, 03:39:44 PM
It's a bigger market, of course it had an effect. I wouldn't put all the blame on them though. Last time I checked white kids are supporting real hip hop far more than black kids. Ever seen a Roots/Mos Def/etc concert? Filled with white people.

well yeah but that is just one side of the story, what about those kids that made 50cents game a million seller? what about millions and millions of kids who don't know shit about music but are ready to consume what ever mtv's execs feeding them because they wanna be a part of this "urban/cool/badass/trendy" lifestyle that is called hip-hop nowadays? just compare how many albums roots have sold lately and how many "videogames" 50cent sold, you'll se what i mean. also i don't have nothing against white suburbanites or anything, i just feel like when massess of white young suburbia (excluding white suburban music enthusiasts) got into hip hop is also the point in time that mainstream hip hop started to sound more and more like pop music.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 04:13:37 PM
It's a bigger market, of course it had an effect. I wouldn't put all the blame on them though. Last time I checked white kids are supporting real hip hop far more than black kids. Ever seen a Roots/Mos Def/etc concert? Filled with white people.

well yeah but that is just one side of the story, what about those kids that made 50cents game a million seller? what about millions and millions of kids who don't know shit about music but are ready to consume what ever mtv's execs feeding them because they wanna be a part of this "urban/cool/badass/trendy" lifestyle that is called hip-hop nowadays? just compare how many albums roots have sold lately and how many "videogames" 50cent sold, you'll se what i mean. also i don't have nothing against white suburbanites or anything, i just feel like when massess of white young suburbia (excluding white suburban music enthusiasts) got into hip hop is also the point in time that mainstream hip hop started to sound more and more like pop music.

You think all of the people who made the 50 Cent game a million seller are white? Sorry to tell you this, but the truth is that most of them people are black. My cousin and all of his friends have that game. The whole gangster image affects the black kids way more so than the white ones because it makes them think that's the way they're supposed to act, and if they don't, they aren't black.

The black people perpetuate this stereotype WAY more than the white ones. A wigger is rare, while a good majority of black youth act that way.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Phoenix Dark on April 24, 2007, 04:19:39 PM
It's a bigger market, of course it had an effect. I wouldn't put all the blame on them though. Last time I checked white kids are supporting real hip hop far more than black kids. Ever seen a Roots/Mos Def/etc concert? Filled with white people.

well yeah but that is just one side of the story, what about those kids that made 50cents game a million seller? what about millions and millions of kids who don't know shit about music but are ready to consume what ever mtv's execs feeding them because they wanna be a part of this "urban/cool/badass/trendy" lifestyle that is called hip-hop nowadays? just compare how many albums roots have sold lately and how many "videogames" 50cent sold, you'll se what i mean. also i don't have nothing against white suburbanites or anything, i just feel like when massess of white young suburbia (excluding white suburban music enthusiasts) got into hip hop is also the point in time that mainstream hip hop started to sound more and more like pop music.

You think all of the people who made the 50 Cent game a million seller are white? Sorry to tell you this, but the truth is that most of them people are black. My cousin and all of his friends have that game. The whole gangster image affects the black kids way more so than the white ones because it makes them think that's the way they're supposed to act, and if they don't, they aren't black.

The black people perpetuate this stereotype WAY more than the white ones. A wigger is rare, while a good majority of black youth act that way.

Whites buy like 80% of all hip hop sold though. So by pure numbers they buy more.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 04:20:44 PM
Yes, but just because you're white and like rap doesn't make you a wigger. Corny's a big fan and he's certainly no wigger.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: MrAngryFace on April 24, 2007, 04:21:13 PM
I dont get why white suburban kids relate to hip hop, the music doesnt even come from their type of environment.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Van Cruncheon on April 24, 2007, 04:22:54 PM
good hip-hop doesn't go on about guns and slangin' and bangin' and bitches and cristal, but as folks are lamenting, the good stuff also gets very little exposure

everyone else, see: makaveli
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 04:24:14 PM
I dont get why white suburban kids relate to hip hop, the music doesnt even come from their type of environment.

It's something interesting and different. Imagine living in the 80's and then Public Enemy drops. It would be the dopest shit ever because you never thought about that stuff before. I'm pretty sure they like it simply BECAUSE they don't relate it. It's interesting because it's so foreign.

Also a lot of the hip hop we listen to, and especially the "underground" artists aren't even making songs about specific environments, they're just good songs that any normal person should like.

Are you saying that all rap is about guns and gangsters? Because that's quite naive and ignorant. There was a time when hip hop was positive, and I don't think it really mattered where you lived, you could enjoy it plenty.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Saint Cornelius on April 24, 2007, 04:25:05 PM
Yes, but just because you're white and like rap doesn't make you a wigger. Corny's a big fan and he's certainly no wigger.


hahahahaha, that all depends on who you ask


I dont get why white suburban kids relate to hip hop, the music doesnt even come from their type of environment.


sure it does. get picked on in school, feel better about yourself by pumping "Fuck the Police". and believe me, the type of hip-hop *I* listen to, I can relate to. People Under the Stairs songs usually consist of references to getting drunk, getting stoned and playing videogames. I know what they mean!
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 04:26:25 PM
sure it does. get picked on in school, feel better about yourself by pumping "Fuck the Police". and believe me, the type of hip-hop *I* listen to, I can relate to. People Under the Stairs songs usually consist of references to getting drunk, getting stoned and playing videogames. I know what they mean!

Was he just talking about gangster rap or what?

hahahahaha, that all depends on who you ask

Well, you certainly don't come off as a wigger, just someone who genuinely loves music, because you listen to more than hip hop.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Phoenix Dark on April 24, 2007, 04:29:12 PM
I dont get why white suburban kids relate to hip hop, the music doesnt even come from their type of environment.

It's escapism. The music exposes them to a thought process and culture they'll never see up close - but which captivates their imagination. Think japafags

These types of white kids wind up actually forming their understandings of black cuture off of what they see in the rap culture, and that's definitely not a good thing
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 04:30:56 PM
These types of white kids wind up actually forming their understandings of black cuture off of what they see in the rap culture, and that's definitely not a good thing

It honestly depends. if they listen to solely gangster rap, yeah it's not a good thing, but if they are exposed to all types I think it's great because they're honestly interested in my culture and not being ignorant bigots which kinda makes me smile.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: tiesto on April 24, 2007, 04:31:30 PM
It's a bigger market, of course it had an effect. I wouldn't put all the blame on them though. Last time I checked white kids are supporting real hip hop far more than black kids. Ever seen a Roots/Mos Def/etc concert? Filled with white people.



This is very true - went to a Talib concert last fall in Central Park, the crowd was probably 50% white, 25% asian, 25% black... the afterparty at the Tribeca Cinemas  (it has a bar in the basement, where the party took place), where they played everything from rare groove to funk to underground to classic hip hop was probably the best non-dance-music-oriented club/bar I've ever been to - great crowd, great music, a lack of pretentiousness.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 04:32:19 PM
What's rare groove?
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Saint Cornelius on April 24, 2007, 04:37:55 PM
Funky jazz stuff, basically. The songs that your favorite hip-hoppers sampled.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: tiesto on April 24, 2007, 04:38:23 PM
I dont get why white suburban kids relate to hip hop, the music doesnt even come from their type of environment.

Well, there are quite a number of people who take interest in music abroad... there's quite a few fans of grime and dubstep (Burial  :heartbeat) that exist outside of south London, baille funk fans who don't live in the Rio De Janeiro favelas, non Indian bhangra fans, and other specific culture/location-oriented music. For me, the reason why I like certain hiphop is due to the production, the beats/bass, the lyrical flow... same things I look for in lots of other musical genres. (I don't pay attention to the lyrical content, no matter what type of music it is.)

Crunk started because Lil' Jon liked the house and trance he heard at strip clubs, and wanted to mold those sounds to a hiphop structure, hence the snappy 808 snares and 303s you hear in his productions.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Mupepe on April 24, 2007, 04:42:01 PM
I dont get why white suburban kids relate to hip hop, the music doesnt even come from their type of environment.
to be fair, most black people don't live in that type of environment either.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Saint Cornelius on April 24, 2007, 04:42:59 PM
Crunk started because Lil' Jon liked the house and trance he heard at strip clubs, and wanted to mold those sounds to a hiphop structure, hence the snappy 808 snares and 303s you hear in his productions.


Actually it was the Three-Six Mafia that started "crunk". Lil' Jon may have had some of the earliest successes in that genre, but he didn't invent it.

Speaking of crunk, what do you think of DJ Shadow's latest? Talk about pissing on ones' fanbase.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 04:43:37 PM
Funky jazz stuff, basically. The songs that your favorite hip-hoppers sampled.

Got any suggestions from this genre?
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 04:45:24 PM
Speaking of crunk, what do you think of DJ Shadow's latest? Talk about pissing on ones' fanbase.

I still haven't bothered checking it out since you told me it sucks.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Phoenix Dark on April 24, 2007, 04:46:34 PM
Funky jazz stuff, basically. The songs that your favorite hip-hoppers sampled.

Got any suggestions from this genre?
[youtube=425,350]8f4la3t1Uok[/youtube]

Last song he plays is badass
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Saint Cornelius on April 24, 2007, 04:47:36 PM
Not really. But if you search for "rare groove music blog", you'll get a lot of hits - like this for example (http://cubikmusik.typepad.com/cubikmusik/rare_grooves/index.html)
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Saint Cornelius on April 24, 2007, 04:48:10 PM
I still haven't bothered checking it out since you told me it sucks.


Oh god it does, but I'm not a fan of crunk. If you like that shit, then you'd probably flip.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 04:48:48 PM
I hate crunk. It's not my thing at all.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Phoenix Dark on April 24, 2007, 04:55:55 PM
http://cubikmusik.typepad.com/cubikmusik/files/03_how_high.mp3

omg! That's pretty awesome :bow
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: MrAngryFace on April 24, 2007, 05:02:29 PM
I dunno, I cant find anything to relate to in hip hop.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Phoenix Dark on April 24, 2007, 05:05:58 PM
I dunno, I cant find anything to relate to in hip hop.

You be on dat kryptonite tho
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 05:14:56 PM
I don't see why it's really necessary to relate to anything when dealing with entertainment or art. I mean, rock for example. I don't relate to a lot of the stuff they're singing about, and hell, often times I don't know what they're singing about at all, but I like it anyways.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Saint Cornelius on April 24, 2007, 05:16:23 PM
I dunno, I cant find anything to relate to in hip hop.


Chorus: Let me tell you about the Proto Culture
If you don't know the culture, here's the whole structure
We've had enough of the lackluster-trust us
We get the kind of games you can't rent at Blockbuster
KU: Game related, raise it bit by bit
Yo D, link up the cable we'll go hit for hit
Phantasma plasma particle beam means I have ya
on the run-the rendered effects hot like magnas

Del: I play games by Capcom with a power glove strapped on O
n any platform, I don't spend my dough on Phat Farm
Video games, I got many to play
Before my life expires; fufill my desires

KU: Mastering your hardest boss
Shattering all stars across
Ain't hard to cross the finish line
Floatin' on Daytona
Wex, Gex or Kloana, we get ‘em all at cost
RPG, Platform we transform like Macross

Del: Rival schools, Batsu
Purchase you ought to
It came with one free CD, it's like I bought two
I hope they make part II for Dreamcast
‘Cause games I've seen in mags, you won't believe they have!

KU: Getting callouses turning over asteroids
Graviton bombs destroyed
Getting moms annoyed
Now I'm hacking Nightmare Creatures
Their features splattered across the screen
It gets more clean each year

Del: I remember my homie Ed Coats had the most
A Colecovision-every week I'd visit
Playing Donkey Kong Jr., Venture, Rock and Rope
Games I thought was dope
While my moms was watching soaps

KU: I'm on the next level
I got a double barrel shotgun in the Doomworld
Waiting on the next devil
Armor's low-check the arsenal
Rupture the main conductor playin Disruptor

Del: I remember Ninja Gaiden
Finished finally
With Ramone wouldn't answer the phone
This was before getting blown
I own the first Nintendo Power
With the maps of Zelda Help me conquer in an hour

Chorus: Let me tell you about the Proto Culture
If you don't know the culture, here's the whole structure
We've had enough of the lackluster-trust us
We get the kind of games you can't rent at Blockbuster
(2X)

Del: Hey KU you know my SEGA collection is massive
Got all the past hits and classics
Herzog Zwei now Panzer Zwei
Originality that made me a fan today

KU: It's Pandemonium-it's like Toys R Us
Flippin the next Saturn game brings out the boys in us
It's poisonous
Taking out the boys in blue in Grand Theft Auto,
Snatch a Rolls Royce to use

Del: Yeah, I'll admit Playstation improved
Come visit Feudal Japan with me and Tenchu
Bushido Blade 2 with sword play so accurate
Mega Man Legends but I had to buy a map for it.

KU: I fence Hyo to get a Neo-Geo
For Samurai 64 in full rendered splendor
Rival counter and enter my sword in his innards
My joint was being Leonardo wuppin' on Splinter

Del: I gotta get Xenogears-that's the type of game that relieves my fears
Get it from overseas to here
I gotta get Psychic Force
Authentic arcade that I can endorse
They got me liking imports

KU: I'll need to be at the next E3,
What's the next CD I need to see
Me and D signing checks
Let's float overseas, mingle with game companies
Giving tips to Capcom and Sega-you can't front on these

Del: To anyone who knew me better
Know I chose Saturn first Cause it's 2-D heaven
Bernie Stolar dropped the ball with the RAM cartridge
X-men Vs. Streetfighter could've expanded the market

KU: Marvel Vs. Capcom-beyond fathom
Tell the truth, Playstation ain't ready to have ‘em
Come on I'll bring the onslaught
Alpha and Omega
Khaos Unique brought to you by SEGA.

Chorus: Let me tell you about the Proto culture
If you don't know the culture, here's the whole structure
We've had enough of the lackluster-trust us
We get the kind of games you can't rent at Blockbuster
(2X)
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 05:18:12 PM
:rofl :rofl
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Saint Cornelius on April 24, 2007, 05:19:38 PM
And my favorite line from my man Thes One:

"I said "Thes, yo I'm feelin' all those old jazz loops
can you make me up a track, man I got a little loot"
he said "thanks but don't thank me, thank the forefathers
they deserve the credit, nowadays nobody bothers"
He paused, I said "true", he took a sip of his stew
and said "I'll dig you up a beat like Super Mario 2"

Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: MrAngryFace on April 24, 2007, 05:31:27 PM
I dont like games that much! Its a hobby! Listening to game inspired music makes me groan.

Are there songs about drinking lots of scotch?
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Saint Cornelius on April 24, 2007, 05:36:33 PM
I dont like games that much! Its a hobby! Listening to game inspired music makes me groan.

Are there songs about drinking lots of scotch?


It's actually a really good song! There's not any songs that I know that are SPECIFICALLY about drinking Scotch, but I'm sure MF DOOM has mentioned it quite a few times in his stream-of-consciousness raps.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: bluemax on April 24, 2007, 05:39:09 PM
Del <3

I hope he really is working on a new Deltron album.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Mandark on April 24, 2007, 06:19:21 PM
I dunno, I cant find anything to relate to in hip hop.

I don't think it's about relating so much as wish fulfillment.  Teen boys gravitating towards danger and status symbols and stuff.  Same principle for cowboy-centric country music.


Man, I was going to follow Saint C's post with Candyland by Soul Position, but Google can't find the lyrics and I'm not spending my time transcribing it for a post.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Fresh Prince on April 24, 2007, 06:25:57 PM
Jay-Z is like the Anakin Skywalker of Hip-Hop. He was supposed to be the chosen one but now is the archetype rapper that most modern mainstream rappers follow now. Most rappers often start out trying to sound like Nas or Tupac but when they get signed they begin to become Jay-Z No. 1238739.

Also fuck the jazz loops and trying to bring it back to the mid-90's. I love that shit but man let go, you never going to recreate that era. Hip-Hop should move forward not only in lyrical content but music. What we need is an injection of youth not fucking mid-30 years going on like they are fucking teenagers. There needs to be a culling of Hip Hop artists. The problem is people like Jay-Z, Tupac have made it seem that you can be only one 'type' of rapper to achieve fame and recognition.

South, hyphy have all stagnated because all they are is great forgettable club music. Afrocentric Hip-Hop has stagnated because they repeat the same shit.

Yes most fans are stupid but that's because they only see Hip-Hop as only club and 'angry' music.




Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: MrAngryFace on April 24, 2007, 06:30:15 PM
Mandark: I just wish for peace and quiet and a shotgun and a porch to sit on with my shotgun and a big barrel of booze and a rocking chair and a lawn to scare kids off of.

*ha ha this is a joke, not serious I am not actually threatening people with guns. I dont even own a gun and would never shoot someone unless they broke into my house with a gun but even then maybe I could just wrestle the gun with them and use reason to convince them to leave because I hate violence*

ECHELON IS LISTENING
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Mandark on April 24, 2007, 06:34:06 PM
There's a 50/50 chance you'd like Jolie Holland, I think.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: MrAngryFace on April 24, 2007, 06:35:14 PM
ill itunes preview a song tonight.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: hyp on April 24, 2007, 06:41:12 PM
i'm still hooked on 90s and early '00-'01 independent hiphop.  i can't stand to listen to the newer shit.  i think hiphop died when the underground surfaced.  all the styles and trends got so over-commercialized that you couldn't distinguish underground from mainstream anymore.  even the rhyming sounded the same and a lot of mainstream artists were claiming they were from the "under" for street cred when all they were doing was biting styles.  i've always been anti-commercial hiphop so when some of my favorites like common sense, atban klann (aka black eyed peas), murs and even atomsphere became household names, i dropped them like bad habits.  the music never stays the same once it surfaces.  it's a shame, but i guess they gotta sell out sooner or later or face the reality of being broke the rest of their lives.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Flannel Boy on April 24, 2007, 06:49:07 PM
This was obtained (not by me) using the General Social Survey with a vocabulary test which is highly g-loaded.

Musical taste and Mean IQs--whites
Opera 108.2
Classical 108.2
New Age 107.5
Jazz 107.2
Showtunes 107.0
Blues 106.3
Big Band 105.2
Folk 104.6
Latin 103.3
Oldies 102.3
Contemporary Rock 101.1
Easy Listening 100.2
Reggae 99.7
Heavy Metal 98.5
Bluegrass 98.1
Country 97.1
Gospel 96.0
Rap 93.5
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Beezy on April 24, 2007, 06:54:18 PM
What category would your typical pop music fall under?
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Flannel Boy on April 24, 2007, 06:58:06 PM
What category would your typical pop music fall under?
Is pop even a musical genre? All it means is popular, so you can have pop music which is rock, rap, easy listening, etc.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Beezy on April 24, 2007, 07:00:04 PM
Then shit like Britney Spears, Spice Girls, etc.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Himu on April 24, 2007, 07:13:48 PM
What about Michael Jackson and Blondie?
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Mupepe on April 24, 2007, 07:18:48 PM
What category would your typical pop music fall under?
dunno.

But it would probably rank right above rap on the IQ list because at least no pop fan is deluding himself into thinking that his crappy music is "art".

spoiler (click to show/hide)
lolz
[close]
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Phoenix Dark on April 24, 2007, 07:49:07 PM
This was obtained (not by me) using the General Social Survey with a vocabulary test which is highly g-loaded.

Musical taste and Mean IQs--whites
Opera 108.2
Classical 108.2
New Age 107.5
Jazz 107.2
Showtunes 107.0
Blues 106.3
Big Band 105.2
Folk 104.6
Latin 103.3
Oldies 102.3
Contemporary Rock 101.1
Easy Listening 100.2
Reggae 99.7
Heavy Metal 98.5
Bluegrass 98.1
Country 97.1
Gospel 96.0
Rap 93.5

Where's the inspirational music?
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Phoenix Dark on April 24, 2007, 07:53:49 PM
Also Malek that isn't credible when you consider rap most rap fans are much younger than opera and classical music aficionados
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Saint Cornelius on April 24, 2007, 07:58:45 PM
But it would probably rank right above rap on the IQ list because at least no pop fan is deluding himself into thinking that his crappy music is "art".



*sigh*
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Mupepe on April 24, 2007, 08:02:38 PM
But it would probably rank right above rap on the IQ list because at least no pop fan is deluding himself into thinking that his crappy music is "art".



*sigh*
you didn't notice the "lol" in spoilers?  I'm a rap fan :btw if you haven't noticed me chime in in most rap threads.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Saint Cornelius on April 24, 2007, 08:04:13 PM
This was obtained (not by me) using the General Social Survey with a vocabulary test which is highly g-loaded.

Musical taste and Mean IQs--whites
Opera 108.2
Classical 108.2
New Age 107.5
Jazz 107.2
Showtunes 107.0
Blues 106.3
Big Band 105.2
Folk 104.6
Latin 103.3
Oldies 102.3
Contemporary Rock 101.1
Easy Listening 100.2
Reggae 99.7
Heavy Metal 98.5
Bluegrass 98.1
Country 97.1
Gospel 96.0
Rap 93.5


Harumph.

you didn't notice the "lol" in spoilers?  I'm a rap fan :btw if you haven't noticed me chime in in most rap threads.

Harumph x2.
Title: Re: Who killed Hip Hop?
Post by: Flannel Boy on April 24, 2007, 10:34:41 PM
Also Malek that isn't credible when you consider rap most rap fans are much younger than opera and classical music aficionados
The vast majority of respondents are over the age of 19 (97 or 98%). Most of those under 19 are over 15 (when age no longer factors in determining IQ scores).