THE BORE

General => The Superdeep Borehole => Topic started by: Tasty on January 01, 2019, 02:12:33 PM

Title: Learning Music OT
Post by: Tasty on January 01, 2019, 02:12:33 PM
Edit- New title! Thread is now about discussing anything to do with music theory or learning an instrument (regardless of skill level .) :) Conversations about classical music and its history may also randomly pop up.



2019 marks the thirteenth year since I became seriously interested in learning how to play the piano. In fact sometimes it seems like I never STFU about it (http://www.thebore.com/forum/index.php?topic=46033.msg2543121#msg2543121), so I'm gonna keep it to this thread now.

The dream will be deferred no longer.

I'll be posting my progress at least weekly ITT over the next year, and intend to make a new version each year. I'm committed to developing this skill for the remainder of my lifetime.

I have some goals of increasing difficulty that I'm working towards, but I'm making my regimen extremely malleable so I can find what really works for me. Because of that I'm trying not to post specifics, other than that I intend to practice daily. That's the most consistent advice, I've found -- be consistent.

Here's the resources I'm using:
I started learning for real on December 10th. My progress so far:

spoiler (click to show/hide)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TgtEwmK2_1Q

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YR0V1QbtF5M

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJa_clN6f6U
[close]

I fully believe involving friends or rivals in the practice or exercise of anything is extremely beneficial, so I'm hoping there's others here who will be posting progress too. :) Let's get musical.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Valkyrie on January 01, 2019, 02:14:23 PM
You have nice hands.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Tasty on January 01, 2019, 02:19:23 PM
You have nice hands.

:-[ Thanks. :)
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Nintex on January 01, 2019, 02:40:30 PM
Good luck :rimshot
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Himu on January 01, 2019, 03:11:39 PM
I’d like to learn piano eventually. My passion is guitar though. I want a classical guitar this year after learning basics of electric and learn Spanish guitar music.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Trent Dole on January 01, 2019, 04:03:29 PM
Oh yeah, this is something I've needed to get back on for a while.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on January 01, 2019, 04:13:15 PM
Last year I spent most of it getting a set of recital pieces ready. I don't know what I want to do this year.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Transhuman on January 01, 2019, 04:38:33 PM
https://youtu.be/pvJ1NZsmA9I

Just play the Ryan Adams version.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Himu on January 01, 2019, 05:00:04 PM
How hard is piano?
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Himu on January 01, 2019, 05:02:22 PM
I’m also surprised how the music knowledge came back to me after not using it for over a dozen years when I got my electric last year.

I forgot how much I had missed playing music. My goal is to get into a band or something eventually. Music is more fun with other people. I’m still a band nerd at heart it appears.

I thought I’d lost all of my music knowledge but apparently playing music every day for 6-8 years doesn’t go away over night. Very reassuring.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: headwalk on January 01, 2019, 05:31:56 PM
i hate the sound that most modern guitar virtuosos go for.  too compressed, too precise, too autistic.

randy and slash were sloppy as and it only added to their pantie wetting pelvis splitting appeal.

shred chads rise up.


Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Himu on January 01, 2019, 05:37:43 PM
What modern guitar virtuosos?

You’re talking electric?
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Transhuman on January 01, 2019, 06:53:51 PM
As much as I love music, at 27 I think the ship has sailed for me to learn piano or guitar.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Rufus on January 01, 2019, 06:57:29 PM
You can always learn, so long as you take the time to practice. If you can't, though, then don't bother.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Himu on January 01, 2019, 07:12:09 PM
^
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Transhuman on January 01, 2019, 07:40:09 PM
If I can type on a computer keyboard playing piano is probably super easy
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Tasty on January 01, 2019, 07:46:50 PM
As much as I love music, at 27 I think the ship has sailed for me to learn piano or guitar.

I'm 27 and starting from scratch.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Transhuman on January 01, 2019, 07:58:42 PM
What song do you want me to provide vocals for?
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Himu on January 01, 2019, 08:01:10 PM
What are notes and scales like on piano? On guitar I learned my notes first and it went something like this.

E through G then A through D.

Every note has a sharp except E, A, and B and B has a flat.

Once you remember it starts with E, goes alphabetical, and then starts with A, it's easy to keep in your head:

E - F - F# - G - G# - A - B - Bb - C - C# - D - D#

What is piano like? It seems like a super intimidating instrument.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: shosta on January 01, 2019, 08:09:12 PM
Every key is a halfstep. The white keys are the regular notes, the blacks are the sharps and flats. Harder to memorize scales because you can't rely on translating the gap between your finger. Of course, it's impossible to play the wrong note.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Snoopycat_ on January 01, 2019, 08:50:44 PM
This nice lady has some really good piano tutorials. I learned the Star Wars theme tune and decided that was all I really needed to know.

https://www.youtube.com/user/theonlinepianotutor/featured (https://www.youtube.com/user/theonlinepianotutor/featured)
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Tasty on January 01, 2019, 08:54:59 PM
What song do you want me to provide vocals for?

Ordinary Day - Vanessa Carlton
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Transhuman on January 01, 2019, 08:59:38 PM
https://youtu.be/nP3Mym9_yvY
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Tasty on January 02, 2019, 01:41:22 AM
Daily Status: 2019-01-01

- Completed Section #1 of Beginner Piano on Udemy (https://www.udemy.com/beginner-piano/) by finishing Lectures #9-13. There's twelve Sections overall, with eighty-nine Lectures in total.
- Due to the above I can now play "Imagine" by John Lennon at full speed for two minutes with both hands. :) (Sorry TVC!)
- Didn't read much of Music Theory for Dummies today but I have a semi-road trip tomorrow that would be the perfect situation for reading.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 02, 2019, 04:17:58 AM
Every key is a halfstep. The white keys are the regular notes, the blacks are the sharps and flats. Harder to memorize scales because you can't rely on translating the gap between your finger. Of course, it's impossible to play the wrong note.

Breh, all white keys are a Cmaj scale. "iT hArD tO lEaRn ScAlEs"  ::)
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on January 02, 2019, 01:12:12 PM
There's this joke that I can only play Wonderwall, but I'm pretty decently legit at guitar. In 2019 my goal is to become a real master.
"real master"

 :foodcourt

Some of the best professional guitarists I know barely consider themselves masters. If at all.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Himu on January 02, 2019, 01:45:21 PM
Yeah I'm surprised at Glen. Usually when you do an art or hobby the better you get the more you realize you still have a long way to go and that your skill will never actually be satiated. Even when you're good at it. Doesn't matter if it's music, martial arts, sports, fighting games, or drawing. I'm sorry Glen, but because you think you'll become a real master it truly shows how far you have left to go.  :'(
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: shosta on January 02, 2019, 04:02:16 PM
Breh, all white keys are a Cmaj scale. "iT hArD tO lEaRn ScAlEs"  ::)
I meant all the ones besides Cmaj and Amin! :bolo

spoiler (click to show/hide)
AGRAJAAAAAAAAG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[close]
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 02, 2019, 04:05:15 PM
just don't learn any songs that aren't in Cmaj, problem solved
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: shosta on January 02, 2019, 04:10:45 PM
Like musical modes in medieval times :ohhh
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Himu on January 02, 2019, 05:11:21 PM
Hmmph. Took Shosta off ignore because of this thread.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: shosta on January 02, 2019, 05:17:59 PM
Thanks, babe!
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on January 02, 2019, 06:09:14 PM
lol I know MAYBE 6-8 virtuosos on the guitar. The rest just gotta
(http://media.giphy.com/media/inVvfuomoD31K/giphy.gif)
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 02, 2019, 06:31:56 PM
self-proclaimed virtuosos

 :neogaf
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on January 02, 2019, 06:38:36 PM
(http://i0.wp.com/www.lauriehaller.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/04/Screenshot-2017-04-24-14.40.18.png)
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 02, 2019, 06:47:49 PM
uh Glen I can do all that, and I hardly consider myself one millionth of a virtuoso. Once you learn every scale and every mode in every position all over the fretboard, you realize that it's just scratching the surface of the iceberg. Like congrats, you just learned the alphabet. That's like the bare minimum base for a classically trained musician. (I'm not classically trained, just self taught schumck like most everyone that's not puppy, and I took jazz guitar lessons for a few months years ago).

Anyway, in the spirit of positivity, I wish you luck on your musical journey (you will probably respond by telling me to choke on some horse semen or something). I'm sure you are a decent player and have capacity for greatness in you. I myself have made great strides in the past year in terms of theory knowledge and technique, hoping to keep the same energy in 2019.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 02, 2019, 06:58:46 PM
I have never heard Glen play and thus do not feel comfortable granting him higher accolades. We don't even know what skill level his Wonderwall cover is at.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Himu on January 02, 2019, 07:13:53 PM
This is going to be a nitpick but as a black guitarist it pisses me that almost all the guitarists (which are mostly white) they only really consider guitar music to be rock and blues. Maybe country depending on the guitarist. Meanwhile they don’t touch stuff like disco or funk or r&b and when you talk about playing funk they’re just like,”to play funk all you need to do is play 1 and 4 position on a strat” when anyone who knows funk knows barely (it any) funk guitarists played strat. They worship and concentrate sooooo much on their blues and rock that most don’t know jack shit about the aforementioned genres and black guitarists are a dime in a dozen. So when they talk about guitar they really usually just mean one or two genres.

Basically, it pisses me off that in guitar circles no one knows Jimmy Nolen and it can be a lonely experience if you’re interested in more than blues or rock. I’ve had to resort to listening to my funk records and trying to copy them rather than try to find an actual teacher to help me with the funk.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 02, 2019, 07:15:57 PM
No, I didn't say I am a great sight reader, but that wasn't in your post that I quoted. That's a whole different skillset that I am not proficient in, and truthfully have no interest, as I have no desire to do any kind of gigs in a professional capacity. Too old for that and too late in the game. If you think you'll be able to do that in a year's time, more power to you.

My focus is to improve my improvisational skill. If I can comfortably improvise over Coltraine changes in my lifetime, I will feel accomplished.

And my post was plenty positive, asswipe.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 02, 2019, 07:18:08 PM
You ain't shit until you're playing gypsy jazz Django Reinhardt pieces in your sleep, tbh

I jerk off to Joscho Stephan videos, son.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Himu on January 02, 2019, 07:20:37 PM
Also it pisses me off how they romanticize Jimi as just a bluesman and never look to the r&b he played on the Chitlin Cirquit (speaking of chitlins, my dad made some yesterday and grossssss). As if r&b isn’t worthy of playing but for some reason blues is when Jimi mastered both.

It also pisses me off that Jimi is considered “white music” still 50 years after the fact and not a single black station can play some Hendrix still. I heard this location black station play Cream - CREAM - and yet still hasn’t played Hendrix.

Basically the guitar music world annoys me for many reasons and talking about guitar with other guitarists is an aggravating experience.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 02, 2019, 07:21:56 PM
basically, everything pisses you off. You and Jack should get married.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Himu on January 02, 2019, 07:25:30 PM
Agrajag stays on ignore. I haven’t read a single thing what he said but and Stro keep posting and I see constant “this user is on ignore” posts. I bet they’re all shit. Please do us all a favor and die already - both of you.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 02, 2019, 07:28:07 PM
"I haven't read a thing he said"

Sure, Jan.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: shosta on January 02, 2019, 07:40:37 PM
Leave this loser on ignore. None of these posts are worth reading!
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on January 02, 2019, 07:42:56 PM
Back to it. Last year I spent some time getting a few pieces from Tedesco's Platero y Yo ready for performance. I got the guitar parts down and hoping I could then do the narration myself. But first few attempts it's seeming like something that I can't really do. The guitar takes too much focus to give the narration the attention it requires. I'd like to think about getting a narrator to do it with me. But in its entirety it's a massive piece both on guitar and narration parts. It's too much for me to ask for someone to do with me. It's because of these challenges that make it hard to find a good set of recordings. I was introduced to the piece by my Grandteacher (My teacher's teacher) who did a wonderful performance with the head of the drama department of the university he taught at, and I fell in love with it. I guess performing the piece will have to stay a dream. (Here's a sample of some of the pieces I worked on)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GTDfTrwnEYU&index=13&list=OLAK5uy_nW_I0qu7Hs5_mE4YHFMFGTvAlwxJjUmH4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMHqDUgKIR8&list=OLAK5uy_nW_I0qu7Hs5_mE4YHFMFGTvAlwxJjUmH4&index=7
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02cIOGs8jDU

For me, this year I'm eyeing these pieces as the main pieces of the year. One is somewhat modern and I find I have to explain it to people for them to thoroughly enjoy it. The other is readily palatable, not anything groundbreaking, but fun and easy to enjoy

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MOINvJPgIvg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HI3DHXzpzw0

I've got the manuscripts and I've been looking at them, and realistically I don't really have the time to do both or other serious pieces (though I always keep about 6-8 pieces in rotation at any time). Having a hard time selecting which one. The Rodrigo piece will take me about 2 months before it starts to sound like something. The Guiliani piece already sounds like something but to take it at the tempo I want it'll take months. Certainly the Guiliani piece would be easier for the wife/kids as even slow it's nice. But that Rodrigo piece. :checkit
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 02, 2019, 07:44:48 PM
mad respect ronito, classical guitar is something I'd never be able to do in a million years
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Himu on January 02, 2019, 07:45:51 PM
Puppy any tips for classical guitar? It’s my goal to get one this year and learn some classical.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on January 02, 2019, 08:22:19 PM
Puppy any tips for classical guitar? It’s my goal to get one this year and learn some classical.
4 things and they're contradictory, but that's what it is

:trumps

1) Skip the serious guitar school books like Parkening, Sagregas, Schearer or heaven forbid, what I learned from the Pujol Guitar school (hundreds of pages across multi-volume crap that would put the most boring person to sleep). If you already know your away around, don't waste the time. My friend Scott wrote an excellent book that covers methodology well enough without getting too serious
https://www.amazon.com/Pumping-Nylon-Classical-Guitarists-Technique/dp/1470631385

In essence: Don't get caught up in technique and it doesn't have to be a slog to learn. Also keep in mind that there's no one way to classical guitar proficiency.

2) While I'm telling you to not get too serious about the method, you have to be serious about what you intend to play. You can't get into a piece without planning. This is classical music, you can't "wing it". For example, here's a pic of my first day at a bach fugue (notice, I only did one page, I didn't touch the second page until my planning for the first page was done).
(https://i.imgur.com/nKOkqiy.jpg)

And that's day 1. By the time it's "Performance ready" It's much much worse. Also, keep in mind you gotta start SLOW. A piece when I start it sounds like nothing. I usually start playing at about at 5th or slower speed and then work up.  Don't go into a piece thinking you can just play it.

3) Start small. Everyone wants to get to Bach and Albeniz and the cool stuff. Cool your heels. Find some easy pieces you like and get those 100% right before moving to other stuff

4) I just said there's no one way to guitar proficiency, BUT if you can do these sets of studies/etudes a performance grade you're ready for almost anything. My professor insisted I be able to do all these before I could move to a non-etude piece. It was a painful 18 month slog, but after I could do all these I was ready for anything. They're listed in the order I'd approach it in.  Now I wouldn't suggest you go full bear like my teacher and not play anything else til these are done. But I'd suggest always have a few of these in your practicing.

Guliani's 120 Arpeggios
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=srOhzfFuIO0&list=PL3qRaKhDtIvRRgoEVZVqaFu6xFjBUNrIo

Brouwer's 12 simple Etude's
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TuzyUiHB2FM&list=PLETJzegkWdsGVJex5G90Paw0CbW03EiE8

Sor's 24 Etudes (The Segovian Selections)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDXoejCGMHg&list=PL849B469AB01C7FF7

Villa-Lobo's 12 Etudes
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JP8R7JBu_UM&list=RDJP8R7JBu_UM&start_radio=1

Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on January 02, 2019, 08:25:06 PM
I’ll do the narration for you.
Combine your crazy schedule with mine? Dude, we'll be ready in 2022. LOL.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 02, 2019, 08:25:45 PM
I'm gonna try to work on learning some Wolfhart studies. A guitar player I really admire recommended those.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Himu on January 02, 2019, 09:05:49 PM
Thanks Puppy. I have learned a few arpeggios. I can get started on this on my tele right?
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 02, 2019, 09:23:03 PM
in the new year Agrajag is going to tune out all the negativity. When Jack goes low, I am going high!

So, Tasty, in this giving spirit, I will recommend you one of my favorite Youtubers. You may not necessarily learn much from her videos, as they're not really instructional in nature, but as a lover of piano/music I think you will enjoy it a lot.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oOA04Kat-7c&list=PL0UfT1ar7nMejZ-0QHuMWPq3CFld0aCGD
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Himu on January 02, 2019, 09:44:01 PM
Puppy, does learning classical guitar also help with proficiency in other genres? Like for instance, Jazz? Or even metal?
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Tasty on January 02, 2019, 09:53:27 PM
Wow, this thread kinda exploded. Glad to see so much interest. :)

I'm trying to gear my brain as much as possible for the long haul (30+ years), though I'm setting achievable goals for the next year (and some rough ideas for the next five years.) Keeping up with it consistently is going to be extremely difficult.

Mostly, I just want to express myself through music, and play covers of my favorite songs. I'm not really that musical by nature and composition isn't in my blood, but I'm hoping once I get a solid backing in music theory it'll become more science than pure art -- and thus I'll be able to wrap my head around creating melodies and eventually songs.

But in any case I'm not expecting to compose much until a few years down the line at least. In addition to the odd modern song cover I learn, I also intend to get a grip on the classics. If anyone has some good intro classical pieces my ears are open. :D
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 02, 2019, 10:01:26 PM
Yeah Tasty, it's best to set smaller, achievable goals for yourself and just keep it moving.

Myself, hopefully if the cash flow allows it, I want to buy some new equipment this year. I am looking at Solar guitars, which is a newer brand that is high quality, but very affordable. Additionally a new laptop and a good interface, maybe a cheap mixer and some software, so I could start recording some stuff. The software has a learning curve in itself, and I will need to start learning how to program drum loops. Bass I pretty much can play, but that's another investment. In addition, I am going to be extremely busy with work in the second half of the year, so we'll see. Baby steps.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Himu on January 02, 2019, 10:25:08 PM
I know it can be a slog, but I highly suggest not getting too carried away with yourself too fast too soon, Tasty. Keep it small. The most fundamental parts of music learning are things that are actually the most boring such as scales. "I'm not that musical by nature and composition isn't in my blood." You're just learning the basics and you're too early in the game to be worrying about that. Worry about mastering your scales till they're tip top shape and working on execution. :) Have fun with it.

I'm not familiar with piano as I haven't learned to play it but some pretty famous classical piano songs that are commonly embraced by teachers in my experience are things like:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_mVW8tgGY_w

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XXIu0MRuIQU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S-Xm7s9eGxU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nT7_IZPHHb0

These are common beginner piano songs that you hear any beginner pianist learning.

These are all songs that are ingrained in the societal culture footprint so you should know how they go as a 27 year old, which will only help learning them faster.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Himu on January 02, 2019, 10:31:35 PM
Also, I have no idea if piano has uhhhh like finger numbers or something. For trombone, when I first learned it in 6th grade, we often learned by position. Say, position 4, or position 7. So position 1 is F on trombone. Rather than knowing notes I'd know the positions. In the end, this limits your ability as a player and when I would compete and get training from my private teacher, it would make things harder to learn. When learning saxophone and later, guitar, I avoided learning by lazy short hands. On sax it's pretty damn hard to do, but on guitar it's popular to use tabs or say "1st string or 5th string" rather than know the exact note. Learn your notes and if it uses a short hand thing that allows some finger chart or whatever, give it the finger and throw it in the trash because it is trash. Learn the notes and learn to read your music. Don't bother with any "easy" fingering. It's always a waste of time and a detriment any long-term music ability.

My opinion of course.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Tasty on January 02, 2019, 10:38:52 PM
Good vids Queen, will add them to my WL list.

My early goals are really simple and mostly involve just sticking with and completing (as in, playing as the teacher intends) my five Udemy courses and finishing some ebooks. As a bonus / for fun I go on Flowkey to practice covers I'm interested in.

In a month or two I intend to get a real IRL teacher who will be able to guide my through that phase of my learning better, but for now I'm content with learning non-interactively and memorizing some recognizable pop songs to somewhat-impress family (even if it's babby level and half speed, haha.)

No, I didn't say I am a great sight reader, but that wasn't in your post that I quoted. That's a whole different skillset that I am not proficient in, and truthfully have no interest, as I have no desire to do any kind of gigs in a professional capacity. Too old for that and too late in the game. If you think you'll be able to do that in a year's time, more power to you.

I will say, the prospect of being able to easily read and understand sheet music is 20-35% of my motivation for learning piano. Usually with something I don't understand, I can wrap my brain around it, but even since I was a kid sheet music through my soft, rhythmless mind for a loop.

The Music Theory for Dummies book has been super-helpful at getting the basics across and I'm pretty happy with how my sight reading is developing (barely nonexistent for now, but has a promising future.)
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 02, 2019, 10:43:25 PM
I learned to sight read a long time ago, but didn't keep practicing it, so it's a chore now. Scratch that, it was always a chore for me, my guitar teacher would only write things out in standard notation, and it always felt like boring homework to me. I would end up cheating and memorize the lines, so he would think I am reading the music, but I would be playing it by memory or by ear. He was probably very frustrated with me.

Knowing how to read is incredibly helpful if you are trying to learn piano pieces, so keep doing your thing man.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Tasty on January 02, 2019, 11:51:49 PM
Daily Status: 2019-01-02

- Completed Section #2 of Beginner Piano on Udemy, bringing me to 22% completion for the course.
- Learned how to find any key (A-G) on the piano using some brain tricks. I can name any key now! :)
- Practiced the right hand intro to "Auld Lang Syne" on Flowkey (beginner level.)
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 03, 2019, 12:03:57 PM
Gmaj/Em had always been my rut on guitar
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: shosta on January 03, 2019, 12:14:08 PM
Daily Status: 2019-01-02

- Completed Section #2 of Beginner Piano on Udemy, bringing me to 22% completion for the course.
- Learned how to find any key (A-G) on the piano using some brain tricks. I can name any key now! :)
- Practiced the right hand intro to "Auld Lang Syne" on Flowkey (beginner level.)
nice. Pretty soon you'll be playing this

https://youtu.be/0mq5_UGpNlM
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 03, 2019, 12:24:33 PM
I want Andy to serenade us with some saccharine Schoenberg ballads.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: shosta on January 03, 2019, 12:40:30 PM
Learning how to play a piano means you'll be able to play a keyboard and vice versa, maybe minus some pedals.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 03, 2019, 12:40:55 PM
one is an acoustic instrument, the other electronic.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on January 03, 2019, 01:29:51 PM
Puppy, does learning classical guitar also help with proficiency in other genres? Like for instance, Jazz? Or even metal?
Certainly the Guiliani 120 would be perfect on a tele or good for any guitar. The Brouwer 12 should work there too. But once you get to the latter numbers of the Sor 24 you'll likely run out of room to do all the work necessary. I wouldn't try the Villa Lobos 12 at all (though a few Etudes, like #1 do go well on an electric)

As to classical  guitar helping with other kinds of playing. Well, yeah, it helps, just in the way playing different kinds of styles help expand your knowledge. Randi Rhodes was known to be a huge fan of the Villa Lobos 12 Etudes and used some of them as warm up pieces.

I will say though that there's a difference. As you can see, classical guitar is all about dissection and building ways in and out of positions. It's almost a scholarly pursuit. Whereas other styles, especially Jazz, are almost diametrically opposed (less dissection and more flowing). For these kinds I'd say look at what Glen was talking about shifting scales and all that. If you can do that you're better off than teaching yourself classical guitar to get better at Jazz guitar.

Classical guitar is about taking something someone else made, playing by their rules and making it your own. Jazz is about creating your own thing. Different paradigm. Requires different skills.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on January 03, 2019, 01:37:07 PM
Daily Status: 2019-01-02

- Completed Section #2 of Beginner Piano on Udemy, bringing me to 22% completion for the course.
- Learned how to find any key (A-G) on the piano using some brain tricks. I can name any key now! :)
- Practiced the right hand intro to "Auld Lang Syne" on Flowkey (beginner level.)

Tasty, I love your gusto here. But a possible word of caution, as you get better and move farther the progress you make will not be able to be measured daily. Or if you did it'll get really depressing. There's been times where I've spent a week working on 4 measures.  It can be really depressing. I used to report status weekly so I'd have more to show. I just wanted to point out not to get discouraged when you get to that point where you spend days on one thing. It doesn't mean you're stalled or crap. It's a different kind of progress.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on January 03, 2019, 02:57:36 PM
As for my daily status, I'll be using this as my sight reading practice today.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rM7SHZ-gckQ

It's a nice piece, never played it.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Tasty on January 03, 2019, 04:53:27 PM
Daily Status: 2019-01-02

- Completed Section #2 of Beginner Piano on Udemy, bringing me to 22% completion for the course.
- Learned how to find any key (A-G) on the piano using some brain tricks. I can name any key now! :)
- Practiced the right hand intro to "Auld Lang Syne" on Flowkey (beginner level.)

Tasty, I love your gusto here. But a possible word of caution, as you get better and move farther the progress you make will not be able to be measured daily. Or if you did it'll get really depressing. There's been times where I've spent a week working on 4 measures.  It can be really depressing. I used to report status weekly so I'd have more to show. I just wanted to point out not to get discouraged when you get to that point where you spend days on one thing. It doesn't mean you're stalled or crap. It's a different kind of progress.

Ya I know, in the OP I mentioned weekly updates for the year. I just feel like doing daily right now while I'm hyped up. :P

I am concerned about what'll happen when I hit my first wall (or couple walls.) It's been really smooth sailing so far but I'm basically covering the same ground a new third-grade student would. Sticking with it and practicing a section every day is tough, but much more so when you end the session no better than when you started. It concerns me how it'd probably only take a day or two of that to derail my interest slightly (which always has the danger of becoming more than that.) I suppose in that specific instance I could try a different section or song, but there's other "mental" walls I'm sure I'll hit once I get into intermediate music theory too. There's a number of things I'm expecting to potentially trip me up.

So it's something I have my eye on for sure. My hope with this thread is that the social pressure will keep me at the keyboard every day. :)

I also signed up for Habitica (https://habitica.com/), an honestly pretty-lame habit tracking RPG thing. I've been using a pretty barebones tracker for the past two years to moderate success, but I wanted something cloud-based and more social. If anyone here is on the site, PM me and I'll add you ("Parties" and "Group Quests" are things on Habitica.)
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Tasty on January 04, 2019, 01:46:36 AM
Daily Status: 2019-01-03

- Read 30 pages of Music Theory for Dummies. :o Just kept devouring the pages while bored this afternoon. About 1/3rd done with the book now.
- Memorized the first half of the right hand part to "Auld Lang Syne" (see spoiler.) Second half and left hand this weekend. Really happy with my progress today. :)

spoiler (click to show/hide)
https://youtu.be/_bQSfi86G50
[close]
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 05, 2019, 12:18:44 AM
Tasty, is it cool to use your thread as a catch-all for musical thoughts? I'm a philosopher.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Tasty on January 05, 2019, 01:00:07 PM
Tasty, is it cool to use your thread as a catch-all for musical thoughts? I'm a philosopher.

Absolutely!
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Tasty on January 05, 2019, 08:11:55 PM
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Music_and_mathematics

My music theory book has touched on a lot of this so far and it's kind of blowing my mind.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Trent Dole on January 06, 2019, 01:14:11 AM
I've seen it said that music theory is 'just numbers'. :-*
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 06, 2019, 06:59:29 PM
I've been messing around with this looper pedal I bought a couple of weeks ago. Man, what a great tool for testing out musical ideas.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Tasty on January 06, 2019, 07:01:54 PM
Made a deal with myself to upgrade from my 61-key non-weighted Casio to the 88-key *fully-weighted Yamaha P45/P71 at the end of the month... if I keep up with my practicing and meet the goals I set out at the start of the month.

Wish me luck. 😬
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 06, 2019, 07:18:29 PM
good luck!
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: shosta on January 06, 2019, 08:26:10 PM
jagrabag, you should post some of your stuff
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 06, 2019, 08:42:06 PM
I've been messing around with this looper pedal I bought a couple of weeks ago. Man, what a great tool for testing out musical ideas.

What pedal is it?

NUX LOOP CORE. It works ok, but doesn't seem to work with distortion. I am still figuring it our, probably need to check out some demo videos.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 06, 2019, 08:43:00 PM
jagrabag, you should post some of your stuff

I don't have anything recorded nor do I have the equipment for that. This year I plan on getting that fixed.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Tasty on January 06, 2019, 08:44:31 PM
Get fully weighted man.

That's more Demi's thing than mine
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Tasty on January 07, 2019, 12:31:08 AM
👀

spoiler (click to show/hide)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=no94UO1YHBw

I'm an emo boy shutup :maf :-[

spoiler (click to show/hide)
This is sooooooo much fun. I'm even having a lot of fun just trying to do sheet music without any other visual aides. I need to start using a metronome tho, my timing's pretty fucked up.

I'n not 10% satisfied with my current playing of this btw, and I still have the other half to learn too.
[close]
[close]
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: Tasty on January 07, 2019, 01:46:58 AM
Get fully weighted man.

Also I was incorrect -- the Yamaha P45/P71 is fully-weighted. :D

I'm gonna get the bundle, too (consists of the stand, bench, pedal, and headphones.)
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 10, 2019, 07:21:58 AM
The Russians' contributions to musical arts are substantial and will not be questioned.

https://youtu.be/tr-j0h7MPF4
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on January 10, 2019, 09:41:51 AM
Rimsky Korsakov is seriously underrated. I always say the best neo-classical Spanish composer was Russian because of him.
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 10, 2019, 09:51:04 AM
Rimsky Korsakov is seriously underrated. I always say the best neo-classical Spanish composer was Russian because of him.

the flight of the bumblebee is the only work of his I am familiar with (although I could have heard more of his stuff and just don't know the titles/that they were his compositions). Any particular works you like?
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: recursivelyenumerable on January 10, 2019, 11:18:14 AM
You've probably heard parts of Scheherezade ...
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: agrajag on January 10, 2019, 11:23:08 AM
oh yeah, for sure
Title: Re: Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on January 10, 2019, 11:27:07 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lh6mDL-VwYw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rXR0tloMmoo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGzBWPLxF0w
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on January 10, 2019, 01:15:40 PM
New thread title. :)
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: agrajag on January 10, 2019, 04:33:14 PM
ostinato?
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: agrajag on January 10, 2019, 04:44:12 PM
well, ostinato is a more general term for a repeating pattern, maybe there is a more specific term for what you're thinking of
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on January 10, 2019, 04:45:43 PM
I've always wondered, is there a term for a rythmn or bassline that is more or less constant through a song, even though everything else changes for the chorus?

Examples being,

The bassline in Bodies

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-_Q8znGMRg

The rhythm in Everlong

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBG7P-K-r1Y
Boy, am I going to blow your mind right now

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVoFLM_BDgs
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on January 10, 2019, 04:53:39 PM
I'm not listening to 13 minutes of organ music, trying to figure out what's supposed to blow my mind.
Your loss. Stay dumb. :trumps
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on January 10, 2019, 07:18:31 PM
My music theory professor, who had his doctorate in Music theory always quoted Debussy saying "There is no theory. Music cannot be learned."

That confusing asshole!
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: agrajag on January 10, 2019, 07:38:28 PM
My music theory professor, who had his doctorate in Music theory always quoted Debussy saying "There is no theory. Music cannot be learned."

That confusing asshole!

so his entire career was a sham then?
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on January 10, 2019, 10:47:52 PM
Today marks one month since I started learning piano! (Dec. 10) 🎹

Might have a vid of my progress tonight or tomorrow. Today also marked the first time I learned a ""completed"" song, but I'm not quite at speed on the last couple measures yet.

Spent like three hours today practicing lol. I've missed two days in January so far but I've made up for it on the following days.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on January 10, 2019, 10:55:25 PM
That's awesome tasty! I'm really proud and envious.


But, there's no such thing as make up practice. It doesn't work that way. Still, way to go!
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on January 10, 2019, 11:02:57 PM
Yeah it's really frustrating. :lol Those three hours were basically half hour chunks throughout the day, I've noticed my playing gets a LOT worse after the 30 min mark haha.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on January 10, 2019, 11:20:58 PM
Actually -- misread your post. I agree! There are no makeup days really. That said, when you're traveling cross-state without your keyboard, sometimes you have to just accept an off day. (I mean mostly practice-wise; on those days I still tore into my music theory book.)
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on January 10, 2019, 11:47:20 PM
Fun fact: Rachmaninoff wrote his second piano concerto but hadn't learned it and his agent booked him to debut it 3 weeks later in New York.
Which means he had to learn it solely using a practice keyboard while taking a ship from Europe to New York. He arrived 2 days before the concert. This makes listening to it that much more impressive. When he debuted it he had only played it on an actual piano a handful of times.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJpJ8REjvqo
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: agrajag on January 11, 2019, 05:57:53 AM
iirc Berlioz was the first major composer who didn't play an instrument, or could not play his own pieces at any rate.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on January 11, 2019, 10:21:19 AM
iirc Berlioz was the first major composer who didn't play an instrument, or could not play his own pieces at any rate.
He could play guitar. But he was apparently not very good at it.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: agrajag on January 11, 2019, 10:31:00 AM
sounds like a guitar player
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on January 11, 2019, 10:36:27 AM
(http://media.giphy.com/media/oOX5qIDkzDjeo/giphy.gif)
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: agrajag on January 11, 2019, 02:00:40 PM
another favorite of mine I want to share.

https://youtu.be/lD66s4m8wIw

he has so much knowledge and so engaging, even people that don't know a lick (har) about music watch his videos.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: agrajag on January 13, 2019, 02:15:11 AM
I love old timey instruments with nylon (or better yet gut) strinfs. Classical guitars, lutes, harpsichords, they instantly transport you go a long gone era.

 :lawd

https://youtu.be/eVabz8LneI4
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on January 14, 2019, 10:36:35 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0efFv2zHVIM

It seems like I suck 10% more when the camera's on, but that's just one more skill to learn. :idont

My first "complete" song at full speed. :D You can really tell the differences compared to the vid a week ago. I'm really happy with my progress so far. :heart
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on January 14, 2019, 11:16:02 AM
Also been listening to chunks of this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V4YSysUn-Bk

Puts the fear of God into me like little else has.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: agrajag on January 14, 2019, 12:22:53 PM
well Scriabin did try to initiate the apocalypse and raise the old ones with his music..
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on January 14, 2019, 01:17:19 PM
I love old timey instruments with nylon (or better yet gut) strinfs. Classical guitars, lutes, harpsichords, they instantly transport you go a long gone era.

 :lawd

https://youtu.be/eVabz8LneI4
True story. When I was in college I was approached by the early music ensemble because they needed a lute player and they were asking me to help them. I said OK, and they gave me a lute to use and some tablature. I had to learn to teach myself to learn lute tab (no small feat) and I honestly rather enjoyed it. Not as much as the guitar, but it was a nice diversion. Anyhoo, we play a bunch of concerts and all that then one day I get a letter from the Utah Shakespearean festival offering me a job to come and dress up like a minstrel and play the lute for people at the festival. 

Right after that I put down the lute and never picked it up again. If the end game is becoming a professional m'lady-er I didn't want to spend more time on it.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: agrajag on January 14, 2019, 04:18:51 PM
yeah, next thing you know you're an alcoholic living in the trailer behind the renaissance festival
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Snoopycat_ on January 14, 2019, 08:21:14 PM
I once dated this girl who was in an "experimental" band which made her seem all cool and mysterious. One night I went to see her and her band playing a gig in a half empty pub. It turned out it was just her and 3 Yokos hitting things with spoons. I had to be all supportive and pretend she wasn't a total spaz so I could get into her panties, which turned out to be not worth it. The next day she took me to see some chamber orchestra. I was stuck with her and a bunch of beards watching some divs playing cellos like it mattered. Anyway, the point is you don't even need to learn to play anything cos you can just say your avant garde and nobody will say shit.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on January 14, 2019, 08:24:01 PM
There's always room for self-improvement. :)
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Snoopycat_ on January 15, 2019, 08:23:31 AM
This is my favourite YT music guy. I like Jak because he's coked to the gills and looks like Bill Murray in drag, but he knows his stuff and he's down to earth. A lot of YT music guys are boring or precious as fuck. Ask James James why he only plays boring 70s shit and it's guaranteed she'll have a mental breakdown and threaten to quit.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K6N7Y-oHQeQ
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: headwalk on January 15, 2019, 08:35:44 AM
This is my favourite YT music guy. I like Jak because he's coked to the gills and looks like Bill Murray in drag, but he knows his stuff and he's down to earth. A lot of YT music guys are boring or precious as fuck. Ask James James why he only plays boring 70s shit and it's guaranteed she'll have a mental breakdown and threaten to quit.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K6N7Y-oHQeQ

this is what i'm talking about. i get nothing out of the modern eductated youtube guitarist who goes into aspergic detail about the pick slant slash uses or whatever while having no emotion behind it. if you're teaching rock or metal, there needs to be a rawness there. a piss stained pair of drainpipes that you haven't been able to squeeze into for a decade and a trembling disposition that tells its own story.

i mean, you don't have to go that far, but you have to understand that it's as much about projection of energy as it is notes on a page.

quite like ben eller for that reason. he splits the difference. he's def of the new school but still gets it.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: agrajag on January 15, 2019, 09:17:34 AM
ITT old rocker man yells at cloud
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on January 15, 2019, 11:27:04 AM
I once dated this girl who was in an "experimental" band which made her seem all cool and mysterious. One night I went to see her and her band playing a gig in a half empty pub. It turned out it was just her and 3 Yokos hitting things with spoons. I had to be all supportive and pretend she wasn't a total spaz so I could get into her panties, which turned out to be not worth it. The next day she took me to see some chamber orchestra. I was stuck with her and a bunch of beards watching some divs playing cellos like it mattered. Anyway, the point is you don't even need to learn to play anything cos you can just say your avant garde and nobody will say shit.
In college there were several times I was asked to perform with the modern music ensemble. 80% of the performances I did with them I was sight reading/just making it up on the fly. They were always like "Oh man, that was soul touching! Such artistry!" 80% of modern/avant garde music  ::)
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Himu on January 15, 2019, 11:29:32 AM
Tasty doing good :heartbeat
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: agrajag on January 15, 2019, 11:46:30 AM
that depends on your taste.

According to some very well respected musicians and composers, theory is more of an "after the fact" analytical tool. The real trailblazers create theory. But, all the greats were students of the craft in one way or another.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on January 15, 2019, 11:51:51 AM
For every guitarist that actually doesn't need theory there's 20,000 playing wonderwall baldy and thinking they're hot shit.

Never understood the "I don't need theory!" people. Unless you're Jimi or Stevie or Randi (who btw he actually knew his theory) why would you not want more insight into your craft?
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on January 15, 2019, 11:55:05 AM
Tasty doing good :heartbeat

Thxoxoxo :heart
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: agrajag on January 15, 2019, 12:00:54 PM
For every guitarist that actually doesn't need theory there's 20,000 playing wonderwall baldy and thinking they're hot shit.

Never understood the "I don't need theory!" people. Unless you're Jimi or Stevie or Randi (who btw he actually knew his theory) why would you not want more insight into your craft?

True. At the end of the day, all those theoretical terms Stro ridiculed are just names for musical sounds. If you just want to play blues-based riffs it's fine to stay in the rock bubble, and it's true that you don't need a whole shit ton of theory for that.

A lot of oldschool jazz guitarists have a very simple approach to theory. For example, Jimmy Bruno rejects any kind of modal analysis, he just trained his ear very well and knows how each note will sound over any given chord, how intervals resolve, etc. That's theory in itself, but more like theory in practice and very stripped down.

I think theory should be looked at as an educational tool, not a rigid template for composing music.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on January 15, 2019, 12:08:05 PM
Yup. And it takes different kinds. I understand that I dissect pieces and like to follow theory and all that. But that's why I stay away from composition. I'm too held by rules by the way my mind works. That's fine. I can take someone's piece and make it mine. Others can go and create new. I just can't stand though people that are like "I don't need theory!" and all they can come up with is the same insipid stuff everyone else who thinks they don't need theory comes up with. Just as much as I can't stand the people that are like "Well, I learned in theory class that I should write it this way..."
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: agrajag on January 15, 2019, 12:18:49 PM
For every guitarist that actually doesn't need theory there's 20,000 playing wonderwall baldy and thinking they're hot shit.

Never understood the "I don't need theory!" people. Unless you're Jimi or Stevie or Randi (who btw he actually knew his theory) why would you not want more insight into your craft?

Mostly because it's boring and turns music into a mechanical process.

"A lot of oldschool jazz guitarists have a very simple approach to theory. For example, Jimmy Bruno rejects any kind of modal analysis, he just trained his ear very well and knows how each note will sound over any given chord, how intervals resolve, etc. That's theory in itself, but more like theory in practice and very stripped down."

That makes sense to me and I feel like really that's more than good enough for most players, and actually the natural way to learn it over time on your own without really needed to actually study up on theory itself. If you stick to it long enough you'll likely just kind of figure out most of this stuff and likely in a more intuitive and memorable way than studying definitions and vocabulary.

Actually a lot of like I mentioned, old school jazz players will agree with you. A lot of them resent the modal approach (which scale and mode should I play over this chord) and call it unmusical and the two approaches do have different characteristics. But these differences really boil down to improvisational playing.

Actively studying music does help a lot if you want to compose stuff beyond popular genres.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: agrajag on January 15, 2019, 12:23:00 PM
I think modal harmony is the term I am referring to. It is the preeminent approach to soloing in the jazz circles nowadays, but the older bebop guys reject it and focus on chord tones. The modal harmony approach was developed in music conservatories.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: headwalk on January 15, 2019, 12:58:03 PM
getting circa 2003 musicianforum flashbacks.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on January 25, 2019, 09:59:00 AM
Music theory is coming along a little bit, although I'm rushing through some of the memorization stuff (like all the key signatures) for now -- a cheat sheet over the course of a few months will likely be how I learn those.

As for practice, life's been crazy so I've been missing it, which is on me. What's also stunted things is I accomplished my first real goal and so I'm sort of in search of the next one.

Whatever it is, after I complete it, I intend to get a teacher afterwards.

Great reading your progress man. :)
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on January 25, 2019, 10:57:46 PM
Even 15 minutes a day is better than zero minutes.

My lack of keyboard has been an issue more days than not, although that balance could flip this weekend I think... :-\

You're totally right tho.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on January 25, 2019, 11:00:32 PM
Also tried playing on an actual piano for the first time tonight... holy fuck I need weighted keys so bad what the fuck
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: agrajag on February 01, 2019, 10:28:45 AM
I am not good at fingerpicking and doing percussive things with my thumb.


Tasty:
https://youtu.be/IGJeGOw8TzQ
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Himu on February 28, 2019, 11:02:05 PM
So like, I want to get started on my classical guitar stuff. I don't have an acoustic or classical guitar yet but have my trusty tele here. Can I learn classical guitar (baroque, flamenco, folk) on my telecaster?

Yesterday trashuman posted this great video of Nancy playing a solo to Heart's Crazy On You live, and as said earlier in this thread, I LOVE folk, baroque, flamenco, classical inspired guitar styles and I've been listening to folk rock all day. I've finally got the motivation to get started thanks to that video, which is here:

https://youtu.be/qVcl0Iw3fs8

I guess I can get started learning those arpeggios Puppy posted.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Himu on February 28, 2019, 11:06:14 PM
This video gives me hope I can hack learning classical without a classical guitar until I get one.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvUq2SApkWI

Just gotta remember guitars are just tools.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Himu on February 28, 2019, 11:40:34 PM
Yeah, I really need a classical guitar. :(

It seems this book is good for self learners.

https://www.amazon.com/Solo-Guitar-Playing-Book-4th/dp/0825636795/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=frederick+noad&qid=1551415137&s=gateway&sr=8-1

I'll have a teacher check up on my progress every few months. Need that classical guitar first.

https://youtu.be/xSEG6DHlLto

Guitar is the most beautiful instrument (my opinion). :uguu
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Himu on March 01, 2019, 12:29:44 AM
Puppy also suggested this book.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1470631385?tag=thbo09f-20
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Bore Expert on March 01, 2019, 12:36:32 AM
Open tunings are fun if yr bored of standard tuning on guitar. Chord shapes are different and it also works well for slide playing if you’re into that. Capos too. Lots of possibilities
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on May 21, 2019, 12:39:34 AM
Been way too long since I had an update here so here's what's been going on with me:

Jan: Probably practiced the same 2-3 songs I picked up from Flowkey every other day. Was partway through Music Theory for Dummies. Was doing a popular Udemy course to learn piano.

Feb: Baaaaaaasically finished Music Theory for Dummies, very insightful book up until it started getting into what I consider reference material (or at least, material much too advanced for me to worry about memorizing right now.) Got 29% of the way through my Udemy course before putting it on pause.

Mar: Too busy, unfocused and depressed to even keep up practicing the couples songs I had finally learned. Near total degradation of muscle memory, though a lot of the concepts in the Music Theory book have surprisingly stuck around in my head. Joined TakeLessons Live intending to cancel after the trial period, but I've kept it up even though I rarely attend the group classes. Just having them available at different skill levels and at different times is a cognitive load off.

TakeLessons Live is the scheduled-livestream group class offering, but the original use of TakeLessons was finding online or local language/music teachers. After literally weeks of research, weighing options including in-person vs. online factoring in cost and convenience, and a bunch of last-minute bookmark checking, I chose a 1-on-1 private piano teacher and paid for ten 45-minute lessons, to be attended online every Thursday. In addition, he agreed that the last 15 minutes of each lesson can instead be focused on vocal and singing training, as he offers lessons for that too. What can I say, I want to kill karaoke. :-[

Apr: Lesson #1, my first real piano (and vocal) session, was April 4th. :D I was nervous but in the end I fucking love my teacher, he's so chill, he had to give me extra time since we spent 10 minutes geeking out about Linux and The Matrix. :doge ...:lol I attended Lesson #2 on the 11th, but didn't really have much to practice although we did make some good progress. Unfortunately, due to events I may post in the Struggle Thread, I had to cancel the next three weeks of classes. :( I didn't practice either.

May: I knew I was in danger of losing this passion if not forever, then at least for a long time, and that scared me more than the anxiety of facing my teacher after three weeks of no practice and in fact full regression of our first two lessons. So I sucked it up and signed on for Lesson #3, we recapped and got back up to speed much quicker than I expected, and I was honest with him about my possible need for concrete "homework" to practice on. All good stuff and after this first lesson "back" I bought the book he was teaching from: Adult Piano Adventures (Volume 1.)

From my perspective, I was playing some pretty complex songs in December/January, especially compared to the early material my teacher and I are working through now, but I'm honestly happy to be going through the basics a bit more deliberately and with a guide to boot. In addition, I feel like I've gotten a good grasp at some of the various methods of teaching piano playing, or possibly music in general, after: having a real teach, taking an impersonal online video course, attending group livestream classes, watching YouTube videos, using the Synthesia-like app's guided "courses," and reading Music Theory for Dummies. For instance, only one of those "sources" introduces black keys immediately, which I find interesting.

I didn't practice in the week leading up to Lesson #3, but I vowed to rectify that. And I have -- between Lessons #3 and 4 I practiced almost every day for more than 20 minutes, though there was a day I only did 3 mins. :lol Lesson #4 was where I felt like we finally moved past the really babby stuff and now we're onto like, kindergarten concepts like ottavas, thirds/skips, and sheet music comprehension.

I'm really excited about that last one (sheet music.) After Lesson #4 I skipped ahead in my book to the next song ("Camptown Races," doo-dah) after my current homework, and it was the first song since I started learning last December where the sheet music was guiding my hands more than just my raw muscle memory, and it wasn't half bad for a first-time stumble-through. My familiarity with the song may have helped too, but for the first time I'm really associating the notes on the staff with the keys on the keyboard.

Now I just need to get faster. :P

Aaaaand that's my update for now, Lesson #5 is in three days and I've moved ahead of my homework by another song, "Eine Kleine Nachtmusik" by a little guy called Mozart. This one's pretty hard for my stupid fingers (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bjbgeGhn_Lg), so I'm taking it slow and doing each hand at a time. I'm hoping I can learn it and surprise my teacher Thursday. I also plan to attend an online group lesson by my same teacher tomorrow.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on May 24, 2019, 04:51:06 PM
Thanks. :D

Lesson #5 was great, I asked about a couple things that I couldn't really put in words to Google, and I really came to grips with 2nds and 3rds and ottava notation. Nightmusic by Mozart is a fun ditty, like Camptown Races. I can see using it as a warmup or exercise song even down the road.

In addition to those songs for homework, I'm practicing a song on Flowkey just for me. I've learned RH the opening couple measures, and those are beautiful and compelling enough that I feel a compulsion to keep learning the rest of the song every time I play them. Will post a vid of my stupid fingers progress soon.

Honestly, I'm pausing and reading the sheet music in Flowkey more often than the interactive "here's when you play each note" modes, but I think it's good to have those there since I find them more easy to grok than a straight metronome to keep pace.

A bonus I realized earlier today is I have like $125 in Amazon credit right now... it'll be a week or two before I can justify it to myself, but I think I can spring the additional $275 it costs for a Yamaha P45/71. The creaky plastic keys of my Casio are beginning to get to me, as is the thought I'm still incapable of playing anything I know on a "real" piano. Plus my teacher warned that even towards the end of the beginner section, some songs start to get into the 88-key-specific octaves, and I'm stuck on 61-keys. Hopefully not for much longer though. :)
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on May 29, 2019, 02:03:13 AM
Good luck. I have a lot of respect for drummers. My early musical career was basically:

~ begin flashback ~

Mom: "I'm signing you up for music lessons right now on the phone! What instrument do you want to learn?"

8-year old Tasty: "Uhhh guitar??" [having basically been reinforced through various 90s media how "cool" an instrument it was]

Mom: "...they don't have that. What about drums?"

8yo Tasty: "Umm... OK." [internally: I guess drums are still apart of rock bands...]

~ end flashback ~

I had weekly drum lessons for a few school years afterwards, but I could never wrap my head around the drum... as a white boy, I really had no rhythm. :doge So it was difficult for me to keep time, and I was also drum-tone-deaf(?) since the notes sounded the same to me, even though they're played for differing intervals. (From what I remember anyways, it was so long ago.)

I was also adverse to loud noises and music, and practicing the drum at home was more the former than the latter to my ear.  :-\

Once I gave up on the drums I gave up on ever learning an instrument... until high school, and I became enchanted by the piano. And then it took about a decade after that for me to finally sign up for lessons...

So to reiterate, yeah, respect for drummers.  :tophat
 
Part of that is still creeping up in my piano practicing now; it's difficult for me to keep time without mouthing out the 1-2-3-4 as I go. But I think as I learn the song and the notes, I'll instinctively know when to "hold back" on playing, when to draw things out, when to add and not add legato, etc.

Lol this turned out way longer than I thought. :P
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on May 29, 2019, 01:47:57 PM
I was friends with a guy who was getting his masters in percussion performance and I asked him how it was, he said, "Playing Percussive instruments is less a talent or skill, and more an attitude." Gotta say I can't really say he's wrong.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on May 29, 2019, 04:27:20 PM
I was friends with a guy who was getting his masters in percussion performance and I asked him how it was, he said, "Playing Percussive instruments is less a talent or skill, and more an attitude." Gotta say I can't really say he's wrong.

Yep... Whatever it is, I don't got it.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on May 29, 2019, 06:58:42 PM
Metronome is really hard for me, since I'm concentrating more on the timing than the notes... but the advice there is to slow it down to 30bpm and work upwards from there. Just have to throw myself against it until I get it.

As an additional perspective, I talk about Flowkey a lot, and it's a lot like Synthesia except with sheet music. I bring it up because Flowkey's "slow mode" is like a 45bpm metronome... but with the notes of the song instead of a dull "tick." With that, I'm able to concentrate on the notes at the same moment as the timing.

Flowkey's downside is that only vetted songs that have been specifically written for the platform are available, so you're stuck with their library (kinda like Rock Band), but they surprisingly have a decent collection of songs IMO... maybe a bit too much popular music and, weirdly, k-pop though.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on May 30, 2019, 09:58:37 AM
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/05/30/magazine/earl-rose-piano-carlyle-new-york.html
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on June 01, 2019, 10:10:40 PM
Due to other things in my life I've been settling on 25-minute "blocks" of productivity and using various tools to help me focus during those blocks. I've been using it for some coding projects, but started applying it to my practicing and I'm noticing some improvement already.

Mostly because before I just promised myself to do "10+ minute" sessions, trying to be flexible so that I at least practice *something* every day. And there may be days I just don't have 25 minutes, and 5 will have to do. But overall I've found that knowing the fixed amount of time let's me structure the practicing out in my head...

Dunno, could be total placebo, but it seems to be making a difference. I basically want to ideally do two "blocks" of practice per day, one for "homework" for my teacher and one for a song to learn on my own.

Btw my teacher said I'm progressing really well. :) Could be a ploy to just keep renewing with him but fuck it I'll let myself have this one.

im interested in a keyboard synthesizer cuz u get to make any sound but it would probably be also distracting to practice on :lol

A few months ago I got gifted a 66-key Casio from the mid-80s, the thing must weight more than some small cars and it has a *ridiculous* amount of wacky soundbanks and weird processing effects. It's pretty awesome. Not weighted either though. :/
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on June 04, 2019, 11:10:06 PM
Homework for this week:

spoiler (click to show/hide)
https://youtu.be/Hf6pTx3mlB8
[close]

Fun song. Playing is still a bit rough but I have two days to shape things up before Thursday's lesson.


25 minutes of deliberate practice with a focus on getting better in your weakest areas is better than an hour of practicing on autopilot.

Between both "blocks" it's really more like an hour, though I've only been doing my homework block the last couple days.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on June 15, 2019, 02:15:41 AM
http://www.calnewport.com/blog/2011/12/23/flow-is-the-opiate-of-the-medicore-advice-on-getting-better-from-an-accomplished-piano-player/

Excellent excellent article! This seems to line up with my experience practicing...

HN has some good comments too: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20185854

Quite a few people there saying a metronome is a must at all times, even if you don't consciously try to follow it. Also that playing slow can become a timewasting crutch if you're not careful.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on June 15, 2019, 02:40:28 AM
Absolutely! I've been trying to follow your advice and confronting the hard/"ugly" parts can actually be fun in its own way. At least you're engaged when practicing those parts.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on June 17, 2019, 01:37:26 AM
Frederick Hodges: "Ragtime is neither classical music nor jazz" (2009) (http://www.frederickhodges.com/is%20ragtime%20classical%20music.html)

Fascinating article. Maybe I'll give ragtime another look.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on June 29, 2019, 10:13:06 AM
Excellent podcast on classical music history: Decomposed with Jade Simmons (https://www.google.com/podcasts?feed=aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkcy5wdWJsaWNyYWRpby5vcmcvcHVibGljX2ZlZWRzL2RlY29tcG9zZWQvcnNzL3Jzcy5yc3M)
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Himu on July 11, 2019, 02:28:24 AM
Struck some luck this year with my guitar playing. Gotten good book to help me learn guitar in a more structured manner similar to my classical education in middle school. Enjoying the instrument far more and trying my hand at learning to play some hard rock and metal.

I've been copying Nancy. My shero.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVcl0Iw3fs8

The good thing is the material I've been going over has basics in classical guitar and I've been implementing that (thanks to puppy) into my practice. It's helped learn to form a bond with the instrument which only recently felt like a massive wall because it's not like the instruments I'm used to learning (which are far more linear).

Unfortunately only have a telecaster for now which limits my guitar picking but isn't really stopping me. When I'm no longer poor I'm looking at getting an classical guitar for my guitar pickin' and a Les Paul for metal. Hopefully a Les Paul Standard can play metal.

My goal is to get a gig in a band as a guitarist next summer. Have to get good enough by then.

For the most part I've thrown youtube and apps in the trash as far as guitar learning goes unless I want to learn how to play a song or see how a hero/shero plays. Due to my classical training, I demand structure and unfortunately electric guitar teachers are way, way, way behind classical instrument teachers. So I've turned to books and taking the occasional guitar lesson to check on my progress.

Books >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Youtube

One interesting tidbit is that I still think like a trombone player despite being 30+. I always look to F on sheet music because F is first position on trombone.

Another benefits to books is confidence. One problem I've had learning guitar is that with sax and trombone I learned the basics relatively quickly. My band teacher in middle school told my high school band teacher that I was the fastest learner he has ever met and that I could learn an instrument in a few months. I never really found playing music to be terribly hard. This prompted the fucker to try to get me to switch to Tuba junior year, which is an absolute shit instrument. So then I got a guitar and I had no idea what to do with it and the teachers don't know how to teach it, at least in the manner I'm used to being taught. So due to music being not too difficulty to not knowing what to do with an instrument, I was left with utter de-motivation. But thanks to the books, for the first time I feel I can actually learn guitar, and learn it well. Given guitars non-linearity (there’s like five ways to play each chord I think) this is helpful and helps me have fun. Going from a linear instrument that relies on sheet music  and basic music theory knowledge to guitar is so, so intimidating. Having structure makes learning guitar fun, which makes addictive like learning past instruments was, which allows me more fuel to get better.

Loving it.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on July 14, 2019, 05:55:35 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VNG8Jmz5zqI

:heartbeat
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on July 14, 2019, 05:59:39 PM
OMG Queen how did I miss your post??

Quote
My goal is to get a gig in a band as a guitarist next summer. Have to get good enough by then.

Nice! What kind of composing are you drawn to? Or do you anticipate letting the rest of the band have more creative control? Have you played in a band before?

Quote
For the most part I've thrown youtube and apps in the trash as far as guitar learning goes unless I want to learn how to play a song or see how a hero/shero plays.

I've basically done the same, in order to try and improve my sheet reading. It's like trying to learn a language but then never visiting where it's used or speaking it day-to-day, you're just never going to be as good as someone who is "forced" to do it regularly.

So I've uninstalled Synthesia. I still use Flowkey as it still includes sheet music, but I wish I could turn off the rest of the UI so *only* shows sheet music (and not the real-time hand positions) as the "repeat a section on loop" part of the app is really useful for practicing, but I digress...

Basically I agree that pretty much all of these new-fangled "learn X easy with just an app!!!" apps are trash for actually learning any kind of long-term skill. But if they work for somebody than more power to them.

Quote
Due to my classical training, I demand structure and unfortunately electric guitar teachers are way, way, way behind classical instrument teachers. So I've turned to books and taking the occasional guitar lesson to check on my progress.

This is interesting, I didn't think this was a potential perspective... Why are electric guitar teachers "behind?" Is it just because classical has been around longer and teaching methods are more time-tested?
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on July 14, 2019, 06:05:13 PM
Quote
Books >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Youtube

Also, YES. YouTube is more trash than I thought for learning this stuff...

I've been listening to Decomposed (awesome classical podcast I linked (https://decomposedshow.org) above) when I take my smoke (#420) breaks, but I'm on the last episode for it now so I'm considering switching to trying audiobooks. I'm actually retaining much more information about each podcast episode despite the marijuana, and it's honestly been perfect for the 5-15 minute gaps I'm outside.

Anyways, just something that's working for me, might work for someone here too. :pimp

Like I said I'm gonna try it with audiobooks about classical music history next. I've always been interested, and have scraped the surface over the years via Wikipedia, etc., but Decomposed has given me an entirely new and exciting way to consider this stuff.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Himu on July 14, 2019, 06:11:24 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VNG8Jmz5zqI

:heartbeat

I want to suck Bach's dick tbh
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Himu on July 14, 2019, 06:27:20 PM
Nice! What kind of composing are you drawn to? Or do you anticipate letting the rest of the band have more creative control? Have you played in a band before?

I'm attracted to anything but the ultimate goal is to have a heavy metal band full of black people. I need to work my way up to metal though because it's so technical, which means getting down other styes.

I have never played in one of those bands we're thinking of before but I was in band 6th grade to 12th grade. So for me, music = playing with others, and the competition that comes with that.

Quote
I've basically done the same, in order to try and improve my sheet reading. It's like trying to learn a language but then never visiting where it's used or speaking it day-to-day, you're just never going to be as good as someone who is "forced" to do it regularly.

So I've uninstalled Synthesia. I still use Flowkey as it still includes sheet music, but I wish I could turn off the rest of the UI so *only* shows sheet music (and not the real-time hand positions) as the "repeat a section on loop" part of the app is really useful for practicing, but I digress...

Basically I agree that pretty much all of these new-fangled "learn X easy with just an app!!!" apps are trash for actually learning any kind of long-term skill. But if they work for somebody than more power to them.

The only guitar app I have installed now is Guitar Tuna which is a tuner.

Quote
This is interesting, I didn't think this was a potential perspective... Why are electric guitar teachers "behind?" Is it just because classical has been around longer and teaching methods are more time-tested?

Guitar teachers, in my experience, are mostly bad. They are entirely too focused on chords. They're like, here's a D7, here's an A minor, here's a C chord. Nothing about songs. I'm sorry, but I was in band almost a decade, bro. I won music contests. I won first chair multiple times. We had to memorize songs. Instruments = playing music. Chords are not music but a way to play music. I imagined myself as an 11 year old learning guitar and I would have banged my head against the wall learning this shit. One time I took a class in community college for guitar and we did jack shit but learn chords. I did not learn one single song. It fucking sucked. It's so goddamn boring. I have multiple teachers since and they're all the same.

Meanwhile, in classical land, we learned songs within days of getting our instruments. We couldn't wait to play music as kids! Emphasis - MUSIC. Chords are not music. They are not songs. If you are not teaching your student to play Mary Had A Little Lamb within a week you have failed. GOOD DAY. What motivation is there to keep going if you aren't learning songs? Songs give motivation. The electrical guitar teaching from my experience completely lacks structure.

I picked up a guitar book and played a song by the end my first session and have been hooked ever since. Why in the fuck would someone who has prior experience with music playing want to play chords for a few months? Don't get me wrong. Chords are important, and it's good to practice them, but a big problem with guitar teaching is that they tend to teach ONLY chords to beginners. Chords are not fun. I saw that many guitar teachers have low student retention and honestly, I know why.

Also they dive into chords too fast. The guitar book I've been reading teaches you individual notes on each fret. That is more far more logical to me as a saxophonist. 

Can you imagine some kid taking sax lessons and you don't learn how to play a single song after multiple lessons?

:stop

Quote
Books >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Youtube

Also, YES. YouTube is more trash than I thought for learning this stuff...

I've been listening to Decomposed (awesome classical podcast I linked (https://decomposedshow.org) above) when I take my smoke (#420) breaks, but I'm on the last episode for it now so I'm considering switching to trying audiobooks. I'm actually retaining much more information about each podcast episode despite the marijuana, and it's honestly been perfect for the 5-15 minute gaps I'm outside.

Anyways, just something that's working for me, might work for someone here too. :pimp

Like I said I'm gonna try it with audiobooks about classical music history next. I've always been interested, and have scraped the surface over the years via Wikipedia, etc., but Decomposed has given me an entirely new and exciting way to consider this stuff.

Youtube is good if you find gold but it's mostly trash. It's good for looking up specific things, like the other day I looked up strum pattern videos and found this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzC0orOGARw

Also it feels good to read music again.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on July 14, 2019, 06:37:05 PM
Oh damn, yeah. Trying to memorize chords would be way over my head right now... might be different for guitars, but yeah. I understand the concept enough to see why songs are composed in certain ways, and I know there's basically a cheat sheet I can use to look things up, but that's definitely not super interesting to learn right now...
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Himu on July 14, 2019, 06:38:16 PM
Another reason classical teachers are generally better besides having a superior structure is the fact you tend to play with others. They teach multiple people at the same time, so you get to learn things you otherwise wouldn't know or think about. It also helps you get used to playing WITH, and in front of others. Multiple times as a kid, the band teacher would hear a section and call us all out. We would be forced to play our bits of the songs individually in front of the entire class, by ourselves. Imagine public speaking but with an instrument. Playing in front of people is no longer scary then. There's also the camaraderie of learning an instrument with multiple people as you each get better. Never mind the rivalries and the drive to prove yourself the better musician.

Most guitar lessons are one on one and it lacks all of this. For many reasons, guitar teachers are just centuries behind.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Potato on July 15, 2019, 01:03:20 AM
I've been seriously considering buying an acoustic guitar and learning to play.

I played a little bit of piano as a kid and dabbled in bass guitar as a teenager, but never anything more than learning a few songs for amateur gigs.

I really want to just learn to play some Leonard Cohen songs and a few other things like that.

What is the chance of a middle aged man with two active young kids being able to learn to play at least semi-competently?
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Trent Dole on July 15, 2019, 02:35:07 AM
I've been seriously considering buying an acoustic guitar and learning to play.

I played a little bit of piano as a kid and dabbled in bass guitar as a teenager, but never anything more than learning a few songs for amateur gigs.

I really want to just learn to play some Leonard Cohen songs and a few other things like that.

What is the chance of a middle aged man with two active young kids being able to learn to play at least semi-competently?
Can ya spare an hour or so a day? Then you can do it.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on July 15, 2019, 06:14:12 PM
I think even half an hour a day is enough, as Glen said earlier. As long as you do it every day and are patient with your own progress, anyone can absolutely start learning. I'm only 8 months into things but I see the sentiment echoed by musicians and teachers many years my senior.

Just play. (And practice every day.)
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Himu on July 16, 2019, 12:31:41 AM
Four more hours with the guitar tonight. Loving this instrument. It’s so logical too, once you think of it. High E goes to F, G on first and third fret. Then second string is B, and the first and third fret are C, D. So you’ve got B, C, D, E, F, G. Then you’ve got G string which has A, completing the scale. Fourth string is D, so now you’ve learned to play D in two separate ways and E in three different ways thanks to learning notes on the neck. And the best part is by knowing this you learn a scale and it doesn’t seem random. Learning the neck and learning to transition from note to note is so gradual and natural that I have no idea why guitar teachers don’t teach this out the gate. Guitar is a great, beautiful, logical instrument. You just seem to need to taught it properly to fully enjoy it, it seems.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Himu on July 16, 2019, 02:28:24 AM
Really falling for this instrument thanks to these series of books. My guitar and I are finally bonding and creating a relationship with one another.

I’ve added major and minor arpeggios to my practice session for something to work on besides the book.

https://youtu.be/qX9BmR_AjrQ

Seeing myself get better every day is exhilarating.

Also that guy has the same guitar as me. :heartbeat Hello bb :3
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Himu on July 16, 2019, 03:29:48 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4X7qgBVnMfY
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Himu on July 17, 2019, 02:47:11 PM
I only have an electric guitar and it's thundering. I want to jam on my guitar but I'm quickly learning that you can't always play an electric. It can be conditional if you don't have power or there's certain weather conditions. For that reason I need to get an acoustic (preferably classical) so i can play guitar any time I want.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on July 17, 2019, 04:03:01 PM
You can't turn the volume on the amp down?

I guess I take the volume control on my keyboard for granted. :thinking
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: archnemesis on July 17, 2019, 04:06:10 PM
I have five guitars in my living room and I never bother with hooking up an electric one. Even when I'm playing death metal.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Himu on July 17, 2019, 04:35:44 PM
You can't turn the volume on the amp down?

I guess I take the volume control on my keyboard for granted. :thinking

No it's because in order to run an electric guitar to make sound you have to make it go through an amp, which is plugged into a socket/surge protector. That and thunder doesn't mix. Don't know if you'll have a black out and it'll fuck up your equipment  since it's all hooked up. Ya dig? So if it’s storming, you don’t want to jam on an electric guitar. You want an acoustic for that.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Himu on July 17, 2019, 05:26:35 PM
I’m conflicted on whether or not my next guitar should be classical or acoustic. I lean classical because I’ll be learning classical but they’re so big and I’ll need that damn foot pedal to raise my foot to not hurt myself. Do they make small classical guitars than say, what’s in this video?

https://youtu.be/inBKFMB-yPg

I see this video and it looks like a smaller guitar but I’m not sure if it’s the guitar or the man.

https://youtu.be/WlGiOiRQNhI

What’s going on here? Do classical guitars come in different sizes?
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: archnemesis on July 18, 2019, 05:36:38 AM
Classical guitars are typically nylon stringed acoustic guitars and not particularly big. Large acoustic guitars tend to have steel strings.

Most string instruments can be bought in different sizes. Since you're an adult you want the standard size.

You're probably looking for a basic nylon stringed guitar with a standard sized body. As long as it feels nice and the neck is properly aligned so that you can get a tone from each fret then any model will do fine.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on July 18, 2019, 08:51:51 AM
Resisting the urge to buy a new instrument is difficult.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Himu on July 18, 2019, 02:29:58 PM
I only have an electric guitar and it's thundering. I want to jam on my guitar but I'm quickly learning that you can't always play an electric. It can be conditional if you don't have power or there's certain weather conditions. For that reason I need to get an acoustic (preferably classical) so i can play guitar any time I want.

:mindblown

just play it unplugged, i do it all the time

seems like you're just making excuses to buy more guitars

Nah.

As a beginner this is bad because you don't know if you hit the note right since there's no real "sound" coming out. How do you know if you hit it right? This could easily lead to bad habits and poor sound articulation.

Also, I need a classical guitar anyways for my goals. I have a classical guitar book here. This was the plan all along. I'll be learning electric and classical concurrently.
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Himu on July 18, 2019, 06:44:12 PM
Whew.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMO-wMy85Dc

Classical guitar is such a beautiful instrument.

Guitar as a whole may be the most beautiful instrument to me.

Also got this as per Puppy.

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51n03tuhkUL._SX373_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg)
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Transhuman on July 18, 2019, 08:37:27 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=12gVdwrX9yY

if classical guitars are beautiful, electric guitars are sexy
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Himu on July 18, 2019, 09:26:25 PM
Electric guitar is also beautiful.  :-[
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on July 20, 2019, 01:02:00 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ymJ1uSMzOr0

:ohyeah
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: Tasty on July 20, 2019, 01:58:26 PM
https://youtu.be/5GUwyRWy4V0

:aah
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: VomKriege on July 20, 2019, 02:26:12 PM
Dufus once again living up to his name. :hhh
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Tasty on July 26, 2019, 07:35:48 PM
Had to skip a few weeks of lessons this month. :-\ But I've been practicing (not frequently enough, but still) and intend to get back on track next week. I'm anticipating August being a good month, and I can feel in my bones the rising desire to practice more. Sometimes those embers cool so it's encouraging when I feel them get stoked back up again. :D

I'm also solidifying my practice regimen more, giving it a bit more structure so I'm less likely to be at a "loss" of what to do when practicing -- a kind of "paralysis of choice" negatively biases me against hitting the keys. I'm also incorporating more hand exercises that my teacher turned me on to, and they're already improving things especially in my sinister hand.

Also here's a neat puff piece on concert pianist + Googler June Wu. (https://www.blog.google/inside-google/googlers/june-wu-piano/)
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Tasty on July 29, 2019, 05:25:58 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/HxwrXeV.png)

https://thehardtimes.net/music/band-caught-taking-performance-enhancing-lessons/

Quote
“It’s becoming increasingly common,” Dr. Woods added. “Since so many established bands are doing it, up-and-coming musicians feel they need to as well just to level the playing field. Even beginners started taking lessons. So sad.”
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Tasty on August 05, 2019, 04:55:40 PM
Updates:

Resumed lessons on Aug 1 (lesson #10.) Practiced a ton (for me) leading up to it, getting down pretty much all the songs I've gotten through so far in my book (including such smash-hits as Jingle Bells, Mozart's Nachtmusik, New World Symphony (as posted), and a few others.

We've moved onto to doing parallel/contrary thirds, so right now practicing Shepherd's Song from Beethoven's Symphony #6. It's a fun song. :) Last two weeks I've been practicing more than ever. :heartbeat

I also plan to participate in this month's piano jam on Reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/piano/comments/cmajv0/piano_jam_72_august_2019/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OdYI79CqOSs

Pretty music~
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Tasty on August 09, 2019, 06:27:30 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/IsyRebj.png)

Keep the streak going 😤
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Tasty on August 11, 2019, 07:31:36 PM
https://youtu.be/CPRFLAvB7ug
Title: Re: Musicality thread of learning to play, music theory, and never enough practice
Post by: I'm a Puppy! on August 12, 2019, 04:05:13 PM
Whew.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMO-wMy85Dc

Classical guitar is such a beautiful instrument.

Guitar as a whole may be the most beautiful instrument to me.

Also got this as per Puppy.

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51n03tuhkUL._SX373_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg)
How's scott's book working out for you?
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Tasty on August 16, 2019, 09:34:50 AM
"If you're going to try, go all the way. Otherwise, don't even start. This could mean losing girlfriends, wives, relatives and maybe even your mind. It could mean not eating for three or four days. It could mean freezing on a park bench. It could mean jail. It could mean derision. It could mean mockery--isolation. Isolation is the gift. All the others are a test of your endurance, of how much you really want to do it. And, you'll do it, despite rejection and the worst odds. And it will be better than anything else you can imagine. If you're going to try, go all the way. There is no other feeling like that. You will be alone with the gods, and the nights will flame with fire. You will ride life straight to perfect laughter. It's the only good fight there is."

Bukowski's Factotum
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Tasty on August 16, 2019, 11:12:49 AM
Reddit faux-inspirational quotes :rejoice
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Trent Dole on August 16, 2019, 01:40:58 PM
We should all want to be like Bukowski, a miserable alcoholic toiling away at the post office. :doge
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Tasty on August 16, 2019, 07:26:43 PM
Got some analysis paralysis on my keyboard purchase next month and could use some advice.

Yamaha P-125

+ Four speakers (two downward, two upward)
+ Less expensive (by about ~$100)
+ Newer (released last year)
- Plastic feel keys

Roland FP-30

+ Ivory feel keys
+ Better sound (based on Steinway Model D Grand vs. Yamaha's Concert Grand)
+ Has Bluetooth
- Two speakers (both downward)
- More expensive (by about ~$100)
- 5 lbs heavier

After being stuck with crappy plastic unweighted keys for what feels like forever, I'd really like to settle on something as close to the "real thing" as possible before I eventually (2-3 years down the road) get an upright hybrid. I've also listened to samples on YouTube, and the difference in sound is fairly noticeable on the low end; see ~15:50 here:

https://youtu.be/sDjokwNhu4c?t=950

Edit- This is the older Yamaha P-115, not the updated P-125. Still a good demo of the two different approaches and samplings used by Yamaha and Roland.

With that said, the speaker setup on the FP-30 kinda blows by all accounts, and it's old enough that Roland could theoretically announce an updated version a week after purchase, which wouldn't feel great.

As I said this purchase is still a month away, so I'm planning on taking a trip to a local music store and trying both myself. However I'd still like input from any who can give it. I know either way it'll be more than enough for my next 2-3 years of development, but I also want to be confident of my expensive purchases.
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Transhuman on August 18, 2019, 11:32:40 PM
We should all want to be like Bukowski, a miserable alcoholic toiling away at the post office. :doge

And he liked sandwiches. He was a smart dude
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Tasty on August 19, 2019, 11:43:05 AM
Kickstarter: The Standing Grand - a new light, portable, acoustic piano (https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/futurepiano/the-standing-grand-a-new-light-portable-acoustic-piano)

(https://i.imgur.com/xfivz4k.png)
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Tasty on August 23, 2019, 10:01:09 PM
Here's how my lessons are going! (Btw have to be honest I don't know most of these composers or their songs! I'm hoping to deepen my classical background in the coming months and years. 8))

Lesson #11 on August 8th was doing simple arrangements of Surprise Symphony by Haydn, Hungarian Dance by Brahms, "Shepherd's Song." Key concepts introduced were staccato notes (actually difficult to integrate naturally for me at first, I want to let the notes finish haha), and crescendo/decrescendo. Also learned some exercises for parallel and uh, sequential(?) note playing across both hands (e.g. left hand finger 5 and right hand finger 1 playing their notes, then finger 4 and finger 2, etc.)

In Lesson #12, I moved on to Unit 6 of Adult Piano Adventures, and started playing eighth notes for the first time. I also learned about the fermata mark to play certain notes longer, and upbeats/downbeats which basically let songs start/end uniquely relative to normal measures. Songs learned include an arrangement of Jean-Philippe Rameau's French Minuet and Morning from Peer Gynt. I also took the opportunity to skip ahead one song to Happy Birthday, just cause it's my birthday (and my niece's, and my sister's) next month so it could be handy in a cheesy Hallmark-y way. :P

My homework heading into Lesson #13 was "English Folk Song" and an arrangement of George Frideric Handel's Gavotte, which I found really fun to learn and play! I was taught about inner ledger notes, and learned some exercises to start stretching my thumb, and even crossing my index finger over it! Wild stuff. My current homework is "Simple Gifts" and makes use of both thumb stretching and index crossing over. Figured this would come eventually and I'm glad it doesn't seem too hard so far! Also, learned some chords! Specifically C major and Csus4, which my teacher says this book is unique in introducing the latter this early, but I don't mind, it's a rad chord.

What's mostly hurting me right now is my wacky rhythm, but that tends to get straightened out with practice. Thankfully I've kept up and have only missed one day of practice since July 27th. :D Each day I've done at least 30 minutes, with some days being a bit more. I honestly never thought I'd keep up with it like this, me posting in this thread now is surprising to me too. All my other efforts to better myself or pursue any interest that required daily upkeep, even important ones, have bombed pretty hard. If I had to say why, maybe due to having pent-up interest in learning for 10+ years... I'm still really fired up, and enjoy playing every day.

I really, really can't wait to get a real keyboard.
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Tasty on August 24, 2019, 01:13:22 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x0ePero9tQA

With financing I could get it...

spoiler (click to show/hide)
Resisting the urge to buy a new instrument is difficult.

spoiler (click to show/hide)
Though I'm already buying one next month, either the Yamaha P-125 or Roland FP-30...
[close]
[close]
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Tasty on August 25, 2019, 06:31:07 PM
Ugh now I can't choose between the Yamaha P-125 and the Casio Privia PX-S1000. By all accounts the Casio is the way better value with the better reviews, and more importantly key action, and it includes 2-3 battery power support. On the other hand the Yamaha has better speakers and I think sampling, among some other things I can't explain... ahhh...

So tempted to do financing/rent-to-own on an N1X... hybrids are the future. I fully expect them to represent 95% of piano sales within 50 years.

Also, 【new goal !】  By the end of 2020 I want to take an ABRSM exam! Because of how the exam schedule works out, I'll have to register this January for a May exam... So probably Grade 1 (will be consulting with my teacher and working with him on a regimen), and I have a lot of work to go before I can try passing that. Still, I want to get better, and I want to start having tangible goals. I'm no longer ignorant enough to try "learning outside the 'system'" and thinking I'm some kind of latent musical genius... Like all good shit in life, musical proficiency takes hard work and time.

And I'm totally on board. :D
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Tasty on August 25, 2019, 08:19:27 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/eYb8aWa.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/OYLhE5o.jpg)

I'm :lol-ing a bit at the model in these, but goddamn is that one sexy hybrid grand. :drool
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Snoopycat_ on August 25, 2019, 08:44:56 PM
Anyone use that Beatmaker 3 app? I bought myself a IPad last week so was lookin through the music apps to see if there was anything worth getting and that one stood out
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Tasty on August 27, 2019, 12:46:58 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/RERlGsK.jpg)
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Mr Gilhaney on August 30, 2019, 09:28:32 PM
who of you is this

(https://i.imgur.com/Drnkyjg.jpg)
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Tasty on November 07, 2019, 08:08:36 PM
December 10 marks one year since I picked up the keys. :rejoice

(https://i.imgur.com/IlFIU2O.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/xsHJ4Dr.jpg)

We goin' all the way, baby. :playa
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Transhuman on November 07, 2019, 10:36:55 PM
I want to post in this thread but I have no confidence
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Tasty on November 07, 2019, 10:39:48 PM
I want to post in this thread but I have no confidence

I'm legit still terrible so why not? :idont
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: shosta on November 08, 2019, 01:41:46 AM
Andy, your artistic ambition and confidence remind me a lot of Cindi (RIP). Keep it up!
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Tasty on November 08, 2019, 09:54:33 AM
Thanks! I've been surprised not at my progress necessarily, but my focus and attention. It's very rare I keep something up like this. :D

I worry about losing focus and letting myself lapse big-time at some point, but for now, I'm still as excited as when I started. Even learning how much work is ahead, I'm not daunted.
Title: bla
Post by: Rufus on November 08, 2019, 12:23:17 PM
You have very consistent handwriting. :obama
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Trent Dole on November 08, 2019, 12:48:52 PM
Ahh, this is something I super need to get back on. :-[
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Nintex on November 08, 2019, 12:50:39 PM
Some people play an instrument I play the orchestra
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Tasty on November 08, 2019, 02:27:42 PM
You have very consistent handwriting. :obama

Thanks? :P
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: shosta on November 10, 2019, 11:26:29 PM
Been a long time since I recorded anything

https://youtu.be/bk9wGwlOkTA

think it came out pretty solid considering both tracks were first take and it all came together in about 40 minutes. I've never been able to get the sound I want out of amp to PC or even with a microphone though :goty

I had no idea you were this talented.

Now agrajag has no excuse not to post some guitar material.
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Tasty on December 29, 2019, 07:01:55 PM
End of the year update!

This thread started as "Learning (or continuing to learn) an instrument in 2019" and my goal was the piano. I'd say this year was a huge success. Before making this post I planned on compiling a video of all the short pieces I've learned over the year, maybe will still do it.

My goal for 2020 is to take and pass an ABRSM piano exam, though it'll likely be Grade 1. Still, lots of fundamentals I need to learn before attempting even that!

But this year wasn't all great. There was a couple weeks over the summer I lapsed practicing, and November and December were similar disasters too. In the latter case, real life started to really fuck with me, and while I always thought the piano would be a refuge, trying to practice just reminded me how I can't afford a "real" keyboard yet, and I'm at the point in my learning where that's really becoming a hindrance.

Still, I bit the bullet and got a teacher in April, and while there's been some off-weeks I've been pretty good about attending my 45 min session every week. I really like my teacher and his methods are working very well for me. :) And while it's bummer not having 88 weighted keys or pedals, I don't see that situation lasting much longer.

(https://i.imgur.com/kWVTveg.gif)
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Tasty on January 03, 2020, 08:50:23 PM
I'm curious, do you see yourself as incapable of learning to read music at this point since you've played so long by ear, or is it more that you don't see much value in it because of your skill level?
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Tasty on January 03, 2020, 09:33:40 PM
That's true, I guess if you know tabs that pretty much covers a lot of the same ground as sheet music for guitar.
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: shosta on January 16, 2020, 01:59:02 AM
It's so relaxing :aah love the change midway through.
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: kingv on February 21, 2020, 09:09:45 PM
Made bops:

https://voca.ro/hkytq9yVwAL

https://vocaroo.com/hctCJmRnfE4

Edit: shosh didn’t get a single anime reference and is not a true and loyal fan.
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: kingv on February 22, 2020, 12:40:35 AM
Me and another dude
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: kingv on February 22, 2020, 03:20:13 AM
Thanks, man! I haven't really shown most of this to people before. It's very difficult to gauge how good it is or isn't, because I hear all the flaws where it didn't come out exactly how I wanted it.

We have been recording songs off and on since high school. He's the one with most of the musical talent though, does all the production and mastering (and frankly has the better verses), he plays in a number of bands as well.

We stopped for a long time, but now every time I go back to visit my family we try to record at least one song with the goal to get an EP done. His girl is seriously considerate to let me stay at their house until like 3AM. I might be able to dig up some older stuff, but frankly a lot of that is embarassingly awful. Most of it was just recorded on a 4 track with beats made on like that PSX beat making game by drunk 22 year olds. Some of the samples in the Killing Gods track were actually from really old stuff we recorded years ago.

There were originally like maybe 10 of us that did it, but only Freeze and I really still do it at all. One dude is really really talented, but we haven't been able to get him to show up, unfortunately.
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Transhuman on February 22, 2020, 10:51:00 PM
https://voca.ro/ePGNVv6GOyC
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: shosta on February 23, 2020, 03:57:56 AM
wypipo rap :lawd
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: kingv on February 23, 2020, 01:13:47 PM
wypipo rap :lawd

I’m basically Logic now.
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Transhuman on April 11, 2020, 09:22:58 AM
How great is music?
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: toku on April 11, 2020, 11:00:01 AM
proud of you
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Transhuman on April 11, 2020, 07:43:56 PM
Why is that
Title: Re: Learning Music OT
Post by: Tasty on May 26, 2020, 12:17:36 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWWdcTbXLfk

Relationship goals.
Title: Re: Learning Music OT
Post by: Tasty on May 27, 2020, 06:16:23 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/7BoXGqvl.png)

Time spent practicing this year (in minutes.) Slowly clawing my way back. 😤

Also if anyone has opinions on the Yamaha P-515 vs. the Kawai (:uguu) ES8, speak now before I buy one or forever hold your peace. Leaning towards the Yamaha despite the heavier keys.
Title: Re: Learning Music OT
Post by: Tasty on May 31, 2020, 12:17:26 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/9ZCwbvS.jpg)

:tocry :tocry :tocry
Title: Re: Learning Music OT
Post by: eleuin on June 19, 2020, 01:04:52 AM
https://twitter.com/katie_dey/status/1273566975688495105
Title: Re: Learning Music OT
Post by: Trent Dole on June 19, 2020, 10:13:27 AM
Just follow these steps
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u0IgJIpAZsQ
Title: Re: Learning Music OT
Post by: Tasty on November 19, 2020, 09:33:47 PM
Next month is two years from when I started learning how to play! I took a personal inventory and I'm happy with my progress so far. There's been some gap weeks but fewer this year than 2019, I'm playing more often and practicing has gotten more enjoyable with time -- not less! :D I've kept up attending my remote 45-min weekly lessons too, and it seems like with COVID I was ahead of the curve getting a virtual teacher in spring of last year, haha.

Here's two videos I recorded around September, I've gotten better on both since then but been too lazy to record recently:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j3GevYxXqd4

https://youtu.be/TjD1jHDJz0M

The above has some bad singing but I stopped being embarrassed about my voice dozens of Chinatown karaoke trips ago. :-[

Right now I'm learning some Christmas pieces to play for the family. Good thing I love Christmas music. :P Every so often I try a harder piece than I think I would be able to do, just to see how realistic overcoming the gap is. Most of the time it seems doable. I'm trying out Adagio for Tron (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bv4gPcz0sxA) right now and the intro is challenging but a lot of fun.

I go back and forth on piano-only more "classical" pieces from like my book, and seeking out piano+vocal pop music sheets to try.

(https://i.imgur.com/7BoXGqvl.png)

Time spent practicing this year (in minutes.) Slowly clawing my way back. 😤

Also if anyone has opinions on the Yamaha P-515 vs. the Kawai (:uguu) ES8, speak now before I buy one or forever hold your peace. Leaning towards the Yamaha despite the heavier keys.

Progress update:

(https://i.imgur.com/ffOGOWCl.png) (https://i.imgur.com/ALdvrqVl.png) (https://i.imgur.com/2hp6Zrql.png)

(minutes spent practicing per week)

Surpassed my 2019 totals a few weeks ago. Like I said I'm pretty happy. :) Just need to start getting into more advanced stuff and actually taking the music theory side seriously instead of winging it. Still want to complete some level of ABRSM in the next year. 😤

Anyways that's my update. Hope others have been keeping the music alive too. :rock
Title: Re: Learning Music OT
Post by: Tasty on November 19, 2020, 09:47:41 PM
Also I love love love love LOVE my Yamaha P-515! It's honestly the best purchase I've ever made and it's made me so immensely happy I cried the day I got it. :D It got me thinking I don't really need further physical items... Between my laptop, Switch, and Yamaha piano, I'm pretty much happy forever. :heartbeat

I waited an entire extra year beyond when I originally thought I'd upgrade from my old keyboard, but it was more than worth it. I was able to save up and get something that's really good and will last me for years to come.

(https://i.imgur.com/SuTnrRt.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/ktN7dV7.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/pGJrEFk.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/Ai2NLJJ.jpg)


:heartbeat :heartbeat :heartbeat
Title: Re: Learning Music OT
Post by: team filler on November 20, 2020, 02:02:42 AM
I can sing while you play the keys, bb  :-[
Title: Re: Learning Music OT
Post by: Tasty on November 20, 2020, 08:54:55 AM
Let's do Over the Rainbow together :uguu

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HreQIuq8xaE
Title: Re: 🎼 Musicality 🎹 🎸 🥁 🎻 🎷
Post by: Tasty on November 20, 2020, 11:19:09 AM
https://soundcloud.com/stro-legitshook2


As of today I have finally finished the full cover album for Chinese Democracy that I've wanted to do for years because I'm an asshole. Seemed like as good a time as any to really try to push myself to improve as a player and learn to use my software (FL Studio) that I've had for probably a decade and barely scratched the surface of.

Tbh the most frustrating part wasn't learning the parts or realizing some shit I'm never going to be able to play, but in getting the right amp sound. There are so many variables that go into it, up to and including shit I can't control at all like interference. I'm not satisfied with all the songs, nor the sound on all the songs, but I am satisfied enough to finish it and put it out there. All drum and bass tracks are from the Rock Band 2 stems, but all guitar/piano/synths/strings on every song is all me.

I think I'm most satisfied/proud of There Was A Time, Prostitute, Better, and Catcher In The Rye. Honestly I think the part I enjoyed most was fucking around with the non-guitar stuff. I'm also :dead at roughly 90% of all the non guitar instrumentation (and actually I believe some of the songs on the album do have VST guitars and/or sampled loops) could be almost 1:1 recreated with stock FL Studio plugins. Shit it probably was.


My set up is FL Studio, an Epiphone Casino that probably needs a full tune up and adjustments, a Vypyr amp with line in directly into my PC's sound card. It took me fucking around for a while to realize there's a tool to reduce amp buzz, which sometimes works really well and other times can completely fuck up the sound, again depending on a million variables. But for an amateur that has really never sat down and applied myself and learned most of these songs by ear since there aren't tabs for half of them and I can't read sheet music so piano/strings stuff had to be all by ear by default, I'm happy with how it all turned out.

Finally listened to the three your had left on Soundcloud and was totally blown away! Even with the bass and drum being provided I left the Chrome tab going and was just jamming along without a care in the world. Not familiar with Chinese Democracy but I dig the sound. My favorite track is Better, quite catchy.
Title: Re: Learning Music OT
Post by: Tasty on January 07, 2021, 10:50:03 AM
End of the year update! [...]

End of the year update, 2020 edition! (a little late, sue me)

Made a lot of good progress this year, mostly around habits and being more consistent about coming back to the piano day after day, week after week. According to my data, I went from 51 hours of practice and lessons in 2019 to 73 hours this past year. :D (Let's get that over 100 hours in 2021!! :punch)

I've been working with the same teacher since April 2019 and it's been paying off. I'm almost through Faber's Adult Piano Adventures Book 1, with plans to move onto Book 2 after my ABRSM exams.

(https://i.imgur.com/WeH7o2P.jpg)

Speaking of, I'll be booking my remote exams sometime in the next week! Even though I didn't accomplish the goal of passing Grade 1 in 2020, I'm teed up perfectly to do so right at the start of 2021. :heart My official exam book with a whopping 9 pieces just arrived from the UK (slight water damage, 'nache), but I'm starting to really dig into my first official ABRSM piece. It's difficult but doable, I feel.

I have to give a shoutout to my new life partner and companion: my Yamaha P-515. This ivory-looking beauty is what I had dreams of some nights. And, she sings for me. :heartbeat I had to save up for an entire extra year, but it was completely worth it and I honestly love practicing sometimes just to feel her keys beneath my fingers.

I consider my singing/playing pop music covers "extra credit," and it's been fun learning parts of different songs. I've only got two of these down completely, though: Don't Think Twice (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=il1zid5_lnI) and Coming Home, Pt. II (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k84QxVJd0tI). I performed the former for my parents on their anniversary and the latter privately for my mom. All I'll say is practice pays off and there's no shortcut. :lol I want to "finish" so many other songs but the patience/focus requirements get pretty steep for anything slightly non-repetitive. Shout-outs to MusicNotes (https://www.musicnotes.com/commerce/myaccount.asp), which I've spent way too much money at -- even if they might be a scam I love the range of songs they have and their player helps me visual difficult parts (and is just fun to listen to, imo. :P)

Still, I know where my weaknesses are and having my teacher point things out has been indispensable. I'm more driven and excited to play than ever because certain basic things are starting to become so much easier -- I can see the path forward to more advanced music, I don't have to "imagine" how that path looks anymore.

Even simple things like knowing the staff well has made practicing and just trying new pieces out 10x more fun. As long as I make sure to sit on the bench each day, learning piano has become a self-sustaining reaction. I'm still a little scared of hitting that first real big wall, but until then I'm having the time of my life. ✌🏻

Title: Re: Learning Music OT
Post by: Tasty on January 26, 2021, 12:04:27 PM
My first official ABRSM piece!!!

(https://i.imgur.com/6smk3hb.jpg)

(no piracy plz they apparently take scans of sheet music super cereal, please support the official release (https://www.amazon.com/Piano-Exam-Pieces-2021-2022/dp/1786013878/ref=sr_1_6?dchild=1&keywords=abrsm+grade+1&qid=1611680697&sr=8-6))

Been practicing for about two weeks a little every day in between learning how to cover a Kelly Clarkson song. 😬 :P

I've got the fingering pretty much down for the first half, definitely tricky. But now that I'm bringing it up to speed I honestly get a little spooked out when I "pull it off" quickly without consciously thinking about it. Obviously I've known muscle memory is a real thing forever, but to see such a stark example clearly is, yeah, a bit spooky.

Second half looks a bit more difficult but I'm not deterred. This is a really old piece (for harpsichords) so the pic I posted is a more "modern" interpretation even though the notes are the same. Double treble cleff always throw me though, and of course they couldn't resist and had it switch back to bass clef for the last three and a half measures. :social

So next steps:
- Bring first half up to speed
- Get fingering on second half
- Bring second half up to speed
- Focus on dynamics

If I get the fingering down on the second half I'll probably overlap practice with my second ABRSM piece (to be determined -- all the B section pieces look even more tough! :o)

I am anticipating taking my Grade 1 exam in the March period (1st-21st), which gives me at most eight weeks to nail all three pieces. Let's go!
Title: Re: Learning Music OT
Post by: Tasty on March 05, 2021, 09:56:07 PM
New York Magazine: The Everything Guide to Picking Up the Piano, As An Adult (https://nymag.com/strategist/article/piano-classes-for-adults.html)

Quote
Dwight Bell, 64, first heard Mozart’s Sonata in A-major, K. 331, 30 years ago in an episode of The Twilight Zone in which the dolls in a dollhouse come to life. He eventually wanted to play it — a desire that only intensified after he heard Spanish pianist Alicia de Larrocha’s version on the radio. “It sounded easy to play. Little did I know,” he says.
Title: Re: Learning Music OT
Post by: Tasty on March 13, 2021, 10:43:29 PM
https://soundcloud.com/wickedtasty/ordinary-day-instrumental-verses-1-and-2/s-2h0pTNKwxvA

First real (recorded) attempt, made a couple of mistakes for sure. I also need to integrate vocals and the third verse, but this is coming along. :)
Title: Re: Learning Music OT
Post by: Tasty on March 19, 2021, 10:25:08 PM
https://soundcloud.com/wickedtasty/dont-think-twice-take-2/s-dzRsELz1qq5

The second recording I made of Don't Think Twice by Utada Hikaru. I have the rest down but messed it up in this recording. Need more oomph in the vocals too, was a bit drunk here.
Title: Re: Learning Music OT
Post by: Tasty on March 21, 2021, 11:59:51 PM
Just got rly high and played my keyboard and karaoke'd and loved it :aah
Title: Re: Learning Music OT
Post by: Tasty on April 19, 2021, 11:50:05 AM
Deriving the piano keyboard from biological principles using clustering (Jupyter) (https://fiftysevendegreesofrad.github.io/JupyterNotes/piano.html)
Title: Re: Learning Music OT
Post by: Tasty on April 19, 2021, 11:50:59 AM
http://openmusictheory.com/scales.html

Also every time I realize how scales work it gets quicker and quicker lol. Hoping the info sticks this time, finally seeing how the code in The Matrix functions. 8)
Title: Re: Learning Music OT
Post by: Tasty on August 21, 2021, 11:25:43 AM
Craigslist customer dumbfounded by seller’s ‘haunted’ piano listing: ‘Please take this out of my home’ (https://www.yahoo.com/now/twitter-users-losing-over-haunted-201537416.html)

https://twitter.com/bubbaprog/status/1427431450803068932
Title: Re: Learning Music OT
Post by: Tasty on September 17, 2021, 10:53:20 AM
https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/brian-wilson-revisits-peerless-songbook-091847126.html

Quote
“I play it when I’m happy or feeling sad,” he continues. “I love playing for people and I love playing alone when no one is listening. Honestly, the piano and the music I create on it has probably saved my life.”

https://youtu.be/O8qhfG5iXIc

"God only knows what I'd be without you..."
Title: Re: Learning Music OT
Post by: CatsCatsCats on September 17, 2021, 12:34:07 PM
Keep up the good work Andy-kun!
Title: Re: Learning Music OT
Post by: Tasty on September 17, 2021, 12:37:24 PM
Keep up the good work Andy-kun!

:o Thanks! 😊
Title: Re: Learning Music OT
Post by: Tasty on September 17, 2021, 09:14:39 PM
Musical components important for the Mozart K448 effect in epilepsy (https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-021-95922-7)

Quote
There is growing evidence for the efficacy of music, specifically Mozart’s Sonata for Two Pianos in D Major (K448), at reducing ictal and interictal epileptiform activity. Nonetheless, little is known about the mechanism underlying this beneficial “Mozart K448 effect” for persons with epilepsy.

...

Apart from one other composition—Mozart’s Piano Sonata in C Major (K545)—the therapeutic properties of K448 could not be replicated with other musical stimuli. Stimuli previously tested were other Mozart compositions, Beethoven’s Fur Elise, and a string version of K448.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9iePyP2HOr8

This one song by Mozart -on the piano only- can mysteriously calm epileptic episodes in those prone to them. Absolutely fascinating.

It is honestly quite the banger. I believe they used this on at least one episode of Ouran High School Host Club.
Title: Re: Learning Music OT
Post by: Tasty on July 16, 2022, 02:20:29 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6aezSL_GvZA