Apple has removed Epic Games’ battle royale Fortnite from the App Store after the developer on Thursday implemented its own in-app payment system that bypassed Apple’s standard 30 percent fee. The decision marks a significant escalation in the feud between Epic and one of the most popular mobile app stores in the US, and it comes at an especially fraught time for Apple as the iPhone maker navigates antitrust concerns over its operation of its mobile marketplace and the rules it imposes on certain developers.
Chairman Tim fighting the good fight.
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Hate fortnite, but Apple sucks with its payment rules, get fucked Apple.The most 'let them fight' situation ever?
Hate fortnite, but Apple sucks with its payment rules, get fucked Apple.The most 'let them fight' situation ever?
Yeah they made a video, hired lawyers... then released the software knowing it'd get pulled.
Fun to watch I guess.
Is the older version of the game still available for kiddos?
Fuck Epic trying to force this shit on Apple. Not that I'm a fan of Apple at all, but this is just a planned attack on Apple from Epic. Tim shitlord Sweeney at it again
30% cut is too big compared to what exactly? Don't most if not all platform holders take a 30% cut?
How is Apple 'stifling' competition? Does Epic have their own mobile device store? What competition are we speaking of?
Why should they allow devs to circumvent the cut entirely if the app is hosted on Apple's servers and Epic has agreed to those conditions Apple has placed on their store?
Who are the bad guys here, someone do my thinking for me pls :trumpsI dunno, but Epic gave me some free games, Apple gave me just a lot of headaches with their fucking tech support bullshit, back in the day.
Who are the bad guys here, someone do my thinking for me pls :trumps
Remember when Epic used to actually make games?By themselves or with the help of Digital Extremes, etc.? :teehee
Remember when Epic used to actually make games?
Who are the bad guys here, someone do my thinking for me pls :trumps
Remember when Epic used to actually make games?
Whoever wins, we loseI see it as Whoever loses, we win... Fuck Apple, Fuck Fortnight and Fuck Epic. Let one kill the other. Like a giant cock fight of shitty games, as far as I'm concerned.
I'm really sceptical that any of Fortnites playerbase would get the reference that that freefortnite video is parodying
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VtvjbmoDx-I
It feels like there's already a million "HEY HERE'S WHERE THIS CAME FROM AND WHY IT WAS AN IMPORTANT AD" tweets out there.
It feels like there's already a million "HEY HERE'S WHERE THIS CAME FROM AND WHY IT WAS AN IMPORTANT AD" tweets out there.
Well its a good opportunity for techbloggers to pretend they know whats being talked about and try and grow an audience that don't give a fuck about them or read anything they write (or read anything at all because they get all their news direct from YT)
The game industry has quickly moved to launchers and their own platform infrastructure vs. using the platform of the hardware manufacturer (which was standard).
LOL. wtf are you talking about?
Other than on PC where launchers abound.. like.. what?
Why doesn't Epic just make their own mobile os if they don't want to do any revenue split? Brats would make their parents buy Fortnite phones.
How long til Tim pitches a big baby fit about the cut for console manufacturers and takes his ball away from them too?They'd be suing one of their investors (Sony), but idk, maybe it's common.
How long til Tim pitches a big baby fit about the cut for console manufacturers and takes his ball away from them too?
How long til Tim pitches a big baby fit about the cut for console manufacturers and takes his ball away from them too?
Hoping this escalates further and causes the death of the walled garden. It is ridiculous to buy any hardware and not be able to choose what software runs on it.
Hoping this escalates further and causes the death of the walled garden. It is ridiculous to buy any hardware and not be able to choose what software runs on it.
Hoping this escalates further and causes the death of the walled garden. It is ridiculous to buy any hardware and not be able to choose what software runs on it.
https://twitter.com/Slasher/status/1295434558112960519 (https://twitter.com/Slasher/status/1295434558112960519)
Hoping this escalates further and causes the death of the walled garden. It is ridiculous to buy any hardware and not be able to choose what software runs on it.
Same with ps4/xbox?
Hoping this escalates further and causes the death of the walled garden. It is ridiculous to buy any hardware and not be able to choose what software runs on it.
Same with ps4/xbox?
Yes.
I mean I'm pro custom firmware in relation to electronic devices but I understand why it would be against the rules of the products
Hoping this escalates further and causes the death of the walled garden. It is ridiculous to buy any hardware and not be able to choose what software runs on it.lol apple don't curr about fortnite.
Hoping this escalates further and causes the death of the walled garden. It is ridiculous to buy any hardware and not be able to choose what software runs on it.
Same with ps4/xbox?
Hoping this escalates further and causes the death of the walled garden. It is ridiculous to buy any hardware and not be able to choose what software runs on it.
So you don't buy a console, then?
The Walled Garden is fine. The issue is Apple mandating everything going through their store for purchases. Which is where the issue for Epic is.
Thing is: It's a good thing in comparison to Google Play and it's malware app problems.
Why shouldn't everyone be able to have Steam on Xbox or Game Pass on Playstation?
Well that's why PC has traditionally always been the place for those who value options. That's why Apple isn't good for those who value options.
A console is not for someone who wants options.
fuck you naff, don't lasagna-shame me. :'(Well that's why PC has traditionally always been the place for those who value options. That's why Apple isn't good for those who value options.
A console is not for someone who wants options.
People often have different opinions on what they care about when shopping for stuff. I'm pretty sure if you gave people a choice, they would....make choices.
Hoping this escalates further and causes the death of the walled garden. It is ridiculous to buy any hardware and not be able to choose what software runs on it.
So you don't buy a console, then?
The Walled Garden is fine. The issue is Apple mandating everything going through their store for purchases. Which is where the issue for Epic is.
Thing is: It's a good thing in comparison to Google Play and it's malware app problems.
I mean, you can have an app store that only supports certain devices for QA and security reasons. Would the iPhone become worse if it allowed side-loading though?
Frankly, I'm all for Apple keeping their shit tight if it means supporting their shit is much easier on me in a consumer and enterprise way. As much as I hate the "Apple way of doing" shit, I will give them props that their end-user experience is generally solid enough to where I'm not called on Apple support often.
Well Google allows it to circumvent the Playstore. I guess their strategy is to play hard when it comes play store revenue share but otherwise to pretend to be the good guy here.
Frankly, I'm all for Apple keeping their shit tight if it means supporting their shit is much easier on me in a consumer and enterprise way. As much as I hate the "Apple way of doing" shit, I will give them props that their end-user experience is generally solid enough to where I'm not called on Apple support often.
"I'm fine with their bullshit because it makes my job slightly easier" :doge
Hoeg Law on YouTube has breakdown videos of the two lawsuits. The more I listen the more I think these lawsuits don’t survive in court.
Hoeg Law on YouTube has breakdown videos of the two lawsuits. The more I listen the more I think these lawsuits don’t survive in court.
Well, without looking too deeply into it Epic's lawsuit seems to come down to "Apple shouldn't be able to kick us off their platform for doing something that their rules expressly forbid us from doing."
Apple allows subscriptions and other content purchased outside of the App Store for most types of software, very similar to Google... without Apple getting a cut. Apple's and Google rules are essentially the same here, the difference is Android allows software installed outside of the Play store.
And Epic ENTIRELY bypassed play store to avoid giving Google their cut, WTF are you talking about?
In app purchases on Google Play also require you use Goolge's payment systems.. Epic tried getting in without that, and were denied.
They capitulated only a few months ago, likely always planning all along to do the same thing they did on iOS:
https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-52383286#:~:text=Epic%20Games%20has%20released%20Fortnite,cut%20of%20in%2Dgame%20purchases.
And now Google did the same thing, booted Fortnite... because less than 6 months into launching on Play Store they released the version that doesn't use Google Pay lol
And Apple does allow paid content in apps on their store, as well as subs, without Apple getting a cut.
And Apple does allow paid content in apps on their store, as well as subs, without Apple getting a cut.
I didn’t know about this. Which apps are the standouts in your mind?
it's almost like you are the most obnoxious human being on the planet.
You haven't gathered anything you fucking moron.
It's absolutely pathetic that the bare minimum of fact checking I do here somehow gets me labeled "obnoxious" and I need to "get over myself."
I get it, you guys don't give 2 shits about being lied to, and forming opinions based on lies.
Enjoy being idiots.
You really are the most annoying kind of troll.
Your brain being unable to comprehend the idea of a person becoming rich and not using that money to fuck kids is how I know you are a pedo.
Aslo you play pedo games, but still.
If you run into an asshole in the morning, you ran into an asshole. If you run into assholes all day, you're the asshole.
Hope you enjoyed your free games from Epic store while they lasted.
https://twitter.com/EpicNewsroom/status/1295430127455596544 (https://twitter.com/EpicNewsroom/status/1295430127455596544)
Tim Sweeney thinking he could take on Apple :heh
(http://www.quickmeme.com/img/32/32b4229145de0a2c1171b9b5757f25dfaa1bbf7b9be0b687be4dd5aec76a34d6.jpg)
If you come for Apple you better not miss
https://twitter.com/Slasher/status/1295434558112960519 (https://twitter.com/Slasher/status/1295434558112960519)
“Forced.” One could always just not buy those games and instead wait for the inevitable release elsewhere, or maybe devote their time/money to other things. Lord knows the average working adult has a kings ransom of choices in games these days and likely could never get to playing everything they want.
If Apple chooses instead to take punitive action by blocking consumer access to Fortnite or forthcoming updates, then Epic will, regrettably, be in conflict with Apple on a multitude of fronts - creative, technical, business, and legal - for so long as it takes to bring about change, if necessary for many years.
“Forced.” One could always just not buy those games and instead wait for the inevitable release elsewhere, or maybe devote their time/money to other things. Lord knows the average working adult has a kings ransom of choices in games these days and likely could never get to playing everything they want.
That doesn't negate the fact you are forced to use their store if you have any intentions of playing these games day one. Regardless of your perception of time and ability to play any games at all
Sure I could play other things. Do I want to play Hitman 3 when it comes out? Yes. Do I want to buy anything from Sweeney cuckold? No.
https://twitter.com/MrRobRoberts/status/1296916086911246336
Those e-mails :doge
Guideline 2.3.1 - Performanceas per the emails filed as evidence
We discovered that your app contains hidden features. Attempting to hide features,functionality or content in your app is considered egregious behavior and can lead to removal from the Apple Developer Program.
Specifically, we found that your app includes an “Epic direct payment” feature, which provides access to external payment mechanisms and enables the purchase of content,services, or functionality by means other than the in-app purchase API
Go against Apple's lawyers and hand them their defense - as well a possible avenue to countersue - by yourself brehs
well if that was epic's plan, and that's the only plan that lines up with this pointless bluster, then I wonder how myopic their leadership is to think this will matter at all in a few weeks time given apple is about to drop new shiny shit.Go against Apple's lawyers and hand them their defense - as well a possible avenue to countersue - by yourself brehs
Doubt it's that simple. It seems pretty obvious that they never expected to win any legal battles. It feels like the one goal Epic had in those emails was to get Tim Cook to say "We are your lords beeotch" or something like that which is totally legally okay, but leaves a bad taste in the consumers mouth.
Basically, they know there's no legal argument here but they're paying their lawyers to drag this out for as long as possible so that the consumers and developers can rubberneck the ugliness of Apple, Google, etc having app stores that return an 80% profit margin just to act as the middleman.
The question is will anyone care if they see the app vendors screwing over everybody on both sides?
Anyone who invested in Epic must be WTF'ing pretty hard right now including Sony lolFeels like Tim got just a little bit too greedy, which is weird to say, since the other side of this is Apple, :lol.
Epic's lawyers claiming devs are already fleeing Unreal in droves... yeah, because your boss is a freak show who puts all of his partners at risk lol
With the way this is going this will end up with Tim Sweeney jumping from a bridge live on Facebook blaming Apple.
Epic's lawyers claiming devs are already fleeing Unreal in droves...
There will be class actions against Sony/Microsoft the second any court decides Apples practice isn't fair.
Is Fortnite totally gone from iOS then?
I'm literally incapable of dumbing this down any further for you
(https://i.imgur.com/mXpRlyX.jpg)
Epic could not give a single shit about why things are to the left or to the right, they just want apple to move either left or right
You two should really just get it over with and fuck. Get rid of all that tension.put it on onlyfans :phil
- iOS on Fortnite allows content purchased outside of iOS... same as Xbox or Playstation..
Yes, Epic are suing Google to..
Honestly, the actual lawsuit about 95% applies to Sony/Microsoft:
https://cdn2.unrealengine.com/apple-complaint-734589783.pdf
The lawsuit is basically "Apple collects fees on all in-app purchases and doesn't allow competing app stores".
There's barely anything UNIQUE to Apple that doesn't apply to Sony and Microsoft.. and the reality is that MS's/Sony's practices are far WORSE in relation to most of what is being said here. They enact more control overall, not less, than Apple does.
Epic going after only cell phone OS makers is pretty damn arbitrary. While they are likely to fail, if somehow they do win.. unless the ruling only cites Apple-specific complaints like not allowing apps to tell users they can pay elsewhere, it's a ruling that could haunt console manufacturers.
But in the new filing, Epic argues that more than its reputation has been harmed: “Daily active users on iOS have declined by over 60% since Fortnite’s removal from the App Store,” Epic claims. (It measured through September 2nd, in case you’re curious; by that point Fortnite had effectively split into two different games.)
Epic says iOS is the biggest platform for Fortnite, too: 116 million registered users, or nearly a third of the 350 million registered users Epic says Fortnite has attracted in total. It also claims 63 percent of Fortnite users on iOS access Fortnite only on iOS, and that it’s the only way for many people to play the game.
Epic says it’s worried it “may never see these users again” (referring to the 60 percent decline); that its Fortnite community of players has been torn apart; and that some of its non-Fortnite customers have also been collateral damage. As we reported last week, some of Epic’s other games are no longer available to re-download, and Epic says that its Shadow Complex Remastered has been removed from the Mac App Store, too, after Apple terminated Epic’s developer account.
Epic also claims that Apple is threatening to deny any attempts to apply for a new developer account “for at least a year,” quoting a communication from Apple itself, and is arguing that the harm it would endure by being “denied the opportunity to access even a single new user among the one-billion-plus iOS users for at least the next year” is harm worth creating a preliminary injunction for.
Epic argues that more than its reputation has been harmed: “Daily active users on iOS have declined by over 60% since Fortnite’s removal from the App Store,” Epic claims. (It measured through September 2nd, in case you’re curious;[/u] by that point Fortnite had effectively split into two different games.)
Epic says iOS is the biggest platform for Fortnite, too: 116 million registered users, or nearly a third of the 350 million registered users Epic says Fortnite has attracted in total. It also claims 63 percent of Fortnite users on iOS access Fortnite only on iOS, and that it’s the only way for many people to play the game.
Epic says it’s worried it “may never see these users again” (referring to the 60 percent decline);[/u]
While Google announced that it would seek the dismissal of Epic's complaint over the Play Store, Apple's filing says the iPhone maker "looks forward to defending against Epic's baseless claims."
On the basis of its counterclaims, which are largely based in contract law but also invoke California Unfair Competition Law, Apple seeks damages and "demands a trial by jury on all issues so triable."
The following paragraph is the most interesting one to me--and I wouldn't be surprised to see some references to China in next year's trial:
"Not content with attacking Apple's app review process, Epic, backed by the tech giant Tencent (which has its own competing app store, one of the largest in the world), also seeks to dismantle the App Store's entire business model to advance its own economic interests without regard to the effect on other developers and consumers."
Tencent owns other games companies as well, such as Supercell (Clash of Clans, Hay Day etc.). And here's a link to Tencent's app store.
Apple says it wants to close all of Epic's accounts in part to prevent what it calls a "shell game" of apps being transferred from one developer account to another. But Apple says it's also because the company now sees Epic's Unreal Engine as a "potential threat" that "poses as a second potential 'trojan horse' that would enable Epic to carry through on its threats to undermine the App Store and insert further unauthorized features."
Apple trying to murder all UE4 dev on iOS:
https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2020/09/apple-asks-to-block-ios-unreal-engine-development-in-new-court-filing/ (https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2020/09/apple-asks-to-block-ios-unreal-engine-development-in-new-court-filing/)QuoteApple says it wants to close all of Epic's accounts in part to prevent what it calls a "shell game" of apps being transferred from one developer account to another. But Apple says it's also because the company now sees Epic's Unreal Engine as a "potential threat" that "poses as a second potential 'trojan horse' that would enable Epic to carry through on its threats to undermine the App Store and insert further unauthorized features."
That's right, use UE4 on iOS to make your game and Epic will sneak in secret code on deployment to undermine the App Store, those sneaky boogers
Haha fuck both parties but seriously fuck Apple the most
Maybe he should sue Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo next for being a "monopoly" on their platforms? :girlaff
Why wouldnt they push for an Epic Store on consoles if it would serve them?
Lmao Epic destroyed by judge :lol
Lmao Epic destroyed by judge :lol?
Lmao Epic destroyed by judge :lol?
Yeah, uhh.. that's what I was saying in this thread lol
GreatSage, thoughts?
They can't, and don't, bypass it on consoles.. hence what the judge said.. and what I've been saying.. JFC..
PC AND CONSOLE SAVINGS
Starting today, any V-Bucks or real-money offers you purchase on PlayStation 4, Xbox One, Nintendo Switch, PC, and Mac are now discounted by up to 20%. You don’t need to do anything!
Where does it say that Epic are no longer paying fees to the console platform holders? All I’m seeing in that linked PR piece is that Epic chose to reduce the cost of purchasing their digital monopoly money, not that the platform holders are seeing a lesser percentage than before.
Why in the world do you think the consoles don't charge 30%? Because Epic gave a discount on consoles? lol
Like you are so ignorant of how this shit works.. they do charge 30%.
Sony makes most of their revenue from MTX...
Fuck you you dumb gaslighting piece of shit.
hence why I include the past tense.. as I explained to you several times,
iOS/Apple allows content purchased from outside their store
Apple Removes Fortnite from the App Store
Allowed = past tense, referring to Fortnite
Allows = current tense, for games that didn't get their dumbasses pulled from Apples store
These aren't Fortnite specific rules after all you stupid cunt.
edit: Actually I said worked/works you dumb motherfucker
Here you go you dumb biaaattchhh:
https://developer.apple.com/app-store/review/guidelines/Quote3.1.3(b) Multiplatform Services: Apps that operate across multiple platforms may allow users to access content, subscriptions, or features they have acquired in your app on other platforms or your web site, including consumable items in multi-platform games, provided those items are also available as in-app purchases within the app.
I've been telling you from the start you have no clue how any of this shit works.. I love how the only thing I got wrong, that Netflix has a link on PS4/Xbox that opens a browser window to subscribe gets thrown in my face lol.. meanwhile everything else about a console works about the same as it does on iOS. (except console manufacturers charge devs WAY MORE realistically due to certification fees in the 10's of thousands)
And as I pointed out before.... and maybe you'll actually read this now:
PS4 was the only version of Fortnite that initially locked users into purchases only on Playstation. You couldn't even use your account at all outside of PS4, no buying content outside of PS4, etc... oh and yeah Sony charges 30%. Epic eventually got Sony to fix that, well after Fortnite's release.
During Monday's hearing on Epic's request for an injunction that would force Apple to return Fortnite to the iOS App Store while the legal action between them proceeds, the judge presiding over the matter said she'd prefer that the lawsuit be tried in front of a jury. In a filing made the following day, Epic and Apple were actually able to find common ground on something: They'd prefer not to bring a jury into it.
"During the September 28, 2020, hearing on Epic’s Motion for a Preliminary Injunction, the Court indicated that it '[did not] want to try two cases' and was 'inclined to try both cases at once,' and asked the parties to inform the Court by 5:00 PM PT on September 29, 2020, whether either party demands a jury trial," the filing states.
"Epic and Apple have met and conferred, and the parties agree that Epic’s claims and Apple’s counterclaims should be tried by the Court, and not by a jury. Therefore, with Epic’s consent, Apple hereby withdraws its demand for a jury trial pursuant to Federal Rule of Civil Procedure 38(d). The parties respectfully request that the case (including any claims and counterclaims) proceed to a bench trial on a schedule determined by the Court."
The comment about "two cases" is a reminder that there actually two separate actions going on here: Epic's lawsuit against Apple over "monopolistic practices" on the App Store, and Apple's breach of contract countersuit against Epic. Apple had initially demanded a trial by jury in its lawsuit.
A bench trial is one in which a judge, rather than a jury, hears the case and delivers a finding. The American Bar Association says that despite what you may have seen on television, bench trials are actually more common in civil matters than jury trials. In theory, a judge should be better equipped to follow complex legal arguments than a jury.
A trial date has not yet been set, but the judge in the case said yesterday that it likely won't take place until July 2021.
Please also tell more historical anecdotes about companies not involved in this lawsuit, they are super relevant.
Also: did Riotous get ultra-nuked?
That seems like a really bad idea. I’d expect nothing less from clown shoes Timmy.
Also: did Riotous get ultra-nuked?
Google cutting Play Store commission to 15% on first $1 million in revenue for all Android devs (https://9to5google.com/2021/03/16/google-play-store-commission/)
Googs trying to seem like the good guys lol.
Starting on July 1, 2021 we are reducing the service fee Google Play receives when a developer sells digital goods or services to 15% for the first $1M (USD) of revenue every developer earns each year. With this change, 99% of developers globally that sell digital goods and services with Play will see a 50% reduction in fees.
This is a victory for basically everyone and a loss for Apple. Rejoice!
Maybe not, Apple's happy and Sweeney's not. :lol Guess I should read further before posting, my bad.
This is a victory for basically everyone and a loss for Apple. Rejoice!
Maybe not, Apple's happy and Sweeney's not. :lol Guess I should read further before posting, my bad.
On Twitter, Epic CEO Tim Sweeney expressed disappointment in the order. “Today’s ruling isn’t a win for developers or for consumers,” Sweeney said. “Epic is fighting for fair competition among in-app payment methods and app stores for a billion consumers.” Separately, an Epic Games spokesperson told NPR that the company plans to appeal.This sounds entirely reasonable.
https://twitter.com/TimSweeneyEpic/status/1444125331544322049What the fuck does he actually think he’s saying, here?
https://twitter.com/TimSweeneyEpic/status/1445517299406938122
:dead
What the fuck does he actually think he’s saying, here?