Woman arrested for naming a teddy bear Mohammed

[Candyflip]

Old?
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21973378/

Too lazy to copy/paste and bold. Sorry.

[bagofeyes]

Older than Mohammed himself.

















or is it....?

[Ichirou]

Not just arrested, convicted.  This was in the Sudan.  She was an elementary school teacher at some sort of international school.  As an activity, she gave the kids teddy bears and told them to name them.  One boy named his teddy bear Mohammed, after himself.  The secretary at the school heard this and reported the teacher to the authorities for insulting Islam.  Ridiculous.

[Candyflip]

Not just arrested, convicted.  This was in the Sudan.  She was an elementary school teacher at some sort of international school.  As an activity, she gave the kids teddy bears and told them to name them.  One boy named his teddy bear Mohammed, after himself.  The secretary at the school heard this and reported the teacher to the authorities for insulting Islam.  Ridiculous.

Even more ridiculous is that this is grounds for arrest and holding. Amazing how ass-backwards religion can make people.

[bagofeyes]

I wonder how much this international school pays

[Gay Boy]

. Amazing how ass-backwards religion can make people.

Its the culture in the middle east, not the religion, thats the problem. For example America is filled with normal level-headed muslims.

[bagofeyes]

. Amazing how ass-backwards religion can make people.

Its the culture in the middle east, not the religion, thats the problem. For example America is filled with normal level-headed muslims.

and crazy-ass christians

[Ichirou]

It's fundamentalism that's the problem, be it christian or islamic.

[Candyflip]

. Amazing how ass-backwards religion can make people.

Its the culture in the middle east, not the religion, thats the problem. For example America is filled with normal level-headed muslims.

Yeah, but seeing as their culture and laws are directly influenced by their religion, I'd say it's fair to cite it as a contributing factor. I'm not trying to say all Muslims are extremists, obviously..

[Bloodwake]

It's fundamentalism that's the problem, be it christian or islamic.

Exactly. Fundamentalism is an evil that plagues the world and its religions.

[Flannel Boy]

Exactly. religion is an evil that plagues the world.

.

[Gay Boy]

It's fundamentalism that's the problem, be it christian or islamic.

Way better way to explain what my point was.

Muslim/Islam is inheritnly not at fault, its the fundamentalism of the religion that is. Same with fundamentalist jews who kill palestinians or fundamentalist Christians who attack planned parenthood buildings.

Islam is not violent purely by definition due to the fact that the majority of muslims don't act violently. If islam bread violence then I doubt most would be decently peaceful. Fundamentalists USE islam as a reason for the violence, islam itself is not the cause of it, their fundamentalism is.

And Malek, that is not true. Society very likely could not function without religion. Religion gives people a sense of meaning and hope. There would be a lot more sucidial dreary depressed people not putting any effort into life if there was no religion, it'd be a big mess. We wouldn't have anymore people murdering in the name of their God but you also would have to say bye to a hell of a lot of  the optimism that exists in the world. Most people need some sort of crutch or reasoning to try to better their lives and be happy. It's not that easy to flip a switch.

[zeergoth]

It's fundamentalism that's the problem, be it christian or islamic.

Way better way to explain what my point was.

Muslim/Islam is inheritnly not at fault, its the fundamentalism of the religion that is. Same with fundamentalist jews who kill palestinians or fundamentalist Christians who attack planned parenthood buildings.

Islam is not violent purely by definition due to the fact that the majority of muslims don't act violently. If islam bread violence then I doubt most would be decently peaceful. Fundamentalists USE islam as a reason for the violence, islam itself is not the cause of it, their fundamentalism is.

And Malek, that is not true. Society very likely could not function without religion. Religion gives people a sense of meaning and hope. There would be a lot more sucidial dreary depressed people not putting any effort into life if there was no religion, it'd be a big mess. We wouldn't have anymore people murdering in the name of their God but you also would have to say bye to a hell of a lot of  the optimism that exists in the world. Most people need some sort of crutch or reasoning to try to better their lives and be happy. It's not that easy to flip a switch.

[Gay Boy]

I don't need religion to be happy and do stuff with my life but A LOT of people do.

[FlameOfCallandor]

Religion of peace, right guys?

[FlameOfCallandor]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/worldnews.html?in_article_id=496844&in_page_id=1811


My whole back felt like it was on fire': As a British t

Just what is it like to be lashed? In 1993, Gavin Sherrard-Smith, a computer expert from Cheltenham, received 50 lashes with a bamboo cane in a prison in Qatar.

He was accused of breaking an alcohol ban while living in Doha, the capital - something that Mr Sherrard-Smith, now 47, has always denied.

He was lashed for supposedly having alcohol. WTF!!

[Mupepe]

I don't need religion to be happy and do stuff with my life but A LOT of people do.

I agree.  If most of the people who believe in religion didn't have their respective religion, they'd find something equally as ridiculous to engage themselves in.  Gotta believe in something...

[zeergoth]

I don't understand why any sane person would want to go to a muslim-heavy country where you can get lashes and put in jail just for looking at someone the wrong way. Sure christian-heavy country's aren't great but the worst you'll deal with is stupidly ignorant people.

[Flannel Boy]

Cheebs, you are simply looking at causation as deterministic. In that narrow view cigarettes don't cause cancer and rain does not cause floods. Islam causes violence if it increases the probability of violence. And it does!

Non religious people are better educated and less likely to commit crime. That doesn't sound like they’re harming society. Countries that are fairly irreligious like Sweden, Japan, Denmark, and Finland are not falling apart. I'm sure religious America would love their crime rates and their life expectancy averages.

[zeergoth]

Cheebs, you are simply looking at causation as deterministic. In that narrow view cigarettes don't cause cancer and rain does not cause floods. Islam causes violence if it increases the probability of violence. And it does!

Non religious people are better educated and less likely to commit crime. That doesn't sound like they’re harming society. Countries that are fairly irreligious like Sweden, Japan, Denmark, and Finland are not falling apart. I'm sure religious America would love their crime rates and their life expectancy averages.

[FlameOfCallandor]

Non religious people are better educated and less likely to commit crime. That doesn't sound like they’re harming society. Countries that are fairly irreligious like Sweden, Japan, Denmark, and Finland are not falling apart. I'm sure religious America would love their crime rates and their life expectancy averages.

It's possible that these things have more to do with society and cultural than lack of religion.

[Flannel Boy]

Non religious people are better educated and less likely to commit crime. That doesn't sound like they’re harming society. Countries that are fairly irreligious like Sweden, Japan, Denmark, and Finland are not falling apart. I'm sure religious America would love their crime rates and their life expectancy averages.

It's possible that these things have more to do with society and cultural than lack of religion.

It's is not just possible, but likely that there are many other factors that are just as important or more so. That is not important! Cheebs wrote "Society very likely could not function without religion." I was pointing out how baseless this was. I am not claiming that atheism leads to low crime rates and high literacy rates. I am claiming that society can function well without being religious. And that non-religious members of society within religious societies also show this possibly.

[Mupepe]

i didn't read cheebs' "society could not function without religion" so i'm going to seperate myself from his comments now and JO

[Flannel Boy]

Interestingly the myth that society requires religion has historically been propagated by many non-religious people. And obviously continues to be. This is extreme egoism. "Sure I can function well without religion, but without the fear of god in them everyone else would turn into savages. Society would be ruined if we did not burn virgins, talk to oracles, and bow down to Jesus!" Hogwash!

[zeergoth]

 Sudan protesters: Execute teacher

http://edition.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/africa/11/30/sudan.bears/index.html

[Tauntaun]

Why hasn't Britain extracted her with S.A.S. units? 

[zeergoth]

Why hasn't Britain extracted her with S.A.S. units? 

Seriously, fucked up country's like that don't deserve any hospitality and no one should have anything to do with them. Do you think anyone will care if we piss off Sudan

[brawndolicious]

. Amazing how ass-backwards religion can make people.

Its the culture in the middle east, not the religion, thats the problem. For example America is filled with normal level-headed muslims.

it's not the middle east.  it's sudan.  didn't they just have a muslim/christian war?  they probably do these types of things to piss off christians/keep people acting pissed at christians.

and wtf are you talking about synbios?

I don't understand why any sane person would want to go to a muslim-heavy country where you can get lashes and put in jail just for looking at someone the wrong way. Sure christian-heavy country's aren't great but the worst you'll deal with is stupidly ignorant people.

[zeergoth]

. Amazing how ass-backwards religion can make people.

Its the culture in the middle east, not the religion, thats the problem. For example America is filled with normal level-headed muslims.

it's not the middle east.  it's sudan.  didn't they just have a muslim/christian war?  they probably do these types of things to piss off christians/keep people acting pissed at christians.

I'm sure there's more to it than that.

[brawndolicious]

what the fuck are you talking about?

[xnikki118x]

Isn't Mohammed like one of the most popular first names in the world?

There are people in the Christian-dominant U.S. who name their sons Jesus and no one arrests them.

[brawndolicious]

you can use it as your own name.  I think there's something missing from the story (as in the teacher was being framed for some reason).

[brawndolicious]

Muslim teaching is divided on the subject of naming objects. Seems like half believe it is an afront to god, and the other half don't.

well "ali" is a name of god in the quran so I'm sure it's not half of all muslims against those types of names.  I'm sure 95% of muslims have ali or mohammed somewhere in their names.   if you name a kid "allah" (which literally translates to "one god") then they could be offended by that though.

[MCD]

The 99 names of god/Allah are all adjectives.

which means, it's alright to name your kid the supreme (Ali) or whatever.

and yes, it's alright to name a boy Mohammed, but like am nintenho said, naming him Allah is not right by Islam.

as for naming "objects", dunno about that.

[FlameOfCallandor]

We should just kill all non muslims that way we can all be happy.

[etiolate]

Cheebs, you are simply looking at causation as deterministic. In that narrow view cigarettes don't cause cancer and rain does not cause floods. Islam causes violence if it increases the probability of violence. And it does!

Non religious people are better educated and less likely to commit crime. That doesn't sound like they’re harming society. Countries that are fairly irreligious like Sweden, Japan, Denmark, and Finland are not falling apart. I'm sure religious America would love their crime rates and their life expectancy averages.

Ehh nnnnyaaah no

But cigarettes have one single purpose and their product is toxic in a measurable sense. Once you smoke them, the process starts.

Religion is a faith and then also a congregation. It is sort of like, the faith is the cigarette unlit, the congregation is a room full of chain smokers. Your dealing with ideas and then physical things and comparing them. An idea, like a tool, can be used for things outsides its purpose. A crowbar is meant for prying open objects, like doors. It can also be used to murder someone through blunt trauma to the head. The cigarette could be used as a bookmark and cause no harm. That is not its intended purpose. The intended purpose of most religions is not harm.

Also, those countries are greatly homogenized. Religions like Islam and Christianity in their search to spread their ideas open themselves up to everyone, so they are counter-effective to homogenization. Of course, people can use them as tools for such a cause, but again that is the person not the tool.

[Flannel Boy]

tool, tool, tool.

That's all I read.


Most religions, like cigarettes, contain the ingredients that cause harm. They are divisive, they contain many horrible ethical precepts, and they devalue the material world. Just because some people use religion for benign purposes (like using a smoke for a bookmark) does not make the cigarette benign.

Also, those countries are greatly homogenized.

Vancouver, for example, is one of the least homogenous cities in the world. Most of the population isn’t religious. It must be falling apart. 

[Mandark]

When I was 12, I remember fast track, magnet-program students getting all silly/clever and saying "You know, communism works in *theory*, just not in practice."

I had it pegged for sophistry back then, but I didn't manage to articulate the problem until later:  Every philosophy of government or social order works in theory!  No system was ever designed to fail, no matter how stupid it looks to us now.  "You know, divine monarchy works in theory.  I mean, God wouldn't pick some asshole to rule us."

If a system, be it a religion or government, does not function in the real world as it does on paper, then the paper is wrong, not the world.

[brawndolicious]

Religions aren't fucking people either.  They don't have any qualities or uses outside of how people use them, and the fact is that religion has frequently been used as a tool to bolster the worst features of people like tribalism and systems of difference that sometimes lead to disastrous.  Saying they being used in bad faith reminds me of filthy hippies that claim communism is workable, it just wasn't given the right chance. 

wut?

like, you're comparing communist hippies to people who say they have the power of god..

I doubt this "punishment" actually makes sense to anybody.  it's only to incite hatred.  pretty much the only people that caught the bait are foc and synbios and everybody already hates them so it doesn't matter.

[Mandark]

Religions like Islam and Christianity in their search to spread their ideas open themselves up to everyone, so they are counter-effective to homogenization.

I've read this at least half a dozen times and I'm still not sure what it's meant to mean.

[etiolate]

Religions like Islam and Christianity in their search to spread their ideas open themselves up to everyone, so they are counter-effective to homogenization.

I've read this at least half a dozen times and I'm still not sure what it's meant to mean.

Well in the sense that a place like Sweden is homogenized, a religion seeking followers can't spread out unless it mixes with everyone and be welcoming of outsiders. A church that closes its doors is destined to die out.

[etiolate]

When I was 12, I remember fast track, magnet-program students getting all silly/clever and saying "You know, communism works in *theory*, just not in practice."

I had it pegged for sophistry back then, but I didn't manage to articulate the problem until later:  Every philosophy of government or social order works in theory!  No system was ever designed to fail, no matter how stupid it looks to us now.  "You know, divine monarchy works in theory.  I mean, God wouldn't pick some asshole to rule us."

If a system, be it a religion or government, does not function in the real world as it does on paper, then the paper is wrong, not the world.

WTF Mandark. First mistake is putting all plans on the same level. Second mistake is thinking in a 100% binary outcome one way or the other.

So all these things, every idea, that fails because it is done wrong, is a failure on paper. Basically what you're saying will lead to the realization that nothing will ever work if the best laid plans do not work, and they will all fail because of people, but it is the plans fault. Brilliant.

And when someone follows an idea correctly and creates a beneficial life, while others are following that idea but creating problems, it is the plans fault.  Yet, it created two outcomes that are different.



So, next time, when you're at McDonalds getting your cup of coffee and it comes in a protective sleeve, and it warns you that it is very hot and to be very cautious, but instead you get the idea to wipe the sleep out of your eyes with some of that fresh fast food java, well I'm blaming the cup if not the coffee.

[Mandark]

Now, now.

No need to be so dumb.

[Ichirou]

etiolate, re-read what Mandark wrote.  You completely didn't get what he was saying.

[etiolate]

I read system and paper and my brain translated them into 'plan'.

[recursivelyenumerable]

When I was 12, I remember fast track, magnet-program students getting all silly/clever and saying "You know, communism works in *theory*, just not in practice."

I had it pegged for sophistry back then, but I didn't manage to articulate the problem until later:  Every philosophy of government or social order works in theory!  No system was ever designed to fail, no matter how stupid it looks to us now.  "You know, divine monarchy works in theory.  I mean, God wouldn't pick some asshole to rule us."

the thing about communism though (if by communism you mean Marxism) is that there's not much practice in the theory.  most of Marx's writings are analysis of capitalist society, the discussion of the future is purposely left vague and open to interpretation.  "I don't write recipes for the cook-shops of the future".  the arguments over whether Lenin & co. implemented "real" Marxism are sort of beside the point for this reason.

[zeergoth]

[youtube=425,350]maHSOB2RFm4[/youtube].

[zeergoth]

Religion of peace