The thread of Pig Farmers Fulfilling Ancient Prophecies (the fantasy thread)

[studyguy]

Gardens of the Moon is such a better read the second time through.

Gardens of the Moon is the worst in that entire series.

[Human Snorenado]

Gardens of the Moon is such a better read the second time through.

Gardens of the Moon is the worst in that entire series.

Ehh... I'm not too sure the 8th or 9th books are better, tbh.

[Kara]

Claiming 1984 isnt also for children

One of the few authors whose book with talking animals is more mature than their other works.

Talking about this elsewhere on the internet but I think at this point my favorite thing of his is Shooting an Elephant.

Not really because it's great by any criteria but the picture it paints of Orwell's anti-imperalist / racist #dualities ends up being the most entertaining thing he's ever written, even if unintentional.

Overall i like his short stories more than his novels

That's a good'un to toss at people who idolize him.

[Kara]

TOP TEN

[Madrun Badrun]

Not according to the establishment. 

[studyguy]

TOP TEN

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Looks like a vote taken after junior year in high school tbh.

[Kara]

Not according to the establishment.

1984 is #13 on theirs.

[Human Snorenado]

TOP TEN

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7 of the readers top 10 occupied by Rand and Hubbard

[Joe Molotov]

@ the reader's list

spoiler (click to show/hide)

"Fear" is pretty good, tho.

[close]

[Phoenix Dark]

Quick run down of some TWOW info from Martin's ConQuest appearance a few days ago, plus some stuff from a few months ago:

(He started out by reading the recently released Alayne sample chapter)

-We will see more of the Mad Mouse in TWOW
-Don't read unless you finished ASOS:

spoiler (click to show/hide)

-TWOW will resolve the contents of Robb's will

[close]

-Mercy's identity is "out of the window" now, which I assume means [TWOW sample chapter spoiler]

spoiler (click to show/hide)

Arya will no longer be able to use that face and will move on

[close]

Also from Adam Whitehead:

Someone asked if "Howland, Eddard and Jon were the only people to leave the Tower of Joy alive," and GRRM amusedly said that, "Howland and Eddard" were the only people to leave the Tower of Joy alive. Which seems to throw a wrench in some versions of R+L=J.

There's a dispute over what Martin allegedly said. I assume he said or meant that Howland and Eddard were the only men who left the ToJ alive.

From a few months ago, concerning Nymeria:

"You know, I don't like to give things away." says Martin, a grin spreading across his face. "But you don't hang a giant wolf pack on the wall unless you intend to use it."

[chronovore]

TOP TEN

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What the actual fucking-fuckity fuck?

What group made the Readers’ List, and how can I stop them from breathing my oxygen?

[Madrun Badrun]

Ya if I could expand my life time by eating the souls of children, I'd use 2 African adoptees to read the book.  However, since I don't have 2 African adoptees, I won't be wasting my time.

[Phoenix Dark]

Game of Thrones: Martin Hopes to Finish Book Six Before Season 6
http://www.ign.com/articles/2015/06/01/george-r-r-martin-wants-to-finish-novel-before-sixth-season-of-game-of-thrones

I'm cautiously optimistic. I think it'll come out next year regardless, but the question is whether he can finish by February - which is when it would need to be done in order to come out in April. The two major structural problems that delayed AFFC and ADWD have been solved, and he's on record as saying he hasn't done nearly as much rewriting on TWOW as he did with those books.

Seems like his plan is for his stretch run to be October 2015-January 2016, plus half of February 2015.

[jakefromstatefarm]

Talking about this elsewhere on the internet but I think at this point my favorite thing of his is Shooting an Elephant.

Not really because it's great by any criteria but the picture it paints of Orwell's anti-imperalist / racist #dualities ends up being the most entertaining thing he's ever written, even if unintentional.

Overall i like his short stories more than his novels

he's prob the most touched on fiction author in the poli theory/sci literature I've read, but I see this and Catalonia drawn from way more than AF/1984. let me pull up a passage when I'm capacitated

e:

Nowhere has the "act of power" been more successfully examined than in Orwell's essay "Shooting an Elephant," from his days as a subinspector of police in the 1920s in colonial Burma...What frustrates logic for Orwell is that there are now more than two thousand colonial subjects who have followed and are watching him:

And suddenly I realized that I should have to shoot the elephant after all. The people expected it of me and I had got to do it; I could feel their two thousand wills pressing me forward, irresistibly. And it was at this moment, as I stood there with the rifle in my hands, that I first grasped the hollowness, the futility of the white man's dominion in the East. Here was I, the white man with his gun, standing in front of the unarmed native crowd-seemingly the leading actor of the piece; but in reality I was only an absurd puppet pushed to and fro by the will of those yellow faces behind. I perceived in this moment that when the white man turns tyrant it is his own freedom that he destroys. He becomes a sort of hollow posing dummy, the conventionalized figure of a sahib. For it is the condition of his rule that he shall spend his life in trying to impress the "natives", and so in every crisis he as to do what the "natives" expect of him. He wears a mask and his face grows to fit it. .  .  . A sahib has got to act like a sahib; he has got to appear resolute, to know his own mind and do definite things. To come all that way, rifle in hand, with two thousand people marching at my heels, and then to trail feebly away, having done nothing-no, that was impossible. The crowd would laugh at me. And my whole life, every white man's life in the East, was one long struggle not to be laughed at.

Orwell's use of the theatrical metaphor is pervasive: he speaks of himself as "leading actor of the piece," of hollow dummys, puppets, masks, appearances, and an audience poised to jeer if he doesn't follow the established script. As he experiences it, Orwell is no more free to be himself, to break convention, than a slave would be in the presence of a tyrannical master. If subordination requires a credible performance of humility and deference, so domination seems to require a credible performance of haughtiness and mastery. There are, however, two differences. If a slave transgresses the script he risks a beating, while Orwell risks only ridicule. Another important distinction is that the necessary posing of the dominant derives not from weaknesses but from the ideas behind their rule, the kinds of claims they make to legitimacy. A divine king must act like a god, a warrior king like a brave general; an elected head of a republic must appear to respect the citizenry and their opinions; a judge must seem to venerate the law. Actions by elites that publicly contradict the basis of a claim to power are threatening. The cynicism of the taped Oval Office conversations in the Nixon White House was a devastating blow to the public transcript claim to legality and high-mindedness. Similarly, the poorly concealed existence of special shops and hospitals for the party elites in the socialist bloc profoundly undercut the ruling party's public claim to rule on behalf of the working class.

https://books.google.com/books?id=ixkfcbWanf0C&pg=PA1&source=gbs_toc_r&cad=4#v=onepage&q&f=false

I like the idea of social behavior as performance. I haven't read the essay; from what I can gather it's intended as an anti-imperialist polemical but this passage strikes a more interesting nerve imo in how it emphasizes the theatrical nature of the public sphere. If I'm not butchering it, I can see what you mean by unintentional quality.

[Kara]

Since this turned into an Orwell sucks thread, on my book break I reread Teffi's "Subtly Worded" (the story not the anthology) and still couldn't believe that she managed to eviscerate the Party's control of language in 3 pages while that fucking oaf Orwell needed a damn dull dystopian novel to do the same thing. Oh yeah, Teffi managed to do it while being funny and celebrating human perseverance (without being schmaltzy) too.

Teffi da goddess

Orwell

[studyguy]

I finished Book 3 of the Lightbringer series The Broken Eye

I really like it so far, Weeks keeps shit laser focused while expanding shit out. Every title leaves cliffhangers for sure but none so vast that it takes away from the self contained arcs that rise and conclude with each book. Also motherfuckers are doing magic by shooting colors and shit.
Rainbows of magic brehs.

 

[studyguy]

SyFy picking up Magicians

spoiler (click to show/hide)

WOAT

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MTV picking up Shannara and actually making that shit look real fucking impressive

 

No joke Game of Thrones is probably to thank for all these fantasy shows.

[studyguy]

I fucking hate steampunk and cowboy shit but I read Alloy of Law: Mistborn

It was a fucking Sanderson book through and through, the fact that it links the the rest of his cosmere (think of the Marvel Cinematic Universe but for all of Sanderson's books) is sort of cool though. Read enough of them and shit starts to cross paths since they all actually source from a singular event described in scraps through various titles. It was okay I guess, though he always leans too heavily into the fedora ideal of what's cool with neckbeards including steampunk goggles, bowler hats and damsels in distress.

Going through two books now The Warded Man and By The Grace of Kings.
I don't know shit about either aside from The Warded Man sounds like low fantasy and the intro gives me some Robin Hobb vibes.

[chronovore]

Have I complained about Robin Hobb here yet? I love her writing, but all the Assassin stuff was just misery porn. I gave up when I realized she was just a big sadist.

[studyguy]

Have I complained about Robin Hobb here yet? I love her writing, but all the Assassin stuff was just misery porn. I gave up when I realized she was just a big sadist.

Yeah the characters never catch a fucking break in that series. It's real shitty situation in those books where the light of the end of the tunnel is always just a dim candle leading to the next disaster.

[chronovore]

Or an oncoming train.

[Great Rumbler]

MTV picking up Shannara and actually making that shit look real fucking impressive

 

Oh man, now there's a nostalgia trip. I read quite a few of the Shannara books back in the day, and enjoy them, too. I'd say they were decent B-tier fantasy, good for when you'd read big series but still wanted some more.

The more-recent Jerle Shannara trilogy was better than the older books, though.

[studyguy]

I forgot to mention the Hugos 2015.
Grown ass men crying about the state of their science fiction novels... Where for some reason applying a 1940's rhetoric towards culture, gender, etc in novels concerning life hundreds of years from now is preferable to any other alternative.

[Great Rumbler]

Not a single Puppy-endorsed candidate took home a rocket. In the five categories that had only Puppy-provided nominees on the ballot—Best Novella, Best Short Story, Best Related Work, and Best Editor for Short and for Long Form—voters instead preferred “No Award.

[chronovore]

Looks like the Puppies accidentally picked up a Heisman Trophy.

[Joe Molotov]

Lot of Ben Carson bestickered cars going home from Worldcon full of salt.

[Joe Molotov]

At the seventy-third annual Worldcon science fiction convention on Saturday night, social justice warriors did their best impression of the nightmare firemen of Ray Bradbury’s classic Fahrenheit 451, choosing to burn down the Hugo Awards and damage science fiction instead of seeing works of heretical authors outside of their exclusive clique winning awards.

Breitbart

[Phoenix Dark]

I'd be very interested in hearing Brandon Sanderson's views on this. I know Martin has ethered them on multiple occasions, including at the event this year as the article states.

The idea that social commentary is some recent phenomenon in sci-fi (or fantasy) is ludicrous btw. Sci fi has explored social issues for decades. The fact that it's suddenly a problem now that the protagonist isn't a white male scientist tells you everything you need to know.

Daps to GRRM btw.

[studyguy]

I'd be very interested in hearing Brandon Sanderson's views on this. I know Martin has ethered them on multiple occasions, including at the event this year as the article states.

The idea that social commentary is some recent phenomenon in sci-fi (or fantasy) is ludicrous btw. Sci fi has explored social issues for decades. The fact that it's suddenly a problem now that the protagonist isn't a white male scientist tells you everything you need to know.

Daps to GRRM btw.

Dude's been mum on the issue as far as I know, though I doubt Sanderson would play nice with the Sad Puppy types given how inclusive his novels are. I don't like Scalzi tbh, but dude went 100 real quick on the movement. Either way after the Hugos the group will prob just stew for a year, hopefully they implode in on themselves. I'm sure in some time straight white male sci-fi writers like Vox will be able to explore the pain of this disenfranchisement authentically and be lauded for it, I mean the type of discrimination they face is an absolute travesty

[chronovore]

What don't you like about Scalzi?

[studyguy]

What don't you like about Scalzi?

Dude's an unabashed, egotistical dick. He owns it and even when you agree with his opinion, his blog tirades are cringey as hell to read through.


Started on The Grace of Kings, author is Ken Liu.
Thematically it's way different than most western fantasy titles I've read through. Mostly why I can't be arsed to bother with Hugo fuckery when talking about booting minorities in fantasy/sci fi. Dude plays hard into his own heritage and into Han Chinese mythology... real reminiscent of shit you read in Romance of the Three Kingdoms.

[Phoenix Dark]

https://storify.com/scottlynch78/that-awful-awful-sjw-message-fiction

[bluemax]

Not a single Puppy-endorsed candidate took home a rocket. In the five categories that had only Puppy-provided nominees on the ballot—Best Novella, Best Short Story, Best Related Work, and Best Editor for Short and for Long Form—voters instead preferred “No Award.

http://www.npr.org/2015/08/26/434644645/how-the-sad-puppies-won-by-losing

[Great Rumbler]

Yeah, all that's probably true and the Hugos are going to have to figure something out to stop this kind of vote packing [from either side], but I still appreciate seeing Sad Puppies get smacked down.

[chronovore]

The stupidest part was Puppy affiliated nerds getting hate boners over GRRM handing out newly minted "Alfies" at the traditional "Loser's Party" after the Hugo ceremony. They aren't Hugos! They aren't Pretend Hugos.

It would have been better for the Puppies to have their own award ceremonies and then hand out press invitations to say why they're outraged at the Hugo Award process, rather than trying to disingenuously game the system.

Whatever. Fuck Larry Correia and his Mary-Sue accountant-cum-monster-hunter fan fic, fuck Vox Day and whatever reactionary bullshit he wants to promote, more than anything else: fuck herp-a-derp fanboys who think they're being excluded by speculative fiction becoming more inclusive. SF/F literature, movies, TV, games, YES, even beer. Fuck them one and all.

[Great Rumbler]

But Terry Pratchett? Get real. It’s time we stopped this pretence that mediocrity is equal to genius.

I have never read a single one of his books and I never plan to.

[Kara]

While I agree that maybe people could stand to consume actual literature more often, the author of this article realizes that Moby-Dick didn't even sell 10,000 copies when it was first published (iirc) when they say things like, "A middlebrow cult of the popular is holding literature to ransom," right?

Oh well, I'll just sit back and enjoy nerds catching feels about being made fun of by a low tier cultural mouthpiece like The Guardian's Arts section.

[studyguy]

Kingskiller Chronicles got picked up by Lionsgate.

Supposedly some game rights are getting talked about too. I wouldn't hold my breath but in the event it actually does come to fruition, I can't wait for the 1000 fingers in a fairy vagina minigame during his adventures with Felurian 

[Phoenix Dark]

I've held off bringing this up but it's gaining more traction now. Last month GRRM's friend and South American editor mentioned that TWOW will be out next year, and that he'll be getting the manuscript significantly earlier than previous books in order to ensure the release date isn't far behind the English (Us and Europe) release dates. 

Now yesterday, his Polish translator said he has been asked by his publisher to reserve time this year to work on TWOW.
https://www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/comments/3n65hi/spoilers_all_polish_asoiaf_translator_was_asked/

There have been a lot of rumblings about the editing process ramping up, and Martin being close-ish to the finished line. It coincides with his comments that he wants the book out before S6. Obviously Martin has missed a billion deadlines over the last 15 years but this sounds different to me. Based on his own comments and those of people close to the writing process, he hasn't run into any major structural problems with TWOW. There is no Meereenese Knot to solve anymore, and the 5 year gap stuff is long in the past.

I'm guessing he knows he can't finish the series before the show ends, and this is his last shot to get a book out first. There's also the issue that he's said before that TWOW will have a pretty big revelation - which will almost certainly be R+L=J. Sounds like S6 of the show is going to reveal it, based on set reports, so Martin wants to get there first.

[studyguy]

We'll see

[bluemax]

It's never coming out.

In other news:

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/lionsgate-wins-rights-fantasy-book-828557

[bluemax]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=180851260&postcount=19855

Oh PD, why.

[Human Snorenado]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=180851260&postcount=19855

Oh PD, why.

Stan to the end. Like bringing up anything to do with ADWD's editing process and saying it bodes well for TWoW is farcical, and something only the Axis of Idiocy (PD/Walrus) would do.

[El Babua]

I'm in the camp of a 2016 release, but I'll be surprised if it's before season 6.

[studyguy]

[Joe Molotov]

PD gonna be all like

[Phoenix Dark]

I'm confident. Every publicly revealed indicator points to 2016, the only question is whether it comes out before S6 or afterward.

I've said it before but the wait for this book hasn't felt anything like the AFFC/ADWD waits. Martin sounds far more positive.

[studyguy]

Well least he's not dead.
That's a more positive outlook I had than when I was waiting at the tail end of WoT...
 

[CatsCatsCats]

I'm very much on the fence as to whether or not I will watch the next season before reading the book. Probably will but 

[studyguy]

Reviving this to post that LitRPGs are garbage and the encroachment of 'another world' anime is killing Fantasy.
Also rolling through Tiguana right now and it is that 

[hampster]

I found out a few weeks ago that Megan Whalen Turner released a new book in her thief series in May, Thick as Thieves Its on my to read list but I'm thinking about just rereading the whole series since its been awhile since I read them (the last book released 7 years ago). The second book, Queen of Attolia, is one of my favorites and kinda gave me a thing for scary women

[chronovore]

Just finished my first ever reading of Nine Princes in Amber. I had SO MANY friends who were in love with this book, and for something written in 1970 it is a fresh take on entitled, hereditary badasses doing epic and bad things to everyone on the sidelines. The amnesiac protagonist is played for all it's worth. As a setup for the larger story arc, I liked it. As a book on its own merit, less so.