Epic Mickey

[EmCeeGrammar]

Kingdom Hearts is for tween girls who don't know any better.  I'm sure Epic Mickey sucks, but I doubt its as catastrophically bad as Kingdom Hearts.

[brawndolicious]

wow the scores range from 6/10 to 5/5.  it sounds like it's the type of game you could enjoy if you had any interest in it before it came out.

[Positive Touch]

I don't think Warren Spector knows how to manage a project anymore. Between this and the last Deus Ex, that's two turkeys in a row. He's a great speaker. And intellectually a smart guy, but his days of creating the next big thing seem to be over. He struggles to make competent games now.

warren spector didn't make the shitty deus ex

[Stoney Mason]

Well he was studio director. And while that is a higher level management type job and not a day to day project manager, perhaps if he tasted the pie his designers were cooking while it was still cooking, he could have said it was under cooked and demanded a few changes.

Not to mention if he is constantly put forth as the face of a game, he damn well better make sure the game is okay.

I like Warren. You can't take away all the things he did in the past. I just don't think lately he has done much but they still interview him like he's making great stuff.

[Great Rumbler]

Removed from the hype and the disappointment over shattered expectations, Invisible War is actually a pretty fun game, marred mainly by it's length [less than ten hours] and not being quite as deep as it should've been.

[Purple Filth]

I tried to watch some of a playthrough of this on youtube.


It looked incredibly boring.

This right here. And it looked the same in those early previews too.

I had more enjoyment watching the first Kingdom hearts 

[chronovore]

Wtf, Kingdom Hearts is an amazing game. Epic Mickey can't touch KH's awesomeness.

Epic Mickey's failure means no more Disney on the Wii. This automatically means that Kingdom Hearts 3 will be released for the HD consoles.

THE VOICE OF REASON.

spoiler (click to show/hide)

[close]

[Stoney Mason]

[youtube=560,345][/youtube]


 

[Great Rumbler]

A 7 average for a kid-friendly platformer is pretty much a death sentence. If it was a city-builder or some kind of grand strategy game, I'd still be interested. But a platformer? Pass.

[pilonv1]

Just buy the HD versions next year

[chronovore]

But will Disney even invest in that? I worry that their recently announced move away from high end games will prevent them from even porting this.

[Great Rumbler]

Just buy the HD versions next year

They released Epic Mickey on the most kid-friendly console and the one with the biggest install base, and it still bombed. You think they're going to spend the money on a HD version?

[pilonv1]

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2010-12-07-spector-defends-epic-mickey-camera

Probably not, it's sent Spector insane.

Epic Mickey director Warren Spector has defended the game's much-maligned camera, claiming getting the camera right in any game is the "hardest problem" developers face.

In an interview withMTV's Clutch blog, a full unedited version of which appeared on examiner.com, the Deus Ex creator said "First, there has never been a game that I couldn't break if you give it to me for 30 seconds. I mean, I will break a camera in any game ever made.

"And if I learned one thing on this project, it's an immense amount of respect for people who have been making third person action and platforming games. Third person camera is way harder than I even imagined it could be.

"It is the hardest problem in video game development," he added. "Everybody gets it wrong. It's just a question of how close to right do you get it."

Eurogamer's Dan Whitehead awarded Spector's Wii game 6/10 last month. His take on the camera? It "blights the more perilous platforming sections, struggling to keep pace as you climb and drop, and it's an absolute pain during combat."

"What I try to be completely clear about is that this is not a platforming game," Spector went on to explain, in response to gamers' complaints that his team should have followed Super Mario Galaxy 2's near-impeccable lead.

"This is a game that takes platforming elements and adventure game elements and role-playing elements and merges them. So we couldn't tune the camera perfectly for platforming or for action adventure. It's a very different camera style.

"What we did is try to find the best compromise in the moment and give the player as much manual control as we could. So we took the hardest problem in third-person gaming and made it harder by trying to accommodate two different playing styles.

"And I will go to my grave, imperfect as it is, proud as hell of my camera team," he concluded.

"If reviewers want to give us a hard time about it because they're misunderstanding the game we made, it's not for me to tell them that they're wrong, absolutely not. But I wish people would get it out of their head that we made a 'Mario' competitor, because we didn't."

[Great Rumbler]

Ugh, he pulls the "you guys just don't understand it!" defense. 

[Sho Nuff]

Warren has gone bye-bye

[Howard Alan Treesong]

gamers just don't un-der-stand

[Stoney Mason]

It would be better if he never addressed the issue or said something like it was a tough problem to solve. We did our best, but we couldn't accommodate all cases. We'll try better next time.

But with that explanation I'm not even sure what he means. The game is full of platforming. Yes its a hybrid game but part of that hybrid is platforming and jumping around on shit and climbing shit. It's a very odd defense.

[chronovore]

Just buy the HD versions next year

They released Epic Mickey on the most kid-friendly console and the one with the biggest install base, and it still bombed. You think they're going to spend the money on a HD version?

[pilonv1]

[duckman2000]

I don't think Warren Spector knows how to manage a project anymore. Between this and the last Deus Ex, that's two turkeys in a row. He's a great speaker. And intellectually a smart guy, but his days of creating the next big thing seem to be over. He struggles to make competent games now.

He was smart enough to take a step back and let that other dude take the heat for such brilliant ideas as unified ammo, the removal of a proper inventory and the shit lots of loading times and shitty level design because hey, it's not like anyone actually liked the exploration aspect of Deus Ex anyway. :|

This one, this is all Warren.

[Sho Nuff]

so is this game actually selling

[Bebpo]

Remember Epic Mickey for what it tried to be and not for what it was.

A poor man's Kingdom Hearts?

[Purple Filth]

Remember Epic Mickey for what it tried to be and not for what it was.

A poor man's Kingdom Hearts?

isn't that what it is now?

[pilonv1]

so is this game actually selling

good one.

[Sho Nuff]

Actually I assumed that Disney would be doing a mega advertising blitz for this -- spamming the shit out of the Disney Channel with ads for this would all but ensure retail domination

Oh wait this is the wii we're talking about  :'(

[demi]

This game is hardly a poor man's Kingdom Hearts... we already have Kingdom Hearts for that

[chronovore]

Actually I assumed that Disney would be doing a mega advertising blitz for this -- spamming the shit out of the Disney Channel with ads for this would all but ensure retail domination

Oh wait this is the wii we're talking about  :'(

Seriously though, even a mediocre game (which this may or may not be) with a killer license (which this has), should be able to sell with enough marketing creating public awareness. If there really is an absence of advertising, even on Disney Channel, this is one of those cases where the corporation dictated moving away from large console titles and marketing immediately abandoned support for it, leaving it to wither on the vine.

[tiesto]

Would have bought it if it was straight up 2.5D platforming goodness; an Okami wannabe with shitty camera and tons of pointless fetch quests doesn't sound like my cup of tea.

[Stoney Mason]

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2010-12-07-spector-defends-epic-mickey-camera
"What I try to be completely clear about is that this is not a platforming game," Spector went on to explain, in response to gamers' complaints that his team should have followed Super Mario Galaxy 2's near-impeccable lead.

"This is a game that takes platforming elements and adventure game elements and role-playing elements and merges them. So we couldn't tune the camera perfectly for platforming or for action adventure. It's a very different camera style.

"What we did is try to find the best compromise in the moment and give the player as much manual control as we could. So we took the hardest problem in third-person gaming and made it harder by trying to accommodate two different playing styles.

"And I will go to my grave, imperfect as it is, proud as hell of my camera team," he concluded.

"If reviewers want to give us a hard time about it because they're misunderstanding the game we made, it's not for me to tell them that they're wrong, absolutely not. But I wish people would get it out of their head that we made a 'Mario' competitor, because we didn't."

Interesting ideas abound in Epic Mickey, but they're all sadly in service of gameplay that just doesn't deserve them. While it has some half-baked open-world and role-playing elements, this is a platform-jumping game first and foremost. Specifically, it feels like the kind of mascot-driven platformer that was legion in the N64/PlayStation era, before dual analog sticks were standardized and when most third-person polygonal games struggled valiantly with camera controls. Epic Mickey's unruly camera isn't insurmountable, but having to replay sections due to blind jumps and constant fussing gives you plenty of time to consider just how boilerplate most of the platforming feels, and just how dull vast stretches of this game are

http://www.giantbomb.com/disney-epic-mickey/61-27562/reviews/

[Sho Nuff]

"Literally, we've got a half dozen perfect scores and I've also gotten the lowest scores I've ever gotten on any game I've ever worked on. In a weird sort of way, I think that's kind of cool."

UK Resistance lays it all out
http://www.ukresistance.co.uk/2010/12/one-last-roll-of-the-dice-for-epic-mickey/

[magus]

told ya guys but nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
"magus hates everything"

spoiler (click to show/hide)

[close]

[Bebpo]

how's that new shiren?

[magus]

you mean shiren 5? my lack of japanese knowledge is a crippling weakness

[cool breeze]

I feel like I'm in an alternate future where where no advances were made since the Nintendo 64 and developers somehow became worse at camera control.

Only an hour or two in but it's kinda boring, doesn't really have the charm I was expecting (surprisingly, kingdom hearts get it more), and controlling the shockingly bad camera is just frustrating.  It's not a nice looking game.  All the environments are like a tim burton game on the playstation 1; a lot of vomit and dark colors, off shapes, etc.

The camera is the worst part.  My standards for camera control on the Wii are incredibly low after games like Crystal Bearers, but this game's camera is a nightmare.  It's automatic and never shows you want you want, but if you try to manually move it d-pad/c button controls, the auto camera fights you.  Maybe that's the real enemy in the game since combat seems to involve holding down the B trigger over an enemy for three seconds.  Mickey represents the artists that are held by the director.

[demi]

told ya guys but nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
"magus hates everything"

spoiler (click to show/hide)

[close]

lmao. I didnt evne have to finish the game to tell anyone it was poo. You = wasted time

[chronovore]

This game is in my Amazon cart. Should I kill it before shipping? Should I wait until it's 10USD and be "part of the problem"?

[cool breeze]

this game is so bad

I looked at the table of content of the guide to see if I was close to finishing it.  I only have one more level after this to slog through, so I might just do it.  But this entire game is a drag and it just drains the joy out of you.  A clinical F-grade platformer that can't even touch PS2 licensed platformers like Treasure Planet.

[EmCeeGrammar]

Why are you slogging through it?  Hock that shit, duder.

[cool breeze]

oh, it's getting sold, but I'm close enough to end that I might as well finish it.  At least I thought so, because the game makes you go back to old areas and literally do the same exact task a few dozen times.  and whoever thought it was a good idea to have shitty shit shit 2d levels between every area, to and from, is ridiculous.

honestly, the best thing to come out of this game is that I'm more hopeful for Deus Ex 3.  If this is the quality of game Warren Spector is producing these days, I'd much rather have some french canadians I haven't heard of before handling that that series.

[magus]

link - tell me where you are and i'll tell you how close you are to the end

[EmCeeGrammar]

I think you might have a problem Linkzg, seriously, if a game sucks then get rid of it pronto.

[cool breeze]

No shit I have a problem.  I played Castlevania to the end and that game was longer, though, not as bad and at least nice to look at.   Epic Mickey is the worst game of 2010 full stop.

link - tell me where you are and i'll tell you how close you are to the end

I entered another area filled with vomit that looks like a Tim Burton game released on the Jaguar.

I know I'm at the end game since the game already told me that this was the point of no return.  It's at the sleeping beauty castle or something.

Oh, and this game is a giant joke on westerners.  The Japanese did a better job at capturing Disney whimsy than this game.  This game just has a lot of old Disney characters that barely serve a purpose other than to be present in the game world.  It's like an early rough draft of a fan fiction.

It also has this crazy balance of being painfully stupid friendly for kids, yet the game itself is so poorly designed and arbitrary that I can't image any kid enjoying it.  That and all the references are to old Disney characters that they wouldn't have heard of.  This is a man baby game through and through...and I intend to finish it  :'(

[duckman2000]

Banjo N&B reigns supreme as that game for kids and adults.

[chronovore]

Amazon notified me that Epic Mickey went from being reasonably discounted back to it's normal price while lingering in my Cart.

...Well, that made life easy.

BUH-LETE.

[Sho Nuff]

This game is so polarizing. It's love-or-abhor.

Judging by the reviews from the peeps I spect, I think I would find this game turd. Fortunately I don't own a Wii so that makes the decision easier

[Sho Nuff]

BTW Spector is a wiener for not fighting back and making the amazing Uncle Scrooge game that he initially wanted to make.

Mickey is a shitty character. He's boring. He doesn't have any interesting catchphrases aside from "Oh, golly." He's a fucking dork.

On the other hand, Scrooge will FUCK YOUR SHIT UP.

[Eel O'Brian]

well, mickey turned into a bland character over the years, but he was pretty cool in the early black and white shorts when he was sort of a mischievous asshole

[Great Rumbler]

Amazon notified me that Epic Mickey went from being reasonably discounted back to it's normal price while lingering in my Cart.

...Well, that made life easy.

BUH-LETE.

Nier and Bayonetta both went up by $5 as well. 

[TakingBackSunday]

I like this game 

[cool breeze]

This game is so polarizing. It's love-or-abhor.

Judging by the reviews from the peeps I spect, I think I would find this game turd. Fortunately I don't own a Wii so that makes the decision easier

I'd actually like to know what the people who love it think.  Is it purely because of Mickey Mouse/Disney nostalgia? as a game it has some indefensible choices.  But it has a bunch of old, forgotten characters that a Disney enthusiast ( ) might enjoy.

[magus]

as i said in my ramblings...

the 2D level are awesome
the 3D level averagish,for being inspired by disneyland attraction they are really bland
the huge amount of fetch questing is really what completly ruins the game and bring to bleh level
the gimmick is just there for gimmicky reason

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/2575-Epic-Mickey

[pilonv1]

Yahtzee was awesome in this one

[duckman2000]

BTW Spector is a wiener for not fighting back and making the amazing Uncle Scrooge game that he initially wanted to make.

Mickey is a shitty character. He's boring. He doesn't have any interesting catchphrases aside from "Oh, golly." He's a fucking dork.

On the other hand, Scrooge will FUCK YOUR SHIT UP.

(Image removed from quote.)

Yeah, Scrooge is hardcore. So what's the story there, why didn't Disney go for that? Not easy enough to co-market with the products of cutesy Disney?

[Sho Nuff]

Disney really hasn't given much of a shit about the ducks since the early 90s, so that's probably why they didn't bite. It's sad because guys like Carl Barks and Don Rosa have made the duck universe the most fleshed-out and compelling one in the Disney canon. (DuckTales was good, but doesn't hold a candle to most Barks and Rosa stuff.)

[demi]

too bad you should leave this country ASAP, loser

[chronovore]

A friend who is a fan of Warren Spector tonight told me that the game isn't worth buying at just about any price. I told him to keep an eye on sales for me after I go back to Japan, and grab it for US$10. Sadly, he'd just sold his for US$10. 

I'm super curious about how it turned out. He said it's basically Super Mario Sunshine, except the camera is crap and Warren Spector will have a tantrum if you say it's like Mario... anything.

[Stoney Mason]

Warren Spector will have a tantrum if you say it's like Mario... anything.

The whole thing was very weird. From the beginning this seemed like Spector either slumming or just selling out a bit to try to make some dough off that Wii craze which must have seemed amazingly hot when he started developing this game a few years back. It's like he wants to speak from the elevated position of the guy who made Deus Ex but Epic Mickey ain't no Deus Ex and he's never seemed quite comfortable with that. Even the superficial choice elements that do exist in the game that are a throwback to his previous work I hear are bad in this game.