Author Topic: STAR CITIZEN: JEU PRÉFÉRÉ DE VOMKRIEGE  (Read 106570 times)

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bluemax

  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #240 on: October 10, 2015, 09:06:26 PM »
Well, have you vetted them ? Did they show you paystubs ? Are you DEREK SMART ? Why do you want to kill Star Citizen ?

I realize you are joking but I went ahead just now and looked them up on LinkedIn. They both are on LinkedIn and the woman has updated her profile to indicate she doesn't work at CIG. I'm not gonna go blabbing this to Kotaku or Polygon or The Escapist though.
NO

VomKriege

  • 韬光养晦
  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #241 on: October 11, 2015, 04:08:14 AM »
In the Gary Oldman interview :

“From what I gather, Chris [Roberts] is a bit of – the sort of George Lucas of this stuff… or potentially could be."

 :lol
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Rufus

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #242 on: October 11, 2015, 05:49:01 AM »
High praise. :doge

recursivelyenumerable

  • you might think that; I couldn't possibly comment
  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #243 on: October 11, 2015, 11:38:04 AM »
this is great for anyone who's ever wondered what Scientology would be like if they led with the bad space opera instead of reserving it for initiates.
QED

mormapope

  • Do what you can.
  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #244 on: October 11, 2015, 12:38:37 PM »
Its laughable as all fuck when people say things like "We aren't ready for developers to be transparent with development due to all the whining and questioning :maf"

The criticism being lobbed at this abomination in the making is doing nothing to development, and these same people are willing to or have thrown dozens of other games under a bus for any number of reasons. A lot of game players on the internet are whine monsters.

Developers/publishers nowadays release a shit ton of promo footage, along with there being impressions from other people all the time. These dorks have convinced themselves that the narrative CIG is giving them is some sort of godsend in the gaming world.
Faith

Joe Molotov

  • I'm much more humble than you would understand.
  • Administrator
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #245 on: October 11, 2015, 12:41:33 PM »
omg, I just saw Fish Tank 2.0 :dead

At least pyramid schemes offer you actual money for scamming your friends and family.
©@©™

Barry Egan

  • The neurotic is nailed to the cross of his fiction.
  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #246 on: October 11, 2015, 01:38:56 PM »

VomKriege

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #247 on: October 11, 2015, 03:25:32 PM »
Star Citizen is a master class in deceitful marketing. There's no denying they communicate a lot, in fact they overload their backers weekly with minute list of bugs and tasks... While changing the TOS without notice, never aknowledging delays until after the fact or adressing elephants in the room (why is the FPS alpha that was weeks away in March still not out ?).

Reading reactions to the recent CitizenCon, a lot of backers got the impression the FPS module was merged away in the MMO. That the thing is even to be speculated upon after a promotion show is an indictement of how opaque the marketing is, to the point of not clearly conveying what the core features will be.
« Last Edit: October 11, 2015, 03:56:34 PM by VomKriege »
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Barry Egan

  • The neurotic is nailed to the cross of his fiction.
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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #248 on: October 11, 2015, 03:43:57 PM »
Reading reactions to the recent CitizenCon, a lot of backers got the impression the FPS module was merged away in the MMO. That the thing is even to be speculated upon show is an indictement of how opaque the marketing is.

Yep, I'm convinced that the FPS module they've been promising all year is gone for good.  CIG has totally abandoned even pretending to have release dates at this point, so there is absolutely no sign of when the next playable anything will be released. 

On the plus side, there is a new referral system in place!  Tell your friends!


wsippel

  • Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #249 on: October 12, 2015, 03:35:53 AM »
Star Citizen is a master class in deceitful marketing. There's no denying they communicate a lot, in fact they overload their backers weekly with minute list of bugs and tasks... While changing the TOS without notice, never aknowledging delays until after the fact or adressing elephants in the room (why is the FPS alpha that was weeks away in March still not out ?).

Reading reactions to the recent CitizenCon, a lot of backers got the impression the FPS module was merged away in the MMO. That the thing is even to be speculated upon after a promotion show is an indictement of how opaque the marketing is, to the point of not clearly conveying what the core features will be.
I'm as skeptical as the next guy, but it's not that intransparent. As a backer, it was impossible not to notice the ToS change. Arena Commander displayed a modal message, and I'm pretty sure CIG sent out emails as well. They also explained why the FPS got delayed (after the fact, but still): What they had was buggy as hell, so they ended their relationship with Illfonic and worked on it themselves, then decided that, as maintaining separate branches for Arena Commander, Star Marine and the PU alpha was inefficient, they'd merge first, then focus on fixing the FPS stuff. That obviously led to further delays, but it was something they had to do sooner or later anyway.

VomKriege

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #250 on: October 12, 2015, 06:15:18 AM »
I honestly didn't get the impression they were that forthright with this info. Judging by the RSI forum itself, not meeting the September release of Star Marine wasn't even really aknowledged, it just happened. Last week update still seems to imply a separate release for the FPS, and now it's supposedly not the case anymore. To be clear, I don't even postulate active malicious intent : I get the impression the communication is a mirror to the development that tends to get lost in the details while missing the big picture.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2015, 06:27:09 AM by VomKriege »
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wsippel

  • Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #251 on: October 12, 2015, 08:49:20 AM »
I honestly didn't get the impression they were that forthright with this info. Judging by the RSI forum itself, not meeting the September release of Star Marine wasn't even really aknowledged, it just happened. Last week update still seems to imply a separate release for the FPS, and now it's supposedly not the case anymore. To be clear, I don't even postulate active malicious intent : I get the impression the communication is a mirror to the development that tends to get lost in the details while missing the big picture.
The official forums are a cesspool and pretty useless as a source of information. You basically have to watch AtV and RtV to stay up to date. It's not ideal, but they don't actually have a huge marketing and PR team (and what they have is in Santa Monica, while the heavy lifting is mostly done in Europe), so it's to be expected I guess. I don't think it actually reflects the development itself. Well, I hope it doesn't...  :-\

And I have no idea what's going on with Star Marine either. I think it's still happening as a stand alone thing, but I could understand if CIG wanted to release the PU alpha first, as that contains the FPS mechanics and doesn't require that much balancing. Seems more efficient to me.

Barry Egan

  • The neurotic is nailed to the cross of his fiction.
  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #252 on: October 12, 2015, 08:08:20 PM »
And I have no idea what's going on with Star Marine either.

No one does, hence the accusations of CIG not being forthright with what's going on. 

Every indication at this point is that they've quietly terminated the independent module, and are "rolling it in" to the PU, which they have no intention of putting a release date on.  They did this without any outright acknowledgement at their presentation, and after an entire year of promising the modules release in 2015. 

I heard that if you give them $900 though, they will send you a JPEG with "YOU ARE BEING SCAMMED" written in comic sans across a white background.     

VomKriege

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #253 on: October 13, 2015, 05:19:31 AM »
FPS module is still a thing but should release after AC2.0 according to Ben Lesnick on the forums
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benjipwns

  • so let's go outside and we'll play william tell, take your time drawing a bead, i'll stand as still as you need
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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #254 on: October 14, 2015, 01:43:34 AM »
I heard that if you give them $900 though, they will send you a JPEG with "YOU ARE BEING SCAMMED" written in comic sans across a white background.   
Will this have voicework?
meowr

wsippel

  • Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #255 on: October 14, 2015, 08:36:57 AM »
So, it appears CIG did away with the old module pass system and unified alpha and beta access. If you have a stand alone Arena Commander pass, you can melt it for $5 store credit without losing anything. If you don't melt it, or if it's part of your package, it will be exchanged for 5,000 UEC in a few days. If you have a package with alpha access, you'll get 10,000 UEC instead. Just a heads up in case we have a few backers on here who don't follow the development and prefer store credit over UEC.

VomKriege

  • 韬光养晦
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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #256 on: October 15, 2015, 05:29:19 AM »
https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/289275/the-new-referral-program-leaves-out-those-who-have-already-recruited-their-friends

Quote
I feel some frustration in that I have already recruited most of my friends into the game (one of them just last week!) and that I will not be rewarded simply because of my unlucky timing.

Quote
I've already recruited probably 70 people.

You can always say they are RPing but the insistance of using the term "recruit" is  :doge
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Tasty Meat

  • It will never appear where there is strife. Its sightings have become rare recently.
  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #257 on: October 15, 2015, 10:07:30 AM »
Definitely verging on cult territory now.
🌈

Barry Egan

  • The neurotic is nailed to the cross of his fiction.
  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #258 on: October 17, 2015, 05:16:28 PM »
Smart is claiming CIG has until November 1st to make their finances public or he is going forward with a lawsuit.  :hulk

naff

  • god is dead. satan lives. the year is 1.
  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #259 on: October 20, 2015, 02:41:37 AM »
 :kobeyuck

You know you're doing bad when Wing Commander IV seems appealing vs this.
(_,_)

VomKriege

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #260 on: October 20, 2015, 12:37:01 PM »
So an user on Frontier (Elite dev) forum tried to make an headcount of all companies linked to Star Citizen
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=57576&page=522&p=2977258#post2977258

He also list subcontractors :
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=57576&page=523&p=2977350&viewfull=1#post2977350
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Kara

  • The P in MPL secretly stands for Petite Bourgeois
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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #261 on: October 20, 2015, 04:22:24 PM »
Special purpose entities aren't indicative of anything in and of themselves. They might be necessary to get tax credits or they might be a way of hiding losses. Really have to look under the hood.

VomKriege

  • 韬光养晦
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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #262 on: October 20, 2015, 05:16:34 PM »
Special purpose entities aren't indicative of anything in and of themselves. They might be necessary to get tax credits or they might be a way of hiding losses. Really have to look under the hood.

I just posted as is because as you point there's nothing especially nefarious about that. It does seem to me like a a ridiculously complex setup for such a young company though, tax breaks incentive or not.

All banter and allegations aside, the most damning factual thing about Star Citizen is that the funding has run continuously since the Kickstarter, with no stated imminent end despite having overshot any objective set by Roberts himself.
« Last Edit: October 20, 2015, 05:22:26 PM by VomKriege »
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Kara

  • The P in MPL secretly stands for Petite Bourgeois
  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #263 on: October 20, 2015, 06:28:07 PM »
I agree that they look overly complex (and often are) but they can be very effective for legitimate purposes depending on tax and business laws in a jurisdiction. It's the consequence of (1) taxing different types of income differently--i.e. if I earn the same amount of money in my business and from dividends they're not taxed the same even though it's the exact same amount of income and (2) using the tax code to offset the effects of uneven development.

Given the amount of money that's been raised, the lack of investor oversight (since the investors are more like patrons than investors), and the involvement of family members I'm pretty suspicious that the group of companies aren't a vehicle for embezzling but I'm just projecting what I've seen in my career onto something I don't know the gritty details about when I say that.

bluemax

  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #264 on: October 22, 2015, 01:14:45 AM »
I didn't know they had an office in West Hollywood, weird. I wonder if that's just a business office or something?
NO

VomKriege

  • 韬光养晦
  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #265 on: October 22, 2015, 05:03:46 PM »
So some members of the SC community have compiled several versions of a survey to better gauge who were Star Citizens. Those are the results for what appears to have been a study done at least up until January 2015. Most of the interesting stuff is at the beginning, the latter part consists mostly of questions regarding SC features and the like.

All usual precautions apply here with regards to the bias of the survey. It was mostly done by Reddit or RSI forums users, so it may skew the demographics towards a more internet literate crowd and/or enthusiasts. Nonetheless, 4000 surveys filled makes for a more than acceptable sample size for a population estimated between 700.000 and a million. Please note that not all persons having filled it have pledged money yet.

The key numbers for me :

97% male.
82% of the pool between age 18 and 37.
26% report an annual income of 10.000$ or less.
Out of those who report 10.000$ or less in income, a little under half of them have pledged 100$ or more.
More than 750 people claims they're in over 1000$ (47 of those for 10.000$ or more).
72% plan on upgrading their PC.
233 people out of 4329 own 11 ships or more.
36% want a game universe that takes over 48 hours to traverse ( :heh ).
1% want Star Citizen to remind them of Lost in Space.
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studyguy

  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #266 on: October 22, 2015, 05:05:55 PM »
I'm prob of that majority that put in like $20 bills whenever it came out then forgot and haven't bothered till it finally releases.
pause

brawndolicious

  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #267 on: October 22, 2015, 07:25:09 PM »
The annual income of investors part is what surprises me. I would have thought most kickstarter investors just have money to burn but if you're making <$10k/year you're either a college student with a part-time job or really underemployed. I'm really curious how they ended up with a nearly perfectly negative correlation between income and being a KS investor for this game (is this a trend on KS?).

Most pledges are below $200 which sounds okay for a PC game but the percentage of investors who make the big donations of $500+ apparently stays pretty constant at around 5% regardless of income level.

Which means that poor people seem to be more likely to invest in this game and presumably no one is paying too much attention to their personal budgets as far as deciding what investment tier to go into. It's like this game breaks all the rules of economics.

bluemax

  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #268 on: October 22, 2015, 08:08:51 PM »
The annual income of investors part is what surprises me. I would have thought most kickstarter investors just have money to burn but if you're making <$10k/year you're either a college student with a part-time job or really underemployed. I'm really curious how they ended up with a nearly perfectly negative correlation between income and being a KS investor for this game (is this a trend on KS?).

Most pledges are below $200 which sounds okay for a PC game but the percentage of investors who make the big donations of $500+ apparently stays pretty constant at around 5% regardless of income level.

Which means that poor people seem to be more likely to invest in this game and presumably no one is paying too much attention to their personal budgets as far as deciding what investment tier to go into. It's like this game breaks all the rules of economics.

Well aren't poor people more likely to be charitable in general?
NO

brawndolicious

  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #269 on: October 22, 2015, 09:25:58 PM »
The annual income of investors part is what surprises me. I would have thought most kickstarter investors just have money to burn but if you're making <$10k/year you're either a college student with a part-time job or really underemployed. I'm really curious how they ended up with a nearly perfectly negative correlation between income and being a KS investor for this game (is this a trend on KS?).

Most pledges are below $200 which sounds okay for a PC game but the percentage of investors who make the big donations of $500+ apparently stays pretty constant at around 5% regardless of income level.

Which means that poor people seem to be more likely to invest in this game and presumably no one is paying too much attention to their personal budgets as far as deciding what investment tier to go into. It's like this game breaks all the rules of economics.

Well aren't poor people more likely to be charitable in general?
:dead

VomKriege

  • 韬光养晦
  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #270 on: October 23, 2015, 05:08:53 AM »
The annual income of investors part is what surprises me. I would have thought most kickstarter investors just have money to burn but if you're making <$10k/year you're either a college student with a part-time job or really underemployed. I'm really curious how they ended up with a nearly perfectly negative correlation between income and being a KS investor for this game (is this a trend on KS?).

Most pledges are below $200 which sounds okay for a PC game but the percentage of investors who make the big donations of $500+ apparently stays pretty constant at around 5% regardless of income level.

Which means that poor people seem to be more likely to invest in this game and presumably no one is paying too much attention to their personal budgets as far as deciding what investment tier to go into. It's like this game breaks all the rules of economics.

I don't think it breaks any economics rule, unless you believe in individuals being "objectively rational". I don't know if we have any point of comparison with another crowdfunded project but it's not totally unexpected that the wet dream of big hard videogames would mainly attract young people (thus poor), though I expected age brackets over that to be more prominent with some of the nostalgia pull of the project. Maybe that is where the RSI/Reddit bias comes into play, working dads harping for a new Wing Commander might not be wasting time there in the first place.

EDIT :
Derek Smart has a new blog post ready, he's seemingly going all in on that Star Citizen / Gizmondo / Swedish organised crime angle...  :lol

EDIT :
Decent article from a designer (Although I can't judge how expert the technical points are)
http://massivelyop.com/2015/10/21/ascents-lead-dev-offers-insight-on-the-star-citizen-controversy/

Holy shit, SC backers are taking angry dumps to what is a very mild article in the comments.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2015, 05:49:42 AM by VomKriege »
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brawndolicious

  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #271 on: October 23, 2015, 02:23:35 PM »
I just think it's funny that some irrational/subjective preference is the main motivator for investing tens of millions of dollars into a company. You always hear in microeconomics that markets MOSTLY respond to objective factors but this is definitely an exception.

bluemax

  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #272 on: October 23, 2015, 02:32:45 PM »
The annual income of investors part is what surprises me. I would have thought most kickstarter investors just have money to burn but if you're making <$10k/year you're either a college student with a part-time job or really underemployed. I'm really curious how they ended up with a nearly perfectly negative correlation between income and being a KS investor for this game (is this a trend on KS?).

Most pledges are below $200 which sounds okay for a PC game but the percentage of investors who make the big donations of $500+ apparently stays pretty constant at around 5% regardless of income level.

Which means that poor people seem to be more likely to invest in this game and presumably no one is paying too much attention to their personal budgets as far as deciding what investment tier to go into. It's like this game breaks all the rules of economics.

I don't think it breaks any economics rule, unless you believe in individuals being "objectively rational". I don't know if we have any point of comparison with another crowdfunded project but it's not totally unexpected that the wet dream of big hard videogames would mainly attract young people (thus poor), though I expected age brackets over that to be more prominent with some of the nostalgia pull of the project. Maybe that is where the RSI/Reddit bias comes into play, working dads harping for a new Wing Commander might not be wasting time there in the first place.

EDIT :
Derek Smart has a new blog post ready, he's seemingly going all in on that Star Citizen / Gizmondo / Swedish organised crime angle...  :lol

EDIT :
Decent article from a designer (Although I can't judge how expert the technical points are)
http://massivelyop.com/2015/10/21/ascents-lead-dev-offers-insight-on-the-star-citizen-controversy/

Holy shit, SC backers are taking angry dumps to what is a very mild article in the comments.

I'm not an engine or graphics guy per se but everything he said seems pretty sound to me.
NO

VomKriege

  • 韬光养晦
  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #273 on: October 23, 2015, 05:56:28 PM »
The only thing I would object, as a layman, is the whole Z-axis / max distance on screen. I would suppose devs has a bag of tricks for that considering how common it is nowadays to display impressive sceneries in AAA games ? Still seeing the problem explained was interesting in itself.
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VomKriege

  • 韬光养晦
  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #274 on: October 26, 2015, 04:32:54 AM »
https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/292766/patch-1-3-32-gb-to-download-why

Pretty amazing what you can get away with when you change the base narrative.
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bluemax

  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #275 on: October 26, 2015, 05:45:15 PM »
Quote
During my time at Cloud Imperium Games I have been subjected to the following verbal abuse: Been called homophobic slurs, mentally disabled, female genitalia, female dog by management of the company. Founders of the company routinely scream at employees. All of this was reported to HR with no action taken. The management have forced employees to enforce illegal hiring practices such as: "We are not going to hire her, we're not hiring a black girl" "We won't hire her, she looks like she has a hairy [private parts]" "Make sure to check their education field on the resume, if it is from too long ago don't interview them, they may be over 40 which makes them a protected class and harder to fire" All of this was reported to HR and no action was taken. Management frequently discuss drug use and desire to use drugs in the office and inappropriate discussion of their sex lives in front of employees Management misappropriate projects development budget. They have: Taken 1st class trips to Paris, Milan, London, Bora Bora, Rio de Janeiro, Australia, Venice, and several more locations all paid for using backer funds. Taken money directly out of the company coffers for personal expenses. Buy fancy clothes, expensive dinners (over $1,000), private chefs, lease three Porsche vehicles, and lease a mansion all using company money. This was reported to Executive staff multiple times and no action was taken. Executive management (remaining, the honest ones all left) are powerless to affect change as they live in fear of being fired by the founders. Morale at all studios is extremely low and the culture is often referred to as similar to "A Game of Thrones" with the management often compared to Joffrey Baratheon. You never know who is going to get fired next (head on a pike) for no reason whatsoever. The company lies. It lies to employees, it lies to its backers, it lies to the media. It lies to everyone. If I haven't scared you off yet and you still want to join the company here is one last reason to sway you. If you get hired you will only have the job for another couple months before the company is out of money. That is why myself and 35+ other people have been told their last day next month in addition to the 25+ people that got fired or quit in September. Save yourself, you've been warned. Standard stuff: No 401k No profit sharing Medical plan has a $5,000 deductible before it kicks in 80+ hour weeks are mandatory to avoid falling behind or being fired/singled out of the herd Most employee positions are made salaried to avoid paying overtime

And a new bit of glass door salt:

Quote
I have been working at Cloud Imperium Games full-time (More than a year)
Pros
Pay checks don't bounce.....at least so far. Smart people in the development ranks. Some really smart people. Love working with those who have passion.
Cons
Complete and Total Financial mismanagement. The rumors within the company are rampant. Many fear they will lose their job in weeks. Communication is poor. Development is stunted, reprioritized and ridiculed
Advice to Management
CEO needs to go....Cannot believe how abusive senior management is.

From experience I can say if the only thing you can think of for a pro on a job is that your paycheck doesn't bounce, it's probably time to find a new job.
NO

VomKriege

  • 韬光养晦
  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #276 on: October 27, 2015, 07:15:12 PM »
RPS, which have been very reserved in their treatment of Star Citizen, are attempting to do a neutral recap :
http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2015/10/27/star-citizen-101-what-is-it-and-why-is-it-controversial/

Comments and reddit already engulfed in flames.
Need either some actual game or some drama to go forward...

« Last Edit: October 27, 2015, 08:22:08 PM by VomKriege »
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VomKriege

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #277 on: November 03, 2015, 10:36:43 AM »
Not a lot of drama. Have some nice GIFs.





For all intents and purposes, the Austin office has been significantly hollowed out, tho.
« Last Edit: November 03, 2015, 05:46:16 PM by VomKriege »
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Barry Egan

  • The neurotic is nailed to the cross of his fiction.
  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #278 on: November 03, 2015, 10:41:34 AM »
new derek smart blog hits today

VomKriege

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  • Senior Member
Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #279 on: November 04, 2015, 04:23:18 AM »
New Smart article is password protected ? :lol

Edit: Found on reddit. Meh. Miles of red herring and guilt by association. As usual, the most interesting bits are those who may come from inside sources.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2015, 04:44:48 AM by VomKriege »
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nudemacusers

  • #freecream #jesuisfiller #resist #mbga
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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #280 on: November 04, 2015, 01:45:22 PM »
https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/3rcfqi/94_millions_reached_congratulations_citizens/

Quote
I'm not spending a dime unless 2.0 is out then - I don't think I'm alone.

I'm just at full exhaustion of looking at my hangar, and the $ amount on my RSI profile, without anything meaningful to actually do with it.

If 2.0 launches and it's awesome, with Retaliators and Constellations everywhere then maybe. But we know the Redeemer and Freelancer haven't even been given game-ready passes yet, so they won't be in.

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Stepping stones, my friend, stepping stones. Once the full product is out, you will be satisfied in knowing you helped make many people's dreams a reality, mine included. Regardless of how much you spend, it helps, and will be worth it if it means getting the BDSSE.

no time for doubts, just keep spending money  :doge

Joe Molotov

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #281 on: November 04, 2015, 02:24:05 PM »
https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/3rcfqi/94_millions_reached_congratulations_citizens/

Quote
I'm not spending a dime unless 2.0 is out then - I don't think I'm alone.

I'm just at full exhaustion of looking at my hangar, and the $ amount on my RSI profile, without anything meaningful to actually do with it.

If 2.0 launches and it's awesome, with Retaliators and Constellations everywhere then maybe. But we know the Redeemer and Freelancer haven't even been given game-ready passes yet, so they won't be in.

Quote
Stepping stones, my friend, stepping stones. Once the full product is out, you will be satisfied in knowing you helped make many people's dreams a reality, mine included. Regardless of how much you spend, it helps, and will be worth it if it means getting the BDSSE.

no time for doubts, just keep spending money  :doge

You will surely get the Karkland.
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nudemacusers

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #282 on: November 04, 2015, 02:31:19 PM »
also i'm confused; are people buying ships they can fly around it right now, or are they just buying 3d models that they can fly around in once the game is finished?

if the latter, people are hinging a lot on this not being a mess at release. :kobeyuck

Joe Molotov

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #283 on: November 04, 2015, 02:42:43 PM »
You're buying the concept of a space ship.
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VomKriege

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #284 on: November 04, 2015, 02:51:08 PM »
Several dozens of ship concepts have been on sale so far and they're all at different levels of completion. Some can fly in the alpha. Some more can be seen in the hangar only. A lot of them have not yet been modeled.

According to a community spreadsheet, 27 of a little over 100 ships plus variants known (a couple non playable) are flyable as of now.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2015, 02:57:36 PM by VomKriege »
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Tasty Meat

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #285 on: November 04, 2015, 02:56:52 PM »
Several dozens of ship concepts have been on sale so far and they're all at different levels of completion. Some can fly in the alpha. Some more can be seen in the hangar only. A lot of them have not yet be modeled.

According to a community spreadsheet, 27 of a little over 100 ships plus variants known (a couple non playable) are flyable as of now.

:lol
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VomKriege

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #286 on: November 04, 2015, 03:04:57 PM »
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/tnx5w5EwJw23lPYhHdlHs5g/htmlview?pli=1

Spreadsheet here for anyone interested.
Note that none of the multicrew ships have been released to players.
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nudemacusers

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #287 on: November 04, 2015, 04:05:16 PM »
So to recap, the game's been delayed a few years, the featureset is a moving target, the rollout of the various game modes is under constant flux, the FPS portion has switched hands, employees are leaving, development arms are being shuttered and moved, and the many of the game's preorder ships which don't count as pay to win are incomplete. and it's still in alpha. but we have a cool cgi scene with gary oldman.

sounds like everything is gtg, time to apply for a HELOC for my videogame spaceship :itagaki

VomKriege

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #288 on: November 05, 2015, 04:52:37 AM »
Well, you see, the game has not been delayed because each date was a purely tentative estimated potential windows and not an actual target.
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nudemacusers

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #289 on: November 05, 2015, 11:20:01 AM »
good point, brb buying accounts, space fashions and ships for all my friends so they too can experience the majesty of virtual intergalactic life.

but which one to buy!??!!

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ojxR84DJlX9i7Zu0ZrYkWPhKQUYIcK5bx5Ia8fQgimY/edit?usp=sharing&pli=1

:huh

Joe Molotov

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #290 on: November 05, 2015, 01:01:55 PM »
As long as you're only spending fake fiat money, does it even matter? Just don't spend any of your real currency like gold and bitcoins.
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Trent Dole

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #291 on: November 05, 2015, 01:58:02 PM »
One of the ships is $1,250. For a game that doesn't even exist yet. :lol
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nudemacusers

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #292 on: November 05, 2015, 02:04:33 PM »
can't wait for the post release rebalance nerf on these totally not pay to win like all that freemium garbage! preordered $1,000 ships :lawd

i'm gonna eat :mouf

Barry Egan

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #293 on: November 05, 2015, 02:52:50 PM »
I really don't think there will ever be an MMO-style release like they are promising and most of these ships won't ever be made let alone nerfed.  At this point they're probably trying to shit out the single-player game which will be beyond unplayable and filled with game-destroying bugs, wedged between 10+ hours of Gary Oldman cut-scenes penned from the guy who gave you the Wing Commander movie.  Then they will either declare bankruptcy or try to sell the entire mess to a publisher. 

Asperger tears falling like rain either way though :mouf

nudemacusers

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #294 on: November 05, 2015, 03:02:59 PM »
like manna from heaven :rejoice

VomKriege

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #295 on: November 05, 2015, 06:55:26 PM »
Heh something funny.
The stretch goal for 10m was a motion capture rig. Roberts went into great detail here about that. CIG did in fact buy this equipment.

Nevertheless they still, as advertised a few weeks ago, do most of the hard work for the single player at the Imaginarium (Andy Serkis's studio). Now, according to Chris Roberts himself, such a studio "costs between $25,000 and $50,000 and provides roughly 200 “moves”; simple gestures, limb movements and so on. More complex shoots which require props, additional actors, finger movements and other factors are significantly more expensive. Still more expensive are shoots that capture audio and facial movements.". Consider they were there for 60 days.

Promise nothing, imply everything, it's never said outright that whatever studio they create, they would do everything in house. Simpler mocap tools may be useful to CIG on top of what they did in the rented studio, at the very least flexible and constantly available. Any aspiration to facial capture was only gonna be possible at a very high end specialized company.

Still makes me raise an eyebrow with regards to their planning. In the end they maybe paid north of 3m$ just for their single player capture plus whatever cost was their own rigs. Considering the fees for their cast, it all makes up for quite an heavy line in their budget... in a spaceship game where the flight model is still under significant revision.
« Last Edit: November 05, 2015, 07:00:16 PM by VomKriege »
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chronovore

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #296 on: November 05, 2015, 10:10:20 PM »
I was going to respond to the points made about MoCap, but when I tried to RTFA it seems like there is a lot of explanation about MoCap in general -- I got ⅓ of the way through it before I felt like it was more about smokescreen than actual transparency. I mean, it could just be stated "We are getting a MoCap system for gross body movement to shave time off our basic humanoid animations in the game." I understand he's got a bunch of bigwig actors coming in and all, but if his vision for a spaceship battle game involves maintaining a performance capture studio... Huh.

Barry Egan

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #297 on: November 06, 2015, 12:32:30 AM »
Now they are building yet another mo-cap studio and an entirely new office in Santa Monica, backer-funded of course.

:itagaki

Barry Egan

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #298 on: November 06, 2015, 12:45:49 AM »
Also, Imaginarium is one of two mo-cap studios they rented from, the other being Cubic Motion

So for those keeping count, that's 1 in house MoCap studio, 2 rented MoCap studios, and now a 4th studio under construction.  For a game where you supposedly spend most of your time stationary in an aircraft.  Nope, no wasteful spending here.  :doge 

Joe Molotov

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Re: It's About Ethics in Videogame Spaceships
« Reply #299 on: November 06, 2015, 12:50:18 AM »
So for those keeping count, that's 1 in house MoCap studio, 2 rented MoCap studios, and now a 4th studio under construction.  For a game where you supposedly spend most of your time stationary in an aircraft.  Nope, no wasteful spending here.  :doge 

Gary Oldman ain't gonna animate himself, bruh.
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