Making a Dragon Quest thread and no one can stop me. (Dragonphile Support Group)

[tiesto]

damn did ANYONE finish this game back in the day? the original version was still fantastic...

Not back in the day, but I finished the original one some 5-or-6 years ago...

[Bebpo]

damn did ANYONE finish this game back in the day? the original version was still fantastic...

I heard it was like 130 hours long, which made me never want to play it.  I'm sure it was a great game, but that's so much time for a single game.  Only reason I'm gonna eventually play through it on 3DS is supposedly it's down to 50-60.

[archie4208]

I'm like ~27 hours in and from eyeballing an online guide I think I'm about halfway done.

I never played the PS1 version, but from reading online, there are a number of QOL features added in the 3DS version to make things easier (most notably a radar for the puzzle pieces and an NPC that gives hints as to where the pieces are located in the world).

[AdmiralViscen]

Do you need to pre plan and stress out about your class selection or can you pretty much wing it? DQ8 drove me nuts with that.

Bought this but playing FF4 now so won't start right away.

[archie4208]

You'll want to level up the right vocations to get to the advanced classes, but it's spelled out for you and there is no guesswork.

[Bebpo]

Do you need to pre plan and stress out about your class selection or can you pretty much wing it? DQ8 drove me nuts with that.

Really?  I've never put a lot of thought into classes and stuff in DQ.  Like I pick one class for each character and call it a day and never have a problem through the final boss.  Post-game bosses like DQIX's extensive stuff is a different matter, but unless I really love I game I just drop it at that point if the story is done and I can't beat a post-game boss without grinding for hours.

[AdmiralViscen]

In DQ8 you don't get enough skill points for every specialization, especially if you don't grind to 100. And you only get moves at specific specialty levels, which are not known to the player, and if you are 1 point short you don't get shit.

[Positive Touch]

dq7 you're free to change classes whenever so the only limits are how much time you wanna spend developing each class

[Freyj]

I used a fragment guide for the PS1 version, because that was pretty obnoxious otherwise iirc, but it never felt like a 130 hours, maybe 80-90? I've certainly had far less patience with other, shorter games.

[bluemax]

Do you need to pre plan and stress out about your class selection or can you pretty much wing it? DQ8 drove me nuts with that.

Bought this but playing FF4 now so won't start right away.

Nah they took out the only planning aspect of classes from the original, which was the Hybrid Skills. They rolled these into some of the classes as normal skills.

I think they also got rid of the thing where any time you switched jobs you'd be in a nerfed state until you won a certain number of battles.

[a slime appears]

So I've been playing this game and enjoying it but MAAAN OH MAAAN is it slow.

To refresh my memory I loaded up the original PS1 version and I completely forgot how much a trainwreck the game is at the beginning. This remake is a vast improvement so far.

[archnemesis]

With emulation you can always frame-skip past the slow parts.

[bork]

Does VIII have this much of a slow pace?  Wondering if I should sell this and just wait for that instead (or get it on my phone).

[a slime appears]

8 starts off pretty quickly and it's a better game overall. The 3DS port is gimped in comparison with the PS2 and has inferior graphics. If you just want to play 8 and don't care if it's on a handheld then get the PS2 version instead, it's still the best version and is cheaper.

The mobile version is a pretty interesting port which has a few drawbacks that prevent it from being a clear recommendation. Most notably the framerate along with lack of VO and orchestrated score are the big negatives with the forced portrait mode and touch-screen integration being surprising positives. If you have a 6 Plus sized screen then the resolution and size of the display are pretty big advantages as the game is easier to play and the visuals looks really nice and sharp. If you have an older phone then the performance might might it unplayable.

[bork]

8 starts off pretty quickly and it's a better game overall. The 3DS port is gimped in comparison with the PS2 and has inferior graphics. If you just want to play 8 and don't care if it's on a handheld then get the PS2 version instead, it's still the best version and is cheaper.

The mobile version is a pretty interesting port which has a few drawbacks that prevent it from being a clear recommendation. Most notably the framerate along with lack of VO and orchestrated score are the big negatives with the forced portrait mode and touch-screen integration being surprising positives. If you have a 6 Plus sized screen then the resolution and size of the display are pretty big advantages as the game is easier to play and the visuals looks really nice and sharp. If you have an older phone then the performance might might it unplayable.

Thanks.  I'm looking to play on a portable and don't mind the lack of VO/midi music.  Don't think the framerate would be an issue either since there's no action.  I have a Note 5 so the screen is nice and large, but I'm more interested in playing it on a 3DS.  What is gimped in comparison to the PS2 version, or was it the framerate/audio stuff that you already mentioned?

EDIT: Just watched a video of VIII on mobile.  I take back what I said about not caring about the framerate...that is hideous. 

[AdmiralViscen]

8 starts off pretty quickly and it's a better game overall. The 3DS port is gimped in comparison with the PS2 and has inferior graphics. If you just want to play 8 and don't care if it's on a handheld then get the PS2 version instead, it's still the best version and is cheaper.

The mobile version is a pretty interesting port which has a few drawbacks that prevent it from being a clear recommendation. Most notably the framerate along with lack of VO and orchestrated score are the big negatives with the forced portrait mode and touch-screen integration being surprising positives. If you have a 6 Plus sized screen then the resolution and size of the display are pretty big advantages as the game is easier to play and the visuals looks really nice and sharp. If you have an older phone then the performance might might it unplayable.

I remember the PS2 having pretty shitty load times for basic things like going in and out of battles. I'm assuming the DS version improves that? I'd take that over the graphical or audio fidelity honestly.

[Positive Touch]

http://www.usgamer.net/articles/retronauts-explores-the-slow-burn-strength-of-dragon-quest-vii

Jeremy Parish wrote up an article talking about how he liked the games intro, and I'd agree. it's not perfect and even the 3ds version could have some bullshit removed, but to me it feels just like any other dq vignette minutes the monsters. it's also sets up the game world in a better way than a 10 minute intro or a text crawl could've. in the context of the game and the series i think it works great.

and bork if you're not liking 7 then you prolly won't enjoy 8. 8 is by far the most-loved game in the series in the West, but it doesn't play all that different that the first 7. same game progression (talk a lot at a town, fight thru a short dungeon, repeat) and the battle system is similar except there's no classes in 8. i never played 9 or 10, but the first 8 games in the series have iterative differences in pacing and combat, not major changes.

[Himu]

dq8 is not a better game than dq7 in any sense of the word. ps2 version of dq8 blows. You have to wait for the alchemy pot. Added voice acting and orchestrated ost adds load times and ui sluggishness. slower battles. dq8 in general is more padded than 7. In 7, generally things happen for a reason. It has a slow burn to its storytelling. 8? Not so much. When you want to get the ship, enjoy. You'll have to backtrack and do a dungeon just to use it. A lot of the stories feel like filler and the game needed to be edited. There's a part where you can't do something in a castle, so you have to go and get a harp, do a dungeon, go back just to use the harp. So much of 8 is stretched and dragged out for no reason. 7, despite its infamous length, has far more brevity if you can imagine. dq7 also has better stories and writing. dq8 has a plot focus where almost every town/city is ravaged by the villain Dhoulmagus, so it gets boring after a while. It lacks not only 7's emotional highs but also its story variety. Complaining about dq7's slow burn storytelling but giving dq8 a pass is pretty LOL to me.

Mobile version (specicially, ios, not android) is better than dq8 ps2 western version because it's faster, and the alchemy pot is instant like in 9 and a more balanced (read: challenging) game difficulty. dq8 3ds is the best version of the game. It has the added bonuses of dq8 mobile, including instant alchemy pot, added stories, and two bonus characters, and a turbo battle mode. Still highly suggest for a first dq, but if 7 isn't working for you, which is the most story-based dq, then there's small chance dq8 will.

bebpo is also crazy again, dq7 3ds has the fastest battle system in the series.

[Bebpo]

Uh, I was going to agree with you until that last line.  DQ8 is slow as shit, which is why I'm a fan of 4-6.  But are you seriously trying to tell me the DQ7 battles where you have to watch your characters jump out and attack aka DQ8 is faster than first person 4-6 of just quick slash effects?  Err...no?

[Himu]

In old dq, I can generally read every line even on the fastest text speed. On fast speed mode in dq7r, I can't always read it because the text goes by so fast.

dq7r does not have dq8's battle system. They're not even similar. Have you even been playing dq7r? In the remake, the view is made so that so it allows you to see your characters actions but also is presented in an almost first person view. So it has the benefits of both: fast speed of first person combat and the animated charm of dq8 and 9.

Believe when I say it's the fastest in the series and if it's not, it's close to it. dq7 original is already the fastest in the series. Having animations doesn't necessariy make the battle system slow and comparing it to DQ8 makes me think you haven't actually played this remake at all and have been watching clips on youtube where people play it on the normal speed option.

[bork]

http://www.usgamer.net/articles/retronauts-explores-the-slow-burn-strength-of-dragon-quest-vii

Jeremy Parish wrote up an article talking about how he liked the games intro, and I'd agree. it's not perfect and even the 3ds version could have some bullshit removed, but to me it feels just like any other dq vignette minutes the monsters. it's also sets up the game world in a better way than a 10 minute intro or a text crawl could've. in the context of the game and the series i think it works great.

and bork if you're not liking 7 then you prolly won't enjoy 8. 8 is by far the most-loved game in the series in the West, but it doesn't play all that different that the first 7. same game progression (talk a lot at a town, fight thru a short dungeon, repeat) and the battle system is similar except there's no classes in 8. i never played 9 or 10, but the first 8 games in the series have iterative differences in pacing and combat, not major changes.

I'm not sure how I feel about it yet.  Right now I feel it's just dragging on and I'm not really finding it challenging.  I'm gonna keep going, but if it's not for me, there's always Dragon Quest Heroes II that I need to get back to.

I'm just not a big fan of turn-based RPGs- the majority are so incredibly boring to me.  As I was running around in DQ7, I kept wishing it was more like Zelda.

But I don't want to come off like I'm totally down on the game either.  It has its charms and it has been easier for me to get into than Square RPGs.

[a slime appears]

dq8 is not a better game than dq7 in any sense of the word. ps2 version of dq8 blows. You have to wait for the alchemy pot. Added voice acting and orchestrated ost adds load times and ui sluggishness. slower battles. dq8 in general is more padded than 7. In 7, generally things happen for a reason. It has a slow burn to its storytelling. 8? Not so much. When you want to get the ship, enjoy. You'll have to backtrack and do a dungeon just to use it. A lot of the stories feel like filler and the game needed to be edited. There's a part where you can't do something in a castle, so you have to go and get a harp, do a dungeon, go back just to use the harp. So much of 8 is stretched and dragged out for no reason. 7, despite its infamous length, has far more brevity if you can imagine. dq7 also has better stories and writing. dq8 has a plot focus where almost every town/city is ravaged by the villain Dhoulmagus, so it gets boring after a while. It lacks not only 7's emotional highs but also its story variety. Complaining about dq7's slow burn storytelling but giving dq8 a pass is pretty LOL to me.

Mobile version (specicially, ios, not android) is better than dq8 ps2 western version because it's faster, and the alchemy pot is instant like in 9 and a more balanced (read: challenging) game difficulty. dq8 3ds is the best version of the game. It has the added bonuses of dq8 mobile, including instant alchemy pot, added stories, and two bonus characters, and a turbo battle mode. Still highly suggest for a first dq, but if 7 isn't working for you, which is the most story-based dq, then there's small chance dq8 will.

bebpo is also crazy again, dq7 3ds has the fastest battle system in the series.

Man, that's a lot of words for "I'm wrong".

[Himu]

dq8 is not a better game than dq7 in any sense of the word. ps2 version of dq8 blows. You have to wait for the alchemy pot. Added voice acting and orchestrated ost adds load times and ui sluggishness. slower battles. dq8 in general is more padded than 7. In 7, generally things happen for a reason. It has a slow burn to its storytelling. 8? Not so much. When you want to get the ship, enjoy. You'll have to backtrack and do a dungeon just to use it. A lot of the stories feel like filler and the game needed to be edited. There's a part where you can't do something in a castle, so you have to go and get a harp, do a dungeon, go back just to use the harp. So much of 8 is stretched and dragged out for no reason. 7, despite its infamous length, has far more brevity if you can imagine. dq7 also has better stories and writing. dq8 has a plot focus where almost every town/city is ravaged by the villain Dhoulmagus, so it gets boring after a while. It lacks not only 7's emotional highs but also its story variety. Complaining about dq7's slow burn storytelling but giving dq8 a pass is pretty LOL to me.

Mobile version (specicially, ios, not android) is better than dq8 ps2 western version because it's faster, and the alchemy pot is instant like in 9 and a more balanced (read: challenging) game difficulty. dq8 3ds is the best version of the game. It has the added bonuses of dq8 mobile, including instant alchemy pot, added stories, and two bonus characters, and a turbo battle mode. Still highly suggest for a first dq, but if 7 isn't working for you, which is the most story-based dq, then there's small chance dq8 will.

bebpo is also crazy again, dq7 3ds has the fastest battle system in the series.

Man, that's a lot of words for "I'm wrong".

Pretty common opinion among DQ fans though? I don't know a single DQ fan who is knowledgeable about the series and has played every entry who likes DQ8 more than 7. That's usually the people who like DQ8, but haven't really played much of the series. Most are going to agree 7 is the better game. The mainstream media may prefer 8, who knows, but that doesn't make them dq fans necessarily. You're quite literally the first dq fan I've seen who prefers 8 to 7.

[archnemesis]

DQ8 is pretty popular in Europe since it was the first entry we got.

At the moment I prefer DQ8 to 7, but maybe I'll change my mind after having played this version.

[AdmiralViscen]

I haven't played 7 but he's spot on about 8 relative to other games in the series.

Himu what is turbo battle mode in the 3DS version of DQ8?

[Bebpo]

I've seen a lot of people who prefer DQ8 as the best in the franchise.  It definitely has the best sense of exploration.

I mean, outside of the battles being slow, there's really nothing particularly bad about DQ8 as a DQ game, and let's not pretend the other DQ games all don't have their flaws.  DQ5 is the only entry I don't have issues with.

[AdmiralViscen]

To me, the speed is why I like DQ over most other RPGs. I think it's key to the whole design, the feedback loop of town->dungeon grind->equip->beat dungeon.

[tiesto]

I like 8 more than 7, Himu. I think it's because a number of factors - DQ8 came after years of disappointing RPGs and had an amazing world map, great characters, absolutely stunning production values. Its vignettes admittedly aren't as interesting as 7's, though.

[Joe Molotov]

I prefer the original Dragon Warrior. 

[Joe Molotov]

Real talk tho, I loved Dragon Warrior I on the NES. It was one of the first NES games I owned, and I beat it probably 3 or 4 times at least (and then again on the GBC later). I had the huge fold-out map from Nintendo Power and I wore that thing out pouring over it.

[Positive Touch]

i still play dq1 all the time. unlike a lot of 80s rpgs it isn't filed with clutter and repetition (especially later ports that make it easier) and its just a fun little game about exploration.

[Bebpo]

Maybe I should play DQ1 someday.  I like FF1 quite a bit, but that's because I actually like and have nostalgic attachment to the FF series.  I like DQ, but I'm definitely not a DQ fan.  The games are occasionally charming little short stories with cute slimes and other monsters, and some of the games have nice worlds to explore.  But outside of 5 the overall stories are zzz, the characters are zzz, and the gameplay is fairly simple.  It's part of why I couldn't get into DQH, is that I don't really care about any of these DQ characters outside maybe Yangus and maybe Torneko.  DQ Builders is a better fanservice game because I care more about the DQ aesthetics and slimes and monsters than I do any of the actual DQ characters.  Hell, even the developers thought their non-MC playable characters were so good that they removed them all from IX and X!

[Freyj]

The gameplay is simple, but it still manages to be leagues ahead of pretty much every other JRPG franchise out there. Buff/debuff matters, gear matters, new spells matter. That seems like a bunch of "of course" points, but strangely enough most JRPGs can't seem to hit many if any of them. Of course, things like that mattered much less to the younger, more weeb me.

It took me a long time to warm to the series.

[Bebpo]

I agree with you on the buff/debuff.  But buff/debuff gameplay ala SMT only works in games that are challenging enough to require the strategy to use them.  I think a lot of DQs are pretty easy.  But I do remember a few where buffs mattered.  Idk, the series is good but for me the games are very forgettable because they don't have memorable characters or memorable stories.  I loved 4-6 but I don't remember anything about 4 other than Torneko has a chapter and in 6 there's a flying carpet.  5 I remember the story a little more.  DQ8 I barely remember anything about and DQ9 I remember absolutely nothing because I didn't like it.

[archie4208]

I just fought a challenging boss that nearly killed me. 

Kasnooze

[Positive Touch]

this thread is a dumpster fire now

[Bebpo]

Eh, I'm just being bitchy about DQ.  I love 4-6, and 8 was my first real exposure and enjoyed exploring the world map at the time.  I'm sure I'll enjoy DQ7 3DS when I have more time to play it.  The series 8-bit aesthetic with the fonts, sound effects is lovely and the monster designs are adorably charming.  If I love seeing each new demon in SMT for the cool factor, I always enjoy running into new DQ monsters for the charm factor, especially if they're well animated.

I'm looking forward to DQ11 for hopefully a nice big 3d world to explore and find treasures in.

That's about as nice as you're gonna get from me on DQ.  You're not going to get me saying anything nice about DQ9 though even though I sorta enjoyed my 60 hours or so through it.

[AdmiralViscen]

Why the fuck aren't we talking about DQ3

[Positive Touch]

dq3 is great game yes (although I'm ashamed to say i never beat it)

[I'm a Puppy!]

3 is tied with 7 for my favourite. Had about a 30 save file on my old phone but then it died.  :'(

[bluemax]

I just wish DQ games had more interesting spells honestly. There's sap and oomph and that's about it. And then in later games (DQ8 especially) bosses just use Wave of Ice and undo all that.

I get why they don't, because it keeps the systems super easy to understand, but it reduces most of the strategic complexity to buff, heal, damage and repeat.

[Positive Touch]

snooze works great against big enemy groups, as do other attacks that stun enemies or make them dance. attacks that blind work great on big enemies and frequently work on bosses.

that stuff combined with abilities that attack various group configurations are why i think dq battles are so great. the games are balanced with the idea that you'll constantly be using spells and abilities. if you're just using regular attacks every round then you're fucking up and wasting time.

[I'm a Puppy!]

It's a bit ironic in that DQ is one of the few JRPG series where buff/debuff actually matters. But there's like 3, maybe 4 of those kinds of spells.

[archie4208]

I'm tapping out after ~50 hours and doing all the color fragments.  It was fun while it lasted, but I'm getting burnt out and there was one fragment that was beyond annoying to get and that's when I threw in the towel.

[Positive Touch]

wait what? you finished all the islands in 50 hours?

[archie4208]

Yeah.  And apparently there are even more islands with Mysterious Fragments. 

I liked the game a lot, but I've had my fill. 

[Positive Touch]

yeah there's a few more scenarios  after you finish all the main pillars, but i think you're like 80% done with the game. and if you're bored with it then yeah, move on, but from what i remember the endgame had a bunch of stuff that was way weirder and more out there than the rest of the game that was pretty cool to see. 

[I'm a Puppy!]

50 hours? That seems REALLY short.

I'm just hitting my stride now at 12.

Is it just me or does the game seem a lot easier but at the same time it seems the random encounter rate is a bit higher? I know it's not really random but in dungeons they always spawn in an unavoidable spot.

[Positive Touch]

yeah i was surprised at that. you gotta be doing nothing but running to exactly where you need to go to finish it that fast. I'm only at the robot level and I'm at 15 hours already.

and i HATE the lack of random battles. it just doesn't work in this game. on the overworld you'll never get into a fight at all, and in dungeons it's every three steps. really fucking annoying.

[archie4208]

I didn't realize I was that close to the end. 

I'll go ahead and finish it.

Also it was actually 55 hours to finish all the main islands.

[demi]

Sell me your copy Archie since you're done with it

[bluemax]

50 hours? That seems REALLY short.

I'm just hitting my stride now at 12.

Is it just me or does the game seem a lot easier but at the same time it seems the random encounter rate is a bit higher? I know it's not really random but in dungeons they always spawn in an unavoidable spot.

I would agree with this. I've only had 2 characters die so far (Almost done with the Herb garden scenario) but I feel like I'm fighting all the time. I also avoided encounters a bit more in the PS version to keep my levels low for Dharma which isn't an issue this time around. I'm level 14-15 at this point.

The battles aren't bad on the world map, but the dungeons should've been made a little wider to accommodate for the monster hit boxes.

[AdmiralViscen]

https://store.playstation.com/#!/en-us/games/dragon-quest-builders-demo/cid=UP0082-CUSA05700_00-BUILDERS00000000

[bluemax]

I played it, almost lost track of what time it was. I've never played Minecraft so I can't compare but it was pretty fun.

[demi]

Yet another Vita game

Vita means Life

[a slime appears]

DQ Builders is honestly really cool. I enjoyed the demo.

[bluemax]

Spent two hours doing Casino shit in DQ7 yesterday. Got every item from Lucky Panel but 1, got enough coins from slots to get the Bottlenose Shield and 2 Magic Vestments. Next part gonna be pretty easy. Its funny to think about the fact that my dopey fisherman's son hero is decked out in full plate, a heavy helmet, and a giant war hammer.

[tiesto]

Played some of the DQ Builders demo and it was pretty fun. I never had any interest in Minecraft, but give it some direction, good graphics, and chock it full of DQ nostalgia and I'm in.

[bork]

Builders on Vita is super-small.  Pretty much the same size as the demo at under 300 MB.

The game does not have PSTV support or cross-save support, though.  That sucks...I would have gotten this on PS4 if I knew that before getting it off PSN today.  Oh well.  Might be time to hack my second PSTV and use the antiblacklist app to run this.

[archnemesis]

Apparently the PS4 version is only about 1 GB. My copy should arrive this Friday.