Author Topic: US Politics Thread |OT| SAD TRUMP  (Read 7204417 times)

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Nintex

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This lady talks like a YouTube algorithm.
https://twitter.com/DailyCaller/status/1022852142682570752


It somehow makes less sense than what Trump says.

"So if we close the loopholes, that's 2 trillion dollar right there and then for 3 trillion we transfer to total renewable energy, education, fair share, corporations, tax cuts, pay before what Trump tax"

🤴

Optimus

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Did you watch the whole video? She's also talking about carbon tax and significantly cutting military spending. The only problem with this segment is that she's a little cringy and that she doesn't factor the possibility of being coincidentally assassinated if she tries to go against the military industrial complex.

Nintex

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Did you watch the whole video? She's also talking about carbon tax and significantly cutting military spending. The only problem with this segment is that she's a little cringy and that she doesn't factor the possibility of being coincidentally assassinated if she tries to go against the military industrial complex.
"They're like don't give us another nuclear bomb!!! like like"

"Agent 47?!... we have a live one. Do it quick and don't leave a mess in the car this time."


https://twitter.com/maggieNYT/status/1023244353488252928
 :dead  :dead :dead :rejoice :neogaf
« Last Edit: July 28, 2018, 12:54:57 PM by Nintex »
🤴

Kara

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CatsCatsCats

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Quote
Google has a name for them: TVCs

 :ohhh

Nintex

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https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-07-25/inside-google-s-shadow-workforce
Silicon Valley has reinvented feudalism.

- Kings/noblemen (the CEO's, shareholders, VPs of "Consumer Excellence")
- Knights (Their own top employees - the Google/Facebook/Apple 'Family')
- Peasants (Low wage workers working the digital fields)

Without classic hierarchical structures and an overall apathy towards working conditions for nerds it couldn't have ended any other way.
🤴

Nola

  • Senior Member
It should be more of a focus by Democratic socialists, but even if you took Bernie’s completely abstract and detail lite version of UHC that has basically no cost or price controls besides drug negotiation, even the most expensive estimates to shift the entire sector to Medicare for all come in cheaper by a wide amount than the overall cost of America’s current healthcare system. Which that right there should explain just how fucked and wasteful our current system is.

Also lol at The Daily Caller selectively remembering to whine about debt when the libs want to spend.

Optimus

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It should be more of a focus by Democratic socialists, but even if you took Bernie’s completely abstract and detail lite version of UHC that has basically no cost or price controls besides drug negotiation, even the most expensive estimates to shift the entire sector to Medicare for all come in cheaper by a wide amount than the overall cost of America’s current healthcare system. Which that right there should explain just how fucked and wasteful our current system is.

Also lol at The Daily Caller selectively remembering to whine about debt when the libs want to spend.


https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/25/business/trump-corporate-tax-cut-deficit.html

"Bububububububu what about the debt?"

Nola

  • Senior Member
Yeah the tax cuts were trillions in unfunded borrowed spending, and now that the trickle down fairy has failed to appear once again and pay for everything, I don’t see any movement by the Republicans to pay for the hole except to make overtures about hollowing out social services(of course) that won’t begin to fill the void(as they’ve always done)....and in some cases just increase costs like the whole(ironic) idea to Obamacare the Medicare system, first pushed by Paul Ryan as a way to funnel more tax money to less efficient private companies to carry out the same jobs as the government insurance program.

 I’d say it’s best to ignore the pearl clutching, but a good chunk of the non-rightwing press loves to play right into this rightwing media game(not that these sorts of questions are invalid as a whole). Though for Alexandra’s sake, she does need to spend some more time on this issue because Trevor Noah is not going to be the only one asking those same questions if she wants to continue to tour and capitalize on her rise.

spoiler (click to show/hide)
Also the debt is a fairly overstated concern. There is very little wrong for a leading economy like America to have debt, even fairly notable amounts, but obviously I would prefer that debt to go to more valuable things.
[close]
« Last Edit: July 28, 2018, 03:00:39 PM by Nola »

Kara

  • It was all going to be very admirable and noble and it would show us - philosophically - what it means to be human.
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Silicon Valley has reinvented feudalism.

- Kings/noblemen (the CEO's, shareholders, VPs of "Consumer Excellence")
- Knights (Their own top employees - the Google/Facebook/Apple 'Family')
- Peasants (Low wage workers working the digital fields)

Without classic hierarchical structures and an overall apathy towards working conditions for nerds it couldn't have ended any other way.

tfw u don't know feudalism is a mode of production centered around the allocation of arable land in exchange for tribute.

kingv

  • Senior Member
Yeah the tax cuts were trillions in unfunded borrowed spending, and now that the trickle down fairy has failed to appear once again and pay for everything, I don’t see any movement by the Republicans to pay for the hole except to make overtures about hollowing out social services(of course) that won’t begin to fill the void(as they’ve always done)....and in some cases just increase costs like the whole(ironic) idea to Obamacare the Medicare system, first pushed by Paul Ryan as a way to funnel more tax money to less efficient private companies to carry out the same jobs as the government insurance program.

 I’d say it’s best to ignore the pearl clutching, but a good chunk of the non-rightwing press loves to play right into this rightwing media game(not that these sorts of questions are invalid as a whole). Though for Alexandra’s sake, she does need to spend some more time on this issue because Trevor Noah is not going to be the only one asking those same questions if she wants to continue to tour and capitalize on her rise.

spoiler (click to show/hide)
Also the debt is a fairly overstated concern. There is very little wrong for a leading economy like America to have debt, even fairly notable amounts, but obviously I would prefer that debt to go to more valuable things.
[close]

The reality is that Medicare for All and Free/subsidized college, it’s really fucking obvious how you pay for it.

You just tax people. We are already paying for college and paying for healthcare and it’s should be pretty obvious that net-net, many if not most people will actually pay less in taxes under Medicare for all than they pay in premiums and deductibles.

The obvious answer is “hey, you know how you drop like $300/month to get a shitty healthcare plan that has a $7k deductible and then some doctors don’t even take it? Well, you’ll just give that money to the government instead and get a healthcare plan wth a $1000 deductible that basically all the doctors will take.

Edit: Bernie wanted to pay for Medicare for all by raising a 2.2% income tax on wages. I make about $130k/year and pay more than that on my premiums alone.

Edit: the average America spent about $9,500 on healthcare in 2017. That’s actually more than they pay in federal income taxes, on average. Believe this number includes ALL healthcare spending not just private.


Because r either way there is a ton of money already in the healthcare system that you can basically just move around and net-net most people will actually save money OR get much better healthcare for a nominal difference in price.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2018, 04:23:50 PM by kingv »

Kara

  • It was all going to be very admirable and noble and it would show us - philosophically - what it means to be human.
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Optimus

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AMEEERIKAAAA, FUCK YEAH!!!

Canadian woman gives birth in US, gets $1 million hospital bill

2014 article btw but still.

Nintex

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Silicon Valley has reinvented feudalism.

- Kings/noblemen (the CEO's, shareholders, VPs of "Consumer Excellence")
- Knights (Their own top employees - the Google/Facebook/Apple 'Family')
- Peasants (Low wage workers working the digital fields)

Without classic hierarchical structures and an overall apathy towards working conditions for nerds it couldn't have ended any other way.
tfw u don't know feudalism is a mode of production centered around the allocation of arable land in exchange for tribute.
True, the word I was looking for was aristrocacy
🤴

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
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AMEEERIKAAAA, FUCK YEAH!!!

Canadian woman gives birth in US, gets $1 million hospital bill

2014 article btw but still.
jeez man, wasn't posting stuff from 18 months ago bad enough?

that she doesn't factor the possibility of being coincidentally assassinated if she tries to go against the military industrial complex.
you're only supposed to leave a signal to readers if you're doing a shtick

benjipwns

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I would think that the GOP would realize they are alienating an entire generation of voters for short term gain, and thus Trump is likely the last gasp before like 20 years of underperforming in elections.... but they don’t seem to realize that yet, so I don’t know.
why would politicians writ large care about anything but the short term gain? their entire existence is tied to a scheduled cycle

spoiler (click to show/hide)
also, if i had a nickel...
[close]

Optimus

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eh, I wasn't aware of the story and found it really entertaining

c'mon, it's one fucking million for a birth, this shit's hilarious in a depressing and fucked up kind of way

benjipwns

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and although i'm not sure i disagree with the main point kingv, i did look up some exit polls data just because...and obviously this is only part of the cohort but it's not like i can break it down more in an easy lazy way

2004:
18-29: D 54, R 45

2008:
18-29: D 66, R 32
30-44: D 52, R 46

18-44: D 58, R 41

|
|
thanks obama
|
V

2016:
30-44: D 50, R 42

18-44: D 52, R 40
« Last Edit: July 28, 2018, 08:29:29 PM by benjipwns »

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
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since they got/get so much commentary, cacs without a college degree, R/D vote share, 1980-2016 (voter population %):
57/36 (63%) -> 66/34 (62%) -> 59/40 (54%) -> 38/39 (53%) -> 43/44 (46%) -> 57/40 (46%) -> 61/38 (43%) -> 58/40 (39%) -> 61/36 (36%) -> 67/28 (34%)

for comparison, cacs with a college degree:
55/31 (25%) -> 62/37 (27%) -> 60/39 (31%) -> 41/40 (35%) -> 47/43 (37%) -> 52/44 (35%) -> 55/44 (34%) -> 51/47 (35%) -> 56/42 (36%) -> 49/45 (37%)

benjipwns

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You don't need a doctor to give birth
she kinda did:
Quote
She stayed on bed rest in the hospital for six weeks and her child, born premature, was placed in intensive care for two months.

benjipwns

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can't find any other follow ups on the story after:
Quote
We will soon find out what it's like to be stuck with a $1 million medical bill while trying to operate a brand new business.

Jennifer Huculak-Kimmel made headlines across North America last year after being handed a massive medical bill for giving birth while on vacation in the United States.

Now, she and her husband, Darren Kimmel, are stars of a new reality show. The program follows the family through the ups and downs of running a fishing lodge in northern Saskatchewan. 

"This fishing camp was a leap into the unknown," Darren said in the trailer of the show, Nordic Lodge.

The couple from Humboldt, Sask., sold their farm and traded their lives as ranchers for a life on Reindeer Lake running a fishing lodge. They knew nothing about running a fishing camp when they bought the business, and signed on in 2013 to take part in the reality show.
her travel policy with Saskatchewan Blue Cross had expired which is why they didn't cover it, the Canadian and US governments paid ~$30,000 of it

 :cancry

Optimus

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You don't need a doctor to give birth
she kinda did:
Quote
She stayed on bed rest in the hospital for six weeks and her child, born premature, was placed in intensive care for two months.


Yeah but you still have the choice in a free market economy to let the baby die if you can't afford the hospital bills. On the other hand these universal health care commies give you no choice other than having a healthy baby.

benjipwns

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well, except for that part where the baby was treated for two months and she was allowed to abscond on the million dollar bill by fleeing to a hostile foreign country that just happened to be the one she came from and agreed to do a reality show in

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
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follow the money and the publicity, it's mostly in Canadian media, this was all a PR stunt for the reality show, wake up sheeple, stop watching CNN

benjipwns

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Canada's a long con to place us back under the House of Windsor

APPLES

6465464_23242

koo-koo-kachoo

offer the recipes

memPHIs 22135

elephants and acrobats, lions snakes monkey

FUNKO rothschilds

6651 nanette

caitlyn jenner

4 days april

407

brother pele's in the back, sweet zina's in the front, crusin down the freeway in the hot, hot sun

b

Mandark

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Silicon Valley has reinvented feudalism.

- Kings/noblemen (the CEO's, shareholders, VPs of "Consumer Excellence")
- Knights (Their own top employees - the Google/Facebook/Apple 'Family')
- Peasants (Low wage workers working the digital fields)

Without classic hierarchical structures and an overall apathy towards working conditions for nerds it couldn't have ended any other way.
tfw u don't know feudalism is a mode of production centered around the allocation of arable land in exchange for tribute.
True, the word I was looking for was aristrocacy

If you're trying to think of some words that describe a hierarchy of social classes, defined by their respective relations to capital...

kingv

  • Senior Member
and although i'm not sure i disagree with the main point kingv, i did look up some exit polls data just because...and obviously this is only part of the cohort but it's not like i can break it down more in an easy lazy way

2004:
18-29: D 54, R 45

2008:
18-29: D 66, R 32
30-44: D 52, R 46

18-44: D 58, R 41

|
|
thanks obama
|
V

2016:
30-44: D 50, R 42

18-44: D 52, R 40

I guess the counterpoint is that the Republicans survived Nixon :-/

I feel like Trump is worse, in many ways, but of course I wasn’t alive for Nixon and also unsure how partisan news sources plays into it. I know a lot of moderately intelligent people that will cover for Trump in a lot of ways... but I also think the chances of hitting some sort of completely avoidable failure is way higher under Trump than Nixon.

Nola

  • Senior Member



The reality is that Medicare for All and Free/subsidized college, it’s really fucking obvious how you pay for it.

You just tax people. We are already paying for college and paying for healthcare and it’s should be pretty obvious that net-net, many if not most people will actually pay less in taxes under Medicare for all than they pay in premiums and deductibles.

The obvious answer is “hey, you know how you drop like $300/month to get a shitty healthcare plan that has a $7k deductible and then some doctors don’t even take it? Well, you’ll just give that money to the government instead and get a healthcare plan wth a $1000 deductible that basically all the doctors will take.

Edit: Bernie wanted to pay for Medicare for all by raising a 2.2% income tax on wages. I make about $130k/year and pay more than that on my premiums alone.

Edit: the average America spent about $9,500 on healthcare in 2017. That’s actually more than they pay in federal income taxes, on average. Believe this number includes ALL healthcare spending not just private.


Because r either way there is a ton of money already in the healthcare system that you can basically just move around and net-net most people will actually save money OR get much better healthcare for a nominal difference in price.

Yep all true, and I could go on a laundry list of other points to make the case. Like the fact that America actually already pays per person more in taxes for healthcare than almost every UHC country. Which is by the far the worst value in the developed world. Theoretically, done right, like doing away with all the redundancy in the government system and making everything under one umbrella, long-term the costs would probably not rise for taxpayers all that much.

The one thing that is always a problem though is the costs are heavily front-loaded, so sticker shock and the fear of change paralyzes mobilization for it. To go Medicare for all would be both incredibly disruptive and incredibly expensive and difficult to coordinate. I'm all for doing it, but I also get it would be unprecedented for a country to so radically change their system(most build on top of whatever was there first, and few if any were every this bloated and dispersed) or when it is so dug in and such a large share of the economy.

Nola

  • Senior Member
AMEEERIKAAAA, FUCK YEAH!!!

Canadian woman gives birth in US, gets $1 million hospital bill

2014 article btw but still.
Those stories are the crazy outliers in this country, but i think what is just as crazy, if not more, is that for most of the American history pregnancy was considered a pre-existing condition and cost a lot more to insure if you wanted the coverage because of the lack of regulation. Which led to a lot of woman unable to afford the cost to get that extra coverage so they went without, then they would get hit with $30-50,000 delivery bills, the average cost of a delivery, thousands more in checks ups and other services along the way like ultra sounds. Thats enough to bankrupt some people. And that vicious cycle just keeps accelerating the costs of the procedure over time as hospitals try to make up the difference.

....But thankfully Republicans would love to return us to that and make abortions illegal so we can have even more people going bankrupt and forced into that system without the ability to afford it.



You don't need a doctor to give birth

I'd be dead and likely so would of my mom if she tried to have me at home because my ass decided to move around last minute and turn somewhat sideways an nearly chock myself with the umbilical cord and required an emergency procedure to save both of us.  :idont
« Last Edit: July 29, 2018, 12:04:10 AM by Nola »

kingv

  • Senior Member
Giuliani is saying he has 5 witnesses that can attest that Dobald Truno did not have advance knowledge of the Trump Tower meeeting....

What?! How can one witness an event that didn’t occur. The only thing that we can draw from this is that he definitely knew.

VomKriege

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The best lawyers, believe me.
ὕβρις

Kara

  • It was all going to be very admirable and noble and it would show us - philosophically - what it means to be human.
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Much tradecraft. Very cut-out. Many active measures. Thank you Tovarish @Jack. Wow. :doge




warcock

  • Member



The reality is that Medicare for All and Free/subsidized college, it’s really fucking obvious how you pay for it.

You just tax people. We are already paying for college and paying for healthcare and it’s should be pretty obvious that net-net, many if not most people will actually pay less in taxes under Medicare for all than they pay in premiums and deductibles.

The obvious answer is “hey, you know how you drop like $300/month to get a shitty healthcare plan that has a $7k deductible and then some doctors don’t even take it? Well, you’ll just give that money to the government instead and get a healthcare plan wth a $1000 deductible that basically all the doctors will take.

Edit: Bernie wanted to pay for Medicare for all by raising a 2.2% income tax on wages. I make about $130k/year and pay more than that on my premiums alone.

Edit: the average America spent about $9,500 on healthcare in 2017. That’s actually more than they pay in federal income taxes, on average. Believe this number includes ALL healthcare spending not just private.


Because r either way there is a ton of money already in the healthcare system that you can basically just move around and net-net most people will actually save money OR get much better healthcare for a nominal difference in price.

Yep all true, and I could go on a laundry list of other points to make the case. Like the fact that America actually already pays per person more in taxes for healthcare than almost every UHC country. Which is by the far the worst value in the developed world. Theoretically, done right, like doing away with all the redundancy in the government system and making everything under one umbrella, long-term the costs would probably not rise for taxpayers all that much.

The one thing that is always a problem though is the costs are heavily front-loaded, so sticker shock and the fear of change paralyzes mobilization for it. To go Medicare for all would be both incredibly disruptive and incredibly expensive and difficult to coordinate. I'm all for doing it, but I also get it would be unprecedented for a country to so radically change their system(most build on top of whatever was there first, and few if any were every this bloated and dispersed) or when it is so dug in and such a large share of the economy.

 :lawd

"You don't understand basic economics" - PhoenixDark circa 2018


The biggest kick I would get out of UHC would not be the human decency and dignity afforded to my fellow americans but the fact that we would probably bellyflop under the EU in terms of aggregate nominal GDP.

Kara

  • It was all going to be very admirable and noble and it would show us - philosophically - what it means to be human.
  • Senior Member
Not sure that's something to brag about but whatever.

agrajag

  • Senior Member
I imagine the biggest hurdle for UHC is the insurance industry. What would happen to all the insurance companies if everyone is on Medicare? I guess many would turn to supplemental insurqnce, but most would shrink and lose a ton of money and some would go bankrupt. So yeah, they would fight tooth and nail against it.

Nintex

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🤴

Nola

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I imagine the biggest hurdle for UHC is the insurance industry. What would happen to all the insurance companies if everyone is on Medicare? I guess many would turn to supplemental insurqnce, but most would shrink and lose a ton of money and some would go bankrupt. So yeah, they would fight tooth and nail against it.

Basically any lever you pull is going to invite resistance by some billion dollar industry. That's the biggest reason why I used to be of the opinion Medicare-for-all was a political pipe dream, but I'm honestly a bit less cynical toward the possibility now, especially with the growth in support, the decaying insurance market, and the ability to basically pass it with 50 votes.

Nola

  • Senior Member


 :neogaf :dead

 ::) Fox News, the home of bringing on body language experts to analyze the "terrorist fist jab" and crying for months that gay marriage will lead to goat marriage is mocking political derangement, that's cute.




warcock

  • Member
I imagine the biggest hurdle for UHC is the insurance industry. What would happen to all the insurance companies if everyone is on Medicare? I guess many would turn to supplemental insurqnce, but most would shrink and lose a ton of money and some would go bankrupt. So yeah, they would fight tooth and nail against it.

Basically any lever you pull is going to invite resistance by some billion dollar industry. That's the biggest reason why I used to be of the opinion Medicare-for-all was a political pipe dream, but I'm honestly a bit less cynical toward the possibility now, especially with the growth in support, the decaying insurance market, and the ability to basically pass it with 50 votes.

billions, large range. 1-999 billion. On the larger end.

Nola

  • Senior Member
I imagine the biggest hurdle for UHC is the insurance industry. What would happen to all the insurance companies if everyone is on Medicare? I guess many would turn to supplemental insurqnce, but most would shrink and lose a ton of money and some would go bankrupt. So yeah, they would fight tooth and nail against it.

Basically any lever you pull is going to invite resistance by some billion dollar industry. That's the biggest reason why I used to be of the opinion Medicare-for-all was a political pipe dream, but I'm honestly a bit less cynical toward the possibility now, especially with the growth in support, the decaying insurance market, and the ability to basically pass it with 50 votes.

billions, large range. 1-999 billion. On the larger end.

Yeah for sure, depending on which interest you are talking about the numbers get enormous. US pharm spending alone is something like close to half a trillion dollars, a trillion dollars flows through private insurance companies and a quarter trillion flow through just their administrative side along with some of the highest paid upper level salaries in the country. While another quarter trillion makes up the employer tax subsidy that helps prop up the employer market. Then you have the care centers themselves which have all sorts of fuckery going on.

Rattle any of those cages and you get some well funded and pissed off stakeholders.

Nintex

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Rudy's back!


Cohen apparently had 183 tapes, 1 with Trump on it, 12 where Trump or the campaign is the subject.
🤴

Himu

  • Senior Member
Have had my Facebook full of bad memes by conservatives making fun of the libs in San Franisco about straws. Getting on their soapbox acting indignant and intellectually superior while offering nothing in the way of solutions  but shit flinging. Same as when I expressed why young people are attracted to socialism but all I get in return is,”they should work harder” and lazy and and want free stuff.”

I’m this close to drawing a comic of Ben Shapiro showing his true form - a robot - that mindlessly sounds off the word facts, but something gets lost in translation and he spouts the word,”fax” as facts instead.
IYKYK

Himu

  • Senior Member
Beep boop.

FAX

FAX

FAX
FAX
FAX
FAX FAX FAX FAX FAX FAX
FAX
IYKYK

Mandark

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meanwhile, in Virginia:


Joe Molotov

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or it is?  :gladbron
©@©™


team filler

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LeslieCockburn
*****

Yeti

  • Hail Hydra
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Unsurprising that a white supremacist has a secret desire for BBC.
WDW

team filler

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Unsurprising that a white supremacist has a secret desire for BBC.
unsurprising that a living creature has a secret desire for BBC.
*****

Nintex

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🤴

BlueTsunami

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Seems like that star destroyer was a job creator
:9

Himu

  • Senior Member
Nah. She’s right.
IYKYK

warcock

  • Member


 :lawd

The war drums resonate so blissfully within my echo chamber, i'm riled up for another ideological putsch. Lets fight again centrist cunts.

agrajag

  • Senior Member
Sam Seder

 :rejoice

kingv

  • Senior Member
Unsurprising that a white supremacist has a secret desire for BBC.

1) it’s BFC not BBC.
2) you’re just jealous.... “Yeti”

kingv

  • Senior Member
Well, I think we are going to wrap it up ok whether or not Trump himself colluded with the Russians this week.

Giuliani was on Fox News this morning basically admitting to it, but saying that Trump 1) wasn’t at the meeting and 2) that it wasn’t illegal but no longer pitching the “no collusion” line.

I’m still predicting Mueller’s report talks about felony FEC violations stemming from the meeting. I feel even better about this after reading an article from one of Obama’s White House Counsels making a similar argument.


agrajag

  • Senior Member
Rudy going through stages of grief about Russia collusion on national television.

kingv

  • Senior Member
More like stages of the narcissists manifesto. We are going into “so what if I did it, it wasn’t illegal and soon to transition into “so what if it’s illegal, Obama made me do it”

Mark it.

Nintex

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Rudy's interviews are great. It basically comes down to:
 :idont
🤴