Author Topic: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery  (Read 901 times)

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Uncle

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Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« on: January 13, 2023, 10:58:47 AM »
interesting news going on in recent days

Hasbro, which owns Wizards of the Coast, which owns Dungeons & Dragons, have decided in their infinite wisdom to revoke their old Open Gaming License from the year 2000

this pulls the rug out from under tons of small creators who used it, and replaces it with a new much worse license that gives them ownership over what you create and a big cut of any money you earn

the old license did not include the word "irrevocable" because it was made before licensing language was commonly strengthened to include that, but in spite of this it's still likely that no court would ever let them get away with revoking it

this information was leaked and the gaming community has been stewing over it for a few days...and as nearly everyone assumed, it's looking like it was intentionally leaked so that they could later "improve" the terms and make everyone think they're meeting people halfway

well a whole lot of people are getting a lot of legal education all of a sudden, and it appears that the old OGL was ALREADY a bad deal, that it claimed to give you legal access to things that you ALREADY HAD ACCESS TO, which Wizards couldn't copyright (mechanics for playing a game and generic descriptive terms like how a magic missile works) so you were already fucking yourself over by publishing under it

in response to all this, Paizo (creators of Pathfinder, which became top dog on the back of the OGL when D&D 4.0 floundered) came out swinging last night with a new license, the Open RPG Creative license (ORC)

they are adding insult to injury by having it drafted by the same lawyers who made the original OGL, and putting it under a non-profit similar to how Linux operates, to ensure that even Future Asshole Paizo can't mess with it

they've already got a huge chunk of third parties on board with the new license, and are prepared to defend themselves legally if necessary

gaming community is in an uproar and lots of people are canceling D&D subscriptions and pissing on Hasbro

Paizo's announcement (hammered and the site is up and down):
https://paizo.com/community/blog/v5748dyo6si7v?Paizo-Announces-SystemNeutral-Open-RPG-License

an article that basically says what I said above:
https://gizmodo.com/paizo-wizards-of-the-coast-dnd-open-rpg-ogl-1-1-1849982443

a very good article on the whole subject of licensing and how shitty Wizards/Hasbro are being:
https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2023/01/beware-gifts-dragons-how-dds-open-gaming-license-may-have-become-trap-creators

another great article:
https://www.tumblr.com/wilwheaton/706168791099392000/good-riddance-to-the-open-gaming-license

angry subreddits, which are shockingly not run by corporate mouthpieces and allowing people to rage:
https://www.reddit.com/r/DnD/
https://www.reddit.com/r/dndnext/



https://twitter.com/DaarkaArts/status/1613614755809492992

https://twitter.com/DnD_Shorts/status/1613576298114449409
« Last Edit: January 13, 2023, 11:02:58 AM by Uncle »
Uncle

BIONIC

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2023, 11:24:42 AM »
:nerds
Margs

Boredfrom

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2023, 11:28:09 AM »
I wish I was into tabletop RPGs to actually understand the drama. Growing in a “pueblo” where there is little to no access to nerd shit made this difficult.

Uncle

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2023, 11:54:08 AM »
I wish I was into tabletop RPGs to actually understand the drama. Growing in a “pueblo” where there is little to no access to nerd shit made this difficult.

sorry, it's not necessarily even about tabletop rpgs as much as it is corporations trying to muscle around and gobble up even more money

think of it like people being able to legally sell their own expansions for video games

Bethesda says "hey you can sell games that run on our Skyrim engine, as long as you don't call it Skyrim or use specific NPCs, we just want people to be able to play cool medieval adventures and won't interfere legally"

the community loves this and a massive industry crops up making Skyrim mods and expansions for sale, they're all indie and not super rich or anything, but it's a thriving market

then Microsoft who owns Bethesda says "we need to extract more money from these fucking plebs, rewrite the contract"

so they do, and say yeah we're altering the deal, pray we do not alter it further, and give us a chunk of your earnings or we'll sue

they likely cannot legally do this and ruin an entire cottage industry, but no one is prepared to challenge them in court and prove it

everyone is pissed, but they aren't sure what their options are since this is the only "open" license they're familiar with

then CD Projekt Red comes along and says "ok fuck this, we're writing a new generalized license that anyone can publish their games under, which grants everyone the right to remix or expand on the base game, and others down the line will have to abide by the same rules, irrevocably.  this will apply to Witcher and Cyberpunk but also any other games you choose to publish under this license."

and then everyone stops playing Skyrim because of their fuckery.

sort of, anyway.
Uncle

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2023, 12:04:28 PM »
Didn’t try to dismiss it, just saying that I don’t understand enough to have a visceral opinion (and I wish I had one, because always wanted to experiment Tabletop RPG but it was impossibility until early adulthood).

At first glance it sounds like typical new corpo owners being clueless about the community they got into.

I know this stuff could affect video games because some use D&D game systems or being outright being video games from tabletop derivatives like Pathfinder.

Uncle

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2023, 12:20:00 PM »
Didn’t try to dismiss it, just saying that I don’t understand enough to have a visceral opinion (and I wish I had one, because always wanted to experiment Tabletop RPG but it was impossibility until early adulthood).

At first glance it sounds like typical new corpo owners being clueless about the community they got into.

I know this stuff could affect video games because some use D&D game systems or being outright being video games from tabletop derivatives like Pathfinder.

yeah, in fact Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic used the OGL, and Disney are remaking the game as we speak, so could also have a dog in the fight

Hasbro are not actually new owners, but they're always scheming in the background and don't understand the market or the vibe of the community
« Last Edit: January 13, 2023, 12:24:37 PM by Uncle »
Uncle

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2023, 01:50:56 PM »
A co-worker of mine is really pissed because this happened. He makes a lot of his own stuff and from what I understand every drawing, story or fan creation you make based on D&D (even if you don't monetize it) is now legally owned by the license holder.
Kind of the thing that companies like Disney and Nintendo have tried to achieve for years.
🤴

Potato

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2023, 02:06:46 PM »
A co-worker of mine is really pissed because this happened. He makes a lot of his own stuff and from what I understand every drawing, story or fan creation you make based on D&D (even if you don't monetize it) is now legally owned by the license holder.
Kind of the thing that companies like Disney and Nintendo have tried to achieve for years.
Except Nintendo and Disney didn't explicitly say it was all good to make your own games/films on their IP and then turn around and then pull the rug from underneath people.

I haven't played D&D since childhood, but my understanding is that these creators pretty much pulled the game back from oblivion.
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Uncle

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2023, 02:45:52 PM »
I haven't played D&D since childhood, but my understanding is that these creators pretty much pulled the game back from oblivion.

you are right

the OGL was a fundamentally good idea that suddenly allowed everyone to build on D&D...if you made a really cool compatible setting and story to go with it and people bought it, they would also have to buy D&D to play it. a rising tide lifts all ships and WotC profited from the loads of open content out there supporting their game, they just didn't make ALL the profit.

they first got pouty about this when they were making 4th edition, which was a dramatic break from past rules (MMO-style ability design, and a focus on table combat so they could sell maps and cards). they released 4e under a different license which would've sunk Paizo, who made most of their money on their 3.5e compatible products. so Paizo kept using the OGL and made Pathfinder which essentially ripped off the previous version, and became the top seller in the RPG space for a few years. D&D was flailing, but the OGL saved the hobby as a whole.
Uncle

Uncle

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2023, 02:51:10 PM »
D&D has responded, they're going back on everything supposedly, but the damage has been done and the dunking continues

https://www.dndbeyond.com/posts/1423-an-update-on-the-open-game-license-ogl

Quote
An Update on the Open Game License (OGL)

When we initially conceived of revising the OGL, it was with three major goals in mind. First, we wanted the ability to prevent the use of D&D content from being included in hateful and discriminatory products. Second, we wanted to address those attempting to use D&D in web3, blockchain games, and NFTs by making clear that OGL content is limited to tabletop roleplaying content like campaigns, modules, and supplements. And third, we wanted to ensure that the OGL is for the content creator, the homebrewer, the aspiring designer, our players, and the community—not major corporations to use for their own commercial and promotional purpose.

Driving these goals were two simple principles: (1) Our job is to be good stewards of the game, and (2) the OGL exists for the benefit of the fans. Nothing about those principles has wavered for a second.

That was why our early drafts of the new OGL included the provisions they did. That draft language was provided to content creators and publishers so their feedback could be considered before anything was finalized. In addition to language allowing us to address discriminatory and hateful conduct and clarifying what types of products the OGL covers, our drafts included royalty language designed to apply to large corporations attempting to use OGL content. It was never our intent to impact the vast majority of the community.

However, it’s clear from the reaction that we rolled a 1. It has become clear that it is no longer possible to fully achieve all three goals while still staying true to our principles. So, here is what we are doing.

The next OGL will contain the provisions that allow us to protect and cultivate the inclusive environment we are trying to build and specify that it covers only content for TTRPGs. That means that other expressions, such as educational and charitable campaigns, livestreams, cosplay, VTT-uses, etc., will remain unaffected by any OGL update. Content already released under 1.0a will also remain unaffected.

What it will not contain is any royalty structure. It also will not include the license back provision that some people were afraid was a means for us to steal work. That thought never crossed our minds. Under any new OGL, you will own the content you create. We won’t. Any language we put down will be crystal clear and unequivocal on that point. The license back language was intended to protect us and our partners from creators who incorrectly allege that we steal their work simply because of coincidental similarities. As we continue to invest in the game that we love and move forward with partnerships in film, television, and digital games, that risk is simply too great to ignore. The new OGL will contain provisions to address that risk, but we will do it without a license back and without suggesting we have rights to the content you create. Your ideas and imagination are what makes this game special, and that belongs to you.

A couple of last thoughts. First, we won’t be able to release the new OGL today, because we need to make sure we get it right, but it is coming. Second, you’re going to hear people say that they won, and we lost because making your voices heard forced us to change our plans. Those people will only be half right. They won—and so did we.

Our plan was always to solicit the input of our community before any update to the OGL; the drafts you’ve seen were attempting to do just that. We want to always delight fans and create experiences together that everyone loves. We realize we did not do that this time and we are sorry for that. Our goal was to get exactly the type of feedback on which provisions worked and which did not–which we ultimately got from you. Any change this major could only have been done well if we were willing to take that feedback, no matter how it was provided–so we are. Thank you for caring enough to let us know what works and what doesn’t, what you need and what scares you. Without knowing that, we can’t do our part to make the new OGL match our principles. Finally, we’d appreciate the chance to make this right. We love D&D’s devoted players and the creators who take them on so many incredible adventures. We won’t let you down.

comments disabled so no one can reply  :doge

"we just want to stop hateful mean content and NFTs"
:social


this is the best part
 :delicious
Quote
A couple of last thoughts. First, we won’t be able to release the new OGL today, because we need to make sure we get it right, but it is coming. Second, you’re going to hear people say that they won, and we lost because making your voices heard forced us to change our plans. Those people will only be half right. They won—and so did we.

Uncle

Potato

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #10 on: January 13, 2023, 03:12:51 PM »
Quote
However, it’s clear from the reaction that we rolled a 1.


PR protip: Don't attempt contextual levity in your grovelling corporate apology letter.


It's very


Spud

Uncle

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #11 on: January 13, 2023, 03:47:36 PM »
Quote
However, it’s clear from the reaction that we rolled a 1.


PR protip: Don't attempt contextual levity in your grovelling corporate apology letter.


It's very
(Image removed from quote.)

it's also a freudian slip, for those who know

rolling a 1 on persuade doesn't mean you realize you screwed up and hang your head in shame, it means you fully meant every shitty word you said, and nobody bought your bullshit
Uncle

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #12 on: January 13, 2023, 05:39:25 PM »
I imagine that the new Dark Alliance game bombing hard didn’t help Wizards of The Coast to justify themselves to the Hasbro overlords.

benjipwns

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #13 on: January 13, 2023, 10:07:04 PM »
D&D has responded, they're going back on everything supposedly, but the damage has been done and the dunking continues

https://www.dndbeyond.com/posts/1423-an-update-on-the-open-game-license-ogl

Quote
An Update on the Open Game License (OGL)

When we initially conceived of revising the OGL, it was with three major goals in mind. First, we wanted the ability to prevent the use of D&D content from being included in hateful and discriminatory products. Second, we wanted to address those attempting to use D&D in web3, blockchain games, and NFTs by making clear that OGL content is limited to tabletop roleplaying content like campaigns, modules, and supplements. And third, we wanted to ensure that the OGL is for the content creator, the homebrewer, the aspiring designer, our players, and the community—not major corporations to use for their own commercial and promotional purpose.

"we just want to stop hateful mean content and NFTs"
:social
I actually believe this paragraph. The latter two are about trying to prevent competitors from profiting off D&D, look at how they framed Paizo which is in no way a major corporation rather than some kind of possible money laundering scheme that also produces RPGs as one.

The first one is just the same as all these attempts, you can't write a rule that allows you to control everything based on content that also allows you unilaterally to determine what content violates the rule. Nobody ever wants to actually construct a rule that only filters out "hateful and discriminatory" content because it would create too much work and they don't want to provide due process, they really only want the power to kill something when they see it.

Let's go back to Paizo, which I don't know a lot about but do know some things about it and more than anything else in D&D so it's the only example I can use, they hire all kinds of writers including freelancers. We take Hasbro at their word and a couple years down the line oh look we've discovered that a key module in Paizo's biggest product was written by a Joanne supporter who follows Donald Trump on Twitter. Are you saying we shouldn't revoke the license for a work produced by a fascist genocider? That doesn't make the content hateful? What are you saying of course it does, clearly this Goblin is Jewish and these Orcs are Black. Are you saying hateful content should be allowed because you seem really concerned that Hasbro wants to do the right thing here. Starting to suspect you actually like the hateful content and are using FREEZE PEACH as a cover for you to say slurs. All while the biggest player in the field has incentive to use their claimed monopoly power to find violations.

Uncle

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #14 on: January 13, 2023, 10:23:54 PM »
I actually believe this paragraph. The latter two are about trying to prevent competitors from profiting off D&D, look at how they framed Paizo which is in no way a major corporation rather than some kind of possible money laundering scheme that also produces RPGs as one.

The first one is just the same as all these attempts, you can't write a rule that allows you to control everything based on content that also allows you unilaterally to determine what content violates the rule. Nobody ever wants to actually construct a rule that only filters out "hateful and discriminatory" content because it would create too much work and they don't want to provide due process, they really only want the power to kill something when they see it.

the first couple minutes of this video:



apparently they don't even need to modify the license in order to kill "hateful content," and the only believable part about the rest is that they want to stop others from profiting from NFTs. they are perfectly fine with profiting from NFTs themselves

Quote
Let's go back to Paizo, which I don't know a lot about but do know some things about it and more than anything else in D&D so it's the only example I can use, they hire all kinds of writers including freelancers. We take Hasbro at their word and a couple years down the line oh look we've discovered that a key module in Paizo's biggest product was written by a Joanne supporter who follows Donald Trump on Twitter. Are you saying we shouldn't revoke the license for a work produced by a fascist genocider? That doesn't make the content hateful? What are you saying of course it does, clearly this Goblin is Jewish and these Orcs are Black. Are you saying hateful content should be allowed because you seem really concerned that Hasbro wants to do the right thing here. Starting to suspect you actually like the hateful content and are using FREEZE PEACH as a cover for you to say slurs. All while the biggest player in the field has incentive to use their claimed monopoly power to find violations.

you think when everything shakes out, paizo won't actually put irrevocable language in the ORC and place it under a nonprofit like they said they would?

you don't need to include protections against hateful content in the license because the prospect of becoming a social pariah (for no fucking reason because no modern publisher would even sell your hateful content) will cause everyone to self-censor anyway
Uncle

benjipwns

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #15 on: January 13, 2023, 10:32:16 PM »
My Paizo example was saying what Hasbro would do to Paizo using the language against certain content. Paizo has a lot of weirdos at it but I suspect their statements on principles are generally honest.

Transhuman

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #16 on: January 13, 2023, 11:17:50 PM »
Wow first Ukraine now this, what next?

Uncle

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #17 on: January 13, 2023, 11:26:09 PM »
Wow first Ukraine now this, what next?

you joke but THERE'S A CONNECTION

Uncle

Uncle

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #18 on: January 14, 2023, 02:05:20 PM »
another article on this, gizmodo got some inside sources

https://gizmodo.com/dungeons-dragons-wizards-hasbro-ogl-open-game-license-1849981136

Quote
In order to delete a D&D Beyond account entirely, users are funneled into a support system that asks them to submit tickets to be handled by customer service: Sources from inside Wizards of the Coast confirm that earlier this week there were “five digits” worth of complaining tickets in the system. Both moderation and internal management of the issues have been “a mess,” they said, partially due to the fact that WotC has recently downsized the D&D Beyond support team.

:neogaf :dead

and another great defiant read on the subject

https://rsdancey.medium.com/22-years-ago-i-saved-d-d-today-i-want-to-save-the-open-gaming-license-77e79eaddfb2
Uncle

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #19 on: January 15, 2023, 10:33:05 PM »

chronovore

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #20 on: January 16, 2023, 09:25:21 PM »
Yeah, this was an amazing clusterfuck. It's the kind of tone-deaf act that only something monolithic like Hasbro can generate. There are some shitty products that are backward thinking and make nerds look like what mainstream society generally think we do anyway. But the OGL had some language in there that allowed for disassociation from those products. The idea that this was to prevent Nazi D&D or something is laughable.

Uncle

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #21 on: January 16, 2023, 11:12:03 PM »
Yeah, this was an amazing clusterfuck. It's the kind of tone-deaf act that only something monolithic like Hasbro can generate. There are some shitty products that are backward thinking and make nerds look like what mainstream society generally think we do anyway. But the OGL had some language in there that allowed for disassociation from those products. The idea that this was to prevent Nazi D&D or something is laughable.

that's the thing, they don't need the license to protect themselves from objectionable content

Creative Commons and the GNU GPL don't have language like that in there either, that's the point of it being an open license

there are plenty of other ways to deal with dumb shit, like cease and desist when they get too close to your trademarks, or simply the fact that no publisher is going to publish it, otherwise they become just as much a pariah in the community
Uncle

Uncle

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #22 on: January 17, 2023, 12:32:42 AM »
even more leaks, confirmed by multiple sources

https://twitter.com/DnD_Shorts/status/1615097747983695872

it's kind of brief here but essentially, their plans are/were that if you want to play D&D at all in the future you have to pay for D&D Beyond

the highest paid tier is $30 per month, per player, and for that you get to play with AI dungeon masters  :doge

also you can't use homebrew content/house rules unless you pay for the high tier
Uncle

chronovore

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #23 on: January 17, 2023, 01:12:27 AM »
LOL - "can't use homebrew" — can these idiots even D&D?

All you need is one set of books and some dice. Even playing remotely, you don't need a subscription, just a voicechat or videochat service.

These people are stunningly greedy, and it's going to cost them.

Fuck, seriously, the subscription software model is one of the worst business practices to evolve during my lifetime.

Uncle

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #24 on: January 27, 2023, 04:56:33 PM »
there have been other developments along the way here, lots of memes and discussion...

for example paizo's pathfinder 2 game has flown off store shelves and they sold through 8 months of books in only 2 weeks

https://twitter.com/paizo/status/1618670416712667137

and Wizards of the Coast was openly mocked on twitter for this debacle by one of their biggest hedge fund investors

https://twitter.com/AltaFoxCapital/status/1618597255786942470

but for now, it seems the community has won

https://www.dndbeyond.com/posts/1439-ogl-1-0a-creative-commons

they just released all of 5th edition's SRD rules under creative commons, which is actually a little unprecedented

all the spells, monsters, everything, you can't be sued if you make a book or game using them and attribute it properly, forever

 :gladbron   :rejoice

as far as anyone can tell, the only hidden downside to this, if you can call it a downside, is that they just want their audience to calm down and go back to being good little consumers and watch their D&D movie and buy their books and re-subscribe to their platform
Uncle

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #25 on: January 27, 2023, 04:58:28 PM »
It's crazy how fast things move these days. I read an article that was like "2.0 leaked, 8 days passed until a response, then another 8 days until the CEO or whatever fully capitulated" and I was like... damn barely two weeks and WOTC wrecked themselves/D&D for 5-10 years+ it seems like.

Uncle

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #26 on: January 27, 2023, 06:12:23 PM »
It's crazy how fast things move these days. I read an article that was like "2.0 leaked, 8 days passed until a response, then another 8 days until the CEO or whatever fully capitulated" and I was like... damn barely two weeks and WOTC wrecked themselves/D&D for 5-10 years+ it seems like.

oh they are fully fucked and they know it, it's been a while since I saw a brand so immediately and thoroughly damaged overnight

everyone has already bought books for alternative systems, it'd be a waste not to at least read them, and maybe discover that they actually do some things better or more creatively than D&D
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Potato

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #27 on: January 27, 2023, 09:21:27 PM »
Brand recognition is very powerful. I have no doubt that they have damaged the brand, but I don't think it will be fatal or really impact their bottom line in the longer term.
Spud

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #28 on: January 28, 2023, 01:35:19 PM »
At some point you gotta ask is the endless growth mindset worth it? How far can you really grow with something like this, so dependent on a niche community enjoying your shit and being on good terms.
010

Potato

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #29 on: January 28, 2023, 03:43:02 PM »
That's why they are expanding using other media like films and merchandising deals. The core users are finite, but they can expand the brand in other ways, plus extract more from the core users through associated sales. It's a similar strategy Nintendo are using.
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Uncle

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #30 on: January 28, 2023, 03:50:29 PM »
That's why they are expanding using other media like films and merchandising deals. The core users are finite, but they can expand the brand in other ways, plus extract more from the core users through associated sales. It's a similar strategy Nintendo are using.

oh yeah, their biggest problem since the beginning was that only DMs (the people running the game for the group) buy the books, and are culturally expected to provide dice, mats, miniatures, etc.

since the game is played in groups with an average of 3-4 players but even as large as 8-10, this means 75-90% of their "customers" do not pay anything

this is why they want everyone paying a monthly fee to use D&D Beyond, which stores and updates your character sheet for you (and follows the rules for you automatically so you don't really even have any bookkeeping), and then down the line get them all paying for the virtual tabletop as well, ideally in video game form, since few people want to DM and they're the hardest role to fill

buy horse armor and purple fey hair for your mini so everyone at your table sees how shiny and special you are  :-*
Uncle

Phoenix Dark

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #31 on: January 29, 2023, 01:49:37 AM »
That's why they are expanding using other media like films and merchandising deals. The core users are finite, but they can expand the brand in other ways, plus extract more from the core users through associated sales. It's a similar strategy Nintendo are using.

oh yeah, their biggest problem since the beginning was that only DMs (the people running the game for the group) buy the books, and are culturally expected to provide dice, mats, miniatures, etc.

since the game is played in groups with an average of 3-4 players but even as large as 8-10, this means 75-90% of their "customers" do not pay anything

this is why they want everyone paying a monthly fee to use D&D Beyond, which stores and updates your character sheet for you (and follows the rules for you automatically so you don't really even have any bookkeeping), and then down the line get them all paying for the virtual tabletop as well, ideally in video game form, since few people want to DM and they're the hardest role to fill

buy horse armor and purple fey hair for your mini so everyone at your table sees how shiny and special you are  :-*

Do a lot of people use D&D Beyond? I'd imagine there's a contingent of fans who aren't digital and keep their characters on paper right.

I wish I had gotten into D&D as a kid. My local comic store often had events but all of my time was spent in the comics or Warhammer sections. The only exposure I had to D&D was playing Baldur's Gate and Icewind Dale back then.
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Uncle

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Re: Dungeons and Dragons and Fuckery
« Reply #32 on: January 29, 2023, 11:29:24 AM »
Do a lot of people use D&D Beyond?

well, they did...

I don't know statistics, there are definitely plenty of people who use pencil and paper, especially since the game is played among middle/high schoolers who might not have the money for a monthly fee like that, and plenty of people who homebrew the rules and might need to record things differently

funny thing about D&D Beyond...D&D is currently stewarded by a guy named Chris Cao who worked at Zynga so he prides himself on knowing how to monetize gamers

D&D Beyond started as a third party tool, its use doubled and tripled over the pandemic.  Chris hated it and wanted to bury it with Wizards' own offering, and spent tons of money working on an official competitor...then because the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing, someone else at Wizards simply bought D&D Beyond last April, handed it to Chris, and said "here's your platform, integrate it and work with it moving forward..." the platform he hated  :lol

that's from this video that also explains the internal mood at Wizards (depressing and stifling, due to Chris), the video is from just before they went into total retreat so it's pretty doom-and-gloom about how too much money has been spent for them to back down now  :teehee



would be amazing to be a fly on the wall inside the company right now
Uncle