Movie News, Reviews, and Discussion Super-Thread

[Tasty]

He hasn't directed a movie in 14 years but he's gonna come back at age 90 for one more? 

He's too old for this shit. Well, guess not!

[Tasty]

https://twitter.com/ShawnFatfield/status/1342862987304943617

[team filler]

 :trashy

[Rahxephon91]

All you need to know was that she was still crying over a dude she knew for a week.

[Joe Molotov]

He hasn't directed a movie in 14 years but he's gonna come back at age 90 for one more? 

Can't be worse than Harrison Ford returning for one last Indiana Jones at ~80!

[Madrun Badrun]

45 mins into Shadow in the Clouds - this is actually pretty good.  I really like how low the production values are and how bottled it is, it makes it feel like a good episode of a horror anothogy tv show or something. 

[Madrun Badrun]

OMG the ending 

Really enjoyable film.  The first 40 minutes work really well as a low-budget horror and just when it is starting to outstay its welcome it turns into nonsense that would make fast and furious blush. 

[Tasty]

https://www.indiewire.com/2021/01/shadow-in-the-cloud-roseanne-liang-max-landis-feminist-monster-1234607112/

Chloe Grace Moretz: "We’ve completely distanced ourselves from [original writer Max Landis.] We’ve rewritten it several times now. His name is kind of far away from the project."

Roseanne Liang: "Max was not the producer or writer of this project, and I was allowed to take on the script and make changes with the producers as I saw fit."


......


Max Landis: "Watch Shadow in The Cloud, my closest ever script-to-screen adaptation, now on streaming."

[Great Rumbler]

Maybe his other screenplays were changed even more from his original script?

[Tasty]

Maybe his other screenplays were changed even more from his original script?

That's what his post is implying but it's funny to me all the bad movies were so allegedly different, while the new hit getting buzzy word of mouth is the closest to his written draft... especially after over a year of the main actor and director saying over and over it's been rewritten and it's "distant" from him.

[Mr Gilhaney]

or he's just trolling, due to them saying that for so long.

[Pissy F Benny]

Imagine being an even bigger scumbag than your child killing father

[Tasty]

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/shadow-in-the-cloud-filmmaker-roseanne-liang-sets-the-record-straight

“The original script I received, the writer of that script [Landis] sometimes uses large-point font. So by the time we removed some of his stylistic flourishes, which involved large writing, the script was something horrendous. It was under 70 pages long. It was a very short script,” Liang shares. “So that was an issue that we had in the beginning. Part of the rewrite process was making sure that we give people their money’s worth. That way, they don’t go into the cinema and think, ‘Ah, I just watched a 55-minute episode of The Twilight Zone.’ That was a huge fear that I and the producers had through development.”

70 pages? That's closer to a TV spec/pilot than feature for sure.

"And then I realized that the guy was not talking about me; he was talking about Max. He’d somehow erased me and decided that a writer who wrote an early draft of this project was the creator of this project.”

I mean... he created the idea, story, and characters... I guess "the project" (movie production) is technically a separate entity, and she's the creator of that, but I can see how someone would be confused.


Sorry but shit like who gets what writer's credit is keenly important to me right now. I find the entire thing fascinating, mostly because this is the first such project I can think of this happening to -- a project beginning from a toxic place but trying (successfully?) to distance itself by the time the final movie is released. All The Money in the World replacing Spacey is sorta comparable, but (apologies to actors) an actor is a cog in the machine compared to the original writer, which makes Shadow in the Cloud even juicier to follow for me.

[Tasty]

THR: So it’s my understanding that to earn a co-writing credit on an original screenplay, a screenwriter has to rewrite at least 50 percent of the original screenplay. And since you’re credited as a co-writer on Shadow in the Cloud, it frustrates me when I see people try and attribute the voice of this movie to someone who you never worked with in any capacity. Plus, anyone who’s seen Do No Harm will instantly be able to recognize that Shadow is your voice. So what would you say to anyone who remains focused on the original screenwriter?

Liang: Thank you for saying that because it frustrates me, too. [...]

So the WGA recognizes she's completely rewritten at least half of the screenplay. Good enough for me, Max is definitely full of shit when he says it's the most accurate rendition of one of his scripts. (Honestly Victor Frankenstein the script wasn't that different from the film despite him saying so on RLM years back.)

And he literally directed one of his own scripts (Me Him Her) so yeah, he's doubly full of shit.

[Tasty]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Sardonicast/comments/kkm9ib/the_ending_of_wonder_woman_1984/

[Don Rumata]

Sorry Tasty but that is all so comical to me.
"We rewrote some of this script, so now you can watch the movie without getting infected!"
No really, why the fuck is it an issue if he did or did not write the script? At beast you should be worrying whether or not he's getting compensation, if you really care.

Max Landis' involvement doesn't literally give you cancer like mercury in the water, it's like i'm reading some kind of collective delusion, reading those morons climbing over themselves to distance from the guy.

[Tasty]

I'm not making a judgment call on the movie, those who watch it, or those who choose not to watch it. There's endless opportunities out there for entertainment and if knowing Max Landis was involved diminishes your potential enjoyment to the point you decide it's not worth it, that's a personal decision and all the more power to you. If you choose to watch it and end up enjoying it, that's OK too.

If you decide to broadcast your decision with a megaphone for internet points, that's where criticism should come into play IMO.

[Tasty]

Also, from a movie production side, they're 100% laser focused on decreasing risk. That's why most movies in theaters are bland rehashes of IPs created decades and decades ago. Associating with someone deemed toxic by any significant amount of the public is bad for business. The moral stand is a nice face, and I'm sure that's more the case for the director and Moretz, but it should be no secret why the production apparatus would want to distance itself from Max.

[Madrun Badrun]

As a call for internet points, I just want to say, I watched it to support Landis   

[Tasty]

Also, humans aren't 100% internally consistent, shocker. Sometimes you make decisions based on your gut instead of dispassionately considering all factors, and that's OK.

[Nintex]

https://twitter.com/ZakReckless/status/1344721104166932483

https://twitter.com/joshgondelman/status/1344730049015128068

https://twitter.com/BstOfAffleck/status/1345127709035343873

 

[Don Rumata]

Yes people are free to do whatever and consume whatever, but to me this moral reasoning makes zero sense.
It makes sense to boycott the movie if watching it directly aids Landis, but them having rewritten or not the script is a completely unrelated and irrational point to make.
Again, we're not talking about a magic spell, where they need to change enough words to make it safe.

Some people may still decide to do whatever, but i'm gonna call that choice completely irrational and comical.

[Tasty]

To invoke Godwin's Law, if Hitler wrote a screenplay that just got discovered and someone announced they were intending to produce it (even "heavily rewritten"), I wouldn't fault people for how they felt about it even though zero of the profits would go to Adolf.

[Don Rumata]

I'm not taking issue with how people do or do not feel, that's something you don't have any control over (for the most part, because certain feelings can be product of peer pressure).
I'm taking issue with the idea that an appropriate response is to rewrite the script, which has nothing to do with anything (since Max Landis' controversies weren't related to his script writing).

That Hitler example doesn't fit 100% because Hitler's sins are directly tied to his ideologies, Max Landis is just a creep.

You can use Polanski as the classic example: You may feel uneasy watching Chinatown, because of the mental association with his criminal case, but going ahead and changing all the shots just to make it safe for consumption, is just as irrational to me, as someone clicking the light switch 3 times because of their OCD.
Him using a close up instead of a long shot, doesn't have anything to do with the problematic nature of his involvement.
Same with Landis.

[Stro]

You might actually get mercury poisoning from a Max Landis scrip tho, wouldn't be surprised at all

[Don Rumata]

You might actually get mercury poisoning from a Max Landis scrip tho, wouldn't be surprised at all

You're mixing up Landis with Umberto Eco. 

[Tasty]

I'm taking issue with the idea that an appropriate response is to rewrite the script, which has nothing to do with anything (since Max Landis' controversies weren't related to his script writing).

The typical response is that the project would have been dropped altogether, see also MGM's Deeper starring (or to star) Idris Elba.

Rewriting the script is actually the "kindest" option to Landis they had. And from the sounds of it, the script needed heavy rewriting anyways (70 pages does not a feature film make, generally.)

That Hitler example doesn't fit 100% because Hitler's sins are directly tied to his ideologies, Max Landis is just a creep.

According to Landis, Shadow in the Clouds (the script) was a response to his own "Rey is a Mary Sue" controvery, which he debatably started. His exact words are:

"Sometimes it’s easier to help people understand how you feel with art, just by showing them the type of thing you want to see and going 'wow, cool right?'"

So you're definitely wrong about this specific example and I would say you're just wrong in general, an artist's thinking is endemic to whatever they create, because art reveals.

You can use Polanski as the classic example: You may feel uneasy watching Chinatown, because of the mental association with his criminal case, but going ahead and changing all the shots just to make it safe for consumption, is just as irrational to me, as someone clicking the light switch 3 times because of their OCD.

This example/comparison doesn't make any sense to me. Could you explain it better? Chinatown had already been released by the time of Polanski's court case, Shadow in the Clouds was picked up and rewritten before, during, and after most of Landis' accusations were known.

Him using a close up instead of a long shot, doesn't have anything to do with the problematic nature of his involvement.
Same with Landis.

The written word by a screenwriter is far and away different from a camera movement by a director. They both communicate an intent but there's a reason words are the primary method humans communicate -- words have power.

[Tasty]

That Hitler example doesn't fit 100% because Hitler's sins are directly tied to his ideologies, Max Landis is just a creep.

Also, this is heavily downplaying what Landis has been accused of to bolster your argument. I don't think you're interested in an actual discussion and are rather just angry and annoyed over something you shouldn't be angry and annoyed about.

[EchoRin]

Kiki's Delivery Service (1989) - What a treat. Enjoyed the various key characters. The two elder sisters. The geeky boy. The artist girl. I guess the couple in the bakery were were least interesting to me. Still likeable too and the silent husband has his little moments that let you know he's got a personality despite being the silent type. I liked how every delivery had its own wrinkle. I mean the movie doesn't really have much growth necessarily.  Just these deliveries that lead to interesting moments. Kiki and her cat Jiji are so likeable. The cat is great. I just like the time we get to spend with these characters. I can't really explain why I like it so much, but I do.

By now I've seen maybe a third or quarter of Studio Ghibli movies. Grave of the Fireflies, My Neighbor Totoro, Princess Mononoke, Kiki, Ponyo, When Marnie Was There, Howl's Moving Castle, Spirited Away. The only one that didn't click with me was Howl.

I think I'd like to see one of the very grounded movies next (or from what I can tell). Only Yesterday or Ocean Waves. I'm all ears as to which one of those two you would recommend to me more

edit: oh I almost forgot. Kiki's character design? Ace. So simple, but so right.

[Stro]

The right path in anything regarding Max Landis is fuck Max, he's in the wrong

[Don Rumata]

That Hitler example doesn't fit 100% because Hitler's sins are directly tied to his ideologies, Max Landis is just a creep.

Also, this is heavily downplaying what Landis has been accused of to bolster your argument. I don't think you're interested in an actual discussion and are rather just angry and annoyed over something you shouldn't be angry and annoyed about.

Please, dont give me this condescending bollocks, i don't claim to be right, but if i didn't want a discussion, i wouldn't be posting.
And i assure you i'm not angry, i couldn't stand Max Landis well before any of the MeToo stuff came out, and i think all of his stuff (that've seen) is dog shit.

My issue is with the idea of treating a piece of work like radioactive material, based solely on the name attached, i do find that ridiculous.
I actually wholly agree with the idea that art and artist are entangled, but it doesn't mean a linear connection (as in: a bad person only creates harmful art), or that "death of the author" has no merit.

Reassuring people that any trace of Landis is erased is silly because nobody had seen the movie yet, so there was no way for the public to tell whether the movie was making absurd political statements in the first place.
I think this is a corrosive way of looking at things, and fosters a simplistic mentality of aprioristically judging things outside of their own merits, which i find dogmatic, but more importantly a way to delegate away critical thinking.
In other words, if Carl Sagan had written Mein Kampf, it wouldn't have been any more or less psychotic and viceversa.

Although it'd be reasonable to say "we've rewritten most of the script because it wasn't good" (as it happens with most movies anyway), i find it toxic and wrong to foster the simple minded apporach of "we've rewritten most of the script, because it was written by a bad person".
Not because of what "damage" it may do to Landis (again, couldn't care less), but because of what it says about our approach to art, and critical thinking.

EDIT: To be more clear, the issue isn't the rewrite, it's the message telling people "the evil is defeated" because it gives the wrong message, as explained above.

[Don Rumata]

Kiki's Delivery Service (1989) - What a treat. Enjoyed the various key characters. The two elder sisters. The geeky boy. The artist girl. I guess the couple in the bakery were were least interesting to me. Still likeable too and the silent husband has his little moments that let you know he's got a personality despite being the silent type. I liked how every delivery had its own wrinkle. I mean the movie doesn't really have much growth necessarily.  Just these deliveries that lead to interesting moments. Kiki and her cat Jiji are so likeable. The cat is great. I just like the time we get to spend with these characters. I can't really explain why I like it so much, but I do.

By now I've seen maybe a third or quarter of Studio Ghibli movies. Grave of the Fireflies, My Neighbor Totoro, Princess Mononoke, Kiki, Ponyo, When Marnie Was There, Howl's Moving Castle, Spirited Away. The only one that didn't click with me was Howl.

I think I'd like to see one of the very grounded movies next (or from what I can tell). Only Yesterday or Ocean Waves. I'm all ears as to which one of those two you would recommend to me more

edit: oh I almost forgot. Kiki's character design? Ace. So simple, but so right.

Howl is a bullshit movie, i agree.
Beyond the amazing animation, there's a really stupidly antithetical story to what are Ghibli's usually anti-war sentiments (not that the movie is pro-war, but its trivialization of it, i mean).
Haven't read the original novel, so maybe that's very different, but that finale, in the movie, annoys me to no end.

Also, Only Yesterday is the best Ghibli movie, in my opinion, so i'd go with that. 

[team filler]

Kiki's Delivery Service (1989) - What a treat. Enjoyed the various key characters. The two elder sisters. The geeky boy. The artist girl. I guess the couple in the bakery were were least interesting to me. Still likeable too and the silent husband has his little moments that let you know he's got a personality despite being the silent type. I liked how every delivery had its own wrinkle. I mean the movie doesn't really have much growth necessarily.  Just these deliveries that lead to interesting moments. Kiki and her cat Jiji are so likeable. The cat is great. I just like the time we get to spend with these characters. I can't really explain why I like it so much, but I do.

By now I've seen maybe a third or quarter of Studio Ghibli movies. Grave of the Fireflies, My Neighbor Totoro, Princess Mononoke, Kiki, Ponyo, When Marnie Was There, Howl's Moving Castle, Spirited Away. The only one that didn't click with me was Howl.

I think I'd like to see one of the very grounded movies next (or from what I can tell). Only Yesterday or Ocean Waves. I'm all ears as to which one of those two you would recommend to me more

edit: oh I almost forgot. Kiki's character design? Ace. So simple, but so right.

and those sweet sweet pantsu 

[EchoRin]

Easy now Filler. It's 13 year old pantsu.

Though without sounding creepy, yes I did notice it, but it's never presented like "yes yesssss. Salivate over that witch pussy."  . It presents it like a matter of fact thing that is bound to happen due to the chosen attire. And that attire is obviously not done for "male gaze" reasons.

[team filler]

of course the animators wouldn't happen to be big time pervs  they'd never do something like that purposely 

[Don Rumata]

The internet ruins it all.

[team filler]

The internet ruins it all.

phallus shaped spire on little mermaid cover was just an innocent accident 

[Don Rumata]

The internet ruins it all.

phallus shaped spire on little mermaid cover was just an innocent accident 

Little Mermaid is different, she literally renounced her singing talent and ability to speak, just to get the prince's dick.
Phallic imagery is integral to the story. 

[Madrun Badrun]

Watching Bad Boys 3.  Movie is straight out of 2001 and pretty tone deaf for 2020.  I'm enjoying it but its jarring. 

[Madrun Badrun]

Decent, but missing a Joe Pesci-esque character to tell a story about having a frog as a best friend.  Also as tone-deaf as it was, at least they didn't have 15 yearold Megan Fox dancing in a bikini, probably only because they couldn't get 15 yearold Megan Fox though.

[MMaRsu]

I dont even know who max landis is

[Pissy F Benny]

A wrestling fan

[GreatSageEqualOfHeaven]

I dont even know who max landis is

spoiler (click to show/hide)

[close]

[EchoRin]

I dont even know who max landis is

Putting aside controversy, you really don't need to. He's not notable in the grand scheme of things. He did a pretty good job of marketing himself in nerd circles though. even was popping up on IGN back when Greg Miller was there.

But I don't recall any of his scripts turning into good movies.

[GreatSageEqualOfHeaven]

I liked Chronicle

[Tasty]

Please, dont give me this condescending bollocks, i don't claim to be right, but if i didn't want a discussion, i wouldn't be posting.
And i assure you i'm not angry, i couldn't stand Max Landis well before any of the MeToo stuff came out, and i think all of his stuff (that've seen) is dog shit.

I was in a bad mood yesterday and was taking it out on you a little. I apologize. That was shitty of me.

EDIT: To be more clear, the issue isn't the rewrite, it's the message telling people "the evil is defeated" because it gives the wrong message, as explained above.

I think the director's message is more nuanced than that. I would read the full THR article.

[Tasty]

Gaspar Noe art shit

[EchoRin]

He loves that song, eh? Me too 

edit: I thought a remix of I Feel Love was in Climax too, but nah. It was a different Giorgio Moroder track

[Tasty]

He loves that song, eh? Me too 

edit: I thought a remix of I Feel Love was in Climax too, but nah. It was a different Giorgio Moroder track

I recognized it from, I think, Studio 54: Director's Cut. It's just one of those songs that lingers in your memory even if you can't exactly place it.

[Great Rumbler]

I dont even know who max landis is

He's a nerd with a famous dad.

[ToxicAdam]

I rewatched Tombstone for the first time in about 25 years. I remember loving it, or at least the Doc Holliday parts. I had forgotten how overwrought and corny the drama was in it. The death scenes in particular were like a throwback to 1930’s Hollywood. It was comical. Obviously, you overlook those parts and it’s just a fantastic distilled Western. But it really could’ve been so much more.

[Mr Gilhaney]

decided to watch shadow in the cloud while playing football manager, and i still feel like i wasted time. fuck me that was bad. no titties shown. 

[Joe Molotov]

decided to watch shadow in the cloud while playing football manager, and i still feel like i wasted time. fuck me that was bad. no titties shown. 

Football Manager is only rated E, so I'm not sure what you expected. Maybe there's some mods, though...

[Madrun Badrun]

decided to watch shadow in the cloud while playing football manager, and i still feel like i wasted time. fuck me that was bad. no titties shown. 

 

[nudemacusers]

Gaspar Noe art shit

vaccarello is killing it... last fall was full of naughty latex items

[EchoRin]

Dark Waters (2019) - Enjoyable legal drama that's very Mark Ruffalo. Fascinating case that sometimes doesn't quite fit the movie format as this is a very long case. I found myself sort of losing interest at times in the second half (ironically probably what DuPont wanted themselves. To have people lose interest due to the length of the process). At times the movie takes a brief look at some years. I almost would have preferred going very brief on them with perhaps just a headline to sum them up and then take a little deeper dive on some of the other years. You'll understand if you watched or will watch the movie. The scene including a real life victim was kind of goofy too. His inclusion was fine, but the dialogue was corny (pardon me if it actually went down like this in real life though  ).
 I like how the film presents the various pressures on people. The main farmer who comes to Ruffalo to create a case against DuPont. How DuPont sort of owns the town  where all this shit is happening. People being angry that the farmer/lawyer are suing the biggest employer. The tension is there. And it weighs on people. And on top of that you see the real long lasting damage caused around there. It ain't pretty.
Worth a watch for sure. I would be heavily interested in a documentary too (which maybe does exist already. I haven't checked)
-----

Matinee (2019, Japan) - A romance film that bites off more than it can chew at times, but has a nice twist and a very mature and sophisticated air to it. You have a lead female who is a Japanese reporter in France and lead male who is a Japanese virtuoso on the classical/acoustic guitar. They meet at one of his shows in Japan and so begins a courtship that is mostly long distance. I find the writing and acting most at home when it's Japanese people interacting and talking to each other. The movie takes place in France and New York too and at times it's achingly obvious that the script was written by someone who is not fully at home with those languages.
The twist is pretty good at how this relationship turns. Believable enough in how it occurs and then understandable how the miscommunication changes the said relationship. I like how our main two characters aren't innocent. There are aspects of cheating and divorce and unhappy marriages. Professional failure and redemption that ties in with the relationships.
Enjoyable enough if you wish to see a romance film about Japanese people in their 40s. For the "I have a good job and education and I enjoy my coffee while discussing mature matters, though I won't let that stop me from love making me do some foolish things" crowd.

[benjipwns]

I rewatched Tombstone for the first time in about 25 years. I remember loving it, or at least the Doc Holliday parts. I had forgotten how overwrought and corny the drama was in it. The death scenes in particular were like a throwback to 1930’s Hollywood. It was comical. Obviously, you overlook those parts and it’s just a fantastic distilled Western. But it really could’ve been so much more.

Then remember it's the good one in comparison to Wyatt Earp and that's despite becoming Kurt Russell directed partway through shooting. Funnier is how Kevin Costner famously used Hollywood pull to change Tombstone's casting multiple times, which is now regarded as one of its better parts.

[EightBitNate]

This shits gonna make me cry so fucking hard

Update: I was right

[Tasty]

https://bloody-disgusting.com/editorials/3647482/21-horror-movies-cant-wait-see-2021/

Looking forward to:

- Malignant (dir. James Wan)
- Halloween Kills
- Resident Evil
- Last Night in Soho (dir. Edgar Wright)

Will probably watch Candyman though it looks like trash.

[Joe Molotov]

Psycho Goreman