The NBA thread

[Stoney Mason]

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/20371337/kevin-durant-golden-state-warriors-no-intention-visiting-white-house-harsh-words-president-donald-trump#show-last-Point

Not unexpected in the era of our racist president but still nice to see.

[Stoney Mason]

The Boston Celtics have acquired All-Star point guard Kyrie Irving from the Cleveland Cavaliers for point guard Isaiah Thomas, forward Jae Crowder, center Ante Zizic and a 2018 draft pick, sources tell ESPN.

Thomas had been bracing for the possibility of a trade on Tuesday, league sources told ESPN.

Irving, 25, requested a trade during a July meeting with Cavaliers owner Dan Gilbert. Irving has said that he wants to play in a situation where he can be more of a focal point and that he no longer wants to play alongside LeBron James, sources said.

Thomas has spent the offseason recovering from a right hip injury. He led the Celtics to the best record in the Eastern Conference, averaging 28.9 points and 5.9 assists over 33.8 minutes per game during the regular season.

Thomas missed the final three games of the Eastern Conference finals with the hip injury and opted not to have surgery. Celtics coach Brad Stevens said Monday that he was not sure Thomas would be ready for the start of training camp, but that further medical tests in September would determine that timeline.

Thomas, 28, will become a free agent when his contract expires at the end of June. Thomas has said he believes he's worthy of a maximum contract.

Irving was the No. 1 pick in the 2011 Draft. Thomas was the last.

The trade will make for an interesting opener for both teams. The Celtics and Cavaliers open the season in Cleveland on Oct. 17.

[Stoney Mason]

Most people are saying Cleveland got the better end of this trade. We'll see I guess.

Also the Pacers continue to be idiots for getting so little for Paul George. Both the Cavs and Celitcs would have been willing to give up a lot to get PG.

[TakingBackSunday]

WHAT

[samfish]

Who will break first?

[seagrams hotsauce]

Not feelin it but I trust in Danny

[Let's Cyber]

Pretty shocked they got a likely lottery pick on top.

[Stoney Mason]

Pretty shocked they got a likely lottery pick on top.

Yeah this seems to be a move aimed at a post lebron future. Isaiah Thomas is a good player with a hell of a heart but I'd rather take kyrie and his size compared to him.

Jae Crowder is a nice under-valued pickup for them though.

[T-Short]

https://twitter.com/Tom_NBA/status/900174983678308352

[bluemax]

Clips signed some dude from the Zombies as their new GM.

[benjipwns]

Kevin Pelton did some RPM crunching to update his projections for the season:

While the two All-Star point guards in this trade have stolen all the headlines, it's the third veteran player -- Crowder -- who actually has the best RPM projection of the three. Why is that? In part, it reflects the defensive shortcomings of both Irving and Thomas, at least during the regular season.

Befitting their status as efficient, high-scoring point guards, Irving and Thomas rate as standout offensive contributors. Thomas' projected plus-5.2 offensive RPM -- based on performance during the past three seasons and an age adjustment -- puts him sixth in the NBA, while Irving (plus-4.2) ranks 13th. Yet both players have defensive RPM projections that put them in the league's bottom 25, with Thomas (minus-3.7) second worst among signed players ahead of only Bojan Bogdanovic of the Indiana Pacers.

By contrast, Crowder's projection is far more balanced. He's one of 12 players in the league who project at least 1.5 points better than league average per 100 possessions on both offense and defense. Nine of those 12 players were All-Stars in 2017, with Nikola Jokic and Ricky Rubio as the other two exceptions.

The balanced projection reflects Crowder's 3-and-D skill set as well as how much of a difference his presence in the lineup has made for Boston. His plus-7.8 net rating on the court in 2016-17 was second best among Celtics behind Amir Johnson (plus-8.0), per NBA.com/Stats. Meanwhile, Boston was outscored by 3.9 points per 100 possessions with Crowder on the bench, the worst mark on the team.

A single season of on-court/off-court data can be fluky, a reason that RPM projections include multiple years of data. But Crowder had a similar, if smaller effect, in 2015-16, when the Celtics' plus-0.8 net rating with him on the bench was worst among regular players. In 2014-15, when Crowder joined the team midseason, Boston had a minus-3.0 net rating with him on the bench, surpassed only by Kelly Olynyk (minus-3.2).

Since Irving and Thomas figure to play similar minutes, the question here was mostly how to redistribute the 30 minutes per game Crowder was projected to play. (Ante Zizic's five minutes per game were also redistributed to centers Aron Baynes and Daniel Theis.) I split them fairly equally between Brown (previously at 20 minutes per game), Tatum (10, much to the dismay of hopeful Celtics fans) and Marcus Morris (25), while also adding second-round pick Semi Ojeleye on the fringes of the rotation.

In RPM's estimation, Boston should get much worse production in place of Crowder. The Celtics were relatively ineffective with Brown on the court last season -- his minus-2.2 on-court net rating was worst among Boston regulars -- while most rookies do little to help their teams win, even ones as highly regarded as Tatum. As a result, Boston's RPM projection tumbles from 49.4 wins on average before the trade to 43.8, putting the Celtics fifth in the Eastern Conference.

Having added Crowder, the Cavaliers are suddenly flush with wing options. I have Iman Shumpert as the odd man out of the rotation for the most part, though. JR Smith also sees less playing time, and Crowder gets far fewer minutes than he was projected for in Boston (30 minutes per game).

Still, siphoning minutes from those Cleveland incumbents to Crowder improves the team's RPM projection from 49.2 wins -- nearly even with but just behind the Celtics before the trade -- to 53.7, tops in the East and within striking distance of the Houston Rockets (55.1) for the second-best projection in the league behind the Golden State Warriors.

[seagrams hotsauce]

Y'know, I can't help but hate this. I was hoping that with the dumb amount of picks they had, Boston might be able to form a team around AB and IT. Now all that shit has been blow up, and it'll be awesome to watch, but Al Horford, Gordon Haywood, and Kyrie aren't carrying the Cs through the playoffs.

 Hope Kyrie isn't too offended by our local paper being named 'The Globe"

[benjipwns]

while literally everything else seems to be about the phony Celtics/Cavs kerfuffle over the trade, KP posted the biggest disagreements between Vegas and RPM and two teams i'm a bit interested in this season popped up along with Boston:

Boston Celtics
Line: 56.5 wins
RPM projection: 44.8 wins

I was looking at the lineup the other day and noticed something I retrospectively thought was totally getting underplayed in the press. Boston was close to league average on D last year, 13th, and they arguably either moved sideways or got worse at three positions. Amir->Morris and Crowder->Hayward are both general downgrades in that regard, plus they lost Bradley which leaves Smart as the main perimeter guy. Kyrie could be an upgrade on Thomas but he's not a huge one and he's never been very positive on that end. Plus Horford's back in the situation he openly hated in Atlanta when he doesn't have someone backing him up ala Amir/Zeller or Josh Smith to cover the backline, he's going to have to do it. Which he can, he just has been open about the fact that he doesn't find it ideal.

Philadelphia 76ers
Line: 42.5 wins
RPM projection: 33.5 wins

34 wins might still be good enough for the playoffs in the East though. Landing inbetween those marks probably definitely is. RPM has got to be tough on them here considering half their ideal rotation has basically no data. Though I may be a bit starry-eyed after Simmons and Embiid were a matchup nightmare that tore me apart in 2K recently. And that version of the team didn't have Amir, Redick, Fultz, a year older Saric, some idea of what to do with Okafor, etc.

LA Clippers
Line: 43.5 wins
RPM projection: 48.1 wins
Difference: 4.6 wins

The Clippers have become a favorite of statistical projections. Andrew Johnson's projections have them even higher at 51.6 wins.

This is one of those superstars get replaced by depth situations like OKC was hoping to have last year. It's going to really be relying on Griffin's development as an offensive player that Paul kinda shunted aside along with DeAndre taking away space down low. Now he's going to be the primary offensive player, but he's got all his additions he's made on giving himself an outside game and ability to distribute to fit himself in alongside those two. With Ganillari and the Rockets imports they don't look like that bad of team, not a contender anymore but probably not as huge of drop off as the Thunder took from Durant. Thunder went from 59-23 to 43-39 in pythag. Clippers were 52-30 last year and I don't think six teams out West going over or near 50 would be too crazy of a situation, yet it's kinda crazy to think losing Paul might only knock a couple wins off. But I guess they did quite well compared to a lot of a teams this offseason considering they got that haul of Rockets pieces and then plugging in Danilo to fill in for their superstar loss.

Their real problem probably continues to be Austin Rivers.

[bluemax]

Hey they got rid of Crawford and his contract, can't fix everything in one off season!

It's going to be interesting watching a more space oriented Clippers team after the last few years of having to rely on one of the best PGs of our lifetime to fit the ball in the awful spacing they had.

[benjipwns]

They could be a fun team if Doc lets em be. I really like Danilo's potential for devastating efficiency alongside a PF who not only can shoot outside eight feet but can distribute it oh, and isn't 6-8 combined with a big guy behind him who can clean up a little and also dominates the glass. He really worked well offensively with Jokic last year. Shame they couldn't have had him and Lou Williams while Paul was around instead of those almost self-inflicted gaping holes on the perimeter they always seemed to roll out with.

[bluemax]

They could be a fun team if Doc lets em be. I really like Danilo's potential for devastating efficiency alongside a PF who not only can shoot outside eight feet but can distribute it oh, and isn't 6-8 combined with a big guy behind him who can clean up a little and also dominates the glass. He really worked well offensively with Jokic last year. Shame they couldn't have had him and Lou Williams while Paul was around instead of those almost self-inflicted gaping holes on the perimeter they always seemed to roll out with.

I kinda wonder what Doc's future is with the team now that they've lost CP3 and he's been stripped of GM powers. He's been horrible at developing/playing anyone but his favorite veterans and now they kinda have some dudes who are not old timers that they should give run to (even if their upside is rotation player at best) but will he be willing to do that?

I could see him quitting after this season.

[benjipwns]

He did want to retire before KG/Pierce convinced him to do one more go around, but that was to spend more time with Austin...

I've assumed he must have had some role in developing DeAndre into smarter positioning and such, he did similar work with Kendrick Perkins that then fell apart when he left, but then I remember the control group was Vinny Del Negro.

[benjipwns]

With a Thursday morning deadline looming, the Boston Celtics agreed to send the Cleveland Cavaliers a 2020 second-round draft pick via the Miami Heat to acquire four-time All-Star guard Kyrie Irving and complete the blockbuster trade, league sources said.

[Stoney Mason]

nice. You could always tell they were just angling for an extra second round pick. I mentioned this to my brother once the initial rumours started swelling.

[bluemax]

https://twitter.com/DimeUPROXX/status/903418797050220545

[benjipwns]

Saw it mentioned today and didn't believe it but it's true, there hasn't been a NBA coach fired since May 2016.

And there hasn't been a NBA coach hired since June 2, 2016: Jeff Hornacek.

This has to be some kind of record post-merger.

And looking through the current coaches, unless something weird happens like Clips struggle so Doc retires or similar, plus whatever it is the Kings do that's called management happens we might go another season. A lot of the ones I could think of potentially aren't expected to win games this year (ATL, CHI, PHX, etc.) or are like Hornacek who will probably at least get a season without having to try and force the triangle on the team. (Especially with the Knicks still paying Fisher and Phil.)

Alvin Gentry is probably the most obvious hot seat but I'm sure he'll get some time to at least try to start off the season with Boogie in the fold. SVG is his own boss after the owner. Terry Stotts just got extended. Steve Clifford maybe?

[benjipwns]

I guess this could go somewhere else but I always like how news stories about sports players turn nobodies into franchise players, my favorite being "star" thrown around which this story doesn't use but is quite common, this is just an example I saw in the AP wire which while technically true still got me to click just to see the end line because I said "who?"

Former Celtic Nate Driggers sentenced to prison for selling stolen guns

CHICAGO -- An eight-year prison sentence has been handed to a former Boston Celtics player found guilty of receiving guns stolen off a freight train in Chicago.

Nate Driggers was found guilty in April of being a convicted felon in possession of stolen guns.

Evidence presented at trial showed the 44-year-old Driggers bought 30 of 111 Rugers stolen by gang members in 2015 from a rail car parked in a rail yard and quickly resold 29 of them. Only 19 guns have been recovered.

In asking for the maximum sentence of 10 years, prosecutors said Driggers' actions have contributed to the "very dark place" Chicago finds itself in when it comes to gun violence.

Driggers on Thursday again denied ever selling guns.

Drafted by the Celtics in 1996, Driggers appeared in 15 games that season.

He had a PER of 6.8 and BPM of -8.2. He spent a training camp with the Nuggets too. Played at the University of Montevallo where he averaged 28/11 as a Senior. He shot only 57% from the line in college.

And now you know... the rest of the story, good day.

[benjipwns]

another seemingly yearly follow up piece on Robert Swift who seems to be putting his life back together if not really having a shot at getting back to the league (vs. the 3-on-3 or g-league) like these stories always try to frame things:
https://www.si.com/nba/2016/09/21/robert-swift-nba-drug-addiction-thunder-sonics

though there was this fun little part of the story from his rookie year:

The first time he guards Tim Duncan, Swift pushes up on him on the block, trying to impress him.

“Nah, nah, don’t do that,” Duncan says.

Swift is surprised. Duncan never talks to opponents. And yet...

“The ball’s going to swing to the other side, get position,” Duncan continues.

The ball swings. Swift follows orders, shuffling his feet across the lane, staying behind Duncan.

“No, further up,” Duncan says. Swift takes a half-step.

“No, a little higher, don’t let me duck in on you.”

Swift complies.

“All right, now come back,” Duncan says, moving across the lane. “The ball’s about to be swung back, but it’s not coming to me this time so don’t worry about it. But now you know how to play it.”

[benjipwns]

Kevin Durant twitter story is so weird I'm convinced it's sorta fake.

Tyler Zeller to Nets and Tony Allen to the Pelicans are fun little end of FA shake outs that might be important later under the right circumstances. Especially the latter if the Pelicans make the playoffs. Zeller got log-jammed in Boston...of course now they have the space for him same as his other former team the Cavs did. I've kinda liked him as a mildly stretchy center off the bench though I can't fathom how any of the Zeller brothers seemingly can't block shots. Both of them still in the league probably need to develop a three point shot and become the new Frye.

The Mason Plumee contract seems like an overpaying especially after adding Milsap to play next to Jokic. Plus they've got Faried and Trey Lyles in the mix along with some other random dudes.

This Mohamed Bamba freshman at Texas is seven foot tall and has a minimum 7-9 wingspan. That's cheating, it totally lowers your ratings in MyCAREER.

Zach Lowe put out a column about some guys he's looking forward to seeing how things go this year: http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/20777848/zach-lowe-most-intriguing-players-2017-18-featuring-justise-winslow-jusuf-nurkic-nba

Remember Justise Winslow? Boston offered Charlotte four first-round picks just for the chance to draft him. One head coach told ESPN.com Winslow gave the best pre-draft interview he had ever seen.

That section along with Drummond being listed next reminded me that Stanley Johnson is probably going to get six times the minutes or more of Boban again.

So, umm, did the Pelicans -- with DeMarcus Cousins' free agency looming and limited paths to upgrade if he leaves -- just give Jrue Holiday $26 million per year to be an average spot-up shooter next to Rajon Rondo and two All-Star bigs?

They concluded Holiday just works better as a secondary ball handler, a role he has played next to Tyreke Evans, Tim Frazier, and others over four strange years in New Orleans. "I honestly don't think it changes much for me," Holiday told ESPN.com. "Rondo makes scoring so much easier."

The team worried about Holiday's court vision and shot selection as the undisputed floor general. "The fit with Rondo is going to be much, much better for him," Alvin Gentry, the Pelicans' head coach, told ESPN.com. "Anyone who doubts the value of Rondo just has to look at the playoffs last year. [The Bulls] dominated with him against Boston."

...

Gentry and his staff have to get creative. They hired Chris Finch away from Denver, and plan to mimic how the Nuggets ran their offense through Nikola Jokic. Cousins and Davis will handle the ball up high, while the other four players screen for one another. Gentry might even stick one of the bigs in the corner in Rick Adelman-style sets, and have Holiday screen for him there. "Deal with that," Gentry said.

"The Paul Georges and Kevin Durants -- we're going to ask Jrue to guard those guys," Gentry said.

[El Babua]

Trump got dunked on by Steph and Bron.

Oh and Carmelo got traded too.

[benjipwns]

That deal is actually kinda weird for the Knicks. They must plan on flipping Kanter?

I also love that both Melo and George who lamented having to play the four in the past are basically now going to be forced into it. Although it'll be a lot of switches and circumstancial matchups and such, the Thunder can't play them both otherwise. The shocking part will be which player realizes he's actually better playing there in the "new" NBA first?

Wade is apparently going to re-unite with LeBron in Cleveland after the Bulls complete his buyout. The dark side of me enjoys the Cavs seemingly accidentally backing their way into the deepest team they've ever rolled out around LeBron. Lots of people weirdly forget that 2015 Finals had Mozgov, Thompson and Dellavedova on the floor for most of the game earning their big contracts because the rest of the team was in shambles physically. Two of those were bench guys to start the season and Mozgov wasn't even on the roster.

Man, do OKC fans lead charmed lives though. Lose their first superstar only to watch Westbrook go insane for a year with a truly historic season and maybe polish off his edges in the process, and then land two superstars for peanuts including a guy who once forced his way off a near contender to New York simply because it was NYC who now is agreeing to play in one of the leagues smallest markets. Meanwhile, their lost star is going through some kind of mid career crisis that makes Draymond look normal and spent half of last year with his teammates visibly upset at his need for outside the system touches.

[benjipwns]

Season is going to be nuts, just dicking around with teams in 2K18 is sometimes silly. Even with all the changes they made recently you can tell their AI and play stuff still can't understand how to manage multiple ball handlers who can all score operating off seemingly eye contact like the 2002 Kings versus a ball handler who gets the ball to a single scorer and alternatively then a second option.

Plus many of the team-ups this year have been Melo, Paul, etc. guys who have gone through their primes as stars rather than the previously lamented guys in their primes-teaming-up. (Which Kobe has an extended monologue complaining about when he's a guest commentator when your team first plays the Lakers at home.)

[jakefromstatefarm]

That 8th seed in the east is going to a team who will maybe be the worst playoff team in the past 10 years. The first 6 slots are pretty much already decided and the 7th is too provided charlotte figures their shit out. If Philadelphia stays becomes healthy, they have as good a shot as anyone else; Hinkie vindicated.

[Stoney Mason]

Been busy so haven't been able to comment on all the nba stuff in the news.

lol at durant and all his twitter foolishness.

OKC has done a great job at rebuilding without giving away anything anybody would care about. Getting Paul George and Carmelo for what they gave up is a steal.

Wade should be interesting. As long as he is willing to accept a diminshed role he can help some teams. If he's still trying to be the wade of old that's ain't gonna work.


Good article on Dwight Howard from a few days ago.

https://www.si.com/nba/2017/09/19/dwight-howard-hornets-magic-lakers-james-harden-kobe-bryant


Fuck our racist president and props to Steph and The warriors


I'm out.

[benjipwns]

I remember reading a serious predraft article about Dwight's religion and how this was a major warning sign that he'd be soft and a team killer like other religious sports players (Kurt Warner and David Robinson I guess?) so the smart move was to draft Okafor or Ben Gordon who you could actually build around. That was either the year before or after Dick Vitale did his big rant about how you shouldn't draft anyone from overseas because they haven't had to work hard every night and earn it like college players do.

I think I like the new analytics obsessed draft process more.

[Stoney Mason]

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2735100-gregg-popovich-usa-is-embarrassment-amid-donald-trump-anthem-controversy

 

[Stoney Mason]

Sources: Dwyane Wade has reached agreement on a one-year, $2.3M deal with the Cleveland Cavaliers.

[El Babua]

Not surprised, but still

absolutelydisgusting.jpg

[benjipwns]

Kevin McHale's NBA-life lessons:

"People will always talk about 'the things you learn in the NBA,'" McHale says. "You know what you learn in the NBA? You learn how to play basketball. That's it. The only other thing I learned in my career with the Celtics was how to follow tall men through airports. You'd get your ticket from the trainer, and you'd follow the other tall men to the gate and get on the plane. It was like a herd of camels moving through the crowd. That was when we took commercial flights. Now we charter. You don't even have to learn how to follow tall men."

[Stoney Mason]

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/20905491/nba-all-star-game-switch-formats-captains-pick-team-conference-affiliations

I don't see how this fixes the issue.

[benjipwns]

I don't really get the lottery reform either based on the supposed explanations for why. Especially if we presume the entire point is to make bad teams not bad anymore.

[Stoney Mason]

Both issues seem pretty much unfixable.

They don't have the votes to try the radical solutions they would want to try for the draft. And honestly I'm not even sure its an issue other than that it gives a bad pr look.

The All-Star game is an even more minor issue. I mean I would love to have more competitive games. While the All-Star contest was never a real game, its gotten worse and worse over my lifetime but for very understandable modern reasons. Fear of Injury during a long season being chief among them.

I think there are solutions to potentially actually improve it. But they generally involve giving it some kind of stupid gimmick (give conference winner home field advantage during finals or something) or moving it away from the middle of the season.

What I've always wanted was to still have the team selection honor thing but move to some kind of three on three format to make it more about one on one matchups. Instead of one contest just run a little mini-tournament all day or weekend long and see who wins.

[benjipwns]

Zach Lowe league pass rankings:
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/20849806/zach-lowe-2017-18-nba-league-pass-rankings-part-1
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/20849807/zach-lowe-2017-18-nba-league-pass-rankings-part-2

spoiler (click to show/hide)

hearing his Blaha line in George's voice

[close]

spoiler (click to show/hide)

also that first Embiid video

[close]

[FStop7]

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2017/10/10/16452324/markelle-fultz-free-throw-shoulder

The Sixers need to fire their entire training staff.  They can't keep any of their young players healthy.  They botched their handling of Simmons' foot injury, etc.

[etiolate]

It doesn't help when you repeatedly draft injured players.

[etiolate]

 . board fail

[Stro]

Pacers playing a team from Israel to a packed house of 2500 people tonight 

[Stoney Mason]

https://www.si.com/nba/2017/10/11/isaiah-thomas-cavs-celtics-trade-kyrie-irving-hip-injury-lebron-james

When Sacramento let Thomas walk in 2014, he left town telling himself, “F--- Sacramento. I’m about to kill those dudes.” When Phoenix exiled him the following winter, he pledged, “O.K., now they’re gonna get it.” But there will be no revenge tour this time. “Boston is going to be all love,” he vows, with one exception. “I might not ever talk to Danny again. That might not happen. I’ll talk to everybody else. But what he did, knowing everything I went through, you don’t do that, bro. That’s not right. I’m not saying eff you. But every team in this situation comes out a year or two later and says, ‘We made a mistake.’ That’s what they’ll say, too.”

[Phoenix Dark]

What if the Sixers training staff deliberately hurts drafted players to ensure the acquisition of high draft picks the following year.

 

[etiolate]

https://twitter.com/ShamsCharania/status/920417917400944641

well damn

[Stoney Mason]

Two good games tonight. Let's do it.

[benjipwns]

https://twitter.com/ShamsCharania/status/920417917400944641

well damn

This could be the most exciting practice fight since 7-3 Ha Seung-Jin tried to impale 7-4 Nedzad Sinanovic with a balance beam or whatever it was and then they wrestled each other.

[etiolate]

I feel like that's the undercard for stretch 4 draft letdowns.

Beasley v Derrick Williams is the title fight.

[seagrams hotsauce]

Holy fucking shit, that was so disgusting looking

[etiolate]

Yah just saw the replay of Hayward's injury. Fell down like rag doll physics.

CURSE OF THE ISAIAH BEGINS

[FStop7]

Jesus Christ I wish I hadn’t heard that crack.  And the way all of the players dropped and started praying... that was awful to witness.

Hayward is a beast, he looked less freaked out than everyone else.

[eleuin]

worst looking injury since PG, fucking hell 

[FStop7]

Skip Bayless evolving from douchebag court jester to outright scumbag.

https://twitter.com/realskipbayless/status/920447725816049666

[Steve Contra]

Jesus christ.

[etiolate]

Fractured ankle the early diagnosis for Hayward.

Celtics got nobody else to score but Kyrie.

[Stoney Mason]

And they want people to go "hard" in a meaningless all star game.

[eleuin]

warriors playing like they're at the ymca and are still up

[bluemax]

Swaggy P is currently leading the Warriors in scoring.

[FStop7]

Tough way for the Warriors to start the season.

The Celts/Cavs finish was intense, too.

It all seems pretty hollow given what happened to Hayward.  That’s completely fucked.

[ToxicAdam]

That Cavs team is so weird looking now. It's like watching a pick up game.