Author Topic: Other Forums |OT| ♀ C O R E V A L U E S ♀ Sponsored By THQNordic  (Read 2755930 times)

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tiesto

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3660 on: April 12, 2018, 11:05:22 PM »
FF1 actually sold surprisingly decent in the US for a really early console RPG, IIRC it was something like 700,000 copies sold. I know Nintendo Power hyped the game up and gave it a TON of coverage (plus its own strategy guide, free to subscribers)... I know that was at least what drew me to the game (though I was a veteran of DQ1 and Ultima: Exodus by that time).

But was NoAs plan with DQ1 "to compete with PCs" or just to try and recreate the magic of Japan? I still reckon that DQ3 would have been a much better first impression of the series, since that had already been out for a year in Japan by that time.

Nintendo's 3rd party strategy with the N64 was so confusing to me too. Like, when they revealed their "Dream Team" and it didn't have any of the companies I grew up with and loved on the other Nintendo systems... no Capcom/Konami/Square/Enix/Hudson... but Paradigm Simulations, Mindscape, and Acclaim (the latter who we all knew were shit we just liked them because they were the hometown company)?
^_^

TVC15

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3661 on: April 12, 2018, 11:09:14 PM »
it's always kind of amusing when you read some of these IGN/Polygon or whoever "long-form" histories [of RPGS/NINTENDO/WHATEVER] that ignore that Nintendo essentially subsidized Square and Enix, famously taking a bath on importing Dragon Warrior, as part of their attempts to convince the US population that the NES could compete with PC's and weren't just arcade titles rehashed endlessly like doomed the market earlier

then truly successfully won over the older market with the Game Boy

just to get their teeth kicked in by Sega and Sony's advertising regimes, with the terrible "PLAY IT LOUD" era albeit producing the SNES's eventual "win" of market share, the period when it put out arguably the consoles best titles across multiple niches, eased up on third parties, and survived in the market against the flailing 32-bit era as the N64 delays piled up, just for Nintendo to abandon nearly everything they had learned and, tying this back into the original thing, most notably completely abandoning RPG's not only in the US, but in Japan right when the Sony-Square-EA partnership took them from good sellers for video games into titles that moved consoles and flooded the PS1 market with them

now this is where some dickbag tries to tell me Aidyn Chronicles: The First Mage was actually pretty okay and i just slap Robin while yelling that THQ IS DEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADDDDDDDD

Lately I’ve been picturing benji’s soliloquies as being performed loudly by the lonely crusade knight locked away deep in Petra as he grows increasingly bored and insane from guarding the Holy Grail.
serge

Pepinappe

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3662 on: April 12, 2018, 11:12:16 PM »
Kidding aside, Microsoft is making me want to get an XBOX more and more, with their full BC initiative. I never did get an Xbox console purely because my PC has sustained me ever since the start of the 7th gen.

Also, didn't that More_Badass moron admit he never actually played a (rather popular) game genre (or was that a game?) back in GAF, and asked members what it was all about? I remember you people being all surprised at his admission, especially since he was a mod at a "nexus of hardcore gamers" at the time.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2018, 11:16:24 PM by Pepinappe »

benjipwns

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3663 on: April 12, 2018, 11:41:33 PM »
FF1 actually sold surprisingly decent in the US for a really early console RPG, IIRC it was something like 700,000 copies sold. I know Nintendo Power hyped the game up and gave it a TON of coverage (plus its own strategy guide, free to subscribers)... I know that was at least what drew me to the game (though I was a veteran of DQ1 and Ultima: Exodus by that time).

But was NoAs plan with DQ1 "to compete with PCs" or just to try and recreate the magic of Japan? I still reckon that DQ3 would have been a much better first impression of the series, since that had already been out for a year in Japan by that time.

Nintendo's 3rd party strategy with the N64 was so confusing to me too. Like, when they revealed their "Dream Team" and it didn't have any of the companies I grew up with and loved on the other Nintendo systems... no Capcom/Konami/Square/Enix/Hudson... but Paradigm Simulations, Mindscape, and Acclaim (the latter who we all knew were shit we just liked them because they were the hometown company)?
Nintendo's acceptance of RPGs, weird simulations, even strategy and a lot of other titles that were at the time dominant on PC were to expand the market, not just FF and DW, but they essentially foot the bill for those titles to come over, FF was a big success, DW was a disaster. NP didn't just do strategy for that, they gave the GAME itself away to subscribers. And there's always been speculation that it was because they expected it to do like FF1, actually better as they spent gobs more in comparison on marketing it vs. Final Fantasy, and were left with a bunch of inventory. Something like 80% or more of the copies were acquired through Nintendo Power (a $20 subscription), not sold at retail (at $60 or more probably).

Remember, the whole thing about R.O.B., the Zapper, the never released keyboard and cassette drives, the NAME and design of the NES itself, were all to signal NOT VIDEO GAMES, BUT LIKE THEM BUT BETTER, NOT QUITE COMPUTERS BUT CLOSER. They couldn't get retailers interested without all this, so they were definitely looking at some of the more successful home PCs of the time that were big in gaming. Then they never needed all the accessories. (Which, speaking of speculation, I've heard many of which never truly existed as even working prototypes, Nintendo just stuck them under glass at shows.)

The funny part about Acclaim was that they more or less nearly killed off the 16-bit market single handedly with their insane orders of outright garbage like every movie licensed game that was a bad platformer, etc. they flooded retailers with this inventory as part of them also taking stuff like Mortal Kombat and NBA Jam. And Nintendo was going around touting them as their big partner in MORE high-priced cartridge inventory. (Even if Acclaim turned it around for a couple years.) Meanwhile, Sony is essentially trying to drive the price as low as it can go and setup all kinds of favorable buybacks. (Which they ported over from their experience with the music business.) It's not a surprise those were some rough years for the two legacy companies.

benjipwns

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3664 on: April 12, 2018, 11:44:44 PM »
Also, didn't that More_Badass moron admit he never actually played a (rather popular) game genre (or was that a game?) back in GAF, and asked members what it was all about? I remember you people being all surprised at his admission, especially since he was a mod at a "nexus of hardcore gamers" at the time.

Please, I'd be surprised if he flipped through a console's UI or logged into Steam.
HEINOUS LIES ABOUT VALUABLE COMMUNITY MEMBER DEBUNKED:
https://steamcommunity.com/id/More_Badass/
https://www.achievementstats.com/index.php?action=profile&playerId=76561198014486748

benjipwns

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3665 on: April 12, 2018, 11:45:05 PM »
oh god i just doxxed him didn't i

i can't control myself

Boredfrom

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3666 on: April 12, 2018, 11:47:55 PM »
Quote
This is going to be the second book on politics I ever buy and read in my life. The first was The Fire & The Fury earlier this year.

 :doge

https://www.resetera.com/posts/6690746/

This is the same guy that said that Free Speech was problematic.
the two books on politics you'll ever read and they're both trash tabloid "tell-alls" about people who spent a few months with Donald Trump

*clicks on user posts, all the threads are political topics*

idontknowhatiwasexpecting.gif

Well, at least is not Bronx Man that gleefully admited that Fire and Fury could be the first book he was gonna read after graduating high school.

benjipwns

  • Senior Member
Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3667 on: April 12, 2018, 11:49:36 PM »
you should have posed that as a question, i think i would have said Bronx Man for some reason

TVC15

  • Laugh when you can, it’s cheap medicine -LB
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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3668 on: April 13, 2018, 12:04:13 AM »
Sea of Thieves would be a lot less shitty if it were exactly like Puzzle Pirates.
serge

EightBitNate

  • I don’t wanna be horny anymore, I wanna be happy
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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3669 on: April 13, 2018, 12:07:36 AM »
I thought Splatoon 2 was fun but man do people stan hard for that game. Guess it’s just part of being a Nintendo game :trumps

benjipwns

  • Senior Member
Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3670 on: April 13, 2018, 12:15:07 AM »
I thought Splatoon 2 was fun but man do people stan hard for that game. Guess it’s just part of being a Nintendo game :trumps
i rather have something that means something to me atleast then just regular pinups.

Boredfrom

  • Senior Member
Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3671 on: April 13, 2018, 12:39:22 AM »
I've wanted to play Splatoon since the Wii U, but insisting your multiplayer game never goes on sale and having archaic ideas of how to handle multiplayer has always turned me off.

What I really don't get are people who insist some really dumb ideas, like having Nintendo choose 3 maps/modes for you depending on the time of day or limiting voice chat, are great because they help "competitive pro scene".

Like, are we suppose to pretend that every other competitive shooter doesn't exist, and that companies are pumping millions into sponsorships?

Does Splatoon even have a real competitive scene, or at least one to warrant their multiplayer experience being the equivalent of a child on a leash?

I think they have, but I really doubt that Nintendo cares outside cheap PR. Also, most people arguing about that probably have Splatoon as their first online multiplayer experience (or don’t care about it to begin with).

Jansen

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3672 on: April 13, 2018, 12:43:23 AM »
https://www.resetera.com/threads/do-you-think-a-us-civil-war-is-on-the-horizon.35873

Quote from: Shauni, post: 6697851, member: 1104
Yes, we 100% are.

Anyone saying otherwise is either just ignorant or doesn't want to accept it. It won't look anything like the first civil war, but we're definitely building to a new civil war event or period of time where violence will be used to suppress those against the government. It's the final stage of the current right wing takeover we're part of and once there's a competent fascist regime it's inevitable. I would say within the next 20 years.

shosta

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3673 on: April 13, 2018, 12:45:21 AM »
the violent takeover of the US government by a party that already runs the whole government
每天生气

benjipwns

  • Senior Member
Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3674 on: April 13, 2018, 12:51:00 AM »
Quote
It won't look anything like the first civil war
reenactors annihilated

benjipwns

  • Senior Member
Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3675 on: April 13, 2018, 12:53:47 AM »
I've wanted to play Splatoon since the Wii U, but insisting your multiplayer game never goes on sale and having archaic ideas of how to handle multiplayer has always turned me off.

What I really don't get are people who insist some really dumb ideas, like having Nintendo choose 3 maps/modes for you depending on the time of day or limiting voice chat, are great because they help "competitive pro scene".

Like, are we suppose to pretend that every other competitive shooter doesn't exist, and that companies are pumping millions into sponsorships?

Does Splatoon even have a real competitive scene, or at least one to warrant their multiplayer experience being the equivalent of a child on a leash?
UR SUCH A JOKE LOL



spoiler (click to show/hide)
[close]

shosta

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3676 on: April 13, 2018, 12:55:44 AM »
 
Quote from: retromelon
I dont think so. Life has gotten too comfortable. In 1860 what the fuck else did you have to do all day but step in cow shit and shoot your rifle off at somebody
retromelon posts :rejoice
每天生气

Pepinappe

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3677 on: April 13, 2018, 12:59:02 AM »
Also, didn't that More_Badass moron admit he never actually played a (rather popular) game genre (or was that a game?) back in GAF, and asked members what it was all about? I remember you people being all surprised at his admission, especially since he was a mod at a "nexus of hardcore gamers" at the time.

Please, I'd be surprised if he flipped through a console's UI or logged into Steam.
HEINOUS LIES ABOUT VALUABLE COMMUNITY MEMBER DEBUNKED:
https://steamcommunity.com/id/More_Badass/
https://www.achievementstats.com/index.php?action=profile&playerId=76561198014486748

Jesus Christ 685 games and DLCs, but only 1.2k achievements total? It's like he's just collecting them or something.

Jansen

  • Senior Member
Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3678 on: April 13, 2018, 12:59:10 AM »
 :hans1

Quote from: Shauni, post: 6698405, member: 1104
Eh, you can laugh at me all you want. Most people do, as evidented by this thread and the others, but the final stages of a coup is rarely gentle. Writing is on the wall.


Momo

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3679 on: April 13, 2018, 01:15:51 AM »
There's a bunch of sick fucks in the Splatoon community, it's much worse than the Sonic fuckers ever got.

Raist

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3680 on: April 13, 2018, 01:16:37 AM »
Was that term even a thing until last gen?

Yes? It's been there since PSX.

I distinctly remember that term used back in the SNES days.

benjipwns

  • Senior Member
Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3681 on: April 13, 2018, 01:18:46 AM »
Quote from: Ether_Snake
The Clive Bundy standoff is what should be seen as a big warning.

What will likely happen eventually is a group of people will carry out an attack or cause a standoff, and the authorities won’t stop them or will be extremely slow in responding. Could be a group in the military, police officers, or right wingers.

I think that is very likely. Right now if you are a young right-winger, why would you want to do anything else than become a police officer? If that becomes a trend, it could have huge implications in a decade. It would spill over in the whole justice system.

People are significantly underestimating this problem.

benjipwns

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3682 on: April 13, 2018, 01:24:30 AM »
Quote
The trend nowadays seems to suggest that if large countries like the US collapse, it might do so relatively peacefully — states might secede without all our war breaking out (though it’ll probably hit the economy hard)
Ah, yes, the trend nowdays of large countries that dominate the world's economy, have over three hundred million citizens and the world's most powerful military collapsing...like...uh...and well...

clothedmacuser

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3683 on: April 13, 2018, 02:11:42 AM »


Well, at least is not Bronx Man that gleefully admited that Fire and Fury could be the first book he was gonna read after graduating high school.

To think that guy once questioned me and I got banned for calling him an idiot.
sigh

Optimus

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3684 on: April 13, 2018, 02:12:54 AM »
https://www.twitch.tv/bullyhunters

best comedy i've seen in years


I can't believe I missed this. Thankfully I found the video with commentary:




I don't know how long I'll be able to last, the SJW cringe level is too high even for me.

Boredfrom

  • Senior Member
Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3685 on: April 13, 2018, 02:15:38 AM »
https://www.twitch.tv/bullyhunters

best comedy i've seen in years


I can't believe I missed this. Thankfully I found the video with commentary:




I don't know how long I'll be able to last, the SJW cringe level is too high even for me.

You are Social Studies Warrior, Optimus? That is surprising, but it makes sense given how obsessed you are...

Transhuman

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Optimus

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3687 on: April 13, 2018, 02:25:38 AM »

You are Social Studies Warrior, Optimus? That is surprising, but it makes sense given how obsessed you are...


I was talking about tolerance levels of SJW cringe. And btw that's uncalled for, I didn't insult you so I have no idea why you'd try to smear me like that. Uncalled for, man.

etiolate

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3688 on: April 13, 2018, 02:26:15 AM »
omg that's amazing



plz rate my bull hunter

Optimus

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3689 on: April 13, 2018, 02:47:10 AM »
https://twitter.com/GamesNosh/status/984583269546188800


Bullyhunter and "victim" were the same person :lol :lol

Rahxephon91

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Momo

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3691 on: April 13, 2018, 03:29:30 AM »
https://www.twitch.tv/bullyhunters

best comedy i've seen in years


I can't believe I missed this. Thankfully I found the video with commentary:




I don't know how long I'll be able to last, the SJW cringe level is too high even for me.
what's this about?

Optimus

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3692 on: April 13, 2018, 03:59:05 AM »

what's this about?


It's the latest episode of "feminism is about empowering wamen so let's treat them like weak and feeble individuals that need our protection from the big bad world".

Momo

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3693 on: April 13, 2018, 04:08:53 AM »
I mean it's an hour and 40 minutes, I generally dont complain about long videos, but that's too much time to invest in something i know fuckall about, some cliffs or highlights would help

Optimus

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3694 on: April 13, 2018, 04:15:39 AM »
Snowflakes whine to them about someone being rude to them on the internet and then they bully and harass the alleged bullies and harassers.

thetylerrob

  • Member
Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3695 on: April 13, 2018, 04:17:38 AM »
This black guy is so try hard I can't watch the video holy shit

Momo

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3696 on: April 13, 2018, 04:28:15 AM »

Raist

  • Winner of the Baited Award 2018
  • Senior Member
Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3697 on: April 13, 2018, 04:28:29 AM »
https://www.twitch.tv/bullyhunters

best comedy i've seen in years


I can't believe I missed this. Thankfully I found the video with commentary:




I don't know how long I'll be able to last, the SJW cringe level is too high even for me.
what's this about?


Progressive heroes log into your favourite games to hunt evil alt-right mysogynistic bullies, on a quest to save the video games industry.

Turns out they're behind the bullies' accounts too.

Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3698 on: April 13, 2018, 04:51:59 AM »
woke

zomgee

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3699 on: April 13, 2018, 05:00:22 AM »
Are.we.the.baddies.jpg
rub

benjipwns

  • Senior Member
Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3700 on: April 13, 2018, 05:06:58 AM »
Quote
What they edited out was me being harassed & killed in game over & over for about an hour by a famous hacker/griefer on YT. I was a good sport most of the way, my ex bf & I used to call each other the f word as a pet name & it slipped. Im actually also bi. This was 5+ years ago
this kind of rabbit hole answer is why you always need to keep your lies simple


zomgee

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3702 on: April 13, 2018, 05:11:37 AM »
Those were all pet names for my family members, they all kinda slipped (I'm bi)
rub



benjipwns

  • Senior Member
Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3705 on: April 13, 2018, 05:49:53 AM »
oh god i just doxxed him didn't i

i can't control myself

You fell right into my trap.

I'll have you sucking dick by June.
https://www.resetera.com/threads/lttp-titanic-it-was-actually-really-fantastic.35831/
Quote from: More_Badass
Yes, I'm one of those people who have never seen Titanic.

After years of expectations and hearing it talked about and seeing video essays mention the movie and pop culture references, I finally have seen it and Titanic hold up incredibly well. Aside from the younger actors, I never would have imagined that this movie is over 20 years old. I guess that's a testament to how expertly Cameron combined grand practical sets with excellent CGI.

I had always heard Titanic described as a love story, so I was expecting the first half to be kind of sappy and maudlin, but it really wasn't. Jack and Rose's relationship is really well done; yes, it's happens way too fast, but it's made compelling by the social stratas of the ship, the side characters and especially Paxton's detestable antagonist. I never found the movie boring or dull, you almost forget that this is a movie set on the Titanic and the looming fate.

And then the iceberg shows up.

It's almost kind of a cinematic jump scare, how suddenly Cameron drops the iceberg in mid-movie and the tone of the movie shifts. Suddenly, it's this tense disaster thriller with huge spectacle as the more intimate action and escape involving Jack and Rose happens among the larger chaos, all brought to tangible terrifying life by the still-amazing on-set and CGI effects.

I've seen a lot of disaster movies, and so many try to use the "protagonists and their family in danger" focus to give the chaos a human touch, like the fact that simply having a character with loved ones is all that's needed for the audience to care. But none have done it better or more genuinely than Titanic. Titanic could have simply been a big budget disaster blockbuster (and it probably would have worked given how great the action is) but that first hour/90 minutes of drama is what elevates it to something more and makes the infamous chaos that much more affecting and intimate.

My only real gripe is that the framing device felt pretty unnecessary, and only distracted from the central plot when it would cut away.

benjipwns

  • Senior Member
Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3706 on: April 13, 2018, 05:54:58 AM »
Quote
It’s one of those things where I look back on it (released when I was in 5th grade) and it seems like the only reason people shit all over it is toxic masculinity.

I had to spend YEARS pretending that My Heart Will Go On isn’t a great song.
Quote
Watched it for the first time about 8-10 years ago, and I also thoroughly enjoyed it. Gets a lot of undue vitriol for being a blockbuster movie heavily featuring romance, a genre unfairly and misogynistically derided for its female audience.
Quote
The only thing that doesn’t hold up is the backlash.
:nope

Momo

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3707 on: April 13, 2018, 06:13:42 AM »



Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3708 on: April 13, 2018, 06:25:10 AM »
https://www.resetera.com/threads/my-friend’s-dog-is-problematic-around-poc.35805/

The mods on reeee are just dumb. If you're gonna allow this unjunior lime

They cant tell this is a joke thread  :doge

Their explanation is to accuse the owner of being racist and the dog learning racism from them :doge :doge :doge

Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3709 on: April 13, 2018, 06:32:22 AM »
They cant tell this is a joke thread  :doge

Their explanation is to accuse the owner of being racist and the dog learning racism from them :doge :doge :doge

To be fair, that's how my dog learned how to lick its balls.
woke

venereology

  • Member
Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3710 on: April 13, 2018, 07:35:54 AM »
https://www.resetera.com/threads/so-i-lost-my-job.35925/

Quote
Lost my job thanks to this forum lol

 :neogaf :snoop

venereology

  • Member
Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3711 on: April 13, 2018, 07:45:37 AM »
oh my god haha

Quote
You're the guy who came on here bad mouthing his company and boss, mentioning them specifically by name. People told you to delete the posts, but you didn't because you said you didn't care. Then someone tweeted pictures of the thread to your boss.

I guess you care now?
« Last Edit: April 13, 2018, 07:51:32 AM by venereology »

team filler

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3712 on: April 13, 2018, 08:18:56 AM »
lol financial instability and possibly ruin  :rejoice
*****

Propagandhim

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bork

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3714 on: April 13, 2018, 08:47:27 AM »
https://www.resetera.com/threads/not-so-channel-awesome-ex-contributors-of-channel-awesome-detail-a-history-of-abuse-read-op.33557/page-42
Quote from: BreezyLimbo, post: 6704583, member: 1041
there was a reason why I never cared for nostalgia critic or his ilk

good to know the gut feeling was justified
:ego
ど助平


HardcoreRetro

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3716 on: April 13, 2018, 09:02:19 AM »
I remember when we went from Nintendo 64 to Gamecube.

A leap of 64 bits from 64 to 128.  :O

agrajag

  • Senior Member
Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3717 on: April 13, 2018, 09:03:59 AM »
By my calculations we should be at 1024 bits by now

Stro

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Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3718 on: April 13, 2018, 09:09:10 AM »
I remember when we went from Nintendo 64 to Gamecube.

A leap of 64 bits from 64 to 128.  :O


 :ohhh

tummyfat

  • Member
Re: The Other Forums Thread for Other Forums
« Reply #3719 on: April 13, 2018, 09:21:00 AM »
I'm going to sign up to be a bullyhunter



Why would SteelSeries align themselves with this dumpster fire