Each new picture of Super Street Fighter II Turbo HD makes it look shittier

[Ichirou]

Check out Cammy, she looks like she was drawn by a marginally talented teenager with markers.

[MCD]

 

still it's no worse than Guile, T.Hawk or that shitty redone stage.

[Van Cruncheon]

why is her right fist so much larger than her left

[CajoleJuice]

[Ichirou]

why is her right fist so much larger than her left

Because the artist is apparently a moron with no knowledge of human anatomy.

I'm more interested in all the bizarre color gradations on her leg.  REALLY makes it look like it was drawn with magic marker.  And her faux-animu face and eyes, ugh.

What shitty art, I bet Capcom would be too embarassed to release this in Japan.  I can't believe people on GAF are hyped/defensive about this POS.

[Robo]

I can't understand now people defend this.  The only saving grace will be, as part of the HD package, including the original SSF2T with online.

[CajoleJuice]

Didn't they already release that?

[Robo]

Street Fighter 2 HF' is much more barebones, if that's what you're thinking of.  And much more unbalanced.  An arcade perfect version of Super Street Fighter 2 Turbo without disgusting redrawn sprites would be fantastic.

[CajoleJuice]

Oh yeah, I've played the demo. I forgot. 

[Ichirou]

The sad thing is how Capcom or Udon keeps releasing these illustrations as though they're so proud of their work in progress, and no one seems to have the cojones to tell them it looks like shit and this whole HD thing should be canned unless they can actually get talented artists to do it.

[Yeti]

heehee, look at this one. What is going in with his legs?

[Ichirou]

Shit, that is laughably awful.

[Van Cruncheon]

this DOES look like bad fanart

[MCD]

hmmm....

[brawndolicious]

why is her right fist so much larger than her left

it's supposed to be closer to the camera but it's too big.

considering this is official capcom art:


it might look better in motion?  If it doesn't, then there won't be an HD street fighter until somebody comes up with a really good cel-shading method.

[Ichirou]

Uh, that official Cammy art is great, what are you talking about?

[Madrun Badrun]

why is her right fist so much larger than her left

To give a sense of depth. 

[brawndolicious]

Uh, that official Cammy art is great, what are you talking about?

the proportions are wrong in both.  I honestly don't get the point in going through the trouble of putting a 2D fighter in HD anyways but I don't think it'll look that bad in motion.

[Ichirou]

Uh, that official Cammy art is great, what are you talking about?

the proportions are wrong in both.  I honestly don't get the point in going through the trouble of putting a 2D fighter in HD anyways but I don't think it'll look that bad in motion.

"the proportions are wrong in both"...I'd like you to tell me exactly in what way the proportions are wrong in the official Cammy art.  She doesn't have mutant hands where one is bigger than the other!

[brawndolicious]

both of them have problems with the proportions of the waist and feet.

[Ichirou]

both of them have problems with the proportions of the waist and feet.

You're clearly mistaken...are you saying that the problem is that there's no way a real woman would have a waist like that, or something? Because, y'know, it's a cartoon.  Using that inane logic, the proportion of her eyes are off too, they're too big for her face! Oh, and look at how small her nose is in the official art, huahuahua.

Artists are allowed to take artistic license with physical anatomy as long as they are CONSISTENT and pay attention to rules of perspective.  The difference between the HD remake art and the official Capcom art is that the HD remake art is drawn by a drooling incompetent while the official art is drawn by someone with skill and talent.

[drohne]

it looks fine. i'm sure you'd find a million things to object to if you looked at individual frames of capcom's own games -- the more so if the artists lacked the PURE NIPPONESE BLOOD NECESSARY FOR THE PRODUCTION OF REAL ANIME

not that i'm so kindly disposed towards these udon fuckers, who can't seem to publish the goddamn okami artbook they promised

[bork]

I'm holding back judgment until we finally see the game in motion.  This is just one frame of animation, to be fair.

[Ichirou]

Every single frame of animation they've released so far looks like shit.  You guys honestly think this is somehow going to magically look better in motion?

[brawndolicious]

Well what I'm getting at is that other than the fists, the unrealistic proportions are all basically the same.  Considering it's a fighting game though, you should wait until videos come out.

seriously though, I think you guys are just being too hard on them.  it's a 2D fighting game getting a 20 times resolution upgrade, you can't even see any detail in the original game and I'm sure as hell nobody tried to dissect the game that much.

[Ichirou]

Even if we were to put the whole uneven proportions thing aside, the art just looks...bad.  Prole compared it to fanart, but I don't think that's even a fair comparison because I have seen fanart that looks LEAGUES BETTER than this.

[drohne]

i'm saying nobody goes over individual frames to see whether a character's fists are perfectly congruent -- the animations for new moves in ssf2 and ssf2t looked like they were from some other game and nobody cared. and moreover the fucked proportions in udon's sprites are mostly due the fucked proportions in capcom's original sprites. they did pretty well to salvage cammy -- have you seen the amateur attempts in that gaf thread? it's mainly japafaggotry that's got people in this hypercritical mood...i mean what's all this:

"And her faux-animu face and eyes, ugh.

What shitty art, I bet Capcom would be too embarassed to release this in Japan."

[Ichirou]

drohne.

I stand by what I said...the art IS faux-animu.  Capcom SHOULD be too embarassed to release this shit overseas...people in Japan are used to playing 2D games that actually have some aesthetic sense - stuff like Guilty Gear and Arcana Heart.  This just looks like a gleaming turd in comparison.

It's kinda funny how you say "nobody goes over individual frames" - well, how's it gonna look when every single frame looks like dogshit?  And have you seen that Vegas background?

[drohne]

you do realize that VRAI ANIMU is drawn by korean slave laborers who routinely violate proportions in ways that make udon's work look like da vinci

i mean how do you manage to get through an episode of XRZ GUNDAM NEW CENTURY WING ANGEL: ENDLESS RAPE

[Ichirou]

Oh, sorry, I thought I was talking to an intelligent poster, not an idiotic troll.

[drohne]

i'm just asking that you apply your standards consistently

...and making fun of your belief in some innate japanese aesthetic sense which would recoil from udon's impertinent FAUX ANIMU

i doubt you could find an actual japanese person who cares

OH NO VE CANT RELEASE IT IN JAPAN OR ZE NIPS VILL MAKE ZE FUN

[Ichirou]

BUBUBUBUBU YOU WATCH ANIMUUUUUUU

No, the "nipischeren" will LOL, say "Well, that looks like shit" and go back to playing Guilty Gear or whatever.

I love how you put meaning into my words that wasn't even there, like how I believe that the Japanese have some "innate aesthetic sense."  I mentioned two games that had that, and I didn't even say whether said aesthetic sense was GOOD or BAD.  I just said they had one.

Reading comprehension FTW.

[brawndolicious]

I think we can all agree that playing street fighter again will work against this game more than it's art.

[Ichirou]

No.  Super Street Fighter II Turbo is a great game.

[brawndolicious]

HETOKEN!

seriously, fuck this series.  I mean 2D HD sprites, WTF?  I would prefer they go with cel-shading and cool 2D special effects.

disclaimer: I am at best a casual fighting game fan and haven't been good at one in years.

[bork]

HETOKEN!

seriously, fuck this series.  I mean 2D HD sprites, WTF?  I would prefer they go with cel-shading and cool 2D special effects.

disclaimer: I am at best a casual fighting game fan and haven't been good at one in years.

I SHOULD FUCKING BAN YOU RIGHT NOW

spoiler (click to show/hide)

if I could

[close]

[Ichirou]

lyte edge, you are the biggest 2D fighter fan on this board.  Does the HD Street Fighter art look good to you?

[brawndolicious]

I SHOULD FUCKING BAN YOU RIGHT NOW

spoiler (click to show/hide)

if I could

[close]

I thought you were a mod?  what can you do?

and it seems stupid to make a fighting game (which has repetitive characters and environments compared to other genres) in 2D HD.

[drohne]

i don't know why i'm bothering, but i had the feeling that cammy's 'faux animu face' was based on a particular piece of official art, and i think i've found it



iirc udon have just traced some of the faces from this set of promotional art -- like t-hawk's

lolz

[demi]

Haters will be owned, this game will rock

I plan on buying it so they make more

[Ichirou]

i don't know why i'm bothering, but i had the feeling that cammy's 'faux animu face' was based on a particular piece of official art, and i think i've found it

(Image removed from quote.)

iirc udon have just traced some of the faces from this set of promotional art -- like t-hawk's

lolz

Yeah...no.  That official art is not particularly great, but it's still leagues ahead of the HD Udon art.  And I doubt they based their design off of it, considering that the face in the HD Udon art is angled in different direction.  She doesn't even have a similar expression on their face fo rthem to trace off of.

[bork]

lyte edge, you are the biggest 2D fighter fan on this board.  Does the HD Street Fighter art look good to you?

Some does, some doesn't, but we haven't even gotten a single screenshot of something close to being finished yet, so I can't really form an opinion yet.  The whole HD thing could end up working against the game in the end, since SSF2T is pretty dated animation-wise.

I SHOULD FUCKING BAN YOU RIGHT NOW

spoiler (click to show/hide)

if I could

[close]

I thought you were a mod?  what can you do?

Other stuff.  I'm not a mod though.  I wouldn't actually ban you for that, BTW...it's a joke.  That would be GAF-level stupid.

and it seems stupid to make a fighting game (which has repetitive characters and environments compared to other genres) in 2D HD.

No it doesn't.  Quit hating.

[brawndolicious]

I know you wouldn't ban me, but it seems smarter to just make this in 3D with decent cel-shading that truely adopts the brilliant Street Fighter Art™.  Would also make sequels a lot easier to make.

[bork]

I know you wouldn't ban me, but it seems smarter to just make this in 3D with decent cel-shading that truely adopts the brilliant Street Fighter Art™.  Would also make sequels a lot easier to make.

No, because the game would not play the same.  Even 3D-polygon based games that feel incredibly close to sprite-based fighters like Battle Fantasia are STILL not the same as traditional 2D hand-drawn fighters.

What the people making HD Remix are doing are simply replacing the sprites with new ones...everything else, like hit boxes, will be EXACTLY the same.  This is not a new game.

[hyp]

looks good to me.  i'm sure the overall package will be nice -- capcom is distinguished mentally-challenged for showing little bits at a time.

[Oblivion]

seriously, fuck this series.  I mean 2D HD sprites, WTF?  I would prefer they go with cel-shading and cool 2D special effects.

Nooooooooooo.

Hand drawn sprites >>>>>>>>>>>>> Cel shading any day of the week.


As for the art, eh it looks aight. Cammy needs bigger titties, tho.

[TVC15]

I don't think the art looks bad.  They are working from the original sprites, so most of the badness was there in the first place.  You can just actually see it now. 

It comes with the territory of what they are doing.  For what it's worth, I don't think anything looks that bad.  For example, in motion, you won't notice that fist thing.  Things like the awkwardness of that Guile kick pose, that was ALWAYS there, and I am surprised you are just noticing it now.

Game looks fine.

[Mondain]

Meh, I don't think that most HD 2D games work very well, they end up looking like gaudy Flash cartoons. 2D is better with small sprites devoid of detail and a small resolution.

[TVC15]

Meh, I don't think that most HD 2D games work very well, they end up looking like gaudy Flash cartoons. 2D is better with small sprites devoid of detail and a small resolution.

I don't think it's a problem of 2d games generally not working well in HD, I just think that in this case, Capcom is trying to stay too true to original artwork that was never designed to be seen in such detail.  The redrawn sprites, due to the policy of apparently not adding new detail that isn't related to shading/lighting, are reminiscent of flat shaded polygonal designs, and despite being very "high tech" 2d, they come out looking simple.  And slavish devotion to the original designs means that things that looked awkward, but were "hidden" in low resolution sprites are now open for everyone to see.

No, this isn't a case of bad new art, this is just a case of bad old art that used to be satisfactory due to technical limitations having the clock run out on it.

[brawndolicious]

No, because the game would not play the same.  Even 3D-polygon based games that feel incredibly close to sprite-based fighters like Battle Fantasia are STILL not the same as traditional 2D hand-drawn fighters.
What the people making HD Remix are doing are simply replacing the sprites with new ones...everything else, like hit boxes, will be EXACTLY the same.  This is not a new game.

other than very minor clipping problems which are nearly impossible to see, you could keep the exact same hitboxes.  it would be hard but still easier than 1920X1080 sprites.

[Ichirou]

Meh, I don't think that most HD 2D games work very well, they end up looking like gaudy Flash cartoons. 2D is better with small sprites devoid of detail and a small resolution.

I don't think it's a problem of 2d games generally not working well in HD, I just think that in this case, Capcom is trying to stay too true to original artwork that was never designed to be seen in such detail.  The redrawn sprites, due to the policy of apparently not adding new detail that isn't related to shading/lighting, are reminiscent of flat shaded polygonal designs, and despite being very "high tech" 2d, they come out looking simple.  And slavish devotion to the original designs means that things that looked awkward, but were "hidden" in low resolution sprites are now open for everyone to see.

No, this isn't a case of bad new art, this is just a case of bad old art that used to be satisfactory due to technical limitations having the clock run out on it.

*shrug* They are adding new details, though.  Look in page one at T. Hawk's belt and face in the new art and in the original.  They're not just tracing the sprite.

[TVC15]

Meh, I don't think that most HD 2D games work very well, they end up looking like gaudy Flash cartoons. 2D is better with small sprites devoid of detail and a small resolution.

I don't think it's a problem of 2d games generally not working well in HD, I just think that in this case, Capcom is trying to stay too true to original artwork that was never designed to be seen in such detail.  The redrawn sprites, due to the policy of apparently not adding new detail that isn't related to shading/lighting, are reminiscent of flat shaded polygonal designs, and despite being very "high tech" 2d, they come out looking simple.  And slavish devotion to the original designs means that things that looked awkward, but were "hidden" in low resolution sprites are now open for everyone to see.

No, this isn't a case of bad new art, this is just a case of bad old art that used to be satisfactory due to technical limitations having the clock run out on it.

*shrug* They are adding new details, though.  Look in page one at T. Hawk's belt and face in the new art and in the original.  They're not just tracing the sprite.

For the most part they aren't adding new details.  They are keeping nearly the exact same outlines, and look, even the creases in his clothes are the same.

[MCD]

What sad is not adding details or making any changes, the sad thing here is tracing Edayan's art, i mean can't they just trace the old art and try to make it better without tracing ANOTHER artist work?

see pic:

[Ichirou]

Oh, man.

Can you find where they traced Cammy's face from, McDragon?  drohne thinks it's a piece of artwork he posted, but I disagree...Cammy's face looks really bad, I think it can only be an original piece of Udon "art."

[MCD]

Well, Ryu and T.Hawk were obvious tracing of Edayan's art for Super Street Fighter II: Turbo Revival (GBA).

Here you can see the portraits art: http://img38.picoodle.com/img/img38/8/6/30/f_SSF2GBA01m_8c67618.jpg

dunno if they traced Cammy too or not...

[MrAngryFace]

Meh, I don't think that most HD 2D games work very well, they end up looking like gaudy Flash cartoons. 2D is better with small sprites devoid of detail and a small resolution.

BO BO BO GGXX that would look good HD you tardo.

Id also like to add that as much as I love Capcom, most of the Street Fighter characters are incredibly stupid in concept, and seeing them high res only makes it more obvious.

[TVC15]

Meh, I don't think that most HD 2D games work very well, they end up looking like gaudy Flash cartoons. 2D is better with small sprites devoid of detail and a small resolution.

BO BO BO GGXX that would look good HD you tardo.

Id also like to add that as much as I love Capcom, most of the Street Fighter characters are incredibly stupid in concept, and seeing them high res only makes it more obvious.

Yeah, this is what I think, exactly.

You cite the belt buckle as being new, Ichirou, but is that really the problem?  The real problem is that like 90% of the character looks blank and empty.  It's a design that was married to the resolution it was drawn for originally.

[bork]

Meh, I don't think that most HD 2D games work very well, they end up looking like gaudy Flash cartoons. 2D is better with small sprites devoid of detail and a small resolution.

BO BO BO GGXX that would look good HD you tardo.

Id also like to add that as much as I love Capcom, most of the Street Fighter characters are incredibly stupid in concept, and seeing them high res only makes it more obvious.

It's also because these characters, the SF2 ones in particular, are fucking 15+ year-old designs.  Of course they look dated and cheesy now.

[MrAngryFace]

Doesnt matter, maybe they shoulda just not done HD then. lol

[Van Cruncheon]

also, last i checked, we are living in 2007 and what was par for a fledgling genre then is not so good now

basically, what maf said: if they weren't gonna improve the art, maybe they should left them sd