Author Topic: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.  (Read 5239 times)

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Flannel Boy

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Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« on: December 12, 2007, 02:21:01 PM »
This happened in my suburb.

Quote
The 16-year-old Mississauga girl who was allegedly strangled by her father in a dispute over her refusal to wear the hijab has died.
Aqsa Parvez, a Grade 11 student at Applewood Heights, succumbed to her injuries late last night, Peel Regional Police said today.
The girl’s 57-year-old father, Muhammad Parvez, has been charged with muder. Aqsa’s 26-year-old brother, Waqas Parvez, has been charged with obstructing police.
Friends believe Aqsa (seen above in a personal photo) was the victim of a dispute over the teenager's desire to be more western.
“She wanted to live her life the way she wanted to, not the way her parents wanted her to,” classmate Krista Garbhet told the Post this morning.
“She just wanted to be herself, honestly she just wanted to show her beauty, and not be pushed around by her parents telling her what she has to be like, what she has to do.  Nobody would want to do that.”
An announcement broadcast at the school, near Bloor Street and Cawthra Road this morning, confirmed Aqsa’s death.
School officials described her as an energetic, well-liked student.
“Peel Police are investigating Aqsa’s death. It’s natural to want answers about why this tragedy occurred, but we really don’t have any of those answers yet. So it’s important to avoid speculation or rumours. If you do have first-hand information that you think is relevant to this case, you can speak with one of the teachers or counsellors, or with office staff,” one school official told students.
A memorial with a photograph of Aqsa and book of dedication was set up in the school’s main foyer.
Grief counsellors are available to support shocked classmates. A flag outside the school has been lowered in memory of the girl.

http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/toronto/archive/2007/12/11/girl-16-dies-after-hijab-dispute-with-father.aspx

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #1 on: December 12, 2007, 02:26:41 PM »
foc: "islam is a religion of peace, lol"
duc

Phoenix Dark

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Mupepe

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #3 on: December 12, 2007, 02:33:07 PM »

Flannel Boy

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #4 on: December 12, 2007, 02:38:53 PM »
foc: "islam is a religion of peace, lol"
Is this response any worse than people who claim Islam had nothing whatsoever to do with this. The Qur'an does suggest that women should cover their hair and wear some sort of hair covering. It shouldn't be shocking when a chauvinistic believer reacts this way to his daughter.

Phoenix Dark

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #5 on: December 12, 2007, 02:44:05 PM »
The hijab is supposed to be a choice, given to daughters when they're 16. But as someone said in the GAF thread, a lot of times when a girl refuses to wear it she essentially becomes blackballed in the community as promiscuous or a non-believer. That gossip spreads around fast in tight knit Muslim communities and can be embarrassing to the father. I'm not justifying the murder, just looking at the situation from a broader perspective.
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brawndolicious

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #6 on: December 12, 2007, 02:59:36 PM »
Is this response any worse than people who claim Islam had nothing whatsoever to do with this. The Qur'an does suggest that women should cover their hair and wear some sort of hair covering. It shouldn't be shocking when a chauvinistic believer reacts this way to his daughter.
the quran doesn't really say you have to wear a head scarf.  in the original arabic that it was written, chest means head in modern arabic (so it first said you just have to cover your chest).  most muslims decided keep to the more conservative definition though.  99% of muslims even in muslim countries don't really care about wearing hijab.  it's expected but those that wear it usually have it half-hanging off.

obviously we're talking about an insane person who the side of believing in his faith over anything else and murdered his daughter over it.  I doubt it was pressure from any "community" since I've never heard anybody (much less people who emigrated to a western country) say something like that.

Mupepe

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #7 on: December 12, 2007, 03:00:50 PM »
crazy people are crazy people.

they each just justify it differently.  they should all burn the same.

Flannel Boy

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #8 on: December 12, 2007, 03:09:44 PM »
Is this response any worse than people who claim Islam had nothing whatsoever to do with this. The Qur'an does suggest that women should cover their hair and wear some sort of hair covering. It shouldn't be shocking when a chauvinistic believer reacts this way to his daughter.
99% of muslims even in muslim countries don't really care about wearing hijab.  it's expected but those that wear it usually have it half-hanging off.


Do you not see how you contradicted yourself.  You can't say that 99% don't care yet then also say it is expected.


crazy people are crazy people.

they each just justify it differently.  they should all burn the same.
The thing is, there is no reason to believe he was crazy. Religion makes sane people do insane things. If he was a crazy atheist there would be no reason for him to get enraged because his daughter did not wear some sort of head-covering.

Phoenix Dark

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #9 on: December 12, 2007, 03:11:18 PM »
Atheists don't have children
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Flannel Boy

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #10 on: December 12, 2007, 03:13:10 PM »
Atheists don't have children
Because having children is about the most irrational thing an individual can do!

That and because we have little to no social skills.  :'(

Phoenix Dark

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #11 on: December 12, 2007, 03:18:03 PM »
Atheists don't have children
Because having children is about the most irrational thing an individual can do!

That and because we have little to no social skills.  :'(

Don't worry, when you're making the big philosophy bucks women will flock to you. Chicks dig Hegel  :-*
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brawndolicious

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #12 on: December 12, 2007, 03:23:02 PM »
Quote
99% of muslims even in muslim countries don't really care about wearing hijab.  it's expected but those that wear it usually have it half-hanging off.
Do you not see how you contradicted yourself.  You can't say that 99% don't care yet then also say it is expected.
99% don't care for the moral of it.  most of the time it's grudgingly followed and only for as long as necessary.  in canada or the west, you wouldn't see the average muslim girl wear a scarf outside of a mosque.  I know a lot of very "religious" muslim women who were born and raised in a muslim country and they don't wear a scarf out in public (unless in a mosque).  it's obvious this guy is on the insaner side of religion.

crazy people are crazy people.
they each just justify it differently.  they should all burn the same.
The thing is, there is no reason to believe he was crazy. Religion makes sane people do insane things. If he was a crazy atheist there would be no reason for him to get enraged because his daughter did not wear some sort of head-covering.
well the guy was waiting for a chance to snap.  if he was an atheist, it could have been triggered by his dog humping his leg instead.  he was definitely psychotic and going to murder someone.

FlameOfCallandor

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #13 on: December 12, 2007, 03:27:25 PM »

well the guy was waiting for a chance to snap.  if he was an atheist, it could have been triggered by his dog humping his leg instead.  he was definitely psychotic and going to murder someone.

Sure their would be. Are you saying that atheists never get mad enough to become enraged?

Flannel Boy

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #14 on: December 12, 2007, 03:31:24 PM »



99% don't care for the moral of it.  most of the time it's grudgingly followed and only for as long as necessary.  in canada or the west, you wouldn't see the average muslim girl wear a scarf outside of a mosque.  I know a lot of very "religious" muslim women who were born and raised in a muslim country and they don't wear a scarf out in public (unless in a mosque).  it's obvious this guy is on the insaner side of religion.


There are many young Muslims in Mississauga. Many wear some sort of head coverings, whether in the mall, the library, or at school. Many women from Muslim countries are no longer religious. Surely they wouldn't count.


well the guy was waiting for a chance to snap.  if he was an atheist, it could have been triggered by his dog humping his leg instead.  he was definitely psychotic and going to murder someone.


You have no proof of this. Without religion you have no idea what he would or would not have done.

brawndolicious

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #15 on: December 12, 2007, 03:35:38 PM »
I don't see a person becoming psychotic enough to kill somebody by reading a book.  you sound pretty picky in how you define the lifestyle of the average muslim.  many may consider themselves very religious and have totally different levels of practice.  and yes, those women who came here that don't wear hijab are religious.  pray 5 times a day, go to mosque 1-2 times a week, etc.

and foc, I don't know what you said.

FlameOfCallandor

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #16 on: December 12, 2007, 03:36:08 PM »
Im agreeing with you nintenho.

Phoenix Dark

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #17 on: December 12, 2007, 03:37:04 PM »
WHAT AN ALLIANCE
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FlameOfCallandor

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #18 on: December 12, 2007, 03:39:33 PM »
My point is that people who are atheists still find ways to get mad and angry.

brawndolicious

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #19 on: December 12, 2007, 03:40:23 PM »
Im agreeing with you nintenho.
well it's not about simply being mad.  that guy was INSANE.

Tauntaun

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #20 on: December 12, 2007, 03:40:49 PM »


this thread will not end well

:)

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #21 on: December 12, 2007, 03:43:10 PM »
me and my wife are agnostics, and we have a kid!

...


:'(
duc

Flannel Boy

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #22 on: December 12, 2007, 03:45:25 PM »
I don't see a person becoming psychotic enough to kill somebody by reading a book.  you sound pretty picky in how you define the lifestyle of the average muslim.  many may consider themselves very religious and have totally different levels of practice.  and yes, those women who came here that don't wear hijab are religious.  pray 5 times a day, go to mosque 1-2 times a week, etc.

You can't reduce religion to books. There is tradition, practice, diet,  interpretation, and cultural influences. And anyway, books have influenced man since they were invented. Often in ways the authors never intended.

I never used the term 'average Muslim'.

I'm sure there are many religious Muslim women who don't wear hijabs. Have I claimed otherwise? Muslim women who wear head-covering just happen to be pretty common in Mississauga.

My point is that people who are atheists still find ways to get mad and angry.
And... thus gold standard.

Yes Atheists get mad. But not because their daughters are not wearing what they interpret to be mandatory dress according to a holy book.

me and my wife are agnostics, and we have a kid!

...


:'(
Just one. If you were full blown atheists you would have gotten a cat name Bertrand.

Phoenix Dark

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #23 on: December 12, 2007, 03:49:31 PM »
me and my wife are agnostics, and we have a kid!

...


:'(

Ah, the bisexuals of the religious community. Your daughter's gonna be a raging fundie
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Flannel Boy

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #24 on: December 12, 2007, 03:51:58 PM »

Malek: Why do I always get the impression that you're suggesting only religion causes people to commit crimes?

Find the quote where I say anything remotely resembling this. This is a dumb strawman.

Himu

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #25 on: December 12, 2007, 03:55:09 PM »
Why are middle eastern women so beautiful? When I saw her pic, I was like,"Damn she was hot." and then I read the article and it said she was 16......................
IYKYK

Phoenix Dark

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #26 on: December 12, 2007, 03:59:30 PM »

Malek: Why do I always get the impression that you're suggesting only religion causes people to commit crimes?

Find the quote where I say anything remotely resembling this. This is a dumb strawman.


Why do you hate religious people as well as America?

But on a serious note, I do constantly get this hint that many seem to think "only" religion causes its followers to carry out extreme acts of violence or stupidity
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brawndolicious

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #27 on: December 12, 2007, 03:59:51 PM »
I was just thinking you were misinterpreting the importance of a hijab in islam.

Mupepe

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #28 on: December 12, 2007, 04:07:46 PM »

crazy people are crazy people.

they each just justify it differently.  they should all burn the same.
The thing is, there is no reason to believe he was crazy. Religion makes sane people do insane things. If he was a crazy atheist there would be no reason for him to get enraged because his daughter did not wear some sort of head-covering.
Sorry.  Any sane person would have said "This is my daughter and I don't think she's worth killing over a difference in belief."  The guy was insane to believe that deeply in something in the first place.

Flannel Boy

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #29 on: December 12, 2007, 04:30:35 PM »
This kind of crime can only be committed by a believer. A believer who thinks that his god would be displeased by his daughter's actions and that he must take action if he is to remain in the good graces of the imaginary tyrant in the sky.

Mupepe

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #30 on: December 12, 2007, 04:34:47 PM »
Regardless of what kind of crime he committed, you don't think there was something fundamentally wrong with him to believe in this imaginary tyrant so strongly?  I see such a strong belief as more of a symptom of a much larger problem with him.


Flannel Boy

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #31 on: December 12, 2007, 04:36:13 PM »
Regardless of what kind of crime he committed, you don't think there was something fundamentally wrong with him to believe in this imaginary tyrant so strongly?  I see such a strong belief as more of a symptom of a much larger problem with him.


Since so many people have such a strong belief in God (though obviously they don't react the same way as this man) such a belief can not in itself be a symptom of insanity.

Mupepe

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #32 on: December 12, 2007, 04:41:30 PM »
ok, so you brought up his reaction.  You don't think there's a fine difference in the people who can simply believe in a God and embrace the values of the religion while not finding it suitable to murder people over it and those who do (edit: unclear, so i meant those who find it suitable to murder people over it)?

« Last Edit: December 12, 2007, 04:43:41 PM by Mupepe »

Himu

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #33 on: December 12, 2007, 04:44:11 PM »
Sometimes atheists and agnostics are more crazy than the religious fanatics.
IYKYK

Flannel Boy

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #34 on: December 12, 2007, 04:46:42 PM »
ok, so you brought up his reaction.  You don't think there's a fine difference in the people who can simply believe in a God and embrace the values of the religion while not finding it suitable to murder people over it and those who do?

Really, all I have claimed is that religion is necessary for this type of crime. I never said it was sufficient. You need someone with certain behavioral characteristics to act out like he did. However that does not mean he was insane.



Sometimes atheists and agnostics are more crazy than the religious fanatics.
Right, because?

Mupepe

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #35 on: December 12, 2007, 06:18:54 PM »
ok, so you brought up his reaction.  You don't think there's a fine difference in the people who can simply believe in a God and embrace the values of the religion while not finding it suitable to murder people over it and those who do?

Really, all I have claimed is that religion is necessary for this type of crime. I never said it was sufficient. You need someone with certain behavioral characteristics to act out like he did. However that does not mean he was insane.

ok not insane by medical standards.  but in all reason, you have to be looney tunes to pull that shit. 

and i understand that religion is a cause of this specific type of crime, but it doesn't mean it should be wholly accountable.  It's not like some religious testament said verbatim "if she doesn't want to wear that shit, trap her ass in a bear trap and leave that motherfucker swinging so high, nobody finds him for days."

FlameOfCallandor

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #36 on: December 12, 2007, 06:20:00 PM »
Sometimes atheists and agnostics are more crazy than the religious fanatics.

Amen.

Flannel Boy

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #37 on: December 12, 2007, 06:32:28 PM »
Sometimes atheists and agnostics are more crazy than the religious fanatics.

Amen.
Please point to my craziness. Was it the time I burned the witch? Talked to my invisible friend? Killed my daughter? Lived in a cave to commune with the universe? Shaved my head and sold all my belongings?

FlameOfCallandor

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #38 on: December 12, 2007, 06:35:27 PM »
Sometimes atheists and agnostics are more crazy than the religious fanatics.

Amen.
Please point to my craziness. Was it the time I burned the witch? Talked to my invisible friend? Killed my daughter? Lived in a cave to commune with the universe? Shaved my head and sold all my belongings?

Are we talking to you?

FlameOfCallandor

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #39 on: December 12, 2007, 06:35:40 PM »
*about you

The Fake Shemp

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #40 on: December 12, 2007, 06:36:42 PM »
Malek is defensive, because his cult of NyQuil has come under scrutiny from the community and the government.  I doubt it'll be recognized by the IRS and he'll be forced to pay taxes.  Nice job, L. Malek Hubbard!
PSP

FlameOfCallandor

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #41 on: December 12, 2007, 06:37:45 PM »
Willco, would you join scientology if it would guarantee success as a screenwriter?

The Fake Shemp

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #42 on: December 12, 2007, 06:38:50 PM »
No, and I've had that opportunity.

I am turning down a chance to submit a script that would no doubt be filmed this summer, without question, just because I don't want to deal with all the implications and hassles of dealing with Scientologists.
PSP

FlameOfCallandor

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #43 on: December 12, 2007, 06:39:13 PM »
No, and I've had that opportunity.
Really? What happened?

The Fake Shemp

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #44 on: December 12, 2007, 06:41:26 PM »
Basically, a gaggle of Xenu-hating Scientologists were going to film something... anything... and wanted a script.  I was tapped by someone from their social circle to write something, and I turned the offer down.  I'd rather wallow in retail hell as I peddle scripts unsuccessfully then be caught up in Scientology, and deal with the implications and hassles that such an association comes with.
PSP

Shuri

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #45 on: December 12, 2007, 06:41:57 PM »
This story is fucking sickening. This guy will be dealt with in prison.

FlameOfCallandor

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #46 on: December 12, 2007, 06:43:59 PM »
Basically, a gaggle of Xenu-hating Scientologists were going to film something... anything... and wanted a script.  I was tapped by someone from their social circle to write something, and I turned the offer down.  I'd rather wallow in retail hell as I peddle scripts unsuccessfully then be caught up in Scientology, and deal with the implications and hassles that such an association comes with.

COuld you pretend to join scientology just to get the job and then drop out later?

The Fake Shemp

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #47 on: December 12, 2007, 06:46:36 PM »
Scientology really doesn't work like that.  You can't really fake it.  I had one friend that thought kind of like you do and now has a ton of Scientology literature in his house, attends meetings at their church, has been audited, etc.  He thoroughly attests there is some credibility to their teachings now, even though he maintains he is not a full-fledged Scientologist.  But his change in attitude and personality is evident, and he would've laughed in our faces if we said the same to him a few years ago.
PSP

FlameOfCallandor

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Re: Father kills his daughter for refusing to wear hijab.
« Reply #48 on: December 12, 2007, 06:47:44 PM »
Oh Shit! Sucks to be that guy.

Well you made the right decision, although I might not have been as strong.