What are the movies you're going make sure your children watch?

[Ichirou]

I hate Natural Born Killers.

[TVC15]

I hate Natural Born Killers.

It's love/hate for me.  I love its visuals, but so much of the content is muddled beyond reason, and some of it is flat out distinguished mentally-challenged. 

I kind of like fractured films like that because I like trying to figure out what Stone was getting at.  He had a very obvious message about the media, but he clearly intended to say much more.  He was apparently doing a lot of drugs at the time.  I appreciate the Leonard Cohen, too.

Woody is great in it, too. I'm give or take on the other performances, but Woody was great casting.  He's a great actor in pretty much everything he's in, although he doesn't show a ton of range.

Scarface, this is like a 90 minute movie dragged to three hours.  You can't do the epic crime rise and fall thing when the characters have the depth of a piece of cardboard.

[Ichirou]

Have you seen the original b&w one?

[TVC15]

Have you seen the original b&w one?

Scarface?  No.  I don't know a lot about it outside of what I learned in The Aviator :p  I figured the only real connection was that both films were really violent for their time.

Fuck, I am going to have to do an Oliver Stone blog post.  Or three.  That nicca needs defending in this brutal day and age.

[Ichirou]

No, the structures and characters of both movies are basically identical, except for the change in time and place.  So, when you say that it's a B-movie that's been stretched out to epic length, you're more right than you know.

[TVC15]

No, the structures and characters of both movies are basically identical, except for the change in time and place.  So, when you say that it's a B-movie that's been stretched out to epic length, you're more right than you know.

And looksie!  The original is only 93 minutes long!

I am guessing this got bloated to huge proportions due to the Pacino/Godfather connection.

I still want to know how Moroder fits into this pie.

Is the original worth tracking down?

[Ichirou]

It's not my favorite gangster movie (it's a little too primitive, like Little Caesar and Public Enemy; The Roaring Twenties is MUCH better), but it's a pretty good film.  Way better than the '80s version, IMO.  First Paul Muni movie I ever saw.  It's weird that he used to be a big star, his acting's so hammy and over-the-top, even when compared to his contemporaries.

[Himu]

i don't know. i'm probably just a scarface fanboy but everytime i watch it, time flies by and it feels like an hour

[TVC15]

It's not my favorite gangster movie (it's a little too primitive, like Little Caesar and Public Enemy; The Roaring Twenties is MUCH better), but it's a pretty good film.  Way better than the '80s version, IMO.  First Paul Muni movie I ever saw.  It's weird that he used to be a big star, his acting's so hammy and over-the-top, even when compared to his contemporaries.

You see, I like old school movie acting.  Probably the art cigarillo in me.  That acting only really works when everyone is doing it though, and I doubt anyone could make it work today.  It's kind of a shame.  Acting has generally shifted towards realism, not just in dramas, but in most types of live-action movies.  There's room for all sorts of acting in cinema, but nobody ever explores that range anymore

i don't know. i'm probably just a scarface fanboy but everytime i watch it, time flies by and it feels like an hour

Dude you are on the reefer.  You probably fall asleep during it.  Here's a hint:  the movie doesn't end at the chainsaw scene.  It goes on for like 7 more hours.

[Ichirou]

hahahah Himuro is a drug addict

Also, TVC, the DVD for the old version of Scarface is really cheap, I think. Eight bucks, maybe?  Perhaps even less depending on where you buy it.

[Himu]

no, it's fun! and the part where that guy screws them over and gets his helicoptor blown up omg

[Ichirou]

The bit with the chainsaw IS the best part, tho.  That and the MOUNTAIN OF COKE on Tony's desk at the end.

[TVC15]

The bit with the chainsaw IS the best part, tho.  That and the MOUNTAIN OF COKE on Tony's desk at the end.

I don't get this.  What's so good about the chainsaw scene?  It's not especially gory or anything.  Dexter blows it out of the water.  You don't even see the saw going into flesh at any point.

Also, why is the Scarface such a cockface to Salieri?

[brawndolicious]

do you people understand the sarcasm in the uncle tom comment?  it was very transparent.

Wait are you saying that the mafia as depicted by The Sopranos, The Godfather, and those terrible Gotti family reality shows isn't real in its depiction of honor?  These terrible and vicious men that put merit in family date back to the mid-19th century, and you can date them back to the Renaissance if you don't restrict yourself to one mafia with origins in Italy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_of_Borgia

I just hated how the movie insisted upon itself.  It just didn't have much of a story, although the acting was pretty good.  If you're a baby boomer, I can understand why you would call it your favorite crime movie of all time because you were hyped to jack off on it.  If you were born after it came out, then one viewing is all you need in your lifetime.  I don't get why any young person would give a fuck about the movie.

Scarface is shit really too but at least it's not as boring.

[Himu]

The bit with the chainsaw IS the best part, tho.  That and the MOUNTAIN OF COKE on Tony's desk at the end.

I don't get this.  What's so good about the chainsaw scene?  It's not especially gory or anything.  Dexter blows it out of the water.  You don't even see the saw going into flesh at any point.

Also, why is the Scarface such a cockface to Salieri?

Because she's a bitch!

As i said on msn I think the scene was just generally shocking, since you didn't expect it the first time around

[TVC15]

do you people understand the sarcasm in the uncle tom comment?  it was very transparent.

Wait are you saying that the mafia as depicted by The Sopranos, The Godfather, and those terrible Gotti family reality shows isn't real in its depiction of honor?  These terrible and vicious men that put merit in family date back to the mid-19th century, and you can date them back to the Renaissance if you don't restrict yourself to one mafia with origins in Italy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_of_Borgia

I just hated how the movie insisted upon itself.  It just didn't have much of a story, although the acting was pretty good.  If you're a baby boomer, I can understand why you would call it your favorite crime movie of all time because you were hyped to jack off on it.  If you were born after it came out, then one viewing is all you need in your lifetime.  I don't get why any young person would give a fuck about the movie.

Scarface is shit really too but at least it's not as boring.

1) There's more to a movie than the story
2) The Godfather is a by-the-numbers mafia flick, but it invented the numbers
3) The acting perfectly fits the tone of the movie set by the visuals, the time period, and the score
4) That score is fuck all amazing
5) Its visuals are often copied, but very rarely matched

The first two Godfather flicks are films in every regard.  Maybe the story is a bit plain to you today, but look at the total packages.  They don't make them like this anymore.

I'm not a huge Godfather defender.  They would likely not even rank on a serious top 10 list, but to deny that they are of extremely high quality when ranked along with the apex of American cinema is to be as ridiculous as a holocaust denier.  I don't think Coppola is especially talented, either that or he is talented and unlucky, but he earned his reputation with those two films alone.

[Phoenix Dark]

The first Godfather is a perfect film imo; it's my third favorite film. It's also a film you have to watch in context to a certain degree. Dismissing it as another "by the numbers mob flick" is stupid because as TVC said, it's the original. This is like dismissing Straight Outta Compton as another "by the numbers gangsta rap album" - no, it's the original, and the innovator. IE, it's not the first of its kind, but it's the first defining achievement of the genre.

When I watch it I'm awed by how perfect everything is, without being stylistic or particularly show-y. The acting is amazing; every performance is top notch, even minor supportive roles. The score is classic. Many scenes are simply amazing - to me, the baptism scene towards the end stands out most. It's not a particularly heavy film in terms of content, but that doesn't mean it's simple. These are layered characters, some more complex than others. And then there's Michael.

[Powerslave]

sometimes I think the godfather and goodfellas are more overrated than Scarface, when we're excluding the obvious gangsta-culture who praises it.

[bud]

scarface is not overrated at all--it's seen as a pretty bad movie.

[Powerslave]

Because Die Hard is such a better movie 

[bud]

i don't see how it isn't.

[Powerslave]

I don't see how Scarface isn't a better movie than Die Hard.
Phew, these types of arguments sure are easy!

[Flannel Boy]

Die Hard is a fun action movie while Scarface is crime drama. They're evaluated by different standards. As a drama, Die Hard isn't very good either. As an action movie it is great. Scarface is only good for camp value.

[brawndolicious]

1) There's more to a movie than the story
2) The Godfather is a by-the-numbers mafia flick, but it invented the numbers
3) The acting perfectly fits the tone of the movie set by the visuals, the time period, and the score
4) That score is fuck all amazing
5) Its visuals are often copied, but very rarely matched
The first two Godfather flicks are films in every regard.  Maybe the story is a bit plain to you today, but look at the total packages.  They don't make them like this anymore.
I'm not a huge Godfather defender.  They would likely not even rank on a serious top 10 list, but to deny that they are of extremely high quality when ranked along with the apex of American cinema is to be as ridiculous as a holocaust denier.  I don't think Coppola is especially talented, either that or he is talented and unlucky, but he earned his reputation with those two films alone.

I realize that it's a significant movie but I don't expect somebody praising the movie today to actually be talking about all of that (especially with the way PD worded how the people he met on the street would not "get" the movie).  While it's an important movie, it's simply not some good.  The directing and acting were as perfect as possible.  But the movie's story was trash.

[Himu]

So TVC do I get to keep the dvd?