Nothing is more boring than Twilight Princess

[Howard Alan Treesong]

I am starting this thread here instead of GAF because I would like to actually have some discussion.

Twilight Princess looks utterly boring to me. People are spazzing over the intro over on GAF, and it's just the OOT intro in higher resolution (but with no better ground textures). Seeing Link ride around on a horse is not the most amazing thing I've ever seen. All the intro looks like to me is a poor-man's Shadow of the Colossus--a less interesting boy, less interesting horse, and way less interesting environments.

I was never that excited about the game to begin with, but I'm even less excited now that it's moved over to the Wii. I feel like the Wii controls are going to be extremely detrimental to the gameplay experience. And I really don't like the art style, either--it just looks boring. Lord of the Rings was "serious," but there was a lot of clever production design that went into every elements of its world and style. Zelda just looks blasé.

I love RPGs and adventure games, but can't get excited about Zelda. It just looks boring, unengaging, and like more or the same. I'm more excited about Gears of War, for fuck's sake, and I've never been a huge shooter fan. I loved Okami, I'm loving FFXII right now, I liked Oblivion and I hope to check out Neverwinter Nights 2. Zelda is not even on my radar.

I have two questions, really; first, why, as a gamer whose first game ever was literally Zelda 1 for NES, have I fallen off the bandwagon so far? I still like the 2D Zeldas--Minish Cap was great, if simple--but the 3D ones never really clicked. The only one I would consider "Zelda"-worthy is Majora's Mask, which is usually perceived as the black sheep of the family.

The second is: why do gamers spaz over Zelda SO HARD? I notice this with some coworkers at my company; they play a new Zelda game every 3-4 years and basically are unaware of the existence of action RPGs or even console RPGs in the interim. What's the big deal? What does Zelda do that other franchises don't do better all the goddamned time?

Anyway. Zelda gets a big ol' rolleyes from me.

[MrAngryFace]

Honestly dude, my favorite Zelda experiences were on the GBC and GBA. I couldnt care less about the 3D ones. The only 3D one I sorta liked I only liked until I was given this freakin boat to waste time on.

Unfortunately even if the game isnt that great it will get A's and fans will make allowances for its faults just like Final Fantasy XII so I dont even know why I am making this post.

[TVC15]

The overworld looks so barren in the intro.  That reminds me of OOT, but for all the wrong reasons.

[cubicle47b]

Wait, you liked Wind Waker up until the point you got the boat?  The only real gameplay before that is the island break-in which sucks.

[MrAngryFace]

No I fought the fire island boss, but im talking about fishin for the triforce.

[Thee Reverend Gary Davis]

No I fought the fire island boss, but im talking about fishin for the triforce.

oh yeah...

[cubicle47b]

Ah, okay.  The dungeon designs are what keep me playing Zelda games so I was wondering what the appeal would have been.

[TVC15]

Also, I think Nintendo's Zelda games typically have well-designed dungeons, and the production values are always good stuff.  I really enjoyed Wind Waker (minus the stealth bit) until heavy travel was required (I think the game lost me after the Hyrule castle awesome bit).  Wind Waker's graphics are better than TP.  At least WW used a style that masked technical flaws.  I look at TP and all I see are VERY last gen textures, barren fields, and poly-starved models.

Disappointment in the visuals aside, I am interested in the game if only for the dungeons.  As MAF pointed out, you can't really trust reviews for Zelda games, so it's really something I have to play for myself before writing off completely.

[MrAngryFace]

I LOVED the fire dungeon thing, then I stopped loving the game as I drifted on the boat in the rain

[ToxicAdam]

I'm alot like your friends SP. I play every iteration of Zelda, and its my favorite series of all time. I loved them all except for the abhorrent Zelda 2 NES.


I think the game loses something in 3D form, but it's still a great game. Certainly the best games you can buy on a Nintendo.



--- ---

Although I enjoy games like Dark Cloud 2. Zelda games have always had a level of polish and gameplay mechanics that are untouched. That's the difference to me.

[cubicle47b]

Has there been a Nintendo made Zelda game where the dungeon designs were truly disappointing?  The Wind Waker dungeons were probably the easiest in the series but even then they were well designed and a lot of fun.

[Christopher]

Zelda: WW was so boring to me...it was so color by the numbers Zelda, nothing different nothing innovate lol kiddie graphics is so cool.  No it just didn't "do" anything new for me.

[Himu]

I loved Wind Waker and I think Twilight Princess looks absolutely amazing. GOTY for sure!

[TVC15]

I just saw this at GAF and it's pretty much the gayest thing I've ever read:

Just think how _____ the final boss fight will be

I left a blank because there are no words that can fill it: epic... no, awesome... no too weak, jaw-dropping... nope, outstanding.... no

After all these trailers of the game with it's unbelivably beautiful graphics, heart-wrenching soudntrack and gameplay.

Just think of the effort Nintendo would put into the final battle, the culmination, the conclusion of the game.

It gives me chills.

[MrAngryFace]

god I hate fanboys

I dont like FFXII, but ill give credit where credit is due, I still bought it!

[Howard Alan Treesong]

I agree that WW looks better than TP, but that's more of a fact than an opinion.

I really like the Zelda dungeons--a lot--but the overworld stuff has gotten increasingly interminable and no better done. Maybe that's why the original games work better for me--it's like a 70/30 split in favor of the dungeons, instead of a 20/80 split in favor of the overworld like it seems these days.

That may also be why the 2D games work better for me than the 3D ones; the process of "solving" a dungeon is more immediate and rewarding with zippy 2D sprites than with big clunky 3D Link "realistically" slogging his way across so many virtual hectacres.

[MrAngryFace]

well I think..like say Pokemon Mystery Dungeon, designing the game for both an older console and a newer console had an effect on the graphic ambitions of the game in general.

Additionally the games development began on the GC right?

[The Fake Shemp]

I just saw this at GAF and it's pretty much the gayest thing I've ever read:

Just think how _____ the final boss fight will be

I left a blank because there are no words that can fill it: epic... no, awesome... no too weak, jaw-dropping... nope, outstanding.... no

After all these trailers of the game with it's unbelivably beautiful graphics, heart-wrenching soudntrack and gameplay.

Just think of the effort Nintendo would put into the final battle, the culmination, the conclusion of the game.

It gives me chills.

 

[Cheebs]

Honestly dude, my favorite Zelda experiences were on the GBC and GBA. I couldnt care less about the 3D ones.

Best statement ever. Link's Awakening and LttP(ON GBA!) are the best Zelda's. OOT was over-rated.

[Christopher]

will you ban me if I say something whiteman?

[Howard Alan Treesong]

Honestly dude, my favorite Zelda experiences were on the GBC and GBA. I couldnt care less about the 3D ones.

Best statement ever. Link's Awakening and LttP(ON GBA!) are the best Zelda's. OOT was over-rated.

Link's Awakening is my favorite, too. Ages/Seasons/Minish Cap are all kind of tied for a close second.

[The Fake Shemp]

OoT > Minish Cap > LttP > Ages/Season > WW > Awakening > Majora's Mask > those 3DO ones > everything else

[Howard Alan Treesong]

OoT > Minish Cap > LttP > Ages/Season > WW > Awakening > Majora's Mask > those 3DO ones > everything else

Awakening > Ages/Seasons > Minish Cap > Majora's Mask > LttP > OoT > WW > probably Twilight Princess lol

Zelda 2 lies outside continuity.

[The Fake Shemp]

I'm sorry sir, I do not agree with your rankings and wish to challenge you to a gentlemen's duel.

[Thee Reverend Gary Davis]

OoT > Minish Cap > LttP > Ages/Season > WW > Awakening > Majora's Mask > those 3DO ones > everything else

God you are gay.

[Christopher]

MY RANKINGS LOLZ

Basing these all on the time they were played, not on how they would be ranked now.

Zelda A Link to the past > OoT > MM > The Legend of Zelda > Zelda DX > OoA > OoS > The Minish Cap > Links Adventure > The Wind Waker

I'm sorry the Wind Waker was the most boring Zelda ever, the story was non existant, and the characters lacked life...it was just all so color by the numbers...

[Himu]

You say the story non existent when it's perhaps the most story based Zelda yet. 

[The Fake Shemp]

Yeah, really.  Wind Waker had a lot more story than any of its console predecessors.  I would say it lacked that charm that made Ocarina of Time so unique, but also we must put that game in context.  At the time, it was awesome - in almost all design elements and gameplay mechanics.

[Thee Reverend Gary Davis]

majora's mask is still my favourite by a country mile.

[Christopher]

Maybe it lacked charm that's the reason I didn't like it, but I literally found it a chore to finish it...really I thought OoT had more of a story *shrugs*

[brawndolicious]

Ignoring nostalgia, Wind Waker is the best 3D Zelda in terms of dungeon design especially compared to all the back-tracking in OoT and the smooth framerate was a huge bonus.  The controls were also the best out of all of the 3D ones.  I don't know why anybody would care about characters or story in a completely new type of Zelda but meh (it was a good story to me but it didn't have any twists really).

For the first white person who complained about this game, it's hyped because it's the only realistic Zelda game of that generation (technically it's also on Wii), but they still didn't show anything really and I guess that's the reason it's getting hyped on gaming forums as well?

[The Fake Shemp]

I really liked Wind Waker, but it definitely felt like familiar territory with a new face and not the epic game that Ocarina of Time was.  I mean, everyone was playing Ocarina of Time.

[Himu]

That is why I can't wait to play TP.

It will be like OoT in a different way. With OoT, it was amazing seeing Zelda in 3d for the first time, which is why it was so damn amazing (aside from the awesome concept). It felt like Zelda recreated. With TP Wii, I am sure it'll be the same way, but with the controls.

Oh my God I can't wait!

[The Fake Shemp]

With TP Wii, I am sure it'll be the same way, but with the controls.

Yeeeeaaahhhhh, probably not.

[Christopher]

that's why I haven't looked up a single media thing on TP except on Opa ages where they had the field song, but I forgot it now...it's better to know nothing.

[Himu]

I have two questions, really; first, why, as a gamer whose first game ever was literally Zelda 1 for NES, have I fallen off the bandwagon so far? I still like the 2D Zeldas--Minish Cap was great, if simple--but the 3D ones never really clicked. The only one I would consider "Zelda"-worthy is Majora's Mask, which is usually perceived as the black sheep of the family.

The second is: why do gamers spaz over Zelda SO HARD? I notice this with some coworkers at my company; they play a new Zelda game every 3-4 years and basically are unaware of the existence of action RPGs or even console RPGs in the interim. What's the big deal? What does Zelda do that other franchises don't do better all the goddamned time?

1. I don't know. Zelda 1 was the first game I ever beat, and the series is special to me. I think that in the transition to 3d, it just never really clicked with you, like you said.  Perhaps 3d Zelda just ain't your thing? And even if the other 3d ones aren't "Zelda worthy" as you call it, do you consider them to be bad games? Even if you prefer the games in 2d, the core Zelda concepts or design haven't changed at all in 3d. So I don't understand what you mean by OoT, WW not being Zelda worthy, while MM is..when MM had the weakest dungeons in the series (imo). 

2. Because Zelda is one of the biggest innovators in the game. I love rpgs of all types and I'm jizzing over TP. Zelda isn't even an rpg, so I don't get that comparison. Zelda games have a level of polish and adventure that is really hard to top, for me, atleast. Ultimately, it comes down to: what exactly is Zelda to you? Do you like the sense of adventure, are you more of a dungeon guy? Do you like the side stuff and just kinda dawdle? What is it? Even though I think that 2d Zelda clicks with me more, I still highly respect and love 3d Zelda titles for what they are.

[TVC15]

I really liked Wind Waker, but it definitely felt like familiar territory with a new face and not the epic game that Ocarina of Time was.  I mean, everyone was playing Ocarina of Time.

I don't like OoT.  I enjoyed Brave Fencer Musashi much more, which came out at the same time.

[The Fake Shemp]

That's because you're a queef.

[Oblivion]

I like Zelda games because dungeons are very well done, and tons of sidequests to do, and exploring is fricken fun.


Not really sure what you want to expect from a 3D Zelda. You say you like MM, but it had only 4 dungeons, and everything else was a sidequest. Granted it was fun, but OoT seemed like the better game to me because of the sense of balance. Also, MM and WW to a lesser extent never had that epic feeling that I got with OoT.

As for graphics/style. Well, dunno what to tell you. Yeah, there might be a few bad textures here and there, but this is a HUGE fucking game, and considering it looks like it does, I'm quite impressed with what they've accomplished. Not to mention amazing lighting effects, among the best I've seen from last gen. And the Twilight Realm fucking rocks imo.
And although Link's hair needs a bit of work, I think he looks infinitely better than that mutant from WW.

So other than that, I dunno, dude. If you didn't like OoT, I doubt you'd like TP. Maybe 3D Zeldas just aren't your thing, I guess. Then again, this could be just a "I'm gonna hate on a highly anticipated game to show I'm gangsta" post, or maybe not. But I'll leave it at that.

[TVC15]

That's because you're a queef.

I generally don't like game with shitty framerates, so OoT was pretty much a failure to me.

[The Fake Shemp]

I generally don't like game with shitty framerates, so OoT was pretty much a failure to me.

Did you put yourself in a time capsule during the PSX/N64 era then?

[Oblivion]

Also, post this thread on GAF plz.


Edit: and who are you on GAF?

[TVC15]

I generally don't like game with shitty framerates, so OoT was pretty much a failure to me.

Did you put yourself in a time capsule during the PSX/N64 era then?

I wasn't super hot on the PSX-era, but there were plenty of games with acceptable framerates.

[Oblivion]

I'm afraid to read this thread on the grounds that there might be spoilers, are there spoilers in here? 

Nah, you're cool.

[etiolate]

Zelda games set standards for control in the genre, dungeon/level design and puzzle solving with about every release. A lot of people nowadays don't care about those things, but I do. Comparing it to a blander SoTC is ridiculous when you consider how absolutely empty SoTC is.

I think I liked Wind Waker more than OoT. I play adventure games to adventure, and so the sailing and exploring was fun to me. I can go back to WW very easily, but I never finished Master's Quest of OoT for some reason.

I also don't find Zelda games overrated in the Final Fantasy sense, I think they face the Nintendo curve, which is a totally different bizarro rating thing. It's either going to be rated 12 out of 10 or 6-7 out of 10.

[Shuri]

Zelda is such a by the number franchise now. It also has a very localise fanbase, extreme nintendo fans who only own nintendo consoles.

[Oblivion]

It also has a very localise fanbase, extreme nintendo fans who only own nintendo consoles.

Oh, dear...

[CajoleJuice]

The only 2D Zelda I've played is A Link to the Past. It was alright.

OOT > Wind Waker > Majora's Mask > ALTTP

I started with OOT. 

[ToxicAdam]

Shuri:

I don't understand how you can call the 3D Zelda's "by the numbers". Each iteration has been radically different than the others.

There are some similar gameplay mechanics and enemies ... but overall each one is very unique.

[Christopher]

The only 2D Zelda I've played is A Link to the Past. It was alright.

OOT > Wind Waker > Majora's Mask > ALTTP

I started with OOT. 

Zelda was more of a "had to be there at the time" game.  I remember how huge AlTTP was being 8 and all...

[Phoenix Dark]

The only 2D Zelda I've played is A Link to the Past. It was alright.

OOT > Wind Waker > Majora's Mask > ALTTP

I started with OOT. 

WTF

You never played Link's Awakening either? 

























I only played a bit of LTTP; I'm ashamed. I'm going to pick it up for GBA

[brawndolicious]

Apparantly the major difference between the Wii and the GC version is that all the dungeons are backwards (left turns are right turns and vice versa) because Link is right-handed in the Wii version because of the controller and left-handed like he's always been in the GC version...

[Phoenix Dark]

The biggest difference is the lack of 16:9 in the GC version, which is utter bullshit. Thanks alot Nintendo

[CajoleJuice]

The only 2D Zelda I've played is A Link to the Past. It was alright.

OOT > Wind Waker > Majora's Mask > ALTTP

I started with OOT. 

Zelda was more of a "had to be there at the time" game.  I remember how huge AlTTP was being 8 and all...

Yea, that's the deal with a lot of games. But I think it's more to do with me playing OOT, a 3D Zelda, first. I just can't go back to 2D Zeldas. I played Super Metroid way after it came out and it still rocked my socks, but I played it before Metroid Prime.

[Himu]

Zelda is such a by the number franchise now. It also has a very localise fanbase, extreme nintendo fans who only own nintendo consoles.

lol

I think it's the opposite. I see more non-Nintendo fanatics being hardcore Zelda fans than the other way around. I'm not a hardcore Nintendo fan and I'm buying a Wii FOR Zelda.

[Polari]

I am starting this thread here instead of GAF because I would like to actually have some discussion.

Twilight Princess looks utterly boring to me. People are spazzing over the intro over on GAF, and it's just the OOT intro in higher resolution (but with no better ground textures). Seeing Link ride around on a horse is not the most amazing thing I've ever seen. All the intro looks like to me is a poor-man's Shadow of the Colossus--a less interesting boy, less interesting horse, and way less interesting environments.

I was never that excited about the game to begin with, but I'm even less excited now that it's moved over to the Wii. I feel like the Wii controls are going to be extremely detrimental to the gameplay experience. And I really don't like the art style, either--it just looks boring. Lord of the Rings was "serious," but there was a lot of clever production design that went into every elements of its world and style. Zelda just looks blasé.

I love RPGs and adventure games, but can't get excited about Zelda. It just looks boring, unengaging, and like more or the same. I'm more excited about Gears of War, for fuck's sake, and I've never been a huge shooter fan. I loved Okami, I'm loving FFXII right now, I liked Oblivion and I hope to check out Neverwinter Nights 2. Zelda is not even on my radar.

I have two questions, really; first, why, as a gamer whose first game ever was literally Zelda 1 for NES, have I fallen off the bandwagon so far? I still like the 2D Zeldas--Minish Cap was great, if simple--but the 3D ones never really clicked. The only one I would consider "Zelda"-worthy is Majora's Mask, which is usually perceived as the black sheep of the family.

The second is: why do gamers spaz over Zelda SO HARD? I notice this with some coworkers at my company; they play a new Zelda game every 3-4 years and basically are unaware of the existence of action RPGs or even console RPGs in the interim. What's the big deal? What does Zelda do that other franchises don't do better all the goddamned time?

Anyway. Zelda gets a big ol' rolleyes from me.

[Himu]

I am sorry but anyone who finds this or this boring, obviously has a broken FUN or AWESOME meter. Possibly both.

[Phoenix Dark]

I'm reading the impressions and watching the 1UP Show

Game looks amazing. I might just buy a Wii in Jan. and hold off on the 360

[Himu]

What impressions? Is embargo up?

[Vizzys]

I agree with the OP on this one, I for one don't care about a new Zelda.