Author Topic: Malek's Log (Read 50901 times)

Madrun Badrun · « **Reply #120 on:** March 25, 2009, 11:53:33 PM »

Malek help me out here

Locke “The particular ideas received from particular objects become general, which is done by considering them separate from all other existences, and circumstances of real existence, as time, place, or any other concomitant ideas”

I'm trying to say that bolded "and" is not a logical and but a rewording of what came before. I want to say there is a ambiguity in the grammar but is there?

fucking Locke and his HORRIBLE definitions.

edit: I could say that considering them separate from any other concomitant ideas = considering them separate from all other existences
we'll call that P. we'll call circumstances of real existence, as time, place, q. so what he is saying is P and (q or P). This means of course that the and (q or P) is totally pointless. That makes sense right?

recursivelyenumerable · « **Reply #121 on:** March 26, 2009, 12:24:35 AM »

I think you need to prove that P first

Madrun Badrun · « **Reply #122 on:** March 26, 2009, 12:30:17 AM »

what the fuck is that?

recursivelyenumerable · « **Reply #123 on:** March 26, 2009, 12:38:31 AM »

http://consc.net/misc/moreproofs.html
http://consc.net/neh/proofs.html

Madrun Badrun · « **Reply #124 on:** March 26, 2009, 12:52:49 AM »

Locke defines abstraction as such.
“The particular ideas received from particular objects become general, which is done by considering them separate from all other existences, and circumstances of real existence, as time, place, or any other concomitant ideas” P.293.
This is a sloppy definition and suffers from an ambiguity. I do not think that Locke meant the bolded “and” to be a logical and but rather he meant to use it to introduce a rewording of what came before it. If we broke down the sentence into its logical structure we see three sentences ‘considering them separate from all other existences’ which I will denote with a P, ‘considering them separate from all other circumstances of real existence’, Q, and ‘considering them separate from any other concomitant ideas’, R. That is to say (P ∧ (Q ∨ R)). Now P is very similar to R. To say ‘any other concomitant ideas’ means all other ideas with related existences, and wether or not you are considering an idea apart from all other existences or all related existances does not matter as you are still considering the idea completely alone. So now we can see that P and R are not just similar but are exactly the same. Then this means that Locke is saying is (P ∧ (Q ∨ P)). But this is going to be true regardless the truth of Q. It is just P and everything else after the ‘and’ is pointless. I can see no reason as to why Locke would include this unless he thought he was just reclaiming the previous statement. This creates a problem because P is not equal to Q. Locke has defined abstract ideas in two distinct ways. One is saying that abstract ideas are ideas considered separate from all other ideas and the other that abstract ideas are ideas considered separate from all other circumstances of real existence. These look very similar but the former, as Berkeley argues leads absurdities while the other is perfectly sound.

Look good?

edit: I have to take the bolded 'all's out for my argument to work. Can I do that.
edit2: that's a shitty argument for a number of reasons. I suck. Fuck Locke. :'( :'( :'(

Loki · « **Reply #125 on:** March 26, 2009, 01:09:52 AM »

Quote from: Father_Mike on March 25, 2009, 11:53:33 PM

Malek help me out here

Locke “The particular ideas received from particular objects become general, which is done by considering them separate from all other existences, and circumstances of real existence, as time, place, or any other concomitant ideas”

I'm trying to say that bolded "and" is not a logical and but a rewording of what came before. I want to say there is a ambiguity in the grammar but is there?

fucking Locke and his HORRIBLE definitions.

edit: I could say that considering them separate from any other concomitant ideas = considering them separate from all other existences
we'll call that P. we'll call circumstances of real existence, as time, place, q. so what he is saying is P and (q or P). This means of course that the and (q or P) is totally pointless. That makes sense right?

You're correct - it's not a logical "and." In general, you shouldn't try to construct propositional arguments from prose (i.e., natural language arguments) unless it has a fairly obvious logical form (meaning that its propositions/relationships are explicitly defined). In most texts, the logical form is generally not apparent on the level of an individual sentence, but rather on a chapter/argument level. Hunting for p's and q's among a mountain of text is an exercise in futility. Read the entire argument, summarize it in bullet point form, determine which relationships the author is positing between different aspects of the argument, and then try to impose a logical structure on it consistent with the overall argument.

It's funny that you're reading this particular work. I had started to reread An Essay Concerning Human Understanding several months ago while on jury duty.

Recursivelyenumerable:

Don't torture him like that.

Madrun Badrun · « **Reply #126 on:** March 26, 2009, 01:21:06 AM »

Thanks.

The problem is that what locke says here is contry to the rest of his argument. I read that quote and I understand exactly what locke was trying to say but he says something completely different and then Berkeley takes this mis-wording and runs with it. I feel like I can't just say well locke didn't really mean what he said and there isn't much else that he says on it. So thus I'm hunting for P and Q. and the more I look at that paragraph the more I feel it's worng:'(

Locke is interesting but he is rather careless in his terminology and the way he structures his thoughts.

Boogie · « **Reply #127 on:** March 26, 2009, 01:44:42 AM »

Quote from: Malek on March 25, 2009, 12:47:38 PM

Quote from: Father_Mike on March 25, 2009, 12:42:16 PM

Malek you decided to go with corporate law?

Probably. I mean, I thought I'd just take whatever classes Flannel Girl was taking, but what's the point.

Quote from: Father_Mike on March 25, 2009, 12:42:16 PM

edit: and you're pissing off hells angels members in a crime ridden place like Winnipeg?

I don't know whether his application was actually accepted. He has, however, owned a bike shop. This alone is not necessarily suspicious, but together with his application, it is.

Do you know if he has any HA-themed tattoos?

Fresh Prince · « **Reply #128 on:** March 26, 2009, 01:47:49 AM »

Profiling, eh?

Flannel Boy · « **Reply #129 on:** March 26, 2009, 11:26:52 AM »

Wow. I just slept for 11 hours.

STILL SNOWING

Arvie, no philosophy questions during cumulative law exams! Loki is right, however, when he says that it's difficult to turn ordinary language into propositional logical. It's easier with first-order predicate logic, but it's better to look at the overall context in which the words are situated. I think the answer to your question depends on what Locke's technical definition of "real existence" is. If I recall, it's not very precise.

Boogie, I've never seen him without a long-sleeved shirt.

Madrun Badrun · « **Reply #130 on:** March 26, 2009, 03:37:36 PM »

8 pages done! I slept from 4AM till 7AM. I want to shit myself and fall asleep in my warm fecal nest. I also want to go home and download the new naruto. There wasn't one last week and I need Naruto it up like coke addict with coke.

spoiler (click to show/hide)

I wrote coke as cock twice in a row :'(

[close]

Madrun Badrun · « **Reply #131 on:** March 26, 2009, 03:46:55 PM »

Is this a correct title Berkeley's Interpretation of Locke's Idea Theory? grammar wise i mean.

Flannel Boy · « **Reply #132 on:** March 26, 2009, 05:49:11 PM »

[youtube=560,345]GE7sGbnbqxk[/youtube]

Loving you
Isn't the right thing to do
How can I ever change things
That I feel

If I could
Maybe I'd give you my world
How can I
When you won't take it from me

You can go your own way
Go your own way
You an call it
Another lonely day

TVC15 · « **Reply #133 on:** March 26, 2009, 05:52:39 PM »

Why don't you listen to mopier music that matches your mood? Why is such a morbidly depressed gloommonger so addicted to hippy dippy shit like Paul McCartney? You should be listening to Xiu Xiu and shit.

Flannel Boy · « **Reply #134 on:** March 26, 2009, 06:00:31 PM »

This is the best I can do.

[youtube=560,345]FdG-ITxL8ok[/youtube]

Ill say goodbye to love
No one ever cared if I should live or die
Time and time again the chance for love has passed me by
And all I know of love is how to live without it
I just cant seem to find it

So Ive made my mind up
I must live my life alone
And though its not the easy way
I guess Ive always know

Id say goodbye to love
There are no tomorrows for this heart of mine
Surely time will lose these bitter memories
And Ill find that there is someone to believe in
And to live for something I could live for

All the years of useless search
Have finally reached an end
Loneliness and empty days will be my only friend

TVC15 · « **Reply #135 on:** March 26, 2009, 06:02:11 PM »

I mention Xiu Xiu and you give me the fucking carpenters. That is not acceptable. The only acceptable Carpenters related song is

recursivelyenumerable · « **Reply #136 on:** March 26, 2009, 06:03:14 PM »

stfu, Malek's Carpenters song is awesome

those are like the best lyrics ever.

TVC15 · « **Reply #137 on:** March 26, 2009, 06:11:55 PM »

He still shouldn't be listening to the fucking carpenters.

Here, Malek

Fresh Prince · « **Reply #138 on:** March 26, 2009, 06:13:57 PM »

Carpenters > Beatles

Flannel Boy · « **Reply #139 on:** March 26, 2009, 06:18:41 PM »

White Man, this is really the best I can do

[youtube=560,345]k2e4V3Xh17w[/youtube]

And I know it's over - still I cling
I don't know where else I can go
Over and over and over and over
Over and over, la ...
I know it's over
And it never really began
But in my heart it was so real
And you even spoke to me, and said :
"If you're so funny
Then why are you on your own tonight?
And if you're so clever
Then why are you on your own tonight?
If you're so very entertaining
Then why are you on your own tonight?
If you're so very good-looking
Why do you sleep alone tonight ?
I know ...
'Cause tonight is just like any other night
That's why you're on your own tonight
With your triumphs and your charms
While they're in each others' arms..."

Eric P · « **Reply #140 on:** March 26, 2009, 06:25:25 PM »

malek should listen to some funeral doom

http://lix.in/-3f0323

recursivelyenumerable · « **Reply #141 on:** March 26, 2009, 06:28:52 PM »

my roommate met Johnny Marr recently.

Flannel Boy · « **Reply #142 on:** March 26, 2009, 06:47:23 PM »

Wish I wasn't out of vodka.

[youtube=560,345]Py4FtRTdH20[/youtube]

TVC15 · « **Reply #143 on:** March 26, 2009, 06:48:39 PM »

In today's installment of Things Better Than Anything by the Beatles:

Diunx · « **Reply #144 on:** March 26, 2009, 06:49:54 PM »

Hmmm vodka, I wish I had a job so I could go to the liquor store after class and buy some vodka and a 7up.

Eric P · « **Reply #145 on:** March 26, 2009, 06:52:57 PM »

from the worse than the beatles file

[youtube=560,345]u9hdgaPTHJQ[/youtube]

Flannel Boy · « **Reply #146 on:** March 26, 2009, 07:08:07 PM »

Worse than the Beatles is a big file, Eric!
[youtube=560,345]iz0Oq6ifH-8[/youtube]

'Cause I wonder where you are
And I wonder what you do
Are you somewhere feeling lonely, or is someone loving you?
Tell me how to win your heart
For I haven't got a clue
But let me start by saying, I love you ...

TVC15 · « **Reply #147 on:** March 26, 2009, 07:21:26 PM »

better than the beatles file

Flannel Boy · « **Reply #148 on:** March 26, 2009, 07:46:54 PM »

Such hate, White Man. You'd think the band was comprised of evil dictators.

demi · « **Reply #149 on:** March 26, 2009, 07:56:39 PM »

The following post, "Malek's Log" by Malek (malek4980) has been reported by T234 on a board you moderate:

http://www.evilbore.com/forum/index.php?topic=29320.msg813461#msg813461

The reporter has made the following comment:
lame

Flannel Boy · « **Reply #150 on:** March 26, 2009, 07:59:50 PM »

Is lameness against the ToS? Ban me for a month, just in case.

[youtube=560,345]jRE79bxfMtY[/youtube]

demi · « **Reply #151 on:** March 26, 2009, 08:03:59 PM »

Lameness warrants thread destruction

Prepare the ICP...

TVC15 · « **Reply #152 on:** March 26, 2009, 08:06:25 PM »

Olivia Wilde Homo · « **Reply #153 on:** March 26, 2009, 08:10:33 PM »

I welcome the ICP derail

Diunx · « **Reply #154 on:** March 26, 2009, 08:21:51 PM »

ICP is the prove that god exist and he hate us.

Phoenix Dark · « **Reply #155 on:** March 26, 2009, 09:17:31 PM »

ICP>
[youtube=560,345]hWuKimtUEas[/youtube]

Flannel Boy · « **Reply #156 on:** March 26, 2009, 10:32:45 PM »

[youtube=560,345]r2DjqB0SO9M[/youtube]

When you reach the part where the heartaches come
The hero would be me
But heroes often fail
And you wont read that book again
Because the endings just too hard to take

Flannel Boy · « **Reply #157 on:** March 26, 2009, 10:40:23 PM »

this will make white man feel conflicted:

[youtube=560,345]ndEqu50MHdE[/youtube]

Flannel Boy · « **Reply #158 on:** March 26, 2009, 10:53:05 PM »

[youtube=560,345]AvO7C-cgALI&fmt=18[/youtube]

[youtube=560,345]F7NjU1sPhs0[/youtube]

[youtube=560,345]kYl0iMSlMQg[/youtube]

Diunx · « **Reply #159 on:** March 26, 2009, 11:17:57 PM »

[youtube=560,345][/youtube]

Enrique Bunbury

TVC15 · « **Reply #160 on:** March 26, 2009, 11:19:40 PM »

Quote from: Malek on March 26, 2009, 10:40:23 PM

this will make white man feel conflicted:

[youtube=560,345]ndEqu50MHdE[/youtube]

Not really. Neil Young's career is kinda a mixed bag to begin with, but this is no different than me shitting on the shit that Macca did with Elvis Costello.

Flannel Boy · « **Reply #161 on:** March 27, 2009, 01:06:25 AM »

Thursday
Overnight
Temp. -22°C
Feels Like -32°C

I hate Winnipeg. Cold weather and colder women.

Madrun Badrun · « **Reply #162 on:** March 27, 2009, 01:09:58 AM »

They just need a hot man to warm them. give Flannel girl my number

spoiler (click to show/hide)

So that I can give her Mup's number :'(

[close]

Flannel Boy · « **Reply #163 on:** March 27, 2009, 01:15:16 AM »

Quote from: Father_Mike on March 27, 2009, 01:09:58 AM

They just need a hot man to warm them. give Flannel girl my number

spoiler (click to show/hide)
So that I can give her Mup's number :'(
spoiler (click to show/hide)

[close]
[close]

Yeah, I hear he's experienced with international thievery!

Madrun Badrun · « **Reply #164 on:** March 27, 2009, 01:17:29 AM »

Flannel Boy · « **Reply #165 on:** March 27, 2009, 01:20:41 AM »

It doesn't matter; I had confirmation today that she's already taken, a fact that should explain the bitter love songs I've posted.

Madrun Badrun · « **Reply #166 on:** March 27, 2009, 01:25:55 AM »

what confirmed this?

Flannel Boy · « **Reply #167 on:** March 27, 2009, 01:29:01 AM »

Quote from: Father_Mike on March 27, 2009, 01:25:55 AM

what confirmed this?

I was eavesdropping on a conversation she was having with another classmate in which she made mention of her boyfriend.

This incident proves that nothing good comes from actually attending classes.

Madrun Badrun · « **Reply #168 on:** March 27, 2009, 01:29:46 AM »

it;s probably for the best

Flannel Boy · « **Reply #169 on:** March 27, 2009, 01:31:21 AM »

I don't see how!

I picked a bad time to quit drinking.

Fresh Prince · « **Reply #170 on:** March 27, 2009, 01:37:23 AM »

Close this thread. Maybe Malek can lust over Plaid Girl next?

Madrun Badrun · « **Reply #171 on:** March 27, 2009, 01:39:39 AM »

Quote from: Malek on March 27, 2009, 01:31:21 AM

I don't see how!

I picked a bad time to quit drinking.

I meant in a utilitarian sense. These heart-broken threads of yours bring so much happiness to the rest of eb.

Flannel Boy · « **Reply #172 on:** March 27, 2009, 01:40:36 AM »

When will you learn to spell? You misspelled unhappiness.

Fresh Prince · « **Reply #173 on:** March 27, 2009, 01:43:34 AM »

Quote from: Father_Mike on March 27, 2009, 01:39:39 AM

I meant in a utilitarian sense. These heart-broken threads of yours bring so much happiness to the rest of eb.

Actually I hope Malek gets out of this rut, stops whining and stops posting threads on Canadian current affairs.

Flannel Boy · « **Reply #174 on:** March 27, 2009, 01:45:21 AM »

I posted a thread about Ukrainian current events yesterday!

Flannel Boy · « **Reply #175 on:** March 27, 2009, 02:40:46 AM »

[youtube=560,345]Y6pkW23vpKM[/youtube]

[youtube=560,345]EiOmhOumh-w[/youtube]

I want you
It's the stupid details that my heart is breaking for
It's the way your shoulders shake and what there shaking for
It's knowing that he knows you now after only guessing
I want you
It's the thought of him undressing you or you undressing
I want you
He tossed some tatty compliment your way
I want you
And you were fool enough to love it when he said
I want you
I want you
The truth cant hurt you its just like the dark
It scares you witless
But in time you see things clear and stark
I want you
Go on and hurt me then well let it drop
I want you
I'm afraid I wont know where to stop
I want you
I'm not ashamed to say I cried for you
I want you
I want to know the things you did that we do too
I want you
I want to hear he pleases you more than I do
I want you
I might as well be useless for all it means to you
I want you
Did you call his name out as he held you down
I want you
Oh no my darling not with that clown
I want you
You've had your fun you don't get well no more
I want you
No-one who wants you could want you more
I want you
Every night when I go off to bed and when I wake up
I want you
I want you
I'm going to say it once again til I instill it
I know I'm going to feel this way until you kill it
I want you
I want you

Robo · « **Reply #176 on:** March 27, 2009, 02:46:38 AM »

fiona apple

Fresh Prince · « **Reply #177 on:** March 27, 2009, 02:48:16 AM »

Take this like a man, Malek. Seduce Flannel Girl away from Military Jacket Man.

Flannel Boy · « **Reply #178 on:** March 27, 2009, 02:52:15 AM »

Quote from: Fresh Prince on March 27, 2009, 02:48:16 AM

Take this like a man, Malek. Seduce Flannel Girl away from Military Jacket Man.

I don't stand a chance.

Time to buy a plaid fleshlight.

Fresh Prince · « **Reply #179 on:** March 27, 2009, 03:01:16 AM »

Nothing to lose.

News:

Author Topic: Malek's Log (Read 50901 times)