Author Topic: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week  (Read 7213 times)

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Himu

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I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« on: April 23, 2009, 09:34:49 PM »
Even though I've had it since December I'm finally going through Metal Gear Solid 4.

I should beat it tomorrow. I've been doing about one chapter a day this week.

It's alright. The story is utter shit though. Someone hire Kojima a mother fucking writer, better yet an editor. These cutscenes are overly long-winded and obtuse, even by Metal Gear Solid standards.
IYKYK

Don Flamenco

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #1 on: April 23, 2009, 09:55:04 PM »
last two chapters are the worst.  Gameplay is pretty much over after ch. 3 or 4...

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #2 on: April 23, 2009, 10:03:27 PM »
I really liked chapter 3. It had great graphics and I loved the stealth gameplay. The problem with act 3 is that i can already predict it being fucking annoying on No Kill, No Alerts, and speed runs.

In fact, the entire game doesn't seem like it's catered to speed runs or no kill, no alert runs in general.

Act 1 was meh for me. I couldn't get into the environment. Act 2 was badass since it was MGS3 in hd.

I think the bosses are all fucking ass tastic so far, with the exception of the first boss which had typical MGS gimmicky boss fight trappings, making it fucking awesome.
IYKYK

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #3 on: April 23, 2009, 10:09:34 PM »
Otacon just had his traditional crying moment where he's on the brink of suicidal depression so I guess the game's almost over.
IYKYK

Don Flamenco

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #4 on: April 23, 2009, 10:10:28 PM »
only the first breakdown?  oh shit, you got like 9 more to go...

Himu

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #5 on: April 23, 2009, 10:12:50 PM »
The story is really awful. It's a bunch of shitty fan service with a bunch nanomachine bullshit thrown in every scene.

Hey, let's make every MGS character appear for no reason at all except for the sake of convience and fanservice!

Asstastic. It's like Kojima and his fellow writers got together and thought up a bunch of ways to please fans without thinking once about the narrative. They even bring in tons of fanservice from other Kojima games like in act 3 where you dress up as Gillian Seed from Snatcher.

I'm not one of those Metal Gear fans who thinks the stories changed his life all that shit, but they're cheesy fun. This, however, is bad cheese. I have no clue what is going on anymore and I used to have a grasp.
IYKYK

Positive Touch

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #6 on: April 23, 2009, 10:22:39 PM »
the final scene is soooooo bad
pcp

Himu

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #7 on: April 23, 2009, 10:23:30 PM »
This is fucking distinguished mentally-challenged.

spoiler (click to show/hide)
They just killed Raiden. He was in like, 4 scenes max and now he's dead. I've been a Raiden supporter since MGS2.
[close]

 :yuck ::)

IYKYK

Positive Touch

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #8 on: April 23, 2009, 10:27:05 PM »
he couldn't get a rock off one arm yet he was able to stop a boat size of a city with the other
pcp

Himu

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #9 on: April 23, 2009, 10:29:06 PM »
I know, that was distinguished mentally-challenged.

I just installed act 5. How long is it.
IYKYK

Rman

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #10 on: April 23, 2009, 11:17:46 PM »
I know, that was distinguished mentally-challenged.

I just installed act 5. How long is it.
You really want to know?

It's the shortest in terms of actual gameplay.

Don Flamenco

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #11 on: April 23, 2009, 11:19:55 PM »
5 is the last one, right?  it's like a 4 hour cutscene.

Himu

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #12 on: April 23, 2009, 11:29:27 PM »
Christ. Sneaking on board a ship full of enhanced soldiers and gekko is not fun AT ALL.  :yuck
IYKYK

Rman

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #13 on: April 23, 2009, 11:35:03 PM »
Christ. Sneaking on board a ship full of enhanced soldiers and gekko is not fun AT ALL.  :yuck
I loved the part.  That was the best sequence of stealth gameplay in the game.  I wish there were more sections like that; it reminded me of VR Missions.

It's great when you finally figure out that room.  Think of it as a puzzle.

Himu

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #14 on: April 23, 2009, 11:40:46 PM »
I prefer act 2 and 3 stealth wise
IYKYK

TVC15

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #15 on: April 23, 2009, 11:44:25 PM »
Did you see Mt. Snakemore in game?
serge

Himu

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #16 on: April 23, 2009, 11:45:42 PM »
Yes and it was fucking distinguished mentally-challenged.

Great, now this game is ripping off the Psycho Mantis fight. ::)
IYKYK

Positive Touch

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #17 on: April 23, 2009, 11:47:24 PM »
just 5 minutes of gameplay and two hours of cutscenes left!
pcp

Himu

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #18 on: April 23, 2009, 11:51:59 PM »
The boss fights in this game are shit, which is funny since metal gear solid games tend to have the BEST boss fights this side of anything made from capcom
IYKYK

Rman

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #19 on: April 24, 2009, 12:02:59 AM »
Yes and it was fucking distinguished mentally-challenged.

Great, now this game is ripping off the Psycho Mantis fight. ::)
Well, the BB crew were an homage to the MGS1 bosses so it makes sense, much like the sniper showdown in Act IV.

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #20 on: April 24, 2009, 12:05:08 AM »
Yes, they're shitty homages.

They only good one is Octopus because we didn't even fight him in the game.
IYKYK

Bebpo

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #21 on: April 24, 2009, 12:06:41 AM »
Yeah, the game 1/2 sucks and has no replayability. MGS3 is king.  Hope MGS5 is a return to greatness.

I don't even remember any of the bosses outside the Octopus one.  That one was cool because of the breaking through windows and making you go OH FUCK.  Plus the part where she transforms into the MK-II and gasses you, lol.

Rman

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #22 on: April 24, 2009, 12:07:52 AM »
I'm still surprised it won so many GOTY awards.  It was a B- game.

Bebpo

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #23 on: April 24, 2009, 12:08:52 AM »
The Rex v. Ray boss fight is cool too, but not for the gameplay depth or anything.  Just fun being a giant robo and blowing shit up.

The final final boss fight is conceptually awesome, but the gameplay is torturous.  You're gonna love it Himuro ;)

BlueTsunami

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #24 on: April 24, 2009, 12:13:49 AM »
Loved the

spoiler (click to show/hide)
return to Shadow Moses
[close]

The only really high point of the game
:9

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #25 on: April 24, 2009, 12:19:20 AM »
Okay, who were the people defending MGS4 on this board again?

They're going on the list.
IYKYK

Sho Nuff

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #26 on: April 24, 2009, 12:21:42 AM »
I like the multiple long one-way hallways where you fight the sphere arm things. It's like the level designers threw up their hands and said, "I've got nothing"

BlueTsunami

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #27 on: April 24, 2009, 12:24:18 AM »
I couldn't stand the Boss battles in this game, not sure exactly why. Probably due to being so boring (gameplay and the bosses themselves). The class system (for beating the game) is shitty too. I hate that you can only see your stats after you've fully completed a level instead of putting in a checkpoint within chapters (mainly due to me killing a single person in the second chapter and I couldn't figure out where).
:9

fistfulofmetal

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #28 on: April 24, 2009, 12:25:39 AM »
GOTY 2008.

nat

Himu

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #29 on: April 24, 2009, 12:27:07 AM »
How the FUCK was this gaf's goty 2008
IYKYK

BlueTsunami

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #30 on: April 24, 2009, 12:28:32 AM »
The Camo system fucking rocked though, I think Kojima and co. nailed the stealth aspect in the first two chapters. The game becomes unforgivable in Chapter 3, makes me happy again in 4 then goes back to shit. So its not entirely bad to me, just very uneven.
:9

demi

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #31 on: April 24, 2009, 12:29:03 AM »
budget gaming console :gloomy
fat

Himu

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #32 on: April 24, 2009, 12:30:09 AM »
I like acts 1-3, but acts 4 and 5 are utter shit.
IYKYK

demi

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #33 on: April 24, 2009, 12:31:39 AM »
himuro... gta4 or mgs4
fat

duckman2000

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #34 on: April 24, 2009, 12:32:09 AM »
The boss fights in this game are shit, which is funny since metal gear solid games tend to have the BEST boss fights this side of anything made from capcom

I guess it makes sense then, since RE5 had such remarkably shitty boss battles. I guess that's what's in style these days.

As for MGS4 being popular, I always assumed that people loved the games for their ridiculous stories and implausible scenarios. MGS4 sounds like the culmination of that, so I guess it's meant to serve the fans. It's a shame, really, because there was a clearly a lot of talent involved in the making of the game.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2009, 12:35:11 AM by duckman2000 »

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #35 on: April 24, 2009, 12:34:18 AM »
demi: re5
IYKYK

Himu

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #36 on: April 24, 2009, 12:41:21 AM »
As for MGS4 being popular, I always assumed that people loved the games for their ridiculous stories and implausible scenarios. MGS4 sounds like the culmination of that, so I guess it's meant to serve the fans. It's a shame, really, because there was a clearly a lot of talent involved in the making of the game.

I love MGS for the great gameplay, high production values, and high replayability. The cheese is just pure icing. The stories are almost always badly written and not meant to be taken seriously, but they're still entertaining despite this. MGS4, however, throws almost all of this out of the window. Gameplay wise it's pretty damn good for three acts. Story wise, the ridiculousness is taken to another level of stupidity.
IYKYK

duckman2000

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #37 on: April 24, 2009, 12:50:25 AM »
Is it possible to play the game as a pure stealth-action game? I mean, could I just skip the cutscenes and still get a good experience out of it? I love the look of it, and the gameplay clips I've seen have looked good, but I could barely get through the cut-scenes in MGS3.




The Gekko is a damned cool design, but it's stuck in MGS.

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #38 on: April 24, 2009, 12:52:37 AM »
You can still play it as a stealth action game...SOMETIMES. It's like half action half stealth. If you're someone who wants nothing but pure stealth gameplay with the only high-tense action parts left for the end of the game like me, you'll be disappointed by the stealth:action ratio.
IYKYK

BlueTsunami

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #39 on: April 24, 2009, 12:52:55 AM »
And has there been anything worse that fucks the pacing of the game than the way this game installs each chapter and subsequently handles the transition between each (BACK TO DA' SHIP!)? Holy crap.
:9

fistfulofmetal

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #40 on: April 24, 2009, 12:57:58 AM »
How the FUCK was this gaf's goty 2008

pretty simple, it's the best game of 2008.
nat

Himu

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #41 on: April 24, 2009, 01:04:14 AM »
How the FUCK was this gaf's goty 2008

pretty simple, it's the best game of 2008.

:lol

"game"

I've never used that term for MGS before. I've always been about gameplay over story when it comes to this series and I've defended it on multiple an occasion from people who say they're not games.

But this is ridiculous.

I just tapped triangle for 3 minutes or something as Snake crawls through a toaster hallway.
IYKYK

fistfulofmetal

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #42 on: April 24, 2009, 01:08:40 AM »


I've never used that term for MGS before.

You're an idiot.
nat

Himu

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #43 on: April 24, 2009, 01:17:05 AM »
:rofl
IYKYK

Himu

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #44 on: April 24, 2009, 01:41:48 AM »
I can't believe my payoff for being an Metal Gear fan for all these years is this shitty final boss fight.
IYKYK

Robo

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #45 on: April 24, 2009, 01:55:44 AM »
Christ. Sneaking on board a ship full of enhanced soldiers and gekko is not fun AT ALL.  :yuck
I loved the part.  That was the best sequence of stealth gameplay in the game.  I wish there were more sections like that; it reminded me of VR Missions.

It's great when you finally figure out that room.  Think of it as a puzzle.

I was so sick of the bullshit at that point that I just replayed that area until I got lucky enough to run the whole way to the end and crank the door open without firing a shot, but I couldn't use the goddamn elevator because I was still in DANGER mode.  None of the soldiers would even follow me down the corridor.  They just stood outside with the Gekkos firing randomly into the walls.  I ended up throwing a bunch of grenades down the hall and hiding in the elevator until the level went down to CAUTION.  Fuck you, Kojima.
obo

Bebpo

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #46 on: April 24, 2009, 01:56:20 AM »
The controls in the boss fight REALLY sucked.  And Ocelot has soooooo much HP.

Enjoy your 1 hour long ending!

Himu

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #47 on: April 24, 2009, 02:03:11 AM »
Christ. Sneaking on board a ship full of enhanced soldiers and gekko is not fun AT ALL.  :yuck
I loved the part.  That was the best sequence of stealth gameplay in the game.  I wish there were more sections like that; it reminded me of VR Missions.

It's great when you finally figure out that room.  Think of it as a puzzle.

I was so sick of the bullshit at that point that I just replayed that area until I got lucky enough to run the whole way to the end and crank the door open without firing a shot, but I couldn't use the goddamn elevator because I was still in DANGER mode.  None of the soldiers would even follow me down the corridor.  They just stood outside with the Gekkos firing randomly into the walls.  I ended up throwing a bunch of grenades down the hall and hiding in the elevator until the level went down to CAUTION.  Fuck you, Kojima.

Same.
IYKYK

Don Flamenco

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #48 on: April 24, 2009, 02:04:49 AM »
How the FUCK was this gaf's goty 2008


bruce lee roy dropped some mad $$$


you know what would've saved the game?  or at least made it worth playing again...or at least made this one chapter worth playing again...if chapter 4 was really a remake of MGS1.  even if it was missing the story (or just rearranged so it's in the context of MGS4) but with all the enemies/bosses of MGS1.

so yeah...MGS4 would've been better if it had MGS1 in it.  I guess that kinda makes sense :lol
« Last Edit: April 24, 2009, 02:07:38 AM by Kranz Fafka »

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #49 on: April 24, 2009, 03:02:49 AM »
Holy shit this ending is awful. It won't end. He is rambling on about a bunch of bullshit.
IYKYK

Robo

  • Senior Member
Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #50 on: April 24, 2009, 03:16:43 AM »
How the FUCK was this gaf's goty 2008


bruce lee roy dropped some mad $$$


you know what would've saved the game?  or at least made it worth playing again...or at least made this one chapter worth playing again...if chapter 4 was really a remake of MGS1.  even if it was missing the story (or just rearranged so it's in the context of MGS4) but with all the enemies/bosses of MGS1.

so yeah...MGS4 would've been better if it had MGS1 in it.  I guess that kinda makes sense :lol

Act 4 could be improved exponentially just by adding human soldiers in place of all the shitty robots.
obo

BlueTsunami

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #51 on: April 24, 2009, 03:21:24 AM »
Thinking it over, I really got that sense that Kojima wanted to wash his hands of the series. Wrap everything up in a neat package so he can finally move on.
:9

Rman

  • Senior Member
Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #52 on: April 24, 2009, 03:29:45 AM »
So, Himuro, are you going for a no-kill, no-alerts run?  Or are you done with MGS4? 

Human Snorenado

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Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #53 on: April 24, 2009, 03:50:47 AM »
Did you get to see the game in all of it's s-video glory?
yar

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #54 on: April 24, 2009, 04:28:08 AM »
Beat it.

+ Good production values, some of the best this generation.
+ The best controls in the series, although it takes a while to adjust to them.
+ The stealth gameplay takes the best bits from Metal Gear Solid 3 and enhances them.
+ Acts 1-3 were very good, stealth wise, when they didn't have stupid action bits in them at least.
+ Some of the fanservice can be good. I liked the Snatcher fanservice and it makes me wish Kojima and Konami would no longer ignore Snatcher, especially considering it has a better story than any Metal Gear put together. Having the MK-II follow you and dressing up as Gillian Seed in Act III were great.
+ I feel that when actually using stealth, the gameplay is tremendous. I am particularly fond of Acts II and III, for their use clever use of stealth.
+ The new characters (Drebin, Sunny, the monkey) were all awesome. I adored Sunny because she was cute in every scene she was in, Drebis was badass, and the monkey is the best character in the game by far.
+ The first boss fight with Octopus is one of my favorite Metal Gear Solid boss fights. It was extremely clever, didn't rely on the overuse of minions like all the other (shitty) boss fights did.
+ Storywise, I was quite fond of Snake's arc. Seeing the man be torn down limb by limb, his body in shambles and still have the balls to continue really made an impact on me. I've always hearted Snake.

+/- The game has quite a variety of locations. This gives it a great visual variety other Metal Gear games don't have. The flipside is that:

1. Metal Gear isn't Bond.

2. One of the best things about past Metal Gear games is that you get attached to one specific location and each game has a specific theme. Metal Gear Solid 4 has no theme, setting wise, that holds the whole game together. It makes the location feel more personal. For example, when you go to Shadow Moses Island on Act 4, you know every nook and cranny for a reason.

3. I am of the opinion that Metal Gear games, particularly the 3d games, are a subset of the action-adventure genre, this means the exploration is a big part of the gameplay for me. Finding the thermal goggles in MGS1, for example, is completely optional. You have to go out of your way to get them. So is finding the croc hat in MGS3. You have to work to get some stuff in these games, and exploration is a big part of that. MGS4 throws this entirely out of the window, unless I missed some items. You don't really have to look or explore for items. If something is hidden, it's just underneath that table or inside that truck. You don't have to work for it at all and this makes the game feel far too linear. The past games weren't exactly non-linear, but they had multiple branching paths full of items you couldn't find anywhere else.

+ / - The whole sneak on a battlefield can be pretty cool when done right (act 2) or just annoying when done wrong (act 1).

+/- They brought back the amazing system from MGS3 where you're awarded the bosses camo or weapon or both if you tranquilize them to death. The flipside is that you don't have to work for it. In MGS3, you had your work cut out for you to pull that shit off. Tranqing The Fear, for example. It was ALWAYS harder to tranq them than killing them with normal weapons. In MGS4, all I have to do is throw a few stun grenades at the "beasts" when they're in their beauty form and I instantly get awesome rewards. Just like everything else in the game, you don't have to work for shit, which goes against anything MGS when it comes to gameplay.

- The pretentious storyline is distinguished mentally-challenged drivel that I feel, shits on the faces of fans who have been following this series for so many years. I'm not one who worships Kojima, nor the stories Metal Gear games. In fact, I find them cheesy. But that cheese is pure icing. I like that cheese. I *like* Volgin saying "Kuwabara kuwabara". I *like* the president grabbing Raiden's nutsack in MGS2 to see if he's a guy or not. Beyond the stupid talk about ideologies, war, and Kojima trying to see if he's better than Yoshiyuki Tomino of Mobile Suit Gundam fame (hint: he's not), there's a great cast of characters who I've loved for years. I'm not entirely fond of MGS4's way of dealing with them or the situations they are in.

The game's story is entirely ham fisted and has an extreme over reliance on fan service and nostalgia. I like the occasional nostalgia trip, which is obvious from praise for including Gillian Seed costume in MGS4 and more above. Okay, so Snake runs into Meryl who was ordered by Camble to go to the middle east. Snake is working with Otacon and Sunny who was the daughter of Olga. Raiden saves Snake in South America after they rescue Naomi who was kept prisoner by Ocelot...I mean Liquid. Drebin somehow knows every single Beast in the game and their backstories. Mei Ling shows up for good measure. Snake eventually runs into Eva, Big Boss, and Zero. Johnny, who has always been a series in joke somehow has ALWAYS loved Meryl, even though in the first MGS they know each other for all but 5 minutes and he's merely the guard for her prison cell. Naomi is the same as Vamp! Wow! Look at all these character links! Everything is linked by pure coincidence!

This is a tad convenient. It is as if the writers threw in every major character in Metal Gear history, put them in a blender to see what would happen if they all appeared in the same game and you have this trainwreck of a story. I like fan service. Metal Gear games often are filled with it, but the amount of recycling, old characters popping up reeks of an extreme lack of creativity. Why is it necessary for the beasts to be named after the bosses in MGS1? No reason other than stupid fanservice. Why is the Mantis fight practically a facelift with the fight with Psycho Mantis in MGS1? Why does Psycho Mantis appear after you defeat that boss and do the tirade you saw ten years ago? He's dead, no reason other than stupid fanservice. Why does the game have you go to Shadow Moses Island? No reason other than stupid fanservice. There's more, but the more I played the more I was disgusted with the writing.

I find it insulting that the writers felt that all Metal Gear fans get their brains tingling just because,"Ooh! There's Mei Ling! She's got a nice butt too!" This game should be renamed Metal Gear: Greatest Hits.

- The emphasis on action is a big downer. It's about half stealth, half action. Pity. I want 95% stealth, 5% action that's reserved for the very end of the game.

- The level design is extremely weak. Acts 4 and 5 are dog shit. It's like the developers threw their hands up and said,"Welp we give up. Instead of creating interesting stealth gameplay let's make the player sneak past/fight a bunch of dumb robots. Both acts could have been better with less robots, more flesh and blood. Acts 1-3, however, have pretty good level design for the most part. Act 2 in particular. My favorite example of this hilarious attempt at level design is near the end where you're on a catwalk and a bunch of robots with legs come down the linear path as if the stop you. That was the laziest shit ever, and boring too.

- Due to the crappy level design and emphasis on action a crucial facet of MGS games has been sacrificed. Replayability. I'm the type of Metal Gear Solid fan who goes through all the difficulty modes, does speed runs, no kill runs, no alert runs and more. I can't imagine any of these being fun at all due to how the game is designed. It's pretty hard to not kill anything when you have 9999 robots chasing after you on an on rails section of the game! Past MGS games had on rails parts, but they threw less enemies at you allowing you to tranq at will. Such a thing is not possible in MGS4. On top of this, due to the overall gameplay:story ratio, speedrunning the game wouldn't be particularly fun at all anyway since there's little pushing buttons and gameplay in MGS4.

- The bosses suck. All of them. Except Octopus. The fight between Rex and Ray was cool, but that was it. Cool. It had no semblance of depth at all and was not particularly fun. The same goes for the final boss, which was a pathetic farewell to Metal Gear Solid, a series that has quite possibly the best boss fights in 3d gaming this side of anything Capcom develops. One crucial thing about MGS bosses is that it's always between you and the boss, and no one else. No minions, just a good ol' fashioned one on one face off. Not the case in MGS4, since all the bosses have backup except for a few exceptions. The only good exception being Octopus of course.

- Too many weapons. A Metal Gear doesn't need this many weapons. Buying weapons is dumb too. Completely kills any sense of exploration. Why explore when I can just buy supplies and guns from Drebin? Terrible idea.

- Entirely lacking of codec. The attention to detail in the MGS games is one of my favorite things. I liked Paramedic's talk about movies in MGS3, or Mei Ling's chinese accent in MGS1, or the cool stuff they'd talk about. Equipping and item and having your support dish the details was always awesome. MGS4 lacks this, and the codec is useful maybe 1 time in the game. Codec sucks in MGS4.

- The ending. I can't believe THAT was the ending to one of my favorite gaming series of all time. What a load of shit. It is essentially Big Boss talking about a bunch of crap I don't care about, Meryl and Johnny getting married which was completely random and stupid and no one gives a shit about. Thankfully Snake's drama and Raiden overcoming his past were there to tide me over.

- Otacon. Worst character ever. That little bitch cried 3-4 times in this fucking game, I counted. He does it every game. I hope the next MGS is in the far future so that walking vagina dead.

- The game isn't a solo sneaking mission.

- The cutscene ratio is out of whack. MGS3 perfected the cutscene ratio. The beginning had quite a few cutscenes, but after that it was smooth sailing and mostly gameplay throughout the majority of the game. Nothing pure, delicious stealth gameplay. The definitive MGS, with the definitive story:gameplay ratio. MGS4 ruins all this. I swear, there's at least 10-11 hours of cutscenes in this game. Which is entirely ridiculous.

Summary: Good game that is entirely too front loaded for its own good. The last two acts fuck it up tremendously, especially gameplay wise. Bosses suck in the game, but the stealth is good when it's actually there in abundance. The story is crap, and relies too much on fanservice and nostalgia rather than attempting to stand on its own. This game represents one thing I hate about modern gaming: over reliance on idiot storytelling, and sacrificing gameplay and personality for a bunch of fluff. It's obvious Kojima wants to direct movies, because this attempt at a game is pretty hilarious.

Series ranking:

MGS3 > MG2: Solid Snake > MGS1 = MGS VR Missions > MGS2 > MG: Ghost Babel > MG1 > MG2 NES >>>>> MGS4
IYKYK

Himu

  • Senior Member
Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #55 on: April 24, 2009, 04:28:36 AM »
So, Himuro, are you going for a no-kill, no-alerts run?  Or are you done with MGS4? 

I'm done with MGS4.
IYKYK

Lafiel

  • Junior Member
Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #56 on: April 24, 2009, 07:19:06 AM »
Quote
The game's story is entirely ham fisted and has an extreme over reliance on fan service and nostalgia. I like the occasional nostalgia trip, which is obvious from praise for including Gillian Seed costume in MGS4 and more above. Okay, so Snake runs into Meryl who was ordered by Camble to go to the middle east. Snake is working with Otacon and Sunny who was the daughter of Olga. Raiden saves Snake in South America after they rescue Naomi who was kept prisoner by Ocelot...I mean Liquid. Drebin somehow knows every single Beast in the game and their backstories. Mei Ling shows up for good measure. Snake eventually runs into Eva, Big Boss, and Zero. Johnny, who has always been a series in joke somehow has ALWAYS loved Meryl, even though in the first MGS they know each other for all but 5 minutes and he's merely the guard for her prison cell. Naomi is the same as Vamp! Wow! Look at all these character links! Everything is linked by pure coincidence!
Word it wasn't that bad though, since it kinda reminded me of a comic book, but a comic book usually ties together several storylines by different writers, i dont know why MGS being written mostly by one guy had to be like this. :lol the cutscene direction of the game was really boring though, needed way more editing, some scenes just dragged on and on, i didn't mind the dragging on in the first three games, but this err.

I also hated it how forced the answers to all of the supernatural stuff were, it was like he was trying to go away from all that because of the backlash he got from MGS 2. Explaining it was all nanomachines is just  :lol

Quote
- The emphasis on action is a big downer. It's about half stealth, half action. Pity. I want 95% stealth, 5% action that's reserved for the very end of the game.
Think your playing the game wrong, best part about the game is you can play it the way you want to play, your allowed to either go full-stealth or guns blazing, though i assume most of your complaints are directed at the on-rail action sequences, in that case i agree. They were fun, but pretty out-of-place in a stealth-action game like MGS.

Quote
- Due to the crappy level design and emphasis on action a crucial facet of MGS games has been sacrificed. Replayability. I'm the type of Metal Gear Solid fan who goes through all the difficulty modes, does speed runs, no kill runs, no alert runs and more. I can't imagine any of these being fun at all due to how the game is designed. It's pretty hard to not kill anything when you have 9999 robots chasing after you on an on rails section of the game! Past MGS games had on rails parts, but they threw less enemies at you allowing you to tranq at will. Such a thing is not possible in MGS4. On top of this, due to the overall gameplay:story ratio, speedrunning the game wouldn't be particularly fun at all anyway since there's little pushing buttons and gameplay in MGS4.
Really? you should love the replayability in this. The replay value of this game is a HUGE step-up from MGS 1-3, there's a insane amount of unlockables, titles and shit and it's way more rewarding then mgs 1-3 ever were, and there's alot of hidden details in the game that you would glance over in your first playthrough.
That said, the gameplay and level design isn't as consistent as the previous games, this is the only MGS game where there's this one area that i find very hard to replay and not very fun, so you have a point there. Also your completely wrong about that bolded part, it is POSSIBLE.:P and robots dont count as kills i think.

Quote
- Entirely lacking of codec. The attention to detail in the MGS games is one of my favorite things. I liked Paramedic's talk about movies in MGS3, or Mei Ling's chinese accent in MGS1, or the cool stuff they'd talk about. Equipping and item and having your support dish the details was always awesome. MGS4 lacks this, and the codec is useful maybe 1 time in the game. Codec sucks in MGS4.
Word up, the codecs in the previous three games added so much to the backstorys, i was really dissapointed when i found out there was only one cool hidden codec conversation. (the big boss CQC story in act 1).

Quote
- Too many weapons. A Metal Gear doesn't need this many weapons. Buying weapons is dumb too. Completely kills any sense of exploration. Why explore when I can just buy supplies and guns from Drebin? Terrible idea.
Argeed

Quote
- The bosses suck. All of them. Except Octopus. The fight between Rex and Ray was cool, but that was it. Cool. It had no semblance of depth at all and was not particularly fun. The same goes for the final boss, which was a pathetic farewell to Metal Gear Solid, a series that has quite possibly the best boss fights in 3d gaming this side of anything Capcom develops. One crucial thing about MGS bosses is that it's always between you and the boss, and no one else. No minions, just a good ol' fashioned one on one face off. Not the case in MGS4, since all the bosses have backup except for a few exceptions. The only good exception being Octopus of course.
To true, though i still say the rex versus ray fight is the MOST epic thing in MGS ever conceived , being the big mecha fan i am.


Quote
- The cutscene ratio is out of whack. MGS3 perfected the cutscene ratio. The beginning had quite a few cutscenes, but after that it was smooth sailing and mostly gameplay throughout the majority of the game. Nothing pure, delicious stealth gameplay. The definitive MGS, with the definitive story:gameplay ratio. MGS4 ruins all this. I swear, there's at least 10-11 hours of cutscenes in this game. Which is entirely ridiculous.
The cutscene ratio wasn't that bad actually, there's way more gameplay in this then the first two MGS games, but coming from MGS 3, i was disappointed in that area, it just wasn't as bad as you are saying, MGS 2 was way worse.

Quote
This game represents one thing I hate about modern gaming: over reliance on idiot storytelling, and sacrificing gameplay and personality for a bunch of fluff. It's obvious Kojima wants to direct movies, because this attempt at a game is pretty hilarious.
What you mean? i argee on the fluff, but there haven't been many games that have had a over reliance on storytelling this gen. :-\

edit
Quote
2. One of the best things about past Metal Gear games is that you get attached to one specific location and each game has a specific theme. Metal Gear Solid 4 has no theme, setting wise, that holds the whole game together. It makes the location feel more personal. For example, when you go to Shadow Moses Island on Act 4, you know every nook and cranny for a reason.
Yeah i never realized that, till i played MGS 4,  i didn't mind the whole act system though. But i miss that part of MGS.

Quote
- The pretentious storyline is distinguished mentally-challenged drivel that I feel, shits on the faces of fans who have been following this series for so many years. I'm not one who worships Kojima, nor the stories Metal Gear games. In fact, I find them cheesy. But that cheese is pure icing. I like that cheese. I *like* Volgin saying "Kuwabara kuwabara". I *like* the president grabbing Raiden's nutsack in MGS2 to see if he's a guy or not. Beyond the stupid talk about ideologies, war, and Kojima trying to see if he's better than Yoshiyuki Tomino of Mobile Suit Gundam fame (hint: he's not), there's a great cast of characters who I've loved for years. I'm not entirely fond of MGS4's way of dealing with them or the situations they are in.
Haha i know, it seems people who think of MGS storytelling as high art, were really really disappointed in MGS 4. Personally for me while i've always loved MGS storytelling and their characters, i've never thought of them as anything more then just over-the-top cheesy entertainment. :)

Overall though, i think your being a bit to harsh, i mean ranking this all the way at the bottom and lower then ghost babel?  :lol That said i'm sure we can all argee that MGS 4 would've been way better if kojima didn't listen to much to his fans. :lol i mean i admire the fact he actually does take player feedback seriously, but he took it to far in this one. :(




« Last Edit: April 24, 2009, 07:37:15 AM by Lafiel »

WrikaWrek

  • Let your soul glow
  • Senior Member
Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #57 on: April 24, 2009, 07:19:47 AM »
Amazing review. Kinda hurts here and there, but also delivers laughs here and there. Really fucking good.

I had more fun reading that review than any "pro" review i've read in the last couple of years.

 :bow Himuro  :bow2

^

to Lafiel: Dude. 9h30m of "cut scenes". That shit ain't "ok".

« Last Edit: April 24, 2009, 07:21:18 AM by WrikaWrek »

Lafiel

  • Junior Member
Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #58 on: April 24, 2009, 07:23:15 AM »
Amazing review. Kinda hurts here and there, but also delivers laughs here and there. Really fucking good.

I had more fun reading that review than any "pro" review i've read in the last couple of years.

 :bow Himuro  :bow2

^

to Lafiel: Dude. 9h30m of "cut scenes". That shit ain't "ok".


On my game save i clocked 12 hours of gameplay and 9 hours and 30 minutes of cutscenes.
Which is not bad for a MGS game imo, considering my final playtime for the first two games are like 8 hours. (and those have like 2-4 hours of cutscenes). :)

WrikaWrek

  • Let your soul glow
  • Senior Member
Re: I've been playing Metal Gear Solid 4 this week
« Reply #59 on: April 24, 2009, 07:26:52 AM »
Amazing review. Kinda hurts here and there, but also delivers laughs here and there. Really fucking good.

I had more fun reading that review than any "pro" review i've read in the last couple of years.

 :bow Himuro  :bow2

^

to Lafiel: Dude. 9h30m of "cut scenes". That shit ain't "ok".


On my game save i clocked 12 hours of gameplay and 9 hours and 30 minutes of cutscenes.
Which is not bad for a MGS game imo, considering my final playtime for the first two games are like 8 hours. (and those have like 2-4 hours of cutscenes). :)

The problem is that the cut scenes are back ended. Basically, you reach half way through the game, and you've already burnt through the core of the gameplay experience, and what comes after is an indulgent mess of a game, with cut scene after cut scene after cut scene.