EB Conservative concentration camp thread of conservatives must stay in here.

[brawndolicious]

What exactly was the point of the Glen Beck thread?  I didn't get the summary in the OP.

[Ganhyun]

You know, when Jehovah Witnesses show up at my house, I usually deck out the Megadeath or Slayer stuff before I open the door. Makes them change their minds usually.

[Ganhyun]

What exactly was the point of the Glen Beck thread?  I didn't get the summary in the OP.

Basically Glenn and Barbara Walters and Whoopi met on AmTrak. Walters and Whoopi had reserved seats. Beck mentioned it, they called him a liar. Turns out it was true. A big hubbub over something silly really.

[Mandark]

Just read the Ballmer thing from the other thread.

I think I understand his argument.  In the current situation, Microsoft pays much higher rates on its US profits than its Ireland profits.  So when doing the books, it will shift as many costs as possible under the US umbrella, leaving more of the profit untouched in Ireland.  One way to do this is to hire people in the US.  If you tax their Irish profits at the US rate, then they no longer have this incentive.

He's talking out of his ass.

If we accept his premise (that the disparity in corporate marginal rates encourages MS-like companies to keep jobs in the US) then the logical conclusion would be that we could protect/create American jobs by raising corporate taxes.  Since he's never going to argue that, you can tell how sincere he's being.



rich people threatening to take their ball and go home

[Kestastrophe]

You know, when Jehovah Witnesses show up at my house, I usually deck out the Megadeath or Slayer stuff before I open the door. Makes them change their minds usually.

offending the base  :'(

[ShogunOfFear]

I actually have no issues raising taxes on companies that try and skip out overseas.  Why not do that and offer tax cuts to companies that keep them here?

[Ganhyun]

You know, when Jehovah Witnesses show up at my house, I usually deck out the Megadeath or Slayer stuff before I open the door. Makes them change their minds usually.

offending the base  :'(

I have nothing against them personally. But I've found that to be the easiest way to get them to leave without being outright rude. At least the ones in my area.

[Human Snorenado]

brown people hate us for our freedoms

no, hardline extremists hate us for what America/The West bring to the table for their people which undermines their control.  At least, thats my view.

It couldn't possibly be because of our decades of undermining their own control of their countries (the Shah, etc), our having military bases on their land, or our support of Israel.  All of which are the reasons THEY FUCKING SAID THEY ATTACKED US.  No.  It's "our freedoms". 

So, why aren't the Netherlands fucking DUST if that's true?  And Canada and Sweden and Finland and the rest of the countries that are actually freer than we are?  Oh, gee, I wonder.

[Mandark]

"undermines their control"?

Dude, where are the hardline Sunnis in control?  Islamist political organizations are almost exclusively opposition movements in countries with secular governments.  The Muslim Brotherhood doesn't control shit.  Yeesh.

[Ganhyun]

brown people hate us for our freedoms

no, hardline extremists hate us for what America/The West bring to the table for their people which undermines their control.  At least, that's my view.

It couldn't possibly be because of our decades of undermining their own control of their countries (the Shah, etc), our having military bases on their land, or our support of Israel.  All of which are the reasons THEY FUCKING SAID THEY ATTACKED US.  No.  It's "our freedoms". 

So, why aren't the Netherlands fucking DUST if that's true?  And Canada and Sweden and Finland and the rest of the countries that are actually freer than we are?  Oh, gee, I wonder.

Gee, because America is the symbol of Democracy and Freedom in this day and age to many? Its also a symbol of the devil/evil to many too.

And yes, we've done alot of shit in those countries. We have bases in their land (which Shogun and I have both posted that we think need to close) by agreement with some of those countries. We've supported rival groups that supported us.  But as Mandark pointed out, in most cases these hardliners are the current fringe groups that want more power/control and to turn their respective countries' governments from secular to religious.

On the Israel issue, I will say this: I think there needs to be a separate Palestine.

[Kestastrophe]

Why not do that and offer tax cuts to companies that keep them here?

good point. I am guessing because in the end it would effectively work like an import tariff, where foreign companies are competitively disadvantaged

[Mandark]

But as Mandark pointed out, in most cases these hardliners are the current fringe groups that want more power/control and to turn their respective countries' governments from secular to religious.

Yeah, but enough about the Republican party.

[Ganhyun]

Why not do that and offer tax cuts to companies that keep them here?

good point. I am guessing because in the end it would effectively work like an import tariff, where foreign companies are competitively disadvantaged

I think we have trade agreements that keep us from doing this as well.

[Ganhyun]

But as Mandark pointed out, in most cases these hardliners are the current fringe groups that want more power/control and to turn their respective countries' governments from secular to religious.

Yeah, but enough about the Republican party.

*Halo voice*

Betrayed...


 

[Kestastrophe]

Just read the Ballmer thing from the other thread.

I think I understand his argument.  In the current situation, Microsoft pays much higher rates on its US profits than its Ireland profits.  So when doing the books, it will shift as many costs as possible under the US umbrella, leaving more of the profit untouched in Ireland.  One way to do this is to hire people in the US.  If you tax their Irish profits at the US rate, then they no longer have this incentive.

I don't think the accounting works exactly like that. If I remember correctly, Microsoft can amortize a large portion of expenses over the expected useful life of software licenses (but this amortized amount does not include R&D, which has to be immediately expensed and is a primary cost driver). You are correct about shifting jobs, but I am not sure of the impact that would tangibly have on the costs. Either way you cut it though, he is talking out of his ass

[Dickie Dee]

Why not do that and offer tax cuts to companies that keep them here?

good point. I am guessing because in the end it would effectively work like an import tariff, where foreign companies are competitively disadvantaged

I think we have trade agreements that keep us from doing this as well.

"International law? I'd better call my lawyer, heheh" -GWB

[Cheebs]

we only have 1 thread for lol news. it made no sense to have decent discussion threads.

Fixed.

political discussion thread = lol
LOOK AT GLENN BECK OWNING THE VIEW OH YEAH = decent dicussion

got it.

lol, did someone get upset? Cheebs if you don't like the thread, don't come in it. You don't see me in the Liberal thread, at least not in a long time.

I can't say how fucking absurd it is to claim those weird right-wing bait topics are serious discussion while the big political thread isn't?

And now that I think about it how is it a liberal thread? sd posts in it all the time.

[Eric P]

well it's not like we treat those posts with the gravitas and decorum i'm certain which is intended.

[Snuflupagulus]

Forwarded to me:

[youtube=560,345][/youtube]

Apparently this is a reading from Glenn Beck's book, The Real America.  No wonder some repubs are coming out in support of gay marriage.  Far less repulsive than the zoophilic romps of Glenn Beck and his sis.

[Tauntaun]

You know, when Jehovah Witnesses show up at my house, I usually deck out the Megadeath or Slayer stuff before I open the door. Makes them change their minds usually.

 

It's Megadeth.

[ShogunOfFear]

Looks like socialism is having hard times in Europe.  Could it be?  Socialism melt down?

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090608/ap_on_re_eu/european_elections

French President Nicolas Sarkozy's governing conservatives trounced the Socialists, while an ecology-minded party vaulted to a surprisingly strong third place, according to official results.

The Socialists, who dominated the last vote in 2004, suffered a stinging defeat, barely clinging to the No. 2 spot.

"Tonight is a very difficult evening for Socialists in many nations in Europe," said Martin Schulz, the leader of the Socialists in the European Parliament. "(We will) continue to fight for social democracy in Europe."
"People don't want a return to socialism and that's why the majority here will be a center-right majority," said Graham Watson, leader of the EU's center-right Liberal Democrat grouping.

In Spain, the conservative Popular Party won two more seats than the ruling Socialists — 23 to 21 seats — with over 88 percent of the vote counted.

In Britain, Prime Minister Gordon Brown was facing a showdown with rebel lawmakers on Monday after the party's expected dismal results in the European parliament and local elections were announced.

Brown has been struggling with the economic crisis and a scandal over lawmakers' expenses. The opposition Conservatives are expected to win the next national election, which must be called by June 2010.

According to a BBC projection, Labour was trailing the United Kingdom Independence Party in third place. It put the main opposition Conservative Party at 27 percent, UKIP at 17 and Labour at 16, followed by smaller parties.

"This time we have come second in a major national election. That is a hell of an achievement," said Nigel Farage, leader of UKIP — which advocates Britain's withdrawal from the European Union.

Europe waking up.  America your next up to bat. 

[Cheebs]

Except America doesn't have a viable socialist party

[Eric P]

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/comic-riffs/2009/06/the_interview_mallard_fillmore.html

thought this may be of interest

[ShogunOfFear]

Except America doesn't have a viable socialist party

Sure we do.  They're called democrats.   

[Ganhyun]

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/comic-riffs/2009/06/the_interview_mallard_fillmore.html

thought this may be of interest

Yea, thats a good article. I've read a few of those comic shorts.  Good find Eric P.

[Cheebs]

Except America doesn't have a viable socialist party

Sure we do.  They're called democrats.   

go tell the european socialists your article talks about and ask if american democrats are socialists.

[Ganhyun]

go see/visit/talk to the european socialists your article talks about and ask if american democrats are socialists.

fixed to what I think he meant.

[Ganhyun]

Also, how bout those gas prices huh? Any guesses on how high they go this year? Obviously not up to 4$ a gallon again I hope.

[Crushed]

Except America doesn't have a viable socialist party

Sure we do.  They're called democrats.   

go tell the european socialists your article talks about and ask if american democrats are socialists.

"What? Why are you calling a bunch of right-wing conservatives like the Democrats, 'socialists'? Strange Americans."

[ShogunOfFear]

Was reading about the dairy industry having troubles in the recession.  I have an idea.

Milk Czar!!  

[Cheebs]

man the democrats are being such extreme socialists! with their refusal to make their health care plan single payer and not nationalizing the banks. sounds like commies to me.

[ShogunOfFear]

Except America doesn't have a viable socialist party

Sure we do.  They're called democrats.   

go tell the european socialists your article talks about and ask if american democrats are socialists.

"What? Why are you calling a bunch of right-wing conservatives like the Democrats, 'socialists'? Strange Americans."

3 Trillion - so conservative.
Owning GM - so right-wing

 

[Cheebs]

and my god, the taxes on the rich will remain lower than under most of reagans 2 terms? god damn socialists.

[ShogunOfFear]

Since the government is now in the role of dictating pay.

[Crushed]

3 Trillion - so conservative.
Owning GM - so right-wing

 

Look I know you don't know what socialism is, and think that anyone to the left of Benito Mussolini is a communist, but that's not really an excuse.

[Cheebs]

Except America doesn't have a viable socialist party

Sure we do.  They're called democrats.   

go tell the european socialists your article talks about and ask if american democrats are socialists.

"What? Why are you calling a bunch of right-wing conservatives like the Democrats, 'socialists'? Strange Americans."

3 Trillion - so conservative.
Owning GM - so right-wing

 

in the american sense? of course democrats aren't conservative. but compared to EUROPEAN SOCIALISTS of which you directly compared to the american democratic party they are clearly much much more conservative.

[ShogunOfFear]

Funny liberals love to use socialism > capitalism to defend their policies, but want to dump the word "socialism" when applied to them.  We can call it socialism "mini me" if you prefer.

[Cheebs]

Funny liberals love to use socialism > capitalism to defend their policies

so, how many democrats in the white house or senate have said that? Seeing how you used european socialists to describe the current elected officials of the democratic party.

show me a list.

[ShogunOfFear]

in the american sense? of course democrats aren't conservative. but compared to EUROPEAN SOCIALISTS of which you directly compared to the american democratic party they are clearly much much more conservative.

But I'm not directly comparing every policy.  Obviously there are differences between some of the policies.  And when the tools of socialism are used, what should we call them if not socialist?   Europe is proof that socialism isn't the perfect utopia.

[Cheebs]

so if anything leaning towards the socialist scale is used that means they should be called socialists?

we had social security and medicare under reagan. socialist polices. is reagan part of the RED MENACE?

[Ganhyun]

Funny liberals love to use socialism > capitalism to defend their policies

so, how many democrats in the white house or senate have said that? Seeing how you used european socialists to describe the current elected officials of the democratic party.

show me a list.

I think Shogun meant that the actions the Democrats take are socialistic. That's why he compared them to European Socialists.

[Cheebs]

Funny liberals love to use socialism > capitalism to defend their policies

so, how many democrats in the white house or senate have said that? Seeing how you used european socialists to describe the current elected officials of the democratic party.

show me a list.

I think Shogun meant that the actions the Democrats take are socialistic. That's why he compared them to European Socialists.

and yet democrats 't pushing for single payer health care or the nationalizing of the banks and so forth. easy socialist policies taken by many socialists in europe.

[ShogunOfFear]

so if anything leaning towards the socialist scale is used that means they should be called socialists?

we had social security and medicare under reagan. socialist polices. is reagan part of the RED MENACE?

Well I don't know if I'd compare Reagan to Obama or Bush even considering he himself said "Government is not the solution to our problems; government is the problem."

If anything Bush started increasing government and Obama is now running with it.

[ShogunOfFear]

and yet democrats 't pushing for single payer health care or the nationalizing of the banks and so forth. easy socialist policies taken by many socialists in europe.

Not yet.  And hopefully it'll stay that way.

[Cheebs]

Obama wants to remain extremely popular with the public like he is now, even if only for that reason I doubt he'll ever do that.

[Cheebs]

anyway I have a damn good reason to support obama's economic polices. the stimulus package resulted in the IT department of a local govt. health care organization to be able to hire some more people, one of which was me. Obama's so called SOCIALISTZZZZZ economic policies got me a job.

[ShogunOfFear]

Health care reform plan would cost more than a trillion dollars.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/06/08/feehery.health.trillion/index.html

What's spending another trillion at this point eh?  Let me guess...

spoiler (click to show/hide)

it's not really spending.

[close]

 
Can we do anything that doesn't cost a trillion dollars?  At least I found something I agree with Obama on...

Obama Taps Well-Known Hacker as Security Adviser

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,525428,00.html

Take that China cyber hackers!!   

[Mandark]

Health care reform plan would cost more than a trillion dollars.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/06/08/feehery.health.trillion/index.html

What's spending another trillion at this point eh?  Let me guess...

That looks like an outright lie.

First, there is no health care bill at this point, not even a preliminary one in committee.  That's why there are all these stories speculating on what Baucus, Nelson, et al are doing behind the scenes.

Secondly, the Obama administration made the first set of health reforms (in the budget bill) revenue-neutral.  In fact, the whole basis of their health care policy is cost containment.

So why would someone try to scare people about the costs of reform?

The Feehery Group already has an impressive list of Fortune 500 companies and trade associations, including Newscorp, Ford Motor Company, PHARMA, and the United States Chamber of Commerce, among its clients.

Well, that clears that up.

[ShogunOfFear]

Hey I'm just posting a story from one of your most trusted LIBERAL networks.  But I'm sure you'll tell us how much it's going to cost.  I bet I know your answer...

spoiler (click to show/hide)

It's going to be free!

[close]

Tell me, where is this money tree you speak of?

[ShogunOfFear]

Seeing that the U.S. spent $2.26 trillion on health care in 2007, I'd say 1 trillion is a generous estimate on all accounts when you take into account we are talking about insuring everyone in the country.

[Mandark]

Hey I'm just posting a story from one of your most trusted LIBERAL networks.

That's not a story.  It's an editorial.  By a Republican operative, at that.  With absolutely no sourcing to back up his numbers.

You haven't done your homework, have you?

[ShogunOfFear]

I suppose I should just take your word for it.   

[Mandark]

Take my word for what?  What are you even arguing here?

[ShogunOfFear]

I wasn't necessarily arguing.  I expected you to post some numbers, figures, or estimates.  The best estimates I've seen for yearly cost of UHC was 69 billion per year and that was from a pro UHC group.  But that number was still just an estimate and they admitted as much.

[Olivia Wilde Homo]

lol wut?

[Mandark]

First, let me repeat, there is no bill currently.  You can't very well ask for a cost estimate of something that doesn't exist.

Second, you don't seem to understand the principles of Obama's health policy.  The plan has always been to lower costs and make insurance more universally affordable, not to simply buy insurance for everyone.  See here.

The costs of UHC have basically nothing to do with the current process.  The only reason I can think you'd bring it up is you haven't been paying terribly close attention.

[brawndolicious]

Funny liberals love to use socialism > capitalism to defend their policies, but want to dump the word "socialism" when applied to them.  We can call it socialism "mini me" if you prefer.

I think your problem is that you think all politicians are complete socialists or capitalists and that anybody who's a little moderate would be forsaking their values or something.

Which is hilarious.

[ShogunOfFear]

News alert some guy on Newsweek has found proof of god.   

[youtube=560,345][/youtube]

First, let me repeat, there is no bill currently.  You can't very well ask for a cost estimate of something that doesn't exist.

The costs of UHC have basically nothing to do with the current process.  The only reason I can think you'd bring it up is you haven't been paying terribly close attention.

Bill or no bill, that doesn't mean people can't predict what it will cost just because you don't like the numbers.  We predict hurricanes every year before hurricane season.  Sometimes those predictions are right, sometimes their wrong, sometimes their close, and sometimes they are very far off.  Still the predictions are made.  You assume Obama will get what he wants, but I think his Gitmo problems proves we don't always get what we want.

[Powerslave]

I think I'm gonna start reading threads like these on sleepless nights.

[Phoenix Dark]

does your country have democracy?