Super Street Fighter IV Arcade Edition 2012 Update Now Up!

[bork]

That was from one guy's post that got deleted on SRK.

[Robo]

Eventhubs posted their new tier list a couple days ago (for your amusement):

http://www.eventhubs.com/guides/2008/oct/17/street-fighter-4-tiers-character-rankings/

Charge character domination.  Probably indicative of how much emphasis this game puts on good normals and zoning.

The sad thing about Dictator is that his absolute worst match-ups are the other A-tier characters, and they're some of the most frequently used.  He's really good (always has been), but he's never gonna have it easy.  :'(

And I think Honda is getting a break on the points and probably should be lower; he dominates the low tier because they can't match his damage output and probably don't have much to deal with headbutt, but how much does that matter?  Balrog should be #4.

[Beezy]

Makoto is at the bottom. Under Dan and Hakan...

[iconoclast]

Some characters are getting a break on points because they dominate the bottom tier. If you take them out of the equation I'd rank it more like this:

A:
Rufus
Ryu
Chun
Guile
Abel

B+:
Bison
Balrog
Akuma
Honda

B:
Viper
Dhalsim
Sagat
Zangief
Seth

[Robo]

If you base it on how characters perform against the top set of characters, it still ends up with Chun on top.  And from an eyeball glance, it looks like she, Dictator and Seth (having the least) have the fewest number of poor match-ups total.

[bork]

I'm curious as to why no one ever seems to win big tournaments using those three, then.

[Robo]

The match-up points aren't applicable to people that are good enough to win big tournaments.  They operate in their own tiny subset as far as matches-ups are concerned, where play skill offsets the individual match-up every time.

Tier lists are more to amuse the much larger set of mid-/high-level players of roughly equal skill, relatively speaking.

[brob]

Just got out of a endless lobby where Robo and some other dude creamed me again and again. Good fun, but I always feel so awkward when I can't put up a proper fight, like I'm going to bore them with my simple shit. Let alone the fact that I've only played Adon in Super so all my SF4 vanilla characters are rusty as all hell...

Is it even possible to punish sonic booms with Adon's U1?  I feel he recovers way too fast for that to be viable, granted, I can't pull off any mid-level execution on my 360 pad so I'm not gonna pretend that my spamming-ass would be able to speak on the subject.

 

[Robo]

Good games, man.  You know what you're doing, so it's not a bore.

Is it even possible to punish sonic booms with Adon's U1?

Sonic booms aren't really punishable by ANY standard method of punishing fireballs.    I think utilizing EX jag kick a little more might've helped close the space a bit.  Jag tooth isn't a bad option either, but isn't so hot at clearing fireballs sometimes and is punishable if baited.  Once you get in and score a knockdown, you gotta go for the cross-ups and start mixing up high, low and throw and keep on the pressure (all the while being wary of reversal flashkick because it's very likely coming at some point).

[brob]

ya, if my execution was better and I had a proper pad/stick I'd try to be more aggressive with block strings in the corner, (instant) air jagga kicks, and doing instant overheads and whatnot on knockdowns. I have such issues with the 360 pad so I tend to focus more on trying to space properly and making sure the inputs register, rather than doing combos, block-strings and hit confirming (which I should work on).

I'll be back though. hopefully with a stick once I get some cash-flow going.

[bork]

Lately I've been playing endless and making lobbies where (people on my friends list/in chat rooms) you can only use characters you don't main.  I.E., ones you think you are an amateur with.  It's been fun (and I am finding myself really liking Juri again!), with the exception of one or two people who pick characters they don't main, but are also way too good with. 

I used Juri last night in a room made by a name I recognized...it was the guy I played as in ranked as E. Honda, in a match I put on Youtube.  He was still using Chun-Li.  I beat him and he kicked me.     Played this guy who was okay-ish with Dictator.  I would have easily taken him out with Chun, but I stuck with Juri and couldn't beat him.  Got close to it and he switched up after that.  Robo, I'd like to play you so I can get some good practice in.

[Rman]

I've really been enjoying Mak of late.  She's really fun.  Although the road getting consistent wins not so much fun.

[Beezy]

I've really been enjoying Mak of late.  She's really fun.  Although the road getting consistent wins not so much fun.

join the club

[Rman]

Game never gets old.  Did anyone catch the God's Garden stream with Sako and Momoch?.  Sako has a sick Cammy.

[Himu]

sako's cammy

[Beezy]

I wanted to use Cammy, but I don't think I can do stuff that seems to be basic with her like those instant aerial spiral arrows or doing the EX ones repeatedly. She's the final piece to my ex-team Bison (Rose, Abel and Cammy).

[Himu]

Those are easy.

This, however, is hard.


[youtube=560,345]VxMikQLxOtI[/youtube]

[bork]

That guy using Cammy wasn't exactly using the best of strategies against that Gief player.  There were plenty of instances where he had the life lead and should have backed off, making the Gief come to him/running away.  Plus it looked like at the end of the second round, he could have finished off Gief with his ultra but didn't.

I wanted to use Cammy, but I don't think I can do stuff that seems to be basic with her like those instant aerial spiral arrows or doing the EX ones repeatedly. She's the final piece to my ex-team Bison (Rose, Abel and Cammy).

Are you talking about the "Tiger Knee Cannon Strikes" that you do on the ground?  Those are tough to do consistently on a pad, IMO.  You don't need them to do well with Cammy but they definitely help, plus you can use them while across the screen from someone to build meter quickly.  Or do you just mean the basic spiral arrows?  'Cuz those are just fireball motions and easy as hell to do. You'll just quickly enough.

Cammy is a lot of fun to use.  I actually play her more like a grappler and like to get in close with strikes, pokes, and lots of throws/hooligans.  When you're starting out with her, you just want to make sure that you're not treating Cammy like a shoto (lots of spiral arrows and random cannon spikes) and not doing her EX hooligans at all OR doing them every chance you get meter.  A lot of people don't take advantage of her spinning back fist move either.

[Beezy]

I mean jump forward and do the spiral arrow in the air. Some people do it so quick that it doesn't look like they jumped and they can do it over and over repeatedly. In the vid Himu posted, the Cammy player is doing it at the beginning.

[Robo]

I made a post awhile back about how to do it.  I certainly wouldn't call it "basic".  Instant-air cannon strikes are pretty essential if you plan to get really good with her, though --they add to her pressure and mix-up considerably.  It's some of the hardest mix-up in the game to deal with, in my opinion.

It's not easy, but what you need to do is roll a quarter circle down to back, then quickly roll to diagonally up/foward and tap kick, with just enough time in between to leave the ground slightly. 

Looking at your keyboard's calculator, the motion is something like: 2149K ((Image removed from quote.)(Image removed from quote.)+(Image removed from quote.)).  Or you can roll it the entire way: 214789K

If you don't roll the QCB correctly or you press the K too quickly, a cannon spike will sometimes come out, and if you don't hit diagonally up/foward fast enough, she'll jump back.  It's pretty tough to do consistently.  Get the basics down first and you can learn her dive kick insanity later.

This explanation isn't the greatest, but the basic idea is to roll the QCB first and THEN jump forward, rather than the reverse.  The game doesn't know any different with regard to the inputs.

[Beezy]

Thanks, I didn't know you could do it that way. And by basic, I meant that it's a basic move that you need to know if you seriously plan on using Cammy.

[Robo]

That's pretty much the ONLY way to do it that close the ground.  You can apply the same technique to a bunch of other characters with similar commands, like Adon or Makoto's axe kicks, although I don't think it's possible to do them quite as low as Cammy's

edit: After testing my crappy theory, I take it back; it's much harder to do it that way for these two because the game doesn't let you do the move off the ground instantly.  Easier to just to jump forward and quickly roll QCB.

[Himu]

Beezy, a great link I'm learning from Sako's vids is jumping cannon drill -> c.FP -> c.FK

[Beezy]

I hate the timing on links.

[Don Flamenco]

i like how people screw up links online and you just mash something to punish them automatically.  seems like a bit of an imbalanced risk/reward thing...

[Robo]

It is, sorta.  I really don't like how you can mash inputs during block stun, but getting hit by gimmicky stuff like that should be a one time thing.  If you notice someone is doing that shit, you can PURPOSEFULLY halt your strings and let their move come out (assuming we're not talking about Zangief or T.Hawk), then punish it hard.

And do it again and again until they stop, then tick-throw like mad.  Most players who do that are into the habit of doing it CONSTANTLY, so it'll probably be a round or two before they stop.  Ultimately, I think it does more harm than good.

That said, it's not bad to do every once in awhile, especially if you're very low on health and desperately need a shift in momentum.  And it can be safe if you're prepared to FADC it.  Obviously you can't cancel it if it doesn't hit, so you need to be aware of the range too.  It doesn't have to be totally brainless.

[iconoclast]

Beezy, a great link I'm learning from Sako's vids is jumping cannon drill -> c.FP -> c.FK

this is a good combo because a sweep is untechable. cammy has a strong wakeup game thanks to her instant cannon strike, which is a free combo on someone if they're trying to option select a throw. i hate that shit with her and rufus.

cannon strike, cr.hp, cr.mk xx hk cannon drill does more damage though.

i like how people screw up links online and you just mash something to punish them automatically.  seems like a bit of an imbalanced risk/reward thing...

yeah, the HUEG reversal window in SF4 is one of the most annoying things about the game (having to link the final move of a combo in order to cancel it into a special is still the worst). if someone is constantly mashing between hitstrings, just stop and block for a second and they'll be open for a big combo once they whiff whatever it is they're doing. or if someone is mashing 360s during hitstrings you can neutral jump, but that is a lot more risky.

beaten

[Robo]

I don't like neutral jumping throw characters; at best, it's a free lariat and knockdown for Zangief if you guess wrong.  :'(  Better to just choose your block strings wisely and get the hell out range.

[Robo]

cannon strike, cr.hp, cr.mk xx hk cannon drill does more damage though.

Easier to hit too, and it seems to give you better position for dive kicks.  Really sucks ass if you miss that link, though.

[Rman]

Chun Li is a beast in this game.  Easily my worst match.  She just has so many tools.

[Himu]

I'm still trying to figure out how Sako's pulls these moves off. I've been trying to pull some of them off and a lot of them are wtf. Maybe I'm doing something wrong.

[youtube=560,345]d2Bj1KhGvVg[/youtube]

How does Sako focus parry like that? Tap focus parry (don't hold it) and then cancel by backdashing? 00:27

Another good one is 2:45

And finally, he manages to do a back jump and pull off a jumping cannon drill. wtf I have tried doing a backwards cannon drill for the longest. HOW. Does he go back and then cancel and pull the move? Timestamp is 2:25

[iconoclast]

You don't tap the focus to do that, you just hold it and you can dash forward or backward in order to cancel the move. And you can only do an EX cannon spike while jumping backwards. A regular one won't work.

But really, the best thing about that match was Tokido's option select ultra at 1:02. Tokido

[Beezy]

[youtube=560,345][/youtube]

[youtube=560,345][/youtube]

Someone wanna explain how the hell do you do these? I understand FADC, but not into fuckin charge ultras.

[Akala]

[iconoclast]

You have to quickly double tap one of the beginning motions of the ultra. Like with Balrog, sometimes I dash ultra through fireballs, so when I do that I input: b, ff, b, f + PPP. So to flashkick -> ultra with Guile, you need to do: db, ub + hk, mk+mp, bb, f, b, f + PPP. Forward dashing out of the focus works as well, but the timing is a little different and he can cross under the opponent, so you're better off back dashing. It's easier said than done though; you have to be pretty fast with the inputs to pull it off.

Dee Jay can also do something similar with his U2. You can do EX machine gun upper, forward dash, ultra. His is way harder to do IMO.

[Himu]

You don't tap the focus to do that, you just hold it and you can dash forward or backward in order to cancel the move. And you can only do an EX cannon spike while jumping backwards. A regular one won't work.

But really, the best thing about that match was Tokido's option select ultra at 1:02. Tokido

Ah, no wonder. Thanks.

[Beezy]

Rman, sorry about my trash talking friend. He just got the game a few days ago and he's letting his few wins get to his head.

[Rman]

I couldn't hear him.  I had music blasting in the background. 

[Beezy]

Oh ok, cool. I hate your Guile btw. I forgot how bad that matchup is for Makoto.

[Himu]

Fought a Balrog tonight called NINJABEEZY

[Robo]

Man, I hate Rose.  Not sure what to do against her with Guile.  Even the crappiest Rose gives me a lot of trouble.

Normally, I'll just try to annoy people using a character that can match projectiles with me into playing more aggressively with a lot of neutral jumping, focus attacks and some sick sunglasses attacks, but Rose has essentially the same long/mid-range game, and she can reflect sonic booms, which makes it more difficult to even create the illusion of attempting to control space.  Coming in on her is made more difficult because of cr.FP, which comes out FAST and beats pretty much anything airborne, and slide under sonic boom at weird ranges, which, even if you predict one, is near-impossible to punish with Guile.  A clever mix of those three options and Guile's zoning and offense are virtually gone.  And oh those frame traps --I don't even want to talk about that.  Defense is not easy either.

Starts to get a little easier if you can score a knockdown, that is, until she gets enough meter Ultra2, which she can pull out for free at ANY TIME and reverse the situation.

Kinda reminds me of the mirror match, except my tools aren't equally effective.

[Beezy]

Rose

I mainly use her and Makoto now.

Fought a Balrog tonight called NINJABEEZY

[TripleA]

I want to beat up someone with Ken

[Rman]

Oh ok, cool. I hate your Guile btw. I forgot how bad that matchup is for Makoto.

I main Guile in ranked.  But I usually like to focus on other characters in Endless.

[bork]

Oh ok, cool. I hate your Guile btw. I forgot how bad that matchup is for Makoto.

Just Guile?  Don't you mean EVERYONE? 

It would be great if they not only "fix" Makoto in the SSF4 arcade version, but also if they make her so good that she's at the top.  Hakan and Dan too.   

[Rman]

Oh ok, cool. I hate your Guile btw. I forgot how bad that matchup is for Makoto.

Just Guile?  Don't you mean EVERYONE? 

It would be great if they not only "fix" Makoto in the SSF4 arcade version, but also if they make her so good that she's at the top.  Hakan and Dan too.  

I never played Makoto in 3s, but how was she nerfed? 

[Robo]

For starters, and probably the most basic thing with regard to her offense, her dash punch pressure wasn't punishable on block (without red parry) and didn't have a lot of pushback, so she was in range to easily mix-up command grab and pokes off a string.  From a grab, she could combo into her SA2 (which is essentially Ultra2) from a standing FP, do the same sort of follow-up you can do after a U2 in SSF4, and on top of the massive damage, you'd only be a hit or two away from being stunned if you weren't already stunned in the middle of the follow-up.  Getting caught in that command grab was a HELL of a lot more dangerous than it is in SSF4, which, aside from a full-stock combo of grab -> st.FP xx dash punch xx Super -> Ultra1, is almost laughable comparatively.

And of course, the parry system makes 3S's defensive game completely different, and she wasn't given any new tools to compensate for the loss.  They probably should've just made her "dragon punch" attack (whatever it's called) come out a bit faster and allowed it to hit characters on the ground more easily so she could have something to use as a reversal (although since she can dash/jump cancel that attack, maybe that's not such a great idea either).

Essentially, like a lot of the low tier in SSF4, she just loses pretty bad to rushdown and zoning because she doesn't have shit to deal with it.  And her damage output isn't as high as it should be considering her high risk playstyle.

Her command grabs seems to kinda suck in SSF4 too.  That thing grabbed like a fucking SPD in 3S --grab you out of ANYTHING from stupid range, but the range seems borked now and it doesn't even seem to grab limbs.  Is the EX version that absorbs a hit even useful at all?  I don't think I've ever seen someone use that effectively.

[Himu]

Arcade version of Super Street Fighter IV? They gonna make a Super Street Fight IV Turbo? Because I wouldn't buy it.

[Robo]

Nah, still SSF4, but with some additions/changes, most likely.  Probably will be DLC on the console version.

[Robo]

Still on Makoto, you can sorta think of Abel (who is high-tier) as a non-broken Makoto.  Same high risk/reward playstyle and he's got a lot of similar stuff, except it actually works and he's got the damage output to make it stick.

[Beezy]

Still on Makoto, you can sorta think of Abel (who is high-tier) as a non-broken Makoto.  Same high risk/reward playstyle and he's got a lot of similar stuff, except it actually works and he's got the damage output to make it stick.

It's not as fun to play with him though. I don't like his pokes and normals.

[bork]

Nah, still SSF4, but with some additions/changes, most likely.  Probably will be DLC on the console version.

It's supposed to have some re-balancing.  We know it's going to have two more characters, and Ono has said there's a possibility of new moves being added.

I have to wonder about this being DLC; how big is that file size going to be?  Makes you wonder if they will end up releasing "SSF4 GOTY Edition" with all the arcade content on the disc, plus the outfits all unlocked.

[Robo]

Sunglasses need some start-up invincibility frames.

[Akala]

Nah, still SSF4, but with some additions/changes, most likely.  Probably will be DLC on the console version.

It's supposed to have some re-balancing.  We know it's going to have two more characters, and Ono has said there's a possibility of new moves being added.

I have to wonder about this being DLC; how big is that file size going to be?  Makes you wonder if they will end up releasing "SSF4 GOTY Edition" with all the arcade content on the disc, plus the outfits all unlocked.

would probably buy 

[Himu]

PLEASE nerf Ryu in the next update.

[Robo]

If they nerf him any more, he'll be Dan tier. 

[Rman]

Ryu isn't an easy win character.  He takes work, just like the other characters.  He's definitely no Vanilla Sagat.  He's also the most well known match up for most people, him and Ken.

I was playing one scrub, who just kept chucking hadokens while I filled my revenge gauge by focusing all day.  I hit him with two Sonic Hurricanes at 80 percent health in one round.

[iconoclast]

Some concept art of the new costumes at the link.

http://www.andriasang.com/e/blog/2010/09/10/super_sfiv_new_costumes/

New arranged costumes are on the way for the console versions of Super Street Fighter IV, and the game's development blog provided a first look today.

Have a look at a new type of Ryu, Alpha-style Chun-Li, kitty Cammy (complete with tail!), sexy Juri, and Suited Fei-Long.

According to the blog, these costumes (and perhaps more) will be shown at the Tokyo Game Show next week, running on actual hardware. We can also expects more specific details then.

The blog also says that Capcom will be announcing future developments for the console versions of Super SFIV at the show. That might be in reference just to these costumes, but perhaps we can expect additional announcements as well.

Before TGS, Super Street Fighter IV's arcade version will be making its second location test appearance, this time in Osaka. The blog would not confirm if the location test would feature new characters, but did say that the game has changed considerably from the previous location test version.

Juri and Fei's costumes look awesome. Ryu's is decent I guess, Cammy is lol, and Chun is

Also, Yun confirmed via Ono's twitter:

[Beezy]

Juri

[bork]

SSF4 Loke Test notes.  Yang is indeed the second new character.  Was really hoping for someone else.

But check out the nerfs n' buffs!  Guile, Seth, Blanka = OWNED.  Makoto, Hakan = Might be good now!

Early reports from the Super Street Fighter 4 Arcade Edition location test that just started in Osaka are saying that the build available seems the same as the console version with Yun and Yang added. Keep your eye on this post for any updates about how Yun and Yang handle, or anything else anyone at the test learns. REMEMBER - This is a location test. Things can and will change between now and the final release.

Apparently it is insanely busy at the location test, and it is difficult to test anything. You pay 100 Yen to play, and if you don't play your hardest with your main, you are probably going to lose and go to the back of the 45 minute line pretty quickly. Everyone there is bringing us as much information as they can, but Capcom employees are practically tackling anyone who has a cell phone out. No photos or video are allowed.

5:38PM PST-Yun's Genei Jin is his super. No word yet on his Ultras. (Anonymous Location Tester)
5:44PM PST-Ingrid is nowhere to be seen. (Anonymous Location Tester)
5:57PM PST-Yun feels stiff like Makoto does, but has his target combos (Anonymous Location Tester)
6:02PM PST-Yang also has his 3s target combos (Anonymous Location Tester)
6:18PM PST-Hakan's oil now stacks and he has a Kick follow-up to Oil. He can reportedly combo standing light kick into Oil.(Anonymous Location Tester)
6:27PM PST-Hakan's kick followup might be on Oil Slide. Waiting for confirmation, this was worded oddly.(Anonymous Location Tester)
6:43PM PST-Zangeif's EX Green Hand no longer causes knockdown. (Anonymous Location Tester)
6:44PM PST-Blocked Blanka Ball distance is halved. (Anonymous Location Tester)
6:45PM PST-Ryu and Akuma's Air hurricane kicks are not good for escaping anymore. (Anonymous Location Tester)
6:46PM PST-Juri's kick fireball combos more naturally (meaning that if the upkick part hits and you do not hold the button to store it, the fireball will combo)(Anonymous Location Tester)
6:47PM PST-Something drastic has been done to Seth's jumping Hard Punch. It may be removed, waiting for more info. 2nd source confirms it has been removed. (Anonymous Location Tester)
6:51PM PST-Hakan can cancel 360K move now, reportedly with a crouch. (Anonymous Location Tester)
6:55PM PST-Honda U2 motion seems to have changed to HCBx2 (Anonymous Location Tester)
6:57PM PST-Hakan Slide Kick follow up seems to be auto oilup. (Anonymous Location Tester)
7:02PM PST-Zangeif jab SPD range seems bigger, but the source says it could be eyes playing tricks (Anonymous Location Tester)
7:09PM PST-Multiple sources saw a Yun Genei Jin combo do near 50%, so it is looking like a very strong super.(Anonymous Location Tester)