Mass Effect 2 Thread

[Raban]

I'm on my second playthrough, doing all the sidequests; holy shit so much busywork. Some of these are cool, but other ones have no reason to be in the game. I'm not even going to touch the half-assed collect-a-thons. I hope this shit is axed in the second game.

[maxy]

It seems that mako is out...no driving at all...bastards

crappy OXM scan
http://item.slide.com/r/1/39/i/6x5WuIdG7D_Eyiv_58pXpCenSHXepjhJ/

[demi]

Sweet, that's one thing fixed

[Raban]

It seems that mako is out...no driving at all...bastards

crappy OXM scan
http://item.slide.com/r/1/39/i/6x5WuIdG7D_Eyiv_58pXpCenSHXepjhJ/

I really don't like what they're doing with the exploratory part of ME. First you have to be flying the Normandy yourself instead of just using the map, adding the additional worry of fuel, then you have to scan the whole planet and identify points of interest, it's stupid. Of all the broken things in ME, the exploration was not one of them. The monotonous, boring-ass, side-quests taking place in the same two fucking buildings no matter what planet you went to, sucked. The controls of the Mako sucked, they could have just fixed them and kept it around, because I liked trucking around on alien planets, just not when it was a three square-mile crater with nothing to do but look at the horribly tiled textures. The weapon overheat system worked, as did the health, and both have changed.

As skeptical as I am, I still trust BioWare to do the right thing with their own damn IP.

[maxy]

Good OXM scans

http://img532.imageshack.us/img532/990/img001.jpg
http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/8084/img002f.jpg
http://img37.imageshack.us/img37/1549/img003kn.jpg
http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/980/img004qk.jpg
http://img695.imageshack.us/img695/5281/img005im.jpg

[Stoney Mason]

[youtube=560,345][/youtube]

[Howard Alan Treesong]

The main quest can be beaten in 15 hours anyways.

Took me 10 hours on Normal. Maybe like two side-quests.

Yeah, I'm playing on Easy, no side quests, and it's gonna take 8-9 hours. If anyone wants Paragon Female Shepard data for the PC, lemme know and I'll hook you up once I finish.

[Raban]

[youtube=560,345][/youtube]

I'm really annoyed by this character. And the CGI used for these trailers looks horribad. Still hype.

[Yeti]

Is "Fight for the Lost" the official subtitle now?

[Himu]

My team shall be Shephard, Subject Zero and Miranda.

[Cormacaroni]

My team shall be Shephard, Subject Zero and Miranda.

It's like you're saying you don't like cock or something.

[cool breeze]

Subject Zero is totally a juggalette

The main quest can be beaten in 15 hours anyways.

Took me 10 hours on Normal. Maybe like two side-quests.

Yeah, I'm playing on Easy, no side quests, and it's gonna take 8-9 hours. If anyone wants Paragon Female Shepard data for the PC, lemme know and I'll hook you up once I finish.

just a heads up, they already said that there will be rewards depending on your level in the save game you import.  I think they specifically mentioned one for 50 and 60 (50 is the max you can get on one playthrough).

[Stoney Mason]

I'm fine with the subject zero chick.

I didn't care for Sten at all by comparison. Medieval Goth is worse than Space Age Goth.

[Stoney Mason]

[youtube=560,345][/youtube]

[Himu]

http://kotaku.com/5446283/mass-effect-2-sets-its-sights-on-the-modern-warfare-crowd?skyline=true&s=x

Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat.

Bioware's goal, Hudson says, is to attract a non role-playing game audience and show them that they actually like the genre.

"A lot of what we are interested in in terms of audience is surprising people that they like RPGs," he said. "That's our favorite kind of new gamer. It's not that we would ever want to go away from making a great RPG experience, it's more about finding ways to show people that even though they didn't know it, they really like RPGs."

[Stoney Mason]

They are a business.
They want more people to buy their games.
They focused on fixing the shooting bits in the game since those were the weak points of the prior game.
It's a shooter rpg on a shooter box console.
They want to attract the larger shooter crowd that dwarfs the niche RPG crowd to get more sales by making the shooter part competent so it's a competent experience in that regard.

What part are you shocked about?

[demi]

Uh oh... Himuro to rebel against WRPGs next?

[pilonv1]

hmm might have to go with a 360 version to keep my saved character.

[Himu]

They are a business.
They want more people to buy their games.
They focused on fixing the shooting bits in the game since those were the weak points of the prior game.
It's a shooter rpg on a shooter box console.
They want to attract the larger shooter crowd that dwarfs the niche RPG crowd to get more sales by making the shooter part competent so it's a competent experience in that regard.

What part are you shocked about?

I'm just disappointed they're downplaying the rpg elements. What's wrong with that? I'm an rpg fan.

Do you have to support everything a developer does in order to understand why they're doing it or are you just playing dumb?

[Stoney Mason]

I'm just disappointed they're downplaying the rpg elements. What's wrong with that? I'm an rpg fan.

Do you have to support everything a developer does in order to understand why they're doing it or are you just playing dumb?

The first game was a streamlined rpg. If you had any delusions that this game was suddenly going to become Baldur's Gate 3 then I'm not sure what to say.

[Himu]

I'm just disappointed they're downplaying the rpg elements. What's wrong with that? I'm an rpg fan.

Do you have to support everything a developer does in order to understand why they're doing it or are you just playing dumb?

The first game was a streamlined rpg. If you had any delusions that this game was suddenly going to become Baldur's Gate 3 then I'm not sure what to say.

The first game was a streamlined rpg, but it was still definitely an rpg. Now you can't even level up on the spot anymore. You have to wait till you're done with the mission because leveling up apparently gets in the way of the action.

That's stupid.

And no amount of damage control can defend it unless you actually want it to be a full fledged third person shooter with rpg elements rather than an rpg with a third person shooter combat system.

[Stoney Mason]

meh. I'll stop arguing.

The game will be out in a few weeks and then I'll be more than happy to discuss and dissect any criticism (since I had a lot directed at the first and felt it was mostly over-rated) at that point when anybody has actually played the game rather than nitpicking aspects I don't really care about. It seems to me you already have a pre-crafted position here.

[cool breeze]

I think it's smart of them to make it more of a shooter with rpg rather than some failed hybrid like the first game.  The shooting mechanic and specifically cover mechanic were a joke in the first game, and the western rpg aspects weren't much better.  All the changes they've talked about seem for the better.  You're still going to have hubs to have dialogue and things like that and leveling up and all that, but unlike the first game, it doesn't sound like I'll be bored out of my mind using my sniper shotgun to kill enemies like it's nothing.  Beyond just making it play like a proper shooter, there seems to be a good squad mechanic now.

[demi]

I guess it would be too much work to play the game first

[Great Rumbler]

I'm just disappointed they're downplaying the rpg elements. What's wrong with that? I'm an rpg fan.

Do you have to support everything a developer does in order to understand why they're doing it or are you just playing dumb?

The first game was a streamlined rpg. If you had any delusions that this game was suddenly going to become Baldur's Gate 3 then I'm not sure what to say.

The first game was a streamlined rpg, but it was still definitely an rpg. Now you can't even level up on the spot anymore. You have to wait till you're done with the mission because leveling up apparently gets in the way of the action.

That's stupid.

And no amount of damage control can defend it unless you actually want it to be a full fledged third person shooter with rpg elements rather than an rpg with a third person shooter combat system.

While Mass Effect 2 will remain very solidly in the realm of role-playing game, the combat has been reworked specifically to try and attract the same sort of gamer who plays Modern Warfare 2

Hudson says the game stays true to the evolving definition of what makes a game a role-playing title.

Our definition of role-playing games is that in addition to the core gameplay you have the ability to explore your world freely, have a non-linear story and the progression of your character.

In the case of Mass Effect 2, while the game's combat feel a lot more like a straight third-person shooter, it's still built on the base of an RPG.

In the combat areas you are fighting your way through areas, you're shooting, you're planning your squad, you're doing all of the same things in this one as Mass Effect one, but each element works a little bit better.

It's no less of an RPG.

So...uh...what exactly is the problem here?

[Stoney Mason]

I think it's smart of them to make it more of a shooter with rpg rather than some failed hybrid like the first game.  The shooting mechanic and specifically cover mechanic were a joke in the first game, and the western rpg aspects weren't much better.  All the changes they've talked about seem for the better.  You're still going to have hubs to have dialogue and things like that and leveling up and all that, but unlike the first game, it doesn't sound like I'll be bored out of my mind using my sniper shotgun to kill enemies like it's nothing.  Beyond just making it play like a proper shooter, there seems to be a good squad mechanic now.

What was frustrating about the first was that it could have been so great but there was just so many issues it dragged the whole experience down.

I was blown away by the aesthetic and the mood, and aspects of the story and universe and voice acting. But the shooter parts were mostly balls. The inventory system was painful. The sidequests were poorly integrated, the leveling upgrades weren't balanced and doled out at a nice clip, etc. Those are the issues that need to be addressed. I'm far less worried about it not being RPG enough.

[Himu]

I actually think it's a good thing they're updating the shooting. I'm just mixed, is all. I think better shooting is great, but not at the expense of rpg'ing.

I'm just disappointed they're downplaying the rpg elements. What's wrong with that? I'm an rpg fan.

Do you have to support everything a developer does in order to understand why they're doing it or are you just playing dumb?

The first game was a streamlined rpg. If you had any delusions that this game was suddenly going to become Baldur's Gate 3 then I'm not sure what to say.

The first game was a streamlined rpg, but it was still definitely an rpg. Now you can't even level up on the spot anymore. You have to wait till you're done with the mission because leveling up apparently gets in the way of the action.

That's stupid.

And no amount of damage control can defend it unless you actually want it to be a full fledged third person shooter with rpg elements rather than an rpg with a third person shooter combat system.

While Mass Effect 2 will remain very solidly in the realm of role-playing game, the combat has been reworked specifically to try and attract the same sort of gamer who plays Modern Warfare 2

Hudson says the game stays true to the evolving definition of what makes a game a role-playing title.

Our definition of role-playing games is that in addition to the core gameplay you have the ability to explore your world freely, have a non-linear story and the progression of your character.

In the case of Mass Effect 2, while the game's combat feel a lot more like a straight third-person shooter, it's still built on the base of an RPG.

In the combat areas you are fighting your way through areas, you're shooting, you're planning your squad, you're doing all of the same things in this one as Mass Effect one, but each element works a little bit better.

It's no less of an RPG.

So...uh...what exactly is the problem here?

Bioware says a lot of things.

[Himu]

meh. I'll stop arguing.

The game will be out in a few weeks and then I'll be more than happy to discuss and dissect any criticism (since I had a lot directed at the first and felt it was mostly over-rated) at that point when anybody has actually played the game rather than nitpicking aspects I don't really care about. It seems to me you already have a pre-crafted position here.

I don't have a pre-crafted position. I'm just sayin'. I'm still going to get it on day one and I'm still pumped, more than I should be even. But some of the new details that have come to light really make me wonder what Bioware is thinking and who this game is being marketed to.

[Cormacaroni]

I think it's smart of them to make it more of a shooter with rpg rather than some failed hybrid like the first game.  The shooting mechanic and specifically cover mechanic were a joke in the first game, and the western rpg aspects weren't much better.  All the changes they've talked about seem for the better.  You're still going to have hubs to have dialogue and things like that and leveling up and all that, but unlike the first game, it doesn't sound like I'll be bored out of my mind using my sniper shotgun to kill enemies like it's nothing.  Beyond just making it play like a proper shooter, there seems to be a good squad mechanic now.

What was frustrating about the first was that it could have been so great but there was just so many issues it dragged the whole experience down.

I was blown away by the aesthetic and the mood, and aspects of the story and universe and voice acting. But the shooter parts were mostly balls. The inventory system was painful. The sidequests were poorly integrated, the leveling upgrades weren't balanced and doled out at a nice clip, etc. Those are the issues that need to be addressed. I'm far less worried about it not being RPG enough.

Stoney, not that you care, but you are rapidly becoming one of my favorite posters on the gaming side. 
Cosign all of this. Making the shooting more like MW2 is NOT a problem; it's fixing THE problem with ME1.

[Stoney Mason]

I don't have a pre-crafted position. I'm just sayin'. I'm still going to get it on day one and I'm still pumped, more than I should be even. But some of the new details that have come to light really make me wonder what Bioware is thinking and who this game is being marketed to.

Why do you care "who the game is being marketed to"?

The game is the game.

This is the same stupid shit where everybody knew how Dragon Age was going to be based on  Marilyn Manson marketing and then suddenly when the game turned out well, all the psychics didn't know what the hell they were talking about. Just to be clear if its not already they market a game to the masses. That's the way it is. They also make the game for the masses if you can tolerate that dirty little secret. You're on safer ground analyzing the game especially after you've played it. Not the marketing of said game. And I still don't even see what was wrong with the link you posted.  

[Raban]

Himuro, I usually agree with you, but stop being a vagina. This is BioWare we're talking about. Has BioWare even made an action game? Ever? Like actually developed one? If they did, it was a mistake. There's a list of things that are actually worth wringing your hands about in the press releases for ME2, but if there's one thing that is undoubtedly NOT worth hand-wringing, is whether or not Mass Effect 2, a game developed by BIOWARE, is going to be RPG enough to satisfy fans of the genre.

[Great Rumbler]

The combat was pretty forgettable and bland in ME1, anything they can do to make it better/more interesting can only be a good thing.

[Himu]

Himuro, I usually agree with you, but stop being a vagina. This is BioWare we're talking about. Has BioWare even made an action game? Ever? Like actually developed one? If they did, it was a mistake. There's a list of things that are actually worth wringing your hands about in the press releases for ME2, but if there's one thing that is undoubtedly NOT worth hand-wringing, is whether or not Mass Effect 2, a game developed by BIOWARE, is going to be RPG enough to satisfy fans of the genre.

MDK2.

Also, I'm not complaining about better shooting in the least. That's actually a good thing.

I'm totally fine with that. I'm not fine with dumbing down an already dumbed down rpg formula in the game's sequel. That's really it, and it's a pretty understandable stance.

Is it expected given the direction of the industry? Maybe. Have I played the game? Nope. But I'm certainly disappointed with some direction Bioware is taking the series. You might as well market it as a third person shooter rather than an rpg; hence my problem.

[bork]

preorder in, no ltd edition. As a wise man said "LTD edition? think i will skip it as i get little value from them nowadays - just a chunky box"

Thanks for the reminder!  I just pre-ordered it from Play-Asia too; since it's an EA game I have no idea if it will be region-free or not as their releases tend to vary.

[Himu]

when the hell can I buy this off of steam?

[brawndolicious]

The game is the game.

The shooting felt so sterile and unbalanced in the first game that I'm happy if fixing it is their main priority with the sequel.  I'm hoping that we'll see an Assassin's Creed 2 effect where the developers build upon the decent skeleton of the first game and fix all the major issues to make something truly great.

[maxy]

Himuro, I usually agree with you, but stop being a vagina. This is BioWare we're talking about. Has BioWare even made an action game? Ever? Like actually developed one? If they did, it was a mistake. There's a list of things that are actually worth wringing your hands about in the press releases for ME2, but if there's one thing that is undoubtedly NOT worth hand-wringing, is whether or not Mass Effect 2, a game developed by BIOWARE, is going to be RPG enough to satisfy fans of the genre.

MDK2.

Also, I'm not complaining about better shooting in the least. That's actually a good thing.

I'm totally fine with that. I'm not fine with dumbing down an already dumbed down rpg formula in the game's sequel. That's really it, and it's a pretty understandable stance.

Is it expected given the direction of the industry? Maybe. Have I played the game? Nope. But I'm certainly disappointed with some direction Bioware is taking the series. You might as well market it as a third person shooter rather than an rpg; hence my problem.

I have the same feeling Himuro,the more i read about it the more i hate it.
If they dumb it down to TPS Gears of War,Uncharted like garbage i am going to be pretty mad

Critics will rave about it,no doubt about that,but that means nothing to me.

Maybe i should stop reading about it

[Cormacaroni]

Jeez, guys please just remember one unalterable fact of game development: sequels are 95%+ the same game as the first. The differences get played up in the pre-release press because it's more interesting to talk about the changes than the stuff that stays the same. But ME2 will play pretty much the same as ME1, bank on it. I'm excited for incremental improvements, sure, but mostly I'm excited about a continuation of an already great game.

[Jansen]

they ditched the overheat on weapons and added ammo counters (thank god!), you can't upgrade you squads equipment (they upgrade automatically at certain levels), and you can't level up during a mission (exp is tallied up at the end of the mission and then you can level up).

out of those changes the only one that bothers me is not being able to upgrade my squads armor. that's pretty fucking lame imo.

[Yeti]

I love leveling up during missions. I'm sad they removed that.  :'(

[dark1x]

Himuro, I usually agree with you, but stop being a vagina. This is BioWare we're talking about. Has BioWare even made an action game? Ever? Like actually developed one? If they did, it was a mistake.

Aside from MDK2 (which Himuro already mentioned), their first game as Bioware was an action mech game known as Shattered Steel.

So, yeah, they've made action games before.  MDK2 was actually really good as well.

[Raban]

Himuro, I usually agree with you, but stop being a vagina. This is BioWare we're talking about. Has BioWare even made an action game? Ever? Like actually developed one? If they did, it was a mistake.

Aside from MDK2 (which Himuro already mentioned), their first game as Bioware was an action mech game known as Shattered Steel.

So, yeah, they've made action games before.  MDK2 was actually really good as well.

Oh I know, I love MDK2. Excellent game.

[bork]

preorder in, no ltd edition. As a wise man said "LTD edition? think i will skip it as i get little value from them nowadays - just a chunky box"

Thanks for the reminder!  I just pre-ordered it from Play-Asia too; since it's an EA game I have no idea if it will be region-free or not as their releases tend to vary.

Why did you not just order the Asian version? Cheaper too, I think.

Yeah, that's what I did!  If the game is leaked before P-A gets their copies (or if they just get them after the American release) and is region-free, I'll just cancel my order.

[Fragamemnon]

haha, you can't upgrade your squad's equipment? Well I suppose that's one way to deal with the original game's poor itemization.

this sounds like a RPG for the bro set. I'm still waffling on the preorder.

[Great Rumbler]

This site has a listing of most of the changes in ME2:

http://masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Mass_Effect_2#Gameplay_Improvements

[Jansen]

i didn't know about the regenerating health...

[Himu]

Borys: I always felt that ME was an rpg first, with shooter elements. I mean, if you leveled up enough, you could vastly change how you handle a mission. You could talk your way out and stuff like that. But can you really do that if you only level up at the end of the mission? Half the fun for me in ME was getting the xp to do things I wanted like talk the cop on Feros into taking the leader dude on trial. I didn't have enough charm to convince him, either of of my playthroughs, so I had to go and play the game, do quests, and then get enough charm to convince him. It felt like I actually worked towards it like an rpg should.

My question is, is this xp cap only with story related events or do you not receive xp when doing quests as well? If so, that's really lame.

haha, you can't upgrade your squad's equipment? Well I suppose that's one way to deal with the original game's poor itemization.

this sounds like a RPG for the bro set. I'm still waffling on the preorder.

I'm not bummed on the stripped down customization.

I'm bummed on not leveling up whenever I kill enemies.

Really Bioware?

i didn't know about the regenerating health...

Me either.

[Himu]

Watch Stoney defend this.

[Jansen]

at least you get to level up at some point whereas you can't ever fuck with you squads equipment!

while the combat looks loads better from the videos the rpg aspect really does seem super dumbed down now.

[cool breeze]

i didn't know about the regenerating health...

First game had regenerating health by applying something to your armor.  Besides that, they've shown that health recharge rate is a stat on some armors.

If it's bad, then w/e.  I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt because I remember people here complaining about recharging health in Dragon Age too (despite that having a much better solution of between battles and not in cover).  I also think people are giving Mass Effect 1 way too much credit as an RPG.  ME2 is looking like a shooter with rpg elements, and I'm happier with that than the poor rpg with poorer shooting in the first game.

[Himu]

The only person who complained about regen health in DA was demi

Regen health is not by any means a bad thing.

[Jansen]

i would prefer more rpg elements AND competent shooting. there's no reason whatsoever not to expect both.

as it has been stated many times already it just seems like they dumbed it all the way down in an effort to cater to the call of duty crowd.

[Raban]

Regen health is not by any means a bad thing.

I strongly disagree.

[cool breeze]

i would prefer more rpg elements AND competent shooting. there's no reason whatsoever not to expect both.

as it has been stated many times already it just seems like they dumbed it all the way down in an effort to cater to the call of duty crowd.

I agree.  That's why I'm looking forward to Alpha Protocol

I'm not saying the direction they're taking is best, just that it sounds better than both elements done poorly in Mass Effect 1.  The reason I liked ME1 was mostly because, somehow, it all kinda worked for me despite the individual aspects being a bit of a mess.  Plus I'm a sucker for nice space fiction and ignoring the dialogue and actual plot I thought the universe was interesting.

[demi]

Regen health is not by any means a bad thing.

I strongly disagree.

co-sign. I hope we can play hardest from the start too with our imports.

[Great Rumbler]

Where are people getting the "you can only level up after a mission" thing from? I've looked around, but I haven't seen anything mention it.

[Purple Filth]

i would prefer more rpg elements AND competent shooting. there's no reason whatsoever not to expect both.

as it has been stated many times already it just seems like they dumbed it all the way down in an effort to cater to the call of duty crowd.

After seeing how much that game sold i can see them trying to get that crowd.

[cool breeze]

Regen health is not by any means a bad thing.

I strongly disagree.

About regenerating health in general I don't actually care for it.  The defense you hear for it is that it allows for each battle to be designed knowing you have full health.  But I like planning ahead and gaining and advantage in the upcoming battle or even feeling like I have to play more cautious when my health is low.

Regenerating health in ME2 is, I don't think, a big departure from the first game.  Between recharging health being an armor power up, you also had medigel flying out your ass on every difficulty.  This is just bad design replacing worse design.

[Himu]

i would prefer more rpg elements AND competent shooting. there's no reason whatsoever not to expect both.

as it has been stated many times already it just seems like they dumbed it all the way down in an effort to cater to the call of duty crowd.

I agree.  That's why I'm looking forward to Alpha Protocol

When is AP due out?

[Himu]

Where are people getting the "you can only level up after a mission" thing from? I've looked around, but I haven't seen anything mention it.

http://meforums.bioware.com/forums/viewtopic.html?topic=717100&forum=144&sp=0