"Watchmen Babies: V for Vacation" soon to be a reality

[Great Rumbler]

Why hasn’t there ever been second series of Watchmen comics? It’s not as though Alan Moore and Dave Gibbons actually own the characters. Well, apparently, any talk of a sequel had been squashed, time and again, by Paul Levitz, former president of DC comics. He was very protective of the title, even denying the creators of the tie-in videogame to invent any new material at all. This was sacred stuff to him.

Now, though, he’s not in charge of the comics at all and is the Contributing Editor and Overall Consultant of DC Entertainment, the spin-off and movies arm. He’s not going to be able to do anything, directly, to stop any Watchmen sequel. More importantly, though, it seems that Dan DiDio, SVP-Executive Editor of DC, has made it his mission to realize not only a sequel series but also several prequels. Why? I suppose he’d say Why Not? And there’s good reason to believe they’ll be coming to screens as well as pages, too.

Rich Johnston at Bleeding Cool has the story. I was gobsmacked but, as I can count Rich as a close friend, I called him up and checked his sources and, let me tell you, this is solid stuff. Here’s Rich on what involvement Alan and Dave might, or might not, have:
I understand that both Alan Moore and Dave Gibbons have to be offered first refusal before any of these titles could be published. But if they don’t want to work on them themselves (and Alan Moore is never going to agree), DiDio has been sounding out people who might be willing to take on the task. While some creators are reticent, the argument goes if there are a number of Watchmen spinoff projects, any blame or shame can be spread on many shoulders. The sales are expected to be massive, whatever the hardcore fanboy reaction and such expected sales benefits will be shared amongst the creative teams.

Now, if I was Alan Moore I’d sign on right away and twist this entire project into a pretzel. But he’s not me, so no matter how subversive the possibilities, I still think he’d rather not meddle with what is certainly a neat and tidy work of great completeness, not even to derail a publisher’s attempt to exploit it.

So, someday soon it looks like somebody else will be writing Watchmen comics and I sure wouldn’t be surprised to see them headed to the big screen, if most likely after Levitz has departed DC Entertainment too. Sadly, for the cast of the first film, they all had sequel clauses in their contracts so, no matter how much an embarrassment it might be considered, they’d find it very hard, or expensive, to get out of taking the job on.

Funnily enough, Rich actually broke the news on the Watchmen sequel clauses too, back when he was at Comic Book Resources.

I’ve got that same horrible taste in my mouth that I had when Disney’s Circle 7 were working on a non-Pixar Toy Story 3. That story had an unexpected ending - can we really hope Alan and Dave will give us one here? Will they step up and give us a Watchmen 2 that isn’t peeing in the pool?

http://www.slashfilm.com/2010/02/03/watchmen-2-looks-like-a-real-possibility/

 

[Raban]

 

[The Fake Shemp]

Yes, the sequel nobody ever wanted!

[Great Rumbler]

What would a sequel even be about?

spoiler (click to show/hide)

Someone on GAF suggested that it might be about the remaining costumed adventurers trying to track down Ozymandias and stop his latest plot to conquer the world. I bet that's what they do with it. 

[close]

[Eel O'Brian]

maybe whoever does it will rewrite a good ending for the first one, too

[Cormacaroni]

There are not enough do not want cat pics to encapsulate my lack of want for this, even if Grant Morrison and Frank Quitely do it. Starting from the premise that 'It will sell loads because FANBOIS' is just a  horrid way to piss on a majestic piece of work that continues to sell precisely because it has a closed-box continuity (not to mention some fucking integrity).

[Eel O'Brian]

yes, but moore himself considered a minutemen prequel at one point

[The Fake Shemp]

It's a shame. Although, I do not have much room to talk - I'm trying to break into an industry where nothing is sacred.

[Cormacaroni]

Tolkien did plenty of work on a sequel to LOTR too. Thought better of it!

[Great Rumbler]

maybe whoever does it will rewrite a good ending for the first one, too

And then he decided against it. But this isn't Alan Moore coming back 24 years later and deciding that he want to work on a sequel, this is some DC executive that wants to turn a self-contained story into a franchise.

[Eel O'Brian]

the sacred argument is bullshit, anyway

moore worked on marvelman, swamp thing, superman, and many other comic creations which existed long before he put his spin on them, and altered them to his own liking (regardless of the quality - and i like moore)

once you alter the work of others, you lose all claims to self-righteous indignation when someone comes along and does it to yours

not that i'm gonna buy this

[Cormacaroni]

Sounds like you're arguing with Alan Moore, Eel, not me.

[Great Rumbler]

once you alter the work of others, you lose all claims to self-righteous indignation when someone comes along and does it to yours

Alan Moore hasn't said anything on this either way.

[Eel O'Brian]

I'm not arguing with anyone, really.  Just rebutting the general attitude I've seen around the net about it.  It doesn't change the first one at all, it still exists as a complete work if you choose to ignore this.  Moore's gotten pissed about this kind of talk before (and there has been this kind of talk before).  I get the feeling he sometimes buys into his own reputation a little too much.

"This is an Imaginary Story... Aren't they all?"  That's from the final two Superman issues he wrote before the Crisis reboot. Sounds like he thinks it's okay to me.

(thinks his swamp thing run is better than watchmen)

[The Fake Shemp]

His Marvelman run is the best.

[Eric P]

thank god i'm old enough to realize this won't affect my love of the original

[Eel O'Brian]

As a matter of fact, Watchmen was originally supposed to use the Charlton Comics superheroes (the creations of other writers and artists), which DC had purchased but never used up until then.  They'd finally decided to use the characters and asked him to change his cast to similar characters, which he did.

[Cormacaroni]

.

thank god i'm old enough to realize this won't affect my love of the original

oh god, i realize THAT. I'm just saying I profoundly DO NOT WANT to read a sequel. It was a thing of its time, which is one of the main reasons the movie felt so weird in 2008

[Eel O'Brian]

I think what I'm trying to stutter out here is that you can never dismiss the possibility that someone could come along and do something with the watchmen "universe" akin to what he did with swamp thing/marvelman/superman/etc

that possibility is certainly slim, to be sure, but what comic reader in 1982 would have thought that someone would come along and blow the doors off a (for all intents and purposes) children's superhero who was just a reworked version of character lost due to copyright dispute?

i just try to keep somewhat of an open mind about these types of things, is all, as nothing is permanent in comics

i won't buy it, but i'll likely download at least a first issue out of curiousity

[Cormacaroni]

To folks who's been consuming comics for over 3 decades, like ourselves, that seems pretty obvious I guess. Maybe worth pointing out for the sake of the newbs though!

If Watchmen hadn't been a closed loop, with such beautiful symmetry, I wouldn't be quite so vociferous in wanting to keep it untouched. There is certainly more material that you could mine there, meaningfully. But the chances of that happening when the stated intent is monetizing the property...yeah. We already know how badly it's going to suck. Even if it's GOOD, it'll suck in comparison.

[The Fake Shemp]

Swamp Thing/Marvelman/Superman were, by design and execution, serial adventures. Watchmen is a bit different.

[Ichirou]

I don't want this mainly because I hate all manabyte style comic book fans and I would rather not read their opinions of it.

I don't want this mainly because I hate all manabyte style comic book fans and I would rather not read their opinions of it.

I don't want this mainly because I hate all manabyte style comic book fans and I would rather not read their opinions of it.

[Diunx]

smh

[Eel O'Brian]

Swamp Thing/Marvelman/Superman were, by design and execution, serial adventures. Watchmen is a bit different.

pretty sure he had an end game planned for marvelman before he got pissed and split

[Mandark]

When I read Watchmen the first time I thought it would have been neat to read about Owl & Rorschach's salad days.

There's no objective difference between Moore using characters he didn't create and other people using Moore's characters, but they'd still feel like different situations to me.  I expect different authors to give their take on Superman, cause at some point I mentally filed him away as a quasi-public domain character.  OTOH I've only ever known Moore's version of the Watchmen, so anything Watchmen without him involved won't feel "official" or whatever.

Yeah, it's not fair or logical and it's kinda bullshit, but for a lot of nerds (many of whom are gonna take this way too personally) it's kinda intuitive.

[Raban]

When I read Watchmen the first time I thought it would have been neat to read about Owl & Rorschach's salad days.

There's no objective difference between Moore using characters he didn't create and other people using Moore's characters, but they'd still feel like different situations to me.  I expect different authors to give their take on Superman, cause at some point I mentally filed him away as a quasi-public domain character.  OTOH I've only ever known Moore's version of the Watchmen, so anything Watchmen without him involved won't feel "official" or whatever.

Yeah, it's not fair or logical and it's kinda bullshit, but for a lot of nerds (many of whom are gonna take this way too personally) it's kinda intuitive.

But understand that Superman wasn't always accepted as a quasi-public domain character. At one point he was only Jerry Siegel's creation, and I'm sure fans of the time were against seeing him written by a different person, until eventually he was passed around like a peace pipe.

For some things, it just takes longer for them to get whored out.

[Cormacaroni]

The lack of Patel in this thread is dumbfounding. The only explanation I can put forth is that title alone left him stunned and foetal, unable even to thumb out a txted 'FUUUUUUUUUUUUU'

[Mandark]

Raban:  Oh yeah.  Just like Shatner was the only Kirk for years, and maybe a few decades from now someone could ask you to rank the Kirks like you would the James Bonds.

I was actually gonna bring up Jane Austen's characters as an example in my post, then I remember they actually are public domain and I just refuse to read any of the "sequels".

[Raban]

Raban:  Oh yeah.  Just like Shatner was the only Kirk for years, and maybe a few decades from now someone could ask you to rank the Kirks like you would the James Bonds.

I was actually gonna bring up Jane Austen's characters as an example in my post, then I remember they actually are public domain and I just refuse to read any of the "sequels".

I know it's hard, because I share your feelings towards things like this. Regardless of how close you hold any work of fiction, eventually it's going to be re-imagined and by extension completely destroyed, and it's up to you to accept it and enjoy the new, or reject it and deal with it.

Personally, I don't hate on ideas themselves very often, but the idea of a follow-up to Watchmen is pretty poor. The graphic novel presents its universe about as completely as can be.

[Green Shinobi]

Like Willco said, Superman/Marvelman, etc were serialized superhero stories. Watchmen was designed from the beginning as a single, cohesive statement. This is about as artistically valid as Stuart Little 2.

[Mandark]

I know it's hard

See now it sounds like you're giving me emotional support during my hard times and I gotta be all "Hey hey I'm not that invested in this!"


PS I was also gonna use Harry Flashman as an example of a character I associate with a single author, but then I remembered Fraser originally lifted him from Tom Brown's School Days.

PPS If someone other than H. Jon Benjamin ever voiced John McGuirk I'd go on hunger strike.

[Raban]

Like Willco said, Superman/Marvelman, etc were serialized superhero stories. Watchmen was designed from the beginning as a single, cohesive statement. This is about as artistically valid as Stuart Little 2.

I hope I'm reading this wrong, but are you saying that the first Stuart Little movie was good in any way?

I know it's hard

See now it sounds like you're giving me emotional support during my hard times and I gotta be all "Hey hey I'm not that invested in this!"

Dude, we're nerds. You don't gotta front.

[Green Shinobi]

I hope I'm reading this wrong, but are you saying that the first Stuart Little movie was good in any way?

I never saw it, but it was based on the classic children's novel, wasn't it?

[Raban]

I hope I'm reading this wrong, but are you saying that the first Stuart Little movie was good in any way?

I never saw it

Lucky man

[Mandark]

Raban:  But I'm not invested in this.  I've got more than my share of irrational attachments to geek culture, but Watchmen isn't one of them.  I'm just pre-emptively defending my right to get pointlessly upset when they remake Jaws with Justin Long, Gerard Butler, and Larry the Cable Guy.

[Cormacaroni]

The fact that all those characters are analogs for older characters just underscores how completely unnecessary it would be to exhume them, whether or not your intention was to skullfuck the corpses and burn them, or merely skullfuck them. Do an Elseworlds series with the original Charlton characters or something. All the folks who gave a crap about the original Blue Beetle and Question have seen them morphed enough times that they won't care anymore.

Having said that, I laughed at all the Star Trek fans who wailed over the remake. To my mind, that took something deeply uncool and generally shit and turned it into something fun and exciting (albeit not something I'm particularly keen to see continued for the next 20 yrs...). If someone out there thinks they can take the Watchmen characters and settings, and do more interesting work than Moore and Gibbons, well, they're probably crazy enough to be worth giving a shot.

OTOH, if Dan DiDio outsources this to some hack like Judd Winick...I too shall take up the worship of a snake god and call venomy vengeance down upon him.

[Howard Alan Treesong]

The lack of Patel in this thread is dumbfounding. The only explanation I can put forth is that title alone left him stunned and foetal, unable even to thumb out a txted 'FUUUUUUUUUUUUU'

I don't really care, and I totally agree with Eel. Watchmen was originally going to be other people's characters, so, whatever. Dan DiDio is a humorless fuck, anyhow. I doubt he gives a shit if they're any good.

[Cormacaroni]

You don't care NOW.

When the solicits come out, with plot by Judd Winick and art by Mark Silvestri, however...

[Howard Alan Treesong]

No, I honestly don't care. Watchmen is Watchmen. Those 12 issues are still there on myshelf. And as Eel rightly pointed out, so much of Moore's best work has been tweaking or re-inventing other people's characters that I don't think he gets to claim his sandbox is special.

If they were making more Invisibles, now, that would be a horse of a different color...

[Cormacaroni]

If they made an Invisibles movie, with McDonalds toys...

Surely we are due a Sandman movie, btw? Hasn't Death been kicked about for years?

[Howard Alan Treesong]

Vaughan wants to make it and he may have the Hollywood cachet after Kick-Ass! get ready for Endless Fights

The Dream Car and his guardian polar bears at his arctic Fortress of Solitude are from the legendary Jon Peters script.

[Howard Alan Treesong]

If they made an Invisibles movie, with McDonalds toys...

I dunno, the possibility of infecting the main cultural body at that level would be kind of hard to pass up

[Cormacaroni]

yes, just like V for Vendetta! The proles would surely rise up.

[Mandark]

Vaughan wants to make it and he may have the Hollywood cachet after Kick-Ass! get ready for the Dream Car and his guardian polar bears!

I liked the original pun.  Re-edit!

[Howard Alan Treesong]

Vaughan wants to make it and he may have the Hollywood cachet after Kick-Ass! get ready for the Dream Car and his guardian polar bears!

I liked the original pun.  Re-edit!

fine, done

[Phoenix Dark]

If this results in a Rorschach/Wolverine cross over, I'm all for it

[Mandark]

I get a lot more worried about bad movie adaptations than bad comic/novel spin-offs or re-imaginings.

If someone screws up a comic there's always a chance the next person to take it on will do better.  If you botch movie, you don't get another chance.  Not for a long time, anyway.

[Howard Alan Treesong]

I get a lot more worried about bad movie adaptations than bad comic/novel spin-offs or re-imaginings.

If someone screws up a comic there's always a chance the next person to take it on will do better.  If you botch movie, you don't get another chance.  Not for a long time, anyway.

Yeah, this. What could additional Watchmen comics do that Zach Snyder didn't do already?

And the Watchmen movie wasn't even that bad. yes it was.

[Cormacaroni]

Ironically, I can't even use the "the issues are still on my shelf" sop re: the Watchmen movie, as I lent my copy to someone who was curious about the movie, but didn't read it and then left the country with it. This was AFTER john tv had it for over 2yrs. Can't do that with a digital copy!

[Raban]

Raban:  But I'm not invested in this.  I've got more than my share of irrational attachments to geek culture, but Watchmen isn't one of them.  I'm just pre-emptively defending my right to get pointlessly upset when they remake Jaws with Justin Long, Gerard Butler, and Larry the Cable Guy.

God, I'd probably kill myself.

[The Fake Shemp]

holy shit who told mandark about my remake of Jaws?!!!

[Raban]

holy shit who told mandark about my remake of Jaws?!!!

 

[Howard Alan Treesong]

Un Barco Más Grande (2010 Remix) by Pitbull

[Diunx]

I'm surprise they didn't just revive Rorschach and called the book Blackest Night Watchmen.

[treythemovie]

I understand that both Alan Moore and Dave Gibbons have to be offered first refusal before any of these titles could be published. But if they don’t want to work on them themselves (and Alan Moore is never going to agree), DiDio has been sounding out people who might be willing to take on the task.

Watch as Alan Moore signs up for the project anyway and then spends the rest of his days sabotaging the project at every step.

[Great Rumbler]

I understand that both Alan Moore and Dave Gibbons have to be offered first refusal before any of these titles could be published. But if they don’t want to work on them themselves (and Alan Moore is never going to agree), DiDio has been sounding out people who might be willing to take on the task.

Watch as Alan Moore signs up for the project anyway and then spends the rest of his days sabotaging the project at every step.

That would be pretty awesome.

[chronovore]

Alan Moore has done the healthiest thing he can: walk away. He writes comics, and then other people come along and forcefully nudge the source material with their erections just enough to push it into a movie-like shape. He has pulled away entirely from these interactions and won't sell his other licenses to anyone.

Who cares if "Moore himself was planning a prequel"? Big deal. Top Ten was superb and its prequel, The Forty-Niners, was very good.

[Bloodwake]

I'm not surprised.

[ferrarimanf355]

What would a sequel even be about?

spoiler (click to show/hide)

Someone on GAF suggested that it might be about the remaining costumed adventurers trying to track down Ozymandias and stop his latest plot to conquer the world. I bet that's what they do with it. 

[close]

spoiler (click to show/hide)

Maybe the Frontiersman published Rorschach's journal...

[close]

Not sure if want. I mean, there's sequel potential there, but without Rasputin writing it, there's a 99.9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 percent chance of it sucking.

If Rasputin does write it, then hell will freeze over, the Israelis and Palestinians will hammer out a peace treaty tomorrow, General Motors will get out the Chevy Volt on time, the next Tony Hawk game won't suck, I'll hit the lottery jackpot, Sony will make a profit on every PS3 sold, I'll be richer than Warren Buffett, Sega will announce a port of Daytona USA to XBLA tomorrow, cats and dogs will live together, and I'll conquer a third-world African nation and rename it Alexville. 

[Tauntaun]

Just as long as there's more blue penis.