9.0 Earthquake in Japan

[SantaC]

so how long are this mass hysteria going to continue? weeks, months, years?

[SantaC]

I guess, are you segata?

[Bebpo]

And thank god for that.

I don't think I could deal with threads on why KH Re:coded is an example of genius game design.

[Corporal]

I'm guessing this has been discussed before, but it's been bugging me for a while now. Why did the Japanese build their plants in clusters at sealevel along the coast without any dikes - or why not on hills?

It's clear why they went to the coast (cheap and abundant water for cooling), but re-watching some old footage I can't say I see anything that strikes me as particularly tsunami-proof with these plants. That seems to be kind of an oversight, with Japan being Tsunami/earthquake central. Sure, hindsight is 20/20, but still... didn't anybody raise an eyebrow at this? Were there any reasons for this particular placement?

[pilonv1]

I would guess the hysteria will die down once the sensationalist western media stops covering it.

[Cormacaroni]

I'm guessing this has been discussed before, but it's been bugging me for a while now. Why did the Japanese build their plants in clusters at sealevel along the coast without any dikes - or why not on hills?

It's clear why they went to the coast (cheap and abundant water for cooling), but re-watching some old footage I can't say I see anything that strikes me as particularly tsunami-proof with these plants. That seems to be kind of an oversight, with Japan being Tsunami/earthquake central. Sure, hindsight is 20/20, but still... didn't anybody raise an eyebrow at this? Were there any reasons for this particular placement?

No idea. No idea why they have to be so close together either. I seem to recall 'chain reactions' being bad. Maybe they are just going for the big combo.

[Cormacaroni]

in other news, I can get a flight to the US tomorrow for a not-too-painful price. Trying to talk the wife into it but it's hard (she doesn't want to leave her pet and her business) and is buying the news reports that Tokyo is in no immediate danger for now. A friend suggested I pull a 'B.A.' on her - anyone know what the A-Team used?

[T-Short]

I'm guessing this has been discussed before, but it's been bugging me for a while now. Why did the Japanese build their plants in clusters at sealevel along the coast without any dikes - or why not on hills?

It's clear why they went to the coast (cheap and abundant water for cooling), but re-watching some old footage I can't say I see anything that strikes me as particularly tsunami-proof with these plants. That seems to be kind of an oversight, with Japan being Tsunami/earthquake central. Sure, hindsight is 20/20, but still... didn't anybody raise an eyebrow at this? Were there any reasons for this particular placement?

From what I read, the plant design was scaled to withstand a 7.9 to 8.2 quake. The structural integrity of the reactor containments seems to have dealt with the extra force from the ground acceleration (tremor) very well, however the plant have suffered mostly because of the large tsunami. On the quake, the three running reactors at Fukushima One were all SCRAM'd, but loss of offsite power meant it needed to use its backup diesels for decay heat cooling. The tsunami hit about one hour after the quake, and apparently the generator halls for all the diesels were apparently in basement levels of the complex and were subsequently flooded, stopping all generators from working and also preventing repair or auxiliary power to be connected. This is the biggest design flaw in my eyes, and I suspect this is very likely to be changed if other japanese plants are similarly designed.

[T-Short]

such a post-apocalyptic vibe in this pic



crazy

[pilonv1]

Sort of looks a bit like Fallout 3

[chronovore]

I can't deal with this anymore, I'm running to Osaka as soon as possible, hopefully within a few hours.

Any Kansai J-bores, does anyone have a place I can crash at or something?  I don't really have many contacts there and am getting pretty desperate.

Check your PMs.

[originalz]

Good looking out Chrono, really appreciate the offer!

I thought about it more and just decided to run to Kanazawa, seems safe and I know a lot of people here to stay with and chat with.  I don't know Osaka very much at all so it seemed kind of a pointless trip, if things get bad enough that KZ gets hit then I'm getting out of Japan.

It seems like my escape may have been for nothing, radiation levels are going down and those which were in the area weren't dangerous at all.  I've just been pretty worried about any info that's not being released and the fact that things aren't getting better at all, but if things seem stable then I'll probably go home on Thursday.


Anyway, check out this mail that the British Center of Commerce of Japan sent to people, grabbed it off another site

*************************************

BCCJ Members Update on Japan’s Nuclear Power station situation

March 15th 2011, 17.00

Telephone briefing from Sir John Beddington, the UK’s Chief Scientific adviser and Hilary Walker Deputy Director Emergency Preparedness at the Department of Health.

“Unequivocally, Tokyo will not be affected by the radiation fallout of explosions that have occurred or may occur at the Fukushima nuclear power stations.”

The danger area is limited to within the 30 kilometer evacuation zone and no one will be allowed to enter this area other than those directly involved in the emergency procedures currently being undertaken at both Fukushima 1 & 2.

Sir John went on to answer a series of questions including a comparison between Chernobyl and Japan. He said, “they are entirely different. Chernobyl exploded and there was a subsequent fire with radioactive materials being launched 30,000 ft into the air”. The maximum height of any Fukushima explosions would be no more than 500 metres.

“The amount of radiation that has been released is miniscule and would have to be in the order of 1,000 or more for it to be a threat to humans” This was confirmed by Hilary Walker.

Sir John went on to say that the Japanese authorities are doing their best to keep the reactors cooled and that this is a continuing operation. All workers on site dealing with the emergency are being fully decontaminated at the end of each shift.

When asked how reliable the information coming from the Japanese authorities was as to radiation levels he said, “this cannot be fabricated and the Japanese authorities are posting all the readings on the recognized international information sites which they are obliged to do. Independent verification shows that the data provided are accurate”.

In answer to a specific question from the Head of the BritishSchool in Tokyo, Sir John Beddington and Hilary Walker said that there was no reason at all for the school to be closed unless there were other issues such as power outages and transport problems.

David Fitton, First Minister at the British Embassy in Tokyo moderated the teleconference and confirmed that a transcript of the briefing will be available on the Embassy website later today.

BCCJ members are encouraged to check the Embassy website regularly as well as the Chamber website and Facebook sites for the latest information.

**********************************

[chronovore]

Good news at last?

NP, originalz. Hit me up if you change your mind.

[Cormacaroni]

all this stuff from experts is all very convincing and all but y'know...LeBron James isn't wearing a Knicks jersey right now. Experts get it wrong all the fucking time.

[SantaC]

I find it hard to grasp that you cannot cool a reactor if you want to. Why cant you just freeze it with Liquid nitrogen or something?

[Diunx]

I just got a couple of broadcast messages on the blackberry messenger warning people that because of the NUCLEAR EXPLOSION(it was in caps) on japan this sunday we should stay away from the rain since it may contain radioactive material in it, I didn't finish reading it since I assumed it only got more stupider I love the dominican's ability to make everything about themselves.

[bork]

You ought to get the hell out of Tokyo for now, originalz...didn't you say that your new job is based out of KZ anyway?

[maxy]

all this stuff from experts is all very convincing and all but y'know...LeBron James isn't wearing a Knicks jersey right now. Experts get it wrong all the fucking time.

My advice

If you have a kid or plan to have one,move...
Old farts have little to fear

Basement nerds are constantly exposed to quite high levels of radiation,if the basement is not ventilated enough.
The big problem with this airborne stuff is that you can't really stop it,localized sources are easy,just obey 1/r^2 rule.
Inhaling highly radioactive stuff is bad,very very very bad

Little anecdotal stuff
One of my nuclear physics college professors,extremely smart nice old guy had like 2-3 students per year(including me),because everybody else was too scared to come even near the lab,lol

One time he pulled like highly radioactive gamma emitter out of its casing and started waving with it,he was like "look,just obey  1/r^2 rule"

My colleague was like"holy shit,are you trying to kill us"...it was like in kung fu movies,when some dude leans back and defies gravity
 

One time he had to go to an X-ray and people there where in shock...everything was white,he had some piece of radioactive material in his pocket for months


We are all still alive.

In short,airborne stuff is dangerous,rain is extremely good,but beware what you eat or drink.

Also you have induced radioactivity...non-radioactive stuff remaining radioactive after radioactive source is removed,although that should be confined to the reactor

[T-Short]

I find it hard to grasp that you cannot cool a reactor if you want to. Why cant you just freeze it with Liquid nitrogen or something?

For cooling inside the pressure vessel, you have to use a substance with good characteristics for heat/pressure resistance, and that also works in an environment with high ionizing activity without creating harmful isotopes. You can't just use anything.

[T-Short]

Fox News Discovers Nuclear Reactor In Japanese Disco

Earlier today on Fox News' Your World With Neil Cavuto, this map popped up detailing the locations of Japan's nuclear power plants:

One name seems out of place on the graphic -- that of "Shibuyaeggman."

It doesn't show up on the International Atomic Energy Agency's list of Japanese nuclear power stations, and this map of Japanese nuclear installations from the Department of Energy's International Nuclear Safety Center doesn't have any listing for "Shibuyaeggman," and doesn't show a nuclear power plant anywhere near the location on the Fox News map. So I did a little research.

A quick Googling of "shibuyaeggman" turned up no meaningful results. A Nexis search was also fruitless. However, further inquiries revealed that Eggman is the name of a dance club in a trendy neighborhood of Tokyo called... Shibuya. And, it just so happens, the Fox graphic appears to place the alleged reactor in Tokyo. Here's a photo of Eggman -- as you can see, it's right below The @ Super Suits Store. And Johnny Hi-Fi played there in 2006.

Sounds like a fun place. But it doesn't sound like a nuclear power plant.

[Great Rumbler]

Apparently Twitter turns everyone into a raging idiot:

A writer on animated comedy series Family guy has been forced to apologize for insensitive remarks he made about Japan's earthquake disaster following a storm of criticism on the web.

Scriptwriter Alec Sulkin took to his Twitter.com page following Friday's huge earthquake and tsunami, which devastated the country's eastern coastline and left over 2,000 dead, with the death toll tipped to reach 10,000 as the relief effort continues.

Sulkin wrote, "If you wanna feel better about this earthquake in Japan, google 'Pearl Harbor death toll.'" Sulkin was referring to the Japanese attack on U.S. forces in Hawaii during World War II, which killed over 2,500 people.

After a series of criticisms from his fellow Twitter followers, Sulkin decided to delete the 'Tweet' and apologize for his comment.

He wrote, "Yesterday death toll = 200. Today = 10,000. I am sorry for my insensitive Tweet. It's gone."

Sulkin is not the only star to come under fire for remarks made following Japan's disaster - 50 Cent was also slammed for making crude comments on Twitter, while comic Gilbert Gottfried's 'Tweets' lost him his job as the voice of insurance company Aflac's duck mascot.

http://www.torontosun.com/entertainment/tv/2011/03/15/17617836-wenn-story.html

smh

[Diunx]

Fucking Gottfried.

[SantaC]

I find it hard to grasp that you cannot cool a reactor if you want to. Why cant you just freeze it with Liquid nitrogen or something?

For cooling inside the pressure vessel, you have to use a substance with good characteristics for heat/pressure resistance, and that also works in an environment with high ionizing activity without creating harmful isotopes. You can't just use anything.

I see, thanks.

[Cormacaroni]

I find it hard to grasp that you cannot cool a reactor if you want to. Why cant you just freeze it with Liquid nitrogen or something?

For cooling inside the pressure vessel, you have to use a substance with good characteristics for heat/pressure resistance, and that also works in an environment with high ionizing activity without creating harmful isotopes. You can't just use anything.

Check out the big brain on Brad!

[T-Short]

BRETT

[Cormacaroni]

that's what I said!

[T-Short]

 

[bork]

He is just one of many idiots who have said the same thing!

I was just on the phone with someone at work...she put me on hold for a minute, and before she came back, I could hear her joking with a co-worker about the internet problem they were having..."it must be coming from the nuclear meltdown yuh huhuhuhuh!"   

If this same shit happened here, people would be furious if anyone made fun of the situation.

[Great Rumbler]

Apparently Twitter turns everyone into a raging idiot:

A writer on animated comedy series Family guy has been forced to apologize for insensitive remarks he made about Japan's earthquake disaster following a storm of criticism on the web.

Scriptwriter Alec Sulkin took to his Twitter.com page following Friday's huge earthquake and tsunami, which devastated the country's eastern coastline and left over 2,000 dead, with the death toll tipped to reach 10,000 as the relief effort continues.

Sulkin wrote, "If you wanna feel better about this earthquake in Japan, google 'Pearl Harbor death toll.'" Sulkin was referring to the Japanese attack on U.S. forces in Hawaii during World War II, which killed over 2,500 people.

After a series of criticisms from his fellow Twitter followers, Sulkin decided to delete the 'Tweet' and apologize for his comment.

He wrote, "Yesterday death toll = 200. Today = 10,000. I am sorry for my insensitive Tweet. It's gone."

Sulkin is not the only star to come under fire for remarks made following Japan's disaster - 50 Cent was also slammed for making crude comments on Twitter, while comic Gilbert Gottfried's 'Tweets' lost him his job as the voice of insurance company Aflac's duck mascot.

http://www.torontosun.com/entertainment/tv/2011/03/15/17617836-wenn-story.html

smh

This guy is smart enough to be a writer? What a fucking asshole.

He writes for Family Guy. Also, have you seen his "jokes" on Twitter?

[Cormacaroni]

hey, PD retweeted a Mothra joke a few days ago. Tasteless. But hell, I've laughed at worse. I even laughed at Doug Stanhope's 'fresh sushi delivery' line. But I would never repeat i...whoops

[Corporal]

Thanks for your answer, Hyoushi.

They probably weren't anticipating a 9.0 quake.  The fact that anything is holding together at all is pretty stunning, though of little comfort.

Yeah, the quake rattled them, but everything went well since the reactors were designed and specially reinforced to cope with that. Then the Tsunami came and fucked things up. I'm just wondering why they evidently built the reactors in a way so they would survive quakes, but somehow completely overlooked the danger of a tsunami right on the heels of said quake. They even built the damn buildings in a way that a tsunami could cause the most terrible mayhem by flooding the diesel engines AND cutting the power between the reactors in one fell swoop.

Which is odd, considering that this is Japan. They have lived with the fear of quakes and tsunamis for as long as they've settled there. Even a Japanese toddler probably knows more than I ever will about these giant waves. Yet ... that. Boggles the mind, really. There has to be a reason I'm just not seeing here. I refuse to believe that this issue didn't come up in some planning session. And I doubt "lol whatever" is an accepted way of dealing with safety concerns in reactor design/plant layout planning.

Oh well. Probably idle speculation anyway. Still, it's bugging me.

[SantaC]

a 6.1 Quake was just reported south of tokyo. 2012 is here sooner than we think.

[Brehvolution]

Our very own Spencer owns thesulk

[Corporal]

Stay safe, guys.  

Did that Fuji-quake have any lasting outcome?

[Mr. Gundam]

It's 2am in Tokyo, hopefully everyone is getting some sleep.

in other news, I can get a flight to the US tomorrow for a not-too-painful price. Trying to talk the wife into it but it's hard (she doesn't want to leave her pet and her business) and is buying the news reports that Tokyo is in no immediate danger for now. A friend suggested I pull a 'B.A.' on her - anyone know what the A-Team used?

Where would you be heading in the states?

[Smooth Groove]

You don't need the news to know that the situation is still scary.    

I know some of you are very attached to your homes, jobs, friends, etc but it really makes sense to get away until this disaster is truly under control. 

[Bebpo]

You don't need the news to know that the situation is still scary.    

I know some of you are very attached to your homes, jobs, friends, etc but it really makes sense to get away until this disaster is truly under control. 

You realize this is like telling people in LA to get away because of things going on in San Fran, right?  There's some good distance between Fukushima and Tokyo.

[Smooth Groove]

You make it sound like nothing has happened to Tokyo.   Look at the damage that has already been done.

Tokyo is close enough for a meltdown to affect them and the quakes are still being felt over there.  If it's possible to leave, it really doesn't make sense to not do so. 

[Cormacaroni]

There's an argument for humor for levity, but that pearl harbor statement just sounded hateful.

Absolutely.

[Oblivion]

Apparently Twitter turns everyone into a raging idiot:

A writer on animated comedy series Family guy has been forced to apologize for insensitive remarks he made about Japan's earthquake disaster following a storm of criticism on the web.

Scriptwriter Alec Sulkin took to his Twitter.com page following Friday's huge earthquake and tsunami, which devastated the country's eastern coastline and left over 2,000 dead, with the death toll tipped to reach 10,000 as the relief effort continues.

Sulkin wrote, "If you wanna feel better about this earthquake in Japan, google 'Pearl Harbor death toll.'" Sulkin was referring to the Japanese attack on U.S. forces in Hawaii during World War II, which killed over 2,500 people.

After a series of criticisms from his fellow Twitter followers, Sulkin decided to delete the 'Tweet' and apologize for his comment.

He wrote, "Yesterday death toll = 200. Today = 10,000. I am sorry for my insensitive Tweet. It's gone."

Sulkin is not the only star to come under fire for remarks made following Japan's disaster - 50 Cent was also slammed for making crude comments on Twitter, while comic Gilbert Gottfried's 'Tweets' lost him his job as the voice of insurance company Aflac's duck mascot.

http://www.torontosun.com/entertainment/tv/2011/03/15/17617836-wenn-story.html

smh

This guy is smart enough to be a writer? What a fucking asshole.

He writes for Family Guy.

All that needs to be said, really.

I haven't spoken to my conservative roommates about this incident, but I'm curious to see what they would say. We've had some interesting discussions on Katrina, with them asking such thought provoking questions like "Why didn't the coloreds just walk out of New Orleans? "

[Corporal]

You have to build them where there is an abundance of water.  Where do you think that steam is coming from?

Already acknowledged that right in that very same post. Of course they went there because of the coolant. That wasn't really what's bugging me.

[Corporal]

Hills could be doable, I suppose - albeit impractical. They'd need to include a water reserve of some kind, and a pump system to get the water up there. Eats energy and introduces errors, but on the other hand, it would be pretty Tsunami safe. Or maybe go behind a hill, so to speak. A natural dike.

A good start would have been designing a reactor and plant layout that doesn't get fucked all to hell because a tsunami happens to rampage through - just like they did with regard to quakes. My first instinct would have been shoveling some dirt and fortifications between the water and the plant so at least parts of a tsunami would be redirected, or maybe lessened in force. Just to begin with.

The tsunami destroyed the pumps, flooded the switchboards, dragged off the tanks, and destroyed any way to reconnect the several reactors of the plant so a safe shutdown of funky reactors could at least be attempted using energy from other, safer reactors in the same plant.

I dunno, really. I'm not a plant or reactor designer. It just seems completely baffling that the plants were safeguarded from quakes but not from tsunamis.

[T-Short]

A good start would have been designing a reactor and plant layout that doesn't get fucked all to hell because a tsunami happens to rampage through - just like they did with regard to quakes. My first instinct would have been shoveling some dirt and fortifications between the water and the plant so at least parts of a tsunami would be redirected, or maybe lessened in force. Just to begin with.

you mean... like this?



 

I dunno, really. I'm not a plant or reactor designer. It just seems completely baffling that the plants were safeguarded from quakes but not from tsunamis.

As I described in an earlier post, the plants were made to withstand a quake of 7.9 - 8.2 (some conflicting info from different sources here). The quake and tsunami that followed was a full richter step higher.

[Shaka Khan]

How old are these plants, really?

[T-Short]

Daiichi reactors 1-3 were constructed from 1967 to 1970, so they were nearing the end of their useful life. All these three have Mk1 containments (suppression torus). Daiichi reactors 4-6 are a couple of years younger, but only reactor 6 has a Mk2 containment design.

[Corporal]

Hyoushi,

spoiler (click to show/hide)

I will readily admit that I have about as little knowledge about Tsunamis as is humanly possible. Which is why this issue leaves me so nonplussed.

Those dock things look like they would about suffice to hold back a storm tide or similar rough conditions - but not hundreds of tons of water intent on getting all up in that land in a hurry. I think I spot those wave breaker blocks too, which surely make formidable crushing implements when ripped loose by the water. There is no way to be safe from any tsunami, I think, but one has to at least try. We're talking about a nuclear facility here. This looks more like a thicker version of a civilian yacht port fortification.


And again, the quakes aren't really the problem. The reactors managed those reasonably well. Since they were designed to do just that I give this a "mission accomplished" mark in reactor design.

However, the Tsunami that followed completely and utterly fucked things up, and more importantly, prevented a timely recovery due to what I'd call design flaws in the reactor and plant layout (mentioned above somewhere). I am guessing even a smaller Tsunami would have hamstrung the entire plant in a similar manner. That is what bugs me.

[close]

I'll shut up now, I'm really derailing the thread. Sorry about that.

Edit: Apparently there's a new fire at the fourth reactor. Fuck. 

[chronovore]

Gottfried's entire schtick is being offensively insensitive. If you want to be surprised about something, be shocked that a life insurance company hired someone famous for being wildly insensitive for their advertisements.

If you guys want to see true idiocy in action, try these:
http://karmajapan.tumblr.com/
http://ignorantandonline.tumblr.com/

[Corporal]

According to BBC the spent fuel rods in reactors 5 and 6 are believed to be heating up. You gotta be shitting me.

Anyone else trying to watch niconicos NHK International stream? Only getting a black image right now. Probably knocked offline by the above snippet causing half of the internet to hop on.

[Mr. Gundam]

Just heard from my good friend in Saitama. He and his wife have left their home for Gifu.

Anyone else trying to watch niconicos NHK International stream? Only getting a black image right now. Probably knocked offline by the above snippet causing half of the internet to hop on.

You could try NHK World Service on UStream.

Also, TV Japan's NHK G coverage is bilingual right now if you have access to that.

[The Sceneman]

http://s3.amazonaws.com/data.tumblr.com/tumblr_li0u1lam131qi07wto1_1280.png?AWSAccessKeyId=0RYTHV9YYQ4W5Q3HQMG2&Expires=1300314769&Signature=4Jcqf6FWOcJ5A8XEcFcGi39DZUs%3D

.....

so many of these comments sicken me... "paybacks a bitch!", how would this motherfucker like to die a painful death? I wish the world was a nicer place sometimes 

[chronovore]

I don't mind the hate, it's the inconsistency in logic that bothers me. I don't mind people getting riled up, it's when they get riled up over stoopid wrong shit that bothers me.

[Smooth Groove]

Apparently Tokyo Electric Power Company has a history of lying and concealing so that it can't be trusted to report on what's really going on. 

[Smooth Groove]

CNN was reporting that Naoto Kan cussed out TEPCO over the phone because the government wasn't notified of an explosion until an hour after it had occurred. 

[Great Rumbler]

(Image removed from quote.)

Our very own Spencer owns thesulk

It's almost like people don't know anything about Japan or WWII in the Pacific other than the fact that Japan launched a sneak attack against Pearl Harbor. I mean, Japan got "paid back" for that several times over by the end of the war. It's not like there's some lingering tensions between the two countries that weren't full resolved decades ago, long before the people spouting off this nonsense were even born [for most of them, long before their PARENTS were born]. It defies all logic or common sense.

[drew]

Gilbert Gottfried fired as Aflac Duck

Aflac Inc. has fired comedian Gilbert Gottfried, the voice of the Aflac Duck, for insensitive remarks he tweeted about Japan after the major earthquake and tsunami on March 11.

Gottfried tweeted: “Japan is really advanced. They don’t go to the beach. The beach comes to them.” He also posted: “I just split up with my girlfriend, but like the Japanese say, ‘They’ll be another one floating by any minute now.”

“Gilbert’s recent comments about the crisis in Japan were lacking in humor and certainly do not represent the thoughts and feelings of anyone at Aflac,” Aflac Chief Marketing Officer Michael Zuna said in a statement. “Aflac Japan — and, by extension, Japan itself — is part of the Aflac family, and there is no place for anything but compassion and concern during these difficult times.”

http://www.wcqj.com/stern-regular-gilbert-gottfried-fired-as-aflac-duck/

[Bebpo]

So they're bailing on the plant entirely atm until they have a plan

hmm...., I still think/hope areas outside of that portion of fukushima aren't going to be affected, but it's looking more and more like that 20-30km area of fukushima is totally fucked for a while.

[Mandark]

You don't see the Geico Gekko pulling shit like that.

[Snuflupagulus]

Nytimes article, following was a gut-blow:

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/16/world/asia/16workers.html?_r=1&hp=&pagewanted=all

The workers are being asked to make escalating — and perhaps existential — sacrifices that so far are being only implicitly acknowledged: Japan’s Health Ministry said Tuesday it was raising the legal limit on the amount of radiation to which each worker could be exposed, to 250 millisieverts from 100 millisieverts, five times the maximum exposure permitted for American nuclear plant workers.

The change means that workers can now remain on site longer, the ministry said. “It would be unthinkable to raise it further than that, considering the health of the workers,” the health minister, Yoko Komiyama, said at a news conference.

Couldn't imagine that choice being asked of me: your life or the lives of an innumerable amount. 

With much of the internet chatter taken up with pro/anti nuclear power talk (and wow has the advent of wiki and blogs made every cave dweller an expert), I wonder about the delivering of potable water, calorie dense food, diapers, shelter, clothing, etc., for the people of NE Japan?  I cannot fathom the trauma the people are suffering.  It would be debilitating.  And the ravaged environment surrounding you as a constant reminder of the abnormality of the present.   :'(

And sorry, not to short shrift those of you in Tokyo or other areas.  I realize that your situation, while not dire, isn't comforting.

[Smooth Groove]

Yes, it's heart-wrenching.  I think the workers should still get to choose if they want to stay, even if the decision might seem obvious to everyone else. 

[Cormacaroni]

Well, we got tickets out of here for Friday. Whether we get to use them is another matter. My wife is freaking out 'cause she can't find someone to take care of her pet bird. It's an incredibly difficult thing to ask of someone - to take on an extra burden (that might end up tying you down) at a time like this. Aargh. Well, at the very least, we have them if we REALLY need 'em. Got another full day after today to watch and fret before we can fly out.