2,405 shot dead since Tucson

[Bocsius]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/dailybeast/12881_acourtrulingandcheneycouldswayguncontrollaws;_ylt=AoFsv0uEqjO1F7ATbxReeIdv24cA;_ylu=X3oDMTRlNTRjcG4yBGFzc2V0A2RhaWx5YmVhc3QvMjAxMTAzMTQvMTI4ODFfYWNvdXJ0cnVsaW5nYW5kY2hlbmV5Y291bGRzd2F5Z3VuY29udHJvbGxhd3MEY2NvZGUDbXBfZWNfOF8xMARjcG9zAzQEcG9zAzQEc2VjA3luX3RvcF9zdG9yaWVzBHNsawMyNDA1c2hvdGRlYWQ-


[Pro gun control sentiment here]

It's unreal the amount of gun violence in the United States. More unreal that we're politically paralyzed to do anything about it.

2,405 people? Seriously?

[Great Rumbler]

The kinds of weapons and the size of weapons on the open market really has gotten completely out of control.

[Bocsius]

Guns don't kill people, people with guns kill people, so we need people with biggers guns to kill the people with guns.

[drew]

when you start legislating for the criminally insane you turn the lawbreakers into lawmakers

[Great Rumbler]

when you start legislating for the criminally insane you turn the lawbreakers into lawmakers

Isn't that what the new laws allowing students to have handguns on campus does?

[drew]

to a lesser extent, in a way, there's a hell of a difference between saying "some of you are psychotically killing people with these things so NONE of you can EVER have them" versus saying "some among you might be psycho's who may act out in a way that has happened before, let's equal the equation in case it happens here"

[drew]

in my opinion and experience most people are either incompetent or just plain afraid of firearms, the only ones who will carry them are those who tend to strive for enough training to be able to stop a mass murder as it is happening rather than add to the problem, no college campus will ever have every student carrying even if legally allowed, that's not realistic at all

[HyperZoneWasAwesome]

Mexico is always in a tizzy about the mafias down there getting their guns from America, is that entirely true?  Do all the guns in Mexico, illegal or otherwise come from north of the border?

seriously, I would like to know.

[duckman2000]

The thing about gun control, and specifically about people claiming that it wouldn't do any good, that it would just leave the good guys defenseless, is that, well, that's the one thing that hasn't been tried. And it's also the one thing that has some substantial research behind it, in terms of success in other nations. And hey, I like guns. But if you want less gun crime, then less guns everywhere, including at gun clubs, is a good place to start.

[Boogie]

Mexico is always in a tizzy about the mafias down there getting their guns from America, is that entirely true?  Do all the guns in Mexico, illegal or otherwise come from north of the border?

seriously, I would like to know.

Pretty much true, yes.

The thing about gun control, and specifically about people claiming that it wouldn't do any good, that it would just leave the good guys defenseless, is that, well, that's the one thing that hasn't been tried. And it's also the one thing that has some substantial research behind it, in terms of success in other nations. And hey, I like guns. But if you want less gun crime, then less guns everywhere, including at gun clubs, is a good place to start.

It's another one of those issues (like Health Care) where, for American conservatives, no other first world country in the world exists.  Anywhere.

Certainly there are no first-world, developed countries with more stringent gun control laws which have murder rates at a quarter that of the United States.  Nope.  Pure fantasy.  The entire issue must be debated in theoretical, ideological terms.  It only makes sense!

[GilloD]

MUSLIMS

[drew]

hyperzone have i got a video for you!

[youtube=560,345]e5r9jeLmb_U[/youtube]

http://www.everydaynodaysoff.com/2011/03/07/cbs-interviews-atf-agent-about-project-gunwalker-scandal/

a lot of those guns came courtesy of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms

[Oblivion]

Gun control is one of those highly amusing subjects where hard core right wingers suddenly become tolerant of other people (at least in the convos I've had).

"Illegals are the scum of the earth, and they have no right to stay in the U.S. and live off welfare paid by MY hard working tax dollars! But who am I to infringe on their god given right to buy assault rifles whenever they want."

[drew]

from the article in the op

Obama should also be encouraged by new evidence that the GOP isn’t particularly invested in keeping high-capacity magazines on the market. As a congressman, Cheney was one of the few Republicans willing to vote against noncontroversial bans on cop-killer bullets and plastic guns, which were designed to evade metal detectors. Now he’s open to reviving the moratorium on Loughner-style clips—a huge shift.

how many eye rolls can you fit into one paragraph, holy fuck, all bullets kill cops, there is no such thing as a plastic gun nor can glocks evade metal detectors, and THIS IS A CLIP

[Brehvolution]

MUSLIMS

NORTH KOREANS

[Mandark]

the only ones who will carry them are those who tend to strive for enough training to be able to stop a mass murder as it is happening rather than add to the problem

haha no

[Boogie]

hyperzone have i got a video for you!

[youtube=560,345]e5r9jeLmb_U[/youtube]

http://www.everydaynodaysoff.com/2011/03/07/cbs-interviews-atf-agent-about-project-gunwalker-scandal/

a lot of those guns came courtesy of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms

ie.  Yes, hyperzone, lax US gun laws do allow Mexican cartels to smuggle guns across the border to arm their drug wars.

[Boogie]

the only ones who will carry them are those who tend to strive for enough training to be able to stop a mass murder as it is happening rather than add to the problem

haha no

oh, missed that gem the first time around.

drew, a question in response to the "MOST gun owners are safe and responsible, therefore gun control is wrong!" argument:

How far does that argument hold true for you?  Is it based on mere mathematics and technicalities?  If 51% of gun owners were to be safe and responsible, and 49% of them are raving mass-murdering psychos, would you still cling to "GUN CONTROL IS WRONG BECAUSE MOST GUN OWNERS ARE SAFE AND RESPONSIBLE!" because, technically, that's still true?

Is it not much more reasonable to say that there is a point where the greater good, the safety of society, necessitates putting restrictions and controls on the purchase and ownership of guns, or certain types of guns, regardless of where the head count of "responsible vs. killers" stacks up?

[drew]

i never claimed to be some sort of debate club wunderkind, booger, and to directly answer your question(s) - sorry i tuned out a long time ago

[Phoenix Dark]

[youtube=560,345]bC8BCnfye3U[/youtube]

Get madmen off streets

Sell guns to madmen in meantime
http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/03/iowa_goper_dubs_nra-backed_legislation_give-a-hand.php?ref=fpb

[Boogie]

i never claimed to be some sort of debate club wunderkind, booger, and to directly answer your question(s) - sorry i tuned out a long time ago

Then I shall declare victory and move on. 

[drew]

whatever gets you to sleep at the end of the day, powerslave

[Bocsius]

Sell guns to madmen in meantime
http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/03/iowa_goper_dubs_nra-backed_legislation_give-a-hand.php?ref=fpb

Wow!

"Yep, the country's going down the tubes when I pull the lever to vote for this thing, I'll tell you that. So, who's up for lunch?"

[Boogie]

Homicide rates per 100k.

Finland: 2.2
Switzerland: 0.6
Sweden: 0.9
Australia: 1.3
Canada: 1.6
Netherlands: 0.9
Japan: 0.5
Germany: 0.6
UK: 1.2
South Korea: 2.2
France: 0.7
Ireland: 0.9
Austria: 0.6
Spain: 0.9
Italy: 0.9
New Zealand: 1.4
Greece: 1.2
Portugal: 1.8


Israel: 4.7

USA: 6.0

The USA has a higher homicide rate than every single developed, first-world country on the planet.  The only first-world country that comes close is Israel.  For all others, the USA homicde rate is at least 3 times higher.

The rational, logical, compassionate person looks at that fact and goes "hmm.  Why is that?  And how can we fix it?"

The typical American Right Winger sticks his fingers in his ears and yells "LA LA LA DON'T CARE!  CONSTITUTION!  FREEDOM!"

[Phoenix Dark]

There's no evidence guns increase homicide rates. That's like saying the US's homicide rate is high because we have more black people than any country listed there.

spoiler (click to show/hide)

[close]

[drew]

actually you might be onto something there pd

[Yoritomo]

You're 6 times more likely to be murdered in the US if you're a black man than if you're white.

[Himu]

You're 6 times more likely to be murdered in the US if you're a black man than if you're white.

i'm scared.

[EmCeeGrammar]

As much as I would enjoy my fantasy america without firearms, isn't it really too late to do anything about it now? Serious question, there's millions if these things out there, and a sizeable portion of our population has been indoctrinated to feel entitled to just about every conceivable munition in the world.

[Mupepe]

Too many people, myself included, would go down shooting if anyone ever tried to collect guns.

[Smooth Groove]

There's no evidence guns increase homicide rates. That's like saying the US's homicide rate is high because we have more black people than any country listed there.

spoiler (click to show/hide)

[close]

Most serial killers are white though. 

[Yoritomo]

The rational, logical, compassionate person looks at that fact and goes "hmm.  Why is that?  And how can we fix it?"

And only a moron thinks gun control will solve the problem.

[Yoritomo]

i'm scared.

If it's any consolation "White people stink" is currently trending on twitter.

[Diunx]

Too many people, myself included, would go down shooting if anyone ever tried to collect guns.

[Smooth Groove]

Guns are for pussies.  Give me a hunting knife, bow and arrows.

[Cravis]

There's not an easy answer to the gun problem. I'd like to see some statistic of how many murders were committed with stolen weapons versus those legally bought. I bought my first gun this past Christmas and was just shocked at the cost. The background check was a joke, though. That needs to be improved. I thought there would be a waiting period. Ha! There was, a waiting period of about 15 minutes.

I would like to guess that the United States' homicide rate is higher because of our justice system. You have those that start a life of crime very young with minor things. They are in and out of prison, continuing to go back to that life of crime because of the lenient consequences. They eventually end up committing murder.

[Brehvolution]

Funeral home lobbyists don't see a problem.

[tehjaybo]

 

This thread...

[HyperZoneWasAwesome]

[Yoritomo]

That wasn't what he was saying at all, but thanks for playing.

I wonder how the US ranks amongst all those nations for income inequality and prison population.

The idea that gun ownership is the primary force that causes homicides in the US is both moronic and short sighted.

[Smooth Groove]

When did Rygar turn into such a pussy? 

[drew]

He was saying that we have a certain school of thought that thinks that any discussion of gun violence in America necessarily needs to preclude any mention of the fact that we have a cheap and readily available supply of guns.

my bank account begs to differ

[Olivia Wilde Homo]

The country is essentially paralyzed from doing anything about it so get used to it.  The idea that we need cheap and plentiful guns is as entrenched as the need to spend nearly a trillion a year on defense.  It's so entrenched that it seems pointless to fight about it, even if overwhelming public opinion on both sides supports controlling either one of them.  The only way to stop it is if gun violence becomes a serious issue in affluent areas, which explains why people got worked up over Columbine.

[Boogie]

That wasn't what he was saying at all, but thanks for playing.

I wonder how the US ranks amongst all those nations for income inequality and prison population.

The idea that gun ownership is the primary force that causes homicides in the US is both moronic and short sighted.

I don't believe that gun ownership is the primary cause of the higher homicide rate.  I do think the USA's gun cutlure may be a part of the explanation.

[T234]

I gotta say:

Out of the three things this continent does well (reefer, guns, people with vaginas), Canada has the best reefer (pains me to say it, but Toronto's Pride is the best I've sampled, hands down.), America makes the best guns, and Mexico has some FINE broads. I would be happier if the all the militias of the world carried 3-foot-long buds into battle.

[Smooth Groove]

Mexican tacos

[T234]

I've tried Sampson's AK (said to be the best in WA state), Jamaican Lambsbread, all manner of elite-cut Bubba Kush, Kentucky Bluegrass (20 foot tall and blue, and awesomely strong. Said to be what George Washington grew.), and that Canadian was a cut above the rest.

Moral of this story, old people got the funk, even in Canada. 

EDIT: There are 100+ year old landraces here that would blow even Jorge Cervantes away.

EDIT 2: I want beautiful bud shots spencer, it's legal there!

[drew]

America makes the best guns

 

[Diunx]

Cuban,Argentine and venezuelan chicks >>>> mexican broads.

[Phoenix Dark]

Cuban,Argentine and venezuelan chicks >>>> mexican broads.

post pics to convince me

[Oblivion]

The country is essentially paralyzed from doing anything about it so get used to it.  The idea that we need cheap and plentiful guns is as entrenched as the need to spend nearly a trillion a year on defense.  It's so entrenched that it seems pointless to fight about it, even if overwhelming public opinion on both sides supports controlling either one of them.  The only way to stop it is if gun violence becomes a serious issue in affluent areas, which explains why people got worked up over Columbine.

I've always found it interesting how the people that usually hoard firearms cause of paranoid, delusional fears about the gubment are usually the same ones that demand the gubment to be continuously more powerful (with defense spending).

[T234]

Anything that has Dj Short's name on it (Flo, Blueberry) is solid gold. Sounds like you guys got the setup up there. If I was you, I'd get a 600 watt HPS and some Green Manalishi seeds. The freebie of that particular seedbank (El Monstre) is really famous for being better than what most seed companies have as a flagship.

Green Manalishi



El Monstre

[Himu]

What's a great way to take in weed without smoking it? I've tried brownies but they're usually not ideal...and I'm not interested in vape.

[Phoenix Dark]

sprinkle some in your apple martini

[T234]

Not interested in vape? What. What don't you like about vaporizers?