a thought I had about Mega Man

[Raban]

I've had this conversation with a few of my gamer friends and I figure a thread would be fun. About a month ago I was browsing around on the GameFAQs boards and found an interesting bit of Mega Man speculation. A member posited that Capcom's recent output of games have had a decidedly "mature" theme. Street Fighter has gotten pretty violent, and the most of Capcom's popular franchises this gen rock the M rating; Dead Rising, Resident Evil, Lost Planet, Devil May Cry, etc.

If you take this into consideration, it makes sense Mega Man's been put on the burner. He's a kid-friendly mascot, and the games that were coming had incredibly limited appeal skewed towards a younger audience. Seeing as how Capcom has stated since Dash 3's cancellation that they're still interested in Mega Man, are we going to see a "mature" reboot of Mega Man? Maybe they'll outsource it? My only problem with this is that the immediate solution for capturing Mega Man's gameplay in modern game design would be a shooter, right? And the market is flooded with that, not to mention the best one got made already.

A fellow Mega Man lover said to me, "Perhaps Mega Man has served his purpose" and I feel inclined to agree. Regardless, we're in store for at least one more go at it. What do you think it'll be?

[The Sceneman]

Street Fighter is about as violent as it has always been? That renders your whole argument invalid

also, tl;dr

[Himu]

Mega Man is Capcom's only kid friendly franchise currently. Think about that.

Honestly, I just don't know. With advent of popular downloadable games like Super Meat Boy I don't think there's really excuse for Mega Man NOT to deserve a modern chance. There's definitely an audience. I think that Capcom screwed the pooch by making Mega Man 10 after the popularity of Mega Man 9. They should have taken note of New Super Mario Bros. and Pacman DX and modernized classic 2d side scroller Mega Man and put it on all platforms (xbla/psn/wiiware/steam).

I think the Mega Man series has been horrifically mismanaged.

[magus]

they already made the matoor reboot of megaman,it's called megaman x... no wait actualy they made the matoor reboot twice with the other being called megaman zero

truth is nobody likes 2D scrollers anymore,so it's a victory they at least never turned him into an fps/cover based shooter a-la what happened to GRIT bionic commando

beside we should care about developers instead of brands,so i can't help but think that people should pay attention to that new keiji inafune game instead of crying about megaman endlessly

[Himu]

Mmx and mmz are in no way "mature". Sigh.

And side scrollers have made a comeback due to downloadable games. What the hell. You bring up Bionic Commando while ignoring Bionic Commando Rearmed.

[The Sceneman]

and the fact that Bionic Commando 2009 was goty 2009

[Himu]

truth is nobody likes 2D scrollers anymore,so it's a victory they at least never turned him into an fps/cover based shooter a-la what happened to GRIT bionic commando

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[magus]

all of these are game made as an afterthought for downloadable service,and they already made that as a megaman game (actualy weren't you complaining that you wanted "a megaman game that they couldn't have made in 1986?")

so yeah i stand by what i said until they release a side-scroller on an actual console that doesn't feature any estabilished nintendo character,i guess there is dragon crown but we all know it's going to bomb horribily including vanillaware itself which is why we love vanillaware so much in the first place

Mmx and mmz are in no way "mature"

why not?

[magus]

well they always says keiji inafune is megaman creator? i have no idea who professor F is

[iconoclast]

@magus' last post

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[Himu]

all of these are game made as an afterthought for downloadable service,and they already made that as a megaman game (actualy weren't you complaining that you wanted "a megaman game that they couldn't have made in 1986?")

so yeah i stand by what i said until they release a side-scroller on an actual console that doesn't feature any estabilished nintendo character

Mmx and mmz are in no way "mature"

why not?

because I complained about it 80's Mega Man being the only side scroller Mega Man in years, doesn't mean that I don't LIKE Mega Man 9 or 10. There is no contradiction here. This also doesn't take away from their existence.

After thought? The download services are THE best thing about this generation. After thought? That does not take away from these games existence.

[magus]

@magus' last post

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i completly forgot about that ,in my defense wasn't it started as a downloadable game?

and *that* is why you fail.

After thought? That does not take away from these games existence.

let me put it this way,they put game as a downloadable title to take less risks,they want to take less risks either because they are a small company/they know the game is going to bomb

a 2D side scrollers with a big budget and some hype behind it is never going to happen,in the same way i don't expect a fighting game from capcom which doesn't feature ryu or is a reboot of some old franchise,and that's because nobody really cares about these kind of games anymore,no matter how many super meats boy and ms.xplosion random indie teams decide to release

[Himu]

I don't see why Capcom doesn't follow stuff like Pacman DX CE or Space Invaders: Infinity Gene.

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[magus]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tokuro_Fujiwara

the guy made tomba?!?!?!?!?

GET THIS MAN A BIG PILE OF MONEY AND PUT HIM ON 3DS

[Himu]

why not?

Uhhhh...

How is this mature?



If this is mature to you, you live in a bubble.

This is mature content:



This is Megaman X:



This is Megaman Zero:



This is Megaman ZX:



Maturity is decided through content and theme. Mega Man X and Zero have the thematic and content of a kids tv show.

I should not have to explain this. X and Z have a greater focus on story, but they are hardly mature.

[magus]

Mega Man X and Zero have the thematic and content of a kids tv show.

being matoor doesn't mean having deep psychological theme or shit like that,it's all in the art and mood and in that regard do we want to put "doofy looking android defeats themed robot from wacky evil scientist" on the same level of "sword ninja android fights oppresive regime after the apocalypse happened"

so yeah i'm not saying "megaman zero is matoor" (cause that's definition in itself is stuuuuuuuuuuupid) i'm saying "megaman zero is more matoor than the original megaman" the difference between them is the same between your average cartoon network cartoon and your average action animu

[archie4208]

[youtube=560,345]LISmPmdUhYA[/youtube]

Looks pretty mature to me. 

[Raban]

a 2D side scrollers with a big budget and some hype behind it is never going to happen,in the same way i don't expect a fighting game from capcom which doesn't feature ryu or is a reboot of some old franchise,and that's because nobody really cares about these kind of games anymore,no matter how many super meats boy and ms.xplosion random indie teams decide to release

I think Capcom realizes this, that's why they've gone back to the drawing board with Mega Man.

[Raban]

It's only when he states the glaringly obvious.

[cool breeze]

i'm just surprised capcom isn't making anymore of those battle network games.  there were like a billion between the GBA and DS.

edit:

wait, Inti Creates made Gal Gun? haha

 

[Himu]

a 2D side scrollers with a big budget and some hype behind it is never going to happen,in the same way i don't expect a fighting game from capcom which doesn't feature ryu or is a reboot of some old franchise,and that's because nobody really cares about these kind of games anymore,no matter how many super meats boy and ms.xplosion random indie teams decide to release

I think Capcom realizes this, that's why they've gone back to the drawing board with Mega Man.

Let me point you to the sales of New Super Mario Bros. wii.

Let me give you a hint. It outsold every 3d Mario. Ever. Mario Galaxy 2 pales in comparison to its sales.

[Raban]

Let me point you to the sales of New Super Mario Bros. wii.

Let me give you a hint. It outsold every 3d Mario. Ever. Mario Galaxy 2 pales in comparison to its sales.

Let me give you a hint. Mario.

Not only that, but it's just naive to compare the appeal of Mario to Mega Man. For the last 15 years, Mega Man has been stuck in Animu-land weeping digital tears. As you said before, horribly mismanaged.

[Himu]

You guys are arguing that no one cares about these kinds of games anymore. These games as in sidescrollers.

A new console Mario side scroller hits consoles for the first time innnnnn...ding! 15 years? And it absolutely butt rapes other 3d Mario titles in terms of sales. Mario is irrelevant, because even other 3d titles still feature Mario, and we are discussing the supposed modern acceptance of sidescrollers. The premise of your argument is that no one cares for side scrollers, yet Castle Crashers sells 1m+, Angry Birds sells whatever the fuck it has sold, and New Super Mario Bros. shows Nintendo that making strictly 3d Mario titles is stupid.

How much did Donkey Kong Country Returns sell?

[Himu]

But, I thought no one had interest in sidescrollers.

[magus]

it's my obligation to warn you that you are agreeing with magoose

you guys are so mean

i'm just surprised capcom isn't making anymore of those battle network games.  there were like a billion between the GBA and DS.

battle network 4 was apparently really really shitty and after that they made 2 more but the series never recovered from that,they tried to reboot it on the DS with a new series called megaman star force but they fucked up that too so it stopped after only 3 titles instead of the 6 of battle network

himuchan's comparison would only be a good one if mario galaxy 2 had mario in it too

which it obviously doesn't

new super mario bros didn't have mario,it had mario AND huge dose of nostalgia's,you just have to look at the ads and how much they are trying to riff-raff super mario bros 3 when it's coming to super mario 3ds

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meanwhile the list of other 2D sidescrollers like wario land shake it,kirby epic yarn and donkey kong country (which unlike the first two is actualy a good game) who have bombed terribily is huge,so yeah...

also note that all of these games play it safe with character that are already estabilished,seriously when was the last time you played a retail game that was a sidescroller and featured a character that already didn't exist in 2000?

this is the only title i could think of and i had to think long and hard

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nobody gave a fuck about it

[Himu]

Well you're now teeter tattering on a slippery slope. Bulletstorm didn't sell well. Does that mean that people aren't interested in fps games? There are exceptions to every rule. Since we're on the subject of Mega Man itself, Mega Man 9 supposedly (if you trust vgchartz, which I don't) sold 140k within its first week. And that was on wii only, and this doesn't take in to account xbla or psn. That ain't bad for a 2d side scroller, and it's certainly more than "nobody".

[Himu]

But see, it doesn't count if it's downloadable because that means magus can't pirate it.

[cool breeze]

pirating wiiware games is easier than legitimately buying wiiware games...

Why does it have to be retail

The money simply isn't there anymore.  The money is is in making downloadable sidescrollers now.  Why would anyone actively go out and try to lose money?

Japanese publisher

but yeah, did MM9 and MM10 cost that much and make so little that Capcom hasn't abused it?

[Himu]

pirating wiiware games is easier than legitimately buying wiiware games...

No one gives a shit about wiiware, mostly talking about xbla here.

[cool breeze]

mega man 9 was a wiiware release before psn/xbl.  can't remember if mm10 was the same.

so, capcom cared about wiiware, briefly.

[Himu]

mega man 9 was a wiiware release before psn/xbl.  can't remember if mm10 was the same.

so, capcom cared about wiiware, briefly.

I'm talking about Magus and game fan interests, not game companies.

[Enl]

Yeah, if anything this generation has proven that sidescrollers still have a big audience, and like any other genre not every one of them is going to be successful.

[magus]

But see, it doesn't count if it's downloadable because that means magus can't pirate it.

is it just me or everytime the argument turns out "hurr durr you are a pirate"?
i can pirate steam just fine,that means i can play stuff like super meat boy and braid (which i actualy played might i add) so stop acting like little kids for once

Why does it have to be retail

why does it have to be retail? i already explained it

let me put it this way,they put game as a downloadable title to take less risks,they want to take less risks either because they are a small company/they know the game is going to bomb

a 2D side scrollers with a big budget and some hype behind it is never going to happen,in the same way i don't expect a fighting game from capcom which doesn't feature ryu or is a reboot of some old franchise,and that's because nobody really cares about these kind of games anymore,no matter how many super meats boy and ms.xplosion random indie teams decide to release

downloadable titles are candy sized snack compared to actual meals,they are what happens when nobody can give a fuck big enough

a nice example of this is shantae risky revenge which became a downloadable title because they couldn't find a real publisher

that's not even getting to mario galaxy 2, whose entire ad campaign predicated on HOLY FUCK KIDS, YOSHI'S BACK!

that's because it worked with new super mario bros wii,because that certainly wasn't the case with mario galaxy 1,meanwhile NSMB hammered the fact that it was going to reuse the koopa kids like it was some sort of national event!

but donkey kong?  are you fucking high?

http://www.thebore.com/forum/index.php?topic=36618.msg1378714#msg1378714

well allright bombed is exagerated but that doesn't still change the fact that's around stuff like twilight princess which by wii standards isn't exactly smashing success

you then go on to make the point that all of these games use existing, established characters from before 2000 - what the fuck is mega man then?

err an estabilished character from before 2000? my point was that there are no new sidescrollers that feature new character,what does megaman have to do with that?

- besides, if we look at digital platforms, there are numerous major success stories involving side scrolling/platformer games with original characters.  braid, N, meat boy, limbo, etc.

have any one of these titles made a splash big enough to make a big company like capcom care to release something similiar though? even disgaea is succesfull on it's own but it's not so big to sway more companies into making SRPG

[demi]

mega man is wack... play command mission. it rox.

[Raban]

[demi]

i own both collections on Gamecube, if it helps.

[magus]

okay hon, 2.35 million units in NA alone is not a smashing success (whatever the fuck that means)

let's look at some other magoose sales failures:

madden football
god of war 3
red dead redemption
metal gear solid 4
assassin's creed i&ii
uncharted i&ii
final fantasy 13
left 4 dead i&ii
guitar hero 3
fallout 3
bioshock
mass effect i&ii
oblivion

NO WONDER THE INDUSTRY IS IN TROUBLE

oh alright alright i was wrong have it your way

[Beezy]

Terrible

[Great Rumbler]

5+ million worldwide is, imo, pretty poor for a series with the prestige of Donkey Kong. Have to side with magus on this one.

[Raban]

The truth is, Mega Man hasn't ever gotten the kind of numbers that Mario or other mass-market video game franchises get. Just because Capcom could release an NSMB-style Mega Man doesn't necessarily mean it'll perform like that game. The brand recognition only goes so far, and the series is known for its "difficulty", unlike its competitors. It's pretty clear Capcom either isn't interested or doesn't understand how to capture the same markets with old-school Mega Man. Dash 3 was angling for an even smaller market than MM9 did.

As a franchise, Mega Man has done well but hasn't registered a "hit" in quite sometime. As I understand it, Capcom's business tactics as of late revolve around becoming Japan's worldwide hit-maker. I think if Capcom's gonna do Mega Man, they're gonna make it big. If their next attempt is yet another market failure, that'll probably be the end of Mega Man for the foreseeable future, though you know this business loves necrophilia.

I'm interested in whatever's coming. Especially curious about the direction the art will take now that Inafune's gone.

[Himu]

I agree with all of that Raban.

[The Sceneman]

5+ million worldwide is, imo, pretty poor for a series with the prestige of Donkey Kong. Have to side with magus on this one.

especially if you consider it was released for the Wii console with a 10 million install base