Author Topic: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.  (Read 9608 times)

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TVC15

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Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« on: January 07, 2007, 10:03:48 PM »
Metroidvania is dead.  It was good in SotN but everything since has been a pale imitation that has failed to advance the series.  Castlevania games used to be about challenge.  Metroidvania has nothing approaching challenge.  Metroidvania's lazy design strategy of corridor-room-corridor-room with no platforming challenges has influenced the design of 2 incredibly poor 3d Castlevanias. 

Metroidvania needs to be put out to pasture.  The Metroidvania games aren't even as good looking as Super Castlevania 4.  They have these long, Hanna Barbara-style repeating backgrounds that are ludicrously cheezy.  What little platforming is there is ruined by the lack of weight to it.  If you fall, you don't die, and the platforming is so ridiculously simple and by the books that it is unlikely you will fall to begin with.

Sure, the moves are cool and the controls are smooth, but what purpose is served without there being anything that resembles challenge?  The bosses are big and cool looking, and the castles are enormous, but it's all for naught when you're playing a game a 7 year old would be pressed to have trouble with.  All the equipment, items, soul collecting, familiars, non-linearity, mapping, all these things added to the series, yet without challenge and weight the games are just a shell of what the series used to be.

I will admit, I liked the Metroidvanias at first.  I have skipped only the most recent one because I am tired of them.  They are like gaming crack, they're easy to plow through and the experience is usually compulsive enough to propel you through a quick playthrough.  But remember, crack is BAD, and these games are bad.  I can play Super Castlevania now and see that it is still great, but if I pop in one of the GBA games, I will see that without the novelty of new gameness, it is poorly designed shit.

IGA has to die.  He needs to be killed for his sin.  Metroidvania is like the Holocaust of gaming - it seemed like a good idea at teh time, but a few years later, the smart people are willing to admit that it wasn't so bright.

DEATH TO METROIDVANIA!  LONG LIVE THE NEW FLESH!
serge

MrAngryFace

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #1 on: January 07, 2007, 10:05:52 PM »
Blah blah I heard this before Live! in concert and it still wasn't a compelling argument.

o_0

CajoleJuice

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #2 on: January 07, 2007, 10:06:01 PM »
I will join this movement.
AMC

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #3 on: January 07, 2007, 10:06:48 PM »
Portrait of Ruin has platforming and linear segments, SIR
duc

Christopher

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #4 on: January 07, 2007, 10:07:20 PM »
Oh shit - I was going to move on to a Metroidvania as my next Castlevania after Super Castlevania 4, but the challenge is gone?  Fuck that, with the music and the bitter unforgiven challenge the game was ace.

TVC we gotta stop buying Wii points :(

demi

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #5 on: January 07, 2007, 10:08:19 PM »
I'm gonna buy Portrait of Ruin just to tell Konami that I want MORE
fat

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #6 on: January 07, 2007, 10:08:46 PM »
demi, :heart
duc

TVC15

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #7 on: January 07, 2007, 10:08:55 PM »
Blah blah I heard this before Live! in concert and it still wasn't a compelling argument.



Enjoy paying for the exact same game, with its shitty graphics, animu, no challenge, and non-compelling design EVERY YEAR!

Some of us like gameplay.  YOU HATE GAMING.
serge

TVC15

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #8 on: January 07, 2007, 10:09:26 PM »
and demi you don't pay for games you are not fooling anyone
serge

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #9 on: January 07, 2007, 10:10:29 PM »
Blah blah I heard this before Live! in concert and it still wasn't a compelling argument.



Enjoy paying for the exact same game, with its shitty graphics, animu, no challenge, and non-compelling design EVERY YEAR!

Some of us like gameplay.  YOU HATE GAMING.

Dude, I will buy every DYNASTY WARRIORS GAME THEY CAN MAKE
duc

demi

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #10 on: January 07, 2007, 10:11:03 PM »


I didn't say I would buy it now... fuck.
fat

TVC15

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #11 on: January 07, 2007, 10:12:28 PM »
Blah blah I heard this before Live! in concert and it still wasn't a compelling argument.



Enjoy paying for the exact same game, with its shitty graphics, animu, no challenge, and non-compelling design EVERY YEAR!

Some of us like gameplay.  YOU HATE GAMING.

Dude, I will buy every DYNASTY WARRIORS GAME THEY CAN MAKE

That's different.  Those are (usually) good games.
serge

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #12 on: January 07, 2007, 10:23:40 PM »
So are all the Metroidvania games, honkie!
duc

CajoleJuice

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #13 on: January 07, 2007, 10:24:40 PM »
I'm just sick of the formula.  :-\
AMC

TVC15

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #14 on: January 07, 2007, 10:29:22 PM »
So are all the Metroidvania games, honkie!

Sorry, lazy design is a different story between Dynasty Warriors and Castlevania.  With DW, we don't know what a well designed entry would be like.  With Castlevania, we've had games with good design, levels, and graphics, and having these lame imitations in their place isn't something we are happy about putting up with.

Those GBA-quality pieces of crap don't even have memorable tunes.  Or good sound quality.  Castlevania IN NAME ONLY.  TOTAL PIECES OF SHIT.  DEATH TO IGA!
serge

MrAngryFace

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #15 on: January 07, 2007, 10:36:59 PM »
TVC: dont lecture me on how I spend my gaming money when you own both a Wii and PS3 lolz. You basically told two companies its ok to release half-baked consoles with one good game.
o_0

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #16 on: January 07, 2007, 10:44:38 PM »
I think the Metroidvania games have great design -- what the series lost in platforming, it made up for with exploration and more interesting enemies. Plus the Yuzo Koshiro soundtrack in Portrait is OMG OMG OMG, and SotN has THE BEST MUSIC OF ALL TIME IN A VIDEOGAME. In your face, old school!
duc

TVC15

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #17 on: January 07, 2007, 10:47:27 PM »
TVC: dont lecture me on how I spend my gaming money when you own both a Wii and PS3 lolz. You basically told two companies its ok to release half-baked consoles with one good game.

One good game?  You mean what the Metroidvania series has failed to produce, aside from the original?

Also, last I checked I am playing the game on the Wii, which means the Wii has more good Castlevania games than the GBA or DS has.  And I paid less for it, even!

You pansies just like easy games.  The Playstation Era mass marketization of gaming has made the games themselves easy pieces of crap, and you folks like it. 
« Last Edit: January 07, 2007, 10:49:20 PM by TVC 15 »
serge

MrAngryFace

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #18 on: January 07, 2007, 10:48:58 PM »
Haha yes, lets ignore your 850 dollars in purchases for the 100 or so ive spent on castlevania for GBA/DS
o_0

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #19 on: January 07, 2007, 10:50:00 PM »
lolz ps3
duc

TVC15

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #20 on: January 07, 2007, 10:50:39 PM »
Haha yes, lets ignore your 850 dollars in purchases for the 100 or so ive spent on castlevania for GBA/DS

I'm paying for potential.  You are paying for SHIT.

I won't deny that I like having new, fancy toys.  I'm not disappointed with either purchase at the moment, although if anyone can piss on my consumer electronicsgasm, it is Sony.  I knew what I was getting into.
serge

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #21 on: January 07, 2007, 10:51:15 PM »
The Playstation 2 is the greatest console of all time, and better than the SNES/Genny/TG-16 combined!
duc

The Fake Shemp

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #22 on: January 07, 2007, 10:52:44 PM »
Portrait of Ruin is awesome - put up or shut up.
PSP

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #23 on: January 07, 2007, 10:54:08 PM »
PoR is indeed the shiz, although MAN I wish they'd ditch the animu portraits. Someone tell Iga to go down on Ayame Kojima and get the crazy bishie acrylic work back!

Also, SCV4 excluded, Dawn of Sorrow is better than every other linear Castlevania. Yes, even better than Rondo of Blood.
duc

MrAngryFace

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #24 on: January 07, 2007, 10:54:35 PM »
Youre paying for shit lol. Wii, come on. Ps3? lol.

distinguished mentally-challenged fellows own those systems.
o_0

TVC15

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #25 on: January 07, 2007, 10:56:51 PM »
Yes, pointing out what systems I have paid for really explains how bad the Castlevania series has gotten.  Totally relevant to the discussion.
serge

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #26 on: January 07, 2007, 10:58:49 PM »
How bad it's gotten? How quickly we forget Castlevania 2, one of the worst games ever made, or the modern unplayability of the original. 3 and Rondo are decent if dated, and only 4 really stands the test of time. ALL of the Metroidvanias remain great -- yes, even Harmony, the weakest of the series. Hell, Circle of the Moon is harder than every decent linear Castlevania made!

Also, why don't you own Castlevania Chronicles for the PSOne? It contains a remix of the original MSX Vampire Killer with new levels and bosses! It would give you something to play on your PS3 -- badly upscaled, but entertaining nonetheless!
« Last Edit: January 07, 2007, 11:03:33 PM by Drinky Crow »
duc

MrAngryFace

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #27 on: January 07, 2007, 11:02:27 PM »
I think ill just point out that if youre willing to pay for potential, you should loan me 1000 dollars, cause I COULD be a millionare someday and PAY U BAK x 10!

TVC doesnt own chronicles cause he isnt a true fan.
o_0

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #28 on: January 07, 2007, 11:04:11 PM »
3D Castlevania AND 3D Metroid need to die.
duc

TVC15

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #29 on: January 07, 2007, 11:04:56 PM »
I actually liked 2 when it came out.  I even beat it on my own, heh.  Without help.  Somehow.  I'll do the game a service and not play it again, though.

1 and 3 are both fantastic games.  I don't get where you are coming from saying that the first one is unplayable.  It's one of the very few NES games that I still enjoy.  Sure, it was before they got the mechanics down, so there were some bits that were unfair, but it's overall an excellent game, deserving of its classic status.  And 3 has some of the most memorable levels in the series!  It's fantastic (and maybe the actual best in the series). 

I can't comment on Rondo or Bloodlines.  I haven't played em.  And isn't Castlevania Chronicles kinda rare?  I believe I was super poor when it came out.  When was the game it contains made?

Also 3d Metroid > 2d Metroidvania.  Just sayin'
serge

MrAngryFace

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #30 on: January 07, 2007, 11:05:59 PM »
lol
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Van Cruncheon

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #31 on: January 07, 2007, 11:06:59 PM »
Quote from: a jerk
Also 3d Metroid > 2d Metroidvania.

now you've done it. i'm pissing in your diet mountain dew tomorrow.
duc

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #32 on: January 07, 2007, 11:07:24 PM »
Bloodlines was really good; forgot about that one.
duc

TVC15

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #33 on: January 07, 2007, 11:09:01 PM »
Quote from: a jerk
Also 3d Metroid > 2d Metroidvania.

now you've done it. i'm pissing in your diet mountain dew tomorrow.

3d Metroid (the first one at least) has pretty visuals (for the system it's on), pretty diverse environments, and actual platforming, 3 things Metroidvanias do not have!
serge

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #34 on: January 07, 2007, 11:10:29 PM »
it has some other things the metroidvanias don't have: scanning, terrible controls, stupid visors, and godawful boss fights!
duc

TVC15

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #35 on: January 07, 2007, 11:13:41 PM »
it has some other things the metroidvanias don't have: scanning, terrible controls, stupid visors, and godawful boss fights!

I'm no big defender of the game, although I do want to give it another shot, but the boss encounters are one of the things I remember being pretty well done.  And while there are some question marks about the controls, I don't think they're that bad.  I think the game almost really succeeded at being a 3d Metroid.  All things considered, it was a good first attempt at something very tricky.

Anyway, I figured Metroid Prime would be right up your ally since you apparently like games that can be beaten by infants.
serge

The Fake Shemp

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #36 on: January 07, 2007, 11:15:42 PM »
 :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o
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Van Cruncheon

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #37 on: January 07, 2007, 11:20:13 PM »
The Thardus and Omega Pirate fights are janky exercises in visor/weapon swapping and ultimately about as fun as trying to finger a cheeseburger.

Metroid Prime wasn't an easy game -- which you'd know if you were capable of beating it!
duc

TVC15

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #38 on: January 07, 2007, 11:24:53 PM »
Was Thardus the rock guy?  I liked that fight, a lot, actually.  That was the first boss I thought of.  ANd I *did* forget about Omega Pirate. 

And yes, it was largely an easy game.  Unless I am forgetting anything, one long stretch without save points and the omega pirate were it as far as difficulty went.

Visor and weapon switching were lame.  So was scanning.  Those are largely why I do not remember the whole game fondly.  The jumping and platforming were pretty well done.

They only reason I stopped playing was because it kept freezing my gamepube at extremely specific parts.
serge

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #39 on: January 07, 2007, 11:27:21 PM »
Freezing? The streaming in that game BROKE my first Gamecube!
duc

MrAngryFace

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #40 on: January 07, 2007, 11:31:30 PM »
Lol
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TVC15

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #41 on: January 07, 2007, 11:32:58 PM »
Freezing? The streaming in that game BROKE my first Gamecube!

Stop lying.  Nintendo hardware is always perfect. Break, psh.
serge

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #42 on: January 07, 2007, 11:34:19 PM »
I had Rushmore from GAF take it in for me!
duc

MrAngryFace

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #43 on: January 07, 2007, 11:36:06 PM »
This is officially a joke thread. Whether or not it was intended to be funny. lol
o_0

Himu

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #44 on: January 07, 2007, 11:38:37 PM »
Portrait of Ruin owns.
IYKYK

TVC15

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #45 on: January 07, 2007, 11:44:05 PM »
Lookie, metroidvania fans are LIARS.

And MAF, there are a growing number of Castlevania fans that are WAKING UP from the Metroidvania Matrix of Shit.  Soon our voices will be LOUD.  We don't want warmed over, effortless yearly updates.  We want something well-crafted, something someone had to THINK ABOUT designing.
serge

Flannel Boy

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #46 on: January 07, 2007, 11:45:26 PM »
My favorite game in the series is Super Castlevania.

Himu

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #47 on: January 07, 2007, 11:47:23 PM »
White Man, PoR has puzzles, platforming, linearity, and ACTUAL DIFFICULTY. Quite possibly the best Metroidvania and your'e shitting on it without trying it.

You disappoint me.  :-\
IYKYK

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #48 on: January 07, 2007, 11:49:23 PM »
He likes Metroid Prime, man. He can't be trusted.

I think he liked Shenmue, too!
duc

Howard Alan Treesong

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #49 on: January 07, 2007, 11:49:46 PM »
Yamane-san is not only a fantastic composer, she carries a hip flask full of whisky and a pedometer with her at all times. She swills alcohol, keeps in shape, and composes phatty beats. What a MILF!  :heartbeat I want her around after your revolution, TVC 15.

IGA, however, can go hang out in the Itagaki Hall of Shame.
乱学者

TVC15

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #50 on: January 07, 2007, 11:50:15 PM »
I'd try it but I do not have a DS at the moment.  Since it's an Iga game, I'll continue to not get my hopes up.  Everyone always says the latest is the best metroidvania, at least at first.
serge

Himu

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #51 on: January 07, 2007, 11:50:39 PM »
I think he liked Shenmue, too!

Hey :(

  Everyone always says the latest is the best metroidvania, at least at first.

Those are the tools. I remember when DoS came out and people said it was the best. I lol'ed
« Last Edit: January 07, 2007, 11:52:10 PM by Himuro »
IYKYK

The Sceneman

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #52 on: January 07, 2007, 11:58:25 PM »
Metroidvanias have the funniest enemy and item descriptions ever.

Shit like: "A healthy treat made from whole wheat", "May give the illusion of increased muscle mass", "An atrocious eagle that carries Ripper with it"
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Van Cruncheon

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #53 on: January 08, 2007, 12:00:29 AM »
Ninthings called DoS the best because they wanted SotN -- a Playstation premium -- to get trumped. Doesn't mean DoS wasn't really good, though.
duc

Himu

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #54 on: January 08, 2007, 12:01:17 AM »
Ninthings called DoS the best because they wanted SotN -- a Playstation premium -- to get trumped. Doesn't mean DoS wasn't really good, though.

I thought it was alright but it was pretty lacking imo. It was mostly because it was a goddamn rehash.
IYKYK

Howard Alan Treesong

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #55 on: January 08, 2007, 12:03:13 AM »
I thought it was alright but it was pretty lacking imo. It was mostly because it was a goddamn rehash.

DoS was not nearly as good as Aria of Sorrow. All the others were fairly obviously incremental improvements, though the portable Metroidvania formula didn't really get nailed down until Aria. Circle is still fun, in a weirdly hardcore way. Harmony is pure trash.
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The Sceneman

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #56 on: January 08, 2007, 12:03:28 AM »
DoS rocked my world because It was the frist Metroidvania I had played since SotN and I hadnt played Aria yet
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Van Cruncheon

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #57 on: January 08, 2007, 12:04:58 AM »
I liked DoS better than Aria -- in fact, Aria's probably my least favorite Metroidvania. Harmony had some nasty music and backtracking, but I loved the massive dual castle and the exploration.
duc

Howard Alan Treesong

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #58 on: January 08, 2007, 12:05:35 AM »
I liked DoS better than Aria -- in fact, Aria's probably my least favorite Metroidvania. Harmony had some nasty music and backtracking, but I loved the massive dual castle and the exploration.

Aria's my MOST favorite! Take that!
乱学者

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Metroidvania needs to die. Right now.
« Reply #59 on: January 08, 2007, 12:06:16 AM »
Why!
duc