Author Topic: Breaking Bad's characters are fucking distinguished mentally-challenged  (Read 28259 times)

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Himu

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Every minute I am laughing at the absurdity of these characters. They MAKE NO SENSE!

I am halfway through season 4 and the only reason I am continuing watching is because I need to see this through out of obligation, not because I'm liking it.

I fucking hate these characters, and not in a "they're bad people!" cliche way either, but because they are so horribly written. I cannot stand Walt and especially Jesse, they are distinguished mentally-challenged.
IYKYK

Olivia Wilde Homo

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There were some people here on this board who thought it was better than The Wire
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ZephyrFate

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and I fucking laugh at their faces when they say such absolute nonsense

brawndolicious

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They make sense.

Because I say so.

Himu

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Walt realizes Jesse is missing, so he takes his unlicensed gun, drives - recklessly! - to the chicken joint and demands to speak to Gus with a gun in his hand. He tells them his NAME. He has cameras locked on him. He has a gun in his jacket pocket. They tell him Gus isn't there, and then he gets a call from Mike. Mike is like, calm the fuck down dumbass. But no, this isn't enough. Walt has to go and kick the door down to Gus' office, with cameras watching him. What does he think this will accomplish? Will it guarantee his safety? No. Will it guarantee Jesse's safety? No. Even if it's not in regards to safety, they could call the cops and he'd be in big trouble being busted with that unlicensed gun he's holding. Even if he DOES leave the place unscathed or not arrested, this will only force them to monitor him even FURTHER.

The whole thing is illogical, stupid, and requires a tremendous amount of grasping at straws to make this character behavior work.
IYKYK

ZephyrFate

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I am now convinced

that The Wire is better than BB

ZephyrFate

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It's not even a contest that Mad Men is better. As is The Borgias, or Homeland. BB is great, but it seriously took until Season 4 for me to see any of that.

Phoenix Dark

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The writing on BB is good overall. It's some of the lazy plot devices and coincidences that sometimes make it hard to view it as some serious show to be compared to The Wire, The Sopranos, The Shield, etc.

S3 is god tier television, and S4 is very good too.

And can we stop proclaiming Homeland as the best thing ever until Showtime proves they can pull off a good season season?
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ZephyrFate

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The writing on BB is good overall. It's some of the lazy plot devices and coincidences that sometimes make it hard to view it as some serious show to be compared to The Wire, The Sopranos, The Shield, etc.

S3 is god tier television, and S4 is very good too.

And can we stop proclaiming Homeland as the best thing ever until Showtime proves they can pull off a good season season?
They already have: The Borgias.

brawndolicious

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The writing on BB is good overall. It's some of the lazy plot devices and coincidences that sometimes make it hard to view it as some serious show to be compared to The Wire, The Sopranos, The Shield, etc.

S3 is god tier television, and S4 is very good too.

And can we stop proclaiming Homeland as the best thing ever until Showtime proves they can pull off a good season season?
They already have: The Borgias.

Seriously, Lucrezia>Sansa any day.

Great Rumbler

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dog

ZephyrFate

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The writing on BB is good overall. It's some of the lazy plot devices and coincidences that sometimes make it hard to view it as some serious show to be compared to The Wire, The Sopranos, The Shield, etc.

S3 is god tier television, and S4 is very good too.

And can we stop proclaiming Homeland as the best thing ever until Showtime proves they can pull off a good season season?
They already have: The Borgias.

Seriously, Lucrezia>Sansa any day.
I love Game of Thrones but you are fucking correct.

Phoenix Dark

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I'll give it a shot, not expecting much.

But seriously, this thread is now about Homeland. Breaking Bad is a good show, get over it.

Homeland's first season is amazing. The penultimate might be one of the most tense, amazing hour of television I've seen in years. The writing is great, as is the acting.

The problem is that it did everything to set up S2 to be a disaster. We'll see soon enough
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Phoenix Dark

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The only people who like Sansa are SanSan shippers, let's be honest. Having a better character on your show than her is not some amazing feat.
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Himu

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Sansa from GoT?
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ZephyrFate

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The only people who like Sansa are SanSan shippers, let's be honest. Having a better character on your show than her is not some amazing feat.
The reason they are compared is that they are in fundamentally the same role in both shows, but Lucrezia is smarter, hotter, and fucking devious as shit.

She's basically what Sansa might become in a book or two.

Phoenix Dark

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The only people who like Sansa are SanSan shippers, let's be honest. Having a better character on your show than her is not some amazing feat.
The reason they are compared is that they are in fundamentally the same role in both shows, but Lucrezia is smarter, hotter, and fucking devious as shit.

She's basically what Sansa might become in a book or two.

So she's basically Margery Tyrell :smug
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Great Rumbler

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dog

ZephyrFate

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Perhaps. At least whatever show-Margaery is going to be.

But I think she's hotter than Natalie Dormer.

brawndolicious

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The only people who like Sansa are SanSan shippers, let's be honest. Having a better character on your show than her is not some amazing feat.

I'm just making the comparison since both characters are the same age/circumstances, but Sansa honestly never does anything rash or ballsy no matter how shitty her situation gets. Lucrezia on the other hand totally learns to pull those puppet strings. But to be fair, she's the only likable character on The Borgias.

ZephyrFate

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The only people who like Sansa are SanSan shippers, let's be honest. Having a better character on your show than her is not some amazing feat.

I'm just making the comparison since both characters are the same age/circumstances, but Sansa honestly never does anything rash or ballsy no matter how shitty her situation gets. Lucrezia otoh totally learns to pull those puppet strings. But tbf, she's the only likable character on The Borgias.
How DARE you say Cesare is unlikable.

HOW DARE YOU

brawndolicious

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How DARE you say Cesare is unlikable.

HOW DARE YOU

He's a romantic sadist. Seriously, a lot of the time he's acting as the pope's thug or he's bitching about not being the pope's official thug.

And the rest of the time he spends looking beautiful.

Phoenix Dark

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I hate this criticism of Sansa, and it makes me upset I'm even defending her. What exactly do people want Sansa to do in her situation?  What "puppet strings" can she pull as a prisoner with next to no time to herself? Worse yet, why would she dare risk the wrath of a sadistic king and an indifferent queen?

She certainly begins to scheme a bit in the third book, but she actually has some protection...eh, I won't go into spoilers.
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Himu

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I like Sansa. I don't understand how anyone can hate her. She comes off better in the books than the show, I think.
IYKYK

ZephyrFate

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I dunno, I think the underlying crux of his powerlessness as being the younger brother who craves the ability to rule an army while constantly getting shut down by his father provides a really great character conflict. On top of that, while he starts to revel in his ability to kill indiscriminately, he's constantly undone by his sister, who wants to keep seeing him as some pure person.

He's likable to me because he's got so many shades to his character -- at times he's romantic, obsessive, cynical, murderous, perverted, gentle, stoic, depressed. He wants what he can't have, an interesting contrast to his father, who has all that he wants but constantly craves more.

That brings me to Rodrigo, who is likable because Jeremy Irons.

Phoenix Dark

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Another thing about Sansa: given her situation, she should be commended for surviving and not making any major mistakes. She perfectly adapted to her role - whereas Arya would have liked been killed under the same circumstances. Likewise, Sansa certainly would not have survived in Arya's shoes. It's an interesting subject

Sansa gets smarter and more cunning in each book
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brawndolicious

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I hate this criticism of Sansa, and it makes me upset I'm even defending her. What exactly do people want Sansa to do in her situation?  What "puppet strings" can she pull as a prisoner with next to no time to herself? Worse yet, why would she dare risk the wrath of a sadistic king and an indifferent queen?

She certainly begins to scheme a bit in the third book, but she actually has some protection...eh, I won't go into spoilers.

GRRM could have given her a dragon-spewing crotch and a death wish. Something to make her interesting.

Sansa's actions are totally understandable, I agree. I just wish something more interesting would come of her situation.

I dunno, I think the underlying crux of his powerlessness as being the younger brother who craves the ability to rule an army while constantly getting shut down by his father provides a really great character conflict. On top of that, while he starts to revel in his ability to kill indiscriminately, he's constantly undone by his sister, who wants to keep seeing him as some pure person.

He's likable to me because he's got so many shades to his character -- at times he's romantic, obsessive, cynical, murderous, perverted, gentle, stoic, depressed. He wants what he can't have, an interesting contrast to his father, who has all that he wants but constantly craves more.

That brings me to Rodrigo, who is likable because Jeremy Irons.

This is true. I don't think any main character on The Borgias is actually totally selfish, except maybe Juan. Even power-hungry cunts like Rodrigo or King Charles can show humility, heroism, and love.

Phoenix Dark

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Don't want to turn this into another GoT thread but I'll just say Sansa is going to be a major player soon. I don't think she's the queen prophesied to destroy Cersei, but she might have the second best trump card in her pocket besides Dany (dragons)
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Himu

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Season 1 starts slow until Kima gets shot. lol @ mojo
IYKYK

Himu

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Well, Baltimore police department really does lack funding. According to all sources, The Wire's depiction of the PD is very accurate. The office scenes are some of the best scenes as well. Seeing the reactions of the characters and their words is a big "thing" with The Wire.

Personally I liked the show from ep 1, but a lot of people aren't big on season 1 until Kima gets shot, and from there, it just goes places.
IYKYK

Mupepe

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The Wire doesn't hit its stride until the end of S01 IMO.

And BB is great pulp drama.  Does anyone expect it to be deep or meaningful?  The entire plot is outlandish.  It's a fun show and that's all it really tries to be.  And it does it well.  I hate the characters too.  They're all idiots.  Every single one.  It's fun watching their world fall apart.  Spoiler alert: you're supposed to hate them

Himu

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Yeah, I find BB more enjoyable if I consider it pulp, but then it tries to be this serious show, and then it takes me out of the experience because the characters are stupid.
IYKYK

Mupepe

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Yeah, I find BB more enjoyable if I consider it pulp, but then it tries to be this serious show, and then it takes me out of the experience because the characters are stupid.
The serious parts never seem that serious for me.  Like Jesse and his girlfriend, Jesse whining over Gale, Walt's marriage.  It never seemed like it was trying to evoke emotion to me.  It just seemed like the writers were using plot devices to obviously move the story in a direction.  It's all so unrealistic that I could never buy it as anything more than pulp.  It's almost as careless as Ugly Betty when it comes to plot devices and I like it that way. 

Himu

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Funnilly, those are my least favorite parts of BB. Jesse going emo over Gale was the last straw. It's like every season he hits rock bottom, and it's so repetitive, because Jesse will always have some new kind of understanding on life, and the whole process repeats. He has zero character development and always reverts to this depressed shell. I'm not sure if that's what they're going for on purpose, but man is it repetitive and tiring.
« Last Edit: July 18, 2012, 10:50:07 AM by Stringer Bell »
IYKYK

CajoleJuice

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Some people don't experience growth in real life.

spoiler (click to show/hide)
Not that I would know anything about that
[close]
AMC

Mupepe

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Breaking Bad as pulp television  :lol
how is it not?  it's a fantasy.  bigger than life characters (Gus and even Walt) doing crazy shit with little or no realistic repurcussions. 

BlueTsunami

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From a cinematic point of view, I love this show to pieces. Its very distinct and they take risks with various aspects and editing.
:9

Phoenix Dark

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Throw this thread in the shite bin
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Mupepe

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Breaking Bad as pulp television  :lol
how is it not?  it's a fantasy.  bigger than life characters (Gus and even Walt) doing crazy shit with little or no realistic repurcussions.

Not all fantasy is pulp.
Cool.  I don't think anyone said all fantasy was pulp.

ZephyrFate

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It puts it at a level below mad men and other serious dramas

Mupepe

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Doesn't seem like there's anything wrong with that.

Robo

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Breaking Bad is closely analogous to The Shield in terms of tone and its treatment of characters and drama.  You'd have to be pretty dumb to think that's a bad thing.
obo

Himu

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no, there's nothing wrong with it.
IYKYK

MyNameIsMethodis

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Mad Men is overrated garbage. IT's too convenient in its themes and its just boring.

Best TV Shows in Order:
The SHield
Twin Peaks
Carnivale
Justified Season 2
HOmicide
The Wire

im sure im forgetting others
USA

Phoenix Dark

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You say that, but I watched season 2 as well.

First problem is a feeble plot loosely based around the Baltimore docks. It never gets any traction, continually scratching around for something to latch on but never coming close to the intensity and concentration of the First Series. Secondly, even this semblance of plot is unconvincing and surprisingly conventional. Guess what? The dockers are ripping off some of the containers! And there are some Bad Men behind the scenes with sinister foreign accents and sinister monikers like "The Greek" who calmly assure the people they torture that they have their solemn word that they'll be spared if they offer the information they're being tortured for but then have them garroted anyway. You'd think this is "Die Hard".

And then the acting is often ridiculously over-the-top. "Season One" was remarkably understated in this regard with exemplary performances throughout but here various characters vie for who can chew the scenery with more aplomb. It's more and more evident that the central character, McNulty, is miscast: Dominic West far more readily suggests that he'd be more naturally attuned to the pages of "Gentleman's Quarterly" than as a sleep-in-his-clothes self-destructive (but dedicated) cop; his drunk scene is about as unconvincing as it gets. And although many of the characters are clearly meant to be eccentrically loveable, I have to admit I find them irritating. The writing is contrived, attempting to capture the Poetry Of The Streets but failing ignominiously. Of course there is "earthy" humour in abundance but it continually falls flat; to compensate, we are shown lots of reaction shots of people laughing uproariously to let us know humour WAS intended. In fact, there's a constant straining for effect rather than natural story-telling. It's as if the writers are vainly shooting the plot up with adrenalin when it is so plainly dead.

You strained really hard to take this dump, I'm somewhat impressed.

First off, there was nothing unrealistic or contrived about the docks. Yes, labor unions and dock workers rip off shipments every day in this country and throughout the world. Yes, mob types have shipped cargo into the United States before. Your focus on this misses the rather obvious story the show told through the dock workers: the death of the manufacturing industry and its impact on the middle class. I would argue S2 of The Wire is arguably the ballsiest season of just about any "serious" show on television in the last 20 years. The abrupt change in scenery from sole focus on the dying Baltimore streets to the dying Baltimore blue collar middle class was amazing.

Second, your critique of the writing makes no sense. Contrived? Forced? One might be able to make that argument for season 5 where Simon is almost directly writing to viewers, but the first four seasons are done magnificently. I've never heard anyone question the show's writing and your weak argument (or lack thereof) explains why. Characters are presented in brutally honest, human fashions, dialogue is witty, and the overall plot movement works like nothing I've seen on television. Simon has said many times that the show's novel like pace was deliberate because he had no interest in playing catch up for viewers. Information is presented perfectly, and by the end of a season each strand has been handled with maximum care/effectiveness.

Finally on acting. The Wire has perhaps the most impressive ensemble cast I've seen on television. The Sopranos comes close, but I'd give it to The Wire due to the amazing emotional range demonstrated by most of the primary characters, and even the child actors.
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Mupepe

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Damn, PD.  I can't believe you bit.  You must not have even read mojo's first post on this page.

Himu

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PD he is taking quotes from amazon reviews and posting them. he is trolling lol
IYKYK

Phoenix Dark

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FUCK

Well I'm signing up on Amazon to find the real poster, as OJ would say
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ZephyrFate

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Mad men having 'convenient themes' is one of the dumbest things ive ever read

EmCeeGrammar

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Funnilly, those are my least favorite parts of BB. Jesse going emo over Gale was the last straw. It's like every season he hits rock bottom, and it's so repetitive, because Jesse will always have some new kind of understanding on life, and the whole process repeats. He has zero character development and always reverts to this depressed shell. I'm not sure if that's what they're going for on purpose, but man is it repetitive and tiring.

Jesse is an ADDICT who RELAPSES whenever he can't cope with the fucked up bed he has made for himself.  Its not that outlandish, really. 

edit: the character development in BB is all about Walt and Skyler and the domino effect of justification that has resulted in their slide to criminal behaviour, (last shot of season four, ted, etc).  I'm expecting season 5 Walt to stop at NOTHING ultimately.
« Last Edit: July 18, 2012, 06:12:12 PM by EmCeeGrammar »
sad

Phoenix Dark

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I'm at the end of S3, gonna watch the finale soon. I gotta say S3 of Mad Men is god tier television. Just amazing, and on a level about the first two seasons which I thought were damn good but not truly amazing.

I love the few discussions of race on the show, specifically the situation with Pete trying to convince a television manufacturer to advertise directly to black people, who were buying their TV sets at high rates.
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bdoughty

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Breaking Bad's characters are a freaking Mensa group compared to Dexter. As much as I love Dexter, the rest of the cast makes me want to tear my ears off. Collin Hanks? WTF were they thinking.

That said Justified is the best show on TV right now.

Freyj

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Walt hasn't been a reasonable, logical person in a very long time, but that's sort of the point and enjoyment of the show. That is, watching Walt pull everyone around him into his downward spiral of crazy.

Jesse has been a weak/impressionable little shit from the first episode. He's more of a Wallace than a Stringer Bell. Was the Season 4 post-Jane party bullshit boring? Absolutely. Should he still be cooperating with Walt after all the bullshit? Absolutely not, but he's as weak and scared as he's always been.

I wouldn't classify them as "distinguished mentally-challenged" or "poorly written". That's reserved for shows like Dexter with characters like LaGuerta.

Dickie Dee

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The Shield is b-tier compared to BB and The Wire
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Phoenix Dark

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The Shield shits on Breaking Bad in nearly every way
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Himu

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I'm at the end of S3, gonna watch the finale soon. I gotta say S3 of Mad Men is god tier television. Just amazing, and on a level about the first two seasons which I thought were damn good but not truly amazing.

I love the few discussions of race on the show, specifically the situation with Pete trying to convince a television manufacturer to advertise directly to black people, who were buying their TV sets at high rates.

if you find that interesting, research this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pepsi#Niche_marketing

Quote
Boyd also led a sales team composed entirely of blacks around the country to promote Pepsi. Racial segregation and Jim Crow laws were still in place throughout much of the U.S.; Boyd's team faced a great deal of discrimination as a result,[9] from insults by Pepsi co-workers to threats by the Ku Klux Klan.[10] On the other hand, it was able to use racism as a selling point, attacking Coke's reluctance to hire blacks and support by the chairman of Coke for segregationist Governor of Georgia Herman Talmadge.[8] As a result, Pepsi's market share as compared to Coke's shot up dramatically. After the sales team visited Chicago, Pepsi's share in the city overtook that of Coke for the first time.[8]

This focus on the market for black people caused some consternation within the company and among its affiliates. It did not want to seem focused on black customers for fear white customers would be pushed away.[8] In a meeting at the Waldorf-Astoria Hotel, Mack tried to assuage the 500 bottlers in attendance by pandering to them, saying: "We don't want it to become known as a distinguished black fellow drink."[11] After Mack left the company in 1950, support for the black sales team faded and it was cut.
IYKYK

CajoleJuice

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I'm at the end of S3, gonna watch the finale soon. I gotta say S3 of Mad Men is god tier television. Just amazing, and on a level about the first two seasons which I thought were damn good but not truly amazing.

I love the few discussions of race on the show, specifically the situation with Pete trying to convince a television manufacturer to advertise directly to black people, who were buying their TV sets at high rates.

And the finale of S3 is the best part.
AMC

Dickie Dee

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The Shield shits on Breaking Bad in nearly every way

Nope.
« Last Edit: July 18, 2012, 06:43:45 PM by Mamacint »
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Phoenix Dark

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Nothing in Breaking Bad matched S5 or S7 of The Shield. S3 of BB comes close of course but that's it
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Dickie Dee

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Breaking Bad is closely analogous to The Shield in terms of tone and its treatment of characters and drama.  You'd have to be pretty dumb to think that's a bad thing.

Except in The Shield the original sin of the end of the first episode should have been threaded through every episode of the series, but all we got was a montage of Vic feelin' bad in the second episode and then it's barely brought up again except as a plot point. For 95%+ of the series Vic is just a bog-standard anti-hero.

There really is no equivalent to Walt's continued moral downward spiral on any show in history.
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