Next Xbox in Japan,Yay or Nay?

[maxy]

The question is simple,should MS bother with Japan next gen?

Eurogamer has some nice article about Xbox failure in Japan,please read
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-12-13-why-xbox-failed-in-japan

Some quotes

"So popular was the first PlayStation that Sony enjoyed a vice-like grip over the hearts and minds of Japanese publishers. They were afraid to alienate Sony by supporting Microsoft. In some cases, they were even afraid to be seen to support Microsoft."

" 'I remember going to a Sony party at E3,” Bachus says. “They had every one of the major Japanese game publishers who we'd spent a lot of time with in Japan. I ran into one of these guys, who was standing with Ken Kutaragi. At first he was like, 'hey!' and his face lit up. And then he realised he was standing next to Kutaragi. 'Oh, oh, I'm sorry, do I know you?' He pretended he didn't because he didn't want to alienate Sony.' "

"We were told we couldn't call it the Xbox because X is the letter of death,” Fries remembers. “We were told we couldn't make it black because black is the colour of death. I was like, isn't the PlayStation black? Rules that apply to you as an outsider don't necessarily apply to insider products.”

"Fries was told he couldn't release Halo the way it was in Japan because Japanese players wouldn't be able to deal with the dual sticks. 'So we ended up having to make a bunch of modifications for Japanese players and dumb the game down, make an easier version.' "

"Microsoft had heard from publishers that Sony struck different loyalty rates with different publishers. Microsoft wanted to create a level playing field where all publishers paid the same royalty fee, but this rubbed some Japanese the wrong way. “They thought we'd buy their loyalty,” Bachus says."

"But things soon went south. Japanese gamers began complaining that the Xbox was scratching game discs. It wasn't a problem local to Japan, but there it caused an uproar that blind-sided Fries and the Xbox team back in Redmond. The re-sell market in Japan is particularly important, and if there is a scratch on a disc it lowers the value of the game. “It's not really an issue in the US,” Fries says. “Maybe a western company sell to a different standard than a Japanese company. It spun in the carrier it could leave a rotary scratch on the outside of the disc, which doesn't interfere with gameplay at all, but interfered with the re-sell value in Japan.”

Microsoft had heard on the grapevine that Shinji Mikami, famed creator of Resident Evil, had grown tired and frustrated with developing for the PlayStation 2, which hadn't even been out a year. There were whispers that Mikami was thinking about moving Resident Evil away from PlayStation. He was looking at Microsoft, preparing to launch the Xbox, and Nintendo, preparing to launch the GameCube. Microsoft saw its chance, and set up a meeting.

Bachus remembers Mikami looking every bit the Japanese rockstar, all mirrored sunglasses and leather jackets. An entourage of hangers on followed him into the Microsoft Japan meeting room.


The meeting was conducted by a member of Microsoft Japan's staff who could speak both English and Japanese. Things began cordially, but soon started to deteriorate. Bachus shifted uneasily in his seat. He could tell from Mikami's body language and tone that he wasn't happy with the answers he was getting. The entire meeting was conducted in Japanese. Notes were passed to Bachus explaining what was going on but all he could do was watch in horror, helpless, as it fell apart. The meeting ended abruptly. Mikami stood, bowed, and left.

Bachus was furious. The translator explained: Mikami had confirmed what Microsoft had heard, that he was frustrated developing for PlayStation 2, which was tough to work with. But his team's bonuses were tied to game sales. He needed a reason, a way to explain the shift away from the wildly successful PlayStation 2, the dominant platform of the time, to the Xbox, which had yet to launch, and which in most Japanese eyes was doomed to failure. “What do you guys have to offer?” he asked, bluntly.

Eventually an exasperated Mikami boiled it down: 'what is your philosophy? Sony says games are entertainment, something larger, fuelled by the Emotion Engine. Nintendo says games are toys, created by the legendary Shigeru Miyamoto, perhaps the greatest game developer of all time. What do you feel?' Microsoft had no answer.

“I almost jumped out the window because we had said repeatedly over and over and over that we aspire to enable games that could be considered to be art, much like film,” Bachus says, “that because of the maturity of the development tools and the APIs and the power of the technology, game developers on Xbox would be able to concentrate on the finesse features that elevated games to being something more than they were otherwise.

“So the guy who reported to me said, 'oh that's so great! I wish that I had known that.' But unfortunately it was too late.”

[bork]

Eventually an exasperated Mikami boiled it down: 'what is your philosophy? Sony says games are entertainment, something larger, fuelled by the Emotion Engine. Nintendo says games are toys, created by the legendary Shigeru Miyamoto, perhaps the greatest game developer of all time. What do you feel?' Microsoft had no answer.

“I almost jumped out the window because we had said repeatedly over and over and over that we aspire to enable games that could be considered to be art, much like film,” Bachus says, “that because of the maturity of the development tools and the APIs and the power of the technology, game developers on Xbox would be able to concentrate on the finesse features that elevated games to being something more than they were otherwise.

“So the guy who reported to me said, 'oh that's so great! I wish that I had known that.' But unfortunately it was too late.”

Ouch.

[bachikarn]

I think console gaming is pretty much dead in Japan regardless.

[tiesto]

No, that way I can save money and not worry about the next Xbox.

[Sho Nuff]

They'll ship it in Japan but fucks given will be likely zero. If the Japanese like making money they'll have to continue to support it in the USA though.

[Brehvolution]

(Image removed from quote.)

[Cerveza mas fina]

Xbox > gcn> ps2

[MCD]

http://www.japantoday.com/category/technology/view/cute-anime-girls-driving-sales-of-windows-8-in-japan

Moe will save Next Xbox.

[tiesto]

http://www.japantoday.com/category/technology/view/cute-anime-girls-driving-sales-of-windows-8-in-japan

Moe will save Next Xbox.

That's awesome. Looks like it's time for me to upgrade to Win8

[ToxicAdam]

I think MS made a good first effort but didn't really follow up on it. Probably a good thing since Japanese don't have much of an appetite for a console anymore.

[Himu]

Thinking gc > ps2 is terrible, lager. Terrible.

Released Xbox Next in Japan, but don't name it Xbox and don't have Microsoft manufacture the hardware. Have a Japanese company do the manufacturing and slap their name on it.

[MCD]

Surface Box

By Toshiba

[cool breeze]

I think Microsoft cares more about Japanese publisher/developer support than the market.  Final Fantasy and Metal Gear are 360 game only in the west (or maybe there's some legal malarkey preventing it?).  Or is it more that Japanese publishers/developers realized the western audience is more valuable than its own Japanese audience?

Original Xbox and early 360 had great exclusive Japanese games.  Anyone know if games like Phantom Dust, Chromehounds or Otogi sold well?

[tiesto]

I think Microsoft cares more about Japanese publisher/developer support than the market.  Final Fantasy and Metal Gear are 360 game only in the west (or maybe there's some legal malarkey preventing it?).  Or is it more that Japanese publishers/developers realized the western audience is more valuable than its own Japanese audience?

Original Xbox and early 360 had great exclusive Japanese games.  Anyone know if games like Phantom Dust, Chromehounds or Otogi sold well?

I thought that with the worth of the yen being at a huge high, Japanese companies (in all fields) have been turning more inward for their sales, instead of outward, which is what they traditionally have done?

[chronovore]

I think Microsoft cares more about Japanese publisher/developer support than the market.  Final Fantasy and Metal Gear are 360 game only in the west (or maybe there's some legal malarkey preventing it?).  Or is it more that Japanese publishers/developers realized the western audience is more valuable than its own Japanese audience?

Original Xbox and early 360 had great exclusive Japanese games.  Anyone know if games like Phantom Dust, Chromehounds or Otogi sold well?

Put it this way: Did you see any sequels? Apparently Otogi had a sequel, which was news to me. It seems like the other two had them planned, but canceled. None of these sold well.

Another problem facing development in Japan is the extraordinary strength of the yen right now. It was running ¥110~120 to the US dollar for decades, but now it's ¥80 or so; that's a massive currency shift where foreign investment is concerned. Though most salaries are the same as they've been for years here, the exchange rate requires 40%-50% more be invested for the same result.

[Olivia Wilde Homo]

Blue Dragon was fucking awesome and its a shame what happened to the series.

I'm sure Durango will come out there but will sell shittier than the Xbox and 360 because I doubt Microsoft is going to put in the nominal efforts they did for those two consoles.

[originalz]

Microsoft had no idea what they were doing in Japan, I've talked to a few people who worked there and it was baffling how they just didn't get it.  Their solution was just to throw money around like crazy and court developers with expensive dinners and promises.  I love that they did it since we got some great games out of it, but I think they got frustrated once they realized that it just wasn't working.

The whole 1-year exclusivity contracts were also deadly, I remember reading 2ch when Vesperia came out and everyone was like "whatever, it'll be on PS3 eventually, just wait!"  Time kept passing and people were slowly starting to give in and think about buying the 360, especially with Star Ocean's announcement.  Then, Vesperia was announced for PS3, with SO following up.  No one gave a shit about the 360's big "exclusives" after that.

[chronovore]

Yeah, it's not money on its own that'll change anything in Japan. Shit, not even plain old common sense will change things in Japan.

The insularity here is intrinsic and overwhelming.

[maxy]

Maybe MS should release a handheld in Japan...that would be fun to watch

There are some (silly)rumors that Xbox Surface production has started.

[Cormacaroni]

バツ箱

i'd honestly be happier if it never released in Japan, 'cause then i would just do what i really wanted to do this gen anyway - import and buy/play only the US versions of games rather than the localized or Asian versions. I probably could never play another Japanese game in my life and be perfectly happy about it

[DCharlieJP]

Apparently Otogi had a sequel

Otogi 2 had Otogi 1 packaged with it! lol.

Chromehounds apparently did good enough to outsell AC4 globally so....

[maxy]

MS needs something Japanese for Japan launch,right?

Chromehounds 2

believe

[MCD]

They need something big

Dragon Quest timed exclusivity or Monster Hunter.

[maxy]

People would just wait until exclusivity expires,not worth the money.Better invest that money into Lost Odyssey sequel

[Cerveza mas fina]

I dont understand why japanese people wont buy the xbox but will buy ps3 and wii. I mean are they really that xenophobic??

[AdmiralViscen]

I bought Chromehounds for full price when I got a 360, played it exactly once.

[Himu]

I dont understand why japanese people wont buy the xbox but will buy ps3 and wii. I mean are they really that xenophobic??

xenophobia has little to do with it. ms adverting for 360 was terrible.

[Cerveza mas fina]

Himu, the reason i rank the ps2 low is cause I only had it for a short while in my first year of college.

[Shaka Khan]

(Image removed from quote.)

[tiesto]

I dont understand why japanese people wont buy the xbox but will buy ps3 and wii. I mean are they really that xenophobic??

Shitty advertising and very little that appeals to the average Japanese gamer?

[Diunx]

Maybe next gen we'll get some Monster Hunter rip offs published by MS, I hear japas love MH.

[Phoenix Dark]

I'm sure MS will at least show up in Japan, but I doubt they'll put nearly the same effort into the market. The 360 is dominating sales because of the US and the next Xbox will certainly reflect that. I'm sure many big Japanese titles (Resident Evil, Final Fantasy, etc) will continue to sell well on the Nexbox in the US while Japanese gamers buy them for the PS4 in Japan...so they'll make money

[chronovore]

I dont understand why japanese people wont buy the xbox but will buy ps3 and wii. I mean are they really that xenophobic??

Nintendo in Japan is hard to beat, but they've had a rough patch during the NGC run, and my impression based on purely anecdotal evidence (watching what my friends and family here are doing) is that the Wii dried up in interest a couple years ago, and no-one is really hyped about Wii U. Actually, what interest there is in Wii U seems to be trying to figure out what it is -- "Is it just a new controller for Wii? Isn't that what we already have?" ( )

Sony doesn't enjoy the perceived monopoly on games which Nintendo still seems to have, but Sony is still a major, respected hardware manufacturer, and Microsoft is known for making OSs and productivity software. It also doesn't help that Xbox seems to focus on FPS games, with the occasional racing game (though PS owners know to wait for Gran Turismo for the "superior product" (again, ). It also didn't help that the original Xbox was the size and shape of an American muscle car, and the controllers were half the size of the other companies' CONSOLES.

But, yeah, you can add some xenophobia in there as well. You can also take that many Japanese devs really focus first on what will sell in Japan, what they can distribute on their own here, and consider the worldwide sales secondary to that. So if they think the 360 won't sell in Japan, there is no market for their local distribution, and they are uninterested.

[maxy]

Going head to head with Nintendo,Sony obviously failed,repeating the same thing would be insanity. If you can't beat them head to head,maybe you should sneak behind.

Microsoft's Xbox set-top box work is said to be part of a broader effort to ensure its core architecture for the next-generation Xbox is scalable enough to be put together to run on a number of devices. We understand that the company could opt to combine its core system for the next Xbox with a phone stack to deliver a phone capable of running a full version of Microsoft's Xbox Live services. It has also investigated providing this functionality to TV OEMs, who could include the core services as part of a licensed Xbox television set.

[treythemovie]

Eventually an exasperated Mikami boiled it down: 'what is your philosophy? Sony says games are entertainment, something larger, fuelled by the Emotion Engine. Nintendo says games are toys, created by the legendary Shigeru Miyamoto, perhaps the greatest game developer of all time. What do you feel?' Microsoft had no answer.

“I almost jumped out the window because we had said repeatedly over and over and over that we aspire to enable games that could be considered to be art, much like film,” Bachus says, “that because of the maturity of the development tools and the APIs and the power of the technology, game developers on Xbox would be able to concentrate on the finesse features that elevated games to being something more than they were otherwise.

“So the guy who reported to me said, 'oh that's so great! I wish that I had known that.' But unfortunately it was too late.”

Bullshit. Microsoft never had such a poetic vision for the xbox, not now and not then. Their motivation was simply to create a trojan horse for the living room to get to their grand set box top plan which, to their credit, they're on the verge of finally capitalizing on.

[Positive Touch]

 

[treythemovie]

That came out way more weeaboo-y than I intended 

[chronovore]

That came out way more weeaboo-y than I intended 

It doesn't make it any less correct. They've been clear about wanting to be the set-top box for a long time. Their biggest problem has been how quickly the market diversified, and how many players are now in that market. Anymore, you can get a Roku or AppleTV or whatever for $99 or less, and it will stream any number of services for you.

[Cormacaroni]

MS is far from perfect but surely it is a lot more credible GLOBALLY as a gaming platform post-2005? I totally understand why the original Xbox was doomed here, and why that domino effect hurt the 360. But if you buy a 720 ANYWHERE, you have to know you are likely going to get a pretty decent crop of games, right?  (With the huge caveat that MS seems to have jettisoned almost all its 1st party efforts. )

That said Japanese gamers want Japanese games. Just to play devil's advocate for a bit - If the only company that made them was MS, and Sony only published EA titles....I think they'd overcome their h/w xenophobia. The software expectations are far more key than the hardware, which is usually mostly a wash anyway. (from the perspective of someone who owns a decent gaming PC, the 360 and the PS3 are practically identical at this point...)

[Tasty]

They need something big

Dragon Quest timed exclusivity or Monster Hunter.

Neither of those are moving away from Nintendo for a while.

Microsoft needs a new IP that will go on to set the country on fire. Unfortunately it's impossible to know ahead of time what that will be.

[MrSingh]

Not worth owning a Japanese 360. 360 owners here miss out on too much stuff. In fact, the only bright spot is the ability to get lower priced asian version releases from the ex-Japan markets. Definitely going for the US region console the next time round.

[archnemesis]

I know. Mystwalker started off well for me but I guess the death of console jrpgs was just imminent.

There have been plenty of good console RPGs the last five years. Lost Odyssey was in no way an end point.

[Himu]

that ain't happenin, wrath.  the gooch has permanently checked out on game design so he can surf all day erryday.  and i blame him not one fucking bit.

the way that man's career ended makes me want to cry.

[archnemesis]

You should try Resonance of Fate, Atelier Rorona/Totori/Meruru, Demon's/Dark Souls, Dragon's Dogma, Folklore, Nier, and Valkyria Chronicles then.

I liked the combat in The Last Remnant and Final Fantasy XIII, but otherwise they weren't that great.

[archnemesis]

I understand if you're turned off by the style of the Atelier games, but they're filled with very fun game mechanics. The combat is a bit simple, but on the other hand you have much more freedom than in your typical command-based JRPG.

[Cormacaroni]

the shittiest part of it is having to use shitty Japan Xbox Live, a fantasy land where everyone loves to pay full price for years-old game downloads at the exchange rate of 1990

[Sho Nuff]

Not worth owning a Japanese 360. 360 owners here miss out on too much stuff. In fact, the only bright spot is the ability to get lower priced asian version releases from the ex-Japan markets. Definitely going for the US region console the next time round.

Actually buying the cheap Asian versions was the highlight of having a J-360! I saved so much cash without having to pay insane markup from Game Hollywood in Akiba for the imported American versions!