Author Topic: Have indie games successfully succeeded/replaced B-games  (Read 1533 times)

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Shaka Khan

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Have indie games successfully succeeded/replaced B-games
« on: June 09, 2013, 05:03:06 AM »
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With a generation as long and arduous as this one, thanks to an ailing economy coinciding with an unprecedented rise in development costs, an entire tier of games have considerably shrunk or even disappeared, as some would argue. In an effort to stabilize their finances, big publishers reallocated/consolidated resources to support their risk-free AAA portfolios, while mid-sized publishers fizzled out one after one.

I think many would agree that it's an unfortunate change. Some of my favorite games from the previous generations were the experimental and unique "hidden gems." They were clearly low(er) budget, and sometimes janky as hell, but still manage to be charming enough for me to stick around. Admittedly, most of them were wacky Japanese games, and that's an industry that could be thriving for all we know, but with localizations for those type of games being at an all time low, we'll never experience them or be aware of their existence, but I digress.

Amid all these shifting models, many platforms that catered to smaller and indie developers rose to prominence, as everyone knows already. We've got Steam, XBLA, PSN, eShope, and hell let's not ignore the App Store. What's remarkable about these platforms (especially non-Steam platforms) is that they've come a long, long way from the days of Geometry Wars and ports such as SSF2THF. Most efforts at the beginning strictly focused on delivering arcade-y games (an excellent goal, mind you) but ever since, and as development tools started advancing and getting cheaper, developers started branching out and experimenting more.

Now the cause of these changes could simply be proper fostering by platform holders (through sponsoring programs or removal of restrictions), simply platform maturity, or even talents from shuttered big pubs/devs starting their own business. But what matters is that the end result is getting closer --if not having reached already-- to filling the void left by the disappearance of that B-game tier.

I think there are a few hurdles that need to be overcome, however, such as the lingering stigma surrounding indie development and challenging certain expectations. But I feel that people have started coming around and are ready for give them even a more serious chance, if only to break away from the monotonous AAA-model. And what's even more exciting is that, as we're starting a new generation, we're hearing of even less restrictions, better support, and even outright recruitment of indies by platform manufacturers such as Sony and Nintendo (MS is unsurprisingly TBA on this).

So, does anyone agree with this sentiment? That the indie scene have matured enough to replace that tier, and that the future has never looked brighter for their prospects?

Discuss my late night ramblings.
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Shaka Khan

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Re: Have indie games successfully succeeded/replaced B-games
« Reply #1 on: June 09, 2013, 05:04:39 AM »


Etc, etc.
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archnemesis

  • Senior Member
Re: Have indie games successfully succeeded/replaced B-games
« Reply #2 on: June 09, 2013, 05:08:17 AM »
I almost responded to your GAF thread, but I didn't feel like writing an essay. The short version is: I think we'll see less B-tier Call of Duty clones, and more B-tier JRPGs. Some genres aren't feasible for tiny indie developers and require a larger team with specialized roles. Tower defense, match-three puzzle, artsy platformer, and rogue-like pixel art games are fun every once in a while, but I also want to play more complex games with higher production values.

Raban

  • Senior Member
Re: Have indie games successfully succeeded/replaced B-games
« Reply #3 on: June 09, 2013, 05:36:02 AM »
I don't think we're there yet. But assuming this whole industry doesn't collapse on itself in the near future, it won't be long before we are.

Damian79

  • Senior Member
Re: Have indie games successfully succeeded/replaced B-games
« Reply #4 on: June 09, 2013, 05:42:11 AM »
Er i would hate for indies to go this direction.  If they did we wont be getting games like Expeditions Conquistador.  Indies are better left to make their unique games that we all love.  That said i want my lolo clone.

brob

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Re: Have indie games successfully succeeded/replaced B-games
« Reply #5 on: June 09, 2013, 05:54:33 AM »
Hopefully with the advent of digital purchasing there could be digital only releases for these sorts of small profit games from bigger studios. I would like it if people weren't so afraid of reusing assets and making obviously perfunctory things. During the PS2 days I was really fond of trashy collect-a-thons, vexx and haven for instance, and I would love to see that sort of low production value/mechanically focused game come back in some way.

Shaka Khan

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Re: Have indie games successfully succeeded/replaced B-games
« Reply #6 on: June 09, 2013, 06:32:13 AM »
Games with high production values are here to stay, and the type of more complex indie games I'm referring to aren't a threat to that market. What really prompted me to make this thread is the stream of indie games that were announced for the PS4, that are already available for the PC or will be available soon. Those cheaper UE3/4 games aren't necessarily feasible for retail nor were they the type of games you normally see on consoles' DD services at the beginning of the generation. I'm all for variety, and these titles are sort of a cure for an itch I hadn't itched on consoles for a long time.

Hopefully with the advent of digital purchasing there could be digital only releases for these sorts of small profit games from bigger studios. I would like it if people weren't so afraid of reusing assets and making obviously perfunctory things. During the PS2 days I was really fond of trashy collect-a-thons, vexx and haven for instance, and I would love to see that sort of low production value/mechanically focused game come back in some way.

Exactly.

I almost responded to your GAF thread, but I didn't feel like writing an essay

Story of my (digital) life. :violin
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magus

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Re: Have indie games successfully succeeded/replaced B-games
« Reply #7 on: June 09, 2013, 09:07:46 AM »
as long as indie games keep abusing the indie label to protect their lack of talent/funds and we keep paying attention to them,no...



"dude your game doesn't even have graphics"

"it's ok! i'm an indie developer! it's stylish and whimsical! ohohoh!"

that looks worse than shareware games on amiga! at least those gave us jazz jackrabbit! imagine if an actual developer went and made a game like that,would you accept it? but says it's indie and it magicaly turns okay... it kinda reminds me of the princess argument that the nostalgic critic brought up once in his review

(WARNING:CONTAINS SONIC THE HEDGEHOG CARTOON)



YOU ARE NOT AN INDIE DEVELOPER,YOU ARE A SOFTWARE DEVELOPER! SOFTWARE IT UP! BITCHES!

and before someone start to say that "i'm just hating" once again... i don't mind playing indie games,i love reus because it had cool graphics and a unique concept and the same goes for gunpoint,it's the shit above which makes me wary of the indie label
« Last Edit: June 09, 2013, 09:11:34 AM by magus »
<----

Don Flamenco

  • FootDiFootDiFootDive
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Re: Have indie games successfully succeeded/replaced B-games
« Reply #8 on: June 09, 2013, 09:52:00 AM »
but my atari 2600 game has a narrator

and I'm a good writer, my mom and friends told me

Positive Touch

  • Woo Papa
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Re: Have indie games successfully succeeded/replaced B-games
« Reply #9 on: June 09, 2013, 11:37:54 AM »
the last year or so we've seen more quality indie releases that focus on real gameplay instead of the precocious crap that got a lot of hype from american press in the pass. look at state of decay - they made a solid title with actual content instead of derivative garbage masked by a faux-creative artstyle, and because it was a budget title it was released at a price that allowed it to catch on instead of dying on store shelves as an overpriced release. its got issues but people are willing to put up with them because it's cheap and fun. that can catch on and make real money which turns into more opportunities for small companies to flourish which turns into more fun for us gamers.
pcp

Great Rumbler

  • Dab on the sinners
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Re: Have indie games successfully succeeded/replaced B-games
« Reply #10 on: June 09, 2013, 12:39:37 PM »
as long as indie games keep abusing the indie label to protect their lack of talent/funds and we keep paying attention to them,no...



"dude your game doesn't even have graphics"

"it's ok! i'm an indie developer! it's stylish and whimsical! ohohoh!"

that looks worse than shareware games on amiga! at least those gave us jazz jackrabbit! imagine if an actual developer went and made a game like that,would you accept it? but says it's indie and it magicaly turns okay... it kinda reminds me of the princess argument that the nostalgic critic brought up once in his review

(WARNING:CONTAINS SONIC THE HEDGEHOG CARTOON)



YOU ARE NOT AN INDIE DEVELOPER,YOU ARE A SOFTWARE DEVELOPER! SOFTWARE IT UP! BITCHES!

and before someone start to say that "i'm just hating" once again... i don't mind playing indie games,i love reus because it had cool graphics and a unique concept and the same goes for gunpoint,it's the shit above which makes me wary of the indie label

 :pacspit
dog

recursivelyenumerable

  • you might think that; I couldn't possibly comment
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Re: Have indie games successfully succeeded/replaced B-games
« Reply #11 on: June 09, 2013, 09:17:14 PM »
I do like "Software it up"
QED

recursivelyenumerable

  • you might think that; I couldn't possibly comment
  • Senior Member
Re: Have indie games successfully succeeded/replaced B-games
« Reply #12 on: June 09, 2013, 09:18:10 PM »
In fact maybe I'll call my future consultancy Software It Up LLC
QED

Great Rumbler

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Re: Have indie games successfully succeeded/replaced B-games
« Reply #13 on: June 09, 2013, 09:50:43 PM »
Indie games and Euro-Jank probably now constitute 75%-80% of what I play now. Add in a few random Japanese games and 4-5 AAA Hollywood titles per year to round out the list.
dog