Author Topic: Nelson Mandela has passed away  (Read 5078 times)

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Eschaton

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« Last Edit: December 05, 2013, 05:25:26 PM by Esch »

Phoenix Dark

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TakingBackSunday

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Re: Nelson Mandela passed away
« Reply #2 on: December 05, 2013, 05:10:14 PM »
 :'(
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Broseidon

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Re: Nelson Mandela passed away
« Reply #3 on: December 05, 2013, 05:14:48 PM »


A great man and one of the greatest Africans.
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Joe Molotov

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Re: Nelson Mandela passed away
« Reply #4 on: December 05, 2013, 05:20:03 PM »
Racism is finally over.
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brob

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Stoney Mason

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #6 on: December 05, 2013, 07:06:06 PM »
Kinda crazy that Mandela was seemingly one of the few of that era to survive and live a long life. The MLK's, the Kennedy's, the Malcolm's X, etc.

RIP.


Broseidon

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #7 on: December 05, 2013, 07:28:39 PM »
bent

benjipwns

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #8 on: December 05, 2013, 07:29:15 PM »
You guys need to understand the descent into madness. Most people just don't know, and as long as they're safe and warm in their little corner of the world, they don't care either. But here we have a European-style country that's been largely reclaimed by Africa.

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #9 on: December 05, 2013, 08:45:34 PM »


RIP
^_^

Purple Filth

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #10 on: December 05, 2013, 10:44:25 PM »
it finally happened  :'(

RIP

nudemacusers

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #11 on: December 05, 2013, 10:48:16 PM »
fake tweet bro
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nudemacusers

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #12 on: December 05, 2013, 10:57:37 PM »
just letting you know before you post on facebook* and get an embarrassing callout <3


*g+ if you're andrex
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benjipwns

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #13 on: December 05, 2013, 10:59:20 PM »
just letting you know before you post on facebook* and get an embarrassing callout <3


*g+ if you're andrex
Who would be there to call you out if you're Andrex?

Eel O'Brian

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #14 on: December 05, 2013, 11:00:35 PM »
He would call himself out?
sup

Eel O'Brian

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #15 on: December 05, 2013, 11:01:59 PM »
Simulchump, high-five
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Diunx

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #16 on: December 05, 2013, 11:38:22 PM »
Didn't he died earlier in the year?
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Phoenix Dark

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #17 on: December 06, 2013, 12:10:14 AM »

 :dead
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fizzel

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #18 on: December 06, 2013, 02:53:33 AM »

nudemacusers

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #19 on: December 06, 2013, 02:57:33 AM »
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Joe Molotov

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TakingBackSunday

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #21 on: December 06, 2013, 11:33:34 AM »
these fucking assholes
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Dickie Dee

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #22 on: December 06, 2013, 11:50:06 AM »
This stuck out at me from Charles Pierce

Quote
Nelson Mandela died yesterday, and he was the last of them, the last of the patriots in a line all the way back to George Washington who fought to rid their native countries of the deadweight of colonialism, who fought for self-determination against the rule of distant, unyielding governments that slid into tyranny without even knowing they were doing it, who fought and won and, in Mandela's case, like Washington, but unlike Michael Collins and so many others, outlived the stifling detritus of dying empires. Nelson Mandela was a reminder of all the others, famous and obscure, who fought the same battle in so many places against so many oppressors, known and unknown. He was the last in their line, the last of them -- people like, to name only one, Ho Chi Minh -- who drew strength and purpose from the deep, lasting echoes of what a group of wealthy merchants and planters -- and, yes, slaveholders -- set loose upon the world in Philadelphia in 1776. What they did was to set freedom itself free, although most of them probably didn't know they were doing it at the time, and many of them would have blanched at the prospect. But the one thing they did, Mr. Jefferson and all of them, was throw out to the world in their magnificent rhetoric a magnificent bluff. Nelson Mandela was the last man who called it in the last place it was called.

All men are created equal.

Endowed with certain inalienable rights.

Self-evident.

Call.

And raise.

That's why it is not a day for carping twerps. It is not a day for remembering the cramped, wretched treatment of Mandela from the likes of Richard Cheney and Ronald Reagan. It is a day, in America, for remembering that, for all our imperfections and for all our loss of faith in our true birthright, that we are in our national soul a revolutionary people, that it was here that was first established in practice the principle later enunciated by another Irish patriot, Charles Stewart Parnell:

"...no man has the right to fix the boundary of a nation. No man has the right to say to his country, "Thus far shalt thou go and no further..."
It is a day for honoring a revolutionary by remembering that we are all children of one of the first revolutions against, as Jefferson once put it, all forms of tyranny over the mind of man.

Mandela's great task was different. He had to wrestle with the primordial hatred of race sharpened to an almost incomprehensibly sharp edge. He had to fight against systematized, mechanized, and weaponized hatred. Instead, in exile and in prison, he decided to create one country out of another. His people were colonized within their own nation. He fought against a kind of internal colonial rule that often was as harsh and bloody than any ever imposed by an outside power. And then when, through the strength of his moral witness, he won his battle, he had to make a new nation out of the suspicious remnants of the old. This was a true revolution of the mind and he was its leader, and he won that revolution on Robben Island long before he won it for all of South Africa. That is what we should remember any more.

There are few colonial nations any more. Instead, we are colonized by financial institutions beyond our political control. We are colonized with pens and papers and millions of little digital bursts transferring billions of dollars all over the globe in the blink of an eye. For the most part, we are not kept colonized with rubber bullets and water cannon -- although there is plenty of that going around these days, as militarized law enforcement all around the world is summoned to do the bidding of major corporations -- but rather through sophisticated financial instruments that keep the money and the power moving upward. There is resistance, as there should be -- the Occupy movement, and what went on in Greece this year -- and that resistance has had its martyrs, like Ken Saro-Wiwa in Nigeria. But it is colonization of a vague and amorphous -- if incredibly powerful -- variety. There are no radio stations to capture, no capitals to fall, no Dublin Castle over which the successful rebels could take command. But it is a revolution of the mind, no less than Mandela's was, and that is also what we should remember today when we remember that we are, in our souls, a revolutionary people. We have a revolutionary history to honor and uphold. Which was what Nelson Mandela did. He reminded us of that which we need to be reminded, over and over again, about our own best selves. He reminded us because he was the last one of them, the last in the line that began with George Washington, the last one to witness what Lincoln called for 150 years ago. He was there for a new birth of freedom.
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Great Rumbler

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #23 on: December 06, 2013, 12:08:09 PM »
-Popular
-Dead

Meet your new conservative hero. :american
dog

Broseidon

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #24 on: December 06, 2013, 12:38:25 PM »
bent

Steve Contra

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #25 on: December 06, 2013, 12:51:07 PM »
-Popular
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Meet your new conservative hero. :american
Double points for being

-Black
vin

nudemacusers

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #26 on: December 06, 2013, 01:20:11 PM »
not only that, but he's a friendly LSB. Won't startle people in dark rooms or hallways.
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Himu

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #27 on: December 06, 2013, 01:24:35 PM »
-Popular
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Meet your new conservative hero. :american

:rofl
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Steve Contra

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #28 on: December 06, 2013, 01:25:29 PM »
https://twitter.com/MattBinder/status/408795404458029057/photo/1/large

I forgot how much the right secretly hates Mandela
vin

Joe Molotov

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #29 on: December 06, 2013, 01:31:49 PM »
https://twitter.com/MattBinder/status/408795404458029057/photo/1/large

I forgot how much the right secretly hates Mandela

Who could forget all those great Hollywood movies about Nelson Mandela?  :rejoice
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Himu

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #30 on: December 06, 2013, 01:34:45 PM »
https://twitter.com/MattBinder/status/408795404458029057/photo/1/large

I forgot how much the right secretly hates Mandela

Let's be real. Many of those arguments, especially the ones that shed light of his violent actions are legitimate criticisms towards Mandela - and trying to rationalize it by telling yourself well hey he's a freedom fighter! - is pretty dumb.  :lenowned
« Last Edit: December 06, 2013, 01:52:14 PM by Formerly Known As Himuro »
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Joe Molotov

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #31 on: December 06, 2013, 01:40:16 PM »
https://twitter.com/MattBinder/status/408795404458029057/photo/1/large

I forgot how much the right secretly hates Mandela

Let's be real. Many of those arguments, especially the ones that shed light of his violent actions are legitimate criticisms towards Mandela - and trying to rationalize it by telling yourself well hey he's a freedom fighter! - is pretty dumb.

But let's also be real, if he was white and anti-communist, none of those people would care.
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Phoenix Dark

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #32 on: December 06, 2013, 01:48:51 PM »
https://twitter.com/MattBinder/status/408795404458029057/photo/1/large

I forgot how much the right secretly hates Mandela

Let's be real. Many of those arguments, especially the ones that shed light of his violent actions are legitimate criticisms towards Mandela - and trying to rationalize it by telling yourself well hey he's a freedom fighter! - is pretty dumb.

Wait, what?
010

Himu

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #33 on: December 06, 2013, 01:51:26 PM »
:badass

I was just trolling.

Mandela is, like Malcolm X, a case of a revolutionary figure who, over time, changed his ideals and manners of fighting. The fact that people only remember the surge of violence Mandela committed and not the changed man he was after almost 30 years of incarceration is another cute conservative story that paints people who try to change things - especially if they are not white - into evil people and not complicated individuals living in a completely different means. Their lack of empathy single-handedly calls them out for their vapid finger pointing.

Wasn't a good troll, I should have added a coli smilie.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2013, 01:53:01 PM by Formerly Known As Himuro »
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Mandark

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #34 on: December 06, 2013, 01:59:17 PM »
It's not even that Mandela changed his ways after decades in prison.  IIRC he only endorsed/encouraged/tolerated guerrilla tactics after years of adopting a nonviolent approach and having it squashed by the force of the South African state.

Though to be honest I'm really not too familiar with the details.  Some Mandela biography or other is getting put on my Guilt-Ridden Reading List (only took me a decade or so to do Rise and Fall of the Third Reich!).

Phoenix Dark

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #35 on: December 06, 2013, 02:00:59 PM »
And can anyone blame him for attempting to topple a tyrannical regime with guerrilla tactics?

remember boys and girls, the only just revolution was the American one.
010

Himu

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #36 on: December 06, 2013, 02:03:00 PM »
The thing that gets me is the utter lack of respect. Here we have, a dude whose resolve ended apartheid in South Africa. Let's bring up totally irrelevant shit because I don't know. The guy just died, was an impactful and influential man the world over, so let's kick shit on his barely cold 95 year old body. I don't even care what they thought of him. The lack of respect is what gets me. Reddit was unreadable yesterday because a bunch of teenagers who googled Nelson Mandela's Wikipedia page contains things that happened during the height of 60's social action. How dare he.
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Himu

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #37 on: December 06, 2013, 02:04:36 PM »
remember boys and girls, the only just revolution was the American one.

NEWSFEED :sabu
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Great Rumbler

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #38 on: December 06, 2013, 02:04:55 PM »
And can anyone blame him for attempting to topple a tyrannical regime with guerrilla tactics?

remember boys and girls, the only just revolution was the American one.

And you can bet at least a few of the people in that Facebook screencap have a Confederate Flag bumper sticker on their truck.
dog

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #39 on: December 06, 2013, 02:11:20 PM »
You see that, Himu? Now that is a troll.
dog

Mandark

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #40 on: December 06, 2013, 02:12:01 PM »
There's also a pretty big dollop of cutesy contrarianism here.  Folks, especially people who argue about shit on the internet, love the idea that they're part of a select few that's educated themselves on the real truth.  You get a surprising amount of people saying the Civil War wasn't really about slavery, even when they have no cultural affinity for the Confederacy, just cause they'd hate to believe the simplistic morality tale they were taught in high school actually wasn't complete BS.

Positive Touch

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #41 on: December 06, 2013, 02:14:48 PM »
sorry guys; only white dudes are allowed to use violence to achieve our goals
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Himu

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #42 on: December 06, 2013, 02:15:52 PM »
Am I being contrarian when I say,"fuck the alamo?" because I hate the alamo and what it stands for.
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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #43 on: December 06, 2013, 02:20:58 PM »
Am I being contrarian when I say,"fuck the alamo?" because I hate the alamo and what it stands for.

Really? I figured you'd be all over the site where a bunch of arrogant Texans got massacred by some dark-skinned folk.
dog

Himu

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #44 on: December 06, 2013, 02:23:10 PM »
I hate the Alamo because it's now a symbol of Texas freedom, and the reason the Texans revolted against Mexico was because they wanted slaves. Mexico said,"no slaves" which was like, their only rule, but we couldn't have that. So we raise a flag, and say,"REMEMBER THE ALAMO AND OUR FIGHT FOR OWNING HUMAN BEINGS" and Texans just go along with it without thinking of its implications.
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fizzel

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #45 on: December 06, 2013, 02:44:29 PM »
Mandela lived to see his legacy shat all over.

Phoenix Dark

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #46 on: December 06, 2013, 03:08:34 PM »
There's also a pretty big dollop of cutesy contrarianism here.  Folks, especially people who argue about shit on the internet, love the idea that they're part of a select few that's educated themselves on the real truth.  You get a surprising amount of people saying the Civil War wasn't really about slavery, even when they have no cultural affinity for the Confederacy, just cause they'd hate to believe the simplistic morality tale they were taught in high school actually wasn't complete BS.

I've talked to people who argued - completely seriously - that the only factor that spurred the Civil War was the north raising the south's taxes, "which would have destroyed their economy."

me: but their economy was dominated by slavery...thus abolishing slavery would destroy their economy
him: actually, higher tax rates posed a long term threat because slavery was always temporary, whereas it's hard to lower taxes

The twist? This guy is black.
010

Himu

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #47 on: December 06, 2013, 03:11:07 PM »
:lol
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Brehvolution

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #48 on: December 06, 2013, 03:20:31 PM »
Wait, so Mandella is a turrist because he kicked the white ruling class out of Africa? Is that what they think?
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Mandark

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #49 on: December 06, 2013, 04:10:28 PM »
You guys need to understand the descent into madness. Most people just don't know, and as long as they're safe and warm in their little corner of the world, they don't care either. But here we have a European-style country that's been largely reclaimed by Africa.

How did this post get ignored?

Cause we know benji and recognize when he's quite obviously 'aving a larf.

Brehvolution

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #50 on: December 06, 2013, 04:27:50 PM »
Apparently, the fox news website has shut off the ability to comment on any Mandela story because of true colors overflow.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2013, 04:58:01 PM by Zero Hero »
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Steve Contra

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #51 on: December 06, 2013, 04:31:43 PM »
Apparently, the fox news website has shut off the ability to comment on any Mandella story because of true colors overflow.
Hahahahaha
vin

Mandark

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #52 on: December 06, 2013, 04:59:38 PM »
Yikes, it's true.  I was going to say something about the general shittiness of internet comments, and how it's not all Fox News' fault.

But I checked CNN.com and not only are they still allowing comments, but at least the top voted ones are shockingly reasonable (with some of the expected awfulness further down).  Meanwhile, the comments on this story on Fox News Insider, where they haven't bothered to mute them...
« Last Edit: December 06, 2013, 05:02:42 PM by Mandark »

benjipwns

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #53 on: December 06, 2013, 05:14:04 PM »
You guys need to understand the descent into madness. Most people just don't know, and as long as they're safe and warm in their little corner of the world, they don't care either. But here we have a European-style country that's been largely reclaimed by Africa.

How did this post get ignored?

Cause we know benji and recognize when he's quite obviously 'aving a larf.
:-[

Human Snorenado

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #54 on: December 06, 2013, 05:53:09 PM »
A mutual acquaintance made a good point- right wingers NEED ALL DEM GUNZ in case the GUBMINT needs to be overthrown, right?

 :hitler
yar

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #55 on: December 06, 2013, 05:56:08 PM »
A mutual acquaintance made a good point- right wingers NEED ALL DEM GUNZ in case the GUBMINT needs to be overthrown, right?

 :hitler

:neogaf
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benjipwns

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #56 on: December 06, 2013, 06:07:53 PM »
The thing that gets me is the utter lack of respect. Here we have, a dude whose resolve ended apartheid in South Africa. Let's bring up totally irrelevant shit because I don't know. The guy just died, was an impactful and influential man the world over, so let's kick shit on his barely cold 95 year old body. I don't even care what they thought of him. The lack of respect is what gets me. Reddit was unreadable yesterday because a bunch of teenagers who googled Nelson Mandela's Wikipedia page contains things that happened during the height of 60's social action. How dare he.
There's also a pretty big dollop of cutesy contrarianism here.  Folks, especially people who argue about shit on the internet, love the idea that they're part of a select few that's educated themselves on the real truth.  You get a surprising amount of people saying the Civil War wasn't really about slavery, even when they have no cultural affinity for the Confederacy, just cause they'd hate to believe the simplistic morality tale they were taught in high school actually wasn't complete BS.
I think there's a lot of value in this kind of thing to an extent, of course then I'm a fan of revisionist history for revisionist histories sake, but in many cases it's seeking out confirmation bias. Mandela's "relevance" is within living memory far more than a JFK or MLK where people who were kids then, or Lincoln or whoever farther back, get to pretend they always were going to be on that winning, moral, side so there's probably far more lasting and recent politico-cultural hangover from the fights in the 1980s.  And Mandela's Presidency was even sooner and like all administrations there's stuff to criticize there which offers more "cover."

The problem with picking and choosing revisionist history is that you're not going to find an answer you don't want and you're not going to accept circumstances of the era to adjust the evaluation because you live after them and can judge backwards especially in criticizing the allies made and other circumstantial decisions like that. Ghandi is often a good example of this, he was by plenty of accounts kinda a big asshole playing up a persona, his motives and "spirituality" weren't pure benevolence and piety, and he even he admitted that he would have taken up arms in revolution had it not been for the tolerance of the ruling British, but this doesn't diminish decolonizing India or the value of nonviolent resistance as a principle or strategy.

I personally think for Mandela the more important thing to stress, is not the ending of apartheid because his role as a symbol for the effort in the simple narrative has created some god-figure like notions about him that then encourages the counter narrative of him being an adulterous darkie Marxist terrorist (which does a lot to ignore that Soviet and therefore Marxist support was nearly essential to almost all national resistance movements of the era simply out of circumstance) and removes a lot of the nuance as to why the ruling powers gave it up finally, but how he didn't seize power and most importantly that he willingly gave it up. Mandela easily could have become like most every other ruler in the region, though not necessarily through violence initially but like George Washington through sheer popularity, and effectively been ruling until this week. But like Washington he turned that massive potential power down. And that's something that illustrates him personally outside the "grand events" of ending apartheid.

Maybe Boerseun and his friends will be right that South Africa is descending into disaster, but you can't really place that, if it comes to pass, at Mandela's feet. I mean sure you can say if not for him these other jerks like Zuma wouldn't have gained power! But who's to say they aren't currently seizing power through violent means after more years of apartheid and establishing an even worse regime that will descend faster in that alternative universe?

remember boys and girls, the only just revolution was the American one.
Besides, the Loyalists had it coming strutting around town wearing their crown-protected property.

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #58 on: December 06, 2013, 07:33:58 PM »
Bwahahahaa, I'm friends with several WHITE South African people, and they both love the shit out of Mandela.  One of their dads used to do accounting work for Mandela.  Racists gonna be racist, basically.
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Joe Molotov

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Re: Nelson Mandela has passed away
« Reply #59 on: December 06, 2013, 07:45:01 PM »
 :paul
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