Author Topic: Begun the online store margins wars have  (Read 2010 times)

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Nintex

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Begun the online store margins wars have
« on: December 04, 2018, 01:47:15 PM »
Epic just announced another online storefront. Taking a smaller cut from developers.

dutch

kingv

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #1 on: December 04, 2018, 03:25:20 PM »
Epic is one company that might be able to pull off seriously competing with Steam. A lot of publishers already have a relationship with them, and a lot of people already have their launcher installed.

Sho Nuff

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #2 on: December 04, 2018, 04:20:31 PM »
This is way rad, I like this a lot

thisismyusername

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #3 on: December 04, 2018, 04:52:25 PM »
Oh boy, another client I don't want to install trying to take Steam's throne.

I'm already entrenched with Steam, unless their client is 200x better than Steams, I'll ignore it just like Uplay and Origin.

Cindi Mayweather

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #4 on: December 04, 2018, 04:56:50 PM »
Yes I really want another client to compete with something I have hundreds of games on. God I wish you could sell digital games.

nachobro

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #5 on: December 04, 2018, 05:06:44 PM »
If anyone is gonna push another client, not too surprising that its the company with the biggest game in the world right now. Easy enough to cut devs a deal when you are making zillions on fortnite vbucks. I already have it installed and I don't use any of Steams features anyway so why not...just give the good deals and I'll be there.

Nintex

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #6 on: December 04, 2018, 05:15:30 PM »
Valve has been sitting on their ass for a while chasing poorly designed hardware.
Epic has a real shot here but it's going to take some convincing for gamers to move on.

However, all devs I showed this to told me: "Yeah we know, we're launching our stuff on it"
dutch

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #7 on: December 04, 2018, 08:04:54 PM »
You can buy porn games on Steam. Steam wins.
dog

213372bu

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #8 on: December 04, 2018, 09:22:36 PM »
Steam's competition will never be as good imo. They all lack the tons of QoL features, developer tools, continuous R&D etc. that have come with being the primary platform for over a decade. That, and the sheer number of games on somebody's account as a result of one primary platform serving everyone for that long of a time.

Any attempt at alternative platforms has always ended up as miserable failures, I don't see this one being any different even with the lower store cut + tons of cash flow. :whatsthedeal

thisismyusername

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #9 on: December 04, 2018, 09:24:25 PM »
However, all devs I showed this to told me: "Yeah we know, we're launching our stuff on it"

And if they go exclusive to it, I'll ignore them like I have done Battle.net and anything non-DICE from EA.

It's really simple: If you're going to make a client, make sure you don't exclusive your shit and let people buy your shit from wherever the hell they want.

The game industry is going the way of the movie houses, and it's going to cause folks to pirate again when Valve got people to pirate less with Steam.

chronovore

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #10 on: December 04, 2018, 09:59:26 PM »
Epic just announced another online storefront. Taking a smaller cut from developers.

(Image removed from quote.)

Full Press Release:
https://www.unrealengine.com/en-US/blog/announcing-the-epic-games-store

Tasty Meat

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #11 on: December 04, 2018, 10:06:18 PM »
Doesn't the OP graphic outright admit Unity is the best option?

Or am I missing something
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nachobro

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #12 on: December 04, 2018, 11:34:08 PM »
Quote
We’ve built this store and its economic model so that Epic’s interests are aligned with your interests.  Because of the high volume of Fortnite transactions, we can process store payments, serve bandwidth, and support customers very efficiently.
:badass these humble brags :lol

chronovore

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #13 on: December 04, 2018, 11:37:00 PM »
Doesn't the OP graphic outright admit Unity is the best option?

Or am I missing something

On Steam? Yeah, it looks like that's about right.

On Epic Store? It looks like they're equal, except that asterisk about not including Unity's licensing fees. Depending on the version used, that can be substantial, I think? Jeez, it's been over a year since I looked at Unity's most recent pricing model. I gave up on tracking it.

Tasty Meat

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #14 on: December 04, 2018, 11:41:18 PM »
Well if you're publishing to both stores then Unity still gets the nod.

That's a really bad marketing graphic. :lol
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kingv

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #15 on: December 05, 2018, 12:10:46 AM »
I think there could be some benefits here that steam can’t beat, like cross platform party chat and universal friends lists for games with cross play.

It would be hard for steam to develop that capability because they don’t have any games they can use to grab a foothold whereas largely epic games has already done it.

Doesn’t necessarily mean that epic WILL proceed ina smart way, but if they do it could be cool.

benjipwns

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #16 on: December 05, 2018, 01:46:35 AM »
I think there could be some benefits here that steam can’t beat, like cross platform party chat and universal friends lists for games with cross play.

It would be hard for steam to develop that capability because they don’t have any games they can use to grab a foothold
Portal 2

 :gaben

benjipwns

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #17 on: December 05, 2018, 02:00:13 AM »
I've been in the beta for this and Epic has a LOT of work they need to do. Even just for launching Fortnite and Unreal Tournament (lol... aww fbm) the new "library" is arguably worse than the old one is. battle.net just sticking the Activision games at the bottom for now is arguably better thought out.

Valve probably can bring down the share at this point if they have to, especially considering how many sellers of keys exist out there. There's just never been someone until Epic with the clout, pre-existing relationships and pre-existing massive cash flow from something to support a truly strong competitor. (Also, should be obvious btw, but Epic takes a greater cut of the "share" vs. on Steam. Their 5% from Steam is 7% of the total vs. 12% on their new store. So Valve's target is more flexible than the graph implies, since Epic's share on Steam doesn't change.) We know Valve does change the share through side deals, Epic does have them over a nice barrel of they can't give a discount to people who use UE because it'll just send people to use UE.

HardcoreRetro

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #18 on: December 05, 2018, 08:22:43 AM »
Epic, baby... First you give us Jazz Jackrabbit 3, then you can talk about your own store.

archie4208

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #19 on: December 05, 2018, 09:28:52 AM »
I can't wait to download another client I'll open once a year to play whatever exclusive the publisher refuses to put on Steam.

BisMarckie

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #20 on: December 07, 2018, 05:38:51 AM »
I am using launchbox as a frontend to not deal with the launchers anymore, if you want to ge the free route: playnite.link :trumps

BisMarckie

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #21 on: December 07, 2018, 05:40:11 AM »
btw Epic will launch its service by giving away Subnautica for free and they are planning to give away one game every two weeks.

kingv

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #22 on: December 07, 2018, 10:55:33 AM »
Already better than steam :doge

I just think the competition will be good for gamers. Maybe even steam sales will be good again.

Borys

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #23 on: December 07, 2018, 11:09:53 AM »
COUNT'EM!

- Steam
- Gog
- Uplay
- Origin
- Battle.net
- Bethesda Launcher
- Epic Games Launcher

THAT'S SEVEN!

Anything else I am missing?

archie4208

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #24 on: December 07, 2018, 11:12:54 AM »
Twitch and Discord also have storefronts.

Borys

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #25 on: December 07, 2018, 11:18:31 AM »
Twitch sells games ??? :lol

That's NINE then!

Does Amazon have one? They invested in gaming some time ago.

benjipwns

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #26 on: December 07, 2018, 11:41:49 AM »
Twitch is owned by Amazon, so Amazon Prime gives you free games on Twitch.

The only one I was sorta excited about and installed of all the ones they've given over the last six months was Sanitarium. :lol

headwalk

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #27 on: December 07, 2018, 11:46:40 AM »
someone is going to make a wrapper for all of these and become sauron.

Akala

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #28 on: December 07, 2018, 12:31:49 PM »
Twitch is owned by Amazon, so Amazon Prime gives you free games on Twitch.

The only one I was sorta excited about and installed of all the ones they've given over the last six months was Sanitarium. :lol

hey now they gave away pillars of eternity too. or was that over six months ago.  :lol

I checked out the epic store, got the early alpha UT thing. It is urleh.
Aka

Borys

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #29 on: December 07, 2018, 01:22:06 PM »
- Windows 10 Store

That's TEN Storefronts :lol

archie4208

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #30 on: December 07, 2018, 03:13:04 PM »
https://www.pcgamesn.com/rage-2/rage-2-steam

Gonna probably wait for a deep sale.  :yuck

Not that it matters much anyway.  My PC is getting pretty old and graphic cards are in a clusterfuck right now so I might as well wait.

Joe Molotov

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #31 on: December 07, 2018, 04:39:24 PM »
COUNT'EM!

- Steam
- Gog
- Uplay
- Origin
- Battle.net
- Bethesda Launcher
- Epic Games Launcher

THAT'S SEVEN!

Anything else I am missing?

RIP Desura. I'll miss having to download you to get a Steam key for some indie bundle jank.
©@©™

benjipwns

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #32 on: December 08, 2018, 09:40:21 PM »


 :rejoice PC GAMING :rejoice

D3RANG3D

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #33 on: December 08, 2018, 09:47:29 PM »
Where are the Itch.io and gamejolt clients pleb.  :snob

benjipwns

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #34 on: December 08, 2018, 09:56:24 PM »
didn't even know itch had a client now too :dead

Coax

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #35 on: December 08, 2018, 10:47:14 PM »
I wouldn't say it's exactly fair to lump GOG Galaxy or itch.io's client in the list given it's not necessary to launch or download games. Handy to have for updating games though. Actually not even sure if Epic's launcher is required to be open to launch games either since it lacks its own DRM and up to games to use solutions of their own from what they've said.

benjipwns

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #36 on: December 08, 2018, 11:22:06 PM »
There are actually a good number of Steam games that can be launched without Steam or even at the same time as a game using Steam.

Origin also has a decent amount of DRM free installs as well*, especially older titles. (like the ones that are also on GOG, natch)

uPlay might be the only client that requires it for all its games. battle.net even has a "silent" background mode for some of the games.

*Along with the special DRM Hell Installs that come with titles like Crysis.

HardcoreRetro

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #37 on: December 09, 2018, 12:00:01 PM »
Apparently I already got an account because I got the free Shadow Complex. Can't wait to boot up the store every few weeks for the free game. Subnautica looks pretty interesting.

Nabbis

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #38 on: December 09, 2018, 12:32:25 PM »
I really cba to install other shit but fuck Steam and Valve for their complacency and nepotism.

Joe Molotov

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #39 on: December 09, 2018, 05:30:55 PM »
I have the Epic Launcher installed from when they gave away Shadow Complex Remastered for free, but it's so old that it won't launch and it can't update itself. Sorry Epic, that was your one chance.

Edit: Wait, wait a second...after I reset it and ran the updater 5 or 6 times, the updater looks different now. I think we've done it! :rejoice

Edit 2: We're on the second update cycle with the more modern updater. I'll keep you posted.

Edit 3: I see a storefront, we got there friends.
« Last Edit: December 09, 2018, 05:37:18 PM by Joe Molotov »
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KissVibes

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #40 on: December 10, 2018, 01:25:44 AM »
Bu bu bu steam has big picture mode that barely fucking works, hardware nobody bought until it was ninety-nine cents, controller support (wow!), and horrible community features filled with toxic shitposters and braindead children. Oh and you can buy keys from other vendors which means steam doesn’t have to offer meaningful sales and can get buy with half-assed holiday ARGs or their horrible gems systems. Oh and they’ll let any fucking asset flip piece of shit on there making discovery absolute garbage.

Give me a lightweight client, have good sales, and a user review system that isn’t abused by gamergate fucks and alt-right turds. That’s all I want and need from a client. I don’t even need a unified friends list. It can be game by game since I have discord.
REAL

Vizzys

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #41 on: December 10, 2018, 02:00:43 AM »
Sad that Epic couldnt compete storefront wise so they resort to exclusivity instead

 interesting to see someone with money that could rival Steam though. as a client its a decade behind steam and a laughable comparison at best
« Last Edit: December 10, 2018, 05:30:09 AM by Vizzys »
萌え~

Borys

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #42 on: December 10, 2018, 03:40:24 AM »
Subnautica for free?

Schweet.

Thanks, Fortnite!

Dickie Dee

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #43 on: December 10, 2018, 08:38:40 AM »
Steam's competition will never be as good imo. They all lack the tons of QoL features, developer tools, continuous R&D etc. that have come with being the primary platform for over a decade. That, and the sheer number of games on somebody's account as a result of one primary platform serving everyone for that long of a time.

 :heh

Steam's a dumpster fire.

WTF does Valve even do anymore? Probably R&Ding robot dogs or some shit.
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nachobro

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #44 on: December 10, 2018, 09:32:55 AM »
valve is mostly wack these days but they did just put out a card game and BR for CSGO

i don't give much of a shit about multiple clients or whatever, that's the other side of the "open platform" pc people are always crowing about all the time. any new store has to have a decent refund policy that is just as easy as steam and community reviews before they really matter though.

thisismyusername

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #45 on: December 10, 2018, 12:00:40 PM »
Bu bu bu steam has big picture mode that barely fucking works, hardware nobody bought until it was ninety-nine cents, controller support (wow!), and horrible community features filled with toxic shitposters and braindead children. Oh and you can buy keys from other vendors which means steam doesn’t have to offer meaningful sales and can get buy with half-assed holiday ARGs or their horrible gems systems. Oh and they’ll let any fucking asset flip piece of shit on there making discovery absolute garbage

Gems haven't been a thing in 3 years. The ARGs haven't been a thing either.

I agree the client needs improving, but you're willing to wade through shit just to avoid another piece of shit? :doge

naff

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #46 on: December 10, 2018, 11:50:53 PM »
y'all deserve a monopoly with the amount you bitch
(_,_)

213372bu

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #47 on: December 11, 2018, 12:59:50 AM »
Steam's competition will never be as good imo. They all lack the tons of QoL features, developer tools, continuous R&D etc. that have come with being the primary platform for over a decade. That, and the sheer number of games on somebody's account as a result of one primary platform serving everyone for that long of a time.

 :heh

Steam's a dumpster fire.

WTF does Valve even do anymore? Probably R&Ding robot dogs or some shit.
???

It's never been about propagating Steam as a monopoly, it's more the fact that the entire non-online PC market has been more or less open sans EA. Valve has even gone to buy out a studio and let them release their games on other platforms. Steam also works on API, streaming support, has cloud saves etc.

This bullshit with other digital storefronts popping up and moneyhatting exclusives is absolute dog shit. There's absolutely no need to install another client that steals RAM and randomly opens when it wants. Especially for games like Super Meat Boy Forever that was going to already launch on Steam.

It's also stupid to criticize Valve for "doing nothing" when they continually pump out updates on >weekly basis.

Rather than competing with Valve with features, price, offerings etc. they actually make the experience actively worse by locking down non-First/Second Party games.

It's the same song and dance with every digital/VR platform.

It's one thing to have a competing secondary store, it's another thing to promote an extremely barebones platform by locking down previously "open" games down into a walled market. A practice being done because, despite being owned by Tencent and Epic Games, lacks basic QoL features that have become the norm that weren't included or a noted priority.
« Last Edit: December 11, 2018, 01:19:35 AM by 213372bu »

benjipwns

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #48 on: December 11, 2018, 01:40:36 AM »
It has felt like Valve's been distracted since they started in on DOTA. But part of that is probably that I don't care about DOTA 2. At the same time a lot of their productions have felt like starts and stops, the CS:GO BR thing surprised me because it was one of those random projects they'd drop in without warning like kooky TF2 updates or L4D2 a year after the first game.

Being a DoD fan first of course, I'm used to this Valve treatment. "We've patched in all these achievements and new stat tracking systems because we want to create new content and make gameplay tweaks!" eons pass... "Turns out we actually meant TF2. Check out this horde mode! DoD? No, the Department of Defense isn't involved on our projects, are you confusing it with America's Army, also F2P on the Steam store!"

The whole store thing was just a matter of time really, and Epic has the clout and cash to do it. EA stopped putting new games on Steam in like 2009 or so. Activision pulling Call of Duty was the big one simply because it was one of the early Steamworks series and they had been prominent in free weekends, betas, etc. That was the first signal the Steam dominance era was over probably.

I think Bethesda thought Fallout 76 was going to be bigger, that and RAGE 2 seem lesser to launch your client with versus Destiny and Call of Duty, with big assists from Blizzard, for Activision. (Even if RAGE 2 is probably the one title out of those four I'd consider buying before launch.)

The Epic Store grabbing so many games that aren't Epics and in some cases are not even established titles/companies will be interesting in testing that factor of how much people want one client with almost all their library. Activision/EA/Bethesda are using bigger guns, and that's just to establish a store with mostly only their own games.

benjipwns

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #49 on: December 17, 2018, 02:33:00 AM »
Bethesda Launcher should let you do something ala GOG Connect...even EA and uPlay allow this to various extent if you have CDKeys or similar codes. Especially on older titles. Like Bethesda's not going to get me to rebuy all the Wolfenstein/Doom/Quake titles on their client, but if you let me bring all those games over from Steam I'll consider your client more, especially when you want me to buy future titles in the franchises on your client. Ubisoft for example, I don't bother with Steam keys anymore, in part because it and uPlay get in fights, but also I might as well have all Far Cry's or Assassin's Creeds or Tom Clancy's in one client, etc. Extra so when the Steam version is barebones and you offer stuff like random ass skins if I play it on your client.

I don't expect the same of Epic, since they aren't the publisher of the games no matter what awesome GOG pulls off in their negotiations, but Bethesda should do this with their games simply to hit a feature parity with Origin and uPlay. And definitely if they're migrating stuff on the backend like Quake Champions and Elder Scrolls Online. I for whatever reason have "paid for" these on Steam (probably from bundles/monthly) and nowhere on Bethesda's client or website does it indicate that my account will cross over and I'll have the "fuller" versions of these games on their client versus just F2P. In the case of these, if I were to play them, especially QC, I might as well just play it through their client rather than layer it under Steam. Siege kept everything when I migrated from Steam/uPlay hell to just uPlay. Do these games? I could look it up, but it doesn't tell me. uPlay made clear you lost no progress in transitioning over to them.

Hell, to hit feature parity with the original days of Steam when you would plug in your Half-Life key and they'd give you like all the add-on content (Blue Shift, Day Of Defeat, TFC, etc.) because why the fuck not.

Even better, it doesn't even indicate whether or not Fallout Shelter of all things has crossplay. I can't trust that it does because a lot of these F2P games have sometimes segmented themselves on PC and especially when they also have mobile versions that are also segmented. I totally suspect that it, and QC and ESO, does use a central account but it doesn't tell me this.

PC Gamers aren't just going to trust that such systems work like this because we've all spent our entire gaming lives running into stupid situations where it doesn't when it should. On games and services far less complex and tied up in corporate reasoning than these clients/storefronts are.

benjipwns

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #50 on: December 17, 2018, 02:34:34 AM »
shut up loser, just buy them again

33% off for Fallout 76 now! 0% off for Return to Castle Wolfenstein!

Great Rumbler

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #51 on: December 17, 2018, 09:05:23 AM »
They should definitely do some kind of one-time-only Steam/GoG import to get people on to the service, I can't imagine that those older games are selling enough at this point on Bethesda Launcher [especially to people who already own those games elsewhere] that it wouldn't be worth it for them to do that.
dog

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #52 on: December 17, 2018, 09:54:06 AM »
I'm still bitter that we haven't seen from Valve a Day of Defeat followup (beyond the source version).
 :goldberg

Nintex

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #53 on: December 17, 2018, 01:51:46 PM »
I'm still bitter that we haven't seen from Valve a Day of Defeat followup (beyond the source version).
 :goldberg
There is a game much like Day of Defeat on Steam that runs on Source that was actually at one point Day of Defeat II that Valve dropped and the devs released themselves instead using a new name with "Day of" in the title.
dutch

MMaRsu

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #54 on: December 17, 2018, 01:53:55 PM »
I'm still bitter that we haven't seen from Valve a Day of Defeat followup (beyond the source version).
 :goldberg
There is a game much like Day of Defeat on Steam that runs on Source that was actually at one point Day of Defeat II that Valve dropped and the devs released themselves instead using a new name with "Day of" in the title.

Which game is it? Also should I buy Insurgancy Sandstorm Nintex? I dont know if it runs on my pc :(

benjipwns

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #55 on: December 17, 2018, 11:15:05 PM »
https://store.steampowered.com/app/447820/Day_of_Infamy/

It's not exactly the same, it leans more towards the realism of beta DoD versus the slightly looser DoD/DoD:S.

Player count is rough unfortunately.

Borys

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #56 on: December 18, 2018, 05:59:01 AM »
Subnautica get!

Thanks, Epic.

Mr Gilhaney

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #57 on: December 18, 2018, 10:26:28 AM »
Downloaded the epic launcher and fuck that shit. Not even free games is going to make me use that.

I just want my csgo skins and racist steam comments.
b♿re

thisismyusername

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #58 on: December 23, 2018, 04:33:50 PM »
https://www.gamespot.com/g00/articles/telltales-the-walking-dead-final-season-becomes-ep/1100-6464053/?i10c.ua=1&i10c.encReferrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8%3d&i10c.dv=19

Welp, time to pirate. I even have the demo on Steam waiting for the final season to come back to buy. :lol Fuck outta here, Kirkman.

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Re: Begun the online store margins wars have
« Reply #59 on: January 09, 2019, 04:27:08 PM »
Ubisoft seems set to pull from the Steam store: Tom Clancy's The Division 2 is no longer on the store and Ubisoft said it's going to be Epic exclusive.

So that's something I can't pirate, but will wait for when Ubisoft fire-sales it (AKA: gives it away for free) I guess.