playing final fantasy 6 as a twelve-year-old American boy

[recursivelyenumerable]

some twenty-eight-year-old dweeb in fuckin' Tokyo is like "wouldn't it be cool if ..."

and some twelve-year-old dweeb in St. Louis is like "whoa, man. whoa. this is fuckin' cool."

pre-internet*. pre-those con-con-con-founding factors that drag you down.
 


* yeah yeah yeah, ARPAnet, ISPs existed since blah blah fuck off. you know what I mean.

[HardcoreRetro]

Great thread. Thumbs up.

[Nintex]

I've more or less gone back to this. I don't consume a lot of pre-release gaming media anymore because of all the negativity.

So I'm having a great time playing a new DOOM, Resident Evil 3 and Half Life Alyx. 
Last year it was the likes of Control, Fire Emblem 3 Houses, Assassins Creed Odyssey, Ace Combat 7 and Link's Awakening. Just ignore the haters and enjoy vidya.

Nearly every game looks beautiful on my OLED 

VR is also very cool, lots of experimental stuff from developers I haven't heard about.
Opens up a new treasure trove of experiences.

[Positive Touch]

back then the game felt impossibly huge, like skyrim (or some more recent example, i dunno) did later. story quest with tons of variety of scenarios and gameplay and an endgame almost as big, with another game's worth of content. it's ofc overshadowed by its sequel nowadays, and doesn't get enough credit for pushing genre forward like it did.

[Himu]

Unpopular opinion:

The modern jrpg era starts with FFVI, not VII. VII just expands upon things already started with VI.

[Himu]

back then the game felt impossibly huge, like skyrim (or some more recent example, i dunno) did later. story quest with tons of variety of scenarios and gameplay and an endgame almost as big, with another game's worth of content. it's ofc overshadowed by its sequel nowadays, and doesn't get enough credit for pushing genre forward like it did.

Dude it was massive even when I first played it in 1999. I thought it flat out shat on VII and VIII

VIII was already out and I had it. Got FF Anthology and thought FFVI was the best game ever.

[Cheddahz]

back then the game felt impossibly huge, like skyrim (or some more recent example, i dunno) did later. story quest with tons of variety of scenarios and gameplay and an endgame almost as big, with another game's worth of content. it's ofc overshadowed by its sequel nowadays, and doesn't get enough credit for pushing genre forward like it did.

Dude it was massive even when I first played it in 1999. I thought it flat out shat on VII and VIII

VIII was already out and I had it. Got FF Anthology and thought FFVI was the best game ever.

Maybe it felt longer because you were playing the version with the ridiculous long load times 

[Cerveza mas fina]

Unpopular opinion:

The modern jrpg era starts with FFVI, not VII. VII just expands upon things already started with VI.

I think this isnt unpopular, but FF7 made jrpgs explode in the west.

[Himu]

back then the game felt impossibly huge, like skyrim (or some more recent example, i dunno) did later. story quest with tons of variety of scenarios and gameplay and an endgame almost as big, with another game's worth of content. it's ofc overshadowed by its sequel nowadays, and doesn't get enough credit for pushing genre forward like it did.

Dude it was massive even when I first played it in 1999. I thought it flat out shat on VII and VIII

VIII was already out and I had it. Got FF Anthology and thought FFVI was the best game ever.

Maybe it felt longer because you were playing the version with the ridiculous long load times 

Well that, and the fact that its dungeons were huge and sprawling. Like the floating continent, phoenix cave;etc. I had never gone through a dungeon as hardcore as phoenix cave before I did it. I realized then that the genre was more than it seemed. I felt so accomplished beating it.

[Himu]

Unpopular opinion:

The modern jrpg era starts with FFVI, not VII. VII just expands upon things already started with VI.

I think this isnt unpopular, but FF7 made jrpgs explode in the west.

It's a popular opinion but it's not really right, either. Only Final Fantasy and Pokemon exploded. The rest of the genre was still niche as fuck. Only Squaresoft games reaped the rewards and even games like Chrono Cross had trouble selling great numbers. No one was running out to pick up SaGa Frontier or Front Mission III or Tales of Destiny. It certainly helped bring a lot more niche rpgs over but no one was buying Persona 2 or Suikoden II en masse.

In fact, I'd argue the genre is just now getting out of niche and becoming mainstream with games like Persona 5 and Nier Automata being so popular. Even got Dragon Quest XI selling as well as it has in the west and this time it didn't come bundled with a demo for a Final Fantasy game.

[Akala]

In addition to being pre-internet hatemind for most people, we were also still at the point where those kinds of games didn't come around often. It was to be savored, totally an event. I still remember my Mom did me a treat and actually picked me up from school that day so we could go and get the game. 

Getting home and starting, the opening, etc...it looked so much better than 2(IV) did and really did feel grand and vast in comparison. IV was my favorite game of all time at that point, and I wasn't as big on it opening up, although it was very unexpected and pretty groundbreaking at the time. I remember having the guide and getting every last drop on probably the second playthrough, but being real I don't remember if I actually beat it first without it or not. I think I did. 

[Svejk]

I didn't have a SNES at the time, but seeing this screen shot in a magazine absolutely blew my mind...

This is what first caught my attention to FF in general.  Even though I was (still am?) pro Phantasy Star, I was so jealous of those with a SNES. 

[Himu]

I didn't have a SNES at the time, but seeing this screen shot in a magazine absolutely blew my mind...
(Image removed from quote.)
This is what first caught my attention to FF in general.  Even though I was (still am?) pro Phantasy Star, I was so jealous of those with a SNES. 

I was jealous of kids with super nintendos because of the FF shit in the back of game mags.

Genesis sucked outside of a few things and everything else worth playing were also on SNES.

[Positive Touch]

i'm trying to think of the big jrpgs that were available back then. the good stuff was final fantasy, dragon quest, phantasy star, lunar, lufia, breath of fire, and some one-offs...that was it tho, right? there was a handful of poo games, like secret of the seven stars or 7th saga, but other than that, i'm drawing a blank. it was rough back then.

[Akala]

There wasn’t much, Ogre Battle and Secret of Mana come to mind but would have to google timings. Enix put stuff out every so often but inconsistent on quality.

[Himu]

i'm trying to think of the big jrpgs that were available back then. the good stuff was final fantasy, dragon quest, phantasy star, lunar, lufia, breath of fire, and some one-offs...that was it tho, right? there was a handful of poo games, like secret of the seven stars or 7th saga, but other than that, i'm drawing a blank. it was rough back then.

It was so dire on Genesis I didn't know what an RPG was when Mario RPG came out.

[Positive Touch]

outside phantasy star genny didn't have shit aside from arpgs and tactical rpgs. had to get a sega cd for the regular ones.

edit: nvm i looked it up and sega cd also only had like 10 rpg or rpg-adjacent games lol

[bork]

16-bit didn't have too much in English and nothing was really all that popular.  RPGs would also be high-priced compared to other games- I remember seeing games like Chrono Trigger, FFIII, and Phantasy Star IV for $89-$99 in stores.  I also remember seeing stacks of unsold Earthbound copies for $10 at Best Buy.  Wish I had bought a bunch of them, lol.

Final Fantasy VII was the game-changer- I was working game store retail at this point and it was the first RPG to ever really be in high-demand.  I think the commercials showing off all the CG on MTV and such were a big reason why.  Cindi is also on point about popularity.  While RPGs got more popular in general, nothing really was "huge" apart from Final Fantasy games and Pokemon during that time. 

[Trent Dole]

I think what was labeled FFIII cost me $79.99 USD back in the day. Was one of the most massive things ever at the time and is still a pretty sizable game today.

[Positive Touch]

I also remember seeing stacks of unsold Earthbound copies for $10 at Best Buy.  Wish I had bought a bunch of them, lol.

oh god i remember this too and that shit still haunts me 25 years later. probably walked out of the store with some bullshit alt-rock cd instead.

[Great Rumbler]

Missed out on Final Fantasy until FF7 because I had a Genny during the 16-bit era.

Did play a lot of Dragon Warrior on the NES, though.

[tiesto]

Unpopular opinion:

The modern jrpg era starts with FFVI, not VII. VII just expands upon things already started with VI.

I think this isnt unpopular, but FF7 made jrpgs explode in the west.

The genre was slowly but steadily becoming more and more popular in the west, laying the groundwork for FF7 to come in and burst open the floodgates. FF4 -> FF6 -> CT -> Super Mario RPG sold progressively more in the west, these games had cachet as a "hardcore gamer" genre, the fanbase frequently skewed older (being the same age as recurisve when FF6 came out I would recall talking to friends' older brothers who were in their late teens, early 20s about the genre), and frequently got high reviews in the gaming press at the time. If you were one of the few to own a Master System, you most definitely were aware of Phantasy Star, likewise if you were one of the even fewer to own a Turbo CD, you knew Ys.

[tiesto]

I also remember seeing stacks of unsold Earthbound copies for $10 at Best Buy.  Wish I had bought a bunch of them, lol.

oh god i remember this too and that shit still haunts me 25 years later. probably walked out of the store with some bullshit alt-rock cd instead.

I'm just pissed that I wasn't a completist back then and didn't care about boxes or manuals... got a lot of loose games at Funcoland back in the day and didn't care - Earthbound, Ninja Gaiden Trilogy, EVO - if just cared about CIB back then...

[recursivelyenumerable]

nobody seems to remember this but FF1 was pretty popular in the US - Nintendo published it and heavily marketed it, including with a sweet Nintendo Power strategy guide included with subscriptions, and it actually sold more copies in the US than it had in Japan (though not as much as FF3 which was already out in Japan at the time). like half my third-grade class was really into FF1 and we'd trade cartridges to experiment with different party builds since it only allowed for one save file (lol)

since Square published FF2US themselves on a new console with a smaller userbase they were sort of starting over I suppose, and it sold a lot less

[bluemax]

i'm trying to think of the big jrpgs that were available back then. the good stuff was final fantasy, dragon quest, phantasy star, lunar, lufia, breath of fire, and some one-offs...that was it tho, right? there was a handful of poo games, like secret of the seven stars or 7th saga, but other than that, i'm drawing a blank. it was rough back then.

I was pretty hip to RPGs as a kid back then, I owned FFMQ, FF2, FF3 and CT. I also rented Earthbound during a summer once for long enough to beat it. I rented BoF2 a bunch of times but never got much further than the part where you meet Jean, I think I got to the whale once and that's about it. I remember being aware of Secret of Evermore, possibly more so than Mana, although I do remember Mana being mentioned in a mailer I got from Squaresoft. Others I remember wanting to play: Actraiser, Lufia, Soulblazer, Terranigma and Super Mario RPG. I don't think I ever heard about games like Paladin's Quest or Secret of the Stars.

On the NES I had definitely played FF1, DQ1, DQ2, Simon's Quest and Faxanadu. I remember I didn't like DQ2 as much but also it was kind of confusing for 9 or so year old me.

Mind you my dad was a D&D nerd who introduced me to games like Ultima and Bard's Tale before we ever got our first NES.

nobody seems to remember this but FF1 was pretty popular in the US - Nintendo published it and heavily marketed it, including with a sweet Nintendo Power strategy guide included with subscriptions, and it actually sold more copies in the US than it had in Japan (though not as much as FF3 which was already out in Japan at the time). like half my third-grade class was really into FF1 and we'd trade cartridges to experiment with different party builds since it only allowed for one save file (lol)

since Square published FF2US themselves on a new console with a smaller userbase they were sort of starting over I suppose, and it sold a lot less

True story, the first time my dad rented FF1 I thought it was Final Fight a game I had played a ton at the arcade. Then when I popped open the rental case and saw that instruction manual and started reading it, I was fucking hooked. And yeah my dad eventually bought that Nintendo Power guide when he got stuck, took him a month to beat the game playing it in the evenings after work.  I used to take that guide to school with me in 2nd and third grade and play pretend FF1 with other kids. I have always been a dweeb.

[benjipwns]

I REMEMBER THAT, I have the original Nintendo Power guide! But wait, I'm not the type you were talking about...

My RPG lineage, since others are talking about it, was not really truly understanding FFI or the GameBoy games that were actually Mana series games, plus some PC stuff I tried to figure out and didn't understand, then really getting into CT after renting it, then playing SMRPG and FF "III" to where those are still my favorite three RPG's followed by Superstar Saga on GBA before I'd even consider something like FFVII

I'm still more of an Action-RPG person to where Mario RPG/Chrono Trigger are close to the most "RPG" like I like things... FF VI and VII just hit and were unique enough for me at the time, I never got into Wild Arms and other stuff like a best friend who was itching for more RPGs, but I also never got into FFX and Kingdom Hearts like he did by the time there was more RPG plenty in the West (I also was more PC/DC/Xbox while he went PS1 -> PS2 with little to no PC outside of Diablo)

[benjipwns]

The FF1 NP guide was actually one in a set of four guides: Super Mario Bros. 3, Ninja Gaiden 2, Final Fantasy and then one for the four-player tap. The success of those guides are what led to the Nintendo Players Guides that started in the Super NES era.

Nintendo also subsidized Dragon "Warrior" in the U.S. through Nintendo Power by giving away the games a bunch of times to try and make it happen in the U.S. like it did in Japan. (It didn't really.)

edit: the four guides off a NP cover poster:

[Akala]

I had rented and liked Dragon Warrior a few times and liked it a lot, but back then I only got games to keep on bdays/holidays. one lazy day it came in the mail unannounced via NP. I freaked out.

[Himu]

Lots of good info here. Stuff was before I was truly conscious and couldn't even read.

[bluemax]

I REMEMBER THAT, I have the original Nintendo Power guide! But wait, I'm not the type you were talking about...

My RPG lineage, since others are talking about it, was not really truly understanding FFI or the GameBoy games that were actually Mana series games, plus some PC stuff I tried to figure out and didn't understand, then really getting into CT after renting it, then playing SMRPG and FF "III" to where those are still my favorite three RPG's followed by Superstar Saga on GBA before I'd even consider something like FFVII

I'm still more of an Action-RPG person to where Mario RPG/Chrono Trigger are close to the most "RPG" like I like things... FF VI and VII just hit and were unique enough for me at the time, I never got into Wild Arms and other stuff like a best friend who was itching for more RPGs, but I also never got into FFX and Kingdom Hearts like he did by the time there was more RPG plenty in the West (I also was more PC/DC/Xbox while he went PS1 -> PS2 with little to no PC outside of Diablo)

Only FFAdventure was a Mana game. FFL1 and FFL2 are Saga games. FFL3 is the pre-cursor to Mystic Quest.

[Svejk]

The FF1 NP guide was actually one in a set of four guides: Super Mario Bros. 3, Ninja Gaiden 2, Final Fantasy and then one for the four-player tap. The success of those guides are what led to the Nintendo Players Guides that started in the Super NES era.

Nintendo also subsidized Dragon "Warrior" in the U.S. through Nintendo Power by giving away the games a bunch of times to try and make it happen in the U.S. like it did in Japan. (It didn't really.)

edit: the four guides off a NP cover poster:
(Image removed from quote.)

I didn't even have a subscription or even had any Nintendo stuff at all, and yet I recognize ALL these covers. 

Unpopular opinion:

The modern jrpg era starts with FFVI, not VII. VII just expands upon things already started with VI.

I think this isnt unpopular, but FF7 made jrpgs explode in the west.

The genre was slowly but steadily becoming more and more popular in the west, laying the groundwork for FF7 to come in and burst open the floodgates. FF4 -> FF6 -> CT -> Super Mario RPG sold progressively more in the west, these games had cachet as a "hardcore gamer" genre, the fanbase frequently skewed older (being the same age as recurisve when FF6 came out I would recall talking to friends' older brothers who were in their late teens, early 20s about the genre), and frequently got high reviews in the gaming press at the time. If you were one of the few to own a Master System, you most definitely were aware of Phantasy Star, likewise if you were one of the even fewer to own a Turbo CD, you knew Ys.

I was... and I was WAY more familiar with Phantasy Star, Miracle Warriors and Y's (on SMS too... and of course I called it "Why's" back then. lol ). At the time, I think I didn't even know of any RPG's on NES.  I was in my newly erected, iron Sega bubble.

[tiesto]

nobody seems to remember this but FF1 was pretty popular in the US - Nintendo published it and heavily marketed it, including with a sweet Nintendo Power strategy guide included with subscriptions, and it actually sold more copies in the US than it had in Japan (though not as much as FF3 which was already out in Japan at the time). like half my third-grade class was really into FF1 and we'd trade cartridges to experiment with different party builds since it only allowed for one save file (lol)

since Square published FF2US themselves on a new console with a smaller userbase they were sort of starting over I suppose, and it sold a lot less

I remember being hyped over the moon for FF1... poring over the NP coverage and thinking "whoa... it's like Dragon Warrior, but the graphics are better, you can control *4* characters, the world looks huge and varied, I *NEED* this game". My friends and I spent the summer between 3rd grade to 4th grade playing through my copy, I think I made some RPG fans for life because of it.

I also used to draw out plans for games when I was younger, most were extremely influenced by FF1 (and later Phantasy Star 1), starring my childhood friends as they go around the world and eventually fight "Chaos". Wanting to make games is what eventually led me into learning how to program, which I've been doing professionally for 15 years now... (though not in the game industry thank god)

[Himu]

I'm convinced that DQ would be on par with FF in America if the first DQ to come over to North America were II or III and not 1. I think 1 was released too late in English and too dated for the time period it was released in. Does this opinion have merit?

[tiesto]

I'm convinced that DQ would be on par with FF in America if the first DQ to come over to North America were II or III and not 1. I think 1 was released too late in English and too dated for the time period it was released in. Does this opinion have merit?

Pre-Nintendo-Power, there was the Nintendo Fun Club, a 4 issue newsletter, and I recall reading a preview about Dragon Warrior (of course, much later on), this was back in '87, early '88. Also the first ever Nintendo Power had pictures of people lining up in Japan for DQ3. I probably just glanced this over when I first got ahold of that issue, never would have guessed that 30 years later I'd spend half the year playing the 11th DQ game.



Also, when I first got my NES in '88 I also got a copy of The Official Nintendo Player's Guide (from 1987). They had this mention of the game, which I think was originally planned to come out in early '88 instead of summer '89.



It's funny, I remember reading the Mega Man 2 issue of NP and they had a small preview of DQ1. I remember seeing so much text and menus and it looked completely alien to me, unlike any other game I've ever seen. I went to the mom and pop rental shop a bit later that summer and saw they had the game to rent, so I rented it and remember it took me like 2 hours just to get out of the throne room  - that was my first ever RPG experience, enjoyed it enough to later buy it (one of the few to have actually purchased the game), but it was FF1 and more importantly the original Phantasy Star that hooked me on the RPG genre. Also played the NES port of Ultima III and I remember being a bit too confused about where to go, though I thought being able to attack townspeople and the king was awesome. The NES Ultima ports are pretty cool though (except 5, which is absolute trash)... western RPG gameplay but ported by Japanese devs with an 8 bit Japanese art style and interface.

[Akala]

Dragon Power. 

So much shit was totally mismanaged back in the day.

[Great Rumbler]

(Image removed from quote.)

"warriers"

[Himu]

(Image removed from quote.)

"warriers"

come out to playyyyyyYYYYyyy

[bork]

I also remember seeing stacks of unsold Earthbound copies for $10 at Best Buy.  Wish I had bought a bunch of them, lol.

oh god i remember this too and that shit still haunts me 25 years later. probably walked out of the store with some bullshit alt-rock cd instead.

I'm just pissed that I wasn't a completist back then and didn't care about boxes or manuals... got a lot of loose games at Funcoland back in the day and didn't care - Earthbound, Ninja Gaiden Trilogy, EVO - if just cared about CIB back then...

So many people just tossed boxes and manuals back then.  I remember wanting to keep everything and my dad thought the boxes were a waste of space, so all our NES games and most GB games were loose.   :'(  We did keep all the SNES stuff, but that all got sold off later on anyway, lol.  TG-16 and (early) Genesis game boxes seemed to be easier to come across.  Guess that was the difference plastic hard cases made.

[Himu]

I don't have a single 16 bit box.

[bork]

nobody seems to remember this but FF1 was pretty popular in the US - Nintendo published it and heavily marketed it, including with a sweet Nintendo Power strategy guide included with subscriptions, and it actually sold more copies in the US than it had in Japan (though not as much as FF3 which was already out in Japan at the time). like half my third-grade class was really into FF1 and we'd trade cartridges to experiment with different party builds since it only allowed for one save file (lol)

since Square published FF2US themselves on a new console with a smaller userbase they were sort of starting over I suppose, and it sold a lot less

Don't remember that.  Interesting- maybe that explains all the NP hype for Mystic Quest, FF2, and FF3 later on?

Where I went to school, nobody had FF1, but I remember Dragon Warrior being really popular, because you got it for free with a Nintendo Power subscription, lol.  Almost every kid had it.

[bork]

I don't have a single 16 bit box.

I used my game store job to my advantage and would grab CIB games or take boxes or manuals where needed, but that was a very different time.  Crazy hardcore game collecting was in its infancy.  I sold off all my old 8 and 16-bit stuff apart from some Gameboy games.  Apart from a few B/W GB carts, everything else I have is CIB.  All PS1-4, Dreamcast, GC, GBA, Switch, etc. 

[bork]

Also going from retail experience, people keeping game boxes wasn't really a regular thing that I remember until the Playstation and Saturn were big- and even then it took stores giving people less credit/cash for games or rejecting the trades for that change things up even a little bit.   

[Positive Touch]

man my mom was determind to get rid of all my old game boxes too, like somehow removing 20-odd little cardboard boxes would free up so much space or something lol. didn't matter much in the end because they all got water damaged. i did find a perfect cib dq1 a few years later at a pawn shop and still have it to this day, tho.

i was too young for the 8bit rpgs when they released, but a year or two later i know i picked up FF4 and lunar at around the same time and loved them. FF had the great combat, lunar had the great story. still didn't understand leveling up until mystic quest came out

[Positive Touch]

Also going from retail experience, people keeping game boxes wasn't really a regular thing that I remember until the Playstation and Saturn were big- and even then it took stores giving people less credit/cash for games or rejecting the trades for that change things up even a little bit.   

pour one out for all those millions of game boy boxes that went straight to the trash

[bork]

i was too young for the 8bit rpgs when they released, but a year or two later i know i picked up FF4 and lunar at around the same time and loved them. FF had the great combat, lunar had the great story. still didn't understand leveling up until mystic quest came out

Yeah- I didn't know that staying at an inn in Final Fantasy saved your game, so I tried playing FF1 and saved at the very first town...erasing my brother's game save at the end in the last dungeon.     He replayed half the game and I ended up doing it again.    He gave up after that.

[Svejk]

I don't have a single 16 bit box.

I used my game store job to my advantage and would grab CIB games or take boxes or manuals where needed, but that was a very different time.  Crazy hardcore game collecting was in its infancy.  I sold off all my old 8 and 16-bit stuff apart from some Gameboy games.  Apart from a few B/W GB carts, everything else I have is CIB.  All PS1-4, Dreamcast, GC, GBA, Switch, etc.

Many a game case surgeries went down there...  Taking the best parts between multiple copies; the manuals, cases and discs of games and combine to make a pristine used copy. 
It was a science.   

[tiesto]

Also going from retail experience, people keeping game boxes wasn't really a regular thing that I remember until the Playstation and Saturn were big- and even then it took stores giving people less credit/cash for games or rejecting the trades for that change things up even a little bit.   

pour one out for all those millions of game boy boxes that went straight to the trash

Some of the more obscure GB games are insanely expensive CIB - TMNT3, Kid Dracula, Rolan's Curse 2, Knight Quest, Great Greed... all can go for $400+. Even more common GB games can go for $60-100 complete.

[Himu]

I ordered repro boxes for my favorite games. Like an FFIII box and manual.

[bluemax]

I'm convinced that DQ would be on par with FF in America if the first DQ to come over to North America were II or III and not 1. I think 1 was released too late in English and too dated for the time period it was released in. Does this opinion have merit?

3 yes, 2 only if it had a better translation that made it less confusing to play. I played DQ1 after FF1 and while I enjoyed it, it was a step back from FF1 in so many ways.

I kept a lot of boxes and manuals and stuff, but we moved a bunch of times and I had younger brothers who liked to destroy everything. Also we didn't get that many games new, so a lot of them we bought from rental stores or pawn shops and they came with nothing but the game. Got FF3 for $20 with no box and when I loaded it up it was a barely played copy (we had rented it enough times for me to know how far in the game the 2 save slots were, and the fact that only 2 save slots had been used).