Author Topic: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?  (Read 1374 times)

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Rman

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Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« on: October 01, 2020, 05:41:04 PM »
I was going through my facebook feed and the Trump dudes kept mentioning they’re voting for Trump due to strong defense, immigration, and support of Israel. There’s all super Christian. I consider myself Christian, but never really saw this in my childhood denomination—Catholicism.  I’m still practicing, although not some fanatic, but the evangelicals you see really involved with politics are just so different lol. 

I looked into it somewhat and I really can’t believe it’s a doomsday thing. Catholics are not obsessed with this stuff.  It is really a doomsday thing?

Mandark

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #1 on: October 01, 2020, 05:46:35 PM »
It really is the doomsday thing for a lot of hardcore evangelicals. The Left Behind series didn't sell a bazillion copies for nothing.

Even for rightwing American Protestants who aren't specifically into the eschatology of it, Ashkenazi Jews generally code as white and Israel's seen as a bulwark against the fiendish Muslims.

VomKriege

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #2 on: October 01, 2020, 05:50:34 PM »
It's very central in a version of the tale of the second coming that is fairly popular in US protestant branches.

I would imagine that for a lot of people it doubles with foreign policy views and other affects but all the commentary I've read insist the whole prophecy thing is, in fact, very serious.
« Last Edit: October 01, 2020, 05:56:13 PM by VomKriege »
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Great Rumbler

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #3 on: October 01, 2020, 06:03:35 PM »
What's already been said is a big part of it, probably also helps that they're constantly fighting with Muslims.
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VomKriege

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #4 on: October 01, 2020, 06:10:25 PM »
Jerusalem and holy sites in Israel are also something that will itch most believing Christians and it potentially being controlled by Muslims is a bit of epidermic issue. Crusades and all that.
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Pissy F Benny

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #5 on: October 01, 2020, 06:13:24 PM »
Isreal is America’s greatest ally :salute
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BIONIC

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #6 on: October 01, 2020, 06:17:40 PM »
filler  :stahp
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Brehvolution

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #7 on: October 01, 2020, 06:27:16 PM »
This is a pretty good idea of why:
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Nintex

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #8 on: October 01, 2020, 06:50:29 PM »
Partly because the US has a strong geopolitical connection with Israel
Partly because of all the holy sites in Israel and the connection with the faith

Partly because supporting Israel is sort of the Catholic guilt thing for Europeans to make up for turning the other cheek during WW2 or blatantly supporting the Nazi's
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Himu

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #9 on: October 01, 2020, 07:03:50 PM »
You don't have to be a political guru to know this:

the rapture.

They think in end times they'll be sent to heaven.
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Nintex

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #10 on: October 01, 2020, 07:30:31 PM »
I always forget that the whole doomsday prophecy is a part of it lmao
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Phoenix Dark

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #11 on: October 01, 2020, 07:32:57 PM »
A loooot of Evangelicals think the Rapture is close. I know, someone is gonna say "but they always think that." As someone who used to live in that world trust me, they really think it now. And they think Assad's kid is the antichrist.
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Himu

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #12 on: October 01, 2020, 08:00:25 PM »
A loooot of Evangelicals think the Rapture is close. I know, someone is gonna say "but they always think that." As someone who used to live in that world trust me, they really think it now. And they think Assad's kid is the antichrist.

I've heard lots of the same shit from Evangelicals. Acquaintance is insisting her husband is adamant the rapture is coming because of 2020. :heh They are serious and are using masks as evidence that end times are on our door step. All that needs to happen is for the temple to be destroyed for Jesus to call their shells (bodies) to heaven.
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Nintex

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #13 on: October 01, 2020, 08:03:12 PM »
A loooot of Evangelicals think the Rapture is close. I know, someone is gonna say "but they always think that." As someone who used to live in that world trust me, they really think it now. And they think Assad's kid is the antichrist.
I did recall when the war in Syria started all of these people started bringing up quotes about Damascus in flames and such.
Syria had a big role to play in the doomsday plot and then it sort of fizzled out when the media got bored with it and the Russians came in.

A loooot of Evangelicals think the Rapture is close. I know, someone is gonna say "but they always think that." As someone who used to live in that world trust me, they really think it now. And they think Assad's kid is the antichrist.

I've heard lots of the same shit from Evangelicals. Acquaintance is insisting her husband is adamant the rapture is coming because of 2020. :heh They are serious and are using masks as evidence that end times are on our door step. All that needs to happen is for the temple to be destroyed for Jesus to call their shells (bodies) to heaven.
Just tell them Shinji and Asuka will not let that happen  :teehee
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Himu

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #14 on: October 01, 2020, 08:05:20 PM »
Partly because the US has a strong geopolitical connection with Israel
Partly because of all the holy sites in Israel and the connection with the faith

Partly because supporting Israel is sort of the Catholic guilt thing for Europeans to make up for turning the other cheek during WW2 or blatantly supporting the Nazi's

Israel is mostly an Evangelical thing. Catholics don't believe in the rapture and also think that being Jewish or Muslim isn't a sin and have no desire to convert them as they are Abrahamic.

Evangelicals on the other hand...


https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/.premium-evangelicals-trying-to-convert-jews-a-fair-price-for-christian-support-for-israel-1.8837182

https://cm2israel.org/
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VomKriege

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #15 on: October 01, 2020, 08:20:30 PM »
A loooot of Evangelicals think the Rapture is close. I know, someone is gonna say "but they always think that." As someone who used to live in that world trust me, they really think it now. And they think Assad's kid is the antichrist.

I've heard lots of the same shit from Evangelicals. Acquaintance is insisting her husband is adamant the rapture is coming because of 2020. :heh They are serious and are using masks as evidence that end times are on our door step. All that needs to happen is for the temple to be destroyed for Jesus to call their shells (bodies) to heaven.

They need to build it first.  :larry
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Himu

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #16 on: October 01, 2020, 08:24:10 PM »
A loooot of Evangelicals think the Rapture is close. I know, someone is gonna say "but they always think that." As someone who used to live in that world trust me, they really think it now. And they think Assad's kid is the antichrist.

I've heard lots of the same shit from Evangelicals. Acquaintance is insisting her husband is adamant the rapture is coming because of 2020. :heh They are serious and are using masks as evidence that end times are on our door step. All that needs to happen is for the temple to be destroyed for Jesus to call their shells (bodies) to heaven.



They need to build it first.  :larry

Right! I forgot the full extent of the quackery.
« Last Edit: October 01, 2020, 08:42:18 PM by Cindi Mayweather »
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OnlyRegret

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #18 on: October 02, 2020, 03:30:55 AM »

Rman

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #19 on: October 02, 2020, 08:18:57 AM »
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Premillennialism
Thanks! Makes more sense now as Catholic don't teach this stuff from my knowledge. I'm not theological expert although practicing. I find it pretty weird as well.  Is this why many evangelicals have this to hell with the world mindset--like regarding the environment and stuff?

Catholic teaching is much more grounded in my experience. I don't agree with everything the church teaches.  But there's a reason why there are so many Catholic hospitals around the world.  The gospel is not just about going to heaven, but feeding the hungry, clothing the naked, and healing the sick right here right now.

Also, I don't mind anyone shitting on the church either. It has its issues.  Vast understatement.

jakefromstatefarm

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #20 on: October 02, 2020, 09:04:06 AM »
Is this why many evangelicals have this to hell with the world mindset--like regarding the environment and stuff?
in antebellum america, there’s a constellation of ‘ideologies’, for lack of a better term, that get glued together to form a common discursive space around american identity: radical whig republicanism + evangelical reformed protestantism + common sense realist epistemology. after the civil war, this gets fractured. the evangelical groups have to either double down on their emphasis of literalist renderings of the principle of sola scriptura, or deflate their epistemological projects. the former, very broadly, develop into the premillenialist tradition*, which is initially apolitical (and you can still see premillenialism have an apolitical effect in its adherents today). the encounter with, especially, darwinism in the 1910s and 1920s politically charges it. it lies largely dormant in popular discourse, but grows in regional importance, until the 1970s and 1980s when the gop, as a principal part of a broader coalition realignment strategy, start to court religious groups into movement conservatism. it’s that moral majority era that produces things like, e.g., prosperity gospel and Left Behind.

*the latter, for whoever’s interested, develop into the postmillenialist tradition, which plays a really important role in the progressive coalition and temperance movement from ~1890-1930

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #21 on: October 19, 2020, 03:41:26 PM »
 :kermit
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recursivelyenumerable

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #22 on: October 19, 2020, 04:59:55 PM »
Is this why many evangelicals have this to hell with the world mindset--like regarding the environment and stuff?
in antebellum america, there’s a constellation of ‘ideologies’, for lack of a better term, that get glued together to form a common discursive space around american identity: radical whig republicanism + evangelical reformed protestantism + common sense realist epistemology. after the civil war, this gets fractured. the evangelical groups have to either double down on their emphasis of literalist renderings of the principle of sola scriptura, or deflate their epistemological projects.[...]

*the latter, for whoever’s interested, develop into the postmillenialist tradition, which plays a really important role in the progressive coalition and temperance movement from ~1890-1930

yeah I wanna know what you mean about the epistemological thing. I mean I have an idea but it's wrong
« Last Edit: October 19, 2020, 05:17:51 PM by recursivelyenumerable »
QED

shosta

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #23 on: October 19, 2020, 05:07:07 PM »
I think he's talking about the literal truth of the bible and especially the claims about Israel as a divinely promised land. Also all the stuff in Revelation.
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Cauliflower Of Love

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #24 on: October 19, 2020, 08:43:56 PM »
can someone summ up the whole israel/palestine/globalists/evangelical/christians thing for me in like three and a half sentences?

Transhuman

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #25 on: October 19, 2020, 09:09:17 PM »
Basically no-one wants to share some useless fucked up land, so Israel is just going to slowly exterminate the Palestinian people until they're all dead or until Jesus comes back or America stops enabling them, whichever happens first (not the last one)


Cauliflower Of Love

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #26 on: October 19, 2020, 09:11:31 PM »
What about the globalists?

Transhuman

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #27 on: October 19, 2020, 09:16:44 PM »
I have to read The End of History and the Last Man by Francis Fukuyama before I can answer that.

recursivelyenumerable

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #28 on: October 19, 2020, 10:09:09 PM »
I think he's talking about the literal truth of the bible and especially the claims about Israel as a divinely promised land. Also all the stuff in Revelation.

where/how does common sense realism come in?
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jakefromstatefarm

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Re: Political gurus, why are evangelicals so obsessed with Israel?
« Reply #29 on: October 19, 2020, 10:13:12 PM »
I mean I have an idea but it's wrong
it’s actually probably right. instead of “epistemological”, i should’ve said “hermeneutic” or “exegetical”. the point at issue is just, for the christian, how do we extract truth claims from this set of scriptures? ante-bellum american evangelical protestantism is attracted to the idea that the entire meaning of any given passage of scripture is just on the surface level of the text. there was a more or less broad consensus on this, in no small part because it jived well with what people took to be the epistemic truths that grounded the natural sciences. after the civil war, it’s a different story, the changing, accelerating trend in the natural sciences towards unintuitive claims, some which flew right in the face of literalist readings of the bible, forced those evangelicals into a gambit: give up on the authority of the sciences, or revise your relationship to scripture

spoiler (click to show/hide)
there is a specific thing -common sense realism- prominent in scottish thought in the 18th century, thats informing the development of premillenialism. its important to keep in mind that premillennialism is a theological development at first, happening inside seminaries and universities. but the median evangelical in the prayer tent isnt reading thomas reid, or anything like that. ive found that the literature can elide the distinction sometimes
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